Retrocausality Mafia - ENDGAME: A Reprieve in the Desert

[Kylemii]

and i want to talk about it cus it might be useful

[MacDougall]

Here are some succinct reads.

ColinIsCool - I have mind melded with him for a lot of this game. He would be my top town read if the game was played in isolation and I didn't have the town bloc shenanigans to consider.

Scotty - Gut town read even before Golden has effectively town confirmed him.

Turnip Head - He is extremely sig teammate compatible if you ignore his indie claim. He's either Mafia or Indie so he should be lynched next imo.

Epignosis - Exhibiting all the hallmarks of civ Epi but he still has my tinfoil.

lapluie - On face value the most likely remaining sig teammate. I just don't like the idea that it would be so easy.

Golden - Exhibiting all the hallmarks of civ Golden but he still has my tinfoil.

Kylemii - Reminds me a lot of U-Pick Kyle in that he is here, he's posting but the longer the game goes on and the more POE there is the closer he gets to the gallows.

SpaceDaisy - I have gone back and forth on Spacedaisy independent of Golden's clear. I would say if there is a person in the town bloc that is bad it is her. Earlier I found her compatible with sig as a teammate. My processor just cannot compute her. Her earlier emotional outbursts had me convinced she is a civ though.

Choutas/Sprityo - Completely up in the air. Angle shooting reasons make me believe he is a scum (and yes sprityo this is kind of a sucky position for you either way).

So in descending order from most to least trusted imo.

Scotty
Golden
Colin
Epi
Spacedaisy
Kyle
Sprityo
Lapluie

Turnip Head is group unto himself

[Kylemii]

useful with a little coordination i mean

[Kylemii]

yeah or i guess everyone can just go to bed in the middle of my thing, that's fine too

[MacDougall]

I am listening and waiting kyle.

[Kylemii]

i can pull people's last night actions into tonight, and make them happen now instead of then

[Kylemii]

without knowing other players roles it's kind of a shot in the dark what happens

[MacDougall]

Why did you inherit that role? What is your original role?

[Kylemii]

Why did you inherit that role? What is your original role?

town backup. the whole mechanical purpose of my role was to replace nutella's role if/when she died.

[MacDougall]

Okay and what did you do with it last night?

[Kylemii]

scotty I think? in hopes of doctoring whoever his night 1 target was again

[MacDougall]

So the role doesn't also undo the original action ergo if he doctored someone on night one you undoctor them thus potentially altering the timelines?

[Kylemii]

yeah it was scotty

[Golden]

So it’s a duplicate?

Does it work only on roles or item uses too? If it works on item uses as well as roles you could use it on me to enable me to watch myself again. People could make claims that I might be able to test.

[MacDougall]

I don't know how this makes sense. How can you unwatch what I did?

[Golden]

I don't know how this makes sense. How can you unwatch what I did?

Good point, but I’m all for causing paradox.

[Kylemii]

So the role doesn't also undo the original action ergo if he doctored someone on night one you undoctor them thus potentially altering the timelines?

yes, exactly. it undoes the original action and redoes it a phase later. cut and paste.

[Golden]

So the role doesn't also undo the original action ergo if he doctored someone on night one you undoctor them thus potentially altering the timelines?

yes, exactly. it undoes the original action and redoes it a phase later. cut and paste.

What about macs point. How can it, for example, undo what I’ve seen?

[Kylemii]

So it’s a duplicate?

Does it work only on roles or item uses too? If it works on item uses as well as roles you could use it on me to enable me to watch myself again. People could make claims that I might be able to test.

it says "actions" so don't see why that wouldn't work

[MacDougall]

I don't see much you can do with it right now to cause positive things. Maybe you can try to target the person who killed last night and attempt to make their kill occur tonight instead to see if you can ... I don't know bring back Quin for the previous day phase and ... he can I have no idea?

[MacDougall]

Is there any reason you couldn't target a vanished player?

[Turnip Head]

I picked Scotty

[MacDougall]

Target the suspected killer and then someone doc Quin?

[Kylemii]

So the role doesn't also undo the original action ergo if he doctored someone on night one you undoctor them thus potentially altering the timelines?

yes, exactly. it undoes the original action and redoes it a phase later. cut and paste.

What about macs point. How can it, for example, undo what I’ve seen?

it wouldn't, and i'm too sleepy to theorize the philosophy behind why it would be in a real time travel narrative, but basically this is a mafia game and basically it would be dumb as hell if speedchuck had to be like "hey btw some stuff randomly unhappened in the past plz pretend like you don't remember it"

[Kylemii]

I don't see much you can do with it right now to cause positive things. Maybe you can try to target the person who killed last night and attempt to make their kill occur tonight instead to see if you can ... I don't know bring back Quin for the previous day phase and ... he can I have no idea?

i've already been told that wouldn't work, directly targeting a killer does nothing.

[MacDougall]

I have had a little tinfoil theory since the start of the game that players become paradox police as the game unfolds. ie. the game started with one and that player sets in motion how/when others become police based on something to do with their role. I only base this on it being cool and I think kind of a logical thing to have done in the build.

[Golden]

If you pick me at least we’ll learn if it includes items and non role based actions.

[MacDougall]

Hence why the civ win con is "all the paradox police are vanished at the same time". It seems at face value to be a typical win con and vanish is just killed but I think it might also mean that players can become paradox police.

[Golden]

I have had a little tinfoil theory since the start of the game that players become paradox police as the game unfolds. ie. the game started with one and that player sets in motion how/when others become police based on something to do with their role. I only base this on it being cool and I think kind of a logical thing to have done in the build.

1) if this is not true please make this game
2) the game ends when ‘all paradox police have vanished’ so that seems like the game would end at the start
3) if your tinfoil theory is right this game would be insane and essentially unsolvable and only here for the ride.

[MacDougall]

How that might work is that they start the game by selecting the team and the night which they become paradox police. Or perhaps they can choose on the run who becomes paradox police and therefore you can use roles like Nutella/Kyle's to unmake paradox police.

[Golden]

Hence why the civ win con is "all the paradox police are vanished at the same time". It seems at face value to be a typical win con and vanish is just killed but I think it might also mean that players can become paradox police.

I just assumed it was framed that way because people can come back.

I also think sig wanting to use his ability early and expressly talking about it makes sense if this is true. Because he can’t use it if he’s last baddie left.

[Golden]

The other reason I think it’s unlikely is the specific references to flavour in the rules

[MacDougall]

I have had a little tinfoil theory since the start of the game that players become paradox police as the game unfolds. ie. the game started with one and that player sets in motion how/when others become police based on something to do with their role. I only base this on it being cool and I think kind of a logical thing to have done in the build.

1) if this is not true please make this game
2) the game ends when ‘all paradox police have vanished’ so that seems like the game would end at the start
3) if your tinfoil theory is right this game would be insane and essentially unsolvable and only here for the ride.

It would require the game to have started with at least one paradox police who is probably a master of time, Godfather and first time unlynchable or something of the sort. Perhaps even able to whisk away through time when the going got tough?

[MacDougall]

Hence why the civ win con is "all the paradox police are vanished at the same time". It seems at face value to be a typical win con and vanish is just killed but I think it might also mean that players can become paradox police.

I just assumed it was framed that way because people can come back.

I also think sig wanting to use his ability early and expressly talking about it makes sense if this is true. Because he can’t use it if he’s last baddie left.

The only player we have seen evidence of actually coming back is sig who caused it himself though.

[MacDougall]

Basically I guess I am saying this could be a time traveling cult leader themed game.

[Kylemii]

Is there any reason you couldn't target a vanished player?

if there's any game where that would be allowed it would probably be this one?

Target the suspected killer and then someone doc Quin?

or target the suspected yersterday killer and have that player also be targeted with a block today so the past kill would be blocked in the future and the past death would unhappen though that would take crazy luck

[MacDougall]

The other reason I think it’s unlikely is the specific references to flavour in the rules

Don't understand this?

[MacDougall]

Is there any reason you couldn't target a vanished player?

if there's any game where that would be allowed it would probably be this one?

Target the suspected killer and then someone doc Quin?

or target the suspected yersterday killer and have that player also be targeted with a block today so the past kill would be blocked in the future and the past death would unhappen though that would take crazy luck

You did say you can't affect the night kill so...

[MacDougall]

I feel like that role is designed to unmake paradox police. It feels right to me.

Go and binge Fringe and you will know what I am getting at lol.

[Golden]

The other reason I think it’s unlikely is the specific references to flavour in the rules

Don't understand this?

The baddies have fake flavour claims, the townies have ‘good’ time travel characters, the baddies have ‘bad’ ones is my assumption

[MacDougall]

I am also wondering if there are more than one thread. It is also a function that the theme of this game lends itself to.

[MacDougall]

The other reason I think it’s unlikely is the specific references to flavour in the rules

Don't understand this?

The baddies have fake flavour claims, the townies have ‘good’ time travel characters, the baddies have ‘bad’ ones is my assumption

I mean the entire premise is based on my own paranoia so it's probably wrong but this logic might only cover the original bad guy having a fake claim in that case.

[Golden]

I love fringe.

I do think it’s tinfoil at the moment but worth keeping an eye on.

[MacDougall]

And speedchuck if you didn't do any of this stuff I am speculating please do it for Retrocausality 2.

Spacedaisy you been watching the thread for ages what you doin?

[Golden]

The other reason I think it’s unlikely is the specific references to flavour in the rules

Don't understand this?

The baddies have fake flavour claims, the townies have ‘good’ time travel characters, the baddies have ‘bad’ ones is my assumption

I mean the entire premise is based on my own paranoia so it's probably wrong but this logic might only cover the original bad guy having a fake claim in that case.

This is exactly how the time travel game worked on RYM I think, I’d i recall correctly. Rundontwalk was the terminator and sole baddie at the start.

[Golden]

And speedchuck if you didn't do any of this stuff I am speculating please do it for Retrocausality 2.

Spacedaisy you been watching the thread for ages what you doin?

Probably reading my exchange with epi

[MacDougall]

I am approaching this game with a huge grain of salt that anything that appears to be the case should not be trusted. It is a speedchuck produced game about the fucking butterfly effect it's going to be nothing like it seems at face value.

[Golden]

Speedchuck also guaranteed no cults.

[MacDougall]

The other reason I think it’s unlikely is the specific references to flavour in the rules

Don't understand this?

The baddies have fake flavour claims, the townies have ‘good’ time travel characters, the baddies have ‘bad’ ones is my assumption

I mean the entire premise is based on my own paranoia so it's probably wrong but this logic might only cover the original bad guy having a fake claim in that case.

This is exactly how the time travel game worked on RYM I think, I’d i recall correctly. Rundontwalk was the terminator and sole baddie at the start.

Yeah I mean, when I rationalise why and how I would have produced a time travel based game I would almost certainly leave room for character states to change based on past occurrences. In this game I am yet to see evidence of it myself but I am pretty confident it's going to be a thing in this game and the most logical thing for it to be is for people's alignments to shift.

[Kylemii]

I can't effect the night kill directly just cus of how real life time works. speedchuck couldn't text quin tonight and be like hey guess what you didn't die after all, go ahead and post a bunch in the past during day 3 except not after that cus you're dead already

but if my targeting causes people to get unblocked or unprotected they can die or undie or i guess... hypothetically re-die?