The Syndicate

Sonny wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 7:21 am

Seanzie wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 1:03 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 12:55 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 12:49 pm Just as a summary, I truly was in the golden zone of drunkeness last night. I know myself, I am an artist-type and I get into that sort of zone sometimes where I have clarity and do some of my best work like that. I know when I am being a dumbass and when I am hot shit, and while I am definitely not going to promise that everything I said last night was completely correct, I was hot shit.

Owner - wolf. 10/10 dentists agree that you should vote her.

Sonny - not outed, but definitely deserves a strong look.
JJJ - not outed, but definitely deserves a strong look.
Mac - probably town.
Dana - probably town, but everyone already knew that.

Unfortunately, those were the only people I majorly interacted with, so I only split the game half open, rather than wide open.

Would you be able to articulate why you are so confident about Owner?
Some detailed thoughts on Sonny would be cool too.

I'd rather not, but I'll bet my life on an Owner scum flip.

Sonny looked very strongly like he wanted to distract me and others from my push on Owner last night. Sonny also felt uncomfortable in my interactions with him. It is hard to articulate exactly what it was that I was feeling with regards to him, but Sonny doesn't like wolfing, and I got strongly uncomfortable vibes from Sonny that reminded me of Wolf!Sonny (I've only seen him wolf once, so take this for what you will). So, super strong wolf!Sonny vibes, plus his actions having scum motive (attemping to move the thread away from an outed partner).

Uncomfortable? I mean you do you but I don't know why people assign these kind of 'emotions' or whatever to me, happens a lot. If Owner is scum, yay, I don't have a hard time believing she is from the way she refused to answer your question about her role and the lack of well, anything. I was catching up on 30 pages while you were posting so was dipping back and forth between old and new posts, I wasn't attempting to 'distract'.

Seanzie wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:00 pm
So you thought about chances of people being alive the next day, and went with JJJ?

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:06 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:00 pm
So you thought about chances of people being alive the next day, and went with JJJ?

He's the one I wanted the most to get lucky is that so wrong? I was more thinking the alive bit for Gavial. But in case something did happen in the night phase I did want JJJ to be lucky. I don't think the no death at the start of day was me. I think the chat was all.

Alison wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 8:20 am I was under the impression that Owner had just not remembered to move their vote after the shot.

Leaving it parked on Tangy is pretty outing as it means Owner is in anti-spew.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 11:33 am

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 11:17 am Open question: did sloonei have tmi that owner didn't gift them and a third person did?

I looked back, and I grant that Sloonei’s assumption that it wasn’t Owner and a third unnamed gifter exists is a bigger assumption than I’d make. @Sloonei should expand. Owner’s suspicion of him Day 1 was short lived.

Seanzie wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:10 pm

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:06 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:00 pm
So you thought about chances of people being alive the next day, and went with JJJ?

He's the one I wanted the most to get lucky is that so wrong? I was more thinking the alive bit for Gavial. But in case something did happen in the night phase I did want JJJ to be lucky. I don't think the no death at the start of day was me. I think the chat was all.

See, the issue I'm having is that you're trying to tell us all of the following:

1.) You thought your 2 gifts might somehow cause an interaction between the two players (chat, whatever),
2.) You thought about if people were likely to die or not when choosing who to gift,
3.) You gave something to JJJ.

Even if you say "well, I wanted at least one to go through, so I choose Gav", that doesn't mesh well with you thinking that your gift might create a chat or something like that... which oddly enough, it apparently did... VERY good guess...

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 11:57 am

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 4:11 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 3:02 am

Seanzie wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 2:29 am @Owner of a Lonely Heart you're here!

Did you target JJJ?

I sent a fruit. It doesn't do much. The person I sent it to hasn't brought it up yet.

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 3:05 am I guess if it was a more important role I would be worried if it didn't go through, but if they didn't get it, it wasn't super important. It would just make the claim more believable.

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:00 am

Seanzie wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 3:23 am @Owner of a Lonely Heart whom did you target with your fruit of love?

I gave JJJ and Gavial a passion fruit. I can target 2 people each night. I have 3 different 1 shot fruits: passion fruit, banana and pomegranate. I don't know what any of them do, aside from a little description. The passion fruit was lucky. I thought to myself if anyone was to get lucky it had to be JJJ, but then I wasn't incredibly sure who I wanted him to be lucky with. I figured I needed to probably pick someone from Cindy Kate. Yes, this is suppose to be a date between the 2 sites, but I guess I was thinking if this is more like a chat of sorts I want there to be lots of progress made, not to say there hasn't been. I wanted someone who could maybe keep up if it was that sort of thing.

The banana is squishy, and the pomegranate is problematic.

I really assumed that the fruit would have been mentioned. Maybe that's not how it works? I should maybe ask more questions.

Is this not just outing

It felt like seanzie was trying to trap me. I don't like being boxed into what someone wants me to do. I would rather give myself time to think things through.

Alison wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 5:04 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:00 am

Seanzie wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 3:23 am @Owner of a Lonely Heart whom did you target with your fruit of love?

I gave JJJ and Gavial a passion fruit. I can target 2 people each night. I have 3 different 1 shot fruits: passion fruit, banana and pomegranate. I don't know what any of them do, aside from a little description. The passion fruit was lucky. I thought to myself if anyone was to get lucky it had to be JJJ, but then I wasn't incredibly sure who I wanted him to be lucky with. I figured I needed to probably pick someone from Cindy Kate. Yes, this is suppose to be a date between the 2 sites, but I guess I was thinking if this is more like a chat of sorts I want there to be lots of progress made, not to say there hasn't been. I wanted someone who could maybe keep up if it was that sort of thing.

The banana is squishy, and the pomegranate is problematic.

I really assumed that the fruit would have been mentioned. Maybe that's not how it works? I should maybe ask more questions.

Refer to the description in pink. Does it make sense to have that thought process, and arrive at Gavial as your final conclusion?

Alison wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 5:06 am Like JJJ and Gavial have already shown on D1 that their thought processes don't necessarily mesh. If your goal was to maximize progress made with someone who can keep up with him, wouldn't Sloonei be the obvious choice? Or Mac, or myself?

Also, what does "I guess I was thinking if this is more like a chat of sorts" mean?? All Owner knew at the time they made the call to send the fruits was that the passion fruit was "lucky". They would have no information that it would give those two a chat, that's something that we only inferred once we realized the passion fruit sent them on a date together.

The more I look at that claim post the more I feel like it's actually a scumslip.

Because of our clashing, I wasn't going to give it to you. Mac and Sloonei, I debated about, but I went with Gavial as I wanted someone who was likely to be alive the next day.

Ah, I guess I do have to say it then. My role is called Cupid. So seeing Cupid + passion fruit = I thought sex, but then I thought in terms of mafia roles, I thought like a mason or neighborizer chat that's protected or something, 'cause lucky. I assume pomegranate is like lovers chat, so I'm not entirely sure if I really want to use that one. Banana sounds like a lesser of passion fruit. Or maybe it is unprotected, but I don't know. If there is a soup kill in the game, I would be fine with going out that way. I mean I don't want to go, but at the same time, I don't have all the time needed to really be full on active this game. I pose as a distraction, but if we could prevent a mislynch that would be kind of cool.

But I don't necessarily expect everyone see it that way.

lost monkey wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:02 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 11:47 am

lost monkey wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 11:43 am Then a syndicate person should have tried to kill you then or gavial is right and he role blocked hawk and hawk is scum.

Where’d you get the doctor claim?

Also, just to be entirely clear, is Owner one of the people you saw targeting me?

Nah i just got 2 perc and 1 synd. First perc player is allcrab he claimed he also watched you and second is owner and she claimed fruit giver. That would mean two things the synd player is the doc or that person did something to you. Other than the doc. synd player should claim if they gave you a fruit or something as well because that would mean gavial is right and hawk is scum and we dont know who got n1 targeted.

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:09 pm No one has claimed chat-maker, so Owner is telling the truth. Isn't that logical?

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:21 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:09 pm No one has claimed chat-maker, so Owner is telling the truth. Isn't that logical?

I think it’s scum-aligned, and I think it’s Gavial. And I think Gavial is making up this Hawk story to take pressure off of Owner, his scum buddy.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:23 pm

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:21 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:09 pm No one has claimed chat-maker, so Owner is telling the truth. Isn't that logical?

I think it’s scum-aligned, and I think it’s Gavial. And I think Gavial is making up this Hawk story to take pressure off of Owner, his scum buddy.

Gavial was mafia in Fallout and had a role which allowed him to send anonymous communication to a player at night. He used it in a convoluted way that was intended to “clear” him in the eyes of the thread.
Unrelated, but he also spent that whole game aggressively tunneling his teammate. Said teammate eventually won the game at F3.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 2:26 am @Owner of a Lonely Heart what made you make made when you could have made nutella?

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:21 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:09 pm No one has claimed chat-maker, so Owner is telling the truth. Isn't that logical?

I think it’s scum-aligned, and I think it’s Gavial. And I think Gavial is making up this Hawk story to take pressure off of Owner, his scum buddy.

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:17 pm
One of my gripes with you is that you said you targeted one single person. Then you said you targeted Jay and Gavial. Can you clear that?

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:25 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:23 pm

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:21 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:09 pm No one has claimed chat-maker, so Owner is telling the truth. Isn't that logical?

I think it’s scum-aligned, and I think it’s Gavial. And I think Gavial is making up this Hawk story to take pressure off of Owner, his scum buddy.

Gavial was mafia in Fallout and had a role which allowed him to send anonymous communication to a player at night. He used it in a convoluted way that was intended to “clear” him in the eyes of the thread.
Unrelated, but he also spent that whole game aggressively tunneling his teammate. Said teammate eventually won the game at F3.

It’s WIFOM but...If he spent the entire game tunneling someone as scum, would he do that again this game when there are people here who know he did that as scum?

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:25 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:23 pm

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:21 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:09 pm No one has claimed chat-maker, so Owner is telling the truth. Isn't that logical?

I think it’s scum-aligned, and I think it’s Gavial. And I think Gavial is making up this Hawk story to take pressure off of Owner, his scum buddy.

Gavial was mafia in Fallout and had a role which allowed him to send anonymous communication to a player at night. He used it in a convoluted way that was intended to “clear” him in the eyes of the thread.
Unrelated, but he also spent that whole game aggressively tunneling his teammate. Said teammate eventually won the game at F3.

It’s WIFOM but...If he spent the entire game tunneling someone as scum, would he do that again this game when there are people here who know he did that as scum?

Seanzie wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:27 pm

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:21 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:09 pm No one has claimed chat-maker, so Owner is telling the truth. Isn't that logical?

I think it’s scum-aligned, and I think it’s Gavial. And I think Gavial is making up this Hawk story to take pressure off of Owner, his scum buddy.

I could be wrong, but I think Gav outed stuff about Hawk before I did with Owner. Owner wasn't exactly in the towncore before this though, so maybe? Seems a bit of a stretch though, even for Gav.

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:27 pm

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:17 pm
One of my gripes with you is that you said you targeted one single person. Then you said you targeted Jay and Gavial. Can you clear that?

It sounded like Seanzie was trying to trap me. I was not going to give him more information than what he provided, so I went singular.

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:09 pm No one has claimed chat-maker, so Owner is telling the truth. Isn't that logical?

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:35 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:09 pm No one has claimed chat-maker, so Owner is telling the truth. Isn't that logical?

Doesn't make them town

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:42 pm

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:35 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:09 pm No one has claimed chat-maker, so Owner is telling the truth. Isn't that logical?

Doesn't make them town

That is true. Let's hope that the people voting Owner based on illogic get lucky then.

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:27 pm

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:17 pm
One of my gripes with you is that you said you targeted one single person. Then you said you targeted Jay and Gavial. Can you clear that?

It sounded like Seanzie was trying to trap me. I was not going to give him more information than what he provided, so I went singular.

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:21 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:09 pm No one has claimed chat-maker, so Owner is telling the truth. Isn't that logical?

I think it’s scum-aligned, and I think it’s Gavial. And I think Gavial is making up this Hawk story to take pressure off of Owner, his scum buddy.

Seanzie wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:45 pm

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:27 pm

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:17 pm
One of my gripes with you is that you said you targeted one single person. Then you said you targeted Jay and Gavial. Can you clear that?

It sounded like Seanzie was trying to trap me. I was not going to give him more information than what he provided, so I went singular.

So like in the world where Owner was indeed town, either

1.) Owner sees me question her about her role, and thinks I'm scum. In that case, I don't think her mind goes to "he's trying to trap me", her mind goes to "he's rolefishing". Not the same thing. Town tries to trap scum, not the other way around? Also, Owner has not expressed any sort of negative read on me here, so I just don't think this is a case that fits reality at all.

2.) Owner sees me question her about her role, and thinks I'm town. In that case, if she was worried about town incorrectly thinking she is "trapped scum", she doesn't tell untruths about her role. Maybe she refuses to talk about it, but she doesn't deliberately lie about it. That is literally asking for town to incorrectly think she is "trapped scum" when her lie doesn't pan out. I also don't think Owner expresses a fear of this happening as "He was trying to trap me".

1.) just isn't happening, and while 2.) is in the realm of possibilities, I don't buy it at all.

Scum is afraid of traps, not town. "Seanzie was trying to trap me" I think is >>>>rand!scum here. Couple ( ) that with everything else bad about Owner, and I think this is a clear hit.

Kito wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:46 pm

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:21 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 12:09 pm No one has claimed chat-maker, so Owner is telling the truth. Isn't that logical?

I think it’s scum-aligned, and I think it’s Gavial. And I think Gavial is making up this Hawk story to take pressure off of Owner, his scum buddy.

Highly doubt it, Gavial has been harping on about hawk since long before Owner got this level of attention. Maybe we were all POE or meta reading her scum, but we weren't talking about her vendor role or anything til way after Gavial started telling us all to vote hawk.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:08 pm Assuming we are correct today: Owner is plainly and obviously being bussed, at least in the poll. It will take some parsing if we wish to sort that out, but I would caution against going too crazy with it. When everybody does one thing, and can become too easy to imagine bad intentions when there aren’t any.

Without looking at or naming anyone in particular just yet, we should consider what bussing might look like in this instance.

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:20 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:08 pm Assuming we are correct today: Owner is plainly and obviously being bussed, at least in the poll. It will take some parsing if we wish to sort that out, but I would caution against going too crazy with it. When everybody does one thing, and can become too easy to imagine bad intentions when there aren’t any.

Without looking at or naming anyone in particular just yet, we should consider what bussing might look like in this instance.

Gavial is off wagon, and if Owner flips scum, I think that’s worth acknowledging. How many scum are there? I imagine if Gavial is scum, and if Owner flips scum, then other scum buddies could be those just hanging out on the wagon hitching a free ride.

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:21 pm We'll see what happens tonight but yeah don't think its likely they're teamed

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:20 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:08 pm Assuming we are correct today: Owner is plainly and obviously being bussed, at least in the poll. It will take some parsing if we wish to sort that out, but I would caution against going too crazy with it. When everybody does one thing, and can become too easy to imagine bad intentions when there aren’t any.

Without looking at or naming anyone in particular just yet, we should consider what bussing might look like in this instance.

Gavial is off wagon, and if Owner flips scum, I think that’s worth acknowledging. How many scum are there? I imagine if Gavial is scum, and if Owner flips scum, then other scum buddies could be those just hanging out on the wagon hitching a free ride.

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:25 pm

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:21 pm We'll see what happens tonight but yeah don't think its likely they're teamed

Any specific reasons why?

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:26 pm

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:25 pm

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:21 pm We'll see what happens tonight but yeah don't think its likely they're teamed

Any specific reasons why?

Yeah she gave him chat

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:26 pm

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:25 pm

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:21 pm We'll see what happens tonight but yeah don't think its likely they're teamed

Any specific reasons why?

Yeah she gave him chat

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:26 pm A team of 5 at the start. So currently 4. nutella, owner, x, y, z.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:26 pm

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:26 pm

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:25 pm

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:21 pm We'll see what happens tonight but yeah don't think its likely they're teamed

Any specific reasons why?

Yeah she gave him chat

I do not see why that should exclude him from being her partner.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:25 pm

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:20 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:08 pm Assuming we are correct today: Owner is plainly and obviously being bussed, at least in the poll. It will take some parsing if we wish to sort that out, but I would caution against going too crazy with it. When everybody does one thing, and can become too easy to imagine bad intentions when there aren’t any.

Without looking at or naming anyone in particular just yet, we should consider what bussing might look like in this instance.

Gavial is off wagon, and if Owner flips scum, I think that’s worth acknowledging. How many scum are there? I imagine if Gavial is scum, and if Owner flips scum, then other scum buddies could be those just hanging out on the wagon hitching a free ride.

My guess would be a team of 5, but that's only a guess.

Allcrab wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:32 pm shouldn't it be 6?

It's usually 25% wolves.

Allcrab wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:32 pm shouldn't it be 6?

It's usually 25% wolves.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:33 pm

Allcrab wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 1:32 pm shouldn't it be 6?

It's usually 25% wolves.

the existence of third party roles and other unknown mechanics makes that ratio more of a guideline than a hard rule.