The Syndicate

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:45 am

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:35 am I’m pretty sure sloonei is mafia because he keeps pushing the weirdest angles

I really like this take and will put a vote on Sloonei for now.

[VOTE: Sloonei] aubergine

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:48 am

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:45 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:43 am I think Johanna seems town.

@ilario what is your present view of Son of Anarch?

Fell off today but still towny enough

If you’re town I understand why you’re not sure of some prior town reads. I am experiencing some similar turbulence. I think you’re taking the tinfoil the wrong direction though (certainly in my case), and I believe SoA needs a more rigorous reassessment. He may yet be town, but I don’t think his posts are that hard for mafia to make.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:49 am

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:47 am
I do wish you would be as cooperative as you expect Axehole to be.

The purpose of my questions for Johanna is to develop my read on her. We have barely gotten started, thus my read on her has not changed.

Why is she town?

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:51 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:48 am

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:45 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:43 am I think Johanna seems town.

@ilario what is your present view of Son of Anarch?

Fell off today but still towny enough

If you’re town I understand why you’re not sure of some prior town reads. I am experiencing some similar turbulence. I think you’re taking the tinfoil the wrong direction though (certainly in my case), and I believe SoA needs a more rigorous reassessment. He may yet be town, but I don’t think his posts are that hard for mafia to make.

Okay, it seems that everyone is uneasy on him so I’ll give it a reread. Can you meet me halfway and talk me through your reads on lc and sloonei.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:49 am

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:47 am
I do wish you would be as cooperative as you expect Axehole to be.

The purpose of my questions for Johanna is to develop my read on her. We have barely gotten started, thus my read on her has not changed.

Why is she town?

Johanna wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:44 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:37 am I don't think Lime Coke is a consensus town read. I'm iffy on him, at the very least.

No one has anything to read G-man off of. He is a suspect by virtue of not being able to be town-read.

Is TSP just a "lock" because of his claim?

Marmot should be a fairly memorable player. He's been around. I'd recommend perusing his ISO.

Not many people have posted reads list on D2 so far and he was definitely high in the townreads of most lists D1.

TSP is not technically lock but if he's lying about it it will self-resolve. I think his attitude towards the mechanics (encouraging false claims d1) has been vastly more pro-town than ANYTHING that ANYONE ELSE has done so far. He's been kind of cryptic but I don't know that that's an uncommon trait.

And PRECISELY because Marmot has been around and yet nothing he has said or done are in any way shape or form memorable or remarkable, despite you saying that they should be, makes me think something's off.

I'm not the first person to remark on his seemingly ethereal quality.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:49 am

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:45 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:43 am

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:40 am Lc, jjj, you, Dolby maybe (?), tsp if he’s not the watcher,

I would like to see you grill jjj harder

Is the top line a list of names you are uneasy about?

I feel no need to grill Jay at present. He is town until further notice.

Yup pmuch

Why have Jay and I slid in your view? Either individually or as the unit that we are.

Also I am interested in your Lime Coke thoughts.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:49 am

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:47 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:46 am

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:43 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:41 am

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:40 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:23 am @Johanna hi my vote is on you, but I know nothing about you! Talk to me about the game. Say any things you want, feel free to bring up any topics you think are under-represented in the discussion so far, or reiterate old points, or whatever.

I think Johanna has been talking for a while now, has your read on her changed?

I'm aware she has been talking. I'm trying to engage her directly because that's the most helpful way for me to read folks, especially when they are new to me.
What is your read on her?

Yes, but has your read on her changed?

I think she's town.

TBD.

Why is she town?

I do wish you would be as cooperative as you expect Axehole to be.

The purpose of my questions for Johanna is to develop my read on her. We have barely gotten started, thus my read on her has not changed.

Why is she town?

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:57 am
Lc is probably scum tbh

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:51 am

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:45 am

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:35 am I’m pretty sure sloonei is mafia because he keeps pushing the weirdest angles

I really like this take and will put a vote on Sloonei for now.

[VOTE: Sloonei] aubergine

This is ilario's first (technically second, but whatever) time playing with me, so it's natural for him to assume the default New To Me position.

This is not your first time playing with me, Marmot.

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:57 am You and jay mostly slid just because I found Johanna and NAA to be very towny today. At which point I reached a threshold of having too many townreads. At that point I asked myself who am I more likely to be misreading. On one hand I have players such as Johanna, naa, soa who seem relatively new to FM. On the other hand I have seasoned vets with a decade worth of experience who were are commanding voices in the game that’s leading us to a poe that I don’t feel all to comfortable with. At that point I figured it’s likely that I’m misreading someone in the latter.

Johanna wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:58 am Well, ilario, I've been playing FM since 2012 and I have about ~60 games under my belt.

I'm just new to the site.

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:59 am

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:57 am
Lc is probably scum tbh

Kek

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:00 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:51 am

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:45 am

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:35 am I’m pretty sure sloonei is mafia because he keeps pushing the weirdest angles

I really like this take and will put a vote on Sloonei for now.

[VOTE: Sloonei] aubergine

This is ilario's first (technically second, but whatever) time playing with me, so it's natural for him to assume the default New To Me position.

This is not your first time playing with me, Marmot.

Correct, this is not my first time playing with you.

Similarly.

This is not your first time playing with me.


Why do you want Johanna to look at and talk about me?

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:01 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:59 am

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:57 am
Lc is probably scum tbh

Kek

He was one of my very first srs btw

Incase you didn’t know

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:01 pm

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:57 am You and jay mostly slid just because I found Johanna and NAA to be very towny today. At which point I reached a threshold of having too many townreads. At that point I asked myself who am I more likely to be misreading. On one hand I have players such as Johanna, naa, soa who seem relatively new to FM. On the other hand I have seasoned vets with a decade worth of experience who were are commanding voices in the game that’s leading us to a poe that I don’t feel all to comfortable with. At that point I figured it’s likely that I’m misreading someone in the latter.

That is not an unfair thought process. But I am town, and I am confident at the present that Jay is too.

I will not ask you to adopt a town read on either of if it is not what you feel in your heart. But I think, rather than dealing in accusations, we talk about that aforementioned POE. You say you have not felt comfortable with the direction it has been going. Excluding Jay and myself (for the sake of this mental exercise), what other changes would you make?

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:02 pm

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:01 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:59 am

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:57 am
Lc is probably scum tbh

Kek

He was one of my very first srs btw

Incase you didn’t know

I'm just laughing at the guy who's voting him having bad reads.

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:58 am Sure. You did make a read and place a vote on her earlier today. So your read did take some shape without any interaction. Why do you feel that interaction is necessary to answer this question?

I think her shift from her original uncomfortable-looking catchup post to hitting the ground running today look good for her. I'm willing to accept that there's an explanation for the discomfort in that catchup post aside from "she is mafia".

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:53 am For everyone:

We all communicate in different ways. We have to identify how people operate and then respect those modes as well as we can.

Continually circling over how we’re frustrating each other isn’t going to make this game thread productive. Let people do what they do, and if it’s not working for you (the general “you”) then try to adapt yourself instead of spamming someone into your own communicative box.

Just base advisement. Take or leave. The game isn’t terribly comfortable right now, and I think that’s the first step toward changing that.

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:01 pm

Johanna wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:58 am Well, ilario, I've been playing FM since 2012 and I have about ~60 games under my belt.

I'm just new to the site.

You don't read like a new player. I don't think anyone reasonable would assume that you were.

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:02 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:01 pm

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:57 am You and jay mostly slid just because I found Johanna and NAA to be very towny today. At which point I reached a threshold of having too many townreads. At that point I asked myself who am I more likely to be misreading. On one hand I have players such as Johanna, naa, soa who seem relatively new to FM. On the other hand I have seasoned vets with a decade worth of experience who were are commanding voices in the game that’s leading us to a poe that I don’t feel all to comfortable with. At that point I figured it’s likely that I’m misreading someone in the latter.

That is not an unfair thought process. But I am town, and I am confident at the present that Jay is too.

I will not ask you to adopt a town read on either of if it is not what you feel in your heart. But I think, rather than dealing in accusations, we talk about that aforementioned POE. You say you have not felt comfortable with the direction it has been going. Excluding Jay and myself (for the sake of this mental exercise), what other changes would you make?

Well what’s the current poe looking like fypov ? I’ll tell you what I’ll add in fmpov

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:05 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:01 pm

Johanna wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:58 am Well, ilario, I've been playing FM since 2012 and I have about ~60 games under my belt.

I'm just new to the site.

You don't read like a new player. I don't think anyone reasonable would assume that you were.

The key word is relative btw. You would have picked up on that if you actually bother to read things properly. The 60 games she has probably doesn’t compare with sloonei and jjj have. But knowing that she does have that many games makes me more doubtful on her now

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:06 pm @Sloonei

I think you’re town. I’m opening with that sentence because I don’t want people taking the following comments and running with them while I am not here.

I do have one concern. I have, at isolated moments, thought you might be laying your shtick on a little thick. Your pokes at NAA seemed to reach beyond a point of standing a chance of helping you “understand”, for example. At a certain point it ought to be clear something isn’t working The Sloonei Way. That’s one example and the most significant. There’ve been a couple others where Sloonei Patience seemed to give way to Sloonei Stubbornness.

Do what you will with those comments I suppose. Does it surprise you that I feel that way? Why might I feel that way? Something something

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:05 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:53 am For everyone:

We all communicate in different ways. We have to identify how people operate and then respect those modes as well as we can.

Continually circling over how we’re frustrating each other isn’t going to make this game thread productive. Let people do what they do, and if it’s not working for you (the general “you”) then try to adapt yourself instead of spamming someone into your own communicative box.

Just base advisement. Take or leave. The game isn’t terribly comfortable right now, and I think that’s the first step toward changing that.

What does your PoE look like right now?

Do you think the discomfort you're experiencing is primarily from playstyle clashes or from the lack of distinct, consensus suspects, or something else?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:06 pm

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:02 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:01 pm

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:57 am You and jay mostly slid just because I found Johanna and NAA to be very towny today. At which point I reached a threshold of having too many townreads. At that point I asked myself who am I more likely to be misreading. On one hand I have players such as Johanna, naa, soa who seem relatively new to FM. On the other hand I have seasoned vets with a decade worth of experience who were are commanding voices in the game that’s leading us to a poe that I don’t feel all to comfortable with. At that point I figured it’s likely that I’m misreading someone in the latter.

That is not an unfair thought process. But I am town, and I am confident at the present that Jay is too.

I will not ask you to adopt a town read on either of if it is not what you feel in your heart. But I think, rather than dealing in accusations, we talk about that aforementioned POE. You say you have not felt comfortable with the direction it has been going. Excluding Jay and myself (for the sake of this mental exercise), what other changes would you make?

Well what’s the current poe looking like fypov ? I’ll tell you what I’ll add in fmpov

I am specifically asking about what you perceived the POE to be at the time that you decided you were uncomfortable with. At the moment you began to distrust SloonJay, what specifically was the source of that distrust?

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:11 pm I perceived the poe to be mostly the low posters/some combination of gman/dolby/marmot/Johanna/naa

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:09 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:06 pm @Sloonei

I think you’re town. I’m opening with that sentence because I don’t want people taking the following comments and running with them while I am not here.

I do have one concern. I have, at isolated moments, thought you might be laying your shtick on a little thick. Your pokes at NAA seemed to reach beyond a point of standing a chance of helping you “understand”, for example. At a certain point it ought to be clear something isn’t working The Sloonei Way. That’s one example and the most significant. There’ve been a couple others where Sloonei Patience seemed to give way to Sloonei Stubbornness.

Do what you will with those comments I suppose. Does it surprise you that I feel that way? Why might I feel that way? Something something

I got more frustrated with NAA than I liked, so I've decided to try to focus elsehwere.

I do not know what the last sentence of your big paragraph means.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:12 pm

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:11 pm I perceived the poe to be mostly the low posters/some combination of gman/dolby/marmot/Johanna/naa

How would you rank those players?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:16 pm It would REALLY help me if I could hear in clear terms an answer to the following:

Why is Lime Coke mafia?

I seriously do not know. What’s the problem? Y’all could be right. It has felt to me like RVS-period problems just never disappeared in his case for some people no matter what he posted. I am sure tge case is more nuanced than that.

So help me out, please and thank you.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:02 pm Because I suspect you, and talking to her about a player I suspect can potentially give me quality about each of you.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:16 pm It would REALLY help me if I could hear in clear terms an answer to the following:

Why is Lime Coke mafia?

I seriously do not know. What’s the problem? Y’all could be right. It has felt to me like RVS-period problems just never disappeared in his case for some people no matter what he posted. I am sure tge case is more nuanced than that.

So help me out, please and thank you.

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:13 pm The source of the distrust was that 1. I found your opening shade of me to ping me 2. I found that jjj commenting that I would poison spf as something potentially he did as mafia to frame me 3. I felt like you were asking some questions just for the sake of asking questions and I couldn’t tell what direction you were going with those questions (eg who we thoufht the watcher report will be) 4. I still think lc is scummy so jjj taking him out of the poe yesterday pinged me

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:18 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:02 pm Because I suspect you, and talking to her about a player I suspect can potentially give me quality about each of you.

Could you expound on your suspicion of me just so everyone's on the same page?

Looking through your ISO, I've seen you ask me a number of questions about things that I have said, but your reasons for voting me are often the same:

No good reason, I just don't like all the votes on sig and feel like Marmot can get some attention too.
Poll diversity. You have not earned a town read yet, but you have not been a big topic of discussion either.
At present I am not uncomfortable voting for either marmot or sig. it is slightly worrying that I don’t have any names beyond those two.
We seem to be circling around Marmot and sig as our primary options for today, but neither has an overwhelming case against them.
I put my vote on Marmot a while ago because sig had all the votes and there was no productive reason for me to leave mine there. Marmot was next in line for some scrutiny.


There is a common theme here that I have perceived, that you want to push my name for discussion but have not voiced a suspicion about anything that I've done. Is this intentional? Or am I missing something?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:18 pm

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:13 pm The source of the distrust was that 1. I found your opening shade of me to ping me 2. I found that jjj commenting that I would poison spf as something potentially he did as mafia to frame me 3. I felt like you were asking some questions just for the sake of asking questions and I couldn’t tell what direction you were going with those questions (eg who we thoufht the watcher report will be) 4. I still think lc is scummy so jjj taking him out of the poe yesterday pinged me

1. I don't remember shading you. I went back to read my early posts. If you are referring to this post, it was not meant as shade. I had no read on you one way or another at a time when others were announcing town reads on you. I wanted to know why that was happening.
2. Jay can answer that for himself if he wants.
3. Yeah I get that a lot. I'm going somewhere. I was admittedly trying to grill Marmot a little harder with the TSP/Watcher stuff last night. But I think it can be a fruitful line of discussion in any context. I can and will elaborate in a post shortly.
4. I'm on board with having Lime Coke in the POE. I think Jay has slid toward that position as well today.

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:18 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:02 pm Because I suspect you, and talking to her about a player I suspect can potentially give me quality about each of you.

Could you expound on your suspicion of me just so everyone's on the same page?

Looking through your ISO, I've seen you ask me a number of questions about things that I have said, but your reasons for voting me are often the same:

No good reason, I just don't like all the votes on sig and feel like Marmot can get some attention too.
Poll diversity. You have not earned a town read yet, but you have not been a big topic of discussion either.
At present I am not uncomfortable voting for either marmot or sig. it is slightly worrying that I don’t have any names beyond those two.
We seem to be circling around Marmot and sig as our primary options for today, but neither has an overwhelming case against them.
I put my vote on Marmot a while ago because sig had all the votes and there was no productive reason for me to leave mine there. Marmot was next in line for some scrutiny.


There is a common theme here that I have perceived, that you want to push my name for discussion but have not voiced a suspicion about anything that I've done. Is this intentional? Or am I missing something?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:16 pm It would REALLY help me if I could hear in clear terms an answer to the following:

Why is Lime Coke mafia?

I seriously do not know. What’s the problem? Y’all could be right. It has felt to me like RVS-period problems just never disappeared in his case for some people no matter what he posted. I am sure tge case is more nuanced than that.

So help me out, please and thank you.

ilario wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 7:38 am LOL nuppp I usually just check my role and go straight to the game, I don’t really care much for mechanics

Lime Coke wrote: ↑Sat Sep 11, 2021 8:26 pm So the last page was SoA vs Sig which I kind of see looking better for SoA based on Sig's weird mis-informed defense.

I saw the stuff with TSP and JJJ. Overall not sure what to think of TSP. He's meme'y which was kind of what he was in Buckets, which he was town there.

I think my town list remains how it was, I didn't pick up anything new, but nothing fell off or made me question anything. So I'm fine read wise.

G-Man wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 9:30 am Thoughts through page 10:

DOLBY

DYSLEXICON
-whole entry to the game was just weird. Don’t recall if this is typical but it feels a little too much. Do not agree with assessment of SPF
-So. Much. Thread-spew! Not enough foundation behind all that glitter.
-254&255: now it simmers down
-275: Waffle House reads
-280: Why play with forced restraint?
-286: Fair criticism, but also sets up a huge bias
-351: “I am intentionally not going to play the way I tend to play”
-373: something concrete is something
-401: hedgy

FALCON
-323: I concur about pingy
-354: scum reads with no meat
-363: agreed

ILARIO
-77: post count padding? Quite agreeable
-113: too much emphasis on entrance (not limited to just ilario)
-192: a little too forward-thinking and helpful without focusing on the here and now
-304: way too soft an acceptance of Dys
-337: rather over-explainy

JAGGEDJIMMYJAY
-56: could be supa-jay but feels too jabbery
-93: more like real Jay
-101: less twang and more neil hartley please
-152: good points but nai
-158: i thought the same; unclear how this makes me feel
-277: this feels slimy
-390: soft pass for NAA
-443: so why bother writing it?

JOHANNA

LIME COKE
-68: a lot to glean from so little
-434: a bit brash and over the top
-440: drifting into ATE?

MARMOT
-184: sassy burn?

NAA
-312: derp?
-437: yes and no

SIG
-291: lol sig

SLOONEI
-72: sassy interesting. Disingenuous?
-125: true
-419: bingo

SOA
-39: experienced player- no passes needed (come at me?)
-41: can’t describe own play style? Odd.
-61: seeking pat on the head or open fishing- don’t force the lure
-63: “interesting” and agreeable
-88: over-equipped try-hard
-148: a bit Mac-like? Hard to pin this personality down
-355: speaking of magnifying things…
-453: feels like too much to explain what it does

SPF
-64: good questions
-69: also good
-111: color me intrigued
-164: ew adverbs; meh

TSP
-317: TR’s sig
-463: lol Tony


Notes before post #201 were recorded before the night post. Everything after that has the benefit of reading both Sig and SPF as town.

More later as I work through it.

Johanna wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:44 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:37 am I don't think Lime Coke is a consensus town read. I'm iffy on him, at the very least.

No one has anything to read G-man off of. He is a suspect by virtue of not being able to be town-read.

Is TSP just a "lock" because of his claim?

Marmot should be a fairly memorable player. He's been around. I'd recommend perusing his ISO.

Not many people have posted reads list on D2 so far and he was definitely high in the townreads of most lists D1.

TSP is not technically lock but if he's lying about it it will self-resolve. I think his attitude towards the mechanics (encouraging false claims d1) has been vastly more pro-town than ANYTHING that ANYONE ELSE has done so far. He's been kind of cryptic but I don't know that that's an uncommon trait.

And PRECISELY because Marmot has been around and yet nothing he has said or done are in any way shape or form memorable or remarkable, despite you saying that they should be, makes me think something's off.

I'm not the first person to remark on his seemingly ethereal quality.