The Syndicate

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 2:43 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 7:32 pm

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 7:11 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:34 pm

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:33 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:24 pm I want Falcon reads. Dude's been parked on me all day.

Town.

Maybe I am the wolf after all.

Eh, Falcon being wrong wouldn't surprise me. Could be that you are tho.

You're that sure Falcon is town?

You're that sure I'm Maf?


You've said before that you find me an easy read as town.

You seem sure I'm Maf, is it because I'm not an easy town find for you? Is my being an easy TR for you usually the basis for your SR?

If I was sure you were maf I would be voting you so I am not sure where you got the impression I was sure. But sure let's go with all of that stuff you said.

@MacDougall
Still would like your POE

@NotAnAxehole
Your current thoughts?

@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
If you had to make a read of your own beyond sheeping Axe, what would it be?

Also how confident are you Axe is town?

@Alison
Build me a 6 or less POE.

@falcon45ca
What's your current POE? Obviously Mac at the front but what else?

@fingersplints
Why did you vote yourself?

Come on guys, we still have days worth of work to get through. Town isn't in that bad of a position, we just need one flip to start unravelling this.

I refuse to let town die on WIM. If we lose we will do it brightly.

Do not go gentle into that good night,
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

the game of mafia is rng

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:11 am the game of mafia is rng

Hard disagree.

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:12 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:11 am the game of mafia is rng

Hard disagree.

I am half joking

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:16 am

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:12 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:11 am the game of mafia is rng

Hard disagree.

I am half joking

Can you give me a POE?

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:18 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:16 am

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:12 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:11 am the game of mafia is rng

Hard disagree.

I am half joking

Can you give me a POE?

haven't I already?

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:18 am

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:18 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:16 am

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:12 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:11 am the game of mafia is rng

Hard disagree.

I am half joking

Can you give me a POE?

haven't I already?

Fingers > Who next total of five or six names?

Luckbox Inc wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 11:34 am

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 11:31 am

Luckbox Inc wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 11:30 am I should theoretically be able to poe game too today.

Perhaps Ender can work with me.

It's 1:30 AM and I'm coffee and I have work tomorrow. I'm pretty much pushing myself to try and find a basis for solve tonight.

OR at least a solid basis so I can stop being so fucking confused.

Fun fact, though, I need to re-think you pretty hard.

I'm actually pretty solidly set on you being good here and confused about why Alison wants to kill you.

What's your case?

Lu Ren, Box

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 12:22 pm If I leave Alison out and suggest something like a
Luckbox > If LB flips red > Fingers > Lu Ren > Mac > TSP
If LB flips green > Lu Ren > If Lu Ren Flips Red > Mac? > Fingers > TSP
If Lu Ren Flips Green > Re-evaluate everything and scream.

POE then idk.

It's 2:30 AM

I'm dead.

Why's Dizzy not in this list? Especially if you're willing to consider me town?

throw in axe

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:39 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:37 pm

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:34 pm Thoughts:
Why is Alison alive? First thing I thought of while I woke up this morning.

If she's green and I'm right with my town leans then one vote from mafia would've flipped her.

I chose to kill Bo instead of her because I believe her to be town.

If Fingers is red and Alison green, Fingers could have easily gotten away with a vote on Alison and she would have flipped.

Bo was an easy ML though, and maybe keeping Alison around is part of the plan.

Ideally I would like LB today but:

IF Fingers flips Red, this actually gives Mac a strong town lean.

If Dizzy is mafia then the reason why is obvious

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:32 am

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 12:22 pm If I leave Alison out and suggest something like a
Luckbox > If LB flips red > Fingers > Lu Ren > Mac > TSP
If LB flips green > Lu Ren > If Lu Ren Flips Red > Mac? > Fingers > TSP
If Lu Ren Flips Green > Re-evaluate everything and scream.

POE then idk.

It's 2:30 AM

I'm dead.

Why's Dizzy not in this list? Especially if you're willing to consider me town?

Dizzy is one of the people I consider town.

I circled around on for a while but if you read my stream-of-consciousness posting from earlier you can see my thoughts.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:40 pm Mafia Mac never saves Alison town. Trust that lol.

I agree which is why I have been giving you so much credit for Alisonsiding.

I kinda think splints is town.

Posts have been townie, just the right amount of emotion at being wrongly suspected. Lots of people toss her into the POE, nobody seems inclined to stand up for her. Even the people that don't really suspect her or consider her lightly town aren't shielding her. I don't believe in DADV reads but if you do then that probably applies here too.

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:35 am I kinda think splints is town.

The self-vote makes me think along same lines.

What's your current POE other than Dizzy?

Dyslexicon - ISO
EnderWiggin - ISO
falcon45ca - ISO
fingersplints - ISO
Grogu => Syn - ISO => MacDougall - ISO
Lu Ren - ISO
Luckbox Inc - ISO
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME - ISO
NotAnAxehole - ISO
TonyStarkPrime - ISO

Remove Mac, Luren, splints.

Dyslexicon - ISO
EnderWiggin - ISO
falcon45ca - ISO
Luckbox Inc - ISO
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME - ISO
NotAnAxehole - ISO
TonyStarkPrime - ISO

Need to cut one person from here to make a 6 person POE. I'm thinking between Luckbox and Axe. The argument that Luckbox is miscleared is that they kinda dipped recently and hasn't been influencing the thread a bunch even though I remember them being fairly active as town. The argument that Axe is miscleared is that they've been trying very hard to influence the exes and trumpeting about how town will go astray without them, but we haven't gotten any good results (and the BK exe was orchestrated by them).

I could see a townie being disheartened and dipping, or just having real life stuff to deal with. I'd remove Luckbox from the POE. So my 6 person POE is Dizzy, Ender, falcon, Nanook, Axe, TSP.

I actually need to make a 5 person POE, not a 6 person POE with the ratio of players currently in the game.

So remove Axe I guess. Dizzy, Ender, falcon, Nanook, TSP.

The fact that I share only one person with Alison's POE makes me skeevy.

tsp is town

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 5:00 am I refuse to let town die on WIM. If we lose we will do it brightly.

Do not go gentle into that good night,
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

I don't really have low WIM. I have low time. This game is quite annoying though. I don't think the Fingers chop is good. Hasn't the wagon lingered some time now? I just want to chop between me and Alison.

Imagine being me. Here's what I see: Alison has been tunnelling first DOO and then me since the beginning. There was no progression in the DOO read, and there's been no progression in her read on me - just repeating that I'm scum and should be turboed if she dies. The reasoning Alison gives for scum reading me? As far as I can tell, that I pretended to want to sheep at the start of the game (I literally do this all the time btw), that my read on her is "bad" and that Esooa was killed. Ok. I have answered all of this post #1077 where I also point out a few things that Alison accuses me of that actually never happened. Alison's response? No response. And nobody cares. I get the clear impression that she's not actually reading my posts (cause she is accusing me of not doing things that I'm actually doing, so if she could read, she would be able to tell), so I ask her about this and then she admits to not have read everything. Cool. Couple this with Alison having no history of being able to read me. Do you know who has a history of being able to read Alison? Moi. That's why I started the game out with trying to gauge her alignment in the first place. Does anybody care? No. Did anybody care that I actually have experience with Belzy and thought they were town? No. I realise I'm just one person in this game, and I realise some of you don't know me (very well). I feel like the fact that I've become such a huge deal through Alison's tunnel just invalidates my whole play, like I'm only a part of that, and everything else doesn't really matter. Probably partly my fault, but it's kind of impossible for me to ignore. What more is, I feel like Alison has a very easy out to just be part of a tunnel that goes and goes, and so she exists in an unsolved pair until one of us is chopped. So that is why I feel one of us should be chopped, because then we solve that. If I'm chopped, you can see that Alison has gleefully tunnelled town the entire game, and then you make up your mind if you want to let that go. I think not. But at least she doesn't exist only in that own little part of the game anymore. If Alison is chopped, I expect her to flip scum, and though I'm probably just killed at least my reads will maybe get listened to. The point I'm trying to make is that it feels hampering being a part of a pairing like this cause it feels almost like an isolated part of the game. And I think for a scum!Alison, that is an advantage. For me, it's not. (I wouldn't be surprised at all if Alison is actually strategic enough to know this, cause she's mentioned before that I can project town easily as town, so the likelihood of her tunnel actually going through isn't really that big. But then we just both exists like this and the thread health suffers).

So, I'm all for chopping Alison, or me if you must. If you chop me, I'm not here to remind you, but can you please then go through how Alison has actually handled me this game and see if you buy that as a real stance. "I thought they were scum" is not a good enough answer to me.

Top suspects for teamed with Alison imo is Lu Ren and Mac. I don't think anything Lu Ren has done has been outside what I expect from scum. Look into their answers to Ender. I remember a post where they said they were almost offended by him having Ender at the bottom of his read list, but then realised he did this himself. This reads like buddying back to me, after Ender had hard town read Lu Ren. There was a brief moment where Lu Ren said they maybe were worried Ender TMI-ed them, but apparently this quickly disappeared. This is from memory, so please check it (I can't right now). Alison and Lu Ren has hard defended each other, using words like Inno child. It's over the top in a way I think can be teammates. Alison says Mac is "alisonsiding" which reads really corny to me. I don't actually remember most of what Mac has done as I think he's been a bit all over the place. But I didn't like his reaction to Ender, wanting to thunder dome there (but apparently that passed?).

If not these two, TSP could be given another look. He said that if Alison and me is fighting, Alison is probably scum. But I haven't seen him do anything to solve this pairing. Fingers is maybe an outside possibility, but I don't really feel that one. Wish I had more words for this, but I have to go very soon.

So my strong recommendation is to chop between me and Alison today.
If you think we are both town, please state why, clearly.
If/when you vote me or Alison, please state why you choose one over the other.

Only other option I'll consider from where I stand now is Lu Ren and Mac.
But I strongly prefer Alison.

holy wall i am not reading batman

I actually agree that chopping between Dizzy/Alison should've been done already.

I really think it should've been done yesterday.

I know I'm going back on my "remove Alison" thing but the lack of matching PoE just makes me feel weird about how Alison is approaching the game.

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:49 am I actually agree that chopping between Dizzy/Alison should've been done already.

I really think it should've been done yesterday.

I dunno they both seem town to me. Especially when compared to others.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:53 am

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:49 am I actually agree that chopping between Dizzy/Alison should've been done already.

I really think it should've been done yesterday.

I dunno they both seem town to me. Especially when compared to others.

On the upside if Alison flips town, then you have good town equity.

alison's reads are quite wayck tho... maybe its time for tinfoil

We should exe within Dizzy/Alison today because it's out last chance to not auto lose if it's T/T.

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 4:59 am @fingersplints
Why did you vote yourself?

Frustration. Not necessarily at suspicion, as that is the nature of the game. But at receiving 3 votes overnight with nothing really to defend against. We just the day before lost town in a similar abrupt manner for not posting enough despite other suspicions being more talked about for days, and I just felt defeated like the exact same thing was going to happen again no matter what I do. I originally voted on the other lead, but was told it was early for that so it was wolfy so I felt defeated like why bother. Town is in a bad position and I’m probably going to go today so we’ll be down 5 town no mafia.

fingersplints wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 7:50 am

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 4:59 am @fingersplints
Why did you vote yourself?

Frustration. Not necessarily at suspicion, as that is the nature of the game. But at receiving 3 votes overnight with nothing really to defend against. We just the day before lost town in a similar abrupt manner for not posting enough despite other suspicions being more talked about for days, and I just felt defeated like the exact same thing was going to happen again no matter what I do. I originally voted on the other lead, but was told it was early for that so it was wolfy so I felt defeated like why bother. Town is in a bad position and I’m probably going to go today so we’ll be down 5 town no mafia.

Swap to Alison/Dizzy then.

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:37 am

fingersplints wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 7:50 am

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 4:59 am @fingersplints
Why did you vote yourself?

Frustration. Not necessarily at suspicion, as that is the nature of the game. But at receiving 3 votes overnight with nothing really to defend against. We just the day before lost town in a similar abrupt manner for not posting enough despite other suspicions being more talked about for days, and I just felt defeated like the exact same thing was going to happen again no matter what I do. I originally voted on the other lead, but was told it was early for that so it was wolfy so I felt defeated like why bother. Town is in a bad position and I’m probably going to go today so we’ll be down 5 town no mafia.

Swap to Alison/Dizzy then.

If it will save me, I can.
Unfortunately I’m not sure I’ll be around for EOD to know what vote will save. Late for me

Forget about saving yourself right now.

Which of the two do you think is scum?

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 9:12 am Forget about saving yourself right now.

Which of the two do you think is scum?

I’ve thought Alison was town this entire game. Dizzy I haven’t given a ton of thought to. Could be

That's fine. I disagree with it but that's fine.

Feel free to vote Dizzy then.

I am resolving the fucking Dizzy/Alison fight if it's the last thing I do.

We aren't leaving this another day.

I think I'm ready to turbo these and see what happens:

Dizzy
Ender
Finger

If it's all town, then I'd probably follow that up with something like Mac, Alison, Nanook... IDK (at that point I'm probably losing)

If there's mafia in the first 3 I have 2 different names I'd go after.

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 9:31 am I think I'm ready to turbo these and see what happens:

Dizzy
Ender
Finger

If it's all town, then I'd probably follow that up with something like Mac, Alison, Nanook... IDK (at that point I'm probably losing)

If there's mafia in the first 3 I have 2 different names I'd go after.

Wait, if it all flips town, it's over, ok whatever I stand by that LOL

...

My god Axe.

How tf.

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 4:57 am @NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
If you had to make a read of your own beyond sheeping Axe, what would it be?

Also how confident are you Axe is town?

I don't understand the question

And pretty confident, like 95%

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 9:35 am

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 4:57 am @NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
If you had to make a read of your own beyond sheeping Axe, what would it be?

Also how confident are you Axe is town?

I don't understand the question

And pretty confident, like 95%

Ignoring Axe's POE, do you have a POE of your own.

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 9:35 am

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 9:35 am

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 4:57 am @NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
If you had to make a read of your own beyond sheeping Axe, what would it be?

Also how confident are you Axe is town?

I don't understand the question

And pretty confident, like 95%

Ignoring Axe's POE, do you have a POE of your own.

Sorry, I didn't quite get that

... Nevermind.