The Syndicate

sig wrote:Well what a way to go I survived three days of bandwagoning to be killed by some Japanese porn monster.
Rezz please

How about REZZ me peoplez

a2thezebra wrote:

sig wrote:Well what a way to go I survived three days of bandwagoning to be killed by some Japanese porn monster.
Rezz please

How about REZZ me peoplez

Maybe if you were a purple zebra unicorn.

HamburgerBoy wrote: Where did I mention my own role? Not sure where you're going with that.

Typhoony wrote: No, I think you tried to come into the thread seeing an easy way to score some civ cred but overplayed your hand. I think you are or are on the team of Scrippleskitz and made the classical mistake of mentioning your own role as a way to distance yourself from it.

I had to check that it was within the rules.

I know that these three people shared a square yesterday. Epi, sig, timmer.

Thats why I am voting to lynch timmer.

S~V~S wrote:

Golden wrote:And I would beseech everyone else to join me, beseech beseech!

I think he was responsible for killing epi too, btw. Villain

Can you possibly tell us how/why?

Yeah, sorry, had to check if I could say what I wanted to say.

Also, I know what square BWT (timmer 2.0) was in when timmer 1.0 died. I was in the same square as timmer that day, so I know that it is only two squares away ie within kill range.

So I know that timmer is capable of having been responsible for all three deaths.

For me, the facts I have overwhelmingly point to timmer being bad.

I take it saying you are in the same square as another player =/= you had BTSC with that player?

Golden, I don't have time for a lot of detail here, but I think I can say that you have hit on some truth but are misguided about some things as well. I am not a fan of info dumping but will say that I have come into contact with an item that was not actually what it said it was and there have been consequences. I've tried to help the cause and ultimately it seems have caused more trouble than anything.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:I take it saying you are in the same square as another player =/= you had BTSC with that player?

Oh, I didn't think about that aspect when I asked, and I was asking LC specifically about whether this stuff breached the talking about specific squares on the map rule. So I hope it's all ok.

However, I will not say anything about who I've had btsc with, and nothing that could have happened in btsc contributes in any way to my theory. It's simply just a matter of working out who was where when and had the opportunity to kill timmer, sig and epi, and I think timmer 2.0 was in the right position to do all three.

linki @timmer - I appreciate your response. I'm going to leave my vote where it is for now, but perhaps we can talk throughout the day and see. Obviously everything needs to keep within the rules, so I wouldn't want you to infodump.

Golden wrote:I had to check that it was within the rules.

I know that these three people shared a square yesterday. Epi, sig, timmer.

Thats why I am voting to lynch timmer.

Rule #5~

5.You may not discuss in-thread who you have had BTSC with, or discuss openly or in detail what was said in BTSC.

This is not exactly the letter of the law, from what you say *YOU* did not have BTSC with them, but it does violate the spirit of the law, imo. While I look forward to Timmers explanation, it makes me kinda sad he should have to provide one based on this kind of thing.

@SVS - like I said, I didn't contemplate the specific thing about 'i shared a square with timmer' in light of rule 5. If I had, I wouldn't have said it, I didn't think through the implication which I think is a fair one. MM made the point already.

However - nothing about the post you've quoted is discussing what was said in btsc by anybody to anybody. And I cleared it with the host. It's completely appropriate timmer should have to defend to it.

Oh, when I said "I had to check it was within the rules"

I did mean check WITH LONG CON.

Not just read the rules.

The one statement that could be considered to not be in the spirit of the rules could be deleted and replaced with:

Timmer 2.0 was within kill range of timmer 1.0

Which is all I was trying to say anyway. I wasn't trying to imply btsc was relevant in any way. I did, by accident. Only because I wasn't careful enough with how I worded it.

Are you the Chaos Wizard, Golden?

Metalmarsh89 wrote:Are you the Chaos Wizard, Golden?

If I was or was not a role, I would never say.

Golden you've tried to attach a motive and alignment and history to me that I cannot defend against without breaking the rules, beyond what I've already said. You ate partly right and very largely partly of base with some odd your thoughts in this game. I soak you would see that, and I will once again caution everyone that some items on the map do not do what they are advertised as doing.

Sorry for the garbling I'm on my phone in transit.

TheFloyd73 wrote:

Tranq wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:Tranq, why do you think you were brought back so quickly?

The Island wasn't done with me yet.

Floyd, why did you NK me?

???

You reply to this but not to DFaraday's 3 posts directly above mine in which he mentions you? You don't think the quote below is worth addressing?

DFaraday wrote:

Dom wrote:Dfaraday-- why Floyd?

I felt his RIP for Luke was a bit odd, and paired with his vote for Nutella when the votes were very close makes me think he could be Luke's teammate. Also, Tranq went after Floyd (including a post pointing out a comment of Floyd's which sounded coached) and was summarily NKed. It could be a setup, but I think it's more likely that he's part of Luke's team.

Tranq wrote:

TheFloyd73 wrote:

Tranq wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:Tranq, why do you think you were brought back so quickly?

The Island wasn't done with me yet.

Floyd, why did you NK me?

???

You reply to this but not to DFaraday's 3 posts directly above mine in which he mentions you? You don't think the quote below is worth addressing?

DFaraday wrote:

Dom wrote:Dfaraday-- why Floyd?

I felt his RIP for Luke was a bit odd, and paired with his vote for Nutella when the votes were very close makes me think he could be Luke's teammate. Also, Tranq went after Floyd (including a post pointing out a comment of Floyd's which sounded coached) and was summarily NKed. It could be a setup, but I think it's more likely that he's part of Luke's team.

I'm a mate of Luke's IRL, what's wrong with paying respects?

Why didn't you answer this when DFaraday brought it up? What about the other points mentioned in the quote?

Perfectly plausible that you were trying to help, timmer. The role 'Cursecrafter' is out there after all. Although the item 'obsidian dagger' does, on the face of it, sound kind of deadly.

I'm going to consider it carefully. I haven't felt any sign of civilian timmer in the thread either, up until those last couple of posts which do feel sincere. You have reminded me a lot more of your very quiet baddie self than your trying to contribute a bit despite being busy civvie self. I had trouble seeing your suspicion of me as sincere. I see you as being a better choice for my vote than people who I also suspect, but have less ability to connect directly to death.

Taht doesn't mean I'll vote for you today... but it does mean I have to take you seriously.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:Are you the Chaos Wizard, Golden?

fwiw I feel pretty sure he isn't since I met someone hanging out at the Chaos Wizard's tower recently. It's possible that that person was not the Chaos Wizard, or that the Chaos Wizard had moved within range at the time of the sig kill, but it's kind of a moot point asking him when golden would know if he could have potentially interfered. Are we allowed to hint at a general region where landmarks are located, e.g. central, northwest, etc?

I'll add that while I know golden would only do this if he was absolutely positive, I'm just as positive that juliets is scum (not for nightkill reasons but other ones). I think either lynch looks promising, especially since we also have this new Floyd business to work with.

HamburgerBoy wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:Are you the Chaos Wizard, Golden?

fwiw I feel pretty sure he isn't since I met someone hanging out at the Chaos Wizard's tower recently. It's possible that that person was not the Chaos Wizard, or that the Chaos Wizard had moved within range at the time of the sig kill, but it's kind of a moot point asking him when golden would know if he could have potentially interfered. Are we allowed to hint at a general region where landmarks are located, e.g. central, northwest, etc?

I don't think so. We can talk about the things, but not where they are.

But you could always PM LC to find out.

Linki: that's a lot of positively baddie players.

I am voting for juliets. You should too.

MacDougall wrote:I am voting for juliets. You should too.

I'm convinced.

juliets

I'm not absolutely positive that timmer is bad.

I am only absolutely positive with the facts as I've presented them. He was in range for both of the circle of decay kills, and on the same square as epi when epi died.

Actually, I'll vote timmer instead.

I do feel strongly that Epignosis was civilian.

Golden wrote:I'm not absolutely positive that timmer is bad.

I am only absolutely positive with the facts as I've presented them. He was in range for both of the circle of decay kills, and on the same square as epi when epi died.

Counterpoint. I am absolutely positive that juliets is bad.

Counterpoint. I am absolutely positive that, if timmer is bad, his death is urgent.

I'm not opposed to a juliet vote today (I voted her yesterday), but I definitely want to work this through.

I trust Golden more than Mac. That said, I think Juliets is likely bad. I will likely vote Timmer, based on what Golden has posted, or Juliets.

LoRab wrote:I trust Golden more than Mac. That said, I think Juliets is likely bad. I will likely vote Timmer, based on what Golden has posted, or Juliets.

Why does it matter who you trust? Why bother even saying that? Are you just trying to be mean to me? That hurts LoRab.

Golden, you are leaping to assumptions and need to realize that you clearly (from my POV) do not know everything you think you know, and are ignoring what I'm trying to tell you (without busting the rules). I can honestly tell you that I had an item in my hands that was not what it seemed, and I had never heard the term Obsidian Dagger before Epig died from it today.

And as for me being passive, I've been passive in every game I've played in the last 6 months, except for when I've found conclusive proof that I wanted to pursue. I've made too many mistakes by only half paying attention and then leaping into poorly-formed suspicions, so I no longer do that until I'm sure. This has been my play as both baddie AND civ, and it is disingenuous to suggest otherwise. Also, you suggested that you thought my suspicion of you was not legit, but Golden, who is the one person who I know was near me when I died? Of COURSE I've been eyeing you all game, look back through my posts. And I've tried to ask people, when I could, what they thoguht of you.

I can't undo what happened last night, but you can realize that your assumptions about last night are NOt entirely accurate. I'm at work,so my posting will remain sporadic today.

To the nooblets saying stuff like "I trust Golden". That question you must ask yourself is not whether you trust Golden. It's that whether you trust this eyelid batting motherlicker named timmer up there.

MacDougall wrote:

LoRab wrote:I trust Golden more than Mac. That said, I think Juliets is likely bad. I will likely vote Timmer, based on what Golden has posted, or Juliets.

Why does it matter who you trust? Why bother even saying that? Are you just trying to be mean to me? That hurts LoRab.

You keep asking people to vote for Juliets because you believe she's bad. As I think you are bad, I don't trust your opinion. I think Juliets is bad for other reasons. Golden, on the other hand, I have low level trust for--he has posted that he believes Timmer is bad--and so if I am considering trusting him on this lynch, then I thought my relative trust was relavent.

I don't believe that for a second!

How could you think I am bad?

HamburgerBoy wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:Are you the Chaos Wizard, Golden?

fwiw I feel pretty sure he isn't since I met someone hanging out at the Chaos Wizard's tower recently. It's possible that that person was not the Chaos Wizard, or that the Chaos Wizard had moved within range at the time of the sig kill, but it's kind of a moot point asking him when golden would know if he could have potentially interfered. Are we allowed to hint at a general region where landmarks are located, e.g. central, northwest, etc?

The rule is: "You may not discuss specific map coordinates in-thread, but you may generally speak of map locations." So yeah, directional and general region discussion is allowed, and talking about squares you have been to is all right as well... preferably in less detail, not trying to paraphrase the exact description.

For instance, I'd prefer "Yeah, there's a poison pool, it's up in the northwest corner" to "Yeah, I found the Hall of Mirrors, it's that little building right there, and here's the 8 different things the Mirrors can do for you!" I know that's not a hard line, so just try and be cool.

Golden's general discussion of who he believes was near who on the map is valid as well, he cleared that with me and I'm okay with it.

I need to get to the bottom of why LoRab thinks I am bad.

Out with it you lot. Who else thinks I am bad. Sheepishly raise your hands if you think I am a bad guy!?

timmer wrote:Golden, you are leaping to assumptions and need to realize that you clearly (from my POV) do not know everything you think you know, and are ignoring what I'm trying to tell you (without busting the rules). I can honestly tell you that I had an item in my hands that was not what it seemed, and I had never heard the term Obsidian Dagger before Epig died from it today.

I don't think it is an accurate representation of my post to say that I've ignored what you said. I heard it very clearly... and I do know everything I think I know, which (as I've said) falls short of you being bad... I'm just also trying to figure out whether it is fair to extrapolate from that to 'you are probably bad'.

@Mac - I'm on the fence with you. You remind me a bit of Talking Heads Mac, but I also have a feeling your meta is deliberate obfuscation.

MacDougall wrote:I need to get to the bottom of why LoRab thinks I am bad.

Out with it you lot. Who else thinks I am bad. Sheepishly raise your hands if you think I am a bad guy!?

*Sheepishly raises hand*

I think you could be. You just remind me of your attitude from last game, it's mostly a vibe thing but something I'd considered looking into when I get 5 minutes.

@Mac: You don't believe that I believe that you're bad?! Have you even read my posts? I've suspected you since day 0.

timmer wrote:Golden, you are leaping to assumptions and need to realize that you clearly (from my POV) do not know everything you think you know, and are ignoring what I'm trying to tell you (without busting the rules). I can honestly tell you that I had an item in my hands that was not what it seemed, and I had never heard the term Obsidian Dagger before Epig died from it today.

And as for me being passive, I've been passive in every game I've played in the last 6 months, except for when I've found conclusive proof that I wanted to pursue. I've made too many mistakes by only half paying attention and then leaping into poorly-formed suspicions, so I no longer do that until I'm sure. This has been my play as both baddie AND civ, and it is disingenuous to suggest otherwise. Also, you suggested that you thought my suspicion of you was not legit, but Golden, who is the one person who I know was near me when I died? Of COURSE I've been eyeing you all game, look back through my posts. And I've tried to ask people, when I could, what they thoguht of you.

I can't undo what happened last night, but you can realize that your assumptions about last night are NOt entirely accurate. I'm at work,so my posting will remain sporadic today.

What this sounds like to me is that you saw an item that said, "I'm a soft and furry, cute kitten that you can give to another player," which you then did, but it turned out to be an obsidian dagger and instead of fuzzy kitten joy, it ended up being a dagger that killed Epig. That sounds disingenuous at best.

And, really, if you see an item that says, "Hi! I'm harmless and you should give me to your friend," in a Long Rock game, you shouldn't believe the sign. You've been around long enough to know that. I'm not sure I believe your defense.

linkitis: I had a whole post yesterday on why I suspect you. It's not like this is out of the blue.

LoRab wrote:@Mac: You don't believe that I believe that you're bad?! Have you even read my posts? I've suspected you since day 0.

timmer wrote:Golden, you are leaping to assumptions and need to realize that you clearly (from my POV) do not know everything you think you know, and are ignoring what I'm trying to tell you (without busting the rules). I can honestly tell you that I had an item in my hands that was not what it seemed, and I had never heard the term Obsidian Dagger before Epig died from it today.

And as for me being passive, I've been passive in every game I've played in the last 6 months, except for when I've found conclusive proof that I wanted to pursue. I've made too many mistakes by only half paying attention and then leaping into poorly-formed suspicions, so I no longer do that until I'm sure. This has been my play as both baddie AND civ, and it is disingenuous to suggest otherwise. Also, you suggested that you thought my suspicion of you was not legit, but Golden, who is the one person who I know was near me when I died? Of COURSE I've been eyeing you all game, look back through my posts. And I've tried to ask people, when I could, what they thoguht of you.

I can't undo what happened last night, but you can realize that your assumptions about last night are NOt entirely accurate. I'm at work,so my posting will remain sporadic today.

What this sounds like to me is that you saw an item that said, "I'm a soft and furry, cute kitten that you can give to another player," which you then did, but it turned out to be an obsidian dagger and instead of fuzzy kitten joy, it ended up being a dagger that killed Epig. That sounds disingenuous at best.

And, really, if you see an item that says, "Hi! I'm harmless and you should give me to your friend," in a Long Rock game, you shouldn't believe the sign. You've been around long enough to know that. I'm not sure I believe your defense.

linkitis: I had a whole post yesterday on why I suspect you. It's not like this is out of the blue.

Oh you're that LoRab! Sorry I thought you were someone else.

Maybe timmer is a civ, thought his thingy was probably going to kill Epi, thought Epi was civ, but did it anyway because killing Epi is awesome?

MacDougall wrote:

LoRab wrote:@Mac: You don't believe that I believe that you're bad?! Have you even read my posts? I've suspected you since day 0.

timmer wrote:Golden, you are leaping to assumptions and need to realize that you clearly (from my POV) do not know everything you think you know, and are ignoring what I'm trying to tell you (without busting the rules). I can honestly tell you that I had an item in my hands that was not what it seemed, and I had never heard the term Obsidian Dagger before Epig died from it today.

And as for me being passive, I've been passive in every game I've played in the last 6 months, except for when I've found conclusive proof that I wanted to pursue. I've made too many mistakes by only half paying attention and then leaping into poorly-formed suspicions, so I no longer do that until I'm sure. This has been my play as both baddie AND civ, and it is disingenuous to suggest otherwise. Also, you suggested that you thought my suspicion of you was not legit, but Golden, who is the one person who I know was near me when I died? Of COURSE I've been eyeing you all game, look back through my posts. And I've tried to ask people, when I could, what they thoguht of you.

I can't undo what happened last night, but you can realize that your assumptions about last night are NOt entirely accurate. I'm at work,so my posting will remain sporadic today.

What this sounds like to me is that you saw an item that said, "I'm a soft and furry, cute kitten that you can give to another player," which you then did, but it turned out to be an obsidian dagger and instead of fuzzy kitten joy, it ended up being a dagger that killed Epig. That sounds disingenuous at best.

And, really, if you see an item that says, "Hi! I'm harmless and you should give me to your friend," in a Long Rock game, you shouldn't believe the sign. You've been around long enough to know that. I'm not sure I believe your defense.

linkitis: I had a whole post yesterday on why I suspect you. It's not like this is out of the blue.

Oh you're that LoRab! Sorry I thought you were someone else.

While I did change my name on LP, that was a really long time ago, and LoRab is based on that screen name. So, uh, yeah. I've been the same LoRab all along.

timmer wrote:But you can realize that your assumptions about last night are NOt entirely accurate.

I do realise my conclusions are based on 'how likely do I think it is that timmer is bad' not that 'timmer IS bad'.

My assumptions could be accurate. Or they could be not accurate.

As I said, we know there is a role that leaves behind items that may not be what they seem, so your explanation is plausible. It might be true, it might be a lie. It's a tough call.

linki - mac has his rabbis confused?

because there are so many of us who play mafia.

Golden wrote:

timmer wrote:But you can realize that your assumptions about last night are NOt entirely accurate.

I do realise my conclusions are based on 'how likely do I think it is that timmer is bad' not that 'timmer IS bad'.

My assumptions could be accurate. Or they could be not accurate.

As I said, we know there is a role that leaves behind items that may not be what they seem, so your explanation is plausible. It might be true, it might be a lie. It's a tough call.

linki - mac has his rabbis confused?

This sums up how I feel about your Timmer argument right now. It's a decent bit of circumstantial evidence, but you could be mistaken altogether. He could be telling the truth about his item, or he could be making the easiest excuse in the book. It's all very complex and I think there would need to be more than just this backing up a proper case against him.

Golden you are trying to decide if it is fair to extrapolate? You already HAVE extrapolated, and are voting me and causing others to vote me as well even though you admit to thinking juliets is bad which I agree with you on. But now that you have sat this in motion you sure are hedging your statements fast and making sure people know you aren't sure. This is blatant. and in a previous post you suggested I need to die urgently. Why?

Not really I know that you are posting that you think I am bad. I am just questioning whether you've actually thought through that possibility.

MacDougall wrote:Not really I know that you are posting that you think I am bad. I am just questioning whether you've actually thought through that possibility.

Yup. Been thinking about it since day 0.

And I even did a whole long post on it.