The Syndicate

Jinrou wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 7:29 am

colonialbob wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 7:10 am

Kylemii wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:13 am

colonialbob wrote: ↑Mon Jun 10, 2019 11:12 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Jun 10, 2019 10:36 pm If one or more of the cops is bad, who and why?

Kyle. Everybody else has legitimate posting history that indicates they actually believed they were the/a cop.

The exception is if Jack told mafia about the multiple cops thing, I guess. Potentially the case but seems a little like stacking the deck? Idk.

that's actually wrong. saying zootopia over and over and generally being a memelord was an active choice i made to make sure I survived long enough to cop someone. i went a different direction once I realized that at the very least my role likely wasn't a perfect cop, but also that there was probably at least one other cop in the game due to the presence of a miller before I got tired/busy

Ok, this is more convincing to me.

[VOTE: jinrou] aubergine

he didnt cop me or is lying

You might want to read more before commenting. You've been copped town by both Indiglo (now confirmed dead town) and Colonialbob. Kyle never claimed to have copped you.

I'm even more comfortable with my vote on Jinrou, because their "he's lying" comment is not followed up with a vote on the offending party.

Fucking hell. Sorry guys. This is a piece of shit. Still hope town wins though.

Logic wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:07 am I'm even more comfortable with my vote on Jinrou, because their "he's lying" comment is not followed up with a vote on the offending party.

So, I'm not completely sold on Kyle being a civilian.

I'm currently leaning that way, depending on how Jinrou flips (which I think will be mafia) and that may push Kyle into higher town confidence. Not sure who Jinrou's partners are at that point. I know it's not me, and colonialbob seems unlikely, leaving Owner, LongCon, Dizzy, Epi, and Kyle.

But if Jinrou flips green, I'm thinking the Epi and Kyle have some partner equity.

One thing that concerns me about both of them is the lack of self preservation votes from both of them onto each other.

Logic wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:38 am So, I'm not completely sold on Kyle being a civilian.

I'm currently leaning that way, depending on how Jinrou flips (which I think will be mafia) and that may push Kyle into higher town confidence. Not sure who Jinrou's partners are at that point. I know it's not me, and colonialbob seems unlikely, leaving Owner, LongCon, Dizzy, Epi, and Kyle.

But if Jinrou flips green, I'm thinking the Epi and Kyle have some partner equity.

One thing that concerns me about both of them is the lack of self preservation votes from both of them onto each other.

"Both of them" meaning Kyle and Jinrou. That last statement is unclear.

Indiglo =(((

Kylemii wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:19 am

colonialbob wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 12:32 amThose are both believable things that Clawhauser (a character from the movie) would do. I'm not sure whether it bothers me that the third was "no results" - either he ran out of stuff to make up, the hosts ran out of creative ways to say stuff, or something different actually happened.

the message I received said that my failure wasn't my fault this time, which implies to me that either I was blocked or that the player I targeted is untargetable somehow.

Who did you target?

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:11 am

Kylemii wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:19 am

colonialbob wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 12:32 amThose are both believable things that Clawhauser (a character from the movie) would do. I'm not sure whether it bothers me that the third was "no results" - either he ran out of stuff to make up, the hosts ran out of creative ways to say stuff, or something different actually happened.

the message I received said that my failure wasn't my fault this time, which implies to me that either I was blocked or that the player I targeted is untargetable somehow.

Who did you target?

Long con, as stated

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 7:48 am

Kylemii wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:13 am

colonialbob wrote: ↑Mon Jun 10, 2019 11:12 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Jun 10, 2019 10:36 pm If one or more of the cops is bad, who and why?

Kyle. Everybody else has legitimate posting history that indicates they actually believed they were the/a cop.

The exception is if Jack told mafia about the multiple cops thing, I guess. Potentially the case but seems a little like stacking the deck? Idk.

that's actually wrong. saying zootopia over and over and generally being a memelord was an active choice i made to make sure I survived long enough to cop someone. i went a different direction once I realized that at the very least my role likely wasn't a perfect cop, but also that there was probably at least one other cop in the game due to the presence of a miller before I got tired/busy

How/when did you "realize" there was another cop?

A miller role would be useless if the only cop that exists doesn't get results anyways

So I've read the back and forth between Jinrou and Epi, and honestly I don't really think either comes off as scummy. I'm not crazy about the Jinrou wagon.

It says in the OP that mafia has safe claims, so that could definitely include cops. Maybe they were explained the cop thing, or maybe they had a couple of cop safe claims and could deduce from that? If that is so, then I still don't trust Bob or Logic. I mean, I guess I trust logic more of the two, read wise.

I don't know if Kyle is the sort of player to make up those kind of results. I don't know why he would be the only one to have a character specific role.

I don't really get Epi's take on the whole thing here. I agree with Logic.

So question is - Are cop claims clearing or not? Sloonmeister was VT, he said. Indiglo was cop with only town results (maybe apart from miller lol). I'm the same as indiglo. Bob and Logic also claims to be the same. Kyle claims a different kind of cop. Nobody else claimed cop. Wait, LC maybe claimed cop?

Eh... If I were to just follow reads I'd just vote Bob.
I don't know Jinrou. Maybe they are scum. The 1 on 1 on Epi is pretty narrow focus.

Logic wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:07 am I'm even more comfortable with my vote on Jinrou, because their "he's lying" comment is not followed up with a vote on the offending party.

I see the logic behind this, pun intended, but I've found that it often doesn't matter in praxis. Players are not robots. -shrug emoji

[VOTE: colonialbob] aubergine

Cause I'm doubting the cop claims could be clearing.

Logic - Why do you think Jinrou will flip mafia?

That would be annoying tbh, cause they were my first investigation. =P

Kyle, why do you think you were not mod killed and Indiglo was?

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:40 am Kyle, why do you think you were not mod killed and Indiglo was?

Jack explained why indiglo did modkillable offense and I didnt?

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:40 am Kyle, why do you think you were not mod killed and Indiglo was?

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:29 am [VOTE: colonialbob] aubergine

Cause I'm doubting the cop claims could be clearing.

Argh what

Go back and look at my interactions with Mac yesterday or the multi cop reveal today. The only way I can fake that as mafia is if I know there are multiple cops.

colonialbob wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:42 am

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:29 am [VOTE: colonialbob] aubergine

Cause I'm doubting the cop claims could be clearing.

Argh what

Go back and look at my interactions with Mac yesterday or the multi cop reveal today. The only way I can fake that as mafia is if I know there are multiple cops.

But that was my point. Scum would perhaps know there are multiple cops if they got multiple cop fake claims, you know.

This reaction is not scummy though.

I have a hard time believing Jack would a) give out a bunch of useless cop roles while also b) telling mafia there are a bunch of useless cop roles. Stacking the deck innit

Kylemii wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:42 am

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:40 am Kyle, why do you think you were not mod killed and Indiglo was?

Jack explained why indiglo did modkillable offense and I didnt?

Ok. I see it.

Really annoying that indiglo got modkilled for confirming themselves as town, cause imo they were as good as confirmed already.

I haven't talked about the syntax or exact wording of my PMs just the general flavor.

colonialbob wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:44 am I have a hard time believing Jack would a) give out a bunch of useless cop roles while also b) telling mafia there are a bunch of useless cop roles. Stacking the deck innit

I guess. But it's kind of stacking the deck if all the cops are actually town also, isn't it?

How about we lynch Epi just for fun?
How sure is everyone that he is town?

Or just follow consensus on Jinrou

Voting there for now.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:45 am

colonialbob wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:44 am I have a hard time believing Jack would a) give out a bunch of useless cop roles while also b) telling mafia there are a bunch of useless cop roles. Stacking the deck innit

I guess. But it's kind of stacking the deck if all the cops are actually town also, isn't it?

Maybe so. I'm guessing there's quite possibly a cop fakeclaim. I doubt there's multiple. Or potentially there's just a ZPD officer character claim without a power to go along with it (that was a common way of giving mafia fakeclaims at the site Jack and I came from)

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:47 am Or just follow consensus on Jinrou

Voting there for now.

Dizzy, your actions today are beginning to cause me to cast some doubt on your townieness.

I wanted to share because I want everyone to know where my head is at.

Logic wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:52 amDizzy, your actions today are beginning to cause me to cast some doubt on your townieness.

I wanted to share because I want everyone to know where my head is at.

How so?

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:45 am

colonialbob wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:44 am I have a hard time believing Jack would a) give out a bunch of useless cop roles while also b) telling mafia there are a bunch of useless cop roles. Stacking the deck innit

I guess. But it's kind of stacking the deck if all the cops are actually town also, isn't it?

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:46 am How about we lynch Epi just for fun?
How sure is everyone that he is town?

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:47 am Or just follow consensus on Jinrou

Voting there for now.

These three in particular. They don't look to be hunting, just throwing s*** at the wall to see what sticks. Maybe that's just your style, and I'm pinging off of culture clash. But it pings me. Especially since your alternative to Jinrou is Epi, and not anyone else that looks even remotely scummier than Epi.

Logic wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 11:10 amThese three in particular. They don't look to be hunting, just throwing s*** at the wall to see what sticks. Maybe that's just your style, and I'm pinging off of culture clash. But it pings me. Especially since your alternative to Jinrou is Epi, and not anyone else that looks even remotely scummier than Epi.

Yeah, welcome to me freaking out. I explore alternatives in the moment and do throw stuff out, especially when I feel like I don't have a direction. This is why I kind of just wanted to sheep indiglo today. I truly don't have a clear suspect. It could be Jinrou. I'm just afraid we just consensus vote there without much question and then they flip town. I've been accused of being flippant and throwing shit out many many times. But I can't pretend to have a clear idea when I don't. I think your paranoia here is a sidetrack. I have the same cop experience as presumably you and bob and LC do (?) If you look at my D2 you will notice that I was strongly against the Neverwhere wagon when Speed and Sloonei tried to make that happen, and that was because I had investigated them in the night.

But why is Epi town though? =p

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:46 am How about we lynch Epi just for fun?
How sure is everyone that he is town?

I don't know if we can truly be sure of anything, but I do think there needs to be some structure or way to feel like we are actually making progress here.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 11:19 am But why is Epi town though? =p

He's still different, but this is also a fairly unusual game that might merit someone playing differently. I don't know.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 11:19 am But why is Epi town though? =p

A better question is "why does Epi look more scummy than either of Jinrou or Kyle?"
You're giving Epi suspicion, and I don't believe you've made a case.

Logic wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:52 am

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:47 am Or just follow consensus on Jinrou

Voting there for now.

Dizzy, your actions today are beginning to cause me to cast some doubt on your townieness.

I wanted to share because I want everyone to know where my head is at.

I don't know how I feel about this. I think Dizzy is like most of us frustrated with it being "bastard" for one thing, but second, that we aren't truly sure what can be trusted or not.

This isn't a game where I feel sure about the direction we should go.

Logic wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 11:48 am

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 11:19 am But why is Epi town though? =p

A better question is "why does Epi look more scummy than either of Jinrou or Kyle?"
You're giving Epi suspicion, and I don't believe you've made a case.

That is not a better question to me. The reason I copped Epi in the first place was that I was unsure of him. I do think he seems more like I've seen him as town in the later stages, but then I'm considering if I just thought that because I got a town result on him. Anyway, I have some doubt there, so the reason I'm even asking that question is for others to give their thoughts. I want to be convinced of something, and I was looking at indiglo to do that convincing because I fully town read them. Jinrou has had narrow focus. I guess that is the most negative thing I've seen from Jinrou. That and disappearing after thinking they had been copped (???)

I'm not ready to deal with the Kyle situation. GTH town.

Lol, what if it's both Epi and Jinrou doing some cross bussing here?

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 12:05 pm Lol, what if it's both Epi and Jinrou doing some cross bussing here?

More concern: you're not voting Jinrou (after you claimed you were) nor are you voting for Epignosis.

Logic wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 12:27 pm

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 12:05 pm Lol, what if it's both Epi and Jinrou doing some cross bussing here?

More concern: you're not voting Jinrou (after you claimed you were) nor are you voting for Epignosis.

No? o.o

I voted Jinrou right after I said I would. I just didn't make a

[VOTE: Jinrou] aubergine

I usually do, but it's not mandatory.

You can vote in the poll without making a blue vote in thread, Logic.

I was positive you had no vote in the poll., and Indy's vote was still there instead.
This one is on me.

colonialbob wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 7:41 am

Jinrou wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 7:29 am

colonialbob wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 7:10 am

Kylemii wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:13 am

colonialbob wrote: ↑Mon Jun 10, 2019 11:12 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Jun 10, 2019 10:36 pm If one or more of the cops is bad, who and why?

Kyle. Everybody else has legitimate posting history that indicates they actually believed they were the/a cop.

The exception is if Jack told mafia about the multiple cops thing, I guess. Potentially the case but seems a little like stacking the deck? Idk.

that's actually wrong. saying zootopia over and over and generally being a memelord was an active choice i made to make sure I survived long enough to cop someone. i went a different direction once I realized that at the very least my role likely wasn't a perfect cop, but also that there was probably at least one other cop in the game due to the presence of a miller before I got tired/busy

Ok, this is more convincing to me.

[VOTE: jinrou] aubergine

he didnt cop me or is lying

Me or mii

mii

Logic wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:07 am I'm even more comfortable with my vote on Jinrou, because their "he's lying" comment is not followed up with a vote on the offending party.

would make more sense, if voting system wasnt done by a poll that i am not used to logic

regardless there is a reason I assume I don’t appear as green to kyle

i am a vanilla town which is a predator

assuming by all means that he checked me and this is a bastard game, i genuinely dont believe vanilla town me should appear as green to him

i didnt watch the movie, but according to what hack wrote on zootopia and racism, people would obviously bot view a predator as innocent. they can inherently murder other animals out of instinct

which is to say i am baffled that in a bastard game, me a generic vanilla town would give a green result to one of the cops in this apparently endless armada of them

Raise your hand if you are a predator

That being said, I don't buy Jinrou's excuses. I don't see town in his posts, at all. I want someone other than Jinrou to challenge me on this. I could use a friendly debate.