The Syndicate

timmer wrote:We could at least put MM into second place in the poll, I'm not liking that so many people who are under suspicion are voting for JJJ right now.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:To be fair, I think MM was conveying some kind of reads through his "funeral" talk -- town reading the people he invited and not the people he didn't. He can contest or confirm that.

The marmot-slayer speaketh the truth.

timmer wrote:We could at least put MM into second place in the poll, I'm not liking that so many people who are under suspicion are voting for JJJ right now.

triceratopzeuhl wrote:

triceratopzeuhl wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I'm putting a vote on Scotty.

What is your reason for this?

Is it that he hasn't answered this post?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I'm going to restate my primary Scotty beefs for Scotty himself whenever he is available.

Spoiler: show

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:~ Scotty's efforts to communicate with Golden and facilitate his involvement in the continuing dialogue was a decent look. I was able to work with the methods they employed myself, though perhaps with less clarity. I appreciate that he provided Golden with a forum to convey his reads when at the time I believe he was not in Golden's good graces. I do have some lingering concern though primarily centered in one post:

Scotty wrote:

Golden wrote:I don't really have time to do a full catch up, just enough to see that (I assume) inh was good.

I don't much like the epi votes. Except maybe trice's one.

I also really don't like scotty basically being like 'told you guys'. Calling your shot on someone being civilian is the easiest thing to do in the world since a) most people are and b) all baddies have an even higher percentage shot of being right (in this case 15/16); but

c) bragging about it afterwards is the equivalent of discrediting a load of people, even when at least half of them are town, and d) not only does it discredit, but it also puts the focus squarely on 'who voted for a civilian to die' instead of 'who is bad' which are not necessarily the same thing.

I'll be all for looking to see if any inh votes are uninspired. But when I last looked, there were four and all of them felt fair and well explained in the thread to me.

What??! How is "well there ya go" in any way "I told you guys"? How is that bragging about it? Show me where I bragged about you all being wrong.

Now you're just putting words in my mouth and manipulating this away from you and the other INH voters so you don't have to take responsibility for your votes. Yes, civs make the wrong votes all the time. Of course they do. But I already feel like you, JJJ, Sloonei and Mp have all come after me on day 1 for bullsuit reasons and I find it manipulative. Couple that with the fact that I don't trust you guys, makes me think at least 1 or a couple of you might be bad. Just because I haven't had a tennis match where I've spewed 5028 posts in the matter of 24 hours doesn't mean I can't make reads off of votes.

I didn't know INH was gonna flip good, but I definitely didn't think he would flip bad. So get off your high horse, golden.

Love, Scotty

Yellow: hyperbolic/exaggerated language looks insincere at face value.

Orange: this is an accusation, and it implies to me that Scotty is suspicious of Golden now for two reasons: contributing to the INH lynch, and "manipulating the conversation away from INH voters". This is something Scotty didn't follow up on, and that makes me question the motive for cramming it into this response in the first place. I think the suspicion inherent in this language is pretty clear, and that he didn't proceed with it (indeed he became Golden's communicative aid in Day 2) raises doubts that it was honest. The alternative explanation is less ideal: that he turned Golden's accusation against him as a defense mechanism with intent to discredit his accuser.

I would also assert the orange bit and the second yellow bit go together awkwardly. If Golden is on a "high horse", that would imply he is overconfident about a read, not falsifying a read. The difference is important, as it relates directly to alignment.

Green: this just has its own discrediting power given its vaguely critical language.

Scotty, please talk about those things.

Spoiler: show

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I could also consider voting for Scotty.

Scotty wrote:I'm way behind everyone. Like 12 pages behind. Looks like no one died?

Will Do my best to catch up.

Scotty wrote:I'm still not caught up. 5 or so more pages to read.. I see JJJ has a little case breakdown that I skimmed. Eventually I'll get around to answering it.

I never said my vote was forced. LoRab decided that. I have calmed my jets on a few people I had recently suspected. I'm actually feeling better about Golden, and Mp. I think BWT is still suspicious? Why? I forgot. But he said some stuff some some time ago that was phrased in a weird way that perked uo ym ears like Pluto. Sloon is on neutral ground. Slight mafia still on JJJ. I don't think he was faking his curse, I just think his curser was just unimaginative.

I'm way behind. Long day, may not get around to this until tomorrow at the earliest. Blech my mafia time where did it go???

To fall behind sometimes is understandable. Life happens. However, I don't get the impression Scotty has much urgency to involve himself in this game even as he makes the attempt to catch up. He has given us a live-track of his status (12 pages behind, 5 pages behind), but in the process of that catchup his productivity has been scarce. I would think a town Scotty would be grabbing quotes as he reads along and sharing some kind of thoughts instead of this sort of one-off neutral commentary on what he needs to do and a few half-reads.

Scotty wrote:ive been traveling to Canada all day today and am currently waiting for a connection flight to...somewhere. I don't even know what time zone im in right now. Halp.

triceratopzeuhl wrote:

triceratopzeuhl wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I'm putting a vote on Scotty.

What is your reason for this?

Is it that he hasn't answered this post?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I'm going to restate my primary Scotty beefs for Scotty himself whenever he is available.

Spoiler: show

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:~ Scotty's efforts to communicate with Golden and facilitate his involvement in the continuing dialogue was a decent look. I was able to work with the methods they employed myself, though perhaps with less clarity. I appreciate that he provided Golden with a forum to convey his reads when at the time I believe he was not in Golden's good graces. I do have some lingering concern though primarily centered in one post:

Scotty wrote:

Golden wrote:I don't really have time to do a full catch up, just enough to see that (I assume) inh was good.

I don't much like the epi votes. Except maybe trice's one.

I also really don't like scotty basically being like 'told you guys'. Calling your shot on someone being civilian is the easiest thing to do in the world since a) most people are and b) all baddies have an even higher percentage shot of being right (in this case 15/16); but

c) bragging about it afterwards is the equivalent of discrediting a load of people, even when at least half of them are town, and d) not only does it discredit, but it also puts the focus squarely on 'who voted for a civilian to die' instead of 'who is bad' which are not necessarily the same thing.

I'll be all for looking to see if any inh votes are uninspired. But when I last looked, there were four and all of them felt fair and well explained in the thread to me.

What??! How is "well there ya go" in any way "I told you guys"? How is that bragging about it? Show me where I bragged about you all being wrong.

Now you're just putting words in my mouth and manipulating this away from you and the other INH voters so you don't have to take responsibility for your votes. Yes, civs make the wrong votes all the time. Of course they do. But I already feel like you, JJJ, Sloonei and Mp have all come after me on day 1 for bullsuit reasons and I find it manipulative. Couple that with the fact that I don't trust you guys, makes me think at least 1 or a couple of you might be bad. Just because I haven't had a tennis match where I've spewed 5028 posts in the matter of 24 hours doesn't mean I can't make reads off of votes.

I didn't know INH was gonna flip good, but I definitely didn't think he would flip bad. So get off your high horse, golden.

Love, Scotty

Yellow: hyperbolic/exaggerated language looks insincere at face value.

Orange: this is an accusation, and it implies to me that Scotty is suspicious of Golden now for two reasons: contributing to the INH lynch, and "manipulating the conversation away from INH voters". This is something Scotty didn't follow up on, and that makes me question the motive for cramming it into this response in the first place. I think the suspicion inherent in this language is pretty clear, and that he didn't proceed with it (indeed he became Golden's communicative aid in Day 2) raises doubts that it was honest. The alternative explanation is less ideal: that he turned Golden's accusation against him as a defense mechanism with intent to discredit his accuser.

I would also assert the orange bit and the second yellow bit go together awkwardly. If Golden is on a "high horse", that would imply he is overconfident about a read, not falsifying a read. The difference is important, as it relates directly to alignment.

Green: this just has its own discrediting power given its vaguely critical language.

Scotty, please talk about those things.

Spoiler: show

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I could also consider voting for Scotty.

Scotty wrote:I'm way behind everyone. Like 12 pages behind. Looks like no one died?

Will Do my best to catch up.

Scotty wrote:I'm still not caught up. 5 or so more pages to read.. I see JJJ has a little case breakdown that I skimmed. Eventually I'll get around to answering it.

I never said my vote was forced. LoRab decided that. I have calmed my jets on a few people I had recently suspected. I'm actually feeling better about Golden, and Mp. I think BWT is still suspicious? Why? I forgot. But he said some stuff some some time ago that was phrased in a weird way that perked uo ym ears like Pluto. Sloon is on neutral ground. Slight mafia still on JJJ. I don't think he was faking his curse, I just think his curser was just unimaginative.

I'm way behind. Long day, may not get around to this until tomorrow at the earliest. Blech my mafia time where did it go???

To fall behind sometimes is understandable. Life happens. However, I don't get the impression Scotty has much urgency to involve himself in this game even as he makes the attempt to catch up. He has given us a live-track of his status (12 pages behind, 5 pages behind), but in the process of that catchup his productivity has been scarce. I would think a town Scotty would be grabbing quotes as he reads along and sharing some kind of thoughts instead of this sort of one-off neutral commentary on what he needs to do and a few half-reads.

Hi.

JJJ wants an answer? My answer is that I was putting most of effort into the Monkey Island, which in and of itself was less time than I would like. In this game, with its early activity, quoting exact posts gets rather tedious when I'm already way behind, because I'll lose track of where I am. Kind of a cop out excuse but that's my excuse.

I don't know if the vote ends now or in a few hours honestly so I popped a vote on JJJ. I think I am with the marmot that JJJ is bad and has been leading us astray. That someone as thorough as JJJ has not produced a successful lynch is not his fault entirely, but he and the other high posters must be scrutinized. I'm not one to talk because I've been more absent than Harry Potter's parents, but if Golden wasn't bad, which it is very apparent he wasn't, then either Mp or JJJ are playing mind games with the thread. I'm willing to bet it's JjJ

timmer wrote:Also of note, Golden was targeted for death and he was one of the people suspecting and voting MM yesterday.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:Have you read anything else, Scotty?

MovingPictures07 wrote:I don't want to lynch Trice or JJJ. I want to lynch Scotty. Let's do it.

triceratopzeuhl wrote:Crooked Epignosis thinks he can keep throwing whoppers after a civvie insanified him, sad!

Scotty wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I don't want to lynch Trice or JJJ. I want to lynch Scotty. Let's do it.

Low hanging fruit, Mp.

timmer wrote:@MM, if you find a way, can you say whether you think all 3 curses today are legit, and if not, which is the lie?

MovingPictures07 wrote:I honestly am town reading Trice still. I think he's just gotten himself into an aggressive and tunneling mindset. This is the Trice meta I remember.

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Scotty wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I don't want to lynch Trice or JJJ. I want to lynch Scotty. Let's do it.

Low hanging fruit, Mp.

You are low hanging fruit? Bullshit.

Boomslang wrote:Fun fact: Lorab only started posting in "sad" and "sadness" acronyms after Trice used the Donald Trump syntax.

triceratopzeuhl wrote:Crooked Epignosis thinks he can keep throwing whoppers after a civvie insanified him, sad!

I have no idea if that means anything, but it's just funky enough that it tickles my brain.

Linki w/MP: And my half-baked theory is that Trice triggered Lorab's curse with that post.
Linki w/MP2: Uh, starting a lynch this late? Do you really not believe in either of the big trains going right now, or are you conveniently copping out of culpability?
Linki w/Scotty: DAMMIT I TYPE SLOW

MovingPictures07 wrote:Alright, I no longer am considering the idea that MM is faking; he's clearly trying to contribute. I think we have 3 legit curses floating around.

Boomslang wrote:Fun fact: Lorab only started posting in "sad" and "sadness" acronyms after Trice used the Donald Trump syntax.

triceratopzeuhl wrote:Crooked Epignosis thinks he can keep throwing whoppers after a civvie insanified him, sad!

I have no idea if that means anything, but it's just funky enough that it tickles my brain.

Linki w/MP: And my half-baked theory is that Trice triggered Lorab's curse with that post.
Linki w/MP2: Uh, starting a lynch this late? Do you really not believe in either of the big trains going right now, or are you conveniently copping out of culpability?
Linki w/Scotty: DAMMIT I TYPE SLOW

MovingPictures07 wrote:Scotty is bad.

Scotty wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I honestly am town reading Trice still. I think he's just gotten himself into an aggressive and tunneling mindset. This is the Trice meta I remember.

I also view trice as good

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Scotty wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I don't want to lynch Trice or JJJ. I want to lynch Scotty. Let's do it.

Low hanging fruit, Mp.

You are low hanging fruit? Bullshit.

No, it's not bullshit and you know it.

Also I changed my vote to MM

MovingPictures07 wrote:I honestly am town reading Trice still. I think he's just gotten himself into an aggressive and tunneling mindset. This is the Trice meta I remember.

birdwithteeth11 wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Alright, I no longer am considering the idea that MM is faking; he's clearly trying to contribute. I think we have 3 legit curses floating around.

Maybe. But you're going to have to point it out to me when you're done. Because I am not seeing any significant contributions from MM today outside of him using his "curse" to state his civ and bad reads.

Linki MP:A vote at Scotty? How come? We have 2 notable trains to consider, and you are willing to throw your vote away instead?

Linki2: Okay I've now had like 10 linkis. Y'all need to post slower.

Linki3: DAMMIT STOPPIT! :P

Linki4: How are you so certain Scotty is bad?

Linki5: Another vote for MM? You're making me consider now...

Linki6: But...what's your reasoning?

Scotty wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Scotty wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I don't want to lynch Trice or JJJ. I want to lynch Scotty. Let's do it.

Low hanging fruit, Mp.

You are low hanging fruit? Bullshit.

No, it's not bullshit and you know it.

Also I changed my vote to MM

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I honestly am town reading Trice still. I think he's just gotten himself into an aggressive and tunneling mindset. This is the Trice meta I remember.

It would represent some of the most intense tunneling I can remember encountering. I don't get the impression his bad read on me ever developed in an authentic way, it simply happened. And when it happened, there was no alternative, no other possible explanation, and every post I've made has been evil incarnate.

MovingPictures07 wrote:

birdwithteeth11 wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Alright, I no longer am considering the idea that MM is faking; he's clearly trying to contribute. I think we have 3 legit curses floating around.

Maybe. But you're going to have to point it out to me when you're done. Because I am not seeing any significant contributions from MM today outside of him using his "curse" to state his civ and bad reads.

Linki MP:A vote at Scotty? How come? We have 2 notable trains to consider, and you are willing to throw your vote away instead?

Linki2: Okay I've now had like 10 linkis. Y'all need to post slower.

Linki3: DAMMIT STOPPIT! :P

Linki4: How are you so certain Scotty is bad?

Linki5: Another vote for MM? You're making me consider now...

Linki6: But...what's your reasoning?

You don't think Scotty's vote for JJJ is total shit? I can smell it all the way from Texas.

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Scotty wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I honestly am town reading Trice still. I think he's just gotten himself into an aggressive and tunneling mindset. This is the Trice meta I remember.

I also view trice as good

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Scotty wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I don't want to lynch Trice or JJJ. I want to lynch Scotty. Let's do it.

Low hanging fruit, Mp.

You are low hanging fruit? Bullshit.

No, it's not bullshit and you know it.

Also I changed my vote to MM

You've been in catchup mode for days, you barely have contributed anything upon the chances you have had to post, and now you come in and drop the laziest vote ever on the second highest vote wagon, JJJ, for bunk reasons. "He's leading us astray". That's nonsense. Everyone is accountable for their own votes.

Boomslang wrote:Fun fact: Lorab only started posting in "sad" and "sadness" acronyms after Trice used the Donald Trump syntax.

triceratopzeuhl wrote:Crooked Epignosis thinks he can keep throwing whoppers after a civvie insanified him, sad!

I have no idea if that means anything, but it's just funky enough that it tickles my brain.

Linki w/MP: And my half-baked theory is that Trice triggered Lorab's curse with that post.
Linki w/MP2: Uh, starting a lynch this late? Do you really not believe in either of the big trains going right now, or are you conveniently copping out of culpability?
Linki w/Scotty: DAMMIT I TYPE SLOW

MovingPictures07 wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I honestly am town reading Trice still. I think he's just gotten himself into an aggressive and tunneling mindset. This is the Trice meta I remember.

It would represent some of the most intense tunneling I can remember encountering. I don't get the impression his bad read on me ever developed in an authentic way, it simply happened. And when it happened, there was no alternative, no other possible explanation, and every post I've made has been evil incarnate.

It's too aggressive and illogical to fit a mafia agenda.

That's exactly what Dom did in P&R as Andy to Leslie, as well as what most of the alive players did to Jerry, that got him and the rest of town in trouble. If anything I'd say that attribute is more likely town than not.

timmer wrote:I still think it should be MM, today, MP.

timmer wrote:I still think it should be MM, today, MP.

nijuukyugou wrote:ARGHHHH so I'm all for lynching either MM or trice now, the latter a lot for this (among other reasons read, although not as compelling and beautifully tinfoil-y):

Boomslang wrote:Fun fact: Lorab only started posting in "sad" and "sadness" acronyms after Trice used the Donald Trump syntax.

triceratopzeuhl wrote:Crooked Epignosis thinks he can keep throwing whoppers after a civvie insanified him, sad!

I have no idea if that means anything, but it's just funky enough that it tickles my brain.

Linki w/MP: And my half-baked theory is that Trice triggered Lorab's curse with that post.
Linki w/MP2: Uh, starting a lynch this late? Do you really not believe in either of the big trains going right now, or are you conveniently copping out of culpability?
Linki w/Scotty: DAMMIT I TYPE SLOW

Whoa. Nice catch! I refuse to ignore stuff that stands out like that, and this smells so bad. I see the other reasons (as far as I can tell) are for general snark and not doing much baddie hunting. Similar to MM, except I feel more strongly about MM from the last time I voted because of those reasons. My only reservation is the sudden train catching on for MM (like a possible save?), but...I think, because I'm starving and do have that stronger conviction towards MM at the moment (and he appears to have a convenient curse/"curse" on him), I'll go that way today.

Linki - DAMN YOU AND ALL OF YOUR LINKI

birdwithteeth11 wrote:

timmer wrote:I still think it should be MM, today, MP.

Then move your vote like I did, and let's get MM lynched!

Linki: Ninja's vote for MM should be all the more reason to do so now.

Scotty wrote:If MM flips bad, let's lynch MP next kthnx

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I honestly am town reading Trice still. I think he's just gotten himself into an aggressive and tunneling mindset. This is the Trice meta I remember.

It would represent some of the most intense tunneling I can remember encountering. I don't get the impression his bad read on me ever developed in an authentic way, it simply happened. And when it happened, there was no alternative, no other possible explanation, and every post I've made has been evil incarnate.

It's too aggressive and illogical to fit a mafia agenda.

That's exactly what Dom did in P&R as Andy to Leslie, as well as what most of the alive players did to Jerry, that got him and the rest of town in trouble. If anything I'd say that attribute is more likely town than not.

Do you feel it fits any better in a scenario where a trice lynch becomes genuinely plausible/probable and a standing JJJ counterwagon is the most viable preventive measure? I've gotten the impression that he's started attacking me with such rabid vigor because lynching me is his surest ticket to Night 4.

MovingPictures07 wrote:

timmer wrote:I still think it should be MM, today, MP.

Why?

timmer wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

timmer wrote:I still think it should be MM, today, MP.

Why?

I think trice may have tilted. I don't like how many people came in early and voted him and have not come back. I don't see enough evidence against JJJ. The Scotty thing is too fresh and new to establish with little time left. MM hasn't actually pursued baddies all game, except for his Timmer ten-minute thing which he inexplicably held onto for 3 games days.

I think MM is the way to go.