The Syndicate

Hi from Florida everyone! Voting now while I have time. Posting this from my phone so I have to be brief. Nothing has changed with Bea. Voted for her. Bye for now.

Huh, did not see that NK coming at all. RIPIYWG, you crazy diamond.

Vompatti wrote:

Lizzy wrote:NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

butt look on the bright side: now you can join me and hoers for tea and Scotch in the afterlife k

i kno rite :;#3

Ture

Quiet.


Boats... what do you have to say? About anything?

Devin the Omniscient wrote:FYI I spent most of my Saturday playing Bioshock Infinite, beating the game last night. It was the 3rd day I had played the game. I am still picking my brain matter off of the walls and floor (It was that damn good). The story was amazing, the graphics were breathtaking, the gameplay was badass, and the ending was mind-exploding! I could not recommend this game more highly!

It is absolutely stellar, isn't it? I loved it so much and agree with this entirely. A replay of it is really nice as well; I've played it twice now. Will eventually get around to playing it again I'm sure.

Needless to say, I will definitely be adapting the theme into a Bioshock Infinite mafia game.

RIP Vomps! Your wit will be missed. Did not see that coming.

Ace is off my list after his defense of boo, and several others on my list of suspects got NK'd, so I am looking at bea right now. The thought of rereading any of the theories expounded on during the contest terrifies me, so I'll do select rereading. Not a supporter of a Boats vote right now. I'd be more in favor of GOB since he has yet to explain his 'vote and run' method of play.

Hedge, what makes you hesitant about Boats?

Someone mentioned previously that though GOB hasn't been posting at all, he hasn't missed any of the polls. I'd like to verify that before taking it as gospel (so I will) but if so that is a bit odd. But again, if GOB is a newb then that could be the issue. (He hasn't played enough to be a nub yet. ) So I'm not sure if I see that case as a super solid one personally at the moment.

I'm still pretty well sold on Boats or Bea myself. I'm 100% open to listening to other options or others opinions, but not sure there could be much to sway me away from those two names as of this moment.

Ok, just as a PS, GOB did miss the Day 2 poll.

indiglo wrote:Hedge, what makes you hesitant about Boats?

Someone mentioned previously that though GOB hasn't been posting at all, he hasn't missed any of the polls. I'd like to verify that before taking it as gospel (so I will) but if so that is a bit odd. But again, if GOB is a newb then that could be the issue. (He hasn't played enough to be a nub yet. ) So I'm not sure if I see that case as a super solid one personally at the moment.

I'm still pretty well sold on Boats or Bea myself. I'm 100% open to listening to other options or others opinions, but not sure there could be much to sway me away from those two names as of this moment.

I think Boats may have other things going on in his life considering how absent he's been. Look at the space between his posts and his reasons. Also based on MP's comment he doesn't come across as a top priority to me. I definitely think that a bea lynch before Boats makes sense. Yes, Boats past comment was suspicious, but he is so inactive at this point.

MovingPictures07 wrote:
Onto more strictly game-related matters... I see Boats has missed votes now three times. Apparently the public penance wasn't enough for him.

As for GOB, he may be new, but he is clearly checking in to vote. I don't find him incredibly suspicious, but if he is regularly voting, why is he not responding or posting at all? I would find his actions more suspicious than Boats, who isn't even voting and therefore doesn't seem to be playing. Thanks for checking GOB's voting too! These are my current thoughts, so I'll be rereading bea for now.

wow the thread is so dead :O

RIPIYWG Vomps. Ryan clearly didn't think you were, but I wasn't sure. I think it's worth noting that Sullivan has apparently attempted 2 kills now and succeeded with his first last night. On Night 6 he'll have to either attempt his third and get a 50% chance of suicide nightly or go anti-Ryan.

I'm still having trouble seeing the bea case. As I stated, I get that her vote timing was bad on the BWT lynch. But the rest of the case against her seems to be 1) Quote her. 2) Say, "This sounds like something a baddie would say." 3) Add to the chorus of suspicion against her. Can anyone point out any specific thread evidence that points to evil? Something along the lines of Epi's criteria (inconsistencies and such) would help me out with that.

At one point bea said "Tell me why I'm suspected and I'll address it." I forget who it was, but someone quoted that and said they thought a baddie would say that. Ridiculous. I've only played in 5 or so mafia games, and I am SURE I have heard someone say just that in at least 3 of them.

I do definitely have sympathy for the rl situation Boats is dealing with right now, but I have to make decisions on him based on what I think his role is. I looked back at his voting record and posts and realized that the only time since Day 0 that he's been around was Day 3, when he self-voted. Not bad in itself, but Night 2 was the night both Big Daddies killed last. If I read their roles correctly one of them attempts to kill every other night, and one attempts to kill every third night starting on Night 2. Now, it's certainly possible that the Big Daddy kill for Night 4 failed (it has a 70% chance of success, I believe), but I think it's also worth examining the possibility that no PM was sent and Boats or another inactive (I'd have to search vote records again to see if there were others) is the Big Daddy. I just thought that should be mentioned, though it doesn't mean I'm certain to vote Boats. I want to see what others think of this first.

By the way, Zany Dex has dropped off the radar, and I still think he should still be looked at closely for his entirely unhelpful behavior. The longer it goes on, the more I think he's a baddie whose strategy is to say nothing related to the game so he can't be caught lying. The G.O.B. situation worries me more the longer he keeps playing this way, as well. Though I was the first to defend him earlier, I'd consider voting him now.

I also think (as I said yesterday, but the thread was swamped) that Boomslang should be looked at more closely. I can't shake the weird, "50-50 that BTSC is civ" thing.

I know people have been busy, but I'd love to hear more from some lower posters (Spacedaisy, Ajira, INH, and DFaraday come to mind). I'm sure you have useful things to contribute and think more voices in the discussion always helps.

There's some quiet people around here,

Idk what boat's rl situation is right now. And - if it's bad boats, I'm sorry. I hope it gets better.

Here is my recommendation.

vote me. Then be done with it.

Obviously, the B theory is the gospel truth. And since boo didn't turn up bad, I must be the one. I mean, boats has RL stuff going on. So it has to be me.

I've been all "wishy washy" - I've been all "posty without saying anything." - obviously I'm the one to vote for. Hell, if it were any other player in this game besides me, I'd be inclined to vote me. It doesn't remove the fact that I've been that clueless - that i've been that lost. I'm playing a game as blind a civ you can be with NO knowledge of the subject matter. Forgive me having a job that frequently requires me to work 40-50 hours a week with no internet access. Forgive me for only getting small chunks of time to internets undisturbed. And forgive me for sometimes saying "screw the interwebs - I have time with my sweetie now, that's more important."

But here's the thing - as long as you all debate whether or not to keep voting the "b's" (this really is the silliest thing I've ever seen, so I'm combating silly with silly) - you keep lynching civs.

Keep it up. Here - I'll virgin sacrifice myself.
And since self voting is all the rager these days - I'll be the first one to throw the vote down on me.

I'm sure Gob is perfectly civ. I mean, he's only just popped up to post just when I asked him to or I'd vote him. He's done a stelar job of reading the thread elsewise he'd know to at least post his vote since - yes - he missed day 2 but the other times he voted there was no post at all. How could you make that mistake day 1 - play catch up and then do it again day 3? He flat out said he was "playing the noob card." - And - I could be completely wrong, but my gut tells me this is totally a Mr. F ala LP Beatles mafia set up going down.

Of course, who is going to listen to me? I mean. I'm bad. Obviously. My name starts with B and I was wishy washy.

votes bea

bea wrote: Of course, who is going to listen to me? I mean. I'm bad. Obviously. My name starts with B and I was wishy washy.
votes bea

Cute. The reason I think you're bad isn't because you're "wishy-washy" or because your name starts with B, it's because you were the last late voter against the lynching of a baddie, and your vote when you cast it was swinging a save.

I suspect the latter votes more than the early voters in this type of situation - a baddie isn't going to jump to the defense of her teamate without waiting to see if (a) it's necessary and especially that (b) it is likely to actually save them (because coming to a baddie's defense when he *does* get lynched is obviously dangerous).

It's possible that you are a civ, but the evidence is strongly against it. This 'poor pitiful me' routine makes total sense - you see how things are going, and you see that if you don't change tactics you'll definitely go down today.. so you try a hail-mary and self-vote.

It's not going to work on me though, and I doubt you'll get many others with it.

*votes bea*

Oh wow, another self vote! And from bea!? I don't recall ever seeing bea give up like this before...and I still am not sold on her being bad.

I get that real life can totally get in the way of playing mafia. Heck, I've been way quieter than is my norm due to real life these past few weeks. However, real life doesn't dictate what role the host gave you and the thread evidence seems to show that Boats has BTSC. And as we've determined, there really aren't any clear civvie explanations for that. So Occam's Razor says that Boats is likely to be mafia. I feel like we return to the argument that was rampant during MOTU Mafia. If someone is mafia but they aren't actively playing, are they really a threat? I guess it depends on if MP lets teammates send in powers for each other.

@MP are the mafia allowed to send in each other's night powers if a teammate isn't around to do so?

I agree that Boomslang might warrant a closer look. The way he came up with the "half and half" chance of Boats having civvie BTSC and in the same post completely left out an entire mafia team seems very strange. But since the facts are so easy to corroborate by simply reading the roles on the first page, I can't quite decide what purpose being blatantly wrong about the BTSC possibilities in this game would serve, other than I suppose to save Boats for another day and/or hope no one noticed.

And I'm sure I'm beginning to sound like a broken record about Dex, but I just can't shake the feeling that he is purposefully trying to distract us with his posts. And I think it has worked if that is what he's doing because he was on a lot more people's radars early in the game, but has sort of drifted off the main list of suspicious characters for those more in favor of the 'B's are Baddies' theory.

And lastly, I think Bea and others might be on to something with G.O.B.'s behavior. Showing up to vote but not posting and then making one post when called out on it but playing the noob card makes it both hard to get a solid read on him and hard to trust his motives.

Just checking in from South Carolina while on vacation! I do not think vomps was baddie, I was feeling pretty good about him being good. As I do not have much time and not much to go on since I am very far behind, the most I have to go on is what I saw of Dex (assuming he is still doing the same as he did the first few days) and Im not feeling good about his bandwagon jumping and such anyways. So I'm going to be voting dex and get on out of here

Gob seems to be playing by the same method that spaghetti used in boos game over at rm. boats gave it away that he had been keeping up, whether it was on his own, or with help. My vote us going to one of them because they are going to be a distraction for many lynches to come, if they aren't dealt with.

Spaghetti, you were the baddie who coasted to victory in boos game. You never got mod killed for not posting or voting. Your team was just allowed to send stuff in for you. And you aren't the slightest bit suspicious of Gob? It sounds like someone gave gob a winning strategy with advice to vote occasionally, to me.

No u spaghetti

I'm FAR more sure about Boats than Bea. And he hasn't been modkilled yet. So *votes Boats*

Bea's recent post actually reads rather genuine to me. (Reminds me a little of how I felt yesterday in the RM Malevolence game where I was just lynched as a civ). She could be bad but I'm not as confident.

I'm back from out of town all weekend and getting caught up on this hot mess. I'll let you know how I'm leaning once I myself know!

I don't have all day to wait, but I have a few more hours. I'd like to see what develops a bit more before I vote. Bea giving up like that feels weird and I'd like to suss out exactly how I feel before voting.

Nev, I think I tend to agree with what you said, but I'd still like to give myself just a little more time before voting. If I vote Bea or Boats it will not be because they're names start with B. Plenty of good points have been made on both of them - and I think it's kinda weird that Bea chose to focus on silly things people said as a joke rather (voting for the B's) than defending against the real reasons posted.

FH, fantastic question about the baddies. I remember thinking that in MOTU - that an absent baddie is less of a threat, but if the team is allowed to send in the night actions then we're really in a pickle. And I have a feeling that if we go for absent players we'll get a lot of innocent fallout. (Not like we aren't already getting that though. )

indiglo wrote:I don't have all day to wait, but I have a few more hours. I'd like to see what develops a bit more before I vote. Bea giving up like that feels weird and I'd like to suss out exactly how I feel before voting.

Nev, I think I tend to agree with what you said, but I'd still like to give myself just a little more time before voting. If I vote Bea or Boats it will not be because THEIR names start with B. Plenty of good points have been made on both of them - and I think it's kinda weird that Bea chose to focus on silly things people said as a joke rather (voting for the B's) than defending against the real reasons posted.

FH, fantastic question about the baddies. I remember thinking that in MOTU - that an absent baddie is less of a threat, but if the team is allowed to send in the night actions then we're really in a pickle. And I have a feeling that if we go for absent players we'll get a lot of innocent fallout. (Not like we aren't already getting that though. )

There, fixed. I hate there, their, they're typos.

indiglo wrote:

indiglo wrote:I don't have all day to wait, but I have a few more hours. I'd like to see what develops a bit more before I vote. Bea giving up like that feels weird and I'd like to suss out exactly how I feel before voting.

Nev, I think I tend to agree with what you said, but I'd still like to give myself just a little more time before voting. If I vote Bea or Boats it will not be because THEIR names start with B. Plenty of good points have been made on both of them - and I think it's kinda weird that Bea chose to focus on silly things people said as a joke rather (voting for the B's) than defending against the real reasons posted.

FH, fantastic question about the baddies. I remember thinking that in MOTU - that an absent baddie is less of a threat, but if the team is allowed to send in the night actions then we're really in a pickle. And I have a feeling that if we go for absent players we'll get a lot of innocent fallout. (Not like we aren't already getting that though. )

There, fixed. I hate there, their, they're typos.

I don't really want to vote bea either. Is there a very succinct reason someone can articulate for me why we (seemingly) abandoned ship on the Boats consideration? Of course, very few votes are in, so maybe the majority hasn't abandoned that course at all.

Matahari wrote:Gob seems to be playing by the same method that spaghetti used in boos game over at rm. boats gave it away that he had been keeping up, whether it was on his own, or with help. My vote us going to one of them because they are going to be a distraction for many lynches to come, if they aren't dealt with.

I agree. We've brought it out publicly about GOB's lack of posts, and then he will pop up just to say hello and then leave again. But as far as prioritizing, I'm not sure whether to go Boats or go GOB today.

Catching up today was thankfully a lot easier; yesterday was absolutely nuts!

nutella wrote:I'm FAR more sure about Boats than Bea. And he hasn't been modkilled yet. So *votes Boats*

Bea's recent post actually reads rather genuine to me.

I agree with this. From what I know of Bea, she isn't the type of player who would emotionally blackmail other players to survive a lynch. My understanding of the current scenario is that the only really solid argument against her is her late vote in a baddie lynch. I think this argument is valid, and that's why I will be keeping my eye on Bea. At the same time, we're talking about an early-game vote, where civvies blunder all the time, and townies die in friendly fire or baddies survive lynches. Unfortunate as this is, I think reading too much into it may lead to us lynching even more townies.

I also agree with FH; the case against Boats is much more Occam's Razor friendly, and it's very likely that Boats has BTSC. I have to vote now since I won't be up by the time the poll closes. I vote Boats.

Ajira wrote:Catching up today was thankfully a lot easier; yesterday was absolutely nuts!

nutella wrote:I'm FAR more sure about Boats than Bea. And he hasn't been modkilled yet. So *votes Boats*

Bea's recent post actually reads rather genuine to me.

I agree with this. From what I know of Bea, she isn't the type of player who would emotionally blackmail other players to survive a lynch. My understanding of the current scenario is that the only really solid argument against her is her late vote in a baddie lynch. I think this argument is valid, and that's why I will be keeping my eye on Bea. At the same time, we're talking about an early-game vote, where civvies blunder all the time, and townies die in friendly fire or baddies survive lynches. Unfortunate as this is, I think reading too much into it may lead to us lynching even more townies.

I also agree with FH; the case against Boats is much more Occam's Razor friendly, and it's very likely that Boats has BTSC. I have to vote now since I won't be up by the time the poll closes. I vote Boats.

Thanks for your comments, Ajira. That makes a lot of sense to me.

I am going to vote Boats too.

Mongoose wrote:
I don't really want to vote bea either. Is there a very succinct reason someone can articulate for me why we (seemingly) abandoned ship on the Boats consideration? Of course, very few votes are in, so maybe the majority hasn't abandoned that course at all.

I haven't abandoned that ship at all, I just thought bea was a better choice. I would be happy to see a boats lynch too, so long as people don't forget about bea (and to a lesser extent bullzeye).

bea, I think maybe your entire post should be in sarcastic orange.

Flyin' High wrote:Oh wow, another self vote! And from bea!? I don't recall ever seeing bea give up like this before...and I still am not sold on her being bad.

I get that real life can totally get in the way of playing mafia. Heck, I've been way quieter than is my norm due to real life these past few weeks. However, real life doesn't dictate what role the host gave you and the thread evidence seems to show that Boats has BTSC. And as we've determined, there really aren't any clear civvie explanations for that. So Occam's Razor says that Boats is likely to be mafia. I feel like we return to the argument that was rampant during MOTU Mafia. If someone is mafia but they aren't actively playing, are they really a threat? I guess it depends on if MP lets teammates send in powers for each other.

@MP are the mafia allowed to send in each other's night powers if a teammate isn't around to do so?

I agree that Boomslang might warrant a closer look. The way he came up with the "half and half" chance of Boats having civvie BTSC and in the same post completely left out an entire mafia team seems very strange. But since the facts are so easy to corroborate by simply reading the roles on the first page, I can't quite decide what purpose being blatantly wrong about the BTSC possibilities in this game would serve, other than I suppose to save Boats for another day and/or hope no one noticed.

And I'm sure I'm beginning to sound like a broken record about Dex, but I just can't shake the feeling that he is purposefully trying to distract us with his posts. And I think it has worked if that is what he's doing because he was on a lot more people's radars early in the game, but has sort of drifted off the main list of suspicious characters for those more in favor of the 'B's are Baddies' theory.

And lastly, I think Bea and others might be on to something with G.O.B.'s behavior. Showing up to vote but not posting and then making one post when called out on it but playing the noob card makes it both hard to get a solid read on him and hard to trust his motives.

Thanks for the post, FH. I'm glad that I'm not the only one thinking along these lines.

I'm going to be putting my vote toward getting Boats, Dex, or G.O.B. lynched today, whichever of the 3 seems most likely to work.

Boomslang, do you have a response about the part of FH's post I bolded? I tend to agree with her that messing up easily verifiable facts wouldn't benefit a baddie. So I guess I'm a bit confused by it.

Nev, I'll direct this at you since I didn't get a response when I asked it generally: is there any thread evidence against bea? I agree with Ajira that one misguided Day 2 vote is a long way from being assured baddiedom.

I'm also interested to hear what Epi and DH think now. They posted a ton during the contest, but because there was so much material and the last lynch didn't go as they expected I'm uncertain as to where they stand right now on the names being discussed.

indiglo wrote:Plenty of good points have been made on both of them - and I think it's kinda weird that Bea chose to focus on silly things people said as a joke rather (voting for the B's) than defending against the real reasons posted.

indiglo, I suppose I could ask you too: what are the "real reasons" people have put out for lynching bea, besides her Day 2 vote?

Sorry I've not had anything to say today - I move out of my uni house tomorrow so I've been cleaning and packing for most of the day. I live a truly exciting life. I'm gonna be voting for Boats today, I feel like there's a good chance both him and Bea might be bad but I feel more strongly about Boats. It seems very likely he has BTSC, which means he's probably a baddie.

*Votes Boats*

Russtifinko wrote:
I'm also interested to hear what Epi and DH think now. They posted a ton during the contest, but because there was so much material and the last lynch didn't go as they expected I'm uncertain as to where they stand right now on the names being discussed.

I've been keeping up off and on all day, but I have little more to offer than what I did before. After boo (and AceofSpaces) posted, I was wary of voting for boo, but by the time I voted, I was too late anyway.

I wish I could say that bea's post enlightens me, but it doesn't; I'm not sure what to make of it, or what to make of others' reactions to it.

The only thing I would add is that quiet people have had ample opportunity to speak, and thus far they have not. I understand any reluctance to do so on Day 4, but now that there's been a lull in conversation, why not express an opinion?

I don't really see any reason to keep waiting to vote. I was hoping Boats might come back and say something. And I think that whichever way MP answers my question I still feel like we've found a baddie in Boats and participating or not, I'd rather lynch someone I feel has a pretty strong chance of being bad.

*votes Boats*

Nevinera wrote:

Mongoose wrote:
I don't really want to vote bea either. Is there a very succinct reason someone can articulate for me why we (seemingly) abandoned ship on the Boats consideration? Of course, very few votes are in, so maybe the majority hasn't abandoned that course at all.

I haven't abandoned that ship at all, I just thought bea was a better choice. I would be happy to see a boats lynch too, so long as people don't forget about bea (and to a lesser extent bullzeye).

I certainly will not be forgetting about bea any time soon.
I really hate to pull a vote but with the horrible concert experience of last night I was unable to get on then for more speculation. Also, with my busy work schedule of this week and the next couple of week's I may not be able to get on during work at those times but I will certainly try to be more active in the evenings.

@Bea: I am sorry the "b for baddies theory" sounds ridiculous but it is just the name that llama gave it and it just stuck with me. I, of course, am not going to let GOB and Dex fly under my radar and I have 1 or 2 others in mind. But, you and Boats are currently at the top of my list.

That being said I am casting my vote for *Boats* today.

voted boats boats or gob, doesn't matter much to me. I'll just vote gob tomorrow.

I voted for Boats before. I see little reason to change that course of action.

Zany Dex wrote:No u spaghetti

This is almost exactly the same thing you pulled with me last time I voted you, Dex. You're getting away with this behavior consistently, and I'm *voting you* to put more of a spotlight on it. Wish I had more time to analyze, but it's my birthday today! Sorry not sorry.

Alright since Boats still isn't showing I guess I'll just vote him anyway since he's not really helping anything.

Epignosis wrote:Happy birthday Boom!

Yay, Happy Birthday! I added your birthday wishes to the birthday thread.

Boomslang wrote:

Zany Dex wrote:No u spaghetti

This is almost exactly the same thing you pulled with me last time I voted you, Dex. You're getting away with this behavior consistently, and I'm *voting you* to put more of a spotlight on it. Wish I had more time to analyze, but it's my birthday today! Sorry not sorry.

Agreed. This is really no defense. Happy Birthday Boomslang!

Zany Dex wrote:Don't lynch me, I'm dead in all my other games

This is the only reason I start to feel bad for you. However, none of your posts this game have contributed anything but confusion, frustration, and ok, definitely humor (so thanks for that), but otherwise you are not helping, but rather distracting. Part of me thinks this is a reason to ignore you, but I think I am done with that for now.

Zany Dex wrote:Lets lynch the ' B's(itches)

While this points out the absurdity of voting all Bs, also not helpful.

Zany Dex wrote:There's some quiet people around here,

Yes, you fall smack dab into that group!

Zany Dex wrote:Hahaha. There is no chance in hell I'm being lynched today!!!

Mwahahahha

Maybe not that day, but I am voting for you today.

Votes Zany Dex

Wasted votes nome I see. Hmm, must use my night power accordingly...

Voting Boats for now, since I think he's bad and support his lynch.

Flyin' High wrote:
@MP are the mafia allowed to send in each other's night powers if a teammate isn't around to do so?

Yes.

Well,it looks like boats is being lynched and I am fine with that, but my vote is going to zany Dex because to be quite honest, I am over his play style this game. So, voting Dex.

I'm gonna go ahead and vote Boats... I don't like how he pretty much told us he has BTSC and there doesn't seem to be a real way he could be a civvie with BTSC.

ALSo,

On Bea


I think the case against her, at this point, is rather weak. It's based on one vote, that doesn't corroborate with the rest of the theory it is based upon, and the people going for her are forgetting about Bullz who actually fit all the criteria in the theory. I think the theory isn't as strong as I used to because Boo was civvie, although, Bullz is on my list for tomorrow though.

Dom wrote:ALSo,

On Bea


I think the case against her, at this point, is rather weak. It's based on one vote, that doesn't corroborate with the rest of the theory it is based upon, and the people going for her are forgetting about Bullz who actually fit all the criteria in the theory. I think the theory isn't as strong as I used to because Boo was civvie, although, Bullz is on my list for tomorrow though.

That's not a bad point about Bullz. I do need to have another look there to remind myself. I think Bea stuck out more to me because I know her better.

I don't have a ton of time right now, I saw at least 1 question directed to me in the thread - please remind me of it tomorrow as I will have loads more time to respond.

Looking at how the votes are going, it looks to me like Boats is the most viable lynch candidate. Since I am ok with that, I am ok voting that way. So I shall!

*votes Boats*

Dom wrote:ALSo,

On Bea


I think the case against her, at this point, is rather weak. It's based on one vote, that doesn't corroborate with the rest of the theory it is based upon, and the people going for her are forgetting about Bullz who actually fit all the criteria in the theory. I think the theory isn't as strong as I used to because Boo was civvie, although, Bullz is on my list for tomorrow though.

I think your points are good ones, and Boats is, for me, more clearly bad than Bea. *Votes Boats*