The Syndicate

So why do you make that kind of post in the first place, especially if you intended to sign your message or whatnot

Whatever Chop chop chop

The thing about the "why does Chop do this if he is scum" arguments is this. What if he *is* town? He's never getting NKed. We can't have him around at FX. He has to be resolved by force because this is too huge to ignore. And if Occam's Razor holds true and he is scum, we get a headstart on analyzing all his spew. Just kill the scumslipped slot and move from there rather than mindgaming yourself into a bad exe.

Considering the possibility that this entire thing is actually just a ploy to distract us from ... something?

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:19 am Considering the possibility that this entire thing is actually just a ploy to distract us from ... something?

If it's a ploy then Chop is in on it. If Chop is in on it then he's scum. We can lock in our decisions to exe Chop, and talk about other concerns so we don't get distracted.

ChopChop wrote: ↑Mon Mar 01, 2021 10:00 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Mon Mar 01, 2021 12:36 pm

c4e5g3d5 wrote: ↑Mon Mar 01, 2021 11:58 am Chop is TWTBAW ez

yuck

Agreed.
Saying I’m “TWTBAW” is flawed logic.
It’s the same as “TWTBT”.
It’s essentially a very low effort evaluation towards my slot.

Indeed, too wolfy to be town

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:12 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:10 am

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:07 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 2:43 am Is it realistic to think that the Enclave member holding that role would actually forget to include the name of their nightkill victim?

If this team is functioning like a normal team should, that message would have been peer reviewed in the team chat before it got sent out. Somebody should have noticed that Esooa's name was missing.

As a wise man once said: Mafia ChopChop doesn't run it by BTSC.

Night actions are usually highly coordinated tho

What are the chances that the other Enclave members said something like "Chop, send a message to Daisy or something and try to fish for a claim", and they don't review the exact wording?

that would depend on the teammates. I'm too much of a control freak to let a message like that go out without checking it myself. But not everyone would be so neurotic about it.

I feel like you would also be in that camp, along with spf. Ordinarily I'd say Epi, but I feel like he's taking it easy in this game regardless of alignment, so I don't know if he'd doublecheck his student's teammate's work for obvious errors right now. Something tells me nanook would be on alert.
Mac would be crafty enough to come up with the plan, but based on his thread presence he might not be tuned in enough to check the message before sending it out. I feel similar about LC and Marmot.

I don't know enough about the scum games of everyone else to say how they'd handle having that role in the hands of a teammate.

I dunno who, of the players I know, would intentionally let that happen if they could stop it tbh. It’s a weird counterfactual

Preflipping Chop -> Urist, poison town, Jack wolf? (?) or maybe switch poison and Jack idk

Urist definitely not w/w with chop

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:25 am I dunno who, of the players I know, would intentionally let that happen if they could stop it tbh. It’s a weird counterfactual

LC and Mac are the only two on this roster who I could see noticing the omission and then saying "Yeah, send it out anyway lol." But I don't think that's what happened.

i say that as a nod of respect to them. absolute wild bois

Addendum that I just thought of: in Grasslands, when SPF was scum that was wrongly threadspewed town, she didn't harp on it or try to play it up. She just focused on looking generically town, pushing townies and pocketing Hally. Now SPF is harping on her being threadspewed.

I am not going to do her scum game the disrespect of claiming she can't adjust her repertoire to add it in, but I will say that SPF as a player and person seems to be more likely to try to coax others into townreading her when she is scum than to try to twist their arms into doing so. She did a bit of arm twisting in Bread Mafia too.

It's not a hugely weighted piece of evidence, but it helps reinforce my confidence in her.

Remind me to go back and check how Jay handles scum actions

i'm surprised at how little i know about jack's behind-the-scenes presence as scum. i think we've only been teammates once, and i was a sub who got chopped almost immediately.

Chop was blatantly never going to escape the POE from Day 1. There was too much suspicion, too quickly. I don't give anyone points for just being harsh towards Chop.

My vote is on chop in spirit.

Who kills Esooa is the other question to have in mind

Honestly my best guess is the scum team just isn’t quite with it

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:36 am Who kills Esooa is the other question to have in mind

That's a fairly long list. She was widely town-read, I think.

who kills wilgy?

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:36 am Who kills Esooa is the other question to have in mind

Mac might kill Esooa - they have history, and she caught him last time he was scum.

LC might kill Esooa. They were pretty harsh on each other, and Esooa was universally townread so killing a hostile player disguised as a generic consensus town kill is not unreasonable.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:37 am

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:36 am Who kills Esooa is the other question to have in mind

That's a fairly long list. She was widely town-read, I think.

Can be rephrased as who doesn’t kill sloonei, but some people are scared of doctors

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:37 am who kills wilgy?

Someone with a PR read that was wrong.

Someone who is so deeply embedded in the towncore that they face suspicion if towncore members start dying and they are still alive, so they fake a PR hunt.

Possibly a vigilante, with the Vault City kill blocked by a doctor.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:37 am who kills wilgy?

I have so faint a clue that I haven’t begun to think about it. Money’s on the second wolf team, maybe to dodge the main kill? Could also be a vig

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Sun Feb 28, 2021 2:06 am Hello everyone, name is DrWilgy.

Pros: Most definitely a doctor
Cons: Most definitely a doctor
Gameplan: Most definitely a doctor
Misc: Most definitely a doctor

It is a pleasure to make your acquaintance.

Wild theory: Vault City is comprised entirely of people who don't know wilgy and thought this was a role claim.

Less wild theory: Wilgy is the safest kill choice because it points to no one and we all say "why would anyone kill wilgy?"

Alternative less wild theory: Wilgy wasn't killed by a mafia team.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:38 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:37 am

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:36 am Who kills Esooa is the other question to have in mind

That's a fairly long list. She was widely town-read, I think.

Can be rephrased as who doesn’t kill sloonei, but some people are scared of doctors

There was more sus on Sloonei than Esooa.

If it’s a big the question becomes what ate the kill

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:40 am

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Sun Feb 28, 2021 2:06 am Hello everyone, name is DrWilgy.

Pros: Most definitely a doctor
Cons: Most definitely a doctor
Gameplan: Most definitely a doctor
Misc: Most definitely a doctor

It is a pleasure to make your acquaintance.

Wild theory: Vault City is comprised entirely of people who don't know wilgy and thought this was a role claim.

Less wild theory: Wilgy is the safest kill choice because it points to no one and we all say "why would anyone kill wilgy?"

Alternative less wild theory: Wilgy wasn't killed by a mafia team.

Esooa knows Wilgy does this, iirc, she's played with him before. She also isn't the type to be lax about checking night kills. If Vault City shot Wilgy, there was purpose behind it.

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:40 am

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:38 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:37 am

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:36 am Who kills Esooa is the other question to have in mind

That's a fairly long list. She was widely town-read, I think.

Can be rephrased as who doesn’t kill sloonei, but some people are scared of doctors

There was more sus on Sloonei than Esooa.

Would point to all of Jack/Mac/spf being town? Or the opposite

I haven't played with esooa before so in my mind this is her first game on the syndicate.

I think very few mafia teams would kill Wilgy just because it points to nobody when [SPF, Sloonei, Alison, Esooa] are all alive and townread, unless they have 2 or more wolves buried deep.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:42 am I haven't played with esooa before so in my mind this is her first game on the syndicate.

She played with Wilgy in Overtime Mafia.

Who vig shoots Wilgy is another question

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:42 am I think very few mafia teams would kill Wilgy just because it points to nobody when [SPF, Sloonei, Alison, Esooa] are all alive and townread, unless they have 2 or more wolves buried deep.

You know esooa better than I do, but I feel like there's a lot of players floating around the mafia world who aim for low key kills on Night 1 to try to keep town in the dark.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:43 am Who vig shoots Wilgy is another question

someone with no restraint.

Shooting Wilgy as vig is a fine play. If he's town he's never going to clear himself or generate a lot of content. If he's scum he has an uncanny ability to slip by day after day and let town self destruct. I would shoot someone I actively suspected (as I did), but shooting Wilgy is not a crazy shot for a vig to make. But if a vig shot Wilgy, why not claim? They're all one-shot.

The slaver might shoot wilgy

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:45 am

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:42 am I think very few mafia teams would kill Wilgy just because it points to nobody when [SPF, Sloonei, Alison, Esooa] are all alive and townread, unless they have 2 or more wolves buried deep.

You know esooa better than I do, but I feel like there's a lot of players floating around the mafia world who aim for low key kills on Night 1 to try to keep town in the dark.

If you shoot a slanker to deny town NKA when the world champion is rampaging through the thread it means you are confident you can fool him. Ergo deepwolf.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:47 am The slaver might shoot wilgy

I could see the slaver not knowing Wilgy and shooting him for claiming doctor. That would mean the actual Vault City kill was blocked.

There are two potential town vigs if I’m reading correctly

Ok so VC kill blocked, what’s up with that

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:51 am Ok so VC kill blocked, what’s up with that

We suspect the VC kill is blocked, we aren't 100% on it. If it's blocked I'm inclined to think it's as simple as a doctor protecting Sloonei or myself.

Possible Esooa carried the kill and Jay blocks actions from dead people

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:52 am

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:51 am Ok so VC kill blocked, what’s up with that

We suspect the VC kill is blocked, we aren't 100% on it. If it's blocked I'm inclined to think it's as simple as a doctor protecting Sloonei or myself.

Yeah I’m using the hypothetical

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:52 am Possible Esooa carried the kill and Jay blocks actions from dead people

sounds like a reach and very nonstandard.

Theory: mafia piled on BK to make him die over c4, so that c4 and Dom would burn the thread down screaming at each other and block any solving from being done.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:52 am Possible Esooa carried the kill and Jay blocks actions from dead people

i do not think so

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:54 am

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 4:52 am Possible Esooa carried the kill and Jay blocks actions from dead people

sounds like a reach and very nonstandard.

This is HCRealms standard, but I’ll take Sloonei’s word for it

Names for the Alison take: Martin, Rej, Grogu