Murder, Mayhem, and Mafia
https://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/
I'm not conjecturing, I'm making a logical conclusion based off your words:MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 8:56 pm1. Remove anything substantiated by "Seemingly". You're conjecturing here, and I tend to be very specific with my wording and intents.Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 8:50 pmYou're either missing my point or dodging it.MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 8:44 pmI just explained it in the above.Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 8:39 pmWhy did you switch from seeming to think there could be a second healer to then seeing to think there absolutely couldn't be one?MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 8:37 pmNo I haven't, I think Seanzie's question was intended for you and I thought the suggestion was ridiculous.JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 7:29 pm Your question is a valid one Seanzie. That’s rather on the nose. Has Martin answered this?
I don't see why I wouldn't mention anything I said in that post.
If I'm going to say that Long Con very likely dies, then I don't see anything in that post as being unnecessary to making that point.
1.) You started by claiming healer, and seemingly in your claim you would not at all be surprised to see a second healer claim, but then
2.) Not long afterwards, you seemed to express strong conviction that there couldn't be a second healer in the game.
These things don't jive. Please explain your thoughts, what led you from 1 to 2?
Besides, if I had any real belief that there was a 2nd healer then I would not have warned Long Con. That simple.
However, I don't know if others have a different vision of the setup. So in order to make my point I have to mention the possibilities that may seem likely from theirs, but aren't from mine.
2. This doesn't conflict with #1. Number 2 is a clarification after all.
Your claim consists more of talking about the possibility of a second healer than it does claiming what you actually did. Maybe you're just being verbose, but your intent to a reasonable audience seems to be to not discredit the fact that there could be another healer. You say that you have to mention possibilities that seem likely from other's perspectives but not from yours... but you don't indicate that is what you are doing at all, so, again, to any reasonable audience, what you are saying now doesn't line up well with what you said then. I may be conjecturing, but surprisingly... pretty much all of mafia consists of conjecturing... unless you're a wolf;)MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Thu May 27, 2021 4:16 pm @Long Con
Unless there's another 1-shot healer, I want to put you on notice that you may be actually dying from poison.
I don't think there's fake poisons given that I'm 1-shot, though I realize that can also be indicative of having the healing ability split up. I doubt that though because there's, to my knowledge, no way to prevent two healers from accidentally healing the same person on the same day.
Basically, as I see it in chronological order:
Please tell me you are trolling.Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 8:53 pmSure, but sometimes things that don't quite fit actually do fit, you just were trying to put them on inside-out. I agree it doesn't quite fit, but that doesn't mean it isn't a possible truth, or a possible near-truth.Guillotine wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 8:50 pmIt doesn't fit. I'm sure I don't have to explain why it does not as you admitted it just does not fit.
Uh, how?
No, I'm telling you that a 3p poisoner with an unknown wincon that made a super duper shady vote last night that could get attention today could be trying to make sure they survive another day by starting off the day with a very believable claim, setting themselves up to win a claim-battle, because maybe they need one more day to fulfil their wincon. Or because of some other unknown possibility that I can't think of. Again, I'm not saying it is like super likely or anything, but I don't see it as out of the realm of possibilities. You think very 1-dimensionally about the game and setups sometimes, but I do not.Guillotine wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 9:13 pmPlease tell me you are trolling.Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 8:53 pmSure, but sometimes things that don't quite fit actually do fit, you just were trying to put them on inside-out. I agree it doesn't quite fit, but that doesn't mean it isn't a possible truth, or a possible near-truth.Guillotine wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 8:50 pmIt doesn't fit. I'm sure I don't have to explain why it does not as you admitted it just does not fit.
Are you telling me that a 3P Poisoner is gonna out himself to bait the healer out with a fake healer claim?
What do you mean "Uh, how?"? Please, quote yourself point out the words where you indicate that this is what you are doing.MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 9:18 pmUh, how?
Isn't it obvious that is what I'm doing?
Like how about I just say
"Long con you're going to die"
It doesn't have the same character.
If I doubted there was another healer, but wanted to mention the possibility, I'd say something likeMartinGG99 wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 9:18 pmUh, how?
Isn't it obvious that is what I'm doing?
Like how about I just say
"Long con you're going to die"
It doesn't have the same character.
"Uh, How?" is referring to your statement.Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 9:21 pmWhat do you mean "Uh, how?"? Please, quote yourself point out the words where you indicate that this is what you are doing.MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 9:18 pmUh, how?
Isn't it obvious that is what I'm doing?
Like how about I just say
"Long con you're going to die"
It doesn't have the same character.
LOL I do not, I apply common sense, Martin is never the 3P here, never, never, not one single tenth of a million chance.Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 9:19 pmNo, I'm telling you that a 3p poisoner with an unknown wincon that made a super duper shady vote last night that could get attention today could be trying to make sure they survive another day by starting off the day with a very believable claim, setting themselves up to win a claim-battle, because maybe they need one more day to fulfil their wincon. Or because of some other unknown possibility that I can't think of. Again, I'm not saying it is like super likely or anything, but I don't see it as out of the realm of possibilities. You think very 1-dimensionally about the game and setups sometimes, but I do not.Guillotine wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 9:13 pmPlease tell me you are trolling.Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 8:53 pmSure, but sometimes things that don't quite fit actually do fit, you just were trying to put them on inside-out. I agree it doesn't quite fit, but that doesn't mean it isn't a possible truth, or a possible near-truth.Guillotine wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 8:50 pmIt doesn't fit. I'm sure I don't have to explain why it does not as you admitted it just does not fit.
Are you telling me that a 3P Poisoner is gonna out himself to bait the healer out with a fake healer claim?
Well, it was valid.
I think this is a question that is best answered tomorrow if and only if it needs to be answered.JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 9:42 pm Point: if hawk flips town does that actually confirm Sloonei as non-mafia (or come close)? His alleged vest would be the last known explanation for a failed kill.
We know it contained at least two wolves. I believe it contained at least a third in Hawk. The only way LC is bad is if he gifted me a fake vest and was poisoned by a third party role. I think having three wolves on the wagon is plenty, and if they piled on any more than that then they are playing pretty fast and loose.
I think Jay has mentioned the possibility that Made might be scum. What do you think?Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 10:51 pmWe know it contained at least two wolves. I believe it contained at least a third in Hawk. The only way LC is bad is if he gifted me a fake vest and was poisoned by a third party role. I think having three wolves on the wagon is plenty, and if they piled on any more than that then they are playing pretty fast and loose.
I was on it because I thought Made’s vote for nutella looked worse than nutella herself.
Based on the wagons Day 1, I’ll call it unlikely but not impossible. Owner was the distant third wagon. Both owner and nutella were on Made. Hawk cast a conspicuous last minute vote for Made too. If all three wagons are mafia then Made would have to have been deemed the most expendable member of the team.Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 10:59 pmI think Jay has mentioned the possibility that Made might be scum. What do you think?Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 10:51 pmWe know it contained at least two wolves. I believe it contained at least a third in Hawk. The only way LC is bad is if he gifted me a fake vest and was poisoned by a third party role. I think having three wolves on the wagon is plenty, and if they piled on any more than that then they are playing pretty fast and loose.
I was on it because I thought Made’s vote for nutella looked worse than nutella herself.
If there was scum on Nutella, who do you think it would be?Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 11:02 pmBased on the wagons Day 1, I’ll call it unlikely but not impossible. Owner was the distant third wagon. Both owner and nutella were on Made. Hawk cast a conspicuous last minute vote for Made too. If all three wagons are mafia then Made would have to have been deemed the most expendable member of the team.Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 10:59 pmI think Jay has mentioned the possibility that Made might be scum. What do you think?Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 10:51 pmWe know it contained at least two wolves. I believe it contained at least a third in Hawk. The only way LC is bad is if he gifted me a fake vest and was poisoned by a third party role. I think having three wolves on the wagon is plenty, and if they piled on any more than that then they are playing pretty fast and loose.
I was on it because I thought Made’s vote for nutella looked worse than nutella herself.
He would not be the first place I look.
Allcrab has claimed the same thing as LoMo, with the same target. I am not sure what to make of it. I am also not sure if the claim is AI. Granted, as of right now, both Nutella and Owner have had claims with mafia-specific powers, so I am starting to think that the game had specific roles for mafia and specific roles for town. If this is true, since there wasn't a lot of evidence in the thread at that point to suggest duplicate roles, but now there is strong evidence, I'd say Allcrab's claim looks good, yes. This might also look good for Bunny since Allcrab apparently has a godread on Bunny.
Yeah, no I only give out vests on odd nights.Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 9:57 pm Also, while speaking of information that should be shared only at specific times under specific circumstances,
@Long Con, I was thinking, you may at some point before EoD want to share if you gave away a second object, but probably shouldn't share whom you gave it to if you gave a second one away. This will help town mech solve and limit mafia's ability to claim stuff (Oh, I am the reason there wasn't a NK last night, because LC gave me a vest N2, and just didn't mention it! Therefore I must be town!). Up to you though if you also think it is a good idea or not.
Aside from Hawk this seems fairly anti-cooperation with the mafia team, regardless of whether Made is town or mafia, unless we're thinking significant distancing. At EoD his vote is on Owner too, instead of made (if we presume "Made is disposable mafia theory").
Is there a strong reason to townread Guillotine?
RE: “town” roles versus “mafia” roles, I was roleblocked last night, apparently by someone other than Gavial.Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 11:16 pmAllcrab has claimed the same thing as LoMo, with the same target. I am not sure what to make of it. I am also not sure if the claim is AI. Granted, as of right now, both Nutella and Owner have had claims with mafia-specific powers, so I am starting to think that the game had specific roles for mafia and specific roles for town. If this is true, since there wasn't a lot of evidence in the thread at that point to suggest duplicate roles, but now there is strong evidence, I'd say Allcrab's claim looks good, yes. This might also look good for Bunny since Allcrab apparently has a godread on Bunny.
Yes, I saw that. I am not sure exactly what to think. You're not the most clear person, so it is possible you were targeted by town, but it is also not inconsistent with having specific roles for town and mafia if you were targeted by mafia. Like... the setup could have included a specific mafia roleblocker and a town roleblocker, similarly to how I kind of believe that there might be a town and mafia healer. I think it is a bit less likely that the setup would include a specific mafia watcher since watcher is kind of an awkward mafia role - not without utility, but you wouldn't think of it as a mafia role.Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 11:44 pmRE: “town” roles versus “mafia” roles, I was roleblocked last night, apparently by someone other than Gavial.Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 11:16 pmAllcrab has claimed the same thing as LoMo, with the same target. I am not sure what to make of it. I am also not sure if the claim is AI. Granted, as of right now, both Nutella and Owner have had claims with mafia-specific powers, so I am starting to think that the game had specific roles for mafia and specific roles for town. If this is true, since there wasn't a lot of evidence in the thread at that point to suggest duplicate roles, but now there is strong evidence, I'd say Allcrab's claim looks good, yes. This might also look good for Bunny since Allcrab apparently has a godread on Bunny.
Hope you're okay. We'll only yeet you if we really feel like it.
It is not unheard of here for roles to be duplicated to some degree across alignments, or for roles to appear opposite of the alignment which they would have the most utility for. Mafia trackers/watchers are not super uncommon on the syndicate, i don't think.Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 11:50 pmYes, I saw that. I am not sure exactly what to think. You're not the most clear person, so it is possible you were targeted by town, but it is also not inconsistent with having specific roles for town and mafia if you were targeted by mafia. Like... the setup could have included a specific mafia roleblocker and a town roleblocker, similarly to how I kind of believe that there might be a town and mafia healer. I think it is a bit less likely that the setup would include a specific mafia watcher since watcher is kind of an awkward mafia role - not without utility, but you wouldn't think of it as a mafia role.Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 11:44 pmRE: “town” roles versus “mafia” roles, I was roleblocked last night, apparently by someone other than Gavial.Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 11:16 pmAllcrab has claimed the same thing as LoMo, with the same target. I am not sure what to make of it. I am also not sure if the claim is AI. Granted, as of right now, both Nutella and Owner have had claims with mafia-specific powers, so I am starting to think that the game had specific roles for mafia and specific roles for town. If this is true, since there wasn't a lot of evidence in the thread at that point to suggest duplicate roles, but now there is strong evidence, I'd say Allcrab's claim looks good, yes. This might also look good for Bunny since Allcrab apparently has a godread on Bunny.
Other setups I've seen though, have the same set of roles, and they get randed to everyone and alignments are randed independently, and so sometimes mafia ends up with roles that are kind of questionable for mafia to have. This doesn't seem like that though.
Mac said he roleblocked you. I wasn't sure if he was joking or not.Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat May 29, 2021 12:00 amIt is not unheard of here for roles to be duplicated to some degree across alignments, or for roles to appear opposite of the alignment which they would have the most utility for. Mafia trackers/watchers are not super uncommon on the syndicate, i don't think.Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 11:50 pmYes, I saw that. I am not sure exactly what to think. You're not the most clear person, so it is possible you were targeted by town, but it is also not inconsistent with having specific roles for town and mafia if you were targeted by mafia. Like... the setup could have included a specific mafia roleblocker and a town roleblocker, similarly to how I kind of believe that there might be a town and mafia healer. I think it is a bit less likely that the setup would include a specific mafia watcher since watcher is kind of an awkward mafia role - not without utility, but you wouldn't think of it as a mafia role.Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 11:44 pmRE: “town” roles versus “mafia” roles, I was roleblocked last night, apparently by someone other than Gavial.Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 11:16 pmAllcrab has claimed the same thing as LoMo, with the same target. I am not sure what to make of it. I am also not sure if the claim is AI. Granted, as of right now, both Nutella and Owner have had claims with mafia-specific powers, so I am starting to think that the game had specific roles for mafia and specific roles for town. If this is true, since there wasn't a lot of evidence in the thread at that point to suggest duplicate roles, but now there is strong evidence, I'd say Allcrab's claim looks good, yes. This might also look good for Bunny since Allcrab apparently has a godread on Bunny.
Other setups I've seen though, have the same set of roles, and they get randed to everyone and alignments are randed independently, and so sometimes mafia ends up with roles that are kind of questionable for mafia to have. This doesn't seem like that though.
This is not an accusation against either of allcrab or lomo. I'm just weighing in on setup speculation in general.
I would be a little surprised if there was a town roleblocker but not a mafia one.
You cant chop me, i can cruise the rest of the game unchopped if i wanted to. If you want me gone you have options though.
how comeGuillotine wrote: ↑Sat May 29, 2021 12:32 amYou cant chop me, i can cruise the rest of the game unchopped if i wanted to. If you want me gone you have options though.
1) Make me quit (very hard to do)
2) Day vig me
3) Night kill me.
I'll never get yeeted in this game, ever.
Because im obvious town baby! Suck on that tit.MacDougall wrote: ↑Sat May 29, 2021 12:44 amhow comeGuillotine wrote: ↑Sat May 29, 2021 12:32 amYou cant chop me, i can cruise the rest of the game unchopped if i wanted to. If you want me gone you have options though.
1) Make me quit (very hard to do)
2) Day vig me
3) Night kill me.
I'll never get yeeted in this game, ever.
It was fun, lol.Actvscenei wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 9:01 pm @hawkataine, do you really believe your ISO of gnome or...?? Lol the only thing from gnome that feels unlike what I know of her, is the sarcasm. I don’t recall gnome ever being this snarky and sarcastic in past games lol. Like, gnome’s got sass! Lol
mmm guillo lactateGuillotine wrote: ↑Sat May 29, 2021 1:27 amBecause im obvious town baby! Suck on that tit.MacDougall wrote: ↑Sat May 29, 2021 12:44 amhow comeGuillotine wrote: ↑Sat May 29, 2021 12:32 amYou cant chop me, i can cruise the rest of the game unchopped if i wanted to. If you want me gone you have options though.
1) Make me quit (very hard to do)
2) Day vig me
3) Night kill me.
I'll never get yeeted in this game, ever.
Aside from Hawk, who else do you think is scum?Garden Gnome wrote: ↑Sat May 29, 2021 2:00 amIt was fun, lol.Actvscenei wrote: ↑Fri May 28, 2021 9:01 pm @hawkataine, do you really believe your ISO of gnome or...?? Lol the only thing from gnome that feels unlike what I know of her, is the sarcasm. I don’t recall gnome ever being this snarky and sarcastic in past games lol. Like, gnome’s got sass! Lol