GY!BE Mafia [E.N.D.]

[Tangrowth]

Well, I've OT talked enough.

Although recently I've uncovered that POE naturally describes my recently developed playstyle because I much more easily find town reads than I do baddie reads, I've never formally used POE before.

I'll be using POE exclusively this game, and I'd like to approach it both as an individual (with my rainbow lists like I usually do) but as a group this time.

Who wants to join me?

Unfortunately, I'll have to abstain. Plus doing POE in such a mysterious, secret-filled game seems a little counterintuitive.

Also, all win conditions are mortality dependent, so lynching people you haven't managed to subjectively clear is going to kinda screw them over, unlike in past games like Red V. Blue, where you could win dead or alive. Civilians who are targeted by the POE cannon have literally no incentive to let themselves get lynched. It could easily get all Oblique Strategies pretty fast.

But hey, with you trying to figure out who's good, and me trying to figure out who's bad, we'll have the role list sorted by Day 3.

To narrow in on one point you made though (using sarcastic orange to highlight, not be sarcastic), although you make an excellent point, I think that makes the prospective use of POE all the more appealing in this setup. I would say a disadvantage to POE, especially when the thread at large is using it, is that it can potentially take away the incentive of scummy-seeming town players to want to defend themselves and remove themselves from the POE suspect pool.

[Epignosis]

POE is Rolling Around in His Grave (Which is in Baltimore, 515 W Fayette Street, in Case You Wanted to Go There)

[Tangrowth]

POE is Rolling Around in His Grave (Which is in Baltimore, 515 W Fayette Street, in Case You Wanted to Go There)

This is too awesome already; I'm frankly tempted to remove you from consideration for my d1 vote already, but I know better that it isn't alignment indicative.

[insertnamehere]

Well, I've OT talked enough.

Although recently I've uncovered that POE naturally describes my recently developed playstyle because I much more easily find town reads than I do baddie reads, I've never formally used POE before.

I'll be using POE exclusively this game, and I'd like to approach it both as an individual (with my rainbow lists like I usually do) but as a group this time.

Who wants to join me?

Unfortunately, I'll have to abstain. Plus doing POE in such a mysterious, secret-filled game seems a little counterintuitive.

Also, all win conditions are mortality dependent, so lynching people you haven't managed to subjectively clear is going to kinda screw them over, unlike in past games like Red V. Blue, where you could win dead or alive. Civilians who are targeted by the POE cannon have literally no incentive to let themselves get lynched. It could easily get all Oblique Strategies pretty fast.

But hey, with you trying to figure out who's good, and me trying to figure out who's bad, we'll have the role list sorted by Day 3.

To narrow in on one point you made though (using sarcastic orange to highlight, not be sarcastic), although you make an excellent point, I think that makes the prospective use of POE all the more appealing in this setup. I would say a disadvantage to POE, especially when the thread at large is using it, is that it can potentially take away the incentive of scummy-seeming town players to want to defend themselves and remove themselves from the POE suspect pool.

I suppose instead of suspecting accused civilians for defending themselves, now everyone's gonna have to actually address people's defenses instead of blindly lynching who the loud ones are talking about.

But I still think it's an unreliable and dangerous method, and that's just my opinion, take it or leave it please don't lynch me because I don't want to go along with this.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I think INH is right that a cooperative PoE effort in a game where townies must survive to win is inherently challenged, because in games like this town reads are generally harder to come by. However, the only reason that's true is that townies are more hesitant to put forth a visible, vocal effort for fear of standing out and becoming kill targets. That problem is resolved if every townie puts forth a visible, vocal effort.

Maybe that's a pipe dream, but I would encourage the townies out there to still make a concerted effort to play for the town win condition as much as their own survival. To focus too much on survival ensures that the baddies benefit maximally from these rules as I would theorize they typically do. I think it's the #1 reason town won games so infrequently on this site until recently (as that rule has appeared less often).

Rico, please don't interpret this as a complaint. It's just advice.

[Tangrowth]

Well, I've OT talked enough.

Although recently I've uncovered that POE naturally describes my recently developed playstyle because I much more easily find town reads than I do baddie reads, I've never formally used POE before.

I'll be using POE exclusively this game, and I'd like to approach it both as an individual (with my rainbow lists like I usually do) but as a group this time.

Who wants to join me?

Unfortunately, I'll have to abstain. Plus doing POE in such a mysterious, secret-filled game seems a little counterintuitive.

Also, all win conditions are mortality dependent, so lynching people you haven't managed to subjectively clear is going to kinda screw them over, unlike in past games like Red V. Blue, where you could win dead or alive. Civilians who are targeted by the POE cannon have literally no incentive to let themselves get lynched. It could easily get all Oblique Strategies pretty fast.

But hey, with you trying to figure out who's good, and me trying to figure out who's bad, we'll have the role list sorted by Day 3.

To narrow in on one point you made though (using sarcastic orange to highlight, not be sarcastic), although you make an excellent point, I think that makes the prospective use of POE all the more appealing in this setup. I would say a disadvantage to POE, especially when the thread at large is using it, is that it can potentially take away the incentive of scummy-seeming town players to want to defend themselves and remove themselves from the POE suspect pool.

I suppose instead of suspecting accused civilians for defending themselves, now everyone's gonna have to actually address people's defenses instead of blindly lynching who the loud ones are talking about.

But I still think it's an unreliable and dangerous method, and that's just my opinion, take it or leave it please don't lynch me because I don't want to go along with this.

Well, ideally even a townie receiving immense pressure from POE should still make every effort possible to display the ways in which they are town and fight the pressure. Even if they cannot convince the other POE participants in time to save their own skin, the mere possibility of convincing enough other players should be enough. Moreover, any content that they leave behind will be potentially helpful regardless.

Mafia members have to manufacture literally every thought of their own, particularly in one-team mafia setups such as the one we are in, so POE can still be applied well. Like any other method though, it really depends on how it is executed, because it can be executed poorly if the thread at large isn't continually assessing whether all players eliminated from the suspect pool should continue to be eliminated.

[Sloonei]

Not me, I suck.

Absolutely untrue.

You sir are a villain and a knave!

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Minor town points to MP for jumping into the thread with a distinct strategy in mind and a willingness to discuss its merits and shortcomings in a way that I think looks genuine.

[Tangrowth]

I think INH is right that a cooperative PoE effort in a game where townies must survive to win is inherently challenged, because in games like this town reads are generally harder to come by. However, the only reason that's true is that townies are more hesitant to put forth a visible, vocal effort for fear of standing out and becoming kill targets. That problem is resolved if every townie puts forth a visible, vocal effort.

Maybe that's a pipe dream, but I would encourage the townies out there to still make a concerted effort to play for the town win condition as much as their own survival. To focus too much on survival ensures that the baddies benefit maximally from these rules as I would theorize they typically do. I think it's the #1 reason town won games so infrequently on this site until recently (as that rule has appeared less often).

Rico, please don't interpret this as a complaint. It's just advice.

I agree that too many players at this site (myself included even) focus too much on their own survival, hyperobsess over the fact that they cannot trust anyone, etc. These are all things that the mafia team can take advantage of. A combined effort of townies working their hardest (or at least remotely hard) to uncover the mafia is what makes the mafia nervous, because in order for one of them to penetrate the POE they have to continually all game force their own content.

If players behave in an inherently suspicious or cautious way out of a fear of being NKed, they not only make it harder for townies to discern whether other players are town but also make it easier for the mafia to blend in and manufacture their suspicions.

[Tangrowth]

Not me, I suck.

Absolutely untrue.

You sir are a villain and a knave!

Seriously, if you are at all referring to Mad Max, you don't suck. Quin had me 100% fooled there too. You played admirably well.

[Tangrowth]

Minor town points to MP for jumping into the thread with a distinct strategy in mind and a willingness to discuss its merits and shortcomings in a way that I think looks genuine.

That's how it's done, son.

[insertnamehere]

I think INH is right that a cooperative PoE effort in a game where townies must survive to win is inherently challenged, because in games like this town reads are generally harder to come by. However, the only reason that's true is that townies are more hesitant to put forth a visible, vocal effort for fear of standing out and becoming kill targets. That problem is resolved if every townie puts forth a visible, vocal effort.

Maybe that's a pipe dream, but I would encourage the townies out there to still make a concerted effort to play for the town win condition as much as their own survival. To focus too much on survival ensures that the baddies benefit maximally from these rules as I would theorize they typically do. I think it's the #1 reason town won games so infrequently on this site until recently (as that rule has appeared less often).

Rico, please don't interpret this as a complaint. It's just advice.

Since we're in the "declaring game-long intentions" phase, let me just say that I am completely willing to put my own survival over the "playing for the town win condition," which I assume means following POE to the letter.

I am a civilian.

Keeping myself alive, and ensuring that people other than myself get lynched can only help the civilian cause.

I'm not willing to sacrifice my chance at winning so that you can cross my name off of your POE list, in order to further a strategy that I believe hurts the civilian cause.

I'd rather not get the entire thread bogged down in a playstyles argument over the merits of POE because that's a dead horse which has already rotted into a skeleton. POE type people are gonna POE, non-POE type people are not. I don't suspect or begrudge anyone for using POE, and I'd ask that they extend the same consideration for me to not use it.

[Golden]

I agree with inh that PoE would be challenging in this game. It's great for a game that is relatively straightforward, but the more secrets there are the more difficult it is to achieve.

I'm willing to see how MP plays it out, though. I could be surprised.

Also, I'd note that the last time I talked about PoE on this site (Red vs Blue), it was fundamentally flawed for that game as well. Not because of the mafia (which it worked for), but because of the specific serial killer secret that G-Man employed, which enabled me to get a hard clear of myself from inh in my second life. Inadvertently, getting Jay on my side through use of PoE while I was a civilian, when he was under attack from people who didn't believe in it, allowed me to manipulate him a little into seeing the serial killer through the same PoE lens when I knew I could use it against him.

PoE is a great tool, but every game secret is a potential chance to manipulate it.

[Sloonei]

Not me, I suck.

Absolutely untrue.

You sir are a villain and a knave!

Seriously, if you are at all referring to Mad Max, you don't suck. Quin had me 100% fooled there too. You played admirably well.

Not at all! I'm wearing that banner with pride. Just nonsensical self-deprecation to start the game off.

[Epignosis]

Townie is Such a Pussy Word

[Golden]

let me just say that I am completely willing to put my own survival over the "playing for the town win condition," which I assume means following POE to the letter.

I don't think Jay means that. I think he means trying to stay under the radar and not take any part in trying to solve the game to avoid being NKed.

In my experience of you, you always try to solve the game.

If you are town, then it's good if we know that we disagree about who is bad (or agree). It's bad if we don't know that we disagree, because neither of us are willing to say who we think is bad in case we are right and they kill us.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

"playing for the town win condition," which I assume means following POE to the letter.

As I've said 8,000 times in these games, I don't care who does or doesn't use "PoE". It's just one strategy among many. When I say I want townies to play for the town win condition, that means I want to see their reads. I want to see their suspicions. I want to see their cases.

When too many people refuse to play with any transparency because they don't want to die, town loses. When town loses, the survival win condition no longer matters because winning is already impossible.

Obviously everyone should play however they want. I doubt my perspective will change anyone's minds.

[Golden]

Townie is Such a Pussy Word

Would you please stop grabbing people by their pussy word.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Townie is Such a Pussy Word

There is no wimpier word than "baddie".

[Sloonei]

Townie is Such a Pussy Word

Goody Two-shoes-aligned player.

[Tangrowth]

I think INH is right that a cooperative PoE effort in a game where townies must survive to win is inherently challenged, because in games like this town reads are generally harder to come by. However, the only reason that's true is that townies are more hesitant to put forth a visible, vocal effort for fear of standing out and becoming kill targets. That problem is resolved if every townie puts forth a visible, vocal effort.

Maybe that's a pipe dream, but I would encourage the townies out there to still make a concerted effort to play for the town win condition as much as their own survival. To focus too much on survival ensures that the baddies benefit maximally from these rules as I would theorize they typically do. I think it's the #1 reason town won games so infrequently on this site until recently (as that rule has appeared less often).

Rico, please don't interpret this as a complaint. It's just advice.

Since we're in the "declaring game-long intentions" phase, let me just say that I am completely willing to put my own survival over the "playing for the town win condition," which I assume means following POE to the letter.

I am a civilian.

Keeping myself alive, and ensuring that people other than myself get lynched can only help the civilian cause.

I'm not willing to sacrifice my chance at winning so that you can cross my name off of your POE list, in order to further a strategy that I believe hurts the civilian cause.

I'd rather not get the entire thread bogged down in a playstyles argument over the merits of POE because that's a dead horse which has already rotted into a skeleton. POE type people are gonna POE, non-POE type people are not. I don't suspect or begrudge anyone for using POE, and I'd ask that they extend the same consideration for me to not use it.

First off, know that even as an avid POE fan I'd never advocate the highlighted. As a member of the town, assuming you are one, then naturally you have 100% confirmation of your own role card and you can never have that of anyone else, save some kind of information-gathering mechanism or power role. The problem is that this fact, IMO anyway, too often lends people to play the game in a way that devalues attempting to solve the game (i.e., find the mafia) at the expense of playing more akin to an independent role instead of a town role (i.e., I only care about my own survival and since I can't know who might be tricking me, I will put forth little effort to find mafia and be OK with anyone else being lynched except for me).

It's OK and even optimal under POE that you fight tooth and nail against your own lynch. No one is saying you or anyone else should sit down and accept being part of the POE suspect pool.

I missed the gigantic POE discussion in Red vs. Blue because I had to sub out, so forgive me for opening up an avenue for dead horse beating there. Your opinion is noted and entirely acceptable. I'd never want to sit here and imply even remotely that someone else has to play the way that I do. I don't think that's ideal. Everyone should play how they most desire to play.

I just have my own differing thoughts on the matter, and I have no experience using group-based POE (only individual-based POE in that I find it easier to form town reads than mafia reads), so I'd like to try it out one of these days, and I figured one of these days is hopefully now.

[Golden]

I said it best, all you other pretenders are just saying what I said but more wordily

[Tangrowth]

I agree with inh that PoE would be challenging in this game. It's great for a game that is relatively straightforward, but the more secrets there are the more difficult it is to achieve.

I'm willing to see how MP plays it out, though. I could be surprised.

Also, I'd note that the last time I talked about PoE on this site (Red vs Blue), it was fundamentally flawed for that game as well. Not because of the mafia (which it worked for), but because of the specific serial killer secret that G-Man employed, which enabled me to get a hard clear of myself from inh in my second life. Inadvertently, getting Jay on my side through use of PoE while I was a civilian, when he was under attack from people who didn't believe in it, allowed me to manipulate him a little into seeing the serial killer through the same PoE lens when I knew I could use it against him.

PoE is a great tool, but every game secret is a potential chance to manipulate it.

I just know my own strengths and weaknesses as a mafia player. I've increasingly realized that I'm awful at finding mafia, but I think I'm generally OK at finding fellow townies, so I'm trying to play to my relative strength here.

[Tangrowth]

Not me, I suck.

Absolutely untrue.

You sir are a villain and a knave!

Seriously, if you are at all referring to Mad Max, you don't suck. Quin had me 100% fooled there too. You played admirably well.

Not at all! I'm wearing that banner with pride. Just nonsensical self-deprecation to start the game off.

Nothing wrong with that, I suppose.

[Tangrowth]

let me just say that I am completely willing to put my own survival over the "playing for the town win condition," which I assume means following POE to the letter.

I don't think Jay means that. I think he means trying to stay under the radar and not take any part in trying to solve the game to avoid being NKed.

In my experience of you, you always try to solve the game.

If you are town, then it's good if we know that we disagree about who is bad (or agree). It's bad if we don't know that we disagree, because neither of us are willing to say who we think is bad in case we are right and they kill us.

Yeah, pretty much this.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Actually MP, your post count has already jumped to an obscene place. I'm not sure I've seen it quite like this since you started Transistor with 57 posts before the second-highest poster made it to #8.

You over-eager cuz you bad, m8?

[Tangrowth]

"playing for the town win condition," which I assume means following POE to the letter.

As I've said 8,000 times in these games, I don't care who does or doesn't use "PoE". It's just one strategy among many. When I say I want townies to play for the town win condition, that means I want to see their reads. I want to see their suspicions. I want to see their cases.

When too many people refuse to play with any transparency because they don't want to die, town loses. When town loses, the survival win condition no longer matters because winning is already impossible.

Obviously everyone should play however they want. I doubt my perspective will change anyone's minds.

Ooooh, you just used my favorite mafia word.

(MM made fun of me in a game once because I used it like 8 times before d2 or something like that.)

[insertnamehere]

Not me, I suck.

Absolutely untrue.

You sir are a villain and a knave!

Seriously, if you are at all referring to Mad Max, you don't suck. Quin had me 100% fooled there too. You played admirably well.

Not at all! I'm wearing that banner with pride. Just nonsensical self-deprecation to start the game off.

what a coincidence, that's the exact same reason I'm wearing the banner.

[Tangrowth]

I said it best, all you other pretenders are just saying what I said but more wordily

It's just because you, Jay, and I all have very similar approaches to the game that is mafia.

[Epignosis]

Townie is Such a Pussy Word

There is no wimpier word than "baddie".

You are Preaching to the Choir, Which is Wearing Robes Made by Unchristian Foreigners

[Golden]

I just know my own strengths and weaknesses as a mafia player. I've increasingly realized that I'm awful at finding mafia, but I think I'm generally OK at finding fellow townies, so I'm trying to play to my relative strength here.

I don't even think that's you. I think it's most people. That's why PoE as a concept has proven successful elsewhere.

I think it's fair to say that many people express an unwillingness to say they read people as town in case it gets their townread killed. But I think declaring town reads is helpful so I continue to do it.

[insertnamehere]

Townie is Such a Pussy Word

There is no wimpier word than "baddie".

You are Preaching to the Choir, Which is Wearing Robes Made by Unchristian Foreigners

I can't wait to see an ISO made out of this.

[Golden]

inh just volunteered to iso epi

[Tangrowth]

Actually MP, your post count has already jumped to an obscene place. I'm not sure I've seen it quite like this since you started Transistor with 57 posts before the second-highest poster made it to #8.

You over-eager cuz you bad, m8?

You wish.

It's really just that I'm dying to play another game after being prematurely taken out in Monkey Island, I'm procrastinating dissertation stuff, and I've been absolutely loving sitting here at my computer the last like five hours just dicking around on the internet (without even worrying about admin stuff here, or teaching, or other PhD concerns). It's been glorious. I haven't done this in way too long.

[insertnamehere]

inh just volunteered to iso epi

Or to watch Epi iso someone else.

[Tangrowth]

I just know my own strengths and weaknesses as a mafia player. I've increasingly realized that I'm awful at finding mafia, but I think I'm generally OK at finding fellow townies, so I'm trying to play to my relative strength here.

I don't even think that's you. I think it's most people. That's why PoE as a concept has proven successful elsewhere.

I think it's fair to say that many people express an unwillingness to say they read people as town in case it gets their townread killed. But I think declaring town reads is helpful so I continue to do it.

That's a good point.

I agree that declaring town reads is helpful; I'd say even immensely helpful. How else can I get a read on whether anyone else is town (i.e., genuine in solving the game) if they do not share their town reads / thought processes?

And I don't find any merit in that argument, but I'll agree with you that it's widespread.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Actually MP, your post count has already jumped to an obscene place. I'm not sure I've seen it quite like this since you started Transistor with 57 posts before the second-highest poster made it to #8.

You over-eager cuz you bad, m8?

You wish.

It's really just that I'm dying to play another game after being prematurely taken out in Monkey Island, I'm procrastinating dissertation stuff, and I've been absolutely loving sitting here at my computer the last like five hours just dicking around on the internet (without even worrying about admin stuff here, or teaching, or other PhD concerns). It's been glorious. I haven't done this in way too long.

Cool. Cool cool cool.

Any immediate perspectives emerging from the little chats you've had to this point?

[Golden]

inh just volunteered to iso epi

Or to watch Epi iso someone else.

If you want to avoid the smily, you have to spoonerise and say :copporn:

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Inadvertently, getting Jay on my side through use of PoE while I was a civilian, when he was under attack from people who didn't believe in it, allowed me to manipulate him a little into seeing the serial killer through the same PoE lens when I knew I could use it against him.

To be fair, I was perfectly ready to lynch you until that bastardized role intervened.

[Tangrowth]

Actually MP, your post count has already jumped to an obscene place. I'm not sure I've seen it quite like this since you started Transistor with 57 posts before the second-highest poster made it to #8.

You over-eager cuz you bad, m8?

You wish.

It's really just that I'm dying to play another game after being prematurely taken out in Monkey Island, I'm procrastinating dissertation stuff, and I've been absolutely loving sitting here at my computer the last like five hours just dicking around on the internet (without even worrying about admin stuff here, or teaching, or other PhD concerns). It's been glorious. I haven't done this in way too long.

Cool. Cool cool cool.

Any immediate perspectives emerging from the little chats you've had to this point?

I want to town read you and Golden, but I cannot justify that quite yet, because I would expect the three of us to mindmeld on all of this regardless of alignment.

I can tentatively call INH a slight town read and remove him from the current suspect pool though. He threw out a fair counterargument at me and engaged me on the subject in what I think displayed a genuine mindset.

Specifically:

Spoiler: show

I think INH is right that a cooperative PoE effort in a game where townies must survive to win is inherently challenged, because in games like this town reads are generally harder to come by. However, the only reason that's true is that townies are more hesitant to put forth a visible, vocal effort for fear of standing out and becoming kill targets. That problem is resolved if every townie puts forth a visible, vocal effort.

Maybe that's a pipe dream, but I would encourage the townies out there to still make a concerted effort to play for the town win condition as much as their own survival. To focus too much on survival ensures that the baddies benefit maximally from these rules as I would theorize they typically do. I think it's the #1 reason town won games so infrequently on this site until recently (as that rule has appeared less often).

Rico, please don't interpret this as a complaint. It's just advice.

Since we're in the "declaring game-long intentions" phase, let me just say that I am completely willing to put my own survival over the "playing for the town win condition," which I assume means following POE to the letter.

I am a civilian.

Keeping myself alive, and ensuring that people other than myself get lynched can only help the civilian cause.

I'm not willing to sacrifice my chance at winning so that you can cross my name off of your POE list, in order to further a strategy that I believe hurts the civilian cause.

I'd rather not get the entire thread bogged down in a playstyles argument over the merits of POE because that's a dead horse which has already rotted into a skeleton. POE type people are gonna POE, non-POE type people are not. I don't suspect or begrudge anyone for using POE, and I'd ask that they extend the same consideration for me to not use it.

I am townreading that highlighted bit. That sentiment is constructed in a manner that bluntly stated his beef; at face value, I believe him. Further, I like his last paragraph, because as a member of the mafia he could have easily used this conversation to derail or antagonize as a way to manipulate the thread, but he left it alone.

In summary, INH noted my declaration to use POE, noted a fair criticism of its approach in this game, then after engaging with me a bit further on it, clearly stated his beef with it, that he will be using a different method, and was willing to leave it at that. I see no nefarious avenue for the way he approached this situation, only a fellow member of the town sincerely expressing his concerns and approach to the game.

It's not much, but I think already the strategy conversation at least generated a potentially useful read. What do you think?

[Scotty]

Hi.

JJJ is bad.



If anyone wants me, I'll be listening to REM

[Tangrowth]

How ironic that through sharing your perspectives against POE that I have cleared you from my current suspect pool using POE, INH? You like that? Here, enjoy that slight town read.

insertnamehere

For now.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I am townreading that highlighted bit. That sentiment is constructed in a manner that bluntly stated his beef; at face value, I believe him. Further, I like his last paragraph, because as a member of the mafia he could have easily used this conversation to derail or antagonize as a way to manipulate the thread, but he left it alone.

In summary, INH noted my declaration to use POE, noted a fair criticism of its approach in this game, then after engaging with me a bit further on it, clearly stated his beef with it, that he will be using a different method, and was willing to leave it at that. I see no nefarious avenue for the way he approached this situation, only a fellow member of the town sincerely expressing his concerns and approach to the game.

It's not much, but I think already the strategy conversation at least generated a potentially useful read. What do you think?

I think INH completely misinterpreted/misrepresented my perspective (I won't even be using much PoE myself in this game, he assumed the contrary based on I don't know what). That happens in every game we play together though so shrug. We seem to have some core inability to understand one another that has never ceased.

I think his stance on the issue suits his meta, which is a decent enough look so early in the game that there's nothing better to say.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Hi.

JJJ is bad.



If anyone wants me, I'll be listening to REM

Hi Scotty.

No. What's your beef?

[Tangrowth]

Hi.

JJJ is bad.



If anyone wants me, I'll be listening to REM

Give me some substantiation for that assertion, brother! You should know me better by now that I wouldn't let you just leave a gut read like that without a request for elaboration.

[Golden]

brother!

Save it for Lost Again.

[Tangrowth]

I am townreading that highlighted bit. That sentiment is constructed in a manner that bluntly stated his beef; at face value, I believe him. Further, I like his last paragraph, because as a member of the mafia he could have easily used this conversation to derail or antagonize as a way to manipulate the thread, but he left it alone.

In summary, INH noted my declaration to use POE, noted a fair criticism of its approach in this game, then after engaging with me a bit further on it, clearly stated his beef with it, that he will be using a different method, and was willing to leave it at that. I see no nefarious avenue for the way he approached this situation, only a fellow member of the town sincerely expressing his concerns and approach to the game.

It's not much, but I think already the strategy conversation at least generated a potentially useful read. What do you think?

I think INH completely misinterpreted/misrepresented my perspective (I won't even be using much PoE myself in this game, he assumed the contrary based on I don't know what). That happens in every game we play together though so shrug. We seem to have some core inability to understand one another that has never ceased.

I think his stance on the issue suits his meta, which is a decent enough look so early in the game that there's nothing better to say.

That's fair, but I think you're somewhat missing the point that I'm making. Don't you agree that there is potential for a mafia INH to have engaged in that conversation in a more antagonistic or opportunistic manner? I don't see the avenue for it based on the way he approached it.

I know it's weak, but I feel like this is significant given how early we are in the game, and I want opinions on this. Am I reading too much into this or am I onto something?

[Tangrowth]

brother!

Save it for Lost Again.

I'm too excited, can't help myself.

[Golden]

I want to town read you and Golden, but I cannot justify that quite yet, because I would expect the three of us to mindmeld on all of this regardless of alignment.

I feel there should be no legitimate reason to townread me yet. I haven't read the thread or the rules even. All I've done is talk philosophy and needled people for fun. So I'm glad you can't justify it. I think it would have been too soon.

Makes me feel like this is not scrimmage MP. That's good.

[Tangrowth]

Actually MP, your post count has already jumped to an obscene place. I'm not sure I've seen it quite like this since you started Transistor with 57 posts before the second-highest poster made it to #8.

You over-eager cuz you bad, m8?

Furthermore, I could say that this was a bit of a softball, Jay, fabricated to seem as though you care about uncovering my alignment, but with no actual value in determining that or in generating useful conversation.

What would you say in response to that?