Ted Lasso Mafia - game over!

[JaggedJimmyJay]

@Bereft and @robyn, each of you had expressed early faith in LoRab, and in the moment I kind of vibed with that. I'd like to dig a bit deeper though: are you able to describe what gave you confidence about her?

I had two major instances of thought about LoRab.

The first was immediately after their entrance.
And to that point, I had the same thought as Robyn did wrt to it.

The second was immediately after LoRab freaked out about getting townreads.
And to that point, I had the same thought as you did wrt to it.

If the question demands why I take strong stock in these thoughts at all, then its because both of these moments are based on LoRab existing archetypical traits of "pure" town spontaneity. And I don't think I've ever once seen these reads fail in my experience. On a mafia theory tangent, its the most basic form of read in existence, mafia simply doesn't post like that, because they have to think about well, being mafia.

I appreciate your perspective, thanks. And I'm not terribly concerned with read strength anyway.

[Cape90]

@Bereft i know whether you've been naughty or nice, and i hope you've been naughty

@Robyn How's the weather been?

i see what u did there Bereft

[LoRab]

Lorab isn’t doing anything so far to make me townread her, and frankly is rather blendy in her entrance posts.

Though I don’t remember how LoRab operates. It’s been a while

That feels better! Pretty sure you suspect me in every game for some version of that reason.

[Cape90]

Is it too early to ask everyone for their top three town reads?

No, of course not. Let’s go ahead an box in the mafia.

you/Scotty/Long Con

[Cape90]

wait fuck i don't have cape, full disclosure i just read [read skimmed] like the first 20 posts out of the first 100, basically forgot he posted and lol, i had to go back and read monroe's posts when schweppes prompted me

would you just have me in your townreads because I am me?

[Cape90]

wait fuck i don't have cape, full disclosure i just read [read skimmed] like the first 20 posts out of the first 100, basically forgot he posted and lol, i had to go back and read monroe's posts when schweppes prompted me

Cape is worth sorting early. There's already a bit of a clash between tone (a bit stilted) and action (pro-town). I currently favor the latter.

i get that i come across stilted a lot fwiw

[Cape90]

Scotty reads entirely civ to me. Even though he needs to stop padding his post count. That always makes me suspish of people, although I know that isn't a tell for you. But I'm reading you as civ other than that.

This is NAI activity and Scotty usually posts a lot

[Cape90]

wait fuck i don't have cape, full disclosure i just read [read skimmed] like the first 20 posts out of the first 100, basically forgot he posted and lol, i had to go back and read monroe's posts when schweppes prompted me

Cape is worth sorting early. There's already a bit of a clash between tone (a bit stilted) and action (pro-town). I currently favor the latter.

i have a god read on cape, i refuse to read the first 100 posts out of some contrived reasoning that boils down to, not enough content especially when thunal's iso is almost entirely filler

what do i have to do with thunal?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

i get that i come across stilted a lot fwiw

Me too (or at least, "formal"). Not a big deal imo.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Is it too early to ask everyone for their top three town reads?

No, of course not. Let’s go ahead an box in the mafia.

you/Scotty/Long Con

Thanks for the response. No pressure here, but if you wanted would you be able to name more than three town reads? I am compiling a bit of data, and if you have more that'd be super. If not, cool.

[Cape90]

@S~V~S do you feel it is on-brand or not (or neither) for @Long Con to express early suspicion of you?

Onnnnnnnnnn-braaaaaaaaaaaaaannnnnnnnnnd...... on-brand. On-brand. Towny. Wolfy. On-brand. Sassy. Classy. On-brand. Interesting. On-brand. Bon-rand?

@JaggedJimmyJay this is what I meant by "theatricality". I used to auto read this as bad~ weirdly enough, even in games where I was bad, and i had TMI re LC being town, I STILL read him as bad, which is why he's always an easy yeet for me when I'm bad. I kinda half believe it when I'm making the case.

I really don't read this as bad at all, it is just kinda there

[Cape90]

Is it too early to ask everyone for their top three town reads?

No, of course not. Let’s go ahead an box in the mafia.

you/Scotty/Long Con

Thanks for the response. No pressure here, but if you wanted would you be able to name more than three town reads? I am compiling a bit of data, and if you have more that'd be super. If not, cool.

LoRab seems to be on the same page as me which is good
Somewhat DM just for beginning
Somewhat robyn
SVS worries me a little bit for the thing i pointed out earlier + #202 tonally speaking
Thunal thanks for also having a sus on SVS ur townish now + asking clarifying questions there = good

[Cape90]

I also meant to say Princess Abigail worries me just because her only content is a townread on SVS and nothing else for right now

[VOTE: S~V~S] aubergine for now though as I find this more concretely bad

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I think these early wagons are well-positioned. The three players with votes are exactly my three null reads (other than the people who haven't posted yet, and perhaps Michelle who just got started).

[Cape90]

I just do not remember seeing town S~V~S having such theatrical language also but this is also the person who in the past game them easy townreads without much thought

[Cape90]

When was the last time you rolled mafia? Mind if I checked it out? I thought there was a game I was speccing where I pegged you as mafia by like day 3 but I don’t remember if that was confbias or you actually were mafia

Refer to the links in this post -- plenty of examples to work with. It's been both annoying and vindicating to be mafia so many times lately. I had one of my worst games ever in Philosophy 2 a couple years ago, but since then I have gone 5-0 as mafia (despite never being pleased to see the role card at first). Feels nice.

Wait- THATS RIGHT! I was just in a game with you in Don’t Starve, and would have absolutely gunned for you D2 if I didn’t get D1’d. I totally forgot about that game.

Ok ok I *can* read you.

You don't seem too confident here tho

i think this is ~rand town perhaps

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I just do not remember seeing town S~V~S having such theatrical language also but this is also the person who in the past game them easy townreads without much thought

In the highlighted bit, are you referring to yourself? As in, you have given S~V~S easy town reads in the past?

[LoRab]

What's normally suspicious about your style?

I think this kind of comment about finding it weird you're too trusted is >rand mafia. A lot of townies are confident in their townieness even if they are suspected often, but it's easy for mafia to assume they're suspicious.

One one level, I have no idea. Maybe I'm just drawn that way? Some of it is how I approach the game and suspicion--some of it is meta, but a lot of it is noticing patterns and when those patterns are off. Which many see as a suspicious way to suspect people, apparently.

And, in a bigger way, your noting my discomfort in being trusted is an excellent example of why--on this particular site. It's a mafia culture thing. I learned mafia in a very different setting than that of most of the players on here. There are some players (SVS, LC in this game) I've been playing with for about 15 years--I think Wilgy for at least a decade. I may have forgotten someone else who is in this game (other than our wonderful host). The game we played then, on sites like LP and The Piano, was stylistically different--we developed our own mafia slang, almost all games were ones in which pretty much everyone has a power, info dumping was essentially always frowned on--at least past a certain point, when we all seemed to realize it's not nearly as much fun that way, and agreed that there just wouldn't be any any more. Where puzzles and hidden messages were everywhere. This site, in large part, grew out of that world--and merged it with other mafia communities.

The mafia game style of those other communities mostly became the prominent culture, with some aspects of my original realm staying around. like this color.

And I still play with my same style that I always have, even though I know that most around me have a different style--and will suspect me for my style. I'm good with that.

Although, I do twirl a lot less than I used to.

As for your suspicion, unless I'm misunderstanding ">rand mafia" (as I don't actually know what that means). It is very par for the course in the games of most of my mafia playing for civvies to not want to be publicly trust. I mean, I guess in a game where there is only 1 bad faction (and no apparent neutral or indy roles), it makes more sense for civs to not worry so much when trusted, but...I'm still more accustomed to games where such a structure (2 teams, one good one bad) is the exception and not the rule,

While I'm waxing nostalgic, and in a Ted Lasso game, a shout out to the OG Diamond Dog, in whose honor this smiley was created It's literally based on the actual human. I miss that FEB.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

To help folks with the lingo:

"rand town" or "rand mafia" refers to probability. If someone is "rand mafia", that means they have the standard probability of being mafia (in this game, 4/16 or 25%). If someone is ">rand mafia", they are more likely than the standard probability of being mafia (more than 25%).

I personally don't like using that lingo, but it helps if we all know what it means.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Bereft is the kind of player that I can find almost obviously town while many others view them as opaque and inscrutable. I am quite comfortable with him right now.

[Cape90]

I just do not remember seeing town S~V~S having such theatrical language also but this is also the person who in the past game them easy townreads without much thought

In the highlighted bit, are you referring to yourself? As in, you have given S~V~S easy town reads in the past?

correct, so meta wise i would have to look back and see how well my current suspicion holds because it's one of those things that could just boil down to playstyle vs actually being sus

[JaggedJimmyJay]

If Day 1 ended ten seconds from now, I would vote for S~V~S.

[Bereft]

Tbh I wouldn't. They're less awkward than normal, and I can't help but find it a good thing, even if I think that it should raise eyebrows.

Frankly, Scotty's first opinion on the slot is one that appears credible, and if I were in a situation where I had to make a call on S~V~S's alignment, I think I would do decently simply by comparing to their presence to Severance Mafia, as it appears they were mafia there if I'm interpreting them correctly.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

S~V~S didn’t play Severance (she was a moderator). You may be thinking of a different game though.

[Bereft]

@S~V~S do you feel it is on-brand or not (or neither) for @Long Con to express early suspicion of you?

Probably. We tend to circle, and in the last game we played, I was bad and railroaded him hideously. I would be surprised if he wasn't somewhat paranoid of me. I haven't read why he susses me yet, I'm answering my @'s first.

Watching your game, I figured out what triggers me about him, he has an almost theatricality about him, that I view as acting to an extent, and to me acting = (in a Mafia game) fake = bad. So I was kinda interested to see what our dynamic was here.

Was referring to the game referenced here, but it appears that's not Severance.

[LoRab]

Scotty reads entirely civ to me. Even though he needs to stop padding his post count. That always makes me suspish of people, although I know that isn't a tell for you. But I'm reading you as civ other than that.

This is NAI activity and Scotty usually posts a lot

Having now looked up NAI, I don't agree. It can be, but isn't always. Very much depends on the player and how it is being done.

[LoRab]

To help folks with the lingo:

"rand town" or "rand mafia" refers to probability. If someone is "rand mafia", that means they have the standard probability of being mafia (in this game, 4/16 or 25%). If someone is ">rand mafia", they are more likely than the standard probability of being mafia (more than 25%).

I personally don't like using that lingo, but it helps if we all know what it means.

Thank you! That is helpful.

[robyn]

wait fuck i don't have cape, full disclosure i just read [read skimmed] like the first 20 posts out of the first 100, basically forgot he posted and lol, i had to go back and read monroe's posts when schweppes prompted me

Cape is worth sorting early. There's already a bit of a clash between tone (a bit stilted) and action (pro-town). I currently favor the latter.

i have a god read on cape, i refuse to read the first 100 posts out of some contrived reasoning that boils down to, not enough content especially when thunal's iso is almost entirely filler

what do i have to do with thunal?

i don’t wanna read fluff, thunal iso has revealed a world of fluff in the first 2 pages

[robyn]

bereft
loreb
jjj
monroe
long con

scotty

null

thunal

I assume you actually do have a reason to read me bad then?

yeah, sorting alphabetically

[LoRab]

okay i just have to ask @LoRab do you fear god?

I realized I never answered. Fear is not a significant part of my theology. Jewish theology is very much not simple--or mandated really.

[robyn]

Bereft is the kind of player that I can find almost obviously town while many others view them as opaque and inscrutable. I am quite comfortable with him right now.

the only thing opaque about bereft is uh, i can’t think of anything

[DrWilgy]

Good morning.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Good morning.

Good morning.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I've counted six players so far that have provided reads of some kind, including town reads (to varying degrees). The following players have been read as town by at least four others:

LoRab, JJJ, DarlingMonroe, and Scotty

How do we feel about that? I invite anyone to answer. Are these good names to have in a "town block" or no? Do you feel comfortable with that game state?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

@DrWilgy is my top town read.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I just compared early Ted Lasso S~V~S with early Guitar Mafia S~V~S (who was mafia).

Similarity -- non-committal reads or commentary without conclusions
Difference -- less game-relevant discussion in Guitar Mafia, more in this game

On-balance, I don't think this makes her look better (or worse necessarily). Null remains null.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I just compared early Ted Lasso S~V~S with early Guitar Mafia S~V~S (who was mafia).

Similarity -- non-committal reads or commentary without conclusions
Difference -- less game-relevant discussion in Guitar Mafia, more in this game

On-balance, I don't think this makes her look better (or worse necessarily). Null remains null.

Guitar Mafia S~V~S link for reference

[Long Con]

Sooooo if I’m reading it right, Rupert’s money is responsible for the killing? So can they choose not to kill?

Probably. My interpretation is that they have to purchase kills (implying they can decline to do so), and that while Rupert is alive he is the only one that can kill. Then once he goes, any of the others can kill.

Important for any investigative roles out there to think about (i.e., tracker/watcher).

I didn't think about him being the only person who can kill, but that makes sense. That makes it much more important for Rupert to avoid sus than the other mafia and he might act differently because of that pressure. Kind of reminds me of John Doe in se7en where that role was important so SVS had pressure to go deep with it.

This was my thought but I was kinda sorta hoping to identify that trait later on in the day without influencing gameplay. But that’s fine

I didn't think about him being the only person who can kill, but that makes sense. That makes it much more important for Rupert to avoid sus than the other mafia and he might act differently because of that pressure. Kind of reminds me of John Doe in se7en where that role was important so SVS had pressure to go deep with it.

Perhaps so. I'm not entirely sure the role is that important since they retain their kill without it. It's just the early killer (if that interpretation is accurate). I just noted that town doesn't seem to have any night actions that would interact directly with a killing mafia member other than an even night role blocker (no tracker or watcher). We have protections, but they don't mean anything with respect to who is killing. It might not matter than much, and it appears that it means close to nothing on Night 1. I could be overlooking something.

From my understanding, the Rupert role is the designated power of attorney, and if he dies, mafia lose the ability to cop and elim save.

Sounds pretty important to me

We need to kill him. That elim save is a game-changer.

Scotty is town. Oozing when you read his ISO. Helpful, redundantly helpful, which looks honest.



HA HA HA H AHA AHAHSHAHAHSGSGHAGHAGH I'm not repeating this from that other game though. "Scotty good, S~V~S bad!" I was half-right. But I'll have nightmares if I do it again. I'm flipping all my reads on Day 4, and I'm literally not joking.

I’m curious- why did you townread me for so long in the last game? I can’t tell if you’re actually serious in this read.

In the game where you were bad with S~V~S? I just got a vibe from you early and decided to stick with it. Was that the flipless game? I needed an anchor, and chose poorly.

I was serious in this read. We'll see if it sticks.

@S~V~S do you feel it is on-brand or not (or neither) for @Long Con to express early suspicion of you?

Onnnnnnnnnn-braaaaaaaaaaaaaannnnnnnnnnd...... on-brand. On-brand. Towny. Wolfy. On-brand. Sassy. Classy. On-brand. Interesting. On-brand. Bon-rand?

Go drunk, LC, you’re home

No! Well yes. But no! More next break --->

@S~V~S do you feel it is on-brand or not (or neither) for @Long Con to express early suspicion of you?

Onnnnnnnnnn-braaaaaaaaaaaaaannnnnnnnnnd...... on-brand. On-brand. Towny. Wolfy. On-brand. Sassy. Classy. On-brand. Interesting. On-brand. Bon-rand?

But this is an unhinged towny post

OK, but really. Baddie LC doesn't let himself post silly/drunkish comments.

Are you sure?

--> cont'd from above: WAS it an "unhinged towny post"? Is everyone okay with JJJ's question? It blew my mind last night because I didn't feel like it was asking ANYTHING. Is it towny or wolfy? "On-brand"? So, what, is JJJ worried that I'm not really me right now? Is that what he's confirming with S~V~S??

And I still can't even handle "on-brand or not (or neither)", like, what? Are we trying to determine if I'm quasi-semi-myself before we try to think about alignment?

How does this stuff not make other people question it? WHAT DOES IT MEAN? If it has no meaning, then what does that say about JJJ?

Forget it, I don't even care.

I assumed the swear jar was a joke, but I could be wrong!

I mean, it could be....but it seems weird to phrase it that way in the roles if it isn't important. If a civ curses, do we give money to Giles (sorry, Rupert)? Or do we take money away from him? Seems like it would be prudent to not risk giving mafia more power, and keep our language clean.

Also, hi, to all!! And, I'm Lorab :Lorab: for those I don't know. I'm an old timer, and have been convinced to come back, lol. Important thing to know is that I have a super quirky schedule, and many times that are great for everyone else are, well, not great for me. So, I'm sometimes MIA. The RAB in my screen name stands for Rabbi--and yes, I actually am. And, that means that weekends are weird. Just so you know.

For what it's worth, I'm reading LC as civ. And I mostly agree with him. Weird. I also thing J3 is probably civ, although keeping a note in my mind that he might just be acting aggressively civ to avoid suspicion, but I'm not feeling that at least for the moment.

So nice to have you back LoRab!

In case others don’t know, this emoji is hers.

This is mine

JJJ is firmly a neutral town lean- he’s adding to discussion so he is a boon to town atm regardless
LC is not quite on my town radar yet. Lean scum

Good. I don't give you permission to townread me.

S~V~S is bad. She's humouring in there like nobody's business. Setting the scene, agreeable. If I were cruder and didn't know S~V~S, she's also sucking up to Jay, possibly pocketing.

Humoring Jay? Nah. I kinda thought I was shading him a slight bit, tbh, with the call back to the game where he was bad.

How would saying jay fooled everyone as a baddie in a game, and pointing out that he was contradicting himself by being super active be "humoring" him? Poking someone with a small, soft stick =/= humoring.

Noooo, sorry, I was loose-verbing it. You weren't "humouring him", you were "humouring in", as in, entering the thread on a little wave of mild humour.

S~V~S is bad. She's humouring in there like nobody's business. Setting the scene, agreeable. If I were cruder and didn't know S~V~S, she's also sucking up to Jay, possibly pocketing.

Intriguing take- I feel like I have the unique benefit of having just wolfed with her and I haven’t seen anything specific about her that is throwing off my paranoia alarm. And I’m usually paranoid of her as of the last 3 games before I wolf’ed with her.

Now do me do me

OK, you're freaking me out here. I don't think you've EVER said anything like this to/about me. Not the last 3 games. EVERY. GAME. Every one. You think I'm bad.

What did you take away from wolfing with me that makes you say this?

Also gotta go get ready for work. Love my new job, hate the longer commute.

I like this S~V~S read of Scotty. Maybe she ain't that bad, and he is.

Like Caterpie into Metapod, I have evolved!
After being utterly wrong about you before we were partners, I figure what I once viewed as suspicious in a vacuum is just you.

You have some quirks that i picked up on that I’m not going to reveal yet. But rest assured, dear Svs, I haven’t seen them so far. Just don’t do them and we’ll be golden

Absolute red flag. The secret S~V~S tells that he has, that he of course isn't sharing. This feels like a lie toped with a cheers for extra smoothness.

I've counted six players so far that have provided reads of some kind, including town reads (to varying degrees). The following players have been read as town by at least four others:

LoRab, JJJ, DarlingMonroe, and Scotty

How do we feel about that? I invite anyone to answer. Are these good names to have in a "town block" or no? Do you feel comfortable with that game state?

Scotty's out, sorry. Maybe you as well. LoRab is fine, I don't have cognizance of DM yet.

[Long Con]

@DrWilgy is my top town read.

That low?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I hadn't noticed the elimination save on Rupert's role. That's... extremely powerful, and by far the most powerful thing in the game, and given the challenge already present, a bit deflating. But we must remain engaged and keep our spirts high.

Yeesh.

[Cape90]

bereft
loreb
jjj
monroe
long con

scotty

null

thunal

I assume you actually do have a reason to read me bad then?

yeah, sorting alphabetically

m doesnt come before l

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Are you sure?

--> cont'd from above: WAS it an "unhinged towny post"? Is everyone okay with JJJ's question? It blew my mind last night because I didn't feel like it was asking ANYTHING. Is it towny or wolfy? "On-brand"? So, what, is JJJ worried that I'm not really me right now? Is that what he's confirming with S~V~S??

And I still can't even handle "on-brand or not (or neither)", like, what? Are we trying to determine if I'm quasi-semi-myself before we try to think about alignment?

How does this stuff not make other people question it? WHAT DOES IT MEAN? If it has no meaning, then what does that say about JJJ?

Forget it, I don't even care.

That question was more about S~V~S for me than it was about you. I mean, in terms of sentence structure it was literally about you, but my interest was in S~V~S. I suggested earlier that I thought you looked town in that moment (for poking the bear). I wanted to directly engage S~V~S with what you had said though, because it would give me a better foundation by which to assess her. The ways that people deal with early suspicion, especially from others that they know well, can be telling.

I don't quite town read her response. She sort of shrugged off your suspicion of her as "probably" on brand, and then went on a tangent about how she usually reads you (without stating a clear perspective of how she reads you this time).

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Anyway, that Long Con post might have been the most town post in the game to this point.

[Cape90]

I've counted six players so far that have provided reads of some kind, including town reads (to varying degrees). The following players have been read as town by at least four others:

LoRab, JJJ, DarlingMonroe, and Scotty

How do we feel about that? I invite anyone to answer. Are these good names to have in a "town block" or no? Do you feel comfortable with that game state?

I feel alright about 3 of those but DM would need to post more to be in a confident range for me

[Cape90]

Anyway, that Long Con post might have been the most town post in the game to this point.

Yeah I agree here

[Long Con]

Are you sure?

--> cont'd from above: WAS it an "unhinged towny post"? Is everyone okay with JJJ's question? It blew my mind last night because I didn't feel like it was asking ANYTHING. Is it towny or wolfy? "On-brand"? So, what, is JJJ worried that I'm not really me right now? Is that what he's confirming with S~V~S??

And I still can't even handle "on-brand or not (or neither)", like, what? Are we trying to determine if I'm quasi-semi-myself before we try to think about alignment?

How does this stuff not make other people question it? WHAT DOES IT MEAN? If it has no meaning, then what does that say about JJJ?

Forget it, I don't even care.

That question was more about S~V~S for me than it was about you. I mean, in terms of sentence structure it was literally about you, but my interest was in S~V~S. I suggested earlier that I thought you looked town in that moment (for poking the bear). I wanted to directly engage S~V~S with what you had said though, because it would give me a better foundation by which to assess her. The ways that people deal with early suspicion, especially from others that they know well, can be telling.

I don't quite town read her response. She sort of shrugged off your suspicion of her as "probably" on brand, and then went on a tangent about how she usually reads you (without stating a clear perspective of how she reads you this time).

I find it hard to blame her for having a lackluster response to a question that means nothing.

She's not afraid to give a read on me in either alignment, is she? You didn't even ask her what her read of me is. No. I like you less than her in this.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I am considering dropping Scotty as a premier town read. There have been a few doubts raised that at least piqued my interest, and I want those dialogues to develop before I commit myself to that viewpoint. For the time being I will place him in purgatory.

[Long Con]

Anyway, that Long Con post might have been the most town post in the game to this point.

Anyway, that Long Con post might have been the most town post in the game to this point.

Yeah I agree here

Nice! Ok, I'm gonna go shower. I got home from work and immediately went here, but it seems my work is done for now. Shower, feed kids, then who knows? Ta-ta.

[Long Con]

I am considering dropping Scotty as a premier town read. There have been a few doubts raised that at least piqued my interest, and I want those dialogues to develop before I commit myself to that viewpoint. For the time being I will place him in purgatory.

Yeah, did you like that S~V~S reaction to him? I thought her point sounded legit.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I find it hard to blame her for having a lackluster response to a question that means nothing.

She's not afraid to give a read on me in either alignment, is she? You didn't even ask her what her read of me is. No. I like you less than her in this.

There's a difference between "a question that means nothing" and "a question with a meaning that Long Con does not see".

Your second point is fair. I did not directly ask her for a read. I thought it was at least somewhat implied, as being "off-brand" would be "off-meta" and therefore suspicious. I acknowledge the language may not necessarily translate.