The Syndicate

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 12:57 pm**

Luxurious wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 12:21 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 11:17 am speedchuck
JaggedJimmyJay
Luxurious
Macdougall
Owner of a Lonely Heart

Dragon D Luffy
nutella
Dragomir
rundontwalk2
M Plus 7
JessieKruger

This is what I have after going back and reviewing a few things.
I checked out Jay's progressions on Gemma and Ultra. At one point early on, both were townreads. The progression from there looked natural.
I probably still need to take a closer look at Lux - volume of posts and tone alone isn't enough to make me completely comfortable leaving him there. Need to check interactions and opinions.
DDL is another I probably need to look closer at.
Nutella is a bit of a question mark because while I was pinged by her entrance (in retrospect) and while she's posted a context-less case on me, that latter bit might be a good look. If she was on a team, they would know that half of the things she cased me with factually failed based on the timing and the in-thread actions. Not to mention that she's jumping in as a replacement. These are all reasons to cut slack here, but I want to see what she does moving forward.
Dragomir is only above the bottom three because I have at least one or two positive pings from him, and the same cannot be said for those beneath him.

11 players left, three scum, no vigs. One kill per night unless the night 4 protectives get lucky. Can't count on that. We have two mislynches before MYLO, or one mislynch before MP and JK kill us with inactivity (if they are both town).

POE needs to be four or five players. I have six. Still work to do, but I'll wait and see if anyone says anything today.
Hey weird flex but why isnt RDW included there

I have no idea. He must have gotten deleted as I was moving things around.
This means my POE is even bigger.

Luxurious wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 12:23 pm Another weird flex is putting me as high as you do and then coming back and saying you need to actually read my posts, which I agree you do but like...

I dont see why I’m that high if all I got going for me is highest poster?

Especially when you come back and say you need to do DDL too, and place him midrange.

I have read your posts, and I find them towny. I have read DDL's posts, and find them a mixed bag.
I have not really gone in-depth and read EVERYTHING, nor have I scoured either of you for interactions or specific things. Your placements on the list are my estimation of you, but my confidence level isn't as high as I would like.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 12:57 pm**

i do lunch now and maybe real grown-up work too

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 1:02 pm**

Lux;1649018 wrote:
Wintermute;1648955 wrote:[V]Dp101[/V]
Are you sheeping a guy read?

Jeanne11;1648996 wrote:Any1 got any questions for me?
How’s your day?

Do you have any thoughts about apw?

There’s a lot of posts but the point is that I started scum reading someone for essentially voting for my partner.

Kinda like a “they cant be scum because I think you’re scum!!!”

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 1:03 pm**

Can someone point out the main points in the Dragomir case? Is there anything that can't be explained by culture clash?

I know I'm waffling on him but I don't want a repeat Gemma. So far I have:

Initial timidity that only lasted like 5 posts. (not applicable anymore)
Gloating when a townie got lynched. (I'm still wtfing over that)
Playa salad (would be the most damning thing, but I'm pretty sure DDL was clearly his preferred lynch, and that miight make it not as bad)
An apparent dislike of providing townreads (he's been throwing scumreads out like candy tho)

All of these points still look somewhat bad, but I want to know if I've missed anything.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 1:04 pm**

We only do chainsaw defenses of ourselves, and we call them NO Us.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 1:07 pm**

Also speed. That makes some amount of sense. Do you plan on doing investigative work?

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 1:11 pm**

He's made a big deal of ddl being clearly his preferred lynch, but whenever there's been an opportunity to put pressure on owner he's jumped onto her and says he'd be okay with lynching her, and same to rdw and jess. He's clearly focused on ddl, but he's also clearly keeping his options open.

[VOTE: dragomir] aubergine

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 1:12 pm**

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 1:03 pm Can someone point out the main points in the Dragomir case? Is there anything that can't be explained by culture clash?

I know I'm waffling on him but I don't want a repeat Gemma. So far I have:

Initial timidity that only lasted like 5 posts. (not applicable anymore)
Gloating when a townie got lynched. (I'm still wtfing over that)
Playa salad (would be the most damning thing, but I'm pretty sure DDL was clearly his preferred lynch, and that miight make it not as bad)
An apparent dislike of providing townreads (he's been throwing scumreads out like candy tho)

All of these points still look somewhat bad, but I want to know if I've missed anything.

I think that’s it?

But i think it’s TWTBAW

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 1:17 pm**

nutella wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 1:11 pm He's made a big deal of ddl being clearly his preferred lynch, but whenever there's been an opportunity to put pressure on owner he's jumped onto her and says he'd be okay with lynching her, and same to rdw and jess. He's clearly focused on ddl, but he's also clearly keeping his options open.

[VOTE: dragomir] aubergine

I think that’s more because we arent listening to him and lynching DDL, so he’s putting his vote where it’d matter while also reiterating his scum reads.

Like i think he had a very clear idea of where he’d like to be, and considering he was gonna go Gemma and then didnt (idk where his vote ended off the top of my head) it seems like he’d still like to lynch within his pool of suspects even if Owner is widely townread.

And yeah I think that’s suspect but continuously doing it? Idk.

I think if Dragomir is right about Owner it’s a bus through and through

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 1:18 pm**

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 1:04 pm We only do chainsaw defenses of ourselves, and we call them NO Us.

If I’m scum I’m defending my whole team.

The game I quoted that from we won without a single mafia being lynched so it’s not like it doesnt work

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 1:19 pm**

Luxurious wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 1:07 pm Also speed. That makes some amount of sense. Do you plan on doing investigative work?

Some.

I won't be reading whole ISOs, but I will be skimming and searching them.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 1:20 pm**

Luxurious wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 1:18 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 1:04 pm We only do chainsaw defenses of ourselves, and we call them NO Us.
If I’m scum I’m defending my whole team.

The game I quoted that from we won without a single mafia being lynched so it’s not like it doesnt work

It can. We're kind of a bus-happy forum this way. In a recent game, JackofHearts bussed both his teammates on D1/D2 and rode to victory from there.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 1:36 pm**

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 1:20 pm
Luxurious wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 1:18 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 1:04 pm We only do chainsaw defenses of ourselves, and we call them NO Us.
If I’m scum I’m defending my whole team.

The game I quoted that from we won without a single mafia being lynched so it’s not like it doesnt work
It can. We're kind of a bus-happy forum this way. In a recent game, JackofHearts bussed both his teammates on D1/D2 and rode to victory from there.

I tried to do that in a recent game (mostly because town was lynching my teammates anyway so I tried to do some distance between us before they died) and I still lost

It’s all mp7’s fault

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 1:38 pm**

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 1:19 pm
Luxurious wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 1:07 pm Also speed. That makes some amount of sense. Do you plan on doing investigative work?
Some.

I won't be reading whole ISOs, but I will be skimming and searching them.

Mmm. Alright

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 1:40 pm**

Point is that I think DDL looks a bit worse regarding Ultra shenanigans.

Not enough so to want to lynch him today but with RDW flip maybe.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 1:58 pm**

Can you clarify that last bit? With a rdw red flip specifically or what, and why?

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:05 pm**

nutella wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 1:58 pm Can you clarify that last bit? With a rdw red flip specifically or what, and why?

Rdw red flip specifically.

Because it looks bad for DDL to defend RDW if rdw is a wolf. On top of Ultra (red flip) chainsaw defending DDL Day 1.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:10 pm**

Luxurious wrote: ↑Tue May 07, 2019 7:42 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue May 07, 2019 7:37 pm Jay is Edison and I am Tesla.
I’m trying to remember the details of their feud but it’s not coming to me.

Didnt edison steal his work.

No i dont know what wikipedia is nor do i have time to google it

Edison is scum.

[VOTE: JJJ] aubergine

Still can't rationalize very well but I wanna lynch him even more today.

The Gemma wagon was garbage from the start of the game and it kept being garbage in Day 3 too.

I guess I could have defended her more but I wasn't super convinced she was a civ. But the reasons to think she was bad ranged from "forced" to "meh".

Jay is the second highest poster and he's spamming interaction posts. He's not gonna convince me has no time to play like a civ. He's not playing like a civ because he's not one. He's just doing coursework while pursuing easy lynches.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:11 pm**

Dragomir is a living mass of hubris and boldness. I don't want to believe he's bad because it's day 4 and by this point some teammate would have already told him to STFU.

He's not playing like someone who wants to look civ, and I think he literally believes the stuff he's saying.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:12 pm**

Also I'm 5 pages behind fyi. Still need to catch up but it's better to ignite the gasoline sooner than later.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:13 pm**

Steely Dan taught me I need to trust me instincts a little more.

Join me in the Successful Jay Lynch Hype Train. If the name doesn't convince you, we have cookies.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:19 pm**

Luxurious wrote: ↑Tue May 07, 2019 8:16 pm I think Dragomir is TWTBAW

too wolfy to be a wolf. I will use the acronym again probably

OMG you people have an acronym?

Here I use Too Scummy to be Scum

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:21 pm**

Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 07, 2019 8:23 pm
Luxurious wrote: ↑Tue May 07, 2019 8:13 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 07, 2019 8:10 pm
Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Tue May 07, 2019 7:34 pm Nova targeted RDW last night.

---I'm kind of pissed; you guys lynched the Night 3 town doctor.
Are you trying to imply that Gemma being town is something we should have known? Because it seems like you're trying to say that we shouldn't have done that.
You came in today with a “HA I WAS RIGHT” type of response to Gemma’s flip. You did know she was town. You argued against her lynch last day phase.

Why are you, specifically, taking issue with this
But I didn't know she was town. I just thought she might be a mislynch that's all. It wasn't a town read but a hunch I got that made me doubt her lynch.

I have an issue with this because if she's trying to get mad at the fact that we lynched a townie even though the only way one could deduce she was town was based on reads and all reads differ, then that implies TMI imo. It's like she was trying to say that town made a stupid decision in lynching Gemma and shouldn't have done it get me?

I was just trying to gloat, don't see me getting mad.

Town made a stupid decision in lynching Gemma and shouldn't have done that.

It's blame time. Join the Inquisition.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:24 pm**

DDL's 2019 Goal

Develop a functioning and reliable Jaydar.

This game is Proof of Concept.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:27 pm**

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 2:19 pm
Luxurious wrote: ↑Tue May 07, 2019 8:16 pm I think Dragomir is TWTBAW

too wolfy to be a wolf. I will use the acronym again probably
OMG you people have an acronym?

Here I use Too Scummy to be Scum

Same difference tbh

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:28 pm**

Please tell me the remaining 4 pages I have to read are not just people trying to make Dragomir act reasonably and failing to do so.

Because it's making this catch-up boring.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:30 pm**

Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue May 07, 2019 9:08 pm That would mean that Ultra just decided to bus his own buddy D1 and that lacks all possible logic. Like, I get bussing D4, D5 even D3. But D1? The person you want to fake a case on and get contribution on for D1 is your own buddy? Also, Ultra being new to the forum and bussing doesn't make any sense. The only ppl he knows in this game are Nova and me. Newbies bussing their buddies at D1 just doesn't make any sense. They don't do that.

I don't understand how you can just read their interaction and think it could be bussing.

You sweet summer child.

And he's not a newbie, he's a Mafia Championship competitor.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:33 pm**

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:33 pm**

I’m still not down to clown about JJJ.

Rn my headspace is still revolving around the issue with Mac.

Without mod confirmation of my theories (ie. Action resolution) I come down to two conclusions

1) Mac is scum who sadly rolled alignment cop and is trying to use his ability to “mechanically clear” whoever his teammate is
2) I was role blocked and Mac still gets to use his action and is town, and does have a green flip.

Option 1 makes me think the team is DDL/RDW/Mac/Ultra

Option 2 I dont want Mac to die with his confirmation information and we have a lock townie on our hands that we cant actually lock as town.

My issue with Option 2 is the fact that Option 1 literally can still be in play despite this. Also, conftowning someone based on Mac’s info will definitely get them killed by scum which is also bad so like

Mrrrrr

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:33 pm**

Hey DDL
Thought experiment:
Who is JJJ’s team should he be scum?

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:34 pm**

DDL focusing on JJJ and defending Dragomir doesnt make sense as scum in my cozy box

Mrrrrrr

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:35 pm**

Mac feels civ but I'm not super good at reading him.

Speedchucks sucks and is my second option.

RDW is an option I want to lynch as much as I wanted to lynch Gemma yesterday. As in, not that much. It's bait. Looking at people who are falling too easily for it.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:35 pm**

Does that mean Dragomir really is scum?

Like: DDL/Ultra/ Dragomir/ RDW

This sucks

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:36 pm**

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 2:35 pm Mac feels civ but I'm not super good at reading him.

Speedchucks sucks and is my second option.

RDW is an option I want to lynch as much as I wanted to lynch Gemma yesterday. As in, not that much. It's bait. Looking at people who are falling too easily for it.

Opinions on Nutella

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:36 pm**

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 2:10 pm Jay is the second highest poster and he's spamming interaction posts. He's not gonna convince me has no time to play like a civ. He's not playing like a civ because he's not one. He's just doing coursework while pursuing easy lynches.

Now that finals are over and as a result I do have some time, I am spending that time doing the work I wanted to do in Steely Dan but could not because of time. I didn't get to the deep analytics until it was too late, particularly re: dunya, and I'm not doing that again. I don't give a shit if you feel inclined to call my work "spam". It's necessary, and I fully expect to lose the game if I don't do all of it.

Your suspicions remind me of something DDL. Stand by.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:36 pm**

Luxurious wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 2:33 pm Hey DDL
Thought experiment:
Who is JJJ’s team should he be scum?

Haven't paid much attention to team analysis tbh.

Maybe two of Speed/nutella/MP/RDW

Could see Jessie too because JJJ is more than capable of bussing.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:38 pm**

Luxurious wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 2:36 pm
Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 2:35 pm Mac feels civ but I'm not super good at reading him.

Speedchucks sucks and is my second option.

RDW is an option I want to lynch as much as I wanted to lynch Gemma yesterday. As in, not that much. It's bait. Looking at people who are falling too easily for it.
Opinions on Nutella

Has done absolutely nothing to impress me so far. Though I'm still on p42.

That said I'm godawful at reading nutella. Will take a while to form anything consistent on her.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:41 pm**

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 2:36 pm
Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 2:10 pm Jay is the second highest poster and he's spamming interaction posts. He's not gonna convince me has no time to play like a civ. He's not playing like a civ because he's not one. He's just doing coursework while pursuing easy lynches.
Now that finals are over and as a result I do have some time, I am spending that time doing the work I wanted to do in Steely Dan but could not because of time. I didn't get to the deep analytics until it was too late, particularly re: dunya, and I'm not doing that again. I don't give a shit if you feel inclined to call my work "spam". It's necessary, and I fully expect to lose the game if I don't do all of it.

Your suspicions remind me of something DDL. Stand by.

Congrats on the work. Regardlessly if you are civ or bad. I mean it.

But I'm not gonna let you use it as a shield.

You are disconnected from this game, and as long as I feel you are disconnected from this game I'll keep pushing you.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2017 8:21 am At this point I'd expect to be drowing in a sea of Jay. To have so much Jay around me I could barely breathe. But I can breathe just fine. Jay is talking, but he is not seizing control. He is engaging, but not in a way that makes me feel like he is trying to produce perfect reads on everyone on day 1, to make everyone interact with each other, to move the game forward.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:52 pm**

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 2:41 pm Congrats on the work. Regardlessly if you are civ or bad. I mean it.

But I'm not gonna let you use it as a shield.

You are disconnected from this game, and as long as I feel you are disconnected from this game I'll keep pushing you.

I think you have an impression of me born of the Mountain game that you haven't quite let go of. In that game my activity slacked, and I was forced into strategically disagreeable (and often overtly angry) moves because it was sorely imbalanced. It just so happens that game was also during one of my finals weeks. What I was reminded of before was Fire Emblem, which was my last mislynch to my memory. You were a part of that due in large part to comparisons to Mountains, at least some of which are quite familiar here:

I'm not suffocating on Jay / He is not ruling the town | Comparison to Mountains | Emotion

The point here is that time constraints can occur at any time and in any game, and that they have a real impact upon how a person plays including as a civilian. It's especially critical for me, because the way I often play demands a ton of my time. If I have to be away from the site frequently, my entire approach has to shift or else I am not going to be able to make the same kind of difference. I think you need to update your definitions.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:54 pm**

Nutella I’m having a hard time reading because I mindmelded a but with Speed iso, but completely hated Dragomir’s

Her iso’s are cases which is like, fine since i do that too and I can see that coming from town.

My issue is Gemma/ Dragomir are both lhf (low hanging fruit), if Dragomir is town anyway, and if he’s not town, I still dont really wanna give nutella towncred for the push? Like it doesnt feel townie.

Mac said that he thought Nutella was town because she jumped in and started pushing which is easier to do as town than scum but shrug to that. I would been more inclined to like her if she didnt come in, instant vote Gemma, and then start pushing Dragomir. Maybe if it was Speed, then it’d be fine, but a lot of her thoughts echo a lot of what everyone else has been thinking, which like

Isnt what I’m used to when I see a town sub. Usually they find the deep wolf, or even then, defend the two people who’s lynch has been talked about on again and off again for the past 3 day phases

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 2:56 pm**

I don't know how I can be called disconnected from the game though. I am literally burying myself in this thread right now to an extent rare even for me.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 3:00 pm**

I'll take a look at nutella in isolation a bit later. At face value I appreciate her hard-nosed attack upon the game thread as a replacement. She turned 0 into 40-something quite quickly, and she doesn't seem concerned with appearances.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 3:02 pm**

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 2:52 pm
Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 2:41 pm Congrats on the work. Regardlessly if you are civ or bad. I mean it.

But I'm not gonna let you use it as a shield.

You are disconnected from this game, and as long as I feel you are disconnected from this game I'll keep pushing you.
I think you have an impression of me born of the Mountain game that you haven't quite let go of. In that game my activity slacked, and I was forced into strategically disagreeable (and often overtly angry) moves because it was sorely imbalanced. It just so happens that game was also during one of my finals weeks. What I was reminded of before was Fire Emblem, which was my last mislynch to my memory. You were a part of that due in large part to comparisons to Mountains, at least some of which are quite familiar here:

I'm not suffocating on Jay / He is not ruling the town | Comparison to Mountains | Emotion

The point here is that time constraints can occur at any time and in any game, and that they have a real impact upon how a person plays including as a civilian. It's especially critical for me, because the way I often play demands a ton of my time. If I have to be away from the site frequently, my entire approach has to shift or else I am not going to be able to make the same kind of difference. I think you need to update your definitions.

Oh, I do need to update my definitions.

But I think that's more of a need of fine tuning than a harsh one.

I have some degree of instinctive ability to read you. I know I do, because the number of times I successfully read you as a civ is numerous. The problem is that I just haven't played many games with you as a baddie. Mountain might be the only one, and if there are more, I likely got lynched/killed early in them because I don't remember. I need more data.

But data is coming. I see that in Fire Emblem I mainly suspected you for tunneling. Well, data updated, you may or may not tunnel. You aren't really tunneling here, just being consistent. So that's a big NAI.

Something about you is giving me the heebie jeebies. Ain't gonna let go of that so soon.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 3:03 pm**

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 2:35 pm Speedchucks sucks and is my second option.

tellmemore.gif

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 3:04 pm**

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 3:02 pm Something about you is giving me the heebie jeebies. Ain't gonna let go of that so soon.

Do your thing.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 3:05 pm**

My poe list regarding this stuff is as follows

Dragomir and above is my “dont lynch this” pile. Jessie and mp7 are bracketed to indicate that they’re inactive and are thusly lower than Mac, but also this list is mostly based on interactions and I dont want them getting in the way of the way it reads.

RDW would shine more of a light on DDL which is why he’s first. DDL last since outside of Scum!RDW he’s probably town.

Speed/ Mac/ Nutella are pretty lose because if RDW is/ isnt scum, someone in that pile is probably scum. Granted mp7 and Jessie avoided rng hell.

Consider this my town -> scum reads list
[green]
Owner
JJJ

[light green]
Dragomir

[yellow
DDL

[death]
Jessie
Mp7

[orange]
Speed
Mac

[orangey]
Nutella

[red]
RDW

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 3:06 pm**

just been invited out with me mates, so i'm away again for a bit

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 3:07 pm**

My first instinct is that DDL is genuine in his suspicion of me. As I just noted, we've been in a similar place before, and I can understand if he feels the need to stand as some resistance to my authority over the game.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 3:09 pm**

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 3:03 pm
Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 2:35 pm Speedchucks sucks and is my second option.
tellmemore.gif

The last remarkable thing he did in this game was the trap thing.

He feel like a part-time outsourced assistant free-lancer who takes requests from an App and has no WiFi.

Posted: **Wed May 08, 2019 3:11 pm**

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2019 3:09 pm The last remarkable thing he did in this game was the trap thing.

Y'know, except for instigating the Ultra lynch.

I don't usually have a problem with being scumread, but I have no idea why it is happening in this game.

The Syndicate

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