The Syndicate

I'm (re)caught up and I thank you for the Colin Cleanse, Sloonei.

linki

question for people familiar with scum juliets: does she talk with her teammates a lot in the thread?

juliets: how do you feel about colin?

juliets wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:12 pm
I have denied the similarities. I have no idea what you are talking about in World Asunder. What was said and what did I start doing? It seems like something you're just throwing out there knowing it can't be verified.

Not so at all. This reads like an accusation. Is it?

Here's what I'm talking about RE: A World Asunder:
G-man was the first to call you out Day 1 here:

G-Man wrote: ↑Sun Dec 09, 2018 11:07 pm Juliets spends most of her time responding to people’s thoughts and stances on other people without offering many of her own thoughts on anyone. I feel like this is normal but it’s also easy to fake. Her post count is high but it is, as she admits, all over the place. Is she being a sponge or just feigning a somewhat active appearance?

I followed that up with an ISO here. To paraphrase the key points made against you in this game, G-man and I were both concerned that you were spending a lot of time poking people with questions and responding to what others had to say, but you were not offering your own reads. You responded to these accusations by posting a big long list of reads the following day.

Compare that with this game. dunya kicked off the suspicion by saying that your behavior was " in direct contrast with her usual day 0 conduct where she digs in and asks people for elaborations or some such." You responded to this and similar criticisms by digging into [url=http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 38#p520538]things.[url]

Now this may be a little unfair as an accusation, since the premise is that your behavior was missing something it should have had, and if you're town your natural behavior should follow on its own. But the observations I've made are that A) in your most recent scum game, you responded to accusations by doing exactly what you were accused of not doing and B) in this game you've responded to accusations by doing exactly what you were accused of not doing. This does not need to mean you are bad, but it's something that I am taking note of.

i was so close to perfect formatting

dontcha just hate it when that happens?

juliets wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 6:33 pm I found a pushback I left out inadvertently:
- dunya calls me bad for not digging, Colin asks her what I could have elaborated on

I pushed back on dunya's suspicion of luna too.

Here are the Day 0 "good" or "civ" reads. I'm just reporting them, not judging them.

Game starts 3:40 pm Sunday

Dunya says MP is a civ after one post “Glad to be playing with ya’ll again” 6:36 pm

Dunya calls sloonei, Juliets, and mp town after a couple of posts (mp still at one) 7:23 pm

Sloonei calls nova town at 8:41 pm on day 0

Luna “so I’ve gathered dunya is town. That’s always a plus” 12:00 pm Monday Day 0

Luna at 12:15 pm Monday Day 0 “I’m adding nova to my town list”

Luna at 1:25 pm Monday Day 0 “dunya your town is shining so brightly it hurts” etc.

Sloonei 1:44 pm Monday Day 0 “nova and dunya are both town now”

Sloonei 5:11 pm adds Luna to the A game list (dunya is on there too but this is the first time he says Luna is good)

I have to take a break before I go on to day 1.

juliets in UPick asked a lot of questions, even in day 0, but i felt like the questions and answers she received were actually weighted ones. even after asking questions here and falling into her usual meta, my concern is that i still haven't felt that juliets has really used any of the feedback she's received to further develop her own opinions on behavior. it's a bit like cbob's "busywork" case in community.

but i do feel like i'm falling into tunneling territory here, so i will pull back for now and give juliets a chance.

so, let's talk about colin.

[url=http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/search ... sf=msgonly]i read colin's iso in ancient greence.[/ur] well, i skimmed the long posts. it's different than the colin of recent games (all of which have been town?). so i dunno. this snappy, short, kinda arrogantly-i'm-bad-at-mafiaing colin is not what i see in ancient greece, even when he was on his way to being lynched. i still think his read on me was a bit weird here, but i'll give him some town cred for today.

looking at nova next.

oh god, i'm sorry for the broken iso. it takes you to the same place tho.

dunya wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 6:48 pm juliets in UPick asked a lot of questions, even in day 0, but i felt like the questions and answers she received were actually weighted ones. even after asking questions here and falling into her usual meta, my concern is that i still haven't felt that juliets has really used any of the feedback she's received to further develop her own opinions on behavior. it's a bit like cbob's "busywork" case in community.

but i do feel like i'm falling into tunneling territory here, so i will pull back for now and give juliets a chance.

so, let's talk about colin.

This was the major point of my case in A World Asunder.

Mac really does get me.

As a reminder — when I’m scum I’m very careful and deliberate about what I do. When I roll town ... not so much. I do dumb shit all the time and I admit it. I think this is a verbatim defense I offered in Outpost, where I was a bumbling townie. I am pretty much always a bumbling townie these days.

I WILL reread the thread and give better thoughts. But for now I will say that I can understand Sloonei’s assessment of me and I give him town cred for it. If he’s scum he’s putting in a ton of roof-care into it.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 6:56 pm

dunya wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 6:48 pm juliets in UPick asked a lot of questions, even in day 0, but i felt like the questions and answers she received were actually weighted ones. even after asking questions here and falling into her usual meta, my concern is that i still haven't felt that juliets has really used any of the feedback she's received to further develop her own opinions on behavior. it's a bit like cbob's "busywork" case in community.

but i do feel like i'm falling into tunneling territory here, so i will pull back for now and give juliets a chance.

so, let's talk about colin.

This was the major point of my case in A World Asunder.

Sloonei, you are forgetting there were two teams in Asunder. I was asking questions there the same way I am asking questions here and have asked questions in other games where I was civ in the exact same way. Look at the many other games I have been civ and you will see the exact same behavior.

dunya, I ask questions for many reasons. It's how I assimilate date in these games. Other people's opinions help inform my opinions. Sometimes I ask questions because I'm suspicious but that is by no means the only reason I ask questions. You cannot see the process in my brain. Look at any other game where I've been a civ and tell me the difference you see there as opposed to here.

Ok I'm off to do Day 1 examples where people have called out civs.

Yes, someone else come out and play. Tomorrow is going to be a real poopkicker of a day, so I want to front load some discourse with you all.

juliets wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:13 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 6:56 pm

dunya wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 6:48 pm juliets in UPick asked a lot of questions, even in day 0, but i felt like the questions and answers she received were actually weighted ones. even after asking questions here and falling into her usual meta, my concern is that i still haven't felt that juliets has really used any of the feedback she's received to further develop her own opinions on behavior. it's a bit like cbob's "busywork" case in community.

but i do feel like i'm falling into tunneling territory here, so i will pull back for now and give juliets a chance.

so, let's talk about colin.

This was the major point of my case in A World Asunder.

Sloonei, you are forgetting there were two teams in Asunder. I was asking questions there the same way I am asking questions here and have asked questions in other games where I was civ in the exact same way. Look at the many other games I have been civ and you will see the exact same behavior.

dunya, I ask questions for many reasons. It's how I assimilate date in these games. Other people's opinions help inform my opinions. Sometimes I ask questions because I'm suspicious but that is by no means the only reason I ask questions. You cannot see the process in my brain. Look at any other game where I've been a civ and tell me the difference you see there as opposed to here.

I don’t think this is true. I had a case against you in a previous game that turned out to be correct. Right now it feels like you’re trying to argue that it was not. I don’t think this point is strictly relevant to this game, but I am concerned by your insistence upon it here.

Mongoose wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:25 pm Yes, someone else come out and play. Tomorrow is going to be a real poopkicker of a day, so I want to front load some discourse with you all.

I’ll also be gone for most of the day tomorrow. I get out of class a few minutes before the lynch deadline, so I’ll need most of my heavy lifting to happen today. But I also have more work to do in preparation for said class.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:32 pm

juliets wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:13 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 6:56 pm

dunya wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 6:48 pm juliets in UPick asked a lot of questions, even in day 0, but i felt like the questions and answers she received were actually weighted ones. even after asking questions here and falling into her usual meta, my concern is that i still haven't felt that juliets has really used any of the feedback she's received to further develop her own opinions on behavior. it's a bit like cbob's "busywork" case in community.

but i do feel like i'm falling into tunneling territory here, so i will pull back for now and give juliets a chance.

so, let's talk about colin.

This was the major point of my case in A World Asunder.

Sloonei, you are forgetting there were two teams in Asunder. I was asking questions there the same way I am asking questions here and have asked questions in other games where I was civ in the exact same way. Look at the many other games I have been civ and you will see the exact same behavior.

dunya, I ask questions for many reasons. It's how I assimilate date in these games. Other people's opinions help inform my opinions. Sometimes I ask questions because I'm suspicious but that is by no means the only reason I ask questions. You cannot see the process in my brain. Look at any other game where I've been a civ and tell me the difference you see there as opposed to here.

I don’t think this is true. I had a case against you in a previous game that turned out to be correct. Right now it feels like you’re trying to argue that it was not. I don’t think this point is strictly relevant to this game, but I am concerned by your insistence upon it here.

Whatever. This is just going around in circles, believe what you want.

Mongoose wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:22 pm

novaselinenever wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2019 8:29 pm I'll have to agree with Dunya also about Luna's read on her. That "Town shines brightly" is funny looking, and it looks like something right out of Jay's eloquent gut reads.

But since Jay can’t be a teammate, what do you think this means? (Ignore this please if you answered it later in the thread, I’ll see it then). Thanks!

Bump

Mongoose wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:55 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:48 pm

Mongoose wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:45 pm

novaselinenever wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:55 pm I'd like to hear more from Mongoose, so I'll wait for her to catch up

Thank you! If I missed anyone’s questions for me, please let me know. I tried to reply to anytime I was asked a question or mentioned in more than just passing.

You got any first impressions of any of these fine folks in here?

See my post above where I go through a few of these. I was reading this thread as fast as Cruella de Ville drives (so please forgive me if I ask or say something that the record would reflect), but I was kinda shocked to see the Colin vote. If the vote did end tonight instead of tomorrow, would you comfortable leaving it there?

[mention]Sloonei[/mention] bumping this since I am interested in the answer and also wanted to see if you agreed with my earlier answer to your question.

Here are the Day 1 callouts of who was civ up to Mac's request:

Nova calls for 2 town reads, 2 scum reads:
Sloonei reiterates luna an nova as town
Dunya says everyone is town except 2 of Julie’s, Mongoose, Colin, speed

Mac says he will follow dunya to heck (this may have been a joke as opposed to calling her out as town)

Sloonei leans town on Mac

Juliets says Sloonei reads town.

Colin thinks Sloonei is town based on his Day 0 reads.

Colin says he doesn’t have any suspects at the moment but doesn’t think Julie’s or sloonei are bad and Luna is “probably good”.

Mac calls Colin town.

Dunya reads Mac’s “I AM TOWN” as town.

Sloonei reads nova, dunya, Luna and Mac as town

Colin reads “probably town” on dunya, Julie’s; reads lean town on Luna, reads town on Sloonei

(The sequence here is a little confusing because he had just voted for dunya)

Juliet reads dunya, Mac, Mongoose and Sloonei as town.

(Mac changes his read of Colin to mafia)

Juliets - you can add that I read Sloonei as civ.

juliets wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:28 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:13 pm

juliets wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:09 pm You guys just go ahead and vote for me. Just don't say I didn't warn you. I'm fine dying on night 1 again.

Day 1 started a little over 3 hours ago. We’re all just throwing crap at the walls. Join us.

I think Colin or speed or maybe both are bad. Colin was here but didn't make posts to further the game. I gave speed a bye for not posting much yesterday but he's had plenty of time today. For the time being I'll put my vote on Colin since he's actually been here more than speed.

do you attribute low posting for scum behavior?

Mongoose wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:48 pm

Mongoose wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:22 pm

novaselinenever wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2019 8:29 pm I'll have to agree with Dunya also about Luna's read on her. That "Town shines brightly" is funny looking, and it looks like something right out of Jay's eloquent gut reads.

But since Jay can’t be a teammate, what do you think this means? (Ignore this please if you answered it later in the thread, I’ll see it then). Thanks!

Bump

i don't understand what you mean by "since jay can't be a teammate" - i don't see where that stems from? did nova call jay luna's teammate?

Mongoose wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:50 pm

Mongoose wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:55 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:48 pm

Mongoose wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:45 pm

novaselinenever wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:55 pm I'd like to hear more from Mongoose, so I'll wait for her to catch up

Thank you! If I missed anyone’s questions for me, please let me know. I tried to reply to anytime I was asked a question or mentioned in more than just passing.

You got any first impressions of any of these fine folks in here?

See my post above where I go through a few of these. I was reading this thread as fast as Cruella de Ville drives (so please forgive me if I ask or say something that the record would reflect), but I was kinda shocked to see the Colin vote. If the vote did end tonight instead of tomorrow, would you comfortable leaving it there?

@Sloonei bumping this since I am interested in the answer and also wanted to see if you agreed with my earlier answer to your question.

You note that nobody seems to be able to read Luna. Do you include yourself in that grouping?
Juliets and Colin are my primary suspects at this point, so I’d be interested to hear your thoughts on them. Nova is my town read that others don’t seem to agree with, so any input on him would also be appreciated.

did you see any resemblance of colin here to colin of ancient greece, sloonei? because i didn't.

welcome to the game, sprityo. dig in.

dunya wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:58 pm did you see any resemblance of colin here to colin of ancient greece, sloonei? because i didn't.

I didn’t look

dunya wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:54 pm

juliets wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:28 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:13 pm

juliets wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:09 pm You guys just go ahead and vote for me. Just don't say I didn't warn you. I'm fine dying on night 1 again.

Day 1 started a little over 3 hours ago. We’re all just throwing crap at the walls. Join us.

I think Colin or speed or maybe both are bad. Colin was here but didn't make posts to further the game. I gave speed a bye for not posting much yesterday but he's had plenty of time today. For the time being I'll put my vote on Colin since he's actually been here more than speed.

do you attribute low posting for scum behavior?

I played in or co-hosted several games in a row where low posters were scum and got away with it so I am certainly sensitized to it. In some cases though, like MP who usually posts a lot regardless of alignment, I attribute the low posting to rl reasons. Mongoose is another example, I knew from discord she was crazy busy so didn't suspect her for low posting. Mac is another example - his employee quit and the work got dumped on him. So it really depends on the person and the circumstances.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 9:01 pm

dunya wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:58 pm did you see any resemblance of colin here to colin of ancient greece, sloonei? because i didn't.

I didn’t look

well, we were his teammates. and i linked to it. i didn't remember much of that lynch day because i was travelling then, but appreciated the refresher. have a look.

juliets wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 9:02 pm

dunya wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:54 pm

juliets wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:28 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:13 pm

juliets wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:09 pm You guys just go ahead and vote for me. Just don't say I didn't warn you. I'm fine dying on night 1 again.

Day 1 started a little over 3 hours ago. We’re all just throwing crap at the walls. Join us.

I think Colin or speed or maybe both are bad. Colin was here but didn't make posts to further the game. I gave speed a bye for not posting much yesterday but he's had plenty of time today. For the time being I'll put my vote on Colin since he's actually been here more than speed.

do you attribute low posting for scum behavior?

I played in or co-hosted several games in a row where low posters were scum and got away with it so I am certainly sensitized to it. In some cases though, like MP who usually posts a lot regardless of alignment, I attribute the low posting to rl reasons. Mongoose is another example, I knew from discord she was crazy busy so didn't suspect her for low posting. Mac is another example - his employee quit and the work got dumped on him. So it really depends on the person and the circumstances.

true, but after watching community go down and some GG flips who were civs and low posters, i feel like people just aren't posting like they used to. colin is one of those people. you should check all his recent games.

checking all his "recent games" is a mammoth of a commitment. i didn't mean it literally.

but after i refreshed myself on how he conducts himself, i feel i'm leaning more town tbh.

dunya wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 9:08 pm checking all his "recent games" is a mammoth of a commitment. i didn't mean it literally.

but after i refreshed myself on how he conducts himself, i feel i'm leaning more town tbh.

lol I was just thinking, I'm exhausted from this game I don't think I have the energy to check all his recent games. I will refresh myself with a couple of them though.

sloonei: i went ahead and saw what you saw in nova. that authenticity in wanting to win games as "town" as you interpreted his post. but i also see the same style of hunting i witnessed in community. do you see a difference here?

juliets wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 9:10 pm

dunya wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 9:08 pm checking all his "recent games" is a mammoth of a commitment. i didn't mean it literally.

but after i refreshed myself on how he conducts himself, i feel i'm leaning more town tbh.

lol I was just thinking, I'm exhausted from this game I don't think I have the energy to check all his recent games. I will refresh myself with a couple of them though.

protip on feeling less exhausted: when mac asks you to do his homework, just say NO U. gets him every time!

dunya wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:55 pm

Mongoose wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:48 pm

Mongoose wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:22 pm

novaselinenever wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2019 8:29 pm I'll have to agree with Dunya also about Luna's read on her. That "Town shines brightly" is funny looking, and it looks like something right out of Jay's eloquent gut reads.

But since Jay can’t be a teammate, what do you think this means? (Ignore this please if you answered it later in the thread, I’ll see it then). Thanks!

Bump

i don't understand what you mean by "since jay can't be a teammate" - i don't see where that stems from? did nova call jay luna's teammate?

[mention]dunya[/mention] Honestly, that's why I wanted more analysis from Nova because the assertion that her language was derived from Jay would otherwise make me think Nova was positing that Jay was her teammate (said something scrumptious in BTSC that you then cannibalize because it just sounded so good). Anyway, that's all I meant.

what i got from it personally is that luna is trying to impersonate jay's "gut reads" since she referenced to trying his strategy in one of her first posts.

i mean, what i got from nova's post.

@Sloonei

In RE: The State v. Luna: Hung Jury. Yes, I do think I would lump myself in with folks that can't read her (this happened in another game recently), but the jury is still out. I'd like to see a little more.

In RE: The State v. Colin: 50/50 - I felt pretty good about him, so I asked for some more details once I saw two of you had voted him, and then you both had answers that were thoughtful and thought-out, so that's why I'm less sure now.

In RE: The State v. Juliets: Nah. While I understand the case folks were making on her, it seemed like a mountain of molehole. An allegation that she uncharacteristically wasn't here enough but when she did, she didn't draw out the right posts or ask the right questions. I'm not looking there yet.


linki - thank you for that dunya

Also, welcome to spirityo!

dunya wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 9:08 pm checking all his "recent games" is a mammoth of a commitment. i didn't mean it literally.

but after i refreshed myself on how he conducts himself, i feel i'm leaning more town tbh.

so yeah you're right, in Community he only had 3 pages of posts for 5 days - he lasted till the end. I'll look at one more game just to make sure but if it lines up like Community I will likely not vote for him.

[mention]sprityo[/mention] welcome to the game! I can tell you from experience the thread reads quickly - I've read it twice just this evening - so I'm hoping you will be able to contribute soon.

dunya wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 9:11 pm sloonei: i went ahead and saw what you saw in nova. that authenticity in wanting to win games as "town" as you interpreted his post. but i also see the same style of hunting i witnessed in community. do you see a difference here?

Sure, there might be similarities. But I think he also looks like he did in Shockheaded Peter. I don’t want to over-rely on past games. I brought up a past performance for juliets because I was reminded of one very distinct parallel. But I don’t think we should try to trace everybody’s present performance back to a past one. This is a new game, and in this game I think nova entered with a pseudo-townslip. He’s given me no reason to doubt that so far.

[VOTE: sprityo] aubergine aka speedchuck, because I want him to know I’m gonna be judging his entry.

Sincere Question: Is it typical these days to scroll through the Archives for historical comparison purposes? Just seems like a lot (not a criticism or suggestion you shouldn't do it) and wondered if it's an atypical amount.

Ew, per Sloonei's post, Colin really doesn't look good.

Mongoose wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 9:57 pm Sincere Question: Is it typical these days to scroll through the Archives for historical comparison purposes? Just seems like a lot (not a criticism or suggestion you shouldn't do it) and wondered if it's an atypical amount.

I do it if I'm not familiar with a player or if someone mentions that some ones behavior is showing a pattern but I don't do it a lot. You're right, it takes time and I don't always have that.

Also what's with the speedchuck votes? The guy hasn't even been able to play, and is pending replacement.