The Syndicate

Caught up, but it's wasn't easy to focus tbh

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:38 pm falcon kinda fell off of the face of the earth

I made a mental note at half past Trustfall o clock yesterday that you, Marmot, and I stuck around to talk about our results. Falcon trustfell and then dipped.

I think Ilario, Marmot and Jimmay are just town. That's maybe not a lot of town reads, but these are strong town reads for me.

I don't like Dolby's push on the general consensus town because I don't really see the substance in it apart from "This bad because I don't like the PoE". If Dolby is mafia, I think the PoE is good.

Anarch is falling down in the PoE for me. Maybe it's because of his activity dropping off, and now my initial town read there just doesn't feel as strong anymore. I don't really know how i feel.

As I read, I like quite a few of Johanna's and G-Man's posts. I don't know if that's really good enough at this stage though. But this may be another reason I'm thinking it's quite possible that Anarch is mafia.

I don't really see many teams that doesn't include Falcon tbh. My actual read on his play is that his posts are probably "fine" within his meta. But I don't really sense that he's going anywhere with his suspicions. His Ilario suspicion has seemed static, and I don't really get the sense that he cares about solving the game.

TSP and NAA exists and have done things.

Ilario/Marmot/Jimmay

NAA/TSP

Johanna/Anarch/G-Man

Falcon/Dolby

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 9:39 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:38 pm falcon kinda fell off of the face of the earth

I made a mental note at half past Trustfall o clock yesterday that you, Marmot, and I stuck around to talk about our results. Falcon trustfell and then dipped.

Any ride-or-die caliber town reads at the moment? I'd like to try again at building a coherent theory of the game, but could use some additional perspectives on the people applicable to tinfoiling.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:28 pm

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:25 pm One question: How long is it since you randed mafia against Sloonei?

Technically: 2019 GOC (we were both mafia on separate teams and correctly identified each other as mafia)

Semi-technically: A random game we played on Bulbagarden: I semi-fooled him on Day 1, but only by hard-bussing my teammate (then got shot by an SK on night 1)

In a normal game: Maybe Mountain Mafia here? I can't remember a different one. He caught me handily there.

Honorable mention: When I was an SK myself in GY!BE mafia, I believe he was onto the fact that I was off at least.

I didn’t play GY!BE.

A correct POE pool of five still wins the game. To get there I think a lot of focus needs to be given to solidifying the positions of these players:

Dyslexicon
ilario
Marmot
NotAnAxehole

I will leave Tony out of it while he remains uncountered. If all of the names in this post are town, then we're still position for a win. If even one of them isn't, I think we're positioned for a loss. Every town member could stand to give special attention to ensuring we get these folks right I believe.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:04 pm I didn’t play GY!BE.

You had 141 posts

@NotAnAxehole What was the reason you claimed and rescinded fruit vendor?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:02 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 9:39 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:38 pm falcon kinda fell off of the face of the earth

I made a mental note at half past Trustfall o clock yesterday that you, Marmot, and I stuck around to talk about our results. Falcon trustfell and then dipped.

Any ride-or-die caliber town reads at the moment? I'd like to try again at building a coherent theory of the game, but could use some additional perspectives on the people applicable to tinfoiling.

Besides you, just Dizzy and by extension Ilario. I do still feel like Ilario’s early Day 1 activity felt very much like an excited town player.

Maybe Marmot too, but that’s slightly less strong. It TSP’s fruit vendor claim goes uncountered, we can consider him a lock.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:06 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:04 pm I didn’t play GY!BE.

You had 141 posts

That’s not me.

I remember asking to be subbed out, and I thought it was an immediate request on my part. I guess I was around longer than I remembered.

Marmot wrote: ↑Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:22 pm @falcon45ca's silence is deafening tbh

You stealin' my lines?



I guess imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:10 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:06 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:04 pm I didn’t play GY!BE.

You had 141 posts

That’s not me.

I remember asking to be subbed out, and I thought it was an immediate request on my part. I guess I was around longer than I remembered.

Huh, I totally did catch you in this game and I forgot all about it!

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 7:12 pm So clearly my solve was wrong. I did nothing in the night phase except distance myself from this game. This is my first 0 for 2 start in a while, and I am going to take that as a signal that I need to step back and re-engage this game in some manner other than what I have been doing. I am going to be less of a noisy butt, but I will still be here working through it and chatting.

I'm open to just about any theories out there. Sloonei being poisoned is kind of a bizarre gift that spares the game mass tinfoil and also maximizes his 48-hour utility for us.

I've actually got an interesting theory, wanna hear it?



[VOTE: JJJ] aubergine

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:15 pm I've actually got an interesting theory, wanna hear it?



[VOTE: JJJ] aubergine

I'm fascinated. Tell me more.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:15 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:15 pm I've actually got an interesting theory, wanna hear it?



[VOTE: JJJ] aubergine

I'm fascinated. Tell me more.

Well, through no fault of your own I'm sure, you had the luck to rand wolf this game.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:18 pm Well, through no fault of your own I'm sure, you had the luck to rand wolf this game.

Okay sure cool, but I am hoping to hear about the theory. Why's Jay mafia?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:13 pm Huh, I totally did catch you in this game and I forgot all about it!

After having a look back at my posts in that old game, it is apparent that I was quite

S T I L T E D

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:19 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:18 pm Well, through no fault of your own I'm sure, you had the luck to rand wolf this game.

Okay sure cool, but I am hoping to hear about the theory. Why's Jay mafia?

I just told you?



In more simple terms, bad luck.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:20 pm I just told you?

In more simple terms, bad luck.

Okay then. I'll just zip it while you continue your solving.

@Marmot how do you feel about the flood of confident town reads you have received in this game?

It does go back aways, to when I noticed you're paying an extra amount of attention to me basically since the start. I'm an easy mislynch for Maf, as I'm generally thought to be scummy, but you've been shading me throughout the game.



Even when you've brought up my town meta, it's always been sprinkled with "but he could be Maf"



There's also the manner in which you described your scum game to me....the only thing I can see different from that description to your play this game is the real time interaction, which since you pointed it out, would be easy to work into your play this game.



Also, I've noticed a weird air of...despair? from you this game that I've never seen with your town game. In other games when there's been mislynches of "100% Maf" I've played with you, you've always kept a spirit of towny optimism: that the game state is within town's grasp, and that town need not panic or sway off course. It's different this game, it's almost like you're waiting to throw in the towel

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:21 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:20 pm I just told you?

In more simple terms, bad luck.

Okay then. I'll just zip it while you continue your solving.

Oh don't be passive aggressive, I have a girlfriend for that!

hello. i didn't get to see EOD. work has me so swamped. who died

oh wait

Son of Anarch wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:30 pm hello. i didn't get to see EOD. work has me so swamped. who died

I have a sneaking suspicion that Nanook tagged you (like he did everybody) and you can go check for yourself.



It's D3, derp clears are for D1

ffffff im an idiot. eod is on saturday though, yeah? i'm gonna be very sparse until saturday but ill be able to catch up then

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:33 pm

Son of Anarch wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:30 pm hello. i didn't get to see EOD. work has me so swamped. who died

I have a sneaking suspicion that Nanook tagged you (like he did everybody) and you can go check for yourself.



It's D3, derp clears are for D1

I honestly didn't think tags did anything on this site but thanks for the passive-aggression bud

Son of Anarch wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:34 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:33 pm

Son of Anarch wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:30 pm hello. i didn't get to see EOD. work has me so swamped. who died

I have a sneaking suspicion that Nanook tagged you (like he did everybody) and you can go check for yourself.



It's D3, derp clears are for D1

I honestly didn't think tags did anything on this site but thanks for the passive-aggression bud

Sorry about that.




I wasn't trying to be passive.

JJJ, Ilario, Dolby, SOA



That's a good POE

It's a shame LC died because I was comin' around to him being town. Sloonei poisoned is slightly unexpected, but I admit I missed a large chunk of yesterday and don't know what happened to possibly turn things around there

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:36 pm JJJ, Ilario, Dolby, SOA



That's a good POE

I don’t think it is.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:28 pm It does go back aways, to when I noticed you're paying an extra amount of attention to me basically since the start. I'm an easy mislynch for Maf, as I'm generally thought to be scummy, but you've been shading me throughout the game.

Sure, I have been doing that. I haven't found a good reason to town read you. Is there a good reason to town read you?

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:28 pmEven when you've brought up my town meta, it's always been sprinkled with "but he could be Maf"

No offense, but your "town meta" might be the single easiest town meta to fake on this game roster. Refusing to trust people and accusing everyone of everything is pretty simple to replicate. If "meta" is all I have for you, then I feel like I have very little.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:28 pmThere's also the manner in which you described your scum game to me....the only thing I can see different from that description to your play this game is the real time interaction, which since you pointed it out, would be easy to work into your play this game.

I won't fight this as it's going to be take-it-or-leave-it wifom regardless. I'll just say that my mafia tendency to engage less real-time dialogue isn't so much "strategic" as it is a concession that I am not as good at it when I'm bullshitting. It's not something I could just add to the equation without a lot of difficulty.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:28 pmAlso, I've noticed a weird air of...despair? from you this game that I've never seen with your town game. In other games when there's been mislynches of "100% Maf" I've played with you, you've always kept a spirit of towny optimism: that the game state is within town's grasp, and that town need not panic or sway off course. It's different this game, it's almost like you're waiting to throw in the towel

This one I don't understand. I had a period of uncertainty in Day 2, and then after I did a lot of work I emerged with a confident solve proposal with the entire mafia team in it. It doesn't get much more self-assured than that. I don't know if you have ever seen me go 0 for 2 though, so you wouldn't have much basis to compare to for this current state of affairs. Normally I get one by now. When I don't I have to be conscious of that and consider ways to adapt. At no point have I done anything resembling "throw in the towel" or "despair" though. That's hard to take seriously. I have made over 400 posts and am still going strong under worse conditions than ever.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:36 pm JJJ, Ilario, Dolby, SOA



That's a good POE

What are the chances this is 4 town?

Son of Anarch wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:36 pm It's a shame LC died because I was comin' around to him being town. Sloonei poisoned is slightly unexpected, but I admit I missed a large chunk of yesterday and don't know what happened to possibly turn things around there

What needed to be turned around?

On some level that falcon post sounds honest despite my questions. I will need someone less biased to talk to me about it.

[VOTE: Son of Anarch] aubergine

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:38 pm On some level that falcon post sounds honest despite my questions. I will need someone less biased to talk to me about it.

[VOTE: Son of Anarch] aubergine

Man, I don't even mind the vote on me. I admit I haven't done anything. I just want to say though that I will be around a lot on Saturday to possibly post and give my thoughts if this is the route you guys choose to go down. So please don't hammer me early.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:38 pm

Son of Anarch wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:36 pm It's a shame LC died because I was comin' around to him being town. Sloonei poisoned is slightly unexpected, but I admit I missed a large chunk of yesterday and don't know what happened to possibly turn things around there

What needed to be turned around?

I thought you were slightly suspicious and weren't as town as the other people I was town reading. So I guess what I'm wonderin' is why you over other people.

Son of Anarch wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:40 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:38 pm On some level that falcon post sounds honest despite my questions. I will need someone less biased to talk to me about it.

[VOTE: Son of Anarch] aubergine

Man, I don't even mind the vote on me. I admit I haven't done anything. I just want to say though that I will be around a lot on Saturday to possibly post and give my thoughts if this is the route you guys choose to go down. So please don't hammer me early.

Saturday is the night phase starting at 7pm edt. I'm in no hurry to hammer, but your time to do things on that specific day will be inherently restricted.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:41 pm

Son of Anarch wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:40 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:38 pm On some level that falcon post sounds honest despite my questions. I will need someone less biased to talk to me about it.

[VOTE: Son of Anarch] aubergine

Man, I don't even mind the vote on me. I admit I haven't done anything. I just want to say though that I will be around a lot on Saturday to possibly post and give my thoughts if this is the route you guys choose to go down. So please don't hammer me early.

Saturday is the night phase starting at 7pm edt. I'm in no hurry to hammer, but your time to do things on that specific day will be inherently restricted.

Yeah, but it's the best I can give. I'm workin' 12 hour shifts which is somethin' I didn't anticipate this week. It's better than nothin' and I'd rather die and give somethin' than die and give nothin'. I'll also probably be around Friday night

@Dolby
@falcon45ca
@G-Man
@Johanna
@Son of Anarch

For those of you that is/are town-aligned, our ability to win this game is likely contingent upon your desire to win. I don't want this to sound like PRESSURE, and it's certainly not intended as hostile. You've all already done things to contribute. What I mean is that if there are mafia members outside this group, they've already established a foothold in this thread that is going to be extremely difficult to break without your intervention (specifically yours). I'm sure it's irritating to be continually stuck within a POE pool every time you click on the thread, but now is the best and perhaps last chance to turn that around. After two mischops to start the game, I think almost every member of the town faction is going to be open-minded to a new view of the game. I am absolutely listening to everything you have to say and will be stoked every time I see a new post pop up from each of you.

Some or all of you might find me suspicious. That's okay. It's a natural thing to expect under the circumstances. I will try my best to follow my own advice here and give you the best chance of finding my own innocence.

Town has exactly one more mischop available before we enter elimination phases (final X). The margin for error is tiny and we cannot afford to have even one member of the town faction say "whatever, I'll just die".

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:10 pm

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:06 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:04 pm

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:04 pm I think the latter is more likely for reasons previously mentioned

Did you happen to notice any moments in the game that pointed in that direction? If mafia had an inkling then perhaps that can be isolated to a timeline.

In what would normally spew me town but which here is is irrelevant, I haven’t been paying enough attention to say

Any thoughts on NAA's fruit vendor claim/rescind?

I don't find it suspicious. I wish to be cautious before handing out town stickers at this stage.

It was towny and good, could have been wolfy but who cares. You want to try to force wolves into making a CC that they don’t have to make

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:37 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:28 pm It does go back aways, to when I noticed you're paying an extra amount of attention to me basically since the start. I'm an easy mislynch for Maf, as I'm generally thought to be scummy, but you've been shading me throughout the game.

Sure, I have been doing that. I haven't found a good reason to town read you. Is there a good reason to town read you?

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:28 pmEven when you've brought up my town meta, it's always been sprinkled with "but he could be Maf"

No offense, but your "town meta" might be the single easiest town meta to fake on this game roster. Refusing to trust people and accusing everyone of everything is pretty simple to replicate. If "meta" is all I have for you, then I feel like I have very little.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:28 pmThere's also the manner in which you described your scum game to me....the only thing I can see different from that description to your play this game is the real time interaction, which since you pointed it out, would be easy to work into your play this game.

I won't fight this as it's going to be take-it-or-leave-it wifom regardless. I'll just say that my mafia tendency to engage less real-time dialogue isn't so much "strategic" as it is a concession that I am not as good at it when I'm bullshitting. It's not something I could just add to the equation without a lot of difficulty.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:28 pmAlso, I've noticed a weird air of...despair? from you this game that I've never seen with your town game. In other games when there's been mislynches of "100% Maf" I've played with you, you've always kept a spirit of towny optimism: that the game state is within town's grasp, and that town need not panic or sway off course. It's different this game, it's almost like you're waiting to throw in the towel

This one I don't understand. I had a period of uncertainty in Day 2, and then after I did a lot of work I emerged with a confident solve proposal with the entire mafia team in it. It doesn't get much more self-assured than that. I don't know if you have ever seen me go 0 for 2 though, so you wouldn't have much basis to compare to for this current state of affairs. Normally I get one by now. When I don't I have to be conscious of that and consider ways to adapt. At no point have I done anything resembling "throw in the towel" or "despair" though. That's hard to take seriously. I have made over 400 posts and am still going strong under worse conditions than ever.

There was a post I read today that got me pinged me in this regard. I'm just finishing up at work, so I'll quote it later.



As to finding a good reason to TR me....that's the easy mislynch stuff I had mentioned. My town play in and of itself gets me mislynched, and it's often for that exact reason "why should I TR him?" Do I have a bunch of pelts? No, I rarely do. But that doesn't make me Maf.

Marmot wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:12 pm I'm also trying to decide if Dizzy is scum who was planning on turboing anyone who cc'd him, but wasn't expecting it to be Sloonei, an already confirmed town.

the fact that it was sloonei and not say, marmot, makes this hard to see unfortunately

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:37 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:36 pm JJJ, Ilario, Dolby, SOA



That's a good POE

I don’t think it is.

Son of Anarch wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:41 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:38 pm

Son of Anarch wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:36 pm It's a shame LC died because I was comin' around to him being town. Sloonei poisoned is slightly unexpected, but I admit I missed a large chunk of yesterday and don't know what happened to possibly turn things around there

What needed to be turned around?

I thought you were slightly suspicious and weren't as town as the other people I was town reading. So I guess what I'm wonderin' is why you over other people.

What’d I do that was suspicious?

I have been widely town read all game long. You would have been in the extreme minority in suspecting me. I think ilario has expressed some gripes, but otherwise people are all aboard the Sloonei Express.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 7:12 pm So clearly my solve was wrong. I did nothing in the night phase except distance myself from this game. This is my first 0 for 2 start in a while, and I am going to take that as a signal that I need to step back and re-engage this game in some manner other than what I have been doing. I am going to be less of a noisy butt, but I will still be here working through it and chatting.

I'm open to just about any theories out there. Sloonei being poisoned is kind of a bizarre gift that spares the game mass tinfoil and also maximizes his 48-hour utility for us.

This is the JJJ despair post.

Nah jay town fam

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:58 pm This is the JJJ despair post.

I don't know why that's despair. That's a very subjective assessment, so I'll just ask a related but different question:

- Would it be wise for me, as a town member, to keep pummeling away at what I have been doing without reconsidering my approach with no dead mafia and only one mischop still available?