Ricochet wrote:
One lingering thing for me since D2 was the way FZ. led the BWT lynch. I think Llama called her on trying to manipulate the last hour of voting. For me, it's more the wording of her posts back then. I don't think I've ever seen so far somebody lobbying for players to "stop" voting for someone (in this case Snowman) or to "please consider" voting for the one she wants lynched (in this case BWT). Adding to that: her obvious disapproval and row with Epig, finding his wasting his vote and such. I am aware that many are feeling better about her right now, probably because she started being the more active player people expected (in which case she either is indeed warming up her usual gameplay or adapting to the requests), but what happened back then still pinged me completely, I'd say.
Unlike Boo, when I think someone is wrongfully being lynched, I'm going to do everything I can to stop it, even at the risk of looking bad. And sometimes I do end up looking bad because that person turns out bad. With all that's been going on the last day regarding Snowman's behaviour and Zomba's feelings about him, I'm starting to wonder if I was wrong.
But I would really like to know what you think I would gain from doing such an obvious and strong interfering?
I cannot project speculation on what would you gain from interfering with the vote on him, but I had seen no signals from your posts as to why Snowman is such a special case of "wrongfully being lynched" that you would need to be so imperative. But as I've said, the wording itself seemed to me so entirely uncharacteristic from any voting instance I've witness so far in gaming.
What can I say? I'm unique
I don't know. it was a vibe thing. I read his defence vote and it just seemed genuine to me, and BWT's vote seemed so easy that it pinged the hell out of me. From that point on, it was easy
Guys, listen to Zombrella. Snowman needs to be melted. He keeps hoping we will forget about him if he posts rarely and is jokey, but he is guilty as the day is long.
Epignosis wrote:If llama is good, it means we exist in a universe in which multitasking llama can call out the first of two mafia while simultaneously calling out two civilians.
bea wrote: @ Snowman, in all fairness - what do you think of how Zombra's been playing so far? Is she reading on the up and up to you? Besides llama, who else will you be looking at going into the next lynch?
I do think she's been a straight-shooter so far. The real test would be how she reacts to a legitimate accusation.
I don't know how juliets feels, but I can't help noticing that you haven't really answered any of her questions in red.
1) Snowman is threatened by me - I deduce that he is afraid I am about to figure him out. He wouldn't worry about this unless he was bad. Where and how does he indicate that he is afraid you are going to figure him out? How can you tell that he's worried?
2) Snowman does not think that we are on the same team. I know what team I'm on - so he must be bad.
3) Snowman doesn't want to come out and build a case against me himself because he thinks that I am good and that if you all lynch me and find that out, he will look bad. He wants someone else to build the case against me so they can take the heat when I flip detective. Why do you say this? How can you tell he wants someone else to build a case on you? He doesn't even say you are bad that I can see.
The fact that he made the post about me tells me that he finds me as a threat. Look at his posts, he has done no baddie hunting. His posts are all defensive or jokes. Coming from Snowman, this is a defensive post. My name is in it, that means its about me. I get that the words are benign, but its the post's existence and form that alerts me.
I know that he wants someone else to build the case for two reasons: 1) he suggests that an accusations should be made against me in order to assess my response 2) he doesn't make that accusation himself. Remember that he finished a PhD in Psychology. I cannot stress how important this is. The words he uses are not what they seem.
You don't have to tell me he's doing no baddie hunting and that his posts are all defensive or jokes, since I voted him for that. The next part, that I underlined, doesn't make any sense as to why you find him suspicious - and more importantly, bad - though. Was he supposed not to answer at all when being asked what he thinks about you? Also, regarding 1), I think others have pointed already that he may have meant you seem genuine so far, but that it will be more telling how you will react to accusations. And that you procedeed to sort of prove his point, by reacting to accusations he didn't even make in that post.
Did he give you any idea how a good Zomba would react? Any idea how a bad Zomba would react? No? How convenient. Additionally, he said to look to how I would react to a "legitimate accusation." His post could hardly be a legitimate accusation.
But it doesn't matter. If you don't trust me, then you don't. There isn't really a lot more that I can say to convince you then what I've already said. You may think it doesn't make sense, but that's because you don't know him or me and you haven't really seen either of us play. Soon enough, you will see....you will see....
Turnip Head wrote:I for one welcome our new zombie and llama overlords. May their reign be long, and may their cases always be on point.
thellama73 wrote:Guys, listen to Zombrella. Snowman needs to be melted. He keeps hoping we will forget about him if he posts rarely and is jokey, but he is guilty as the day is long.
Listen to Llama. I'd daresay that he knows Snowman's play better than anyone besides me, MP and SpaceDaisy.
Turnip Head wrote:I for one welcome our new zombie and llama overlords. May their reign be long, and may their cases always be on point.
thellama73 wrote:Guys, listen to Zombrella. Snowman needs to be melted. He keeps hoping we will forget about him if he posts rarely and is jokey, but he is guilty as the day is long.
Can I vote for him without listening to Zomberella telling me to trust her because she knows better?
thellama73 wrote:Guys, listen to Zombrella. Snowman needs to be melted. He keeps hoping we will forget about him if he posts rarely and is jokey, but he is guilty as the day is long.
Can I vote for him without listening to Zomberella telling me to trust her because she knows better?
bea wrote:MM - nice case! :nod: I'll admit, I've just kinda been skimming Epi - looking for stuff that actually helps and sorta ignoring the wonky. I could see myself voting there.
OMG Zombra's avi. You two have a super fun marriage don't you?
So, I think it was SVS (?) thinking that the LC kill was probably done by a Rev player. Does anyone have any feelings on this? BR - any ideas on who might have wanted LC out of the picture?
Hubby has a dental apt in like an hour - not sure if we are running around between then and our dinner date, but I will keep up on my phone (what else am I going to do while I'm sitting in the waiting room? )
I said the opposite, I think it wasn't a RM player. I think its recent, not older history.
Skip softly, my moonbeams, for I have heard tell
That the stairs up to heaven lead straight down to hell
thellama73 wrote:Guys, listen to Zombrella. Snowman needs to be melted. He keeps hoping we will forget about him if he posts rarely and is jokey, but he is guilty as the day is long.
Can I vote for him without listening to Zomberella telling me to trust her because she knows better?
Yes. Rico, I am ordering you NOT to vote for Snowman. I dare you to defy me.
Turnip Head wrote:I for one welcome our new zombie and llama overlords. May their reign be long, and may their cases always be on point.
DharmaHelper wrote:You know what, fuck it. I'm gonna vote Epi now. He is either a baddie pulling this stunt, or he is somehow not a baddie, but completely disinterested in making any kind of sense. Dead weight either way. Voting now :P
Yes. I am disinterested. I've done what I could, but all it turns into is "stuff to use against Epi later." I am voting Snowman and will allow the rest of the voters to decide if they want me around or not. I'm tired.
zeek wrote:Very convincing case, MM, I hadn't put together all those inconsistencies from Epi. Although I'm not sure on you, your points are persuasive. I may vote Epi if he convince me otherwise.
I really don't know what to make of all the strange behaviour in this game tbh, feels like it's going to be quite a random game.
Go for it zeek. I didn't even read MM's case on me and don't plan to post any manner of defense. I'm the easy choice today and I'm okay with that. If you're a detective though, lynching me won't help you.
MetalMarsh votes Epignosis first thing D3. Only reasoning he gives is that it's because he doesn't think Epig is intentionally inconsistent.
Almost one day later, makes a big case on Epig bringing out a pattern of intentional inconsistencies.
Receives standing ovation.
DharmaHelper wrote:You know what, fuck it. I'm gonna vote Epi now. He is either a baddie pulling this stunt, or he is somehow not a baddie, but completely disinterested in making any kind of sense. Dead weight either way. Voting now :P
Yes. I am disinterested. I've done what I could, but all it turns into is "stuff to use against Epi later." I am voting Snowman and will allow the rest of the voters to decide if they want me around or not. I'm tired.
zeek wrote:Very convincing case, MM, I hadn't put together all those inconsistencies from Epi. Although I'm not sure on you, your points are persuasive. I may vote Epi if he convince me otherwise.
I really don't know what to make of all the strange behaviour in this game tbh, feels like it's going to be quite a random game.
Go for it zeek. I didn't even read MM's case on me and don't plan to post any manner of defense. I'm the easy choice today and I'm okay with that. If you're a detective though, lynching me won't help you.
If you're ready to quit at Day 3 then I am ready to help you.
Epig, could you clarify (one more time? think I missed it ) the dissonance between saying you won't say anything about the three Yotsuba you profiled and then saying that juliets is a Yotsuba according to your profiling? That's the main thing that bugs me, tbh.
thellama73 wrote:Guys, listen to Zombrella. Snowman needs to be melted. He keeps hoping we will forget about him if he posts rarely and is jokey, but he is guilty as the day is long.
Listen to Llama. I'd daresay that he knows Snowman's play better than anyone besides me, MP and SpaceDaisy.
Why does llama know Snowman's play so well if he's just played one game here? Same for MP and Spacedaisy...
And Epi, I don't understand your position at all. Since when do you just give up when a little suspicion is thrown your way?
thellama73 wrote:Guys, listen to Zombrella. Snowman needs to be melted. He keeps hoping we will forget about him if he posts rarely and is jokey, but he is guilty as the day is long.
Listen to Llama. I'd daresay that he knows Snowman's play better than anyone besides me, MP and SpaceDaisy.
Why does llama know Snowman's play so well if he's just played one game here? Same for MP and Spacedaisy...
And Epi, I don't understand your position at all. Since when do you just give up when a little suspicion is thrown your way?
MP, SpaceDaisy, Snowman, and I have played IRL.
Llama knows everything.
Turnip Head wrote:I for one welcome our new zombie and llama overlords. May their reign be long, and may their cases always be on point.
thellama73 wrote:Guys, listen to Zombrella. Snowman needs to be melted. He keeps hoping we will forget about him if he posts rarely and is jokey, but he is guilty as the day is long.
Listen to Llama. I'd daresay that he knows Snowman's play better than anyone besides me, MP and SpaceDaisy.
Why does llama know Snowman's play so well if he's just played one game here? Same for MP and Spacedaisy...
And Epi, I don't understand your position at all. Since when do you just give up when a little suspicion is thrown your way?
Because I learn very quickly. I don't know, guys, I'm just not getting a baddie vibe from Epi.
Epignosis wrote:If llama is good, it means we exist in a universe in which multitasking llama can call out the first of two mafia while simultaneously calling out two civilians.
bea wrote:MM - nice case! :nod: I'll admit, I've just kinda been skimming Epi - looking for stuff that actually helps and sorta ignoring the wonky. I could see myself voting there.
OMG Zombra's avi. You two have a super fun marriage don't you?
So, I think it was SVS (?) thinking that the LC kill was probably done by a Rev player. Does anyone have any feelings on this? BR - any ideas on who might have wanted LC out of the picture?
Hubby has a dental apt in like an hour - not sure if we are running around between then and our dinner date, but I will keep up on my phone (what else am I going to do while I'm sitting in the waiting room? )
I said the opposite, I think it wasn't a RM player. I think its recent, not older history.
OK - thanks for clarifying SVS - I was skimming along last night at work. Go figure I misremembered. Sorry bout that.
@ zombra, can't I believe you and still admire the style in which you express your convictions?
I was born to speak all mirth and no matter....
Epignosis wrote:Bitch, my identity is my identity theft protection!
bea wrote:MM - nice case! :nod: I'll admit, I've just kinda been skimming Epi - looking for stuff that actually helps and sorta ignoring the wonky. I could see myself voting there.
OMG Zombra's avi. You two have a super fun marriage don't you?
So, I think it was SVS (?) thinking that the LC kill was probably done by a Rev player. Does anyone have any feelings on this? BR - any ideas on who might have wanted LC out of the picture?
Hubby has a dental apt in like an hour - not sure if we are running around between then and our dinner date, but I will keep up on my phone (what else am I going to do while I'm sitting in the waiting room? )
Interesting, a rev player would know him better. I do believe he has made an impression since he started playing here as well. I wouldn't limit it to a rev player at all. Killings can be a surprise. Like the last two times I was killed on night 1, I was super surprised when I found out who did it. Don't worry boys, I never forget. I know I'm not that brave. I doubt it was you or SVS. Like I already said I would be blown away if it was Epig. I also can't explain why I doubt it would be him, I guess I always think those two have a lot of fun sparring in the thread. Kinda like a respect thing. I could see DH, Llama, MM, or TH doing it. That's cause I think of them as ballsy players who like to make a statement. It's too hard to be for sure.
Epignosis wrote:If llama is good, it means we exist in a universe in which multitasking llama can call out the first of two mafia while simultaneously calling out two civilians.
There are over 24 hours to deadline. Why is everyone in a hurry to vote?
I would be inclined to trust Zombarella on Snowman, because I believe she is capable of knowing him better than anyone. Just like Epi knows when Elo is bad. It will suck if I turn out to be the one who prevented his lynch the first time, but if it gets a baddie lynched, I'll live with the shame.
Zombarella. While I get how one post by him can give you the bad vibe, could he also be Yotsuba or an indie role? Because if he isn't playing naturally, and feels the need to hide something he's afraid you'll recognize, isn't a non Kira option at all likely in your opinion?
juliets wrote:Spacedaisy, hopefully you'll be here in time to answer this question: do you think Zombrella and llama are right about Snowman?
llama, I'm feeling the same way though it's not because he mistakenly said I'm a Yotsuba. Don't you think he would fight harder if he were civvie?
lol boo, maybe so, maybe so.
I feel like he reads remarkably like I felt when I was on the verge of getting lynched. Frustrated, certain that the baddies will win, and a bit disgusted with the civs for not doing better. I think that is a civ reaction, not a baddie one.
Epignosis wrote:If llama is good, it means we exist in a universe in which multitasking llama can call out the first of two mafia while simultaneously calling out two civilians.
juliets wrote:boo what do you think of Epi this game?
I think he's using a lot of WIFOM. He isn't llama as far as we know, but then, maybe that means he's llama. We should lynch llama to find out for sure.
juliets wrote:boo what do you think of Epi this game?
I think he's using a lot of WIFOM. He isn't llama as far as we know, but then, maybe that means he's llama. We should lynch llama to find out for sure.
Wait, what? He isn't llama but maybe that means he's llama??
juliets wrote:boo what do you think of Epi this game?
I think he's using a lot of WIFOM. He isn't llama as far as we know, but then, maybe that means he's llama. We should lynch llama to find out for sure.
Wait, what? He isn't llama but maybe that means he's llama??
No, it means he could be llama. And if we lynch llama, the result will tell us if Epi is also actually llama. You know, like a llama where an Epi suit to pretend it isn't a llama?
juliets wrote:Spacedaisy, hopefully you'll be here in time to answer this question: do you think Zombrella and llama are right about Snowman?
llama, I'm feeling the same way though it's not because he mistakenly said I'm a Yotsuba. Don't you think he would fight harder if he were civvie?
lol boo, maybe so, maybe so.
I feel like he reads remarkably like I felt when I was on the verge of getting lynched. Frustrated, certain that the baddies will win, and a bit disgusted with the civs for not doing better. I think that is a civ reaction, not a baddie one.
I feel that too, but you can't ignore the fact that he hasn't followed any of his suspicions, and instead of helping find baddies, or at least suggesting them, he focuses on arguing, and posting posts no one can really get. I don't want to lynch a civ EPi, but he's not being helpful at all. And I get being too frustrated to care and feeling like pissing on everyone. But if feels like he's been like that on and off from the start of the game. I don't know what to do with him
FZ. wrote:There are over 24 hours to deadline. Why is everyone in a hurry to vote?
I would be inclined to trust Zombarella on Snowman, because I believe she is capable of knowing him better than anyone. Just like Epi knows when Elo is bad. It will suck if I turn out to be the one who prevented his lynch the first time, but if it gets a baddie lynched, I'll live with the shame.
Zombarella. While I get how one post by him can give you the bad vibe, could he also be Yotsuba or an indie role? Because if he isn't playing naturally, and feels the need to hide something he's afraid you'll recognize, isn't a non Kira option at all likely in your opinion?
I can't totally rule out that possibility (obviously) but I would be VERY surprised if that was the case. I don't think that he would act guilty if he were anything other than Kira or a Kira supporter.
Turnip Head wrote:I for one welcome our new zombie and llama overlords. May their reign be long, and may their cases always be on point.
If I accomplish nothing else this game, causing boo to have a public breakdown has made it all worthwhile.
linki: yeah, I get that, and I can't really blame people for feeling that way. Even if I don't agree.
Epignosis wrote:If llama is good, it means we exist in a universe in which multitasking llama can call out the first of two mafia while simultaneously calling out two civilians.
juliets wrote:Spacedaisy, hopefully you'll be here in time to answer this question: do you think Zombrella and llama are right about Snowman?
llama, I'm feeling the same way though it's not because he mistakenly said I'm a Yotsuba. Don't you think he would fight harder if he were civvie?
lol boo, maybe so, maybe so.
I feel like he reads remarkably like I felt when I was on the verge of getting lynched. Frustrated, certain that the baddies will win, and a bit disgusted with the civs for not doing better. I think that is a civ reaction, not a baddie one.
I feel that too, but you can't ignore the fact that he hasn't followed any of his suspicions, and instead of helping find baddies, or at least suggesting them, he focuses on arguing, and posting posts no one can really get. I don't want to lynch a civ EPi, but he's not being helpful at all. And I get being too frustrated to care and feeling like pissing on everyone. But if feels like he's been like that on and off from the start of the game. I don't know what to do with him
juliets wrote:Spacedaisy, hopefully you'll be here in time to answer this question: do you think Zombrella and llama are right about Snowman?
llama, I'm feeling the same way though it's not because he mistakenly said I'm a Yotsuba. Don't you think he would fight harder if he were civvie?
lol boo, maybe so, maybe so.
I feel like he reads remarkably like I felt when I was on the verge of getting lynched. Frustrated, certain that the baddies will win, and a bit disgusted with the civs for not doing better. I think that is a civ reaction, not a baddie one.
I feel that too, but you can't ignore the fact that he hasn't followed any of his suspicions, and instead of helping find baddies, or at least suggesting them, he focuses on arguing, and posting posts no one can really get. I don't want to lynch a civ EPi, but he's not being helpful at all. And I get being too frustrated to care and feeling like pissing on everyone. But if feels like he's been like that on and off from the start of the game. I don't know what to do with him
I don't find that out of character for him.
linki FZ:
Out of civ character or bad? If that's how he plays every game, god help him :P If you think he does that as a civ as well, than I guess I'll stick with trusting him for now.
By the way, how do the Kira get a DN? Do they go out looking for it in other players' hands? Or does MP give it to them if they manage to do something...like keep silent for 2 days without being lynched, or vote for the same person everyday, or be the first to vote. I don't know.
I've never seen Epi play like this as a civ. Maybe the LOST game, that's it. His "civs are doomed to lose" speech reminded me of something similar he said in Dr Who when he knew his megabaddieteam was gonna take over the game. He also refused to make cases or comment on people who turned out to be his teammates in that game. A civ Epi is a lot less cautious with his thoughts.
He's playing as brazen as he did in Donners, where it turned out he was bad. He also played the invincible card, there, which I don't see him doing it here. I've no read from Donner on the rest of his gameplay (the speculations, the profiling, the game projections).
OMG Zombra's avi. You two have a super fun marriage don't you? 
) the dissonance between saying you won't say anything about the three Yotsuba you profiled and then saying that juliets is a Yotsuba according to your profiling? That's the main thing that bugs me, tbh.
