The Syndicate

Epignosis wrote:It would seem that one man's "obvious" is one man's "delusion."

I understand your default is to antagonize and dismiss me, but it is the only logical option out there.

Night 1 - LC is the target, he will die Sat Feb 21, 2015 7:48 pm

Night 2 - SVS is the target, She will die Tue Feb 24, 2015 2:30 pm

Night 3 - Either a failed kill or a Kira hand off.

Night 4 - Acce is the target, he will die Sun Mar 01, 2015 8:14 pm

Present a viable alternative to this and I will consider it.

Also:

Ricochet wrote:RIP Aces.

Creepy use of smiley face is creepy.

Fine by me if DH and others want to intrrpreted this way, but I personally can't believe the Day/Night cycle has been disturbed based on current evidence.

DharmaHelper wrote: Perhaps I should have said I considere LC and SVS to have different playstyles than Aces, and that informs my theory. And regardless of the thread, people (and particularly killers) are creatures of habit. It's only natural that a subconscious pattern would emerge.

Yes, but remember that Aces was singled out as someone L trusts. Wouldn't Kira think that a safer kill than someone on his own team or suspected of being so? I don't see what playstyle has to do with it. But then, you all know how I feel about assumptions.

Ricochet wrote:Fine by me if DH and others want to intrrpreted this way, but I personally can't believe the Day/Night cycle has been disturbed based on current evidence.

Present a viable alternative and I will consider it.

Turnip Head wrote:Also:

Ricochet wrote:RIP Aces.

Creepy use of smiley face is creepy.

shit. Very sorry about that. Had mobile in one hand, sandwich in another. 4am here

correct one:

DharmaHelper wrote:

Ricochet wrote:Fine by me if DH and others want to intrrpreted this way, but I personally can't believe the Day/Night cycle has been disturbed based on current evidence.

Present a viable alternative and I will consider it.

N2 sudden heart attack and D3 day kill (in anticipation to N3) make more sense to me. Both could have been planned and announced in advance by Kira.

Ricochet wrote:shit. Very sorry about that. Had mobile in one hand, sandwich in another. 4am here

correct one:

Much better :P

Ricochet wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:

Ricochet wrote:Fine by me if DH and others want to intrrpreted this way, but I personally can't believe the Day/Night cycle has been disturbed based on current evidence.

Present a viable alternative and I will consider it.

N2 sudden heart attack and D3 day kill (in anticipation to N3) make more sense to me. Both could have been planned and announced in advance by Kira.

I don't think that makes any sense though.

Final post from me for now

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:Why not, if I may ask?

Because Light is probably sitting back and playing from the sidelines. You are not.

Who fits that profile, in your opinion?

AceofSpaces
bea
Black Rock
Boomslang
DisgruntledPorcupine
juliets
Made
Matahari
Ricochet
Spacedaisy
zeek

Don't know how much more I can rise to your standards of playing, but I don't see myself having been a sideline player, so I don't fit your profile of Light.

DharmaHelper wrote:

Epignosis wrote:It would seem that one man's "obvious" is one man's "delusion."

I understand your default is to antagonize and dismiss me, but it is the only logical option out there.

That wasn't my intention, and I see how what I just said could sound like that. What I mean was that I have suggested some "obvious" things (from my side) only to be ridiculed for them.

Ricochet wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:

Ricochet wrote:Fine by me if DH and others want to intrrpreted this way, but I personally can't believe the Day/Night cycle has been disturbed based on current evidence.

Present a viable alternative and I will consider it.

N2 sudden heart attack and D3 day kill (in anticipation to N3) make more sense to me. Both could have been planned and announced in advance by Kira.

Please lay out how you see this working out from d1 to now for me like dh has. I'm slow. I thiink I've at least made that much abundantly clear this game.

DharmaHelper wrote:

Ricochet wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:

Ricochet wrote:Fine by me if DH and others want to intrrpreted this way, but I personally can't believe the Day/Night cycle has been disturbed based on current evidence.

Present a viable alternative and I will consider it.

N2 sudden heart attack and D3 day kill (in anticipation to N3) make more sense to me. Both could have been planned and announced in advance by Kira.

I don't think that makes any sense though.

agree to disagree then. For me, a new Day still starts a new cycle, we've all been playing it this way. You suggest all except Kira.

bea wrote:

Ricochet wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:

Ricochet wrote:Fine by me if DH and others want to intrrpreted this way, but I personally can't believe the Day/Night cycle has been disturbed based on current evidence.

Present a viable alternative and I will consider it.

N2 sudden heart attack and D3 day kill (in anticipation to N3) make more sense to me. Both could have been planned and announced in advance by Kira.

Please lay out how you see this working out from d1 to now for me like dh has. I'm slow. I thiink I've at least made that much abundantly clear this game.

N1 - intentional no kill or no hit
N2 - Kira announces to the Host he wants LC dead as soon as Night starts (proverbial 40 seconds)
N3 - Kira plans and kills SVS during the day
N4 - no hit
N5- Kira plans and kills Acr during the day

Ricochet wrote:agree to disagree then. For me, a new Day still starts a new cycle, we've all been playing it this way. You suggest all except Kira.

This game's kill schedule is a noticeable departure from all regular mafia cycles, Rico. I don't see how that can be denied. DH's explanation at least makes sense as a pattern. Your explanation feels like trying to fit a square peg in a round hole.

linki: I still believe Kira sends in his Death Note writings at Night time, just as his role says he does. DH's theory conforms to this, yours does not.

Ok then.

thellama73 wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote: Perhaps I should have said I considere LC and SVS to have different playstyles than Aces, and that informs my theory. And regardless of the thread, people (and particularly killers) are creatures of habit. It's only natural that a subconscious pattern would emerge.

Yes, but remember that Aces was singled out as someone L trusts. Wouldn't Kira think that a safer kill than someone on his own team or suspected of being so? I don't see what playstyle has to do with it. But then, you all know how I feel about assumptions.

Perhaps I'm turning over too many stones.

Yea - Rico - the timing feels weird in that kira would have gad to be *right on top* of that n2 lc kill and then you are saying kira was aloud to kill svs during the day? As in completely independant of any other night actions? Same with aces? No chance for any potential blockers or Switchers that might be hanging out in the secrets yet to be revealed to do their thing?

DH, assuming you're right and a second person is now killing, why do you assume it's Higuchi and not Misa?

thellama73 wrote:DH, assuming you're right and a second person is now killing, why do you assume it's Higuchi and not Misa?

Don't worry DH- we've gotten to that point in the show.

Epignosis wrote:

thellama73 wrote:DH, assuming you're right and a second person is now killing, why do you assume it's Higuchi and not Misa?

Don't worry DH- we've gotten to that point in the show.

If its show related you're going to have to explain it. As I said, the last time I saw Death Note was just the one episode on Netflix recently, and I didn't even finish it.

My theory is that the missing kill was the point in which Light forewent his NK in favor of sending in the Death Note swap. Misa (as far as I know) can possess a Death Note independent of Light, and so there should be two kills, not a new killer, when she gets hers.

DharmaHelper wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

thellama73 wrote:DH, assuming you're right and a second person is now killing, why do you assume it's Higuchi and not Misa?

Don't worry DH- we've gotten to that point in the show.

If its show related you're going to have to explain it. As I said, the last time I saw Death Note was just the one episode on Netflix recently, and I didn't even finish it.

My theory is that the missing kill was the point in which Light forewent his NK in favor of sending in the Death Note swap. Misa (as far as I know) can possess a Death Note independent of Light, and so there should be two kills, not a new killer, when she gets hers.

The Death Note swap?

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

thellama73 wrote:DH, assuming you're right and a second person is now killing, why do you assume it's Higuchi and not Misa?

Don't worry DH- we've gotten to that point in the show.

If its show related you're going to have to explain it. As I said, the last time I saw Death Note was just the one episode on Netflix recently, and I didn't even finish it.

My theory is that the missing kill was the point in which Light forewent his NK in favor of sending in the Death Note swap. Misa (as far as I know) can possess a Death Note independent of Light, and so there should be two kills, not a new killer, when she gets hers.

The Death Note swap?

Giving his Death Note to Higuchi.

Also

@Rico

Writes a player’s name in the Death Note every night

DharmaHelper wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

thellama73 wrote:DH, assuming you're right and a second person is now killing, why do you assume it's Higuchi and not Misa?

Don't worry DH- we've gotten to that point in the show.

If its show related you're going to have to explain it. As I said, the last time I saw Death Note was just the one episode on Netflix recently, and I didn't even finish it.

My theory is that the missing kill was the point in which Light forewent his NK in favor of sending in the Death Note swap. Misa (as far as I know) can possess a Death Note independent of Light, and so there should be two kills, not a new killer, when she gets hers.

The Death Note swap?

Giving his Death Note to Higuchi.

Any thoughts on who Light might be that he would have given up his notebook back during Night 3 then?

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

thellama73 wrote:DH, assuming you're right and a second person is now killing, why do you assume it's Higuchi and not Misa?

Don't worry DH- we've gotten to that point in the show.

If its show related you're going to have to explain it. As I said, the last time I saw Death Note was just the one episode on Netflix recently, and I didn't even finish it.

My theory is that the missing kill was the point in which Light forewent his NK in favor of sending in the Death Note swap. Misa (as far as I know) can possess a Death Note independent of Light, and so there should be two kills, not a new killer, when she gets hers.

The Death Note swap?

Giving his Death Note to Higuchi.

Any thoughts on who Light might be that he would have given up his notebook back during Night 3 then?

None in particular.

DharmaHelper wrote:Also

@Rico

Writes a player’s name in the Death Note every night

I admit the LC's kill might have fooled me into seeing what I said was a proverbial 40 seconds death sentence. If that's not possible, then yes, your chain of events makes more sense.

What do you make of Light's very first kill being delayed until the beginning of a new full Night, though?

Ricochet wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:Also

@Rico

Writes a player’s name in the Death Note every night

I admit the LC's kill might have fooled me into seeing what I said was a proverbial 40 seconds death sentence. If that's not possible, then yes, your chain of events makes more sense.

What do you make of Light's very first kill being delayed until the beginning of a new full Night, though?

I think Light realized he could specify in his night PM the time of death, and wanted to be cheeky. Maybe making us think at first that his kill failed.

DharmaHelper wrote:

Ricochet wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:Also

@Rico

Writes a player’s name in the Death Note every night

I admit the LC's kill might have fooled me into seeing what I said was a proverbial 40 seconds death sentence. If that's not possible, then yes, your chain of events makes more sense.

What do you make of Light's very first kill being delayed until the beginning of a new full Night, though?

I think Light realized he could specify in his night PM the time of death, and wanted to be cheeky. Maybe making us think at first that his kill failed.

Totally fooled in that case. Yes, I can see the DN itself having special mechanics as the killing tool and Light being aware of this from the start.

got to fly

Metalmarsh89 wrote:Any thoughts on who Light might be that he would have given up his notebook back during Night 3 then?

Howabout this guy?

Epignosis wrote:Interesting.

Vote me if you must. Like I said, you won't catch Kira. Burn those lynches.

Burn, burn, burn.

Turnip Head wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:Any thoughts on who Light might be that he would have given up his notebook back during Night 3 then?

Howabout this guy?

Epignosis wrote:Interesting.

Vote me if you must. Like I said, you won't catch Kira. Burn those lynches.

Burn, burn, burn.

Epi wouldn't give up the book with such little pressure.

But

He could be on the receiving end of DH's "Death Note swap".

Metalmarsh89 wrote:Epi wouldn't give up the book with such little pressure.

Sure he would, if it made him temporarily invincible and allowed him to be more aggressive in the thread.

What makes you think he could be Higuchi?

Turnip Head wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:Epi wouldn't give up the book with such little pressure.

Sure he would, if it made him temporarily invincible and allowed him to be more aggressive in the thread.

What makes you think he could be Higuchi?

1) His case on DH that fell flat. His conclusion was that DH was a non-Kira sympathizer, of which are good for lynching. However, he's not been interested in lynching DH since then.
2) His earlier continued mentioning of the Yotsuba while telling us to quit talking about them.
3) He now continues to suggest that you are Higuchi (or a Shinigami), and is especially keen on the theory of leaving you alone for a couple days, then lynching you. That's just too convenient for the real Higuchi if you are not he.

Some intriguing points.

You said on Night 4 and repeated again today that you wouldn't be voting for Epi today, and that you had a certain role in mind for him. Are you reconsidering any of that now?

RIP Ace Shame we didn't play together again for long!

I think what DH is saying makes a lot of sense but it's all conjecture at the moment and I don't think it helps us decide who to lynch. And the more I think about it there more I think we have to lynch Elo to find out if L's messages are truthful.

I find myself agreeing with llama on this. Don't see any different type of kills, just that Ace was the only player almost confirmed civ, so probably the best option for a kill.

As for giving up the note, I know it's probably there on the first page, but I'm short on time and would appreciate the help for when I come back later: What happens if Kira gives up the note? Does he ever get it back or does he just becomes like a Kira supporter? I get that he can't be lynched or something. Is that for the rest of the game, or just once? Would it be a good strategy to give up that note for a Kira?

FZ I think it is less confusing if you read it as I answer the questions to the best of my ability. One benefit Kira/Light gets by passing on the Death Note is he cannot be lynched or night killed and that is not just once. It stays that way as long as he doesn't have a Death Note is how I read it. As the description says, Light can regain the Death Note and may in turn pass it to Mikami, but can't get it back unless Mikami dies. I don't know if it is a good strategy, it would depend for me on what the win conditions are. If I misrepresented or left out anything to do with your questions please someone correct me.


Role Description
The initial finder of a Death Note, Light is a high-school senior who quickly grows obsessed with power, declaring himself the ultimate decider of criminals’ fates. Determined to create a new perfect world without evil, Light will manipulate or kill anyone in his way. Has BTSC with Ryuk. Writes a player’s name in the Death Note every night, killing them. Arrogant and incredibly manipulative, Light feels no true alliance to anyone but himself, and thus can kill any human, even one of his supporters. Once Misa starts killing, Light may send a message to her every day. If certain events occur, he and Ryuk may gain BTSC with Misa and Rem. At any time, Light may choose to forfeit ownership of the Death Note. If he does so, Higuchi receives the Death Note. Under certain circumstances, Light may regain the Death Note. After regaining it, he may subsequently pass it on to Mikami at any time, but he cannot regain the Death Note again unless Mikami is killed. While not possessing a Death Note, Light cannot be lynched or night killed. At all times after Light and Misa gain permanent BTSC, only one Kira may be killing at a time. Thus, if Higuchi or Mikami possess a Death Note, Light and Misa must abstain, even if one of them also has a Death Note. If the active Kira is ever caught by Near, Light may have a chance to still win, but only if Matsuda is dead.

FZ as far as strategy goes i mentioned win conditions as a determinant but there is also the possibility that Kira is/was/will take a lot of heat in the thread and give up his Death Note so he will not be lynched or night killed. That's why everyone is talking about who has taken heat in the thread because DH (I believe, it could have been someone else) contends that the first two deaths were not like the last one so it appears the Death Note has changed hands.

As always, some one correct me if I'm wrong.

juliets wrote:FZ as far as strategy goes i mentioned win conditions as a determinant but there is also the possibility that Kira is/was/will take a lot of heat in the thread and give up his Death Note so he will not be lynched or night killed. That's why everyone is talking about who has taken heat in the thread because DH (I believe, it could have been someone else) contends that the first two deaths were not like the last one so it appears the Death Note has changed hands.

As always, some one correct me if I'm wrong.

That is correct, the time of death and victim profile do not match the first two kills. Though the time of death is I suppose the stronger of those two differences.

DharmaHelper wrote:

juliets wrote:FZ as far as strategy goes i mentioned win conditions as a determinant but there is also the possibility that Kira is/was/will take a lot of heat in the thread and give up his Death Note so he will not be lynched or night killed. That's why everyone is talking about who has taken heat in the thread because DH (I believe, it could have been someone else) contends that the first two deaths were not like the last one so it appears the Death Note has changed hands.

As always, some one correct me if I'm wrong.

That is correct, the time of death and victim profile do not match the first two kills. Though the time of death is I suppose the stronger of those two differences.

Is there another player whose profile does match the first two in your opinion? Just a yes or no will suffice, you don't have to tell me who.

What do you think about Epi being Higuchi, and how sure are you that Light did give up his Death Note.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:

juliets wrote:FZ as far as strategy goes i mentioned win conditions as a determinant but there is also the possibility that Kira is/was/will take a lot of heat in the thread and give up his Death Note so he will not be lynched or night killed. That's why everyone is talking about who has taken heat in the thread because DH (I believe, it could have been someone else) contends that the first two deaths were not like the last one so it appears the Death Note has changed hands.

As always, some one correct me if I'm wrong.

That is correct, the time of death and victim profile do not match the first two kills. Though the time of death is I suppose the stronger of those two differences.

Is there another player whose profile does match the first two in your opinion? Just a yes or no will suffice, you don't have to tell me who.

What do you think about Epi being Higuchi, and how sure are you that Light did give up his Death Note.

1. Yes, several.
2. It's an entertaining possibility.
3. Given the evidence, I'm reasonably sure.

Okay, I've decided to give L the benefit of the doubt and vote Eloh today. AT the very least, we'll learn the extent to which we can rely on him in the future, which I think is worth knowing.

I am leaning toward an Elo vote but I will give it a couple of hours to see if Elo has anything else to say or something happens to change my mind.

I get the feeling that lynching Eloh today is unavoidable.

juliets wrote:I am leaning toward an Elo vote but I will give it a couple of hours to see if Elo has anything else to say or something happens to change my mind.

Hey jules, what do you think of Epi and Metalmarsh this game?

llama - that's a fair point. At some point we have to just jump in and have some faith.

I reread eloh today and I have to say all of her posts left me feeling ??? I couldn't decide one way or the other about her. I've had both baddie and civ bts with her and I still couldn't call it.

Had it not been for L's note, I wouldn't have thought to look there at all.

Eloh -dispite how this lynch goes, you should be VERY proud of that.

I see Eloh (and for that matter no one else) has taken my advice to build a case to lynch Made.

Turnip Head wrote:

juliets wrote:I am leaning toward an Elo vote but I will give it a couple of hours to see if Elo has anything else to say or something happens to change my mind.

Hey jules, what do you think of Epi and Metalmarsh this game?

I would need to relook at Epi because there are times I think he is bad but there have been plenty of times I have thought he was a civ. I don't completely trust him though. Metalmarsh I haven't had an opinion on one way or another. Do you think Epi and/or MM are bad? If so I'll dig deeper into both.