The Syndicate

Why are yoi voting for draconusgoose?

Sloonei wrote:Why are yoi voting for draconusgoose?

Turnips, not bad yo. I don't like that I'm at the bottom of your list.

Llama's surely interesting, tho. Hrm.

Btw, way to be Zeebs! Let's get that ika! Also, don't like that I'm orange on your list.

Silverwolf wrote:

Golden wrote:

Silverwolf wrote:You left out some key points there Golden by implying I had nothing to do with the Fuzz lynch. Why are you trying to discredit me? I wasn't the only one involved with it but I called the vote out as bad first and also helped pushed that lynch very hard and even laid out some key points to make it happen. The fact that you are implying I had nothing to do with it by selective quoting is starting to make me not like you again.

What key points did I leave out?

I'm not trying to discredit you. Who do you think made the case on Fuzz. Was it you or SVS?

I neither tried to imply you had nothing to do with it, nor did I say it, and it's the complete opposite of the truth. However, to say it was your case that SVS jumped on is not true. SVS made the case. You didn't expect Fuzz to actually go down immediately and only got on board when you realised it was something that could actually happen. You had plenty to do with it. But not the thing that Quin is saying you had to do with it.

Are you looking at the full context? Are you arguing that SVS is bad and jumped on your case to make herself look better, as Quin is suggesting?

I have a strong townread on S-V-S and I'm sure she was the one who pushed it primarily. I'll reread it for context again. I just always get alarmed when anyone tries to discredit a person who is being townread because I can see that being more of a scum agenda than town. But if it's in the context of trying to prove a point Quin was making as wrong, that's a little different.

You were the one who pointed out Fuzz' post as being so bad, and I searched his posts for prior opinions on Fuzz. I think we both were right on top of it, tbh. Fuzz had NO votes when you pointed that out, iirc. And Fuzz seemed pretty shocked and was getting pretty defensive. I don't think anyone threw him under the bus, and I don't see how anyone who read his posts during the last hour of Day 2 can think so.
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With extra votes on the table, we should either have a strong second place suspect and keep that person & sig (who unless there is an amazing revelation, is probably going to be the person with the most votes) and keep them fairly close OR we should spread the other votes out as much as possible so as many as 6 extra votes won't make a difference.

I can see the merits of doing it either way, but I think we should go forward assuming that the baddies scooped up as many of those as possible. Tomorrow civs, and especially civ BTS groups, should try to pick up as many of those as they can.

Ebwop, prior opinions on ika.

Sloonei wrote:Why are people voting for Draconusgoose?

Silverwolf wrote:Oh I switched my vote to Draconus

I expect sig to be the lynch today but I want to voice my opinions on others I'm suspecting and the fact that Draconus has done very little since replacing reminds me of how myself and others I've seen react to replacing into a scum slot. Be mostly inactive and then just post the bare minimum without really saying much.

I still suspect Soneji for posts that don't really say anything at all and because I think scum are laying low this game while town attacks each other, but I don't see the point of sitting on that vote by myself right now.

Draconus hasn't done much of anything since replacing. Soneji hasn't done anything all game. They both need to be pushed eventually if we are gonna win this. And if they continue, then lynched IMO.

Quin wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:

Quin wrote:

Nerolunar wrote:I believe we should lynch Sig.

Right now lynching Sig is almost the only thing we are talking about. Are we going to talk about him next cycle too? It feels like we are not getting anywhere, and I would much rather get the paranoia out of the way asap. I think we can have a more clear approach to things once we are not as occupied with lynching Sig.

Will keeping Sig alive solve any problems? In my opinion, no. Rather, if he flips bad we can probably clear Golden and that would be really beneficial.

Let's talk about this post.

To me, it screams 'Look, it doesn't matter if sig is civ or scum. We should just lynch him because then people will stop talking about whether he's civ or scum.'

Well I can't say I disagree with him. This is getting old and no one is changing their mind. Some people refuse to move on until this happens.

I think that is extremely dangerous territory. If/When sig is lynched I think it's pretty clear that I'll be next. There are arguments that I'm scum regardless of his alignment. Should we just lynch me tomorrow so people will stop talking about me?

Personally I'd go after gleam next.

Golden wrote:I don't really have a 'problem' with it either - but I'm damn well going to push you until I feel I've gotten to the bottom of it and whether or not it is genuine.

What do you think of a gleam vote? I think Fuzz voting ika might have been to save gleam.

After reading SW's latest post about Ika (I'm catching up right now), I'm starting to consider the save might have been for Ika.

thellama73 wrote:Why aren't people voting Quin when he basically admitted to being bad?

Because people don't do that. Mafia 101.

thellama73 wrote:I'm starting to feel like I'm not being taken seriously.

Can't help it, I always imagine a guy with a fez and a curly mustache saying those things you say.

thellama73 wrote:In all seriousness, I see this all the time, and I regard it as a legitimate baddie catching technique. I ask someone if they are bad, and instead of saying "no" they make a joke out of it.

Why? I think there are still an awful lot of people who are subconsciously uncomfortable lying in the face of a very direct question, so they dodge instead. They don't mean to, but it is their instinct. I trust my methods, and it's why I'm voting Quin today.

Fair enough, didn't see that (still catching up).

I don't trust your methods though so I'm staying away.

Silverwolf wrote:

Sloonei wrote:Why are people voting for Draconusgoose?

Silverwolf wrote:Oh I switched my vote to Draconus

I expect sig to be the lynch today but I want to voice my opinions on others I'm suspecting and the fact that Draconus has done very little since replacing reminds me of how myself and others I've seen react to replacing into a scum slot. Be mostly inactive and then just post the bare minimum without really saying much.

I still suspect Soneji for posts that don't really say anything at all and because I think scum are laying low this game while town attacks each other, but I don't see the point of sitting on that vote by myself right now.

Draconus hasn't done much of anything since replacing. Soneji hasn't done anything all game. They both need to be pushed eventually if we are gonna win this. And if they continue, then lynched IMO.

Your pressure doesn't bother aapje at all. Besides, Alice just started playing.

moresque are your thoughts on The Cyber Controller viands votes? Thoughts overthwart thanks?

Golden wrote:Seriously, I'm not criticising or discrediting silverwolf in any way.

If silverwolf believes she made the case and SVS followed it, she is welcome to give that take.

I think silverwolf had a suspicion, and SVS then went and ISO'd Fuzz and made a case.

This is no more discrediting silverwolf as it is anyone else who is not named SVS for not being the one who made the case.

SIlverwolf pointed out Fuzz's suspicious post. You put him in the list of possible CFD lynches. SVS elaborated on the suspicion and explained the case. You posted again to say you were fine with lynching him. Sloonei started the wagon. You followed it.

That's what happened. It's a little more complicated than the version you're telling.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote:

thellama73 wrote:In all seriousness, I see this all the time, and I regard it as a legitimate baddie catching technique. I ask someone if they are bad, and instead of saying "no" they make a joke out of it.

Why? I think there are still an awful lot of people who are subconsciously uncomfortable lying in the face of a very direct question, so they dodge instead. They don't mean to, but it is their instinct. I trust my methods, and it's why I'm voting Quin today.

Fair enough, didn't see that (still catching up).

I don't trust your methods though so I'm staying away.

Somewhat similarly to how Quin chose to stay away from a vote for Fuzz? He had already voted, and it seems to me that the purpose of those posts was not so much to explain his own vote processes as it was to discourage others from making that vote as well.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote:

Golden wrote:Seriously, I'm not criticising or discrediting silverwolf in any way.

If silverwolf believes she made the case and SVS followed it, she is welcome to give that take.

I think silverwolf had a suspicion, and SVS then went and ISO'd Fuzz and made a case.

This is no more discrediting silverwolf as it is anyone else who is not named SVS for not being the one who made the case.

SIlverwolf pointed out Fuzz's suspicious post. You put him in the list of possible CFD lynches. SVS elaborated on the suspicion and explained the case. You posted again to say you were fine with lynching him. Sloonei started the wagon. You followed it.

That's what happened. It's a little more complicated than the version you're telling.

The streamlined version and the complex version are pretty much the same thing. Quibbling over minutiae doesn't change the basic facts. There are two people I will NOT vote for at any time in this game, Silver & Golden (heh heh) and a third, Sloonei, I am very unlikely to vote for.

I don't see how anyone can look at the last hour of Day 2 and say lines were not clearly drawn. The baddies did not expect a Fuzz lynch since they had more votes on ika, so they were setting themselves up for the next day and felt safe being a bit more open about it, imo.

I agree Quin looks worse every time he posts an OMGUS response.

He's not in my list of priorities right now.

Like I said, a Sig bad lynch would be a game changer. He is currently dividing the player in a "pro-Sig" and an "anti-Sig" camps.

I'm changing my vote to Quin. Somehow Quin has started looking worse than Sig.

I still am a pro TH lynch. The one thing that has not changed my mind, is he has not said anything that he regularly says to me when he is a civ.

Black Rock wrote:I still am a pro TH lynch. The one thing that has not changed my mind, is he has not said anything that he regularly says to me when he is a civ.

I'm ignoring you because, at the moment, I'm not sure I believe that you actually suspect me. And if you really do then fine. I'm civ and eventually you'll see that or you won't, I'm not sweating it.

Yeah, BR has been quietly hanging out and just occasionally throwing a vague suspicion at the Turnip. Consider this me officially Calling Her Out on it. Shit is getting real.

I just want to pop in and say I haven't caught up at all. Take that how you will, but I'll probably be around for the last few daylight hours tomorrow.

Can I get replaced and come back later when there are only a few players left? I kid.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote:

thellama73 wrote:Why aren't people voting Quin when he basically admitted to being bad?

Because people don't do that. Mafia 101.

Yeah they do. I've seen it.

Black Rock is starting to bug me.

She is always a slow starter, and LC is a big touchstone for her in games, I think. Losing him so early may have helped her lose her footing so far, but she seems pretty much straight up so far to me.

thellama73 wrote:

Dragon D. Luffy wrote:

thellama73 wrote:Why aren't people voting Quin when he basically admitted to being bad?

Because people don't do that. Mafia 101.

Yeah they do. I've seen it.

I've seen it before where scum will admit it in the context of being sarcastic to try to get townread for it. I'm at the point where I feel there isn't much I can say scum would never do.

S~V~S wrote:She is always a slow starter, and LC is a big touchstone for her in games, I think. Losing him so early may have helped her lose her footing so far, but she seems pretty much straight up so far to me.

I'll take your word for it. I know losing ika would be a little unsettling for me if he was town as well.

Silverwolf wrote:

S~V~S wrote:She is always a slow starter, and LC is a big touchstone for her in games, I think. Losing him so early may have helped her lose her footing so far, but she seems pretty much straight up so far to me.

I'll take your word for it. I know losing ika would be a little unsettling for me if he was town as well.

BR can be a hard read. So far focusing on the one thing she tends to have a good grasp of, which is TH, without trying to convince anyone else, seems pretty par for the course for her. If we get a few more days in and she is still being wishy washy, I might be more worried.

Silverwolf wrote:

thellama73 wrote:

Dragon D. Luffy wrote:

thellama73 wrote:Why aren't people voting Quin when he basically admitted to being bad?

Because people don't do that. Mafia 101.

Yeah they do. I've seen it.

I've seen it before where scum will admit it in the context of being sarcastic to try to get townread for it. I'm at the point where I feel there isn't much I can say scum would never do.

"Never" is a strong word, but most scum players won't intentionally admit they are scum. The tells are more subtle.

Of course llama's theory that people will unsconsciously joke about it falls in the "subtle" department, which I have no trouble believing in.

My work is conflicting with the EoD so I'm going to drop my vote in real quick and run. I don't know what the current state of the votes are or even the discussion because I'm like four pages behind. Black Rock. You were on my list as a potential suspect because of the laying low during the hooplah of Day 2. I said that I thought the low posters during that time had to be hiding some bad guys. And your behavior during this day has been very hit and run.

Currently catching up...

I should be here this afternoon if anything weird happens again. So far, I'm leaving my vote on Sig. I think I'd be able to consider Gleam next go 'round.


Sad I missed the Silver & ika show though. I wonder if he says he has to poo at any point during the show, and then pantomimes washing his hands after.

agleaminranks wrote:My work is conflicting with the EoD so I'm going to drop my vote in real quick and run. I don't know what the current state of the votes are or even the discussion because I'm like four pages behind. Black Rock. You were on my list as a potential suspect because of the laying low during the hooplah of Day 2. I said that I thought the low posters during that time had to be hiding some bad guys. And your behavior during this day has been very hit and run.

I know, right?

Turnip Head wrote:

agleaminranks wrote:My work is conflicting with the EoD so I'm going to drop my vote in real quick and run. I don't know what the current state of the votes are or even the discussion because I'm like four pages behind. Black Rock. You were on my list as a potential suspect because of the laying low during the hooplah of Day 2. I said that I thought the low posters during that time had to be hiding some bad guys. And your behavior during this day has been very hit and run.

Has Gleam made any mention of Black Rock as a suspect before now? Or is he just going with a name that's currently in the discussion?

Whoops my vote suddenly slipped and now it's on agleaminranks.

Sloonei wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:

agleaminranks wrote:My work is conflicting with the EoD so I'm going to drop my vote in real quick and run. I don't know what the current state of the votes are or even the discussion because I'm like four pages behind. Black Rock. You were on my list as a potential suspect because of the laying low during the hooplah of Day 2. I said that I thought the low posters during that time had to be hiding some bad guys. And your behavior during this day has been very hit and run.

Has Gleam made any mention of Black Rock as a suspect before now? Or is he just going with a name that's currently in the discussion?

No he has not mentioned Black Rock at all until now. And I just double checked.

Because I'm sure we can all agree that bussing is very much a real possibility for the scum strategy on Day 2, but we (some of us) may have been looking at in the wrong place. My one and only reservation about gleam was and has been how quickly the bandwagon formed against him that day but that could very easily have been because 1 or 2 cops wanted to bus him. He was on the chopping block after Day 1 anyway, and some of the cops might have thought it would be in their best interest to just go along with the growing sentiment to lynch him. Golden has been saying for a while that bussing only makes sense in certain situations, such as one teammate being in danger of being voted out anyway. Scums will cut their losses and hop on a bandwagon to cut out one of their teammates. We had two rapid bandwagons: one at the start of the day and one at the end. I'd say Gleam looks like a more realistic bussing option than RadicalFuzz.

So some of their teammates (sig, quin, enrique) were blindsided and didn't know how to respond for a little while. Who were all the people on that early gleam wagon?

linki: Thank you indi. Anyone for a not-so-last-minute bandwagon on gleam?

I did a quick double check too. He hasn't mentioned Black Rock by name but he did mention this earlier:

agleaminranks wrote:I still need to examine the other top candidates for today's lynch but other than that, I feel like I'm still reading civ on just about everyone that's posting regularly. I really don't know what else to think. This game is getting complicated.

But I think the most suspicious would be the people that sat out the Day 2 discussion when attention was directed elsewhere.

Which is sort of how he explained his BR vote.

I think I'll reread him.

The big thing that stood out to me from the CFD was that, of the 3 wagons that existed before Fuzz got blitzed, the Gleam wagon was absorbed by the Fuzz wagon, the ika wagon grew, and the Epignosis wagon stayed stagnant.

Sloonei wrote:linki: Thank you indi. Anyone for a not-so-last-minute bandwagon on gleam?

As much as I believe it just pushes sig conversation tomorrow, I actually wouldn't mind doing this. The Fuzz vote on ika rather than gleam after suspecting gleam and saying he's stay away from the ika/silverwolf thing has always looked like a potential gleam save to me.

I was in both gleam wagons, fyi.

Don't remember who else. I guess SW, Ika, Golden and Scotty have been pushing him for a while too, iirc.

Golden wrote:

Sloonei wrote:linki: Thank you indi. Anyone for a not-so-last-minute bandwagon on gleam?

As much as I believe it just pushes sig conversation tomorrow, I actually wouldn't mind doing this. The Fuzz vote on ika rather than gleam after suspecting gleam and saying he's stay away from the ika/silverwolf thing has always looked like a potential gleam save to me.

Yeah, I can see that. On the other hand, ika could be bad and Fuzz was hoping for some sweet sweet cred by breaking the tie.

As of this very moment, I prefer to leave my vote on sig (with my own healthy dose of mafia paranoia, of course! lol), but I like Gleam as a 2nd. I will keep my mind open though, especially since I've started getting real scum vibes from him the past I don't know how many days, and nothing's shaken that either.


Linki~ Interesting find there, TH. Yes, after I did my previous re-read my thoughts on him started leaning scum. A new re-read might be a good idea, I have a feeling the leaning would only get stronger. Especially after the past few days.

Even more linki!!

Even more, just let me submit this post so I can catch up!

Dragon D. Luffy wrote:I was in both gleam wagons, fyi.

Don't remember who else. I guess SW, Ika, Golden and Scotty have been pushing him for a while too, iirc.

I think I remember Silver and SVS both being on the original Gleam wagon but I feel good about both of their intentions.

Golden wrote:

Sloonei wrote:linki: Thank you indi. Anyone for a not-so-last-minute bandwagon on gleam?

As much as I believe it just pushes sig conversation tomorrow, I actually wouldn't mind doing this. The Fuzz vote on ika rather than gleam after suspecting gleam and saying he's stay away from the ika/silverwolf thing has always looked like a potential gleam save to me.

I wouldn't mind more time to talk sig at this point. I am still feeling confident about him but I really was reading him with too much a bias earlier. That is only the case for me personally, though, and there's no reason for anyone else to care about this.

I'm okay with lynching Gleam instead of Sig, but I wish we would avoid splitting votes. Or scum might buy votes to help the one that is a cop, if the other one is not.

If a lot ot people move to gleam though, I will follow.

Turnip Head wrote:

Golden wrote:

Sloonei wrote:linki: Thank you indi. Anyone for a not-so-last-minute bandwagon on gleam?

As much as I believe it just pushes sig conversation tomorrow, I actually wouldn't mind doing this. The Fuzz vote on ika rather than gleam after suspecting gleam and saying he's stay away from the ika/silverwolf thing has always looked like a potential gleam save to me.

Yeah, I can see that. On the other hand, ika could be bad and Fuzz was hoping for some sweet sweet cred by breaking the tie.

And you're going back to ika's 'slip' with that too. It's a theory I think I'm more on board with the gleam one, but it is interesting.

The thing for me with ika is he felt really genuine in the whole EoD 2 situation.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote:I'm okay with lynching Gleam instead of Sig, but I wish we would avoid splitting votes. Or scum might buy votes to help the one that is a cop, if the other one is not.

If a lot ot people move to gleam though, I will follow.

Yes, I'm kind of just favoring big bandwagons at this point, for this reason. We should only do this if a lot of people are on board. If not, I'm still content enough with sig for today.

Golden wrote:

Sloonei wrote:linki: Thank you indi. Anyone for a not-so-last-minute bandwagon on gleam?

As much as I believe it just pushes sig conversation tomorrow, I actually wouldn't mind doing this. The Fuzz vote on ika rather than gleam after suspecting gleam and saying he's stay away from the ika/silverwolf thing has always looked like a potential gleam save to me.

I had forgotten about that. Let me do a re-read on Gleam again just to solidify a few things in my mind.

Okay, trying to catch up on my phone now on the way to work. I didn't see the discussion had moved towards Black Rock on the last page, I was just doing a quick read on them and didn't have time to formulate my thoughts before I left.

Luffy: "If everyone moves towards a gleam vote, I will too" (probably paraphrased)

I really don't like how your posts have been reading to me lately. It worries me. In a bad way.

Cry me a river.

I sincerely hope those players who are doing nothing but using OMGUS arguments all game are bad. Or I'll have to change some of my concepts about mafia.