Re: Lawyers, Guns and Money- [DAY 3]
Posted: Mon Dec 05, 2022 9:39 pm
Murder, Mayhem, and Mafia
https://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/
If there are wolves on ot, a very good reason for that would be that they want the civ cred for eliminating a baddie.
Themselves. If they go off by themselves and stack onto another person it's suspicious.
For me, it's getting to the point where it's a numbers game. Not too far back I posted a list of the players that most townie-ish players believe to be the most likely wolf. Of those people we pared it down and the consensus ended on him.Dennis wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 9:35 pmWhy would Soneji defend Neon with a after she got called out for adding herself in her towncore? Especially bringing into the equation of different site cultures doesn't make any sense if Soneji is wolf and Neon is town, when it seemed like (to me) that Golden was suspicious of Neon.Soneji wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 3:16 am The logical assumption is that someone includes themselves among their towncore by default so it's unnecessary and potentially performative to list themselves, because either they know they're town from their rolecard, or they know they need to fake being town from their rolecard. One doesn't normally include themselves in readslist as they cannot make a read on their own alignment which is a known factor to them, and either they know they're town or need to fake it. The need for anti-town to fake being town is what subconsciously can cause them to want to project "I AM TOWN" at every opportunity, hence listing themselves in towncores/townreads lists. It is common enough for actual townies, especially from certain site cultures, to list themselves in such things so it's not a hard wolf tell, but it can be a soft tell when alongside other performative town projection examples.
This is just shutting down conversations that were off topic.
This is analysis and I like it.Soneji wrote: ↑Sun Dec 04, 2022 11:00 am The first group is rightly calling for accountability from the Wilgy voters, while the second has every reason to not want to rock the boat. Dennis is a newbie, what narrative is he going to try and control? Plus several players rushed to proclaim him townie for his EoD. Seanzie just narrowly escaped the noose, of course they'd avoid a thunder dome. SVS does look good from how they explained their vote, and how they wanted a tie.
I don't think a wolf would bring this up, because why explain your strategy to the entire thread?Soneji wrote: ↑Sun Dec 04, 2022 9:31 am I'm still reading through parts of the thread but I want to bring forth a thought on the set-up that could certainly have an effect on wolves mindset in this game. I didn't see wolves win condition listed anywhere but assuming it's to reach vote parity, or even just killing all town, then so long as all three members are alive then they win as soon as there are only five town members left due to being able to vote silence two townies each night. At that point town can only tie elim votes, so has no path to winning. So more than normal wolves will want to ensure all members make it to endgame, and keeping the Lawyer alive is top priority as even with just one other wolf they lower the number needed for vote parity. Bussing is very unlikely, and hard defenses of packmates very likely.
I dunno, it's just all of their posts in general I agree with but these were a few examples. Maybe in the 3rd one I'm being convinced by them explaining I don't know what I'm doing still but other than that it's just everything. Now please answer my question.
That's what I was saying; it's not these posts in particular, it's more in general he feels townie. And it's not like I'm 100 percent sure, he could still be wolf. I just don't see any baddie intentions.Kate wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 9:46 pmFor me, it's getting to the point where it's a numbers game. Not too far back I posted a list of the players that most townie-ish players believe to be the most likely wolf. Of those people we pared it down and the consensus ended on him.Dennis wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 9:35 pmWhy would Soneji defend Neon with a after she got called out for adding herself in her towncore? Especially bringing into the equation of different site cultures doesn't make any sense if Soneji is wolf and Neon is town, when it seemed like (to me) that Golden was suspicious of Neon.Soneji wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 3:16 am The logical assumption is that someone includes themselves among their towncore by default so it's unnecessary and potentially performative to list themselves, because either they know they're town from their rolecard, or they know they need to fake being town from their rolecard. One doesn't normally include themselves in readslist as they cannot make a read on their own alignment which is a known factor to them, and either they know they're town or need to fake it. The need for anti-town to fake being town is what subconsciously can cause them to want to project "I AM TOWN" at every opportunity, hence listing themselves in towncores/townreads lists. It is common enough for actual townies, especially from certain site cultures, to list themselves in such things so it's not a hard wolf tell, but it can be a soft tell when alongside other performative town projection examples.
This is just shutting down conversations that were off topic.
This is analysis and I like it.Soneji wrote: ↑Sun Dec 04, 2022 11:00 am The first group is rightly calling for accountability from the Wilgy voters, while the second has every reason to not want to rock the boat. Dennis is a newbie, what narrative is he going to try and control? Plus several players rushed to proclaim him townie for his EoD. Seanzie just narrowly escaped the noose, of course they'd avoid a thunder dome. SVS does look good from how they explained their vote, and how they wanted a tie.
I don't think a wolf would bring this up, because why explain your strategy to the entire thread?Soneji wrote: ↑Sun Dec 04, 2022 9:31 am I'm still reading through parts of the thread but I want to bring forth a thought on the set-up that could certainly have an effect on wolves mindset in this game. I didn't see wolves win condition listed anywhere but assuming it's to reach vote parity, or even just killing all town, then so long as all three members are alive then they win as soon as there are only five town members left due to being able to vote silence two townies each night. At that point town can only tie elim votes, so has no path to winning. So more than normal wolves will want to ensure all members make it to endgame, and keeping the Lawyer alive is top priority as even with just one other wolf they lower the number needed for vote parity. Bussing is very unlikely, and hard defenses of packmates very likely.
I dunno, it's just all of their posts in general I agree with but these were a few examples. Maybe in the 3rd one I'm being convinced by them explaining I don't know what I'm doing still but other than that it's just everything. Now please answer my question.
I like your post and I can see why he appears civvie, I don't see anything overtly civ tbh other than your last point. That post does look townie talking about what could be wolf strategy but it's not unheard of. In face our host Gman did it to me in the last game regarding an OT green curse that the baddies controlled and that HE placed on me.
Well does anyone really SEEM wolfy? That's the whole trick to being a wolf. Golden snowed the everloving hell out of me last game. Far more than I can even explain here, and I've know him for about 15 years?Dennis wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 9:53 pmThat's what I was saying; it's not these posts in particular, it's more in general he feels townie. And it's not like I'm 100 percent sure, he could still be wolf. I just don't see any baddie intentions.Kate wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 9:46 pmFor me, it's getting to the point where it's a numbers game. Not too far back I posted a list of the players that most townie-ish players believe to be the most likely wolf. Of those people we pared it down and the consensus ended on him.Dennis wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 9:35 pmWhy would Soneji defend Neon with a after she got called out for adding herself in her towncore? Especially bringing into the equation of different site cultures doesn't make any sense if Soneji is wolf and Neon is town, when it seemed like (to me) that Golden was suspicious of Neon.Soneji wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 3:16 am The logical assumption is that someone includes themselves among their towncore by default so it's unnecessary and potentially performative to list themselves, because either they know they're town from their rolecard, or they know they need to fake being town from their rolecard. One doesn't normally include themselves in readslist as they cannot make a read on their own alignment which is a known factor to them, and either they know they're town or need to fake it. The need for anti-town to fake being town is what subconsciously can cause them to want to project "I AM TOWN" at every opportunity, hence listing themselves in towncores/townreads lists. It is common enough for actual townies, especially from certain site cultures, to list themselves in such things so it's not a hard wolf tell, but it can be a soft tell when alongside other performative town projection examples.
This is just shutting down conversations that were off topic.
This is analysis and I like it.Soneji wrote: ↑Sun Dec 04, 2022 11:00 am The first group is rightly calling for accountability from the Wilgy voters, while the second has every reason to not want to rock the boat. Dennis is a newbie, what narrative is he going to try and control? Plus several players rushed to proclaim him townie for his EoD. Seanzie just narrowly escaped the noose, of course they'd avoid a thunder dome. SVS does look good from how they explained their vote, and how they wanted a tie.
I don't think a wolf would bring this up, because why explain your strategy to the entire thread?Soneji wrote: ↑Sun Dec 04, 2022 9:31 am I'm still reading through parts of the thread but I want to bring forth a thought on the set-up that could certainly have an effect on wolves mindset in this game. I didn't see wolves win condition listed anywhere but assuming it's to reach vote parity, or even just killing all town, then so long as all three members are alive then they win as soon as there are only five town members left due to being able to vote silence two townies each night. At that point town can only tie elim votes, so has no path to winning. So more than normal wolves will want to ensure all members make it to endgame, and keeping the Lawyer alive is top priority as even with just one other wolf they lower the number needed for vote parity. Bussing is very unlikely, and hard defenses of packmates very likely.
I dunno, it's just all of their posts in general I agree with but these were a few examples. Maybe in the 3rd one I'm being convinced by them explaining I don't know what I'm doing still but other than that it's just everything. Now please answer my question.
I like your post and I can see why he appears civvie, I don't see anything overtly civ tbh other than your last point. That post does look townie talking about what could be wolf strategy but it's not unheard of. In face our host Gman did it to me in the last game regarding an OT green curse that the baddies controlled and that HE placed on me.
I'm saying there's better options, in my opinion. He feels more genuine-townie. Seanzie, or Falcon, or maybe Mata would make more sense to me.Kate wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 10:14 pmWell does anyone really SEEM wolfy? That's the whole trick to being a wolf. Golden snowed the everloving hell out of me last game. Far more than I can even explain here, and I've know him for about 15 years?Dennis wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 9:53 pmThat's what I was saying; it's not these posts in particular, it's more in general he feels townie. And it's not like I'm 100 percent sure, he could still be wolf. I just don't see any baddie intentions.Kate wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 9:46 pmFor me, it's getting to the point where it's a numbers game. Not too far back I posted a list of the players that most townie-ish players believe to be the most likely wolf. Of those people we pared it down and the consensus ended on him.Dennis wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 9:35 pmWhy would Soneji defend Neon with a after she got called out for adding herself in her towncore? Especially bringing into the equation of different site cultures doesn't make any sense if Soneji is wolf and Neon is town, when it seemed like (to me) that Golden was suspicious of Neon.Soneji wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 3:16 am The logical assumption is that someone includes themselves among their towncore by default so it's unnecessary and potentially performative to list themselves, because either they know they're town from their rolecard, or they know they need to fake being town from their rolecard. One doesn't normally include themselves in readslist as they cannot make a read on their own alignment which is a known factor to them, and either they know they're town or need to fake it. The need for anti-town to fake being town is what subconsciously can cause them to want to project "I AM TOWN" at every opportunity, hence listing themselves in towncores/townreads lists. It is common enough for actual townies, especially from certain site cultures, to list themselves in such things so it's not a hard wolf tell, but it can be a soft tell when alongside other performative town projection examples.
This is just shutting down conversations that were off topic.
This is analysis and I like it.Soneji wrote: ↑Sun Dec 04, 2022 11:00 am The first group is rightly calling for accountability from the Wilgy voters, while the second has every reason to not want to rock the boat. Dennis is a newbie, what narrative is he going to try and control? Plus several players rushed to proclaim him townie for his EoD. Seanzie just narrowly escaped the noose, of course they'd avoid a thunder dome. SVS does look good from how they explained their vote, and how they wanted a tie.
I don't think a wolf would bring this up, because why explain your strategy to the entire thread?Soneji wrote: ↑Sun Dec 04, 2022 9:31 am I'm still reading through parts of the thread but I want to bring forth a thought on the set-up that could certainly have an effect on wolves mindset in this game. I didn't see wolves win condition listed anywhere but assuming it's to reach vote parity, or even just killing all town, then so long as all three members are alive then they win as soon as there are only five town members left due to being able to vote silence two townies each night. At that point town can only tie elim votes, so has no path to winning. So more than normal wolves will want to ensure all members make it to endgame, and keeping the Lawyer alive is top priority as even with just one other wolf they lower the number needed for vote parity. Bussing is very unlikely, and hard defenses of packmates very likely.
I dunno, it's just all of their posts in general I agree with but these were a few examples. Maybe in the 3rd one I'm being convinced by them explaining I don't know what I'm doing still but other than that it's just everything. Now please answer my question.
I like your post and I can see why he appears civvie, I don't see anything overtly civ tbh other than your last point. That post does look townie talking about what could be wolf strategy but it's not unheard of. In face our host Gman did it to me in the last game regarding an OT green curse that the baddies controlled and that HE placed on me.
He is gifted and talented. Scores off the charts on everything he attempts. Kinda scary smart.
This is like the fourth time you've shown me off this game.Kate wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 10:26 pmHe is gifted and talented. Scores off the charts on everything he attempts. Kinda scary smart.
people with more experience, i'm prodigious in everything i do, including mafia. and when i play i don't get much influence because of how regularly right i am
Probably the difference is that a few people in the thread know him or know him through me. Also, he's a bit of a legacy player, as in like 2nd generation, if that were to exist in mafia.
It's what moms do.Dennis wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 10:28 pmThis is like the fourth time you've shown me off this game.Kate wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 10:26 pmHe is gifted and talented. Scores off the charts on everything he attempts. Kinda scary smart.
But it's not like I'm being dragged into conversations or anything, I'm trying to start or get involved in conversations when I can. So does the question become who should be starting conversations and I've replaced that?
that's a solid reason, but my logic still holds, i don't like the amount of influence he has
i question this assumption
Dennis determined the first elim, but I don’t think he has outsized influence.
that's not even true if we're speaking genetically (jack)Kate wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 10:35 pmI'm the most similar person to him in the thread.
I would say you have been a significant influence on my thinking this game, moreso than any other player who I didn’t know before the game except maybe Sean.
Jack and Dennis are fraternal twins and are as different as night and day.lucy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 10:36 pmthat's not even true if we're speaking genetically (jack)Kate wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 10:35 pmI'm the most similar person to him in the thread.
As different as night and day?Kate wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 10:37 pmJack and Dennis are fraternal twins and are as different as night and day.lucy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 10:36 pmthat's not even true if we're speaking genetically (jack)Kate wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 10:35 pmI'm the most similar person to him in the thread.
Golden wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 10:38 pmAs different as night and day?Kate wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 10:37 pmJack and Dennis are fraternal twins and are as different as night and day.lucy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 10:36 pmthat's not even true if we're speaking genetically (jack)Kate wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 10:35 pmI'm the most similar person to him in the thread.
Civ/wolf confirmed. But which one is night?![]()
This is a weird take. Dennis has been doing his own thing and hasn’t been a particularly material part of either sabi or soneji wagons forming. Who do you think he’s got an outsize influence on and to what end?
everything
to the end of being wrong, i just had this idea and it isn't really fleshed out
Why does two games from 2 years ago relate to now? Sorry if I'm coming off curt or whatever but I tend to get like this under time limits.lucy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 05, 2022 10:41 pmeverything
my first game i was shafted because i was very right and got no influence, and the following game i was very wrong and i had a lot of influence
these games were 2 years ago so it took me a second to remember, but i believe you are in the second category this game
which would make your degree of influence logica
because you're very much like me, when comparing you to me an example struck out to me, of me being very wrong and getting a disportioncate amount of influence