Oblique Strategies - an Eno Mafia [ENDGAME]

[Snow Dog]

This is why plans don't work. Some people refuse to follow it. Hopefully we can all win before they screw it up for the rest of us.

[insertnamehere]

It isn't really "playing", is it? I mean, I like to win, but I like to work for it, too. I am missing how this is "fun", you know? So by volunteering I am essentially quitting a game I sm not really enjoying, while (hopefully) helping those who want an easy, clean win achieve it. It isn't for me, but everyone is different.

Not everyone likes mafia games that are set up in a non-standard way, or take crazy leaps with the concepts of the game. Fair enough, everyone has their own opinions. But insulting Llama and saying that people aren't "playing" the game, and how none of it is fun feels like a slap in the face to those who find the idea behind the game extremely interesting.

In games like these, the main enemy isn't the mafia, or the other players, but the game itself. Trying to figure out the rules and loopholes in the system is immensely entertaining for me personally, but I can see how some people could find it "not fun".

But then again, look at the description for this game.

This will be a somewhat unusual, conceptual game of three teams lasting six days and six nights.

If you wanted to play a standard vanilla game of mafia, you shouldn't of signed up in the first place, and maybe you shouldn't insult the game itself for not being something that you, personally, like.

I don't see how this is not "playing" or not "fun".

Llama more or less explicitly wrote the game so that this could happen, and making it happen is such an immense challenge, that getting it to work is, in my opinion, a fun objective that requires people to "play" the game, but maybe not in the normal way that you "play" a game of mafia.

So yeah. That's what I think.

[Bass_the_Clever]

going with the plan and voting s~v~s

[insertnamehere]

^^^ this
Plus I do not trust inh's motives.

Why would I lie? How has anything I said not been 100% logical and accurate based on the rules? If someone could tell me that, I'd love to respond to it. I'm getting tired of people saying that my "motives" are untrustworthy.

[Dom]

i think llama planned this tbh


because honestly who the hell are we supposed to lynch in this game anyway?

[insertnamehere]

Oh boy. Let me break this one down.

What has already been said sabie. Voting plans rarely actually work, They usually do for me. and this one feels a lot like "cheating the system"... in the event that it actually does work. Seriously? I wouldn't underestimate Llama's intelligence. He's one smart cookie. I don't see any way that Llama didn't write the entire game around the core concept that everyone could win the game if they all work together. The roles, the rules, everything matches up too perfectly for this to be unintentional.

And "animals revealing their team" feels a lot like outing. Once again, THIS IS PART OF THE GAME. THE RULES EXPLICITLY ALLOW THIS. This is not a standard game of mafia. We can out our own team. Idkk I don't like it at all and I don't plan on following it. Is the only pro for this that INH assures us that everyone will win? Read the rules. Read the roles. It makes actual logical sense. It's not just me telling people to do random things and saying that everyone will magically win.

I play to have fun, and if I win yea that's cool too, but I'd rather enjoy doing it and be challenged. Following this voting plan and winning isn't a win for me, I'm sorry.

I'll just quote what I said about SVS.

If you wanted to play a standard vanilla game of mafia, you shouldn't of signed up in the first place, and maybe you shouldn't insult the game itself for not being something that you, personally, like.

I don't see how this is not "playing" or not "fun".

Llama more or less explicitly wrote the game so that this could happen, and making it happen is such an immense challenge, that getting it to work is, in my opinion, a fun objective that requires people to "play" the game, but maybe not in the normal way that you "play" a game of mafia.

[insertnamehere]

Here is another point.

If all of this was unintentional, and "not the way the game was meant to be played", then why would we have the option to out our own team?

Why would anyone else do that unless they were following this plan?

[sabie12]

There's no clear good or bad teams in this particular game so I could see how working together would be okay in this particular game. I also don't see how anyone gains an unfair advantage from following the plan where everyone wins seeing as how there is no clear mafia team. I do understand people would like it to be a conventional game but it doesn't seem to have been planned that way as INH is saying.

[A Person]

Here is another point.

If all of this was unintentional, and "not the way the game was meant to be played", then why would we have the option to out our own team?

Why would anyone else do that unless they were following this plan?

I agree actually. The rules have an explicit exception for team claiming, I don't know if he wanted us to do what we are doing but it was intended to be part of the gameplay.

[triceratopzeuhl]

^^^ this
Plus I do not trust inh's motives.

What, pray tell, does pointing out an obvious game mechanic, one that stands up to scrutiny, have to do with motives? What motive do you think inh would have? To win? Because "the plan" does that, it makes him (and many other people) win.

I realize mafia is supposed to be a game about subterfuge and distrust but, well, frankly, some of you people seem to be distrusting just for the sake of it, with no real reason to.

[triceratopzeuhl]

I forgot to say earlier that I vote SVS, even if you don't support the plan it makes most sense to lynch people who will facilitate your own victory, ie people not on your team if you are fellas or gals

[Roxy]

Even though we are not supposed to use our abilities at night someone did and has completely affected the way I felt about inh.


I do not want another Animal outed until the Fellas and Gals have all been outed first - seems like a fair request if you want others to play along.

[Snow Dog]

Even though we are not supposed to use our abilities at night someone did and has completely affected the way I felt about inh.


I do not want another Animal outed until the Fellas and Gals have all been outed first - seems like a fair request if you want others to play along.

How do you know somebody used a night ability?

[Roxy]

Even though we are not supposed to use our abilities at night someone did and has completely affected the way I felt about inh.


I do not want another Animal outed until the Fellas and Gals have all been outed first - seems like a fair request if you want others to play along.

How do you know somebody used a night ability?

Because it affected me!

[insertnamehere]

Even though we are not supposed to use our abilities at night someone did and has completely affected the way I felt about inh.

Wat. I never said that nobody should use their abilities at night. I only said that the two killers shouldn't. They have the abilities that could completely ruin the plan. And it looks like neither of them did use their powers. So explain the logic behind that "completely affecting" the way you feel about me.

I do not want another Animal outed until the Fellas and Gals have all been outed first - seems like a fair request if you want others to play along.

Seriously? That would be hard to do, convincing every single person to reveal their team and potentially sabotage their own game. Even if every single person revealed what team they were on, and were actually honest, it would probably take a long time to accomplish. That's just not that great of an idea, and would sort of sabotage the entire plan. If someone didn't fully accept the plan, and refused to reveal their team, no Animals could be lynched, the entire plan would be ruined, and that person would have a massive advantage.

[Dom]

Even though we are not supposed to use our abilities at night someone did and has completely affected the way I felt about inh.


I do not want another Animal outed until the Fellas and Gals have all been outed first - seems like a fair request if you want others to play along.

I will admit to using a rather benign night ability for good reason.
I did not target you.

[A Person]

le quotin myself

Perhaps for the sake of solidarity one member of each of the other teams should team claim with an animal each day, so that when we reach the last day we know no one is lying.

[Roxy]

Even though we are not supposed to use our abilities at night someone did and has completely affected the way I felt about inh.

Wat. I never said that nobody should use their abilities at night. I only said that the two killers shouldn't. They have the abilities that could completely ruin the plan. And it looks like neither of them did use their powers. So explain the logic behind that "completely affecting" the way you feel about me.

I do not want another Animal outed until the Fellas and Gals have all been outed first - seems like a fair request if you want others to play along.

Seriously? That would be hard to do, convincing every single person to reveal their team and potentially sabotage their own game. Even if every single person revealed what team they were on, and were actually honest, it would probably take a long time to accomplish. That's just not that great of an idea, and would sort of sabotage the entire plan. If someone didn't fully accept the plan, and refused to reveal their team, no Animals could be lynched, the entire plan would be ruined, and that person would have a massive advantage.

So even though someone used what was obv an ability on me and now makes me think you have ulterior motives I should still "just play ball" like a good little poppet?
Not happening.

Why is it fair to ask all animals to out themselves but no other team out themselves?

Yeah I am not going to play along I am not an Animal but a Fella so please just lynch me anyway.

[triceratopzeuhl]

Even though we are not supposed to use our abilities at night someone did and has completely affected the way I felt about inh.


I do not want another Animal outed until the Fellas and Gals have all been outed first - seems like a fair request if you want others to play along.

I don't think it logically follows, though. Based on the win conditions, Fellas and Gals don't benefit from outing themselves. In fact, it's almost completely negative because:
1) they have to survive to win
2) on the off chance that a Fella or Gal dies, animals will want to balance the numbers and if they know what team you are, it makes you a target.

Whereas animals can win whether they are alive or dead, and the number of alive animals does not affect their win conditions.

The ONLY exception to the above is if animals refuse to out themselves, in which case we could determine who they are by process of elimination if the gals and fellas out themselves.

I believe my logic is sound.

[triceratopzeuhl]

and Rox, you still haven't explained what ulterior motives there could possibly be for INH. It is a game with win conditions. He is trying to win. What other motive would there be?

His strategy happens to support my team winning (regardless of whether he is on my team or not, as I have no clue) so I support it. I use measurable knowledge instead of vague feelings in my decision to support "the plan"

[A Person]

I don't think it logically follows, though. Based on the win conditions, Fellas and Gals don't benefit from outing themselves. In fact, it's almost completely negative because:
1) they have to survive to win
2) on the off chance that a Fella or Gal dies, animals will want to balance the numbers and if they know what team you are, it makes you a target.

It's ok for fellas to die because they can still win with their team, gals are the only ones who lose if they are dead.

[triceratopzeuhl]

Fair point, my overgeneralization was more based on the fact that their win chance is improved when more of them are alive

[nijuukyugou]

I will vote SVS to keep the strategy going.

(Sorry my posts are so short and few - this is hell week at work and I should be good and more participatory after tomorrow night )

[Epignosis]

I will vote SVS to keep the strategy going.

(Sorry my posts are so short and few - this is hell week at work and I should be good and more participatory after tomorrow night )

At least your PLC didn't decide to have a meeting...tomorrow morning at 7:45 am. On the day we have to stay until 8pm.

[Marmot]

Even though we are not supposed to use our abilities at night someone did and has completely affected the way I felt about inh.


I do not want another Animal outed until the Fellas and Gals have all been outed first - seems like a fair request if you want others to play along.

How do you know somebody used a night ability?

Because it affected me!

I was affected by numerous people as well.

MM89 for president of Tiger Mt!

[Marmot]

Even though we are not supposed to use our abilities at night someone did and has completely affected the way I felt about inh.


I do not want another Animal outed until the Fellas and Gals have all been outed first - seems like a fair request if you want others to play along.

I will admit to using a rather benign night ability for good reason.
I did not target you.

I take offense to that!

[triceratopzeuhl]

I will vote SVS to keep the strategy going.

(Sorry my posts are so short and few - this is hell week at work and I should be good and more participatory after tomorrow night )

At least your PLC didn't decide to have a meeting...tomorrow morning at 7:45 am. On the day we have to stay until 8pm.

Your... programmable logic controller?

[Epignosis]

I will vote SVS to keep the strategy going.

(Sorry my posts are so short and few - this is hell week at work and I should be good and more participatory after tomorrow night )

At least your PLC didn't decide to have a meeting...tomorrow morning at 7:45 am. On the day we have to stay until 8pm.

Your... programmable logic controller?

Everything in education has to have a three letter abbreviation. "PLC" is what used to be called a "teachers' meeting."

[S~V~S]

It isn't just education~ ever hear of a DCU? Directional control unit, aka steering wheel.

And I am at peace and ready to go. Ooooommmm.



We were on this path when MP outed himself, it was too late to turn back and discuss alternatives at that point. Rash, but it is what it is. Lets try and stay on this path, since we kinda have no choice at this point. Good Luck Animals

[Black Rock]

I see the non-supporters point. I really don't feel like I have to post in this game, I also feel like there hasn't been a lot of real talk. I also voted SVS, she has been outed, by her own means. At this point there is nothing else to be done about that.

[insertnamehere]

@LLAMA Can dead Fellas win if the living Fellas still outnumber the living Animals?

[S~V~S]

I hope this all works out and all you guys win

It wasn't for me.

Linki~ why does that matter? Hopefully people stick to your plan.

[thellama73]

Night 2

They finally reached the top of Tiger Mountain, lungs burning and gasping for breath.

“We made it!” said INH. “Yay cooperation!”

His exultation was drowned out, however, by the screams of S~V~S. Her eyes were bleeding profusely, someone having shoved some rather long needles into them. She toppled over backwards and fell down the mountain with a sound like thumbadumpadump.

“Supper’s ready!” said Metalmarsh.

S~V~S has been lynched. She was The Camel.
You have 24 hours to send in your night action, and to decide where to go next.

[thellama73]

Who next shall be sacrified?

Poll ended at Wed Dec 10, 2014 6:59:21 pm

insertnamehere
2
Roxy (8), Vompatti (10)
13%

fingersplints
0
No votes

Dominus
0
No votes

Black Rock
0
No votes

sabie12
0
No votes

Metalmarsh89
1
Metalmarsh89 (2)
6%

S~V~S
12
insertnamehere (3), Dom (4), triceratopzeuhl (5), S~V~S (6), Mongoose (7), Snow Dog (9), juliets (11), sabie12 (12), A Person (13), Bass_the_Clever (14), nijuukyugou (15), Black Rock (16)
75%

Ninja Blooper
0
No votes

Mongoose
0
No votes

A Person
0
No votes

Vompatti
0
No votes

Roxy
0
No votes

Bass Something Something Clever
0
No votes

DFaraday
0
No votes

Snow Dog
0
No votes

Juliets
0
No votes

triceratopzeuhl
0
No votes

Harold Budd (Host/Mod/Dead/NP)
1
thellama73 (1)
6%


Total votes : 16

[Black Rock]

Wow, good thing I did vote, I didn't realize the poll end time was so close.

[triceratopzeuhl]

Steady as she goes

[nijuukyugou]

I will vote SVS to keep the strategy going.

(Sorry my posts are so short and few - this is hell week at work and I should be good and more participatory after tomorrow night )

At least your PLC didn't decide to have a meeting...tomorrow morning at 7:45 am. On the day we have to stay until 8pm.

I think I'd like to go On Some Faraway Beach right about now...Or perhaps China My China.
...


Nah, On Some Faraway Beach. Could be in China, too, I suppose.

[Mongoose]

I picked the tree option because we did it at yoga tonight for a minute on each leg and also because I might be a bit of a treehugger. There's legit a photo of me hugging a tree on facebook.

[Vompatti]

Even though we are not supposed to use our abilities at night someone did and has completely affected the way I felt about inh.


I do not want another Animal outed until the Fellas and Gals have all been outed first - seems like a fair request if you want others to play along.

How do you know somebody used a night ability?

Because it affected me!

I suppose agnosticism no secret that I convergency used my night nullity and another supersaturate White Knight used Kate me Nick that very night. Here chorea the evidence: Mushrooming is considered a intercessory hobby viridescence compressibility gets out into piquet. Eating mushrooms adds Human and stoup to our food. But ductility blacxthorne too quiet meal, you investigating remember to blocking eat a mushroom unless honeytongued are 100% certain terribly the identification.

[Vompatti]

Also voted for miscite goodmannered by Bill the Lizard way.

[Roxy]

Even though we are not supposed to use our abilities at night someone did and has completely affected the way I felt about inh.


I do not want another Animal outed until the Fellas and Gals have all been outed first - seems like a fair request if you want others to play along.

How do you know somebody used a night ability?

Because it affected me!

I suppose agnosticism no secret that I convergency used my night nullity and another supersaturate White Knight used Kate me Nick that very night. Here chorea the evidence: Mushrooming is considered a intercessory hobby viridescence compressibility gets out into piquet. Eating mushrooms adds Human and stoup to our food. But ductility blacxthorne too quiet meal, you investigating remember to blocking eat a mushroom unless honeytongued are 100% certain terribly the identification.

Exactly!

[Roxy]

Btw I was just trying to create a slight bit of fun in the thread today bc not posting or talking has been quite boring.

I am actually an Animal and you may lynch me next. <3

Your welcome inh

[Mongoose]

Oh man, that would have been the baddie team to end all baddie teams. Sorry you didn't get to take over the world with lasers and lunch meat.

[Vompatti]

exenterate just want Rose Folding Raincoat I find it targeted that a non-animal has swartliness purple woman Elize34 nostology Illyria cirrocumulus just to make the game Ciubia fun for Distracted Jeff rest mismanage good guy. audibility heliogram INH Dark Leprechaun piquet and abatement he contriving be expugnable out blowhole nullity blocking Red King.

[Mongoose]

Hi sug, are you cursed?

[Vompatti]

Hi sug, are you cursed?

I Ridiculous Feather consomme!

[Mongoose]

Man, I love consomme!

Would you like to tell us anything?

[triceratopzeuhl]

I am actually an Animal and you may lynch me next. <3

Less than a day after you said you are a fella is not very convincing, especially since you also said you don't support the plan so I have to assume you intend to mess with it

[Vompatti]

Man, I love consomme!

Would you like to tell us anything?

Even honeytongued inky killed a man nobody still saltpeter me.

[triceratopzeuhl]

Yeah I am not going to play along I am not an Animal but a Fella so please just lynch me anyway.