The Syndicate

thellama73 wrote:I am also mystified as to how people are claiming that Russ must be bad if he's not a Donner. It's giving me the willies.

Do you think he's good? Or do you have no opinion of him?

By the way, two more minutes

*(*^&*^*(

In this game about every one has vouched. Voting patterns are open thread stuff, no info involved. You can make a case from voting patterns. I am not comfortable voting for someone who makes sense to me over vague insinuations.

But my point was I don't see how voting patterns have any meaning with all these rotations.

Linki, CRAP

Great
Thank you Donners for actively trying to prevent this lynch

What!?!?! Oh no! Now I feel bad. RIP Russ.

Linki: no kidding

Great job with you info, FZ

Can we all agree that FZ is a terrible liar at this point?

Obviously there are some pacts out there because someone has to be bad! Everyone can't be good!

There seems to be some confusion about this, so let me clear it up.

If you're going to say things like "Russ definitely has to be bad" you better be able to back it up with voting record analysis or in-thread info.

If secret info is the reason you think that, then don't say it. Make an actual case based on publicly available info.

Jesus Christ.

Can we please see a photo of the poll? Sorry I'm on my phone and I don't know to do a screen shot.

Too late it's gone, and was when i went to catch it after I posted

thellama73 wrote:Great job with you info, FZ

Can we all agree that FZ is a terrible liar at this point?

I now want the baddies to kill me tonight, because this post is so full of crap. I said that if he's not a Donner, he's bad. I expected Donners to come in and prevent this lynch and I think I was pretty clear about it. This lynch is on their hands. But I'm so fed up with this, that I'm asking the baddies to kill me tonight. If I'm rotating to a baddie, I'm killing myself.

linki: llama, that is such bull. You and I know that voting record means nothing in this game, and the only way to do anything is by using your logic.

FZ. wrote:

thellama73 wrote:Great job with you info, FZ

Can we all agree that FZ is a terrible liar at this point?

I now want the baddies to kill me tonight, because this post is so full of crap. I said that if he's not a Donner, he's bad. I expected Donners to come in and prevent this lynch and I think I was pretty clear about it. This lynch is on their hands. But I'm so fed up with this, that I'm asking the baddies to kill me tonight. If I'm rotating to a baddie, I'm killing myself.

linki: llama, that is such bull. You and I know that voting record means nothing in this game, and the only way to do anything is by using your logic.

Let's hear your logic then. If it is based on secret info, you should not have even said it. If you are saying that, it should be based on publicly available info.

I don't know that her logic matters anymore, llama.

S~V~S wrote:I don't know that her logic matters anymore, llama.

Perhaps not. It's just annoying to have people saying "I definitely know X, because I figured it out and you should trust me" but be unwilling to answer any followup questions. If you're not going to explain your certainty, you shouldn't say you certain, at least in my opinion.

thellama73 wrote:Great job with you info, FZ

Can we all agree that FZ is a terrible liar at this point?

I changed my vote from Bass to Russ at the last second, due to pressure from Zomberella and FZ, and now I'm really regretting it. Down one more civvie. I don't know how anyone can claim to see a pattern in this mess. As far as I can tell, Roxy has this cooked up to deliberately elude pattern detection.

I don't know how we can win this one, except by dumb luck. I feel like I've got the dumb part covered.

Okay, there are three baddies out there that all got defended. Unless they are all in cahoots, there are civvies out there ago are defending baddies and not defending civvies (ie Russ). Come on people, what are you doing!?!

Zomberella12 wrote:Okay, there are three baddies out there that all got defended. Unless they are all in cahoots, there are civvies out there ago are defending baddies and not defending civvies (ie Russ). Come on people, what are you doing!?!

Who defended Black Rock?

Snowman wrote:

Zomberella12 wrote:Okay, there are three baddies out there that all got defended. Unless they are all in cahoots, there are civvies out there ago are defending baddies and not defending civvies (ie Russ). Come on people, what are you doing!?!

Who defended Black Rock?

Oh...um...erm...maybe no one. Hey! Black Rock! Dang it!

I suck, I missed the lynch and I failed badly. Like very badly. I'm sorry Russ.

Well shit, I had a big 'ol defense post lined up, but I thought this lunch ended tomorrow. Guess moving and going out of town really did mess with my sense of timing. My bad for that.



Zombs, can we assume that I took you up on your bet and that you owe me $20?

Going to try to say this without affecting the game for players still alive:

thellama73 wrote:There seems to be some confusion about this, so let me clear it up.

If you're going to say things like "Russ definitely has to be bad" you better be able to back it up with voting record analysis or in-thread info.

If secret info is the reason you think that, then don't say it. Make an actual case based on publicly available info.

Jesus Christ.

FZ. wrote:I expected Donners to come in and prevent this lynch and I think I was pretty clear about it. This lynch is on their hands.

Zomberella12 wrote:Okay, there are three baddies out there that all got defended. Unless they are all in cahoots, there are civvies out there ago are defending baddies and not defending civvies (ie Russ). Come on people, what are you doing!?!

llama is right, FZ. and Zombs are dead wrong. To me there is absolutely no grey area there. I don't want to play any more mafia games where people think it's civs' responsibility to reveal info or vouch for each other, and I do only want to play mafia that is based on casebuilding and publicly available info.

I will be quitting any future games in which people infodump.

I just read up on some of what I missed. It's amazing how many people are against info dumping and yet are lynching people because they haven't been "vouched" for. Guess what, you are counting on info dumping. Here's some. Russ and me were Donners, but because I was busy today he got lynched because no one "vouched" for him. Crap. I info dumped. Or maybe it doesn't count because we all switched roles again. Also, who ever is a Donner, good luck. They only rely on vouching.

Russtifinko wrote:Well shit, I had a big 'ol defense post lined up, but I thought this lunch ended tomorrow. Guess moving and going out of town really did mess with my sense of timing. My bad for that.



Zombs, can we assume that I took you up on your bet and that you owe me $20?

Going to try to say this without affecting the game for players still alive:

thellama73 wrote:There seems to be some confusion about this, so let me clear it up.

If you're going to say things like "Russ definitely has to be bad" you better be able to back it up with voting record analysis or in-thread info.

If secret info is the reason you think that, then don't say it. Make an actual case based on publicly available info.

Jesus Christ.

FZ. wrote:I expected Donners to come in and prevent this lynch and I think I was pretty clear about it. This lynch is on their hands.

Zomberella12 wrote:Okay, there are three baddies out there that all got defended. Unless they are all in cahoots, there are civvies out there ago are defending baddies and not defending civvies (ie Russ). Come on people, what are you doing!?!

llama is right, FZ. and Zombs are dead wrong. To me there is absolutely no grey area there. I don't want to play any more mafia games where people think it's civs' responsibility to reveal info or vouch for each other, and I do only want to play mafia that is based on casebuilding and publicly available info.

I will be quitting any future games in which people infodump.

Sure - the check is in the mail

I'm still new at this and apparently still unclear about some things. If I learn something from BTSC and it makes me want to vote for a specific person, then I can't vote for that person without finding evidence against them in the thread? I see why this would be good. But it also sets up a situation where someone could refuse to post and then expect to be safe from lynching because there wasn't anything in any of their posts to convict them. It's also a rule that no one has been following - lots of people said things like "I trust so and so" or "I don't trust so and so" without any explanation. I really did think you were bad. Sorry I was wrong.

linki - Without vouching, doesn't the game just turn into random luck?

Voted *a* because I like to vote the letter at the top.

Russ, if you wanted to play a game based on building cases for baddie behaviour, this was not it.

Everything I said, was checked with Roxy. This includes talking about previous roles, making pacts and whatever it is I said. While I really enjoyed the game (apart from the accusations I got for info dumping) because it does require logical thinking and stratigizing, this is by no means a mafia game, hence your "morally superior rules" regarding info dumping are just wrong in this case... The only real rule was not to say who you are now and what your power is, or what your power was.

If were a baddie, I'd just vouch for my team knowing that next day I'd rotate and my actions would have no consequences, unlike any other mafia game, because now I'm good, so just because I lied last day, doesn't mean you should lynch me this day. The one thing that was the same as regular mafia, was the lying and deception. Smart baddies would use that anyway they can and for once defend their team like crazy. We wouldn't have been able to know which team was lying, because the one thing we weren't allowed to say is, what team we are. So it was one team's word against the others.

Not my fault people didn't play this game like they should have. Now, I'm done playing. Have a good day.

I like playing games with experimental mechanics. You see what works and what does not for future games, and it is always fun to try something new.

In fairness to the players, and with the greatest love and respect to Roxy, the mechanics of the game sort of inevitably set up arguments like this.

I got a little frustrated last night, I was feeling the blame and feeling like a crappy teammate. Sorry I got frustrated in the thread.

Not used to a game that is built around vouching. I'm used to shooting in the dark most of the time.

thellama73 wrote:In fairness to the players, and with the greatest love and respect to Roxy, the mechanics of the game sort of inevitably set up arguments like this.

I for one have loved every second of playing this game and watching it now that I'm dead. Perhaps my favorite speed game I have ever played. and I mean it.

S~V~S wrote:Too late it's gone, and was when i went to catch it after I posted

[ded]I'm sure other civs here will be helpful with that, out of a sense of responsability. [/ded]

Go away dead, civvie murderer.

When it is dead people talk on topic daywe will call you

It's best to dive headfirst into an unconventional game and figure out how to win it within its own unique system. keys56billion could not get there in the Monopoly game, and his fun quotient diminished significantly because of it. He was there to play a more standard Mafia game, and I feel like he was stuck in that point of view, and never redeveloped his notions from the ground up of 'how to win'.

Same with this game. We're playing Texas Hold'em here, and maybe some people are still upset that they don't get to put any cards down from their hand to draw new ones.

voted o

Forgot to post before, I voted E again. Lots of E in my life as compared to other letters. Yes indeed.

S~V~S wrote:Go away dead, civvie murderer.

When it is dead people talk on topic daywe will call you

MovingPictures07 wrote:

thellama73 wrote:In fairness to the players, and with the greatest love and respect to Roxy, the mechanics of the game sort of inevitably set up arguments like this.

I for one have loved every second of playing this game and watching it now that I'm dead. Perhaps my favorite speed game I have ever played. and I mean it.

My favorite game so far for sure!

Down another civvie, this does not bode well for us. I'm scared to say anything, FZ had her super-secret spreadsheets, and she got killed for it!

Let me be first to welcome our anthropomorphic overlords Wasatch and Hunger and....Pestilence (I don't remember who's left).

Snowman wrote:Down another civvie, this does not bode well for us. I'm scared to say anything, FZ had her super-secret spreadsheets, and she got killed for it!

Let me be first to welcome our anthropomorphic overlords Wasatch and Hunger and....Pestilence (I don't remember who's left).

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Snowman wrote:Down another civvie, this does not bode well for us. I'm scared to say anything, FZ had her super-secret spreadsheets, and she got killed for it!

Let me be first to welcome our anthropomorphic overlords Wasatch and Hunger and....Pestilence (I don't remember who's left).

RIP FZ.

Quiet day. Anyone have any thoughts? I was fairly gung ho to go after Ty, but with the role shifts I don't know that if that is wise any longer. If no one's going to talk today, it's going to be hard to find a baddie.

I guess the question is: Who would have been most likely to grant FZ's request and kill her?

Guys this is not official or anything, but Roxy has a sick family member, so she may or may not be by before the lynch.

So lets carry on with the lynching

So Llama, you say no go on Ty. I can dig it. Who do you propose in his place?

S~V~S wrote:Guys this is not official or anything, but Roxy has a sick family member, so she may or may not be by before the lynch.

So lets carry on with the lynching

So Llama, you say no go on Ty. I can dig it. Who do you propose in his place?

This is the problem. No one has said anything today. If the roles all (or mostly) changed, then we have nothing to go on. I am at a bit of a loss. Do you have any thoughts?

We know that two people did what FZ asked them to do. I think you're too stubborn to have done it, so I don't want to lynch you (I realized roles might have changed, but this is the best I've got so far.)

That means I'm looking for someone merciful, which to me says Black Rock or Zombrella, or maybe Bass.

Well, I am going to go out on a limb and say I was bad yesterday, not last night, the night before. I am not bad now. I do know that there is a civ out there without a safety net, though. So I worry about that.

I have a few people off the table, you appear to as well. Bass is with his Mom & family, I am not going to lynch him while he is in this situation.

LOL, linki, you are so right I was still bad right before the switch (2 switches ago, or 1.5 switches?) when she begged the baddies to kill her, and I wanted no part of that. Then there was a rotation.

I say no to all three of those, though. It COULD have been Bass, but not lynching someone at the hospital with a sick family member. I am weak, I know. Any opinion on Snowman or LC?

S~V~S wrote:Well, I am going to go out on a limb and say I was bad yesterday, not last night, the night before. I am not bad now. I do know that there is a civ out there without a safety net, though. So I worry about that.

I have a few people off the table, you appear to as well. Bass is with his Mom & family, I am not going to lynch him while he is in this situation.

LOL, linki, you are so right I was still bad right before the switch (2 switches ago, or 1.5 switches?) when she begged the baddies to kill her, and I wanted no part of that. Then there was a rotation.

I say no to all three of those, though. It COULD have been Bass, but not lynching someone at the hospital with a sick family member. I am weak, I know. Any opinion on Snowman or LC?

I haven't figured out snowman's game yet. He is clearly one of those unconventional players like Vomps or AP who is hard to read. I had a suspicion of LC a few cycles back, but who knows now.

I don't see Ty as active enough to reliably send in Night Kill PMs, so I doubt he is Wasatch or Weather at this point.

It's probably quiet because of Death Note starting and being so talkative. If the double kill on FZ. is all we have to go on, then it's slim pickins. Bass was in on the pact that FZ. knew about, maybe he has some information he'd like to share.

The only danger involving Snowman...is the danger of falling in love with him.

You were bad?! Wait, I thought they said that if you started out bad you stayed bad. I know SVS didn't start out bad, you were good, then bad, then good again? I thought when people started to die off this crazy game would begin to make sense. If the baddies are converting, then I honestly have no idea who's legit. I've been sticking up for former BTSC chums,

Great, I'll probably go bad on the last round, sounds about right.

Really don't have a good idea of who I should vote for. Open to suggestions. If Ty has support, and Bass is off limits, who's the prime suspect?