The Syndicate

If the team is Creature/Finger then Finger has to try to save Creature no? Like in that scenario if Creature goes over yesterday I don't think finger can survive 2 day phases. Your argument seems to be that if Finger did that she'd know she'd get turbo'd tomorrow and that Creature would look terrible off her flip... but a) I don't think she can win anyway if Creature goes over, and b) she clearly isn't getting turbo'd today even though Nate went over so where is the idea that finger is going to be auto at F5 coming from?

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:25 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 7:44 am gonna rp the wolf team stratagem if it is Creature/Fingers/JJJ

Fingers is somehow around late at night to make a quick vote on Nate to save Creature, peaces off immediately afterwards, knowing that that will immediately put sus on her.

Wolves here needs to know that either Fingers get turbo yeeted into the moon the very next day and that wolf flip will look horrible for Creature, or bet their banks on taking me down today (or that Creature somehow thinks he can bury me in a F3, which doesn't happen).

so like, i guess it depends on how the day pans out, but right now Fingers look like a tool for wolves to get me misyeeted today.

Like, this post?

This doesn't read like you're clearing Creature/Finger - you you outright say that Finger is a tool for the wolves to get you misexed. Am I reading you wrong?

I strongly suggest that you read my solving in chronological order.

start here
will wait with addressing your points until after tbh

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 7:15 am some quick notes before i forget with d3 votes

JJJ voters: Ender, Dizzy, Marmot, and Lucy

Ender's eod wagon:
[] = unvotes
JJJ, [Creature], [Rondo], Alison, Marmot, Boq, Lucy, Dizzy
I know from a fact that from Marmot, it is only town voting Ender.
I am also noting that JJJ unvoted Ender for a moment to vote me. Rondo followed.

As for Creature wagon...

Nate, then Dizzy (unvotes, revotes, unvotes), Finger, Rondo.
At the point of Rondo's Creature vote, Ender is at 3, JJJ at 2, Alison at 2.

Rondo is probably not wolf with Creature.

Finger also puts Creature at 3 (Dizzy later unvotes). JJJ at 1 at that time, Ender at 2 (so finger's vote puts Creature in the lead), Alison at 2, Me at 1.
This makes me think that Finger is not wolf with Creature.

When Dizzy votes JJJ, the wagons are JJJ (2), Ender (2), Creature (2), Boq (1), Alison (2).
Alison is the next voter. She votes Ender, putting him in majority.

Alison was voted by three people: Me, Dizzy, Marmot - so i know at least that this is pure.

Gonna check D4 now.

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:29 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:25 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 7:44 am gonna rp the wolf team stratagem if it is Creature/Fingers/JJJ

Fingers is somehow around late at night to make a quick vote on Nate to save Creature, peaces off immediately afterwards, knowing that that will immediately put sus on her.

Wolves here needs to know that either Fingers get turbo yeeted into the moon the very next day and that wolf flip will look horrible for Creature, or bet their banks on taking me down today (or that Creature somehow thinks he can bury me in a F3, which doesn't happen).

so like, i guess it depends on how the day pans out, but right now Fingers look like a tool for wolves to get me misyeeted today.

Like, this post?

This doesn't read like you're clearing Creature/Finger - you you outright say that Finger is a tool for the wolves to get you misexed. Am I reading you wrong?

I strongly suggest that you read my solving in chronological order.

I am reading in chronological order and I don't understand it.

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:30 am start here
will wait with addressing your points until after tbh

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 7:15 am some quick notes before i forget with d3 votes

JJJ voters: Ender, Dizzy, Marmot, and Lucy

Ender's eod wagon:
[] = unvotes
JJJ, [Creature], [Rondo], Alison, Marmot, Boq, Lucy, Dizzy
I know from a fact that from Marmot, it is only town voting Ender.
I am also noting that JJJ unvoted Ender for a moment to vote me. Rondo followed.

As for Creature wagon...

Nate, then Dizzy (unvotes, revotes, unvotes), Finger, Rondo.
At the point of Rondo's Creature vote, Ender is at 3, JJJ at 2, Alison at 2.

Rondo is probably not wolf with Creature.

Finger also puts Creature at 3 (Dizzy later unvotes). JJJ at 1 at that time, Ender at 2 (so finger's vote puts Creature in the lead), Alison at 2, Me at 1.
This makes me think that Finger is not wolf with Creature.

When Dizzy votes JJJ, the wagons are JJJ (2), Ender (2), Creature (2), Boq (1), Alison (2).
Alison is the next voter. She votes Ender, putting him in majority.

Alison was voted by three people: Me, Dizzy, Marmot - so i know at least that this is pure.

Gonna check D4 now.

Ok, so you're clearing Finger/Creature off Finger putting Creature in the lead on D3, yes?

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:32 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:29 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:25 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 7:44 am gonna rp the wolf team stratagem if it is Creature/Fingers/JJJ

Fingers is somehow around late at night to make a quick vote on Nate to save Creature, peaces off immediately afterwards, knowing that that will immediately put sus on her.

Wolves here needs to know that either Fingers get turbo yeeted into the moon the very next day and that wolf flip will look horrible for Creature, or bet their banks on taking me down today (or that Creature somehow thinks he can bury me in a F3, which doesn't happen).

so like, i guess it depends on how the day pans out, but right now Fingers look like a tool for wolves to get me misyeeted today.

Like, this post?

This doesn't read like you're clearing Creature/Finger - you you outright say that Finger is a tool for the wolves to get you misexed. Am I reading you wrong?

I strongly suggest that you read my solving in chronological order.

I am reading in chronological order and I don't understand it.

the post you quoted is at the end of it

Hmm

I guess if it was Ender 2 Alison 2 then putting Creature at 3 makes less sense if they're mafia together.

i need to go for a walk to get air, have been inside the whole day tbh

will re-quote my progression so it is easier to follow and conversate about when i get home

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:33 am Hmm

I guess if it was Ender 2 Alison 2 then putting Creature at 3 makes less sense if they're mafia together.

yes

Okay I think I get where you're coming from now.

finger/Creature, let's say this is a clear because of the D3 votes
finger/Alison I know is not true and you should too unless you think I was bussing her for days on end
finger/Boq I haven't cleared yet, will need to comb through that giant mess of interactions you quoted, but will keep an open mind on it
finger/Rondo can't be because Rondo didn't care to move his vote at all when finger was in the lead and a townie was the counterwagon

I think that is actually quite good, if I can clear finger/Boq then I can clear finger altogether

Boq's progression on finger makes sense here then.

But if Boq is town who is right on finger then... the mafia is Creature and Rondo? Not sure I buy that at all. D4 Creature was squatting on Jay and Rondo unvotes Jay's counterwagon so Jay can't snipe a tie. It's like they coordinated to get him killed.

I don't think it's Creature/Rondo which means Boq/finger can't be T/T. Which means your worldview has a big problem to me.

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:40 am I don't think it's Creature/Rondo which means Boq/finger can't be T/T. Which means your worldview has a big problem to me.

well the thing is, my worldview has you and Rondo as scum, so that's a problem indeed tbh

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:42 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:40 am I don't think it's Creature/Rondo which means Boq/finger can't be T/T. Which means your worldview has a big problem to me.

well the thing is, my worldview has you and Rondo as scum, so that's a problem indeed tbh

Are you mafia Boq?

I genuinely feel like your solving today is sincere. I read your posts after you clarified and I get where you are coming from. Your progression makes sense to me. But the end result is rotten. Which means either you are mafia snowing me with good solving or you are town and are about to lose us the game.

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:44 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:42 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:40 am I don't think it's Creature/Rondo which means Boq/finger can't be T/T. Which means your worldview has a big problem to me.

well the thing is, my worldview has you and Rondo as scum, so that's a problem indeed tbh

Are you mafia Boq?

Nope

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:42 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:40 am I don't think it's Creature/Rondo which means Boq/finger can't be T/T. Which means your worldview has a big problem to me.

well the thing is, my worldview has you and Rondo as scum, so that's a problem indeed tbh

I could see this

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:48 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:44 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:42 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:40 am I don't think it's Creature/Rondo which means Boq/finger can't be T/T. Which means your worldview has a big problem to me.

well the thing is, my worldview has you and Rondo as scum, so that's a problem indeed tbh

Are you mafia Boq?

Nope

Cool.

I am going to work with you like you are town for today and reserve judgement until after. I get that you currently have me as a suspect and I ask for you to work with me at the same time. If at the end of it I think you are mafia I am going to vote you. If you are town then I think I can get there on you and I think you can get there on me by the end of today. (If we are V/V and we can't then I dunno how we are supposed to win anyway.)

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:46 am I genuinely feel like your solving today is sincere. I read your posts after you clarified and I get where you are coming from. Your progression makes sense to me. But the end result is rotten. Which means either you are mafia snowing me with good solving or you are town and are about to lose us the game.

Kinda dislike the "or you are town and are about to lose us the game" here because
1. It is sorta an attempt to manipulate me emotionally, make me feel bad and step down.
2. It puts an unreasonable amount of guilt on me when you and Rondo have had me as likely scum - thus if one or both of you are town, you are about to lose us the game as well with that logic.

like I said, my solving here isnt done.

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:50 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:48 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:44 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:42 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:40 am I don't think it's Creature/Rondo which means Boq/finger can't be T/T. Which means your worldview has a big problem to me.

well the thing is, my worldview has you and Rondo as scum, so that's a problem indeed tbh

Are you mafia Boq?

Nope

Cool.

I am going to work with you like you are town for today and reserve judgement until after. I get that you currently have me as a suspect and I ask for you to work with me at the same time. If at the end of it I think you are mafia I am going to vote you. If you are town then I think I can get there on you and I think you can get there on me by the end of today. (If we are V/V and we can't then I dunno how we are supposed to win anyway.)

sure, i havent closed any doors yet tbh

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:51 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:46 am I genuinely feel like your solving today is sincere. I read your posts after you clarified and I get where you are coming from. Your progression makes sense to me. But the end result is rotten. Which means either you are mafia snowing me with good solving or you are town and are about to lose us the game.

Kinda dislike the "or you are town and are about to lose us the game" here because
1. It is sorta an attempt to manipulate me emotionally, make me feel bad and step down.
2. It puts an unreasonable amount of guilt on me when you and Rondo have had me as likely scum - thus if one or both of you are town, you are about to lose us the game as well with that logic.

like I said, my solving here isnt done.

I don't AtE in that way and no attempt at inducing emotion was meant. I am simply stating that if you are town and you hold the worldview that I am mafia then I see this as being a loss.

I am not locking you scum and am working with you to avert us losing if I falsely suspect you, for that exact reason.

Talk to me about Rondo, you seem to think he is quite possibly scum. I think EOD4 looks really good for him. What are your thoughts on him?

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:54 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:51 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:46 am I genuinely feel like your solving today is sincere. I read your posts after you clarified and I get where you are coming from. Your progression makes sense to me. But the end result is rotten. Which means either you are mafia snowing me with good solving or you are town and are about to lose us the game.

Kinda dislike the "or you are town and are about to lose us the game" here because
1. It is sorta an attempt to manipulate me emotionally, make me feel bad and step down.
2. It puts an unreasonable amount of guilt on me when you and Rondo have had me as likely scum - thus if one or both of you are town, you are about to lose us the game as well with that logic.

like I said, my solving here isnt done.

I don't AtE in that way and no attempt at inducing emotion was meant. I am simply stating that if you are town and you hold the worldview that I am mafia then I see this as being a loss.

I am not locking you scum and am working with you to avert us losing if I falsely suspect you, for that exact reason.

Talk to me about Rondo, you seem to think he is quite possibly scum. I think EOD4 looks really good for him. What are your thoughts on him?

I agree that Rondo is looking really good with his sleep post, and he has been one of my strongest town reads.
The problem is that I have a lot of reasons to town read everyone based on votes.

I am also reacting to him entering today with the agenda to bury me, but i read in mu's discord channel how that can actually be clearing in a lylo.
So I am kinda at loss. I have him as scum mainly because of poe reasons.

What do you think of Finger's explanation on voting Nate?

I am going to bed but aside from a dnd session tomorrow, I will dedicate my whole day to this game tbh

Damn I don't like this game

I might need to re-review Rondo, but otherwise I'm leaning towards the wolfteam being Alison + Boquise.

lucy dying over Alison is really suspicious and I believe a Rondo/finger team always kills her. Therefore, there's at least one wolf within Alison/Boquise, possibly both.

Also I kind of townread fingersplints.

lol if they are wolf and survived this long untouched.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon Jun 27, 2022 5:34 am I'm now 99% sure Boq is town.

Hmmm

lol.

Ok time to catch up. Its been a day

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:44 am

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:10 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:06 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 5:12 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 3:21 amGood morning

Your thoughts on the game?

I was pretty disheartened by Nate's flip.

I don't know if I should be reconsidering my read on Jay's spew, because I thought it looked pretty bad for Nate and I was wrong.

I think I have either miscleared Rondo or that the team is Creature/fingers. The scum reads on Nate yesterday felt kinda impossible to debate against because everyone had decided he was scum tbh

Also a lot of what you said last night on re-reading felt like you were preparing to rescind your read on me so you saying this just makes me more suspicious

"A lot"? Hardly. I entertained the idea at the end of the day because I still felt like Nate would flip town and I needed to look through my misclearings. Your response about the fingers thing made me eh.

I still dont see why Fingers gets out of her way to vote Nate there if both Creature/Nate are town tbh, and that helps me with my world building.

Fingers thing?

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 7:59 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 7:54 am Creature votes: Nate, Falcon, Nate, Falcon, Ender, Dizzy, Wilgy, Dizzy, Ender, Ender, Nate, Finger, Boq, JJJ, Boq, Nate (i dont remember if Creature voted anyone else but me and Nate on D5).
Kinda unfortunate votals for him. Heavily scum-sided unless Fingers is a wolf.
Dont think Rondo is scum with Creature through this either.

though looking at flipped town's votals, it isnt really damning.

please explain

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Thu Jul 14, 2022 5:13 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:44 am

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:10 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:06 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 5:12 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 3:21 amGood morning

Your thoughts on the game?

I was pretty disheartened by Nate's flip.

I don't know if I should be reconsidering my read on Jay's spew, because I thought it looked pretty bad for Nate and I was wrong.

I think I have either miscleared Rondo or that the team is Creature/fingers. The scum reads on Nate yesterday felt kinda impossible to debate against because everyone had decided he was scum tbh

Also a lot of what you said last night on re-reading felt like you were preparing to rescind your read on me so you saying this just makes me more suspicious

"A lot"? Hardly. I entertained the idea at the end of the day because I still felt like Nate would flip town and I needed to look through my misclearings. Your response about the fingers thing made me eh.

I still dont see why Fingers gets out of her way to vote Nate there if both Creature/Nate are town tbh, and that helps me with my world building.

Fingers thing?

i wrote that you and fingers or you and creature could be scum. You acknowledged that you and Creature could be, but your denial with you/fingers felt manufactured.

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Thu Jul 14, 2022 5:35 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 7:59 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 7:54 am Creature votes: Nate, Falcon, Nate, Falcon, Ender, Dizzy, Wilgy, Dizzy, Ender, Ender, Nate, Finger, Boq, JJJ, Boq, Nate (i dont remember if Creature voted anyone else but me and Nate on D5).
Kinda unfortunate votals for him. Heavily scum-sided unless Fingers is a wolf.
Dont think Rondo is scum with Creature through this either.

though looking at flipped town's votals, it isnt really damning.

please explain

Several flipped town almost solely voted town, like Ender.

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:39 am finger/Creature, let's say this is a clear because of the D3 votes
finger/Alison I know is not true and you should too unless you think I was bussing her for days on end
finger/Boq I haven't cleared yet, will need to comb through that giant mess of interactions you quoted, but will keep an open mind on it
finger/Rondo can't be because Rondo didn't care to move his vote at all when finger was in the lead and a townie was the counterwagon

I think that is actually quite good, if I can clear finger/Boq then I can clear finger altogether

I wanted finger day 2 or something because she was doing shit and all. if it wasnt for creature voting Ender day 3 I would have stayed on her

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 7:15 am some quick notes before i forget with d3 votes

JJJ voters: Ender, Dizzy, Marmot, and Lucy

Ender's eod wagon:
[] = unvotes
JJJ, [Creature], [Rondo], Alison, Marmot, Boq, Lucy, Dizzy
I know from a fact that from Marmot, it is only town voting Ender.
I am also noting that JJJ unvoted Ender for a moment to vote me. Rondo followed.

As for Creature wagon...

Nate, then Dizzy (unvotes, revotes, unvotes), Finger, Rondo.
At the point of Rondo's Creature vote, Ender is at 3, JJJ at 2, Alison at 2.

Rondo is probably not wolf with Creature.

Finger also puts Creature at 3 (Dizzy later unvotes). JJJ at 1 at that time, Ender at 2 (so finger's vote puts Creature in the lead), Alison at 2, Me at 1.
This makes me think that Finger is not wolf with Creature.

When Dizzy votes JJJ, the wagons are JJJ (2), Ender (2), Creature (2), Boq (1), Alison (2).
Alison is the next voter. She votes Ender, putting him in majority.

Alison was voted by three people: Me, Dizzy, Marmot - so i know at least that this is pure.

Gonna check D4 now.

I followed? I dont follow anyone. I do what I want.

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Tue Jul 05, 2022 8:46 pm I really don't like Ender going over here

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Tue Jul 05, 2022 7:47 pm I need to go, there's backup issues I need to sort and me on this forum won't help.

IF I FLIP DO NOT GO AFTER DIZZY OR RONDO.

You can think about them if we actually get to f3, otherwise fuck off.

THERE IS AT MOST ONE WOLF IMO IN CREATURE/NATE/BOQ

I think there's a wolf in Nate but I don't think that's his partners if so, and if he's town I don't think more than one of Boq/Creature is wolf.

I THINK THERE'S AT LEAST ONE WOLF IN ALISON/JAY

This might be wrong and I'll feel stupid if I am but I believe it.

MARMOT/FINGER/LUCY PROBABLY HAS AT LEAST ONE WOLF IN IT

I am constantly revising this last part so eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeh

I was willing to vote anyone on Enders wagon that day. Its exactly why I voted for creature the next day. The only people left alive that were on Enders wagon are You and Alison. Why are you unpaired with her?

@Alison why are you unpaired with boq?

Nate is down. Lets follow Enders read of the game. Leaning towards boq again. Also

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Thu Jul 07, 2022 7:40 am Current standings
JJJ(-1-1=-2-.5=-2.5+0=-2.5)
Boq(-1-1=-2+.5=-1.5-.5=-1) (Edited to fix a misread of wilgy's previous post)
Marmot(-1+1=0-.5=-.5-.5=-1)
Alison(-1+.5=-.5-.5=0+0=0)
Lucy(-1+.5=.5+.5=1+.5=1.5)

My collation of the legacies of known town. The last people who are alive are Boq/Alison

Boquise wrote: ↑Tue Jul 05, 2022 5:52 pm anyway lets play with some of the standard probabilities and world buildings tbh

There is a me/Alison/JJJ group
There is a Dizzy/Marmot/Ender/Nate group
There is a Lucy/Fingers/Rondo/Creature group

Regarding where wolves prefer to be, it is in the middle.
There should at least be a wolf inside Dizzy/Marmot/Ender/Nate. I do not think that no wolf has preferred to be inside the middle runners.
There could be 1 power wolf inside JJJ/Alison.

There could also be a wolf in the LHF (why, most of these qualis at MU had a lhf wolf, or low-posting wolf - and before you complain about this Rondo, this game was advertised as "lets see how we fare versus the quali towns).

This is based on world buildings and no reads.
I am currently town reading JJJ. So the power wolf is Alison. But would power wolf Alison willingly lose her grip of the game like this with no resistance? I press X for doubt.
I am also currently town reading Rondo, and Nate too but I think he is being a bit too floaty. I know how you can get traumatised by champ games but like the original drive should always be there. I think Fingers is town too?

Let's pretend I also town read Dizzy for their handling of me.

Anywho, I am left with:
Marmot/Ender
Lucy/Creature.

I should ISO here.

Using boqs own words against him. Lucy is dead and Fingers I dont believe is a wolf for previously stated reasons. I am not so sure on creature but crazy thought. What if Boq just grouped all the wolves together into one group? Is that just insane tinfoil? I can see it as an actual strategy.

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:42 am

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:09 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:04 am

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 5:41 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Mon Jul 11, 2022 6:27 pm

NateTheLesser wrote: ↑Mon Jul 11, 2022 3:56 pm Looking back at D1, the first two voters for Creature were Jay and Alison, so... unlikely that Jay/Alison/Creature are the exact team. So combined with the above I'd say one of Creature/Alison is almost certainly a wolf, and it's also a difference check. Meaning there'd be a wolf in the rest. I'm town, I'm reading Boq and Lucy as town, so the other wolf is in Rondo/Finger.

Jay did not seem to like me voting Creature early on day 3, and that stands out in hindsight (I haven't completely re-read but I'm about halfway through the day). The post I quoted earlier is the one I'm talking about. So this is the vote I feel best about atm.

[VOTE: Creature] aubergine

Of course we also have to reckon with the gallon of wine Jay poured for us at some point yesterday:

> says he's going to take a different tack and evaluate everyone from the perspective that they're scum
> does this for Creature
> gives a basically neutral read
> stops

Creature is one of those players I have sussed for a major part of the game. I agree with you that if there is a wolf between Creature and Alison, it is Creature. I disagree with it being a different check though. If Creature is town, I won't start scum reading Alison. She is a lock.

My weakest town read is fingers, so with that poe it would be Creature/Fingers, but I am not sure about it.

Rondo came in now and voted with you on Creature. That means to me that Rondo is not scum with you because at this point scum would be better to just let you go. Which means I am at least reading one of you correctly.

Re-reading this after the flip hurts my head

Why?

I am trying to read it from w!boq perspective writing it (specifically you being paired with creature because of that weird back and forth where he wont talk to you) but it just doesnt make sense. I also dont know what that means in your pov now that Nate has flipped town.

yes me and Creature does not make sense as scum team indeed tbh

fingersplints wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 7:37 am

lucy wrote: ↑Mon Jul 11, 2022 8:25 pm

Creature wrote: ↑Mon Jul 11, 2022 8:24 pm Damn I really wanted Alison's vote of confidence on this

I'm leaning towards the wolfteam being Boq + Nate and I feel more confident on Boq being wolf because that's where Dyslexicon was leaning into when they died and also because I feel like Boquise hasn't been playing to solve, but rather to follow an agenda

I'm less sure on Nate, but I still remember him pushing a list entirely composed of town yesterday and I feel like wolves' play here is to keep hammering these town names until town budges on them and they get a mislynch. I feel like if wolves decided to bus they could easily fall prey to the POE

agree 100%

Interesting dizzy and Lucy apparently both said boq wolf before dying

fingersplints wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 7:41 am I’m going to laugh so hard if the mafia team is jjj/Alison/boq. Like I wouldn’t even be mad losing.

fucking mind meld.

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 8:12 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:45 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:13 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:06 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 5:12 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 3:21 amGood morning

Your thoughts on the game?

I was pretty disheartened by Nate's flip.

I don't know if I should be reconsidering my read on Jay's spew, because I thought it looked pretty bad for Nate and I was wrong.

I think I have either miscleared Rondo or that the team is Creature/fingers. The scum reads on Nate yesterday felt kinda impossible to debate against because everyone had decided he was scum tbh

I think I feel good about Rondo still.

We would in this position a day ago, with Nate still on the table as a misexe, if he had not unvoted.

Creature was a lesser clear, in that he placed his vote on Jay at a time where doing so wouldn't prevent Jay from forcing a tie. I liked him yesterday because of Jay spew, but that spew also looked bad for Nate. So I dunno if I should trust it.

I don't think Creature + you is a team.
I know I'm town, and Rondo is my clear. So I guess if Creature is mafia he's probably with finger, yeah.

If finger is mafia she can be with you or Creature.

If you're mafia, for the same reason that Creature is only mafia with finger, then I'd expect you're mafia with finger too.

So maybe we should just exe finger since she's the most likely mafia in every world. But I am not sure of anything right now and will be re-evaluating my read on everyone. I want to check her interactions with Jay.

Noted, I need to review the votals.

What I am noticing here is that you, like JJJ, are pairing me with Fingers. Why do I make sense with Fingers?

You don't make sense with anyone else.

I know I'm town, I'm pretty sure Rondo is town. That leaves Creature, and Finger as the two people you could be paired with. Except you attacked Creature yesterday while Nate was on the chopping block, and I don't see why you'd bus like that when you have an easy misexe. Your frustration at him for not cooperating also feels unpaired.

Therefore if you are mafia the partner you are most likely to have is finger.

what about with you?

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 8:12 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:45 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:13 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:06 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 5:12 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 3:21 amGood morning

Your thoughts on the game?

I was pretty disheartened by Nate's flip.

I don't know if I should be reconsidering my read on Jay's spew, because I thought it looked pretty bad for Nate and I was wrong.

I think I have either miscleared Rondo or that the team is Creature/fingers. The scum reads on Nate yesterday felt kinda impossible to debate against because everyone had decided he was scum tbh

I think I feel good about Rondo still.

We would in this position a day ago, with Nate still on the table as a misexe, if he had not unvoted.

Creature was a lesser clear, in that he placed his vote on Jay at a time where doing so wouldn't prevent Jay from forcing a tie. I liked him yesterday because of Jay spew, but that spew also looked bad for Nate. So I dunno if I should trust it.

I don't think Creature + you is a team.
I know I'm town, and Rondo is my clear. So I guess if Creature is mafia he's probably with finger, yeah.

If finger is mafia she can be with you or Creature.

If you're mafia, for the same reason that Creature is only mafia with finger, then I'd expect you're mafia with finger too.

So maybe we should just exe finger since she's the most likely mafia in every world. But I am not sure of anything right now and will be re-evaluating my read on everyone. I want to check her interactions with Jay.

Noted, I need to review the votals.

What I am noticing here is that you, like JJJ, are pairing me with Fingers. Why do I make sense with Fingers?

You don't make sense with anyone else.

I know I'm town, I'm pretty sure Rondo is town. That leaves Creature, and Finger as the two people you could be paired with. Except you attacked Creature yesterday while Nate was on the chopping block, and I don't see why you'd bus like that when you have an easy misexe. Your frustration at him for not cooperating also feels unpaired.

Therefore if you are mafia the partner you are most likely to have is finger.

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 10:21 am but yes if you are town you should clear me tbh

But what have you done? Every EOD vote you are on is town

You said earlier you know you are town so the Wilgy wagon is pure. What if it wasnt? What are the odds it is?

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 10:36 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 10:32 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 10:20 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 9:48 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 9:29 am This sounds like you dont want to clear me though.
The me vs. Fingers doesn't make sense as a wolf team

Should I be clearing you?

The most compelling reason I can think of is you mentioning that there's a scum in me/Jay/you, not because of your interactions with fingers.

Do you think you and fingers should be cleared as a wolf team? What interactions unpair you?

I think it is peculiar that you go with a pairing that JJJ was selling.
I think that my whole interaction with Fingers clears that pairing completely, but most specifically D1 and D2

I don't care if he was selling it. If the logic is sound, I think it's fair to expect that pairing to be considered. I don't know why you're getting so jumpy about me thinking about this pairing - it wasn't even the only pairing I considered in the original post.

Could you quote what posts from D1/D2 think unalign you with her? It's been a while since then and I don't remember anything that super dissociates you two.

I care that you are pushing the same narrative as a wolf, because that negatively affects my read on you. Hence "jumpy".

Sure.

Distancing?

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:15 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:09 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:07 am JJJ pushed that narrative when he wasnt in danger too tbh.

Did he push you pre-D3? I don't recall this.

JJJ floated early suspicion on me, but I do think it was D3 where he came back with an ISO case on me being wolf. Prior to that, in his charts, he had me as partner possibility with Fingers.

My conclusions rn are:
Creature/Fingers - doesnt make much sense
Rondo/Fingers - doesnt make sense
You/Fingers - doesnt make sense

Therefore, Fingers is town.

Also
Creature/Rondo doesnt make sense either
...i have kinda forgot what i wrote earlier today about the teams so I will have to review. None of this is cemented however.

So what is left
Alison/Boq - my primary focus
Fingers/Boq - I dont think fingers is paired
Boq/Rondo - I know I am town
Rondo/Alison - I know I am town
Creature/Boq - but you said that it wasnt a thing earlier but left it out of this list?
Alison/Creature - Possibly worth looking into

Have I left any out?

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:40 am I don't think it's Creature/Rondo which means Boq/finger can't be T/T. Which means your worldview has a big problem to me.

Also ignoring Alison/Boq

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:42 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:40 am I don't think it's Creature/Rondo which means Boq/finger can't be T/T. Which means your worldview has a big problem to me.

well the thing is, my worldview has you and Rondo as scum, so that's a problem indeed tbh

What happened to me unvoting clearing me as 100% town?

Boquise wrote: ↑Fri Jul 08, 2022 3:10 pm On sureness:

I am the most sure that Nate is town because of trying to mend between me and JJJ. It is completely unnecessary if both JJJ and I are villa because let us eat each other. Unnecessary if JJJ and Nate are scum together because 1. I have said I villa read JJJ 2. It creates unnecessary associations between him and JJJ

Rondo has been pure town through the whole game.

I think JJJ definitely believe in what he is saying to me and his casing. Like Dizzy yesterday it looks like he genuinely wants me to be a wolf.

Marmot I feel the weakest about and I am admittedly landing on him caring today. Which is eh. Still like the involvement.

we have gone from this to:

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:42 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 11:40 am I don't think it's Creature/Rondo which means Boq/finger can't be T/T. Which means your worldview has a big problem to me.

well the thing is, my worldview has you and Rondo as scum, so that's a problem indeed tbh

Creature wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 7:35 pm I might need to re-review Rondo, but otherwise I'm leaning towards the wolfteam being Alison + Boquise.

Another mind meld

@fingersplints
@Creature
pls

Creature wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 7:36 pm lucy dying over Alison is really suspicious and I believe a Rondo/finger team always kills her. Therefore, there's at least one wolf within Alison/Boquise, possibly both.

I said it before and I will say it again. Me and Finger would Bus me out of the game because we eventually just get antagonistic towards each other. And I would want out or maybe I would just try to play to get her lynched from town pov. Either way, no.

Creature wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 7:36 pm Also I kind of townread fingersplints.

lol if they are wolf and survived this long untouched.

look if finger has made it this far as wolf by basically slanking I am fine for her to win and it be a lesson for all of us to kill slankers faster

Boquise wrote: ↑Thu Jul 14, 2022 5:42 am

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Thu Jul 14, 2022 5:13 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:44 am

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:10 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:06 am

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 5:12 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 3:21 amGood morning

Your thoughts on the game?

I was pretty disheartened by Nate's flip.

I don't know if I should be reconsidering my read on Jay's spew, because I thought it looked pretty bad for Nate and I was wrong.

I think I have either miscleared Rondo or that the team is Creature/fingers. The scum reads on Nate yesterday felt kinda impossible to debate against because everyone had decided he was scum tbh

Also a lot of what you said last night on re-reading felt like you were preparing to rescind your read on me so you saying this just makes me more suspicious

"A lot"? Hardly. I entertained the idea at the end of the day because I still felt like Nate would flip town and I needed to look through my misclearings. Your response about the fingers thing made me eh.

I still dont see why Fingers gets out of her way to vote Nate there if both Creature/Nate are town tbh, and that helps me with my world building.

Fingers thing?

i wrote that you and fingers or you and creature could be scum. You acknowledged that you and Creature could be, but your denial with you/fingers felt manufactured.

"feels" lol

I slept on my mafia thoughts, and my primary interest today is still Alison. I don’t know exactly who her partner is because I can see Alison paired with boq/rondo/creature. And that’s why I think she is the best vote today and most likely to be wolf. I don’t think any other combo works if one of the people isn’t Alison.

it is pretty funny that at sod, alison/rondo were all about me and fingers being wolf, and now when I have sorta cleared fingers, they gun for me even harder but have fingers cleared as well.

If you take issue with the verb "feels", Rondo, lets swap it with "sound" then - means essentially the same thing. It SOUNDED fake, hence how I reacted to your post.

I have not said that you are 100% clear, that is Alison's words.

It is pretty clear that I am scum's focus to misyeet at least, considering all you four have listed me as a yeet you favour (though Fingers is moving to Alison). So 2 of you are getting played tbh

Boquise wrote: ↑Thu Jul 14, 2022 6:34 am it is pretty funny that at sod, alison/rondo were all about me and fingers being wolf, and now when I have sorta cleared fingers, they gun for me even harder but have fingers cleared as well.

If you take issue with the verb "feels", Rondo, lets swap it with "sound" then - means essentially the same thing. It SOUNDED fake, hence how I reacted to your post.

I have not said that you are 100% clear, that is Alison's words.

EOD 4 I was saying I dont think finger is a wolf. Dont mischaracterise my play

Boquise wrote: ↑Thu Jul 14, 2022 6:35 am It is pretty clear that I am scum's focus to misyeet at least, considering all you four have listed me as a yeet you favour (though Fingers is moving to Alison). So 2 of you are getting played tbh

ATE

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Thu Jul 14, 2022 6:42 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Thu Jul 14, 2022 6:34 am it is pretty funny that at sod, alison/rondo were all about me and fingers being wolf, and now when I have sorta cleared fingers, they gun for me even harder but have fingers cleared as well.

If you take issue with the verb "feels", Rondo, lets swap it with "sound" then - means essentially the same thing. It SOUNDED fake, hence how I reacted to your post.

I have not said that you are 100% clear, that is Alison's words.

EOD 4 I was saying I dont think finger is a wolf. Dont mischaracterise my play

I am talking about sod5.

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Thu Jul 14, 2022 6:43 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Thu Jul 14, 2022 6:35 am It is pretty clear that I am scum's focus to misyeet at least, considering all you four have listed me as a yeet you favour (though Fingers is moving to Alison). So 2 of you are getting played tbh

ATE

Nope.

Boquise wrote: ↑Sun Jun 26, 2022 11:48 pm

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Sun Jun 26, 2022 11:39 pm

Boquise wrote: ↑Sun Jun 26, 2022 11:35 pm

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Sun Jun 26, 2022 11:28 pm

Boquise wrote: ↑Sun Jun 26, 2022 11:27 pm I read Rondo as town, I think

why? Ive been nothing but a problem?

You've made me laugh thrice tbh

Hmmmmm

Yes tbh

This vibe is completely gone

Actually how is that even AtE? I am saying facts. It is factual that you, Alison, Creature, Fingers have had me as your primary focus, with the exclusion that Fingers is moving to Alison. That is a cold factual statement.

If you are town, maybe you should think about what that means?

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Thu Jul 14, 2022 6:53 am

Boquise wrote: ↑Sun Jun 26, 2022 11:48 pm

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Sun Jun 26, 2022 11:39 pm

Boquise wrote: ↑Sun Jun 26, 2022 11:35 pm

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Sun Jun 26, 2022 11:28 pm

Boquise wrote: ↑Sun Jun 26, 2022 11:27 pm I read Rondo as town, I think

why? Ive been nothing but a problem?

You've made me laugh thrice tbh

Hmmmmm

Yes tbh

This vibe is completely gone

Well you have made up your mind so it is whatever tbh
I have a dnd session but will come back and solve afterwards. It is good that this game doesn't have a hammer tbh

Points for Rondo - I think town is likelier to try to bury another town than scum at sod.

Points against Rondo - Him pushing me for voting Nate is opportunistic af.