The Syndicate

So we just eliminated one from the team that would have become 3 last night right? The Mafia team that just took a hit now have the gun. Retribution looms.

Enrique wrote:I believe you Sorsha.

TH would you like to come to Arkham with me?

Sure

Scotty wrote:

Bubbles wrote:soo i looked over matt's posts since he is the most voted right now, and i don't see it, don't think he is bad. suspicious of people who voted for him, gonna throw my own vote in for nero

Welcome to the thread, Bubbles.

This post and vote is shady as hell.

Bubbles is the player who put the vote 1 ahead of Matt. Scotty proceeded to very quickly attempt to cast doubt against Bubbles. I read it at the time as a possible Mafia scrambling to put a vote on Bubbles but since Nero was lynched it could very well be not only that but also an attempted defense of Nero. Lorab is the other that cast doubt on Bubbles, but Lorab proceeded to vote for Nero as well, at a point that in my mind rules her out as a teammate.

I saw some people on day 2 pointing out that Scotty sounded overconfident. Could that tone be because he WAS a civ on day 1?

What if the Wilgy is Robin theory is true, but Wilgy discovered that Scotty is a cop, who happened to be the one that was flipped on night 1 by Maroni?

Voted Wayne Enterprises.


Mac, I think this post-day conversation is fruitful. I agree that MP is looking a bit sus.



I want everyone to know, I am off vacation starting now. I have a lot on my plate and my presence will suffer. It might for the best anyway, given the tone I think I've contributed to. Back to student teaching it is!

Okay, crazy idea before I go to bed. I'm probably the worst person to suggest this but I think it's worth a shot.

What if, for one night, Mr. Freeze did us a solid? Block two of Nero's suspected teammates. If they don't kill tonight, it buys him time to find Montoya in a narrower pool of players the next night and make sure she doesn't die and makes him go cuckoo.

Unless of course he wants to go cuckoo in which case fuck him. I think it'd be really cool of u Mr. Fries I hope you consider this.

@Hosts: Does Mr. Freeze have to be alive to win? (before he goes postal)

also when i say suspected teammates i fucking hope you dont interpret that as me and th. MP and sabie I think would be ideal, but really it's down to you.

Brainstorming. If sabie/lovedelic was Nero's original teammate, then she didn't inherit the kill, the cop did. So in accordance to Mac's theory you could block MP and Scotty instead.

(this isn't that crazy, is it?)

Zebra is another who is a very good chance at being Maroni. Even moreso than MP. I will elaborate.

Blackgate, why not.

Nerolunar Posts Related to Zebra -

Nerolunar wrote:@Zebra

Why vote for anything randomly? I really believe its in our best interest to discuss or think about what effect our choice has on the game.

Why vote randomly yet still be suspicious of us who voted for what we actually think helps us? Can you please elaborate?

a2thezebra wrote:

Nerolunar wrote:@Zebra

Why vote for anything randomly? I really believe its in our best interest to discuss or think about what effect our choice has on the game.

Why vote randomly yet still be suspicious of us who voted for what we actually think helps us? Can you please elaborate?

It is not entirely a random vote. Like I said, I narrowed down the options by eliminating the ones which I am cautious of choosing to the ones that I don't think could have much of a bearing on the game, and picked randomly from those (although I do like docks). I want Day 1 to be as regular of a day as possible, where we look for who's the most suspicious and lynch them with no lynch switches, vote manipulation, basically as little foul play as we can hope for. I also believe its in our best interest to look at what options effect the game the most, and I haven't heard a good case for why Arkham Asylum would be in any way ideal.

Like I said, I am not suspicious of anyone in particular who voted for Arkham Asylum (even in Matt's case I'm suspicious of him for other more recent reasons), I am only suspicious of the option itself.

His first interaction with Zebra was a question that allowed Zebra to embark on a waffly explanation as to why she was finding Arkham voters suspicious while under fire. Perhaps she requested he ask this question of her. The interaction isn't THAT bad.

Nerolunar wrote:Yeah okay, thanks for explaining.
.

And he accepted her answer without much issue.

He then went on to make the following posts about Zebra.

Nerolunar wrote:Time for some reads, though mostly tone reading.
Zebra: A frustrated civvy. People tunneled on her waaay too much.

MovingPictures: Neutral/sligtly scum. Rubs me the wrong way how he went for Zebra. Doesn´t seem to me like there was much to deduce from her choice of poll option, yet he kinda pushed her for it. Seems really forced.

Note, he civ reads her AND defends her from MP at the same time. This is both a bad look for Zebra and good look for MP in terms of potential for teammates. Then he actually kinda slips next time he mentions her.

Nerolunar wrote:Im lacking scum reads on people right now. I don´t like how Metalmarsh instantly voted for Zebra, especially when we had a whole day ahead of us. Im still reading Zebra as slightly scummy, but Metals behavior still strikes me as odd. Elaborate on that please.

STILL reading her as scummy? He blatantly said she was a frustrated civ. Now he reads her as slightly scummy WHILE defending her. Did Zebra call him out on this at any stage? If not ... well that's damning.

Nerolunar wrote:

Nerolunar wrote: Im lacking scum reads on people right now. I don´t like how Metalmarsh instantly voted for Zebra, especially when we had a whole day ahead of us. Im still reading Zebra as slightly scummy, but Metals behavior still strikes me as odd. Elaborate on that please.

Metalmarsh please explain why you voted for Zebra at the beginning of Day 1. To me it felt very rushed, especially considering we had a whole day ahead of us to discuss.

Defender of Zebra's honour appears again.

Nerolunar wrote:My scum reads are Dharmahelper, Matt and Metalmarsh. Especially Metal as he has not explained his weird behavior of voting Zebra at the beginning of day 1. I have ased him that question a few times now and keeps ignoring it. If he doesn´t answer I might go ahead and vote him.

And again.

Nerolunar wrote:

a2thezebra wrote:

Nerolunar wrote:Im becoming more and more tempted to vote for Matt.

Because of his desperation to suspect you?

Partly. Enrique made a great case on him. I know for a fact that Im not the Joker, so Matt obviously targeted the real Joker but is trying to frame me, I think.

Linki I still don´t get why Im your top suspect?

Here Zebra fed him a line.

To be continued.

Zebra didn't call Nero out on that post. Zebra would have seen it no doubt, she control F searches her username.

What possible reason does she have for not calling out another player who makes a fraudulent scum read on her that was previously a civilian read with no trackable change of opinion.

Then we have.

a2thezebra wrote:

Dom wrote:The only ones that I'm not sure handled the conflict genuinely would be Nerolunar and DH, especially DH.

A slight ping on Nero, but full blown on DH. As most are want to do with casting mild dispersions against their own team they cast louder ones against someone else.

a2thezebra wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:

a2thezebra wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:

a2thezebra wrote: Thank you, that's an interesting selection of potential votes for the day. Is there anyone in that list that's especially likely to get your vote?

Right now it's Bea, BR or Nero, though I want to look at Glorfy to see what the hub bub is about re: the difference between his civ and baddie games.

I'm not sure about bea or BR but I would oppose a Nero or Glorfy lynch. I don't share anyone's suspicions of either of them.

If you could elaborate re: Nero that would help.

Perhaps you could call it WIFOM but I just don't see how he would be playing like this as a baddie fairly new to the game. And even if he's not new, he's simply yet to ping me. I've disagreed with a lot of what he's said but he's yet to come across to me as opportunistic or manipulative.

Compare to sig...

Says he hasn't pinged her, even though we know he had.. Also defended him with this post plus.

a2thezebra wrote:I am shocked that people are choosing to vote for Nerolunar - a player who none of us are very familiar with - over sig, who is clearly demonstrating his baddie meta moreso than his civ meta, and who has openly advocated what the host has said is not in our best interest, even voicing suspecion (and because of this, pressured) of those who didn't follow his lead. I don't see how anything Nerolunar has done tops this, especially since we are unfamiliar with his meta.

This one.

a2thezebra wrote:

DFaraday wrote:

a2thezebra wrote:I am shocked that people are choosing to vote for Nerolunar - a player who none of us are very familiar with - over sig, who is clearly demonstrating his baddie meta moreso than his civ meta, and who has openly advocated what the host has said is not in our best interest, even voicing suspecion (and because of this, pressured) of those who didn't follow his lead. I don't see how anything Nerolunar has done tops this, especially since we are unfamiliar with his meta.

I do have a bit of suspicion of Nero, but it seems like a lot of people are just jumping on him because it's convenient, which is seeming shady to me. If anything, Sig's recent comments are making me feel worse about him (I had no real opinion of him before).

I completely agree that people seem to be jumping on Nero out of convenience and I don't like that either one bit.

and this one.

a2thezebra wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:Why? Because I don't want to lynch Matt right now and Nero has a couple of votes.

What about sig?

So...

Nero defended Zebra from the big bads while she was being criticised on day 0 for her whackiness around the thing with the Arkham voters. Nero made a post with a scum read on Zebra out of nowhere after having a civilian read on her that Zebra didn't call him out on at all. Zebra of all people didn't call out the guy who made the weak scum read on her. Zebra.

Zebra said she had no ping on him at all while defending him with an admittedly wifom "new bad wouldn't play like this" (like what exactly). She was actively campaigning in his defense while he was going down.

Seems pretty obvious to me.

Well done, Mac. I'm lovin' it.

Sorry fixed the quote error.

Zebra didn't call Nero out on that post. Zebra would have seen it no doubt, she control F searches her username.

What possible reason does she have for not calling out another player who makes a fraudulent scum read on her that was previously a civilian read with no trackable change of opinion.

Then we have.

a2thezebra wrote:

Dom wrote:The only ones that I'm not sure handled the conflict genuinely would be Nerolunar and DH, especially DH.

A slight ping on Nero, but full blown on DH. As most are want to do with casting mild dispersions against their own team they cast louder ones against someone else.

a2thezebra wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:

a2thezebra wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:

a2thezebra wrote: Thank you, that's an interesting selection of potential votes for the day. Is there anyone in that list that's especially likely to get your vote?

Right now it's Bea, BR or Nero, though I want to look at Glorfy to see what the hub bub is about re: the difference between his civ and baddie games.

I'm not sure about bea or BR but I would oppose a Nero or Glorfy lynch. I don't share anyone's suspicions of either of them.

If you could elaborate re: Nero that would help.

Perhaps you could call it WIFOM but I just don't see how he would be playing like this as a baddie fairly new to the game. And even if he's not new, he's simply yet to ping me. I've disagreed with a lot of what he's said but he's yet to come across to me as opportunistic or manipulative.

Compare to sig...

Says he hasn't pinged her, even though we know he had.. Also defended him with this post plus.

a2thezebra wrote:I am shocked that people are choosing to vote for Nerolunar - a player who none of us are very familiar with - over sig, who is clearly demonstrating his baddie meta moreso than his civ meta, and who has openly advocated what the host has said is not in our best interest, even voicing suspecion (and because of this, pressured) of those who didn't follow his lead. I don't see how anything Nerolunar has done tops this, especially since we are unfamiliar with his meta.

This one.

a2thezebra wrote:

DFaraday wrote:

a2thezebra wrote:I am shocked that people are choosing to vote for Nerolunar - a player who none of us are very familiar with - over sig, who is clearly demonstrating his baddie meta moreso than his civ meta, and who has openly advocated what the host has said is not in our best interest, even voicing suspecion (and because of this, pressured) of those who didn't follow his lead. I don't see how anything Nerolunar has done tops this, especially since we are unfamiliar with his meta.

I do have a bit of suspicion of Nero, but it seems like a lot of people are just jumping on him because it's convenient, which is seeming shady to me. If anything, Sig's recent comments are making me feel worse about him (I had no real opinion of him before).

I completely agree that people seem to be jumping on Nero out of convenience and I don't like that either one bit.

and this one.

a2thezebra wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:Why? Because I don't want to lynch Matt right now and Nero has a couple of votes.

What about sig?

FUck kill me. I didn't. Whatever Zebra is bad.

Well done on Nero, everyone but particularly Matt.

sig wrote:@Golden what do you think about MP?

Now seems more town than he did in the early game, but I'd still rank him mild anti-town. Not for his Scotty stuff, though, I disagree intensely with that reason for voting him.

MacDougall wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:Correlation vs. Causation Juliets. I think it drastically reduces the theory that Wilgy was Robin, or at the very least drastically reduces the idea that the mafia figured out he could be Robin and killed him for it. As a result, I don't take any stock in "Scotty must be civ"

Yeah you have a point. I did question whether Wilgy was actually targeted by Two Face who was the one who was hit.

The wording that Wilgy actually used was "would not try to lynch him again". Interesting choice of words.

He then put him afterwards at blue in the rainbow, which clarified those words somewhat.

Black Rock wrote:

Golden wrote:This is insane. I don't know if something like Enrique's recent posting is genuine or forced, and it makes me paranoid either way.

I'm barely going to be around before deadline and definitely don't have time to keep up with all of the developments. I feel that it's kind of ironic that I'm in a position where I'm picking between Matt or Nero for my vote given they are in opposition to each other, but my vote comes down to 'do I trust Matt or not'.

I'm hoping to see at least a bit more to help make up my mind before deadline.

How would it be forced at this point of the day?

No idea, but that doesn't mean I'm not open to the possibility.

Black Rock wrote:

Golden wrote:This is insane. I don't know if something like Enrique's recent posting is genuine or forced, and it makes me paranoid either way.

I'm barely going to be around before deadline and definitely don't have time to keep up with all of the developments. I feel that it's kind of ironic that I'm in a position where I'm picking between Matt or Nero for my vote given they are in opposition to each other, but my vote comes down to 'do I trust Matt or not'.

I'm hoping to see at least a bit more to help make up my mind before deadline.

How would it be forced at this point of the day?

Though, subsequent to me making that post Enrique's behaviour seemed pretty non-forced.

Well, that's awesome that we got a Mafia - I suppose in a way I feel like I should have known after all that lurking...
I personally really like Magnus a great deal. I am his Team Captain in another competition in which both play off site and he did a magnificent job for our team there today! Please forgive me if I can't muster a whole lot of 'whooping it up' at his departure. He is really smart and I think he shows a great deal of potential and I too hope he comes back and plays here some more.

MacDougall wrote:The bubbles attack sounds like Mafia circling an easy person to put a throw away vote on tbh.

Yeah, I'm not a fan of the Bubbles suspicion either. I think she is town.

LoRab wrote:I've been waiting since yesterday for an answer from Bubbles. That's all I really want. I still cannot fathom a way that her post about Dom yesterday wasn't made up.

You have to admit, though, this thread is not exactly 'easy' to keep up with.

a2thezebra wrote:I'm not arguing that they are pro-town, I'm arguing that they are not all automatically anti-town just for being indys. Why is this concept always impossible for people to wrap their heads around?

I don't know. I think of indy's as potentially town-aligned, as usually there will be situations in which they can win with the town.

Enrique wrote:They're listed under "Arkham Asylum" they weren't independents until Golden declared them such on Day 0.

They ARE independents. By any measure of mafia game construction. There is absolutely no ambiguity about that fact. My declaration doesn't make a blind bit of difference. It's just a basic fact.

Enrique wrote:It's such a pointless convo really because we lynch whoever we get, but Zebra is just arbitrarily deciding when they are baddies and when they are indies.

No, zebra is deciding when they are MAFIA and when they are indys.

This isn't hard to understand.

Both mafia and indys can be 'baddies'. Just because an indy is bad does not make him mafia.

MacDougall wrote:You've pretty much got him night killed now anyway so you might as well out with it.

Oh, now look at this...

Both Scotty AND Matt are going to have to be nightkilled tonight. All this target painting, EVERYONE will die.

Or... you know, we solve he game and label so many people civilian on a day that the mafia can't kill them all.

This is exactly why I was saying the points on Scotty from last night are dumb. Now Matt is apparently the one being target painted. So Scotty is forgotten? If you do well enough to solve the game without the mafia being able to keep up, civs win.

The target painting argument is such a silly one. Encouraging civs to let people be lynched who they strongly believe are town, instead of stopping them being lynched in case they are nightkilled, just doesn't make any sense.

Also, a commendation of Mac for the effort he is putting in to trying to find teammates.

Golden wrote:

MacDougall wrote:You've pretty much got him night killed now anyway so you might as well out with it.

Oh, now look at this...

Both Scotty AND Matt are going to have to be nightkilled tonight. All this target painting, EVERYONE will die.

Or... you know, we solve he game and label so many people civilian on a day that the mafia can't kill them all.

This is exactly why I was saying the points on Scotty from last night are dumb. Now Matt is apparently the one being target painted. So Scotty is forgotten? If you do well enough to solve the game without the mafia being able to keep up, civs win.

The target painting argument is such a silly one. Encouraging civs to let people be lynched who they strongly believe are town, instead of stopping them being lynched in case they are nightkilled, just doesn't make any sense.

Um no you don't get it.

MacDougall wrote:

Golden wrote:

MacDougall wrote:You've pretty much got him night killed now anyway so you might as well out with it.

Oh, now look at this...

Both Scotty AND Matt are going to have to be nightkilled tonight. All this target painting, EVERYONE will die.

Or... you know, we solve he game and label so many people civilian on a day that the mafia can't kill them all.

This is exactly why I was saying the points on Scotty from last night are dumb. Now Matt is apparently the one being target painted. So Scotty is forgotten? If you do well enough to solve the game without the mafia being able to keep up, civs win.

The target painting argument is such a silly one. Encouraging civs to let people be lynched who they strongly believe are town, instead of stopping them being lynched in case they are nightkilled, just doesn't make any sense.

Um no you don't get it.

What is it that I don't get?

Sorry for quoting your post in there, my post was basically irrelevant to yours... it's just that your post triggered my thoughts there.

It's better that you don't tbh.

MacDougall wrote:It's better that you don't tbh.

Yeah, yeah, Mac knows best.

If nobody else has bothered to figure out Enrique's obvclue that's great. I imagine supposed bad guys have though. He is saying Matt is Batman.

Yay good job Bye Nero, hope to see you again soon.

Golden wrote:

MacDougall wrote:You've pretty much got him night killed now anyway so you might as well out with it.

Oh, now look at this...

Both Scotty AND Matt are going to have to be nightkilled tonight. All this target painting, EVERYONE will die.

Or... you know, we solve he game and label so many people civilian on a day that the mafia can't kill them all.

This is exactly why I was saying the points on Scotty from last night are dumb. Now Matt is apparently the one being target painted. So Scotty is forgotten? If you do well enough to solve the game without the mafia being able to keep up, civs win.

The target painting argument is such a silly one. Encouraging civs to let people be lynched who they strongly believe are town, instead of stopping them being lynched in case they are nightkilled, just doesn't make any sense.

I don't think anyone was planning on lynching him at this point? Not target painting =/= lynching civvies; rahter an extreme example?

And Mac, you would be amazed at how many people don't get those things.

RIH Tony Zucco. Nero, hope to see you in a game again soon!

a2thezebra wrote:

LoRab wrote: Also, you didn't answer my response to you that literally nothing I said about Bubbles in that one post was something I had done.

Sorry, I didn't know you wanted me to answer...a statement.

That's usually how conversation works. One person says something, the other responds, then the first person responds.

And you made an accusation of behavior. I completely refuted it. I thought the question of, "So, why were you lying about me? or did you really just misundersatnd my behavior?" was implied.

a2thezebra wrote:So Enrique you really think that Epi designed a game where HALF of the players are anti-town. You really think that.

linki - It's hard to tell with you, sig. I could easily see you actually trying to convince people that you were pinged by that. People have suspected me just for saying that I don't think indys are inherently anti-town in other games as well so it wouldn't be the first time for such horse shit. If it was sarcasm then put it in orange font next time please.

linki - See now you ARE serious. Which is it?

I think Epi, and LC for that matter, would absolutely design a game where half of the players are anti-town. Why do you think they wouldn't?

Golden wrote:

MacDougall wrote:The bubbles attack sounds like Mafia circling an easy person to put a throw away vote on tbh.

Yeah, I'm not a fan of the Bubbles suspicion either. I think she is town.

I'm more curious about her posts than truly suspicious of her. Because, especially that one post, doesn't really make sense.

Golden wrote:

LoRab wrote:I've been waiting since yesterday for an answer from Bubbles. That's all I really want. I still cannot fathom a way that her post about Dom yesterday wasn't made up.

You have to admit, though, this thread is not exactly 'easy' to keep up with.

I agree. However, if she isn't keeping up, then this post still confuses me:

Bubbles wrote:city hall sounds like an interesting location so i'm voting that. also sorry for missing the last vote and the lack of thread-related posts, i haven't been keeping up with the thread
but for now dom seems more vocal than usual

How does she know how vocal Dom is being if she hasn't been reading? And, I don't know about anyone else, but I don't think I've ever seen Dom not be vocal in a game, so that's also odd. But, the fact that she is able to comment on any player's relative participation doesn't make sense to me in the same post as someone saying they haven't been keeping up.

If anyone can explain it, please do!!!

I went to the General Hospital, by the way. See if they've had an interesting patients.

Just woke up glad to see the lynch result went well and we caught a baddie! I'm going to GCPD.

Golden wrote:

MacDougall wrote:You've pretty much got him night killed now anyway so you might as well out with it.

Oh, now look at this...

Both Scotty AND Matt are going to have to be nightkilled tonight. All this target painting, EVERYONE will die.

Or... you know, we solve he game and label so many people civilian on a day that the mafia can't kill them all.

This is exactly why I was saying the points on Scotty from last night are dumb. Now Matt is apparently the one being target painted. So Scotty is forgotten? If you do well enough to solve the game without the mafia being able to keep up, civs win.

The target painting argument is such a silly one. Encouraging civs to let people be lynched who they strongly believe are town, instead of stopping them being lynched in case they are nightkilled, just doesn't make any sense.

You are just as correct as Mac IMO. Making a big deal about how someone is obviously a civ - especially one of the most important ones - IS going to get them killed and there's not a lot to be done about it. However if you have reason to believe someone is an important civ then you probably shouldn't sit by and watch them get lynched. It's kind of a Catch-22 I guess.

Anyway, voting for the Asylum.

Also, me thinking its weird about Enrique changing his mind randomly doesn't automatically make me bad. I know I don't post much but Im just getting back into mafia from a year long break and I work full time.

DFaraday wrote:

MacDougall wrote:

sig wrote:I'm watching breaking bad, to bad I'm not a meth dealer in this game I could use the tips I learned from the show.

I'm working from home because my daughter is sick, but I'm actually watching WWE Fast Lane because yolo.

I watched it too! Stupid Reigns...

I can't even be bothered skimming through it because I know it'll be disappointing. No idea how they can salvage Mania with so many top guys injured and Reigns/HHH as the main event.

I've barely read anything since Page 55.
Who is going to save me from torturing myself by providing me cliffnotes on what has happened?

Don't look at me, I spent most of the weekend in bed clutching a box of Kleenex. I can say there was a comedy of errors that led to some target painting and a lynched baddie. The "OMG ARE THE INMATES INDIES OR BADDIES" has reappearted. But most of inbetween I have not caught up to either.

Being sick all weekend was rather boring, so I could use a night at a nightclub~Voting Fish Mooneys.

Golden wrote:

Enrique wrote:It's such a pointless convo really because we lynch whoever we get, but Zebra is just arbitrarily deciding when they are baddies and when they are indies.

No, zebra is deciding when they are MAFIA and when they are indys.

This isn't hard to understand.

Both mafia and indys can be 'baddies'. Just because an indy is bad does not make him mafia.

This post makes no sense, lol. "Indies" can be Mafia now? Jeesh. "Just because an indy is bad does not make him mafia." But... I don't understand, isn't that an argument against Zebra? When did I say anything like that?

You guys have a very loose definition of "facts."

WHO CARES THO

Enrique, cliffnotes, now. Thanks.

Typhoony wrote:Enrique, cliffnotes, now. Thanks.

I don't remember where you left off, but the current thing is basically

Matt got Joker cursed and made no sense so I thought he was confirmed bad pretty much and drove his lynch train really hard.
Matt formed a conspiracy theory that I was Nero's teammate based on me wanting to lynch M and not N (he previously thought N was the Riddler and I was just supposed to buy it I guess).
I realized Matt's role and turned back completely, encouraging a Nero or sig lynch.
sabie didn't care and voted Matt anyway for reasons. Nearly everyone else voted Nero out of faith in Matt.
Nero got lynched and turned out Mafia.
We're trying to find his teammates now.

Sounds like a plotline out of an Arkham Asylum TV-show.

Lol, people suspect me.