The Syndicate

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 7:14 pm

Cape90 wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 7:02 pm Hello everyone!

How's it going, Cape? Is this our first game? I cannot recall for sure. I have spectated or hosted you, certainly.

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 7:46 pmHoly cow! Playing with JJJ not in a champs game is pretty sweet

Also, I can confirm votes are changeable, as I already clicked on the ‘view without voting’ which always locks me out if votes aren’t changeable

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 7:03 pm Some setup notes to be aware of moving forward:

The numbers ratio established in the OP is 12 vs. 4. This is a difficult but not unmanageable arrangement for town, particularly without the benefit of public role reveals.

If the game proceeds at a normal pace (one day elimination and one night kill per cycle), town only gets three mistakes before they reach an endgame phase. Town also boasts one kill (through the Dani Rojas role), but that kill alone would not change this number. It's still three mistakes maximum, and the mafia have two manners of kill protection available to them anyway.

The only way that number changes is with multiple night kill protections and/or a protection plus a kill (I think that works out).

With that in mind, we should just operate under the assumption at present that we are only allowed to make three mistakes. That is not very many. So we are going to have to play hard as a town team to overcome that. It can be done, but it will require concerted desire from everyone to make it so. So let's do that. The best weapon town possesses in a game like this is its ability to talk during the day phase, and so talk we must. Inactivity is more damaging in this setup than it would be in other setups. Mafia already boast a considerable voting block, and we must avoid helping them by unnecessarily splitting our votes or by leaving our votes off the board. These things routinely lose games, and they are unforced errors. We can avoid them if we are conscious of it and communicate effectively.

"Stop telling me how to play, Jay."

I appreciate everyone's right to do their thing, and I hope that's exactly what you do. Play however you like! I just want to emphasize that we begin this game in a difficult position, and that will not change for the better unless we cooperate.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 7:52 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 7:46 pmHoly cow! Playing with JJJ not in a champs game is pretty sweet

Also, I can confirm votes are changeable, as I already clicked on the ‘view without voting’ which always locks me out if votes aren’t changeable

Good to know, thanks. I'm still afraid to click the radio buttons, but eventually it'll happen.

Are we going to be best friends in this game, Scotty? Or will we have problems?

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 7:55 pm I dunno, JJJ. I’m just a dichromatic ball with factory-grade stitching.

Depends on how hard you kick me

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 7:57 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 7:55 pm I dunno, JJJ. I’m just a dichromatic ball with factory-grade stitching.

Depends on how hard you kick me

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:04 pm Sooooo if I’m reading it right, Rupert’s money is responsible for the killing? So can they choose not to kill?

S~V~S wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 7:06 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 6:44 pm

Bereft wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 6:40 pm 'Been a prosperous Tuesday, ye.

Surprised to see you in a game.

Bless. And I am surprised too. JaggedJimmyJay is a memory of the Mafia world, an old pile of bones with a plaque situated in front of them recounting great deeds lost to history, interesting only to the most bored passers-by at The Syndicate Museum of Mafia.

You kicked towns ass in Epis Don't Starve game, so I would think there's probably some life left in those bones yet.

@DarlingMonroe back in the day, if we had info, we took it and used it as a starting point to build a case, not unlike a murder mystery. Building the case isn't hard once you know a person is bad, it's easy to find the bread crumbs. What's hard is getting other people to listen to you.

Linki @Jay, see you're looking pretty alive to me.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:08 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:04 pm Sooooo if I’m reading it right, Rupert’s money is responsible for the killing? So can they choose not to kill?

Probably. My interpretation is that they have to purchase kills (implying they can decline to do so), and that while Rupert is alive he is the only one that can kill. Then once he goes, any of the others can kill.

Important for any investigative roles out there to think about (i.e., tracker/watcher).

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:10 pm Hey, y'all. Let's lasso some varmints!

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:10 pm Hey, y'all. Let's lasso some varmints!

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:17 pm so far, cape’s entrance is the most blendy.
‘Hi!’
Hello

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:20 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:17 pm so far, cape’s entrance is the most blendy.
‘Hi!’
Hello

Agreed. I actually went back and looked at a town game of his (JJJ's Bad First Dates) for an immediate comparison, and at least there it was a slow start for Cape. So I will withhold too much judgment. But I recognize your viewpoint.

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:23 pm Ok real talk/ how do you approach D1’s? Because obviously there’s meta, but I would expect people to try and subvert it.

Like, I always struggle with the vibe approach

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:17 pm so far, cape’s entrance is the most blendy.
‘Hi!’
Hello

Cape90 wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:44 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:17 pm so far, cape’s entrance is the most blendy.
‘Hi!’
Hello

Yeah I am kinda here with muted energy admittedly

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:46 pm

Cape90 wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:44 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:17 pm so far, cape’s entrance is the most blendy.
‘Hi!’
Hello

Yeah I am kinda here with muted energy admittedly

Why do you think that is?

Cape90 wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:50 pm That's about that i have, as boring as it is

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:53 pm

Cape90 wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:50 pm That's about that i have, as boring as it is

That's not boring at all. It's four entire reads. Thank you for your service.

What makes you lean that way on DarlingMonroe and I?

DarlingMonroe wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 6:58 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 6:45 pm

DarlingMonroe wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 6:41 pm Thank you, Jx3!

& for the bolded, just to the type/style of comments or gameplay, etc..

Happy to be of service. By all means, if you think that will help you, then do your thing. Would you say there was anything you picked up in your experience with the Severance game that you'll apply to this game?

Don't worry, this isn't a job interview. Necessarily.

Trust my instinct/gut more. I played a little too passively; perhaps it would have been more useful to town if I had contributed more, perhaps not.

Any advice from a master like you, JJJ?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:59 pm @Bereft could you confirm that you're able to move your vote if you want to?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:29 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:23 pm Ok real talk/ how do you approach D1’s? Because obviously there’s meta, but I would expect people to try and subvert it.

Like, I always struggle with the vibe approach

Meta is fine, and I think it's okay to operate on that basis -- at least inasmuch as you feel like you have a nuanced grasp of what a player is supposed to look like. Sometimes meta reads are too generic to be useful (e.g., "so and so is usually nice, but now they're grumpy") or too specific (e.g., "five games ago when so and so was town, they placed the second vote of the day, but this time they didn't vote until fifth). Find the sweet spot in between, and it's at least worth exploring. Hell, sometimes even the generic reads are worth posting even if they should be taken with a grain of salt.

Day 1 is, for me, about setting the table for the future by establishing communicative links between players. You might recall the lengthy analyses I have posted in yesteryear about "interactions with mafia" or "blind interactions" -- these analyses rely upon a thick game thread with interactions in it, and players have to proactively create those interactions. So I try to do that. From the standpoint of making reads and determining who to vote out, my process is largely process of elimination. I personally find it easier to identify town players early in a game, and that is where I focus. Sometimes when town shines brightly enough, that constricts the pool of choices sufficiently to vote out either a legitimate suspect or a total null read with a heightened probability of a mafia flip.

No process is perfect, but that general approach has worked well enough for me. If a game is active enough, sometimes I will even engage in deep analysis on Day 1 -- but that requires consistent high activity across the roster. If at some point you feel like you're stuck in the Day 1 mud, just say so. Perhaps that will on its own power be the foundation of an interesting dialogue.

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 9:27 pm Though I don’t know how you can have a deep analysis on D1

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 10:36 pm Of the people who've posted so far, I see the least town in Thunal. On that front, I'd call the current wagon reasonable. I could make an argument for Long Con if I am true to the word "least", but his one post was fine.

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 10:43 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 10:36 pm Of the people who've posted so far, I see the least town in Thunal. On that front, I'd call the current wagon reasonable. I could make an argument for Long Con if I am true to the word "least", but his one post was fine.

Was it fine though? I used mild humour. Isn't that a wolf red flag?

I was thinking about the game so far, and I was like, "Okay, if it comes down to me or JJJ for some reason, I'm going down just based on his post count alone." I wanted to ask you for examples of wolf games with very high post counts, because you're already looking so towny with your level of involvement.

The conclusion of this line of thought was to say that I think I do better, involvement-wise, if you ask me questions. I'm naturally more of a listener than a talker. This goes for anyone, but Sir JJJ is Mr Engagement, so I figured it's right up his alley.

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 10:43 pmThe conclusion of this line of thought was to say that I think I do better, involvement-wise, if you ask me questions. I'm naturally more of a listener than a talker. This goes for anyone, but Sir JJJ is Mr Engagement, so I figured it's right up his alley.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 10:50 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 10:43 pmThe conclusion of this line of thought was to say that I think I do better, involvement-wise, if you ask me questions. I'm naturally more of a listener than a talker. This goes for anyone, but Sir JJJ is Mr Engagement, so I figured it's right up his alley.

Questions for Long Con:

Do you have any initial impressions of the folks you know best (e.g., S~V~S or Scotty)?

How do you feel about the two votes currently in the poll?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 10:48 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 10:43 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 10:36 pm Of the people who've posted so far, I see the least town in Thunal. On that front, I'd call the current wagon reasonable. I could make an argument for Long Con if I am true to the word "least", but his one post was fine.

Was it fine though? I used mild humour. Isn't that a wolf red flag?

I was thinking about the game so far, and I was like, "Okay, if it comes down to me or JJJ for some reason, I'm going down just based on his post count alone." I wanted to ask you for examples of wolf games with very high post counts, because you're already looking so towny with your level of involvement.

The conclusion of this line of thought was to say that I think I do better, involvement-wise, if you ask me questions. I'm naturally more of a listener than a talker. This goes for anyone, but Sir JJJ is Mr Engagement, so I figured it's right up his alley.

I can give you a few recent or semi-recent mafia-aligned games. I've been mafia constantly in my "recent" games over the last couple years (out of the small number of games I have played).

Me in Don't Starve
Me in Kid's Birthday Party
Me in Halvosen Ridge
Me in Stardew 2 (Student Doctor Network)

All of those are at least reasonably high in posts.

I'd be pleased to ask you some questions. I'll write a separate post.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:08 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 8:04 pm Sooooo if I’m reading it right, Rupert’s money is responsible for the killing? So can they choose not to kill?

Probably. My interpretation is that they have to purchase kills (implying they can decline to do so), and that while Rupert is alive he is the only one that can kill. Then once he goes, any of the others can kill.

Important for any investigative roles out there to think about (i.e., tracker/watcher).

Thunal33 wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 11:09 pm I didn't think about him being the only person who can kill, but that makes sense. That makes it much more important for Rupert to avoid sus than the other mafia and he might act differently because of that pressure. Kind of reminds me of John Doe in se7en where that role was important so SVS had pressure to go deep with it.

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2023 11:15 pm I was wondering why Thunal had the votes, but then I went through his ISO...



Got'im!