The Syndicate

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:06 pm Actually don't hate the lynch Alison/Dizzy/Mac/Me until we find wolf rn. I'm about 90% there's one ni there

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:06 pm Actually don't hate the lynch Alison/Dizzy/Mac/Me until we find wolf rn. I'm about 90% there's one ni there

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:08 pm

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:06 pm Actually don't hate the lynch Alison/Dizzy/Mac/Me until we find wolf rn. I'm about 90% there's one ni there

Including yourself for that good wifom, I see your game

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:10 pmUm.

I was included in the original list.

To not include me would be bad.

Okay?

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:00 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 11:46 am Who're my teammates, from your point of view?

Nanook, your other scumread has been pretty staunchly pushing me since D1, and has unflinchingly agreed to sheep Axe who has been one of my biggest detractors. Lucky and Syn/Mac, two of the people defending me, are high in your townreads. If your answer is just "they're buried somewhere in the nullreads", I'd expect to see more concerted digging into those slots from you. Because that in world there's two in Fingers/Ender/Lu Ren/TSP which would make them pretty profitable to engage with, but instead it's been Alison Alison Alison the whole day.

I have discussed this in one of my posts. I don't think Lu Ren, probably not Fingers. TPS/Axe/Ender maybe Nanook/Syn.

Also I asked you the same (indirectly)

I literally read the whole thread and have written whatever notes I have on everyone and asked question in order to engage.

The fuck is this. If you're going to shade me for focusing only on you you should vote yourself.

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:10 pm I think Alison is the correct choice for yeet today. Her play has been very different than what I've seen from her town play in the past, and the differences all have potential scum motive, which I'm going to say makes a lot of sense given Alison's take on mafia.

1. Her DoO thunderdome: I think this is very uncharacteristic of Alison. Town!Alison is adverse to thunderdomes because of their effect on the the thread, and also tunneling/confbias is not optimal play, but Alison REALLY pushed DoO to thunderdome (never used this word, but the continual pushing is indicative of this). Normally when Alison forms a strong scumread, she will just make sure the thread is aware, and then move on to finding the rest of scum/town hunting.

2. Her general approach: Alison I feel has not been trying to sort the whole game. Most of D1 she focused a lot on a few scumreads, and threw out a few little townreads, but doesn't have the holistic approach she usually does, hunting from both directions. She also threw out her "sheep my reads if I die" catchphrase when she had only scumreads, normally she would say that when she had reads on almost everyone. Alison will scumread people for PoE reasons, but I've never seen her townread people for PoE reasons, and I think in general that is bad play, so I don't see Alison getting 3 suspects and claiming the game is over and to just sheep her reads. It felt really fake.

3. Her townread of me: Alison has never seen me wolf, but claims to have a towntell on me. It was a garbage towntell as well, and when I asked her to give me evidence that this is a towntell for me, Alison couldn't elaborate. Normally Alison has actually good reasons to townread people, and so her citing a bogus "towntell" that she can't back up is (scum)telling.

4. Alison engaging me with regards to Dizzy at SoD2 felt really slimy. Alison wanted me to commit to sheeping her reads if she flips town, and after I said I think Dizzy has scum equity if Alison is town, Alison asks me about what I would feel about Dizzy if Alison flips town. It really felt like she was trying to manipulate me into helping her form a Dizzy wagon. No bueno.

Luckbox Inc wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:33 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:10 pm I think Alison is the correct choice for yeet today. Her play has been very different than what I've seen from her town play in the past, and the differences all have potential scum motive, which I'm going to say makes a lot of sense given Alison's take on mafia.

1. Her DoO thunderdome: I think this is very uncharacteristic of Alison. Town!Alison is adverse to thunderdomes because of their effect on the the thread, and also tunneling/confbias is not optimal play, but Alison REALLY pushed DoO to thunderdome (never used this word, but the continual pushing is indicative of this). Normally when Alison forms a strong scumread, she will just make sure the thread is aware, and then move on to finding the rest of scum/town hunting.

2. Her general approach: Alison I feel has not been trying to sort the whole game. Most of D1 she focused a lot on a few scumreads, and threw out a few little townreads, but doesn't have the holistic approach she usually does, hunting from both directions. She also threw out her "sheep my reads if I die" catchphrase when she had only scumreads, normally she would say that when she had reads on almost everyone. Alison will scumread people for PoE reasons, but I've never seen her townread people for PoE reasons, and I think in general that is bad play, so I don't see Alison getting 3 suspects and claiming the game is over and to just sheep her reads. It felt really fake.

3. Her townread of me: Alison has never seen me wolf, but claims to have a towntell on me. It was a garbage towntell as well, and when I asked her to give me evidence that this is a towntell for me, Alison couldn't elaborate. Normally Alison has actually good reasons to townread people, and so her citing a bogus "towntell" that she can't back up is (scum)telling.

4. Alison engaging me with regards to Dizzy at SoD2 felt really slimy. Alison wanted me to commit to sheeping her reads if she flips town, and after I said I think Dizzy has scum equity if Alison is town, Alison asks me about what I would feel about Dizzy if Alison flips town. It really felt like she was trying to manipulate me into helping her form a Dizzy wagon. No bueno.

I think you're a still even if you want to kill Alison and think that this is a good post and that it's "the right sort of reads".

It's not a facetious case at all-- Alison just seems too villagery though.

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:10 pm I think Alison is the correct choice for yeet today. Her play has been very different than what I've seen from her town play in the past, and the differences all have potential scum motive, which I'm going to say makes a lot of sense given Alison's take on mafia.

1. Her DoO thunderdome: I think this is very uncharacteristic of Alison. Town!Alison is adverse to thunderdomes because of their effect on the the thread, and also tunneling/confbias is not optimal play, but Alison REALLY pushed DoO to thunderdome (never used this word, but the continual pushing is indicative of this). Normally when Alison forms a strong scumread, she will just make sure the thread is aware, and then move on to finding the rest of scum/town hunting.

2. Her general approach: Alison I feel has not been trying to sort the whole game. Most of D1 she focused a lot on a few scumreads, and threw out a few little townreads, but doesn't have the holistic approach she usually does, hunting from both directions. She also threw out her "sheep my reads if I die" catchphrase when she had only scumreads, normally she would say that when she had reads on almost everyone. Alison will scumread people for PoE reasons, but I've never seen her townread people for PoE reasons, and I think in general that is bad play, so I don't see Alison getting 3 suspects and claiming the game is over and to just sheep her reads. It felt really fake.

3. Her townread of me: Alison has never seen me wolf, but claims to have a towntell on me. It was a garbage towntell as well, and when I asked her to give me evidence that this is a towntell for me, Alison couldn't elaborate. Normally Alison has actually good reasons to townread people, and so her citing a bogus "towntell" that she can't back up is (scum)telling.

4. Alison engaging me with regards to Dizzy at SoD2 felt really slimy. Alison wanted me to commit to sheeping her reads if she flips town, and after I said I think Dizzy has scum equity if Alison is town, Alison asks me about what I would feel about Dizzy if Alison flips town. It really felt like she was trying to manipulate me into helping her form a Dizzy wagon. No bueno.

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:35 pm Have you played with Alison before?

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:35 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:10 pm I think Alison is the correct choice for yeet today. Her play has been very different than what I've seen from her town play in the past, and the differences all have potential scum motive, which I'm going to say makes a lot of sense given Alison's take on mafia.

1. Her DoO thunderdome: I think this is very uncharacteristic of Alison. Town!Alison is adverse to thunderdomes because of their effect on the the thread, and also tunneling/confbias is not optimal play, but Alison REALLY pushed DoO to thunderdome (never used this word, but the continual pushing is indicative of this). Normally when Alison forms a strong scumread, she will just make sure the thread is aware, and then move on to finding the rest of scum/town hunting.

2. Her general approach: Alison I feel has not been trying to sort the whole game. Most of D1 she focused a lot on a few scumreads, and threw out a few little townreads, but doesn't have the holistic approach she usually does, hunting from both directions. She also threw out her "sheep my reads if I die" catchphrase when she had only scumreads, normally she would say that when she had reads on almost everyone. Alison will scumread people for PoE reasons, but I've never seen her townread people for PoE reasons, and I think in general that is bad play, so I don't see Alison getting 3 suspects and claiming the game is over and to just sheep her reads. It felt really fake.

3. Her townread of me: Alison has never seen me wolf, but claims to have a towntell on me. It was a garbage towntell as well, and when I asked her to give me evidence that this is a towntell for me, Alison couldn't elaborate. Normally Alison has actually good reasons to townread people, and so her citing a bogus "towntell" that she can't back up is (scum)telling.

4. Alison engaging me with regards to Dizzy at SoD2 felt really slimy. Alison wanted me to commit to sheeping her reads if she flips town, and after I said I think Dizzy has scum equity if Alison is town, Alison asks me about what I would feel about Dizzy if Alison flips town. It really felt like she was trying to manipulate me into helping her form a Dizzy wagon. No bueno.

Virtually everything you have listed are not only things I do as town, but might actually be things I do more as town. I don't know where you get the idea that I don't tell people to sheep me when I only have scumreads, don't thunderdome, and don't manipulate people into wagoning my strongest scumread as town, but I do all these things in many/most of my town games.

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:38 pm You clearly don't know me then.

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:41 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:38 pm You clearly don't know me then.

Or... and bear with me here... you're a wolf.

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:47 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:41 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:38 pm You clearly don't know me then.

Or... and bear with me here... you're a wolf.

Nope.

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:50 pm Listen, just because you aren't aware something is a towntell for you doesn't mean other people can't see it that way.

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:51 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:50 pm Listen, just because you aren't aware something is a towntell for you doesn't mean other people can't see it that way.

Which of my wolf games have you read?

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:53 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:51 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:50 pm Listen, just because you aren't aware something is a towntell for you doesn't mean other people can't see it that way.

Which of my wolf games have you read?

None. Why do you ask?

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:54 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:53 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:51 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:50 pm Listen, just because you aren't aware something is a towntell for you doesn't mean other people can't see it that way.

Which of my wolf games have you read?

None. Why do you ask?

You can't expect me to believe you have a towntell on me when you haven't even seen me wolf.

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:56 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:54 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:53 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:51 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:50 pm Listen, just because you aren't aware something is a towntell for you doesn't mean other people can't see it that way.

Which of my wolf games have you read?

None. Why do you ask?

You can't expect me to believe you have a towntell on me when you haven't even seen me wolf.

I don't really think that you need to see someone wolf to think that something is a towntell for them.

In fact, iirc, the very first game we played together in Spank!, I called out your reaction test on me lying about how long you've been playing mafia as a towntell for you, even though I've never seen you scum before.

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 4:39 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 4:33 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 4:30 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 4:27 pm @Alison Why do you townread me?

Because "I've done nothing townie, why do you townread me" is a towntell for you.

I also like how active you are in generating activity and clashing with players. You're putting in effort to engage with multiple players and try to solve in a situation where you could easily phone it in.

Can you name another game where I did this?

I just had a scum game where I hardslanked the whole time and had less than 50 posts the whole game, so if I was scum, I would actively work to not look like I did in AtLA. How does that factor into your thinking?

1) Nope. I remember you doing it one game, but I can't remember what it was. It's more of a mindset thing where you question people's motivations rather than just accepting the townread. I'd compare it to what Esooa does, where she constantly pesters people about why they townread her. There's a similar thread of pseudo-reaction-testing line of thinking.

2) It doesn't. If you cared about meta, you'd want to not look like your scum game as either town or scum, because you don't want to be scumread as either alignment. If you didn't care about meta, then all that's happened is that you're putting in a lot more effort/solving than the last time you're scum.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:12 pm Took another look at TSP and there's literally nothing and then a town lean on Falcon.

@TonyStarkPrime Play more it's like super fun I promise

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:52 pm [VOTE: TSP] aubergine

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:29 pmI have spent a lot of time today talking about things other than you.

Axe/Nanook have been pushing me continuously, Synslot is supposedly a townread of yours.

So unless you think I'm being D1 bussed by Axe/Nook for no reason you should be zooming down to TSP/Ender, but I don't see any interest directed their way at all. Nor do I see you thinking about the associations between me and Axe/Nanook, you're just throwing out names.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:08 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:52 pm [VOTE: TSP] aubergine

Is this tmi that you’re a wolf

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:05 pm Nah, now you're conflating specific towntells for people and general towny things. Doing convoluted reaction tests are hard for scum to come up with and is a general town indicator. Me asking why someone townreads me is NOT a hard thing for scum to do, and is NOT a general town indicator. You made out like it was a specific TOWNTELL FOR ME. When asked about it, you tried to back it up with evidence from MY games. Now you're claiming it is a general town indicator, when it is clearly not, and when it is clear that isn't what you originally meant.

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:46 amAs for Lu Ren, their attitude and progression has been town-lined. The "No re" is slightly a joke but I'd have to re-read and find a lot more scumminess than I've seen to reverse it.

Every time Lu has been in thread they've acted in a town manner. I can case it at some point maybe, but I've been tired-ish last few days.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:23 pm I really don't think Alison treats me this way if she's town. She's straight up ignoring everything that should make me town to her, and then saying I'm doing stuff that I'm not actual doing (or not doing stuff that I'm actually doing). Am I the only one seeing this? At this point I'm just chop whoever of me and Alison you prefer, if whoever flips town, flip the other. That's probably objectively bad, but in this game I can't really see myself changing my opinion on Alison. If we're both town then wtf happened tbh

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:27 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:05 pm Nah, now you're conflating specific towntells for people and general towny things. Doing convoluted reaction tests are hard for scum to come up with and is a general town indicator. Me asking why someone townreads me is NOT a hard thing for scum to do, and is NOT a general town indicator. You made out like it was a specific TOWNTELL FOR ME. When asked about it, you tried to back it up with evidence from MY games. Now you're claiming it is a general town indicator, when it is clearly not, and when it is clear that isn't what you originally meant.

I'm not conflating it, I'm saying I think it's a specific towntell for you and have said that since the start. I've seen you do it in town games and it's in line with the general method and mindset I've seen you play as town. If Mac and Esooa did it, I wouldn't think twice of it - it isn't a general town indicator. I just think it's specifically a towntell for you.

I'm sorry if you don't feel like I could read you that well as town to figure out if doing X is something you'd do as town or scum, but that's my read.

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:32 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:27 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:05 pm Nah, now you're conflating specific towntells for people and general towny things. Doing convoluted reaction tests are hard for scum to come up with and is a general town indicator. Me asking why someone townreads me is NOT a hard thing for scum to do, and is NOT a general town indicator. You made out like it was a specific TOWNTELL FOR ME. When asked about it, you tried to back it up with evidence from MY games. Now you're claiming it is a general town indicator, when it is clearly not, and when it is clear that isn't what you originally meant.

I'm not conflating it, I'm saying I think it's a specific towntell for you and have said that since the start. I've seen you do it in town games and it's in line with the general method and mindset I've seen you play as town. If Mac and Esooa did it, I wouldn't think twice of it - it isn't a general town indicator. I just think it's specifically a towntell for you.

I'm sorry if you don't feel like I could read you that well as town to figure out if doing X is something you'd do as town or scum, but that's my read.

or... you're a wolf.

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:35 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:32 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:27 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:05 pm Nah, now you're conflating specific towntells for people and general towny things. Doing convoluted reaction tests are hard for scum to come up with and is a general town indicator. Me asking why someone townreads me is NOT a hard thing for scum to do, and is NOT a general town indicator. You made out like it was a specific TOWNTELL FOR ME. When asked about it, you tried to back it up with evidence from MY games. Now you're claiming it is a general town indicator, when it is clearly not, and when it is clear that isn't what you originally meant.

I'm not conflating it, I'm saying I think it's a specific towntell for you and have said that since the start. I've seen you do it in town games and it's in line with the general method and mindset I've seen you play as town. If Mac and Esooa did it, I wouldn't think twice of it - it isn't a general town indicator. I just think it's specifically a towntell for you.

I'm sorry if you don't feel like I could read you that well as town to figure out if doing X is something you'd do as town or scum, but that's my read.

or... you're a wolf.

One day you will learn that just because you can't do something doesn't mean nobody else can.

Luckbox Inc wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:56 pm [VOTE: Fingers] aubergine

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:57 pm

Luckbox Inc wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:56 pm [VOTE: Fingers] aubergine

Why

Luckbox Inc wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:57 pm Let's just not do the Alison/Dizzy stuff today. Let them battle it out another day.

Fingers/TSP or some other suggestions please.

Alison wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:58 pm You don't think resolving Alison/Dizzy will shed light on the game?

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 2:01 pm

Luckbox Inc wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:57 pm Let's just not do the Alison/Dizzy stuff today. Let them battle it out another day.

Fingers/TSP or some other suggestions please.

What do you feel town will learn by letting them battle another day?

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 2:01 pm

Luckbox Inc wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:57 pm Let's just not do the Alison/Dizzy stuff today. Let them battle it out another day.

Fingers/TSP or some other suggestions please.

What do you feel town will learn by letting them battle another day?