The Syndicate

Elohcin wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 10:01 am I'm a little lost in this game as I put most of my time and thought into the other game i was in and just got lynched in. I hate that too, because this is the type of game I really enjoy (smaller) and would have loved to give it my all. Just with gut reads, I am thinking Dyslexicon or MP could be bad. I think I said I trusted MP in the beginning, but have since changed my mind. I could vote either of those today. However, I could be convinced to vote elsewhere as well with a good theory. Like I said, I didn't invest in this game much and am now regretting it.

The day’s not over and minds can be changed. Cheer up! what are you opinions of marmot?

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 12:56 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 12:46 pmHuh? Quin accused you of muddying up his explanation of the nova kill, im saying it’s a meh case

“Disgusting”

lapluie wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 2:35 pm Colin & marmot r bad

lapluie wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 8:08 pm You cant fool me @ColinIsCool Im onto you , I've caught you once & I'll do it again

why. I know why I do, but you haven’t said why you do.

Scotty wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 12:54 pm

ColinIsCool wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 12:28 pm

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 12:14 pm What makes Scotty town again? : p

For me it’s that he seems pretty similar to his town play in AG the more I see of it, but he’s going to have to flesh out some of these ideas he has and soon.

I’ve already said I think you look suspicious for how you subtly defended choutas on day 1 by proffering that there were better options while rolling your eyes and placing a vote there. You showed up to a friend’s house, and when he handed you a cold refreshing glass of Sunny D, you told him you’d drink it even though it tastes like cat urine

And I’ve already said that I didn’t defend Choutas. What time would you like us to repeat this exchange tomorrow?

ColinIsCool wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 1:00 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 12:54 pm

ColinIsCool wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 12:28 pm

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 12:14 pm What makes Scotty town again? : p

For me it’s that he seems pretty similar to his town play in AG the more I see of it, but he’s going to have to flesh out some of these ideas he has and soon.

I’ve already said I think you look suspicious for how you subtly defended choutas on day 1 by proffering that there were better options while rolling your eyes and placing a vote there. You showed up to a friend’s house, and when he handed you a cold refreshing glass of Sunny D, you told him you’d drink it even though it tastes like cat urine

And I’ve already said that I didn’t defend Choutas. What time would you like us to repeat this exchange tomorrow?

That you can’t own up that you even softly defended him is beyond me. Like, it’s ok if you did defend him, everyone does that. But you’re so guarded about it

Who is your scummate

If I’m a bunny, nutella is my scummate.

ColinIsCool wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 1:10 pm If I’m a bunny, nutella is my scummate.

It was a rhetorical question, but thanks

Yikes this weekend is going to be a drag for a lot of people. I know I’m rather occupied right now, but it’s not a time to be stagnant.

Quick, someone talk about why mp is suspicious before he gets back!

Elohcin wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 8:36 am At least I can feel safe from the night kill tonight.

I have no objection to swinging at this pitch today.

ColinIsCool wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 3:47 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 3:37 pm Tinfoil GTH: Jay, Marmot, and Colin are bad.

You know there’s 2 scum left, right?

Oh.... right.

Disregard then. No clue what I was thinking.

Perhaps my investment in this game has decreased just a tad lately. It's my own fault for juggling another game and trying to be MP in both of them amid IRL stuff.

nutella wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 5:20 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 3:34 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 11:00 am

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 10:22 am

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Thu May 24, 2018 11:26 pm
I wouldn't treat a teammate so transparently terribly, but you know, WIFOM and my word and all of that, so I get it.

I don’t think you treated choutas terribly, and I don’t think that’s the gist of what nutella is suggesting either. I think you left yourself outs for sure, after only lightly prodding choutas beforehand

Yeah, actually MP what did you mean by this?? Especially considering you said this earlier:

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Tue May 22, 2018 8:15 am

Yeah, speaking in the general, I would too. Historically I've defended, bussed, and spoken almost nothing or nothing of lynched mafia teammates in the past, but my inclination is always to bus them. If I do anything other than that, it's because I have to convince my gut that it's a better option. To me, bussing is less risky than defending, all else being equal, but you're right that it completely defends on the circumstances of the bus, because players sloppily bus each other all the time to no avail. It happens to anyone willing to take the risks of bussing eventually.

See recent response.

Sorry, I still don't understand. What "treatment" are you referring to?

Nothing specific, just how I treated Choutas in general. Would you treat a teammate like that? I wouldn't.

Colin, I'm skipping over your ISOs for now but I'll take a look after I catch up.

I have 300 posts? Jesus.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 8:13 pm Not caught up, and won't be until tomorrow.

BUT. I've been thinking about my constant uncertainty as town lately, and that I should stop being dumb and not be afraid to be wrong. I really think I could have and should have stuck with my town read on Wolbre.

So this looks something like - there's one particular aspect of MP's play that makes me think town for him. Don't really want to say what in case I'm right.

I still suspect Marmot. I just do. Rah rah.

Consider me intrigued.

Why do you suspect Marmot exactly?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 8:25 pm nutella good
Scotty good
MP good
Dizzy good
Kyle good
lapluie good

Colin tinfoil

Marmot no
Epignosis no
Elohcin no

Can you briefly talk about these?

nutella wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 9:18 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 8:25 pm nutella good
Scotty good
MP good
Dizzy good
Kyle good
lapluie good

Colin tinfoil

Marmot no
Epignosis no
Elohcin no

Solid. Much agreement here.

Why did you flip me from your second bottom read to good?

Why do you think Marmot, Epi, and Elo are bad specifically?

Kyle being killed is certainly interesting. I suck at NKA, and I typically don't like to employ it, but it seems the mafia team has switched strategies from "lol" to "kill the player least likely to be lynched".

I was the only player to suspect Kyle, let up on it even though I still had it on the back of my mind, so he was under no pressure.

I think this means the first kill was potentially meant to frame someone or get us looking in a specific direction. I'd be wary of people trying to steer that conversation. From what I recall, Jay did this.

That concerns me greatly.

Why is everyone giving Jay a pass? He's on fucking autopilot.

If anything, he looks bad AF. Jay will bus his teammates without remorse if he thinks it's the best way to get to victory.

I want to lynch Jay.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 9:38 pm I think I’ll switch Colin for Dizzy as the tinfoil. If I’m Gladys Campbell, Colin is a dentist.

If MP is mafia I think I’m likely to be dead by now. Epignosis never kills me, and I have no trouble seeing Marmot keeping me alive. Elohcin has said before that her teams have kept me alive strategically. I don’t trust any of those three.

I will be more thorough when I can.

Your scum hunting is weak AF and you should die.

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 11:27 pm [VOTE: Elo] aubergine

I think her buddy Colin saved her yesterday and my suspicion hasn’t abated for her, so...one of them

Will take a look at voting patterns more tomorrow

I would avoid Quin altogether. I don’t think he’s bad unlesssssss he is the white bunny who can’t be lynched. That’s the only reason I would see for him to self vote at that point (I don’t remember how many votes he had in my reread)

Cart ahead of horse.

I'm not sure why I don't trust Colin, but I think I'm wrong in that. My gut tells me there is at least one scum who's been going without any pressure.

Even if I'm wrong, we need to pressure everyone. Please everyone, tell me why Jay is town. Because he led the wagon on Choutas? Choutas wasn't doing shit. Are we going to let a potentially scum Jay coast to victory on that?

Most of his scum hunting since then has been sporadic (I know this is ironic coming from me, but hear me out), and he's been engaging in an uncharacteristic amount of low hanging fruit, WIFOM, and NKA.

I don't like it. Town Jay would be looking at more angles. Jay keeps pushing easy suspects.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 1:05 am

Quin wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 11:27 pm Still all in on dizzy being the big bad.

I'm open. I have no time to do my own digging, but you should assemble a larger case.

Of course you're open, it's because you don't give a fuck who gets lynched.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 8:15 am Also, lol at Colin calling MP out for being cordial. Cause that also makes me paranoid every time I play with him.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 9:27 am [VOTE: Marmot] aubergine

For the moment the loudest things in the thread to me are Choutas's "Mac is right into the role" and Marmot's "I got a mafia role card".

I'm still doing travel things for a few days. I may be able to provide more thorough input later tonight, but I cannot make promises.

Eh? How? You're saying there's nothing that's been said by anyone that's more important than that?

Weak.

How am I the only one seeing this? 95% certain Jay is bad.

Scotty wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 1:31 pm Yikes this weekend is going to be a drag for a lot of people. I know I’m rather occupied right now, but it’s not a time to be stagnant.

Quick, someone talk about why mp is suspicious before he gets back!

Lynch Jay with me.

MP Rainbow #5 - Day 3

nutella
Scotty

ColinIsCool
Dyslexicon
Elohcin
lapluie
nutella

Marmot
Quin

Charlienosis

JaggedJimmyJay

This is a rainbow heavily driven by GTH and not by ISO or similar analysis.

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 5:50 pm MP Rainbow #5 - Day 3

nutella
Scotty

ColinIsCool
Dyslexicon
Elohcin
lapluie

Marmot
Quin

Charlienosis

JaggedJimmyJay

This is a rainbow heavily driven by GTH and not by ISO or similar analysis.

Oops, meant to keep nutella at the top. Disregard the second mention; I overlooked it when moving names around.

Figures I'm here when no one else is.

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 5:31 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 5:20 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 3:34 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 11:00 am

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 10:22 am

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Thu May 24, 2018 11:26 pm
I wouldn't treat a teammate so transparently terribly, but you know, WIFOM and my word and all of that, so I get it.

I don’t think you treated choutas terribly, and I don’t think that’s the gist of what nutella is suggesting either. I think you left yourself outs for sure, after only lightly prodding choutas beforehand

Yeah, actually MP what did you mean by this?? Especially considering you said this earlier:

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Tue May 22, 2018 8:15 am

Yeah, speaking in the general, I would too. Historically I've defended, bussed, and spoken almost nothing or nothing of lynched mafia teammates in the past, but my inclination is always to bus them. If I do anything other than that, it's because I have to convince my gut that it's a better option. To me, bussing is less risky than defending, all else being equal, but you're right that it completely defends on the circumstances of the bus, because players sloppily bus each other all the time to no avail. It happens to anyone willing to take the risks of bussing eventually.

See recent response.

Sorry, I still don't understand. What "treatment" are you referring to?

Nothing specific, just how I treated Choutas in general. Would you treat a teammate like that? I wouldn't.

I asked for clarification and you just used the same words??? What do you mean by how you "treated" him?

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 5:37 pm Why is everyone giving Jay a pass? He's on fucking autopilot.

If anything, he looks bad AF. Jay will bus his teammates without remorse if he thinks it's the best way to get to victory.

I want to lynch Jay.

Sure why not

[VOTE: jaggedjimmyjay] aubergine

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 5:45 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 9:27 am [VOTE: Marmot] aubergine

For the moment the loudest things in the thread to me are Choutas's "Mac is right into the role" and Marmot's "I got a mafia role card".

I'm still doing travel things for a few days. I may be able to provide more thorough input later tonight, but I cannot make promises.

Eh? How? You're saying there's nothing that's been said by anyone that's more important than that?

Weak.

How am I the only one seeing this? 95% certain Jay is bad.

mm yeah I can see it

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 6:21 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 5:31 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 5:20 pm
Sorry, I still don't understand. What "treatment" are you referring to?

Nothing specific, just how I treated Choutas in general. Would you treat a teammate like that? I wouldn't.

I asked for clarification and you just used the same words??? What do you mean by how you "treated" him?

I really don't understand what you're asking me, I'm sorry. Do you want a specific quote or something?

I think something has been lost and we're on completely different books here, nutella. Should we just start over?

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 6:22 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 5:37 pm Why is everyone giving Jay a pass? He's on fucking autopilot.

If anything, he looks bad AF. Jay will bus his teammates without remorse if he thinks it's the best way to get to victory.

I want to lynch Jay.

Sure why not

[VOTE: jaggedjimmyjay] aubergine

You think I'm right?

nutella, are you around around or just semi-around? Are you able to discuss reads?

It is impossible for me to give more right now. I am out of state with family.

I’m a moronic lynch. I don’t slaughter my teammate on Day 1, I don’t kill a guy in everyone’s POE, and I don’t kill the guy who doesn’t know who Gladys Campbell is.

There’s shit all else I can tell you right now, from my phone, as I stampede through San Francisco on limited charge.

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 6:25 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 6:21 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 5:31 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 5:20 pm
Sorry, I still don't understand. What "treatment" are you referring to?

Nothing specific, just how I treated Choutas in general. Would you treat a teammate like that? I wouldn't.

I asked for clarification and you just used the same words??? What do you mean by how you "treated" him?

I really don't understand what you're asking me, I'm sorry. Do you want a specific quote or something?

Meh, I won't pursue this anymore since I think you're town anyway and it doesn't seem worth the effort. I was just a little perplexed since it seemed to me that the "treatment" you were referring to was how you acted nonchalant about his lynch and eventually voted for him, when you also said at one point that you like to bus teammates as mafia. I just couldn't quite put together what you meant in a way that didn't seem like a contradiction.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 6:30 pm It is impossible for me to give more right now. I am out of state with family.

I’m a moronic lynch. I don’t slaughter my teammate on Day 1, I don’t kill a guy in everyone’s POE, and I don’t kill the guy who doesn’t know who Gladys Campbell is.

There’s shit all else I can tell you right now, from my phone, as I stampede through San Francisco on limited charge.

ok cool very convincing, mr. "i will do whatever it takes for my team to win"

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 6:30 pm It is impossible for me to give more right now. I am out of state with family.

I’m a moronic lynch. I don’t slaughter my teammate on Day 1, I don’t kill a guy in everyone’s POE, and I don’t kill the guy who doesn’t know who Gladys Campbell is.

There’s shit all else I can tell you right now, from my phone, as I stampede through San Francisco on limited charge.

I understand you're busy IRL, so let's engage when you get a better opportunity.

If you're a moronic lynch, well, then call me Mr. Moronic Lyncher.

Wait, don't call me that.

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 6:30 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 6:25 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 6:21 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 5:31 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 5:20 pm
Sorry, I still don't understand. What "treatment" are you referring to?

Nothing specific, just how I treated Choutas in general. Would you treat a teammate like that? I wouldn't.

I asked for clarification and you just used the same words??? What do you mean by how you "treated" him?

I really don't understand what you're asking me, I'm sorry. Do you want a specific quote or something?

Meh, I won't pursue this anymore since I think you're town anyway and it doesn't seem worth the effort. I was just a little perplexed since it seemed to me that the "treatment" you were referring to was how you acted nonchalant about his lynch and eventually voted for him, when you also said at one point that you like to bus teammates as mafia. I just couldn't quite put together what you meant in a way that didn't seem like a contradiction.

I'm sorry, what I'm saying makes total sense to me, but that's probably only because I know my alignment and I understand the distinction between how I play when town and mafia, something I'm surprised more of you haven't picked up on.

I love bussing teammates when bad. I would have bussed Choutas the way Jay did if I was his teammate. Trust me.

Look, I shouldn't be so transparent about this, but it seems no one ever believes it anyway because WIFOM, so let's make it clear:

If I'm successfully lynching bad guys, especially early, it probably means I bussed them.

If I'm mislynching townies, especially early, it probably means I'm town.

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 6:35 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 6:30 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 6:25 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 6:21 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 5:31 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Fri May 25, 2018 5:20 pm
Sorry, I still don't understand. What "treatment" are you referring to?

Nothing specific, just how I treated Choutas in general. Would you treat a teammate like that? I wouldn't.

I asked for clarification and you just used the same words??? What do you mean by how you "treated" him?

I really don't understand what you're asking me, I'm sorry. Do you want a specific quote or something?

Meh, I won't pursue this anymore since I think you're town anyway and it doesn't seem worth the effort. I was just a little perplexed since it seemed to me that the "treatment" you were referring to was how you acted nonchalant about his lynch and eventually voted for him, when you also said at one point that you like to bus teammates as mafia. I just couldn't quite put together what you meant in a way that didn't seem like a contradiction.

I'm sorry, what I'm saying makes total sense to me, but that's probably only because I know my alignment and I understand the distinction between how I play when town and mafia, something I'm surprised more of you haven't picked up on.

I love bussing teammates when bad. I would have bussed Choutas the way Jay did if I was his teammate. Trust me.

OK, I think I understand enough since I definitely relate to that as well. I've been completely enamored with bussing ever since it carried me to victory in Mass Effect. I get now what your distinction here is.

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 6:36 pm Look, I shouldn't be so transparent about this, but it seems no one ever believes it anyway because WIFOM, so let's make it clear:

If I'm successfully lynching bad guys, especially early, it probably means I bussed them.

If I'm mislynching townies, especially early, it probably means I'm town.

Yeah, I think this goes for me too lol

Though I have also been lucky sometimes lynching baddies as a civ I guess

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 6:38 pm OK, I think I understand enough since I definitely relate to that as well. I've been completely enamored with bussing ever since it carried me to victory in Mass Effect. I get now what your distinction here is.

Yeah, it's like... when I'm bad, my strength is also my weakness, and that's that I overanalyze how to treat my teammates. And then my effort to fake supatown is an effort solely to cover up that I have extra knowledge and that there's any strategy to how I'm treating certain players. So it's inevitable that I treat my teammates with a concerted effort. Unless I'm completely disengaged from the game, but that's not the case here.

I didn't treat Choutas here with much of any effort.

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 6:38 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Sat May 26, 2018 6:36 pm Look, I shouldn't be so transparent about this, but it seems no one ever believes it anyway because WIFOM, so let's make it clear:

If I'm successfully lynching bad guys, especially early, it probably means I bussed them.

If I'm mislynching townies, especially early, it probably means I'm town.

Yeah, I think this goes for me too lol

It's obviously not always true, but it seems the only reason it holds up as such a trend is despite no matter how much effort I put into a mafia game when I'm town, I'm still usually wrong.

That's what I'm starting to turn around on Marmot again and think that he's genuine. He's being forthcoming with everything, and there's no reason for him as a mafia member to put so much attention himself with a late sloppy Choutas bus vote.

That's why, not that's what.

I'll try to illustrate what bothers me about Jay here in a bit. Most of his recent scum hunting is characterized by low-hanging fruit, WIFOM, etc. that town Jay would only give little consideration, or at least would realize the other point of view. The difference between town Jay and scum Jay is the agenda. Town Jay, despite speaking with confidence, is never really sure of anything; he's always trying to pressure and investigate from as many angles as possible. Scum Jay is trying to appear that way but really he's pushing an agenda. I really hate that Jay's actively engaging in WIFOM and pushing Marmot as a candidate based on such weak shit.

I'll ISO him when I'm less distracted to try to highlight what I mean.