The Syndicate

outed wolf wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:52 pm amy/dya/x

thoughts?

nutella wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:48 pm hmmm okay

i'm not loving these responses from you but i'm not sure if i can articulate why

there's just maybe something slightly off about your perspective. the c4 progression (heh) isn't making a ton of sense to me, and you also say the early votes on me weren't pure and yet dont put them in your subsequent poe

but part of me also still really believes your gavial stuff was genuine

idk


considering your view on dizzy though. i.... i think if you'll pardon me for making a bad dichotomy read, dizzy is likely to be a wolf if bronana isn't. i just feel worse about bronana atm

bronana wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:55 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:48 pm hmmm okay

i'm not loving these responses from you but i'm not sure if i can articulate why

there's just maybe something slightly off about your perspective. the c4 progression (heh) isn't making a ton of sense to me, and you also say the early votes on me weren't pure and yet dont put them in your subsequent poe

but part of me also still really believes your gavial stuff was genuine

idk


considering your view on dizzy though. i.... i think if you'll pardon me for making a bad dichotomy read, dizzy is likely to be a wolf if bronana isn't. i just feel worse about bronana atm

dizzy made a bunch of posts at EOD going ham on me for pushing kza, and you think that makes her town and me a wolf? idgi. i was a bit peeved/worried that she might have influenced the vig to shoot me instead of kza.

nutella wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:48 pm hmmm okay

i'm not loving these responses from you but i'm not sure if i can articulate why

there's just maybe something slightly off about your perspective. the c4 progression (heh) isn't making a ton of sense to me, and you also say the early votes on me weren't pure and yet dont put them in your subsequent poe

but part of me also still really believes your gavial stuff was genuine

idk


considering your view on dizzy though. i.... i think if you'll pardon me for making a bad dichotomy read, dizzy is likely to be a wolf if bronana isn't. i just feel worse about bronana atm

nutella wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:57 pm

bronana wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:55 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:48 pm hmmm okay

i'm not loving these responses from you but i'm not sure if i can articulate why

there's just maybe something slightly off about your perspective. the c4 progression (heh) isn't making a ton of sense to me, and you also say the early votes on me weren't pure and yet dont put them in your subsequent poe

but part of me also still really believes your gavial stuff was genuine

idk


considering your view on dizzy though. i.... i think if you'll pardon me for making a bad dichotomy read, dizzy is likely to be a wolf if bronana isn't. i just feel worse about bronana atm

dizzy made a bunch of posts at EOD going ham on me for pushing kza, and you think that makes her town and me a wolf? idgi. i was a bit peeved/worried that she might have influenced the vig to shoot me instead of kza.

i think the vig was always going to be on kza from the multiple posts about it from me/hally/some others at eod

i think you very well knew that

i think you could be kza's teammate who very well knew that and got some distancing in

bronana wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:02 pm I'm not sure why amy and dya have to be aligned with each other at all

bronana wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:02 pm I'm not sure why amy and dya have to be aligned with each other at all

Alison wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:00 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:48 pm hmmm okay

i'm not loving these responses from you but i'm not sure if i can articulate why

there's just maybe something slightly off about your perspective. the c4 progression (heh) isn't making a ton of sense to me, and you also say the early votes on me weren't pure and yet dont put them in your subsequent poe

but part of me also still really believes your gavial stuff was genuine

idk


considering your view on dizzy though. i.... i think if you'll pardon me for making a bad dichotomy read, dizzy is likely to be a wolf if bronana isn't. i just feel worse about bronana atm

c4 progression: basically I think the way he treated me D1 was garbage and disingenuous which earned him a spot in my POE. On D2 he posted a townie thing that I think is reasonably hard for scum to fake, which wasn't enough to take him out of my POE, but was at least enough for me to focus on the other people in the POE that had not posted townie things.

I don't think the early votes on you are likely to be pure but that's a weaker piece of speculation, and at any rate the three people on there have been posting decently so I don't think it makes sense to just blindly POE them. It's possible I'm wrong and the wagon on you is entirely pure. But even if I'm right and it isn't, I don't get any closer to figuring out which people on your wagon were wolves just by dumping them all in the POE. My approach there is more or less "just let them do their thing, they've been posting fine, and if they're scum you force them to keep posting well or attract suspicion on themselves".

bronana wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:00 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:57 pm

bronana wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:55 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:48 pm hmmm okay

i'm not loving these responses from you but i'm not sure if i can articulate why

there's just maybe something slightly off about your perspective. the c4 progression (heh) isn't making a ton of sense to me, and you also say the early votes on me weren't pure and yet dont put them in your subsequent poe

but part of me also still really believes your gavial stuff was genuine

idk


considering your view on dizzy though. i.... i think if you'll pardon me for making a bad dichotomy read, dizzy is likely to be a wolf if bronana isn't. i just feel worse about bronana atm

dizzy made a bunch of posts at EOD going ham on me for pushing kza, and you think that makes her town and me a wolf? idgi. i was a bit peeved/worried that she might have influenced the vig to shoot me instead of kza.

i think the vig was always going to be on kza from the multiple posts about it from me/hally/some others at eod

i think you very well knew that

i think you could be kza's teammate who very well knew that and got some distancing in

wat

i've been calling out kza since fairly early d1, search my iso. I was the first person to vote him (and the only one for awhile). dizzy was quoting old posts i made about kza, "got some distancing in" give me a break, i'm not asking to be cleared but this is ridiculously uncharitable

Amy wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:01 pm gonna point out that i haven't even mentioned alison today and am in fact voting someone else entirely

if i'm "lining up misexes" i'm doing a pretty crap job of it

nutella wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:57 pm

bronana wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:55 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:48 pm hmmm okay

i'm not loving these responses from you but i'm not sure if i can articulate why

there's just maybe something slightly off about your perspective. the c4 progression (heh) isn't making a ton of sense to me, and you also say the early votes on me weren't pure and yet dont put them in your subsequent poe

but part of me also still really believes your gavial stuff was genuine

idk


considering your view on dizzy though. i.... i think if you'll pardon me for making a bad dichotomy read, dizzy is likely to be a wolf if bronana isn't. i just feel worse about bronana atm

dizzy made a bunch of posts at EOD going ham on me for pushing kza, and you think that makes her town and me a wolf? idgi. i was a bit peeved/worried that she might have influenced the vig to shoot me instead of kza.

i think the vig was always going to be on kza from the multiple posts about it from me/hally/some others at eod

i think you very well knew that

i think you could be kza's teammate who very well knew that and got some distancing in

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:04 pm can someone who scumreads amy break it down for me? what's her scummiest post? what's the most suspicious thing about her? it seems the consensus is shifting a little bit wrt to how she's being perceived, and i'm a little confused about where that's coming from

bronana wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:02 pm I'm not sure why amy and dya have to be aligned with each other at all

dyachei wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:03 pm

bronana wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:02 pm I'm not sure why amy and dya have to be aligned with each other at all

because alison is omgusing

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:04 pm can someone who scumreads amy break it down for me? what's her scummiest post? what's the most suspicious thing about her? it seems the consensus is shifting a little bit wrt to how she's being perceived, and i'm a little confused about where that's coming from

Amy wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:08 pm

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:04 pm can someone who scumreads amy break it down for me? what's her scummiest post? what's the most suspicious thing about her? it seems the consensus is shifting a little bit wrt to how she's being perceived, and i'm a little confused about where that's coming from

alison's omgusing, kinda

visor wolfreads me like every game

nutella's confbiasing off a sod snapread or something

Alison wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:09 pm I think in this specific state my OMGUSes are a lot more likely to be correct than usual so I would appreciate if people didn't brush it off as "oh she's just OMGUSing".

Alison wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:50 am I think Gavial's VT claim was kinda townie. He's never been shy about claiming as town, and it kinda boxes him in claimwise if he's scum. The counterargument is that he's WIFOMing by doing something that sabotages him if he's scum but it doesn't seem like his style to play mind games that twisty.

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:04 pm can someone who scumreads amy break it down for me? what's her scummiest post? what's the most suspicious thing about her? it seems the consensus is shifting a little bit wrt to how she's being perceived, and i'm a little confused about where that's coming from

sunbae wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:11 pm You know those movies where one of the cool kids befriends a loser nerd and they find out they've got a lot in common and are pretty cool

And then the loser nerd sees their new cool friend out in public hanging out with their other cool friends and goes up to say hi

and the cool kid, in an effort to stay cool, just basically punks the loser nerd/ignores them like "lol who tf are you"

and the loser nerd is pretty bummed about it

i am the loser nerd and not the cool kid

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:11 pm c4's righteous indignation at not having his thoughts properly considered is villagery

sunbae wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:11 pm You know those movies where one of the cool kids befriends a loser nerd and they find out they've got a lot in common and are pretty cool

And then the loser nerd sees their new cool friend out in public hanging out with their other cool friends and goes up to say hi

and the cool kid, in an effort to stay cool, just basically punks the loser nerd/ignores them like "lol who tf are you"

and the loser nerd is pretty bummed about it

i am the loser nerd and not the cool kid

sunbae wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:55 pm Arete, can you let me know as briefly as possible why at eod you were approaching the game from a "I don't want people to turn on Vulgard so here's a long explanation of a villa read" perspective when if Gav flipped wolf nobody would ever be questioning Vul yet would start to ponder that alignment if Gav flipped villa? This is not a gotcha or a post to shade you, this is flat out just a question hoping I can get a better handle of your pov as eod went down.

nutella wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:13 pm

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:04 pm can someone who scumreads amy break it down for me? what's her scummiest post? what's the most suspicious thing about her? it seems the consensus is shifting a little bit wrt to how she's being perceived, and i'm a little confused about where that's coming from

it's partially a gamestate read/paranoia, partially her adamance on pushing gavial through along with the alison associative, partially the tone of her sod2 posts made me feel worse

i started to question how easily i had been townreading her by the end of day 1, and noted her dedication to gav being locked as the chop end of story, and then he flipped town

plus like... there's still 3 wolves and it seems likely at least one of them is someone widely townread, and i have the least concrete reasons to townread her. it's possible she's skated by on having good tone early, and her reactions to me today seem upset that her comfortable position is being disrupted (which makes sense regardless of her alignment, she can be upset about that as town who had been read correctly, so i'm trying to sort that out further)

Amy wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:12 pm i honestly don't remember what your read on me was in rocks ngl

i think i was consensus town starting d2ish? but i know i caught a lot of heat d1, might be lumping you in with someone else or smth

and i definitely forgot all those other games were wolfrands

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:11 pm c4's righteous indignation at not having his thoughts properly considered is villagery

Arete wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:15 pm

sunbae wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:55 pm Arete, can you let me know as briefly as possible why at eod you were approaching the game from a "I don't want people to turn on Vulgard so here's a long explanation of a villa read" perspective when if Gav flipped wolf nobody would ever be questioning Vul yet would start to ponder that alignment if Gav flipped villa? This is not a gotcha or a post to shade you, this is flat out just a question hoping I can get a better handle of your pov as eod went down.

I mostly wasn't thinking about Gavial's flip at all (although I did think they were more likely to flip town than scum), I was more thinking, like, if I randomly died N1 or N2 or something, and he were still alive on D4, he's the general-sort-of-player the thread might turn on, particularly if his reads turned out to be wrong (townread for relatively nebulous reasons, not close friends with anyone outside the FoL crowd afaik, nobody except me had particularly strong meta on him) and I wanted to make sure that didn't happen

if Gavial had actually been a wolf I don't think people would have been likely to immediately turn on him but I don't think that really would have reduced the likelihood of people turning on him on day 4, no one was going to give anyone cred for a Gavial hit, although I wasn't specifically thinking about that possibility at EoD

also I didn't care about the wagons, like, at all and I didn't really have strong reads other than Vul but I wanted to do something so that I didn't feel totally useless

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:16 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:13 pm

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:04 pm can someone who scumreads amy break it down for me? what's her scummiest post? what's the most suspicious thing about her? it seems the consensus is shifting a little bit wrt to how she's being perceived, and i'm a little confused about where that's coming from

it's partially a gamestate read/paranoia, partially her adamance on pushing gavial through along with the alison associative, partially the tone of her sod2 posts made me feel worse

i started to question how easily i had been townreading her by the end of day 1, and noted her dedication to gav being locked as the chop end of story, and then he flipped town

plus like... there's still 3 wolves and it seems likely at least one of them is someone widely townread, and i have the least concrete reasons to townread her. it's possible she's skated by on having good tone early, and her reactions to me today seem upset that her comfortable position is being disrupted (which makes sense regardless of her alignment, she can be upset about that as town who had been read correctly, so i'm trying to sort that out further)

thanks. the thing about amy is that i don't really have any concrete reasons to townread her beyond the fact that she consistently just sounded like a villager throughout d1. she consistently showed a high depth of thought and i had no trouble stepping into her shoes and understanding her POV, and my assumption was that there would be more cracks in her overall gameplay if she was playing from a wolf mindset

but i do admit that i haven't really critically evaluated her/considered her since around the middle of d1, and that's a fairly dangerous position for my read to be in. i'll re-evaluate her today even though i don't know if the specific reasons i've seen about her being a wolf resonate with me

Arete wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:19 pm I think Alison being like 'yes I'm OMGUSing but my OMGUSING is RIGHT so you should LISTEN to me' is more likely to come from a villager who's frustrated about not being listened to than from a wolf who's trying to look good

like I feel like a wolf in her position would be more focused on trying to not look like she's OMGUSing/defend the fact that she's doing it, since OMGUS is usually perceived as wolfy, rather than defending the reads she's making via OMGUS

sunbae wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:11 pm You know those movies where one of the cool kids befriends a loser nerd and they find out they've got a lot in common and are pretty cool

And then the loser nerd sees their new cool friend out in public hanging out with their other cool friends and goes up to say hi

and the cool kid, in an effort to stay cool, just basically punks the loser nerd/ignores them like "lol who tf are you"

and the loser nerd is pretty bummed about it

i am the loser nerd and not the cool kid

Amy wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:20 pm Regarding my Alison stuff yesterday - I alluded to this earlier, but I think it's premature to accuse me of trying to set up consecutive flips given that I, uh, literally haven't pushed Alison at all today. Obviously yeah my take yesterday was that I thought her stuff regarding Gav's meta made it look like she had TMI, but 48 hours is a lot of time and a lot of people seem to disagree with me (and also disagree with my current townread of dya, who is Alison's main pusher, which is not a fact that is lost on me).

Amy wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:20 pm What do you mean when you say I was being "deliberately obtuse" though? I thought my stance was pretty clear - Alison made a point that I thought was incongruous with how things actually appeared, and suggested that the perception gap may be due to TMI on her part. Help me see what I'm not understanding here.

bronana wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:13 pm

sunbae wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:11 pm You know those movies where one of the cool kids befriends a loser nerd and they find out they've got a lot in common and are pretty cool

And then the loser nerd sees their new cool friend out in public hanging out with their other cool friends and goes up to say hi

and the cool kid, in an effort to stay cool, just basically punks the loser nerd/ignores them like "lol who tf are you"

and the loser nerd is pretty bummed about it

i am the loser nerd and not the cool kid

...what is this about? did you want to talk about something?

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 8:11 pm c4's righteous indignation at not having his thoughts properly considered is villagery

why would people consider an overnight wall that didn't take the flips into account. I don't understand the point of those.

outed wolf wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:31 pm

Arete wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:29 pm

bronana wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:27 pm

Arete wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 7:17 pm @Chloe

I don't know how to ask this question in a way that doesn't sound like I'm complaining about not being townread so please just treat it as a totally neutral question about your process

given your familiarity with my and Vul's reads on each other why does Vul's read on me seem to not be influencing your thought process at all

is his godread on you as good as his godread on gavial?

his godread on me is real and supported by an extensive history of games as both V/V and V/W

much like his extensive history of games with seth eh?