King of the Hill Mafia

[Lilypetal]

i feel like we are prolonging this lylo when the conclusion won't change tbh

[RondoDimBuckle]

EBWOP

@RondoDimBuckle

Convincing porcha is the obvious play there, it removes your power and it gets me what I want at the same time. I didnt think Lily would move

But also, weren't you on me about the previous EoD "For not convincing one to vote their sr"? Lmfao

I wasnt trying to convince Porcha to not vote their scum read, I was asking her if there was no world SPF could be scum and if there could be to join me.

No, that's not my point tho. You had a sr on SPF and you tried to convince Porscha but not me. You explained with the power thing, but you could clearly see I was tryiing to evaluate all possible options/info before I casted my vote.

And now imagine, people come into today saying, "Man, I wish I voted SPF because Seanzie seemed townie" When I was literally asking everyone's opinions is like a WTF?

I didnt need to convince you, I needed to convince Porscha, I didnt, SPF lived, you voted Seanzie like I predicted. You have not listened to me once this game why would I believe you would listen to me yesterday?

We've had basically almost the same perspective since when you came in, but you have constantly shaded me for it, and every time I made a read, you'd agree but then point the finger at me, and it's so weird to me, cause if we both have the read, why are u pointing the finger at me, if I am wrong on it.

There hasn't really been a time where you discussed with me about your own opinion, and I was asking it from you yesterday but you didn't you mentioned you didn't want to convince me. Like what am I supposed to think if you are town Rondo?

That we havent played together before so our different styles do not match and we are unfamiliar with each other so its bound to create opportunities for miscommunication. I shade everyone. Constantly because I open my mind to several worlds at once. I dont see it as shade personally but other people do. I might have been 'shading' you but did I ever actually push you as a legitimate lynch target? You might not like that I erode your town cred sure but it doesnt mean I am wolf for not taking it as gospel that you are town because other people say so.

[arogame123]

so, let's go back to the basics and think very broadly about what each player has been Doing Throughout The Game

arogame has mostly followed the consensus, and has played a large role in both creating and maintaining the status quo. he:

1. pushed that creature and alison needed to die back to back

2. pushed that me and boq needed to die back to back

3. has generally held consensus, non-controversial reads throughout the game (ie: alison mafia, porscha town, etc etc). generally speaking, he has not really rocked the boat, and has gone with the flow in this game while playing in a more detached, passive role

4. the only time that aro has broken his passive role throughout this game was yesterday. in spite of spending the entirety of the last two dayphases saying that me/boq need to die back to back, and in spite of opening yesterday by saying that i needed to die, he sided with me at the EOD and voted for seanzie anyway. why did aro do this? what was the motivation?

well, i wanna point out a few things:

-aro didn't vote for seanzie until after porscha had voted me and i was the leading wagon

-aro took until the very last minute to decide his vote, which made it clear he was biding his time and watching the way that the wagons developed before he decided

logically speaking, i think that aro voted for seanzie at the EOD1 for two primary reasons: to look good in the event that i flipped town, and to give himself an excuse to push on seanzie today if i flipped and went over seanzie. it seems to me that aro was concerned primarily with positioning toward the end of yesterday, which is probably wolf indicative for him

lilypetal has mostly followed the consensus of the rest of the game, with a few notable twist and turns inbetween. she was in favor of voting for alison, in favor of killing boq and then killing me, etc etc. lily has played a game that has gone along with the consensus for the most part

the thing is, in a world where lily is mafia and she sees me casing seanzie/rondo together yesterday, she would have zero incentive as a wolf to back my push on seanzie, and zero incentive as a wolf to shake up the gamestate and try to get seanzie killed over me. the argument can be made that she was saving me for LYLO, but a world where lily is mafia is also a world where any number of rondo/porscha/seanzie/aro could be perfectly viable mischops from her perspective. if lily is mafia, she did not NEED to save me for LLYLO today because she would be so deep that she already has a bunch of other viable miseliminations from her perspective. her choice to swap to seanzie yesterday and push seanzie with me shows me that:

A. she was making a genuine effort to figure out my alignment yesterday

B. she was not playing the day with a specific agenda or narrative that she needed to make sure was followed through with

based on all of this, i think that lilypetal is probably ultimately town. this is an unfortunate conclusion for me to reach, because a world where lilypetal is town is also probably a world where we lose the game, but it's the conclusion i'm arriving at nonetheless. if she's a wolf then she has fooled me very well, and kudos to her

my evaluation of porscha is similar to my evaluation of lilypetal, which is that she has spent a great deal of time pushing for the consensus, but has also been the pivotal deciding factor in several important momentum shifts throughout the game

for one, she was one of the first players in the game to call me town and attempt to change the gamestate on a dayphase where i was widely POE'd and being pushed for the entirety of the game

for second, she switched between me and seanzie at the EOD yesterday that shows me that she was not married to a specific agenda or scum strategy. if she was mafia then it would be trivially easy for her to simply park her vote on seanzie and then get me killed today, so her swapping to me to see my "reaction" as totally unnecessary to do as a wolf and a sign that she is putting genuine thought into getting reads

for third, she has been playing in her own corner of the game and looks clearly unaligned from about every single player here

now finally, there's still the big question to answer of: what has rondo done? in what ways has rondo interacted with or impacted with the gamestate?

well, looking through his ISO as i write this post, the answer is essentially: "he has done nothing at all". he pushed on creature, self-voted, and pushed on alison throughout the first few pages. on d3, he pushed a POE of neon/creature/lily, and then pushed on porscha. throughout the last several dayphases, he sat back and gladly encouraged the crosses between me and boq and me and seanzie, leaving room open for all of us to be mafia while making no attempts to hunt or push for any deeper wolves

it's actually difficult to find a single unique or contrarian read in the entirety of rondo's 10 page ISO, which meshes awkwardly with rondo's clear playstyle as someone who plays against the grain. in spite of positioning himself as an anti-consensus player, he has done nothing this game beyond push for the consensus and sit back while watching the town falling apart. he has not pushed on a single wolf for this entire game, and he has made no attempts to shake up the gamestate

so, doing some basic deduction here, i have good reasons to believe that lily has tried to shake up the gamestate at pivotal times that would be unnecessary for her to do as a wolf. i have good reasons to believe that porscha has done the same. i am unable to find any reasons to believe that aro or rondo have done anything in this game EXCEPT push for the consensus

this is compounded by the fact that aro and rondo have both spent the entire game circling around each other without ever truly engaging or pushing. aro is doing the classic scum move of pairing me/rondo with each other but pushing on me harder. rondo is calling aro wolfy but pushing on me harder as well. they are playing in a blatantly teamed way while positioning themselves to get me miseliminated today and lose the game

Your point about me being in conensus is really not true at all tbh.

1. I actually pushed on Alison to die first before Creature on day 2 and I made that very clear. I also made the point that the way Creature approached ALison was likely not w/w based on how Alison didn't like her partners defending her from a rececnt game in SCI.

2. You mentioned I wanted to push you/Boq back to back, but clearly that didn't happen and I got swayed by you included lol. I ended up voting Seanzie instead

3. Sure my reads maybe haven't been spicy but that doesn't mean I am scummy. In fact, I have been vocal about my reads and made it very clear where I stood, and I attempted to make everyone accountable this game and ensure to figure out where their reads stood and I have made clear re-evaluations this game even if they ended up being wrong.

4. I made it very clear when I was voting at the time I did so that's moot.

[staypositivefriend]

i feel like we are prolonging this lylo when the conclusion won't change tbh

i mean i understand that i need to die for the crime of being wrong in a mafia game but you should at least consider what im saying

[RondoDimBuckle]

which forces me to vote you to save myself to win the game, if you are town you need to find me

I mean it doesn't save the game if you are town, because I am town, and I don't know what to take of everyone just pairing me with SPF when it's obvious through our interactions and the vote yesterday that it isn't true.

We both agree on SPF, so if you are town, who do you believe is likelier then? Lily or Porscha? I assume you'd be leaning more on Porscha?

Maybe spell it out for me because I dont get what you mean about it unpairing you. Lily had a shitty EOD 1 and Porscha was one of the main wagons so its equal to each other for me. GTH Lily. Porscha is someone I dont mind losing to this game

[RondoDimBuckle]

EBWOP

@RondoDimBuckle

Convincing porcha is the obvious play there, it removes your power and it gets me what I want at the same time. I didnt think Lily would move

But also, weren't you on me about the previous EoD "For not convincing one to vote their sr"? Lmfao

I wasnt trying to convince Porcha to not vote their scum read, I was asking her if there was no world SPF could be scum and if there could be to join me.

No, that's not my point tho. You had a sr on SPF and you tried to convince Porscha but not me. You explained with the power thing, but you could clearly see I was tryiing to evaluate all possible options/info before I casted my vote.

And now imagine, people come into today saying, "Man, I wish I voted SPF because Seanzie seemed townie" When I was literally asking everyone's opinions is like a WTF?

I didnt need to convince you, I needed to convince Porscha, I didnt, SPF lived, you voted Seanzie like I predicted. You have not listened to me once this game why would I believe you would listen to me yesterday?

We've had basically almost the same perspective since when you came in, but you have constantly shaded me for it, and every time I made a read, you'd agree but then point the finger at me, and it's so weird to me, cause if we both have the read, why are u pointing the finger at me, if I am wrong on it.

There hasn't really been a time where you discussed with me about your own opinion, and I was asking it from you yesterday but you didn't you mentioned you didn't want to convince me. Like what am I supposed to think if you are town Rondo?

Also maybe you are right, it takes two to tango maybe I should have engaged you more myself and not relied on other people reading you or what to do with your slot

[Lilypetal]

i feel like we are prolonging this lylo when the conclusion won't change tbh

i mean i understand that i need to die for the crime of being wrong in a mafia game but you should at least consider what im saying

i did the incorrect play and considered your words yesterday and it didnt pan out

i can read what you're saying today and still come to the conclusion that it doesn't matter tho it's not like im ignoring you

[Lilypetal]

i think ur framing of aro is a bit off tbh

[Lilypetal]

@staypositivefriend

so if u had to vote rn which of them would you vote

[Lilypetal]

esooa told me lylo was easy

she lied

[Porscha]

I think alison / rondo unaligned

why?

going thru rondo's first days of posts

[staypositivefriend]

so, let's go back to the basics and think very broadly about what each player has been Doing Throughout The Game

arogame has mostly followed the consensus, and has played a large role in both creating and maintaining the status quo. he:

1. pushed that creature and alison needed to die back to back

2. pushed that me and boq needed to die back to back

3. has generally held consensus, non-controversial reads throughout the game (ie: alison mafia, porscha town, etc etc). generally speaking, he has not really rocked the boat, and has gone with the flow in this game while playing in a more detached, passive role

4. the only time that aro has broken his passive role throughout this game was yesterday. in spite of spending the entirety of the last two dayphases saying that me/boq need to die back to back, and in spite of opening yesterday by saying that i needed to die, he sided with me at the EOD and voted for seanzie anyway. why did aro do this? what was the motivation?

well, i wanna point out a few things:

-aro didn't vote for seanzie until after porscha had voted me and i was the leading wagon

-aro took until the very last minute to decide his vote, which made it clear he was biding his time and watching the way that the wagons developed before he decided

logically speaking, i think that aro voted for seanzie at the EOD1 for two primary reasons: to look good in the event that i flipped town, and to give himself an excuse to push on seanzie today if i flipped and went over seanzie. it seems to me that aro was concerned primarily with positioning toward the end of yesterday, which is probably wolf indicative for him

lilypetal has mostly followed the consensus of the rest of the game, with a few notable twist and turns inbetween. she was in favor of voting for alison, in favor of killing boq and then killing me, etc etc. lily has played a game that has gone along with the consensus for the most part

the thing is, in a world where lily is mafia and she sees me casing seanzie/rondo together yesterday, she would have zero incentive as a wolf to back my push on seanzie, and zero incentive as a wolf to shake up the gamestate and try to get seanzie killed over me. the argument can be made that she was saving me for LYLO, but a world where lily is mafia is also a world where any number of rondo/porscha/seanzie/aro could be perfectly viable mischops from her perspective. if lily is mafia, she did not NEED to save me for LLYLO today because she would be so deep that she already has a bunch of other viable miseliminations from her perspective. her choice to swap to seanzie yesterday and push seanzie with me shows me that:

A. she was making a genuine effort to figure out my alignment yesterday

B. she was not playing the day with a specific agenda or narrative that she needed to make sure was followed through with

based on all of this, i think that lilypetal is probably ultimately town. this is an unfortunate conclusion for me to reach, because a world where lilypetal is town is also probably a world where we lose the game, but it's the conclusion i'm arriving at nonetheless. if she's a wolf then she has fooled me very well, and kudos to her

my evaluation of porscha is similar to my evaluation of lilypetal, which is that she has spent a great deal of time pushing for the consensus, but has also been the pivotal deciding factor in several important momentum shifts throughout the game

for one, she was one of the first players in the game to call me town and attempt to change the gamestate on a dayphase where i was widely POE'd and being pushed for the entirety of the game

for second, she switched between me and seanzie at the EOD yesterday that shows me that she was not married to a specific agenda or scum strategy. if she was mafia then it would be trivially easy for her to simply park her vote on seanzie and then get me killed today, so her swapping to me to see my "reaction" as totally unnecessary to do as a wolf and a sign that she is putting genuine thought into getting reads

for third, she has been playing in her own corner of the game and looks clearly unaligned from about every single player here

now finally, there's still the big question to answer of: what has rondo done? in what ways has rondo interacted with or impacted with the gamestate?

well, looking through his ISO as i write this post, the answer is essentially: "he has done nothing at all". he pushed on creature, self-voted, and pushed on alison throughout the first few pages. on d3, he pushed a POE of neon/creature/lily, and then pushed on porscha. throughout the last several dayphases, he sat back and gladly encouraged the crosses between me and boq and me and seanzie, leaving room open for all of us to be mafia while making no attempts to hunt or push for any deeper wolves

it's actually difficult to find a single unique or contrarian read in the entirety of rondo's 10 page ISO, which meshes awkwardly with rondo's clear playstyle as someone who plays against the grain. in spite of positioning himself as an anti-consensus player, he has done nothing this game beyond push for the consensus and sit back while watching the town falling apart. he has not pushed on a single wolf for this entire game, and he has made no attempts to shake up the gamestate

so, doing some basic deduction here, i have good reasons to believe that lily has tried to shake up the gamestate at pivotal times that would be unnecessary for her to do as a wolf. i have good reasons to believe that porscha has done the same. i am unable to find any reasons to believe that aro or rondo have done anything in this game EXCEPT push for the consensus

this is compounded by the fact that aro and rondo have both spent the entire game circling around each other without ever truly engaging or pushing. aro is doing the classic scum move of pairing me/rondo with each other but pushing on me harder. rondo is calling aro wolfy but pushing on me harder as well. they are playing in a blatantly teamed way while positioning themselves to get me miseliminated today and lose the game

Your point about me being in conensus is really not true at all tbh.

1. I actually pushed on Alison to die first before Creature on day 2 and I made that very clear. I also made the point that the way Creature approached ALison was likely not w/w based on how Alison didn't like her partners defending her from a rececnt game in SCI.

2. You mentioned I wanted to push you/Boq back to back, but clearly that didn't happen and I got swayed by you included lol. I ended up voting Seanzie instead

3. Sure my reads maybe haven't been spicy but that doesn't mean I am scummy. In fact, I have been vocal about my reads and made it very clear where I stood, and I attempted to make everyone accountable this game and ensure to figure out where their reads stood and I have made clear re-evaluations this game even if they ended up being wrong.

4. I made it very clear when I was voting at the time I did so that's moot.

okay, but none of this does anything to change my point about you following the consensus, the consensus that there was a wolf between alison/creature on d1 was already solidified, so it doesn't matter which one you voted first. you pushing on seanzie instead of me yesterday is the only time you diverted from the consensus, but i explained in that exact post why i think it was probably wolf-motivated

[arogame123]

Convincing porcha is the obvious play there, it removes your power and it gets me what I want at the same time. I didnt think Lily would move

But also, weren't you on me about the previous EoD "For not convincing one to vote their sr"? Lmfao

I wasnt trying to convince Porcha to not vote their scum read, I was asking her if there was no world SPF could be scum and if there could be to join me.

No, that's not my point tho. You had a sr on SPF and you tried to convince Porscha but not me. You explained with the power thing, but you could clearly see I was tryiing to evaluate all possible options/info before I casted my vote.

And now imagine, people come into today saying, "Man, I wish I voted SPF because Seanzie seemed townie" When I was literally asking everyone's opinions is like a WTF?

I didnt need to convince you, I needed to convince Porscha, I didnt, SPF lived, you voted Seanzie like I predicted. You have not listened to me once this game why would I believe you would listen to me yesterday?

We've had basically almost the same perspective since when you came in, but you have constantly shaded me for it, and every time I made a read, you'd agree but then point the finger at me, and it's so weird to me, cause if we both have the read, why are u pointing the finger at me, if I am wrong on it.

There hasn't really been a time where you discussed with me about your own opinion, and I was asking it from you yesterday but you didn't you mentioned you didn't want to convince me. Like what am I supposed to think if you are town Rondo?

That we havent played together before so our different styles do not match and we are unfamiliar with each other so its bound to create opportunities for miscommunication. I shade everyone. Constantly because I open my mind to several worlds at once. I dont see it as shade personally but other people do. I might have been 'shading' you but did I ever actually push you as a legitimate lynch target? You might not like that I erode your town cred sure but it doesnt mean I am wolf for not taking it as gospel that you are town because other people say so.

See but that's the thing is we do seem to have different styles and everytime I made a point, I'd feel that you'd agree but also discredit it at the same time and try to make me look bad if it is wrong and that's what felt scummy and eerie of you esp with ur treatment of me. Like, idrc if you scum read me or not. I am used to people sr me and I can actually find people townie in the process, but the issue I have is I felt like you were trying to make me look bad while hiding behind me when agreeing with my reads and it puts me the wrong way.

And like even yesterday, you say I have disagreed with u but we haven't had much disagreement this game lmfao, so when I tried to reach out to you yesterday to get ur pov on SPF vs Seanzie and reject me, and you sr me when I wasn't "pushing who I was voting" it puts me off tbh. And I have made that clear.

But the thing is, it does seem like you are trying to tr me and fine me, and stating that since "I am sr you, that you would vote me anyways to save the game." That would just end the game if you are town. So in the world where you are town, who do u believe the team is?

[staypositivefriend]

i feel like we are prolonging this lylo when the conclusion won't change tbh

i mean i understand that i need to die for the crime of being wrong in a mafia game but you should at least consider what im saying

i did the incorrect play and considered your words yesterday and it didnt pan out

i can read what you're saying today and still come to the conclusion that it doesn't matter tho it's not like im ignoring you

but why are you coming to the conclusion that it doesn't matter? it's because you already conf biased yourself into voting me today no matter what i say because you dont want to be wrong again, and that post just confirmed that im correct

[staypositivefriend]

i think ur framing of aro is a bit off tbh

how so?

[staypositivefriend]

@staypositivefriend

so if u had to vote rn which of them would you vote

honestly? probably rondo. you're probably going to use that as evidence that me/aro are mafia together but in reality i just feel slightly more confident about rondo being mafia and i think there's a higher chance that i'm misreading aro between the two of them

[Lilypetal]

i feel like we are prolonging this lylo when the conclusion won't change tbh

i mean i understand that i need to die for the crime of being wrong in a mafia game but you should at least consider what im saying

i did the incorrect play and considered your words yesterday and it didnt pan out

i can read what you're saying today and still come to the conclusion that it doesn't matter tho it's not like im ignoring you

but why are you coming to the conclusion that it doesn't matter? it's because you already conf biased yourself into voting me today no matter what i say because you dont want to be wrong again, and that post just confirmed that im correct

basically yeah i went for the hype play yesterday disregarding all logic and all legacies and now im centering and going to make the correct play today lol

[staypositivefriend]

also, your view that me/aro are W/W should be blatantly incorrect if you read our interactions for 5 seconds, which means that your view of the game is off right now in general and that you should reconsider. if aro is mafia then i can never be mafia

[staypositivefriend]

I think alison / rondo unaligned

why?

going thru rondo's first days of posts

do u mind elaborating?

[Lilypetal]

i think ur framing of aro is a bit off tbh

how so?

meh maybe im reading into it too much it doesn't rly matter unless you flip W lol

[staypositivefriend]

i feel like we are prolonging this lylo when the conclusion won't change tbh

i mean i understand that i need to die for the crime of being wrong in a mafia game but you should at least consider what im saying

i did the incorrect play and considered your words yesterday and it didnt pan out

i can read what you're saying today and still come to the conclusion that it doesn't matter tho it's not like im ignoring you

but why are you coming to the conclusion that it doesn't matter? it's because you already conf biased yourself into voting me today no matter what i say because you dont want to be wrong again, and that post just confirmed that im correct

basically yeah i went for the hype play yesterday disregarding all logic and all legacies and now im centering and going to make the correct play today lol

the only correct play today is voting for the mafia. you're aren't doing the "correct play" by conf biasing yourself into voting me because you want me to be mafia lol

[Lilypetal]

also, your view that me/aro are W/W should be blatantly incorrect if you read our interactions for 5 seconds, which means that your view of the game is off right now in general and that you should reconsider. if aro is mafia then i can never be mafia

i am reconsidering although i don't think yall aren't capable of doing this lol

[Lilypetal]

i feel like we are prolonging this lylo when the conclusion won't change tbh

i mean i understand that i need to die for the crime of being wrong in a mafia game but you should at least consider what im saying

i did the incorrect play and considered your words yesterday and it didnt pan out

i can read what you're saying today and still come to the conclusion that it doesn't matter tho it's not like im ignoring you

but why are you coming to the conclusion that it doesn't matter? it's because you already conf biased yourself into voting me today no matter what i say because you dont want to be wrong again, and that post just confirmed that im correct

basically yeah i went for the hype play yesterday disregarding all logic and all legacies and now im centering and going to make the correct play today lol

the only correct play today is voting for the mafia. you're aren't doing the "correct play" by conf biasing yourself into voting me because you want me to be mafia lol

you know what i mean tho

[RondoDimBuckle]

so, let's go back to the basics and think very broadly about what each player has been Doing Throughout The Game

arogame has mostly followed the consensus, and has played a large role in both creating and maintaining the status quo. he:

1. pushed that creature and alison needed to die back to back

2. pushed that me and boq needed to die back to back

3. has generally held consensus, non-controversial reads throughout the game (ie: alison mafia, porscha town, etc etc). generally speaking, he has not really rocked the boat, and has gone with the flow in this game while playing in a more detached, passive role

4. the only time that aro has broken his passive role throughout this game was yesterday. in spite of spending the entirety of the last two dayphases saying that me/boq need to die back to back, and in spite of opening yesterday by saying that i needed to die, he sided with me at the EOD and voted for seanzie anyway. why did aro do this? what was the motivation?

well, i wanna point out a few things:

-aro didn't vote for seanzie until after porscha had voted me and i was the leading wagon

-aro took until the very last minute to decide his vote, which made it clear he was biding his time and watching the way that the wagons developed before he decided

logically speaking, i think that aro voted for seanzie at the EOD1 for two primary reasons: to look good in the event that i flipped town, and to give himself an excuse to push on seanzie today if i flipped and went over seanzie. it seems to me that aro was concerned primarily with positioning toward the end of yesterday, which is probably wolf indicative for him

lilypetal has mostly followed the consensus of the rest of the game, with a few notable twist and turns inbetween. she was in favor of voting for alison, in favor of killing boq and then killing me, etc etc. lily has played a game that has gone along with the consensus for the most part

the thing is, in a world where lily is mafia and she sees me casing seanzie/rondo together yesterday, she would have zero incentive as a wolf to back my push on seanzie, and zero incentive as a wolf to shake up the gamestate and try to get seanzie killed over me. the argument can be made that she was saving me for LYLO, but a world where lily is mafia is also a world where any number of rondo/porscha/seanzie/aro could be perfectly viable mischops from her perspective. if lily is mafia, she did not NEED to save me for LLYLO today because she would be so deep that she already has a bunch of other viable miseliminations from her perspective. her choice to swap to seanzie yesterday and push seanzie with me shows me that:

A. she was making a genuine effort to figure out my alignment yesterday

B. she was not playing the day with a specific agenda or narrative that she needed to make sure was followed through with

based on all of this, i think that lilypetal is probably ultimately town. this is an unfortunate conclusion for me to reach, because a world where lilypetal is town is also probably a world where we lose the game, but it's the conclusion i'm arriving at nonetheless. if she's a wolf then she has fooled me very well, and kudos to her

my evaluation of porscha is similar to my evaluation of lilypetal, which is that she has spent a great deal of time pushing for the consensus, but has also been the pivotal deciding factor in several important momentum shifts throughout the game

for one, she was one of the first players in the game to call me town and attempt to change the gamestate on a dayphase where i was widely POE'd and being pushed for the entirety of the game

for second, she switched between me and seanzie at the EOD yesterday that shows me that she was not married to a specific agenda or scum strategy. if she was mafia then it would be trivially easy for her to simply park her vote on seanzie and then get me killed today, so her swapping to me to see my "reaction" as totally unnecessary to do as a wolf and a sign that she is putting genuine thought into getting reads

for third, she has been playing in her own corner of the game and looks clearly unaligned from about every single player here

now finally, there's still the big question to answer of: what has rondo done? in what ways has rondo interacted with or impacted with the gamestate?

well, looking through his ISO as i write this post, the answer is essentially: "he has done nothing at all". he pushed on creature, self-voted, and pushed on alison throughout the first few pages. on d3, he pushed a POE of neon/creature/lily, and then pushed on porscha. throughout the last several dayphases, he sat back and gladly encouraged the crosses between me and boq and me and seanzie, leaving room open for all of us to be mafia while making no attempts to hunt or push for any deeper wolves

it's actually difficult to find a single unique or contrarian read in the entirety of rondo's 10 page ISO, which meshes awkwardly with rondo's clear playstyle as someone who plays against the grain. in spite of positioning himself as an anti-consensus player, he has done nothing this game beyond push for the consensus and sit back while watching the town falling apart. he has not pushed on a single wolf for this entire game, and he has made no attempts to shake up the gamestate

so, doing some basic deduction here, i have good reasons to believe that lily has tried to shake up the gamestate at pivotal times that would be unnecessary for her to do as a wolf. i have good reasons to believe that porscha has done the same. i am unable to find any reasons to believe that aro or rondo have done anything in this game EXCEPT push for the consensus

this is compounded by the fact that aro and rondo have both spent the entire game circling around each other without ever truly engaging or pushing. aro is doing the classic scum move of pairing me/rondo with each other but pushing on me harder. rondo is calling aro wolfy but pushing on me harder as well. they are playing in a blatantly teamed way while positioning themselves to get me miseliminated today and lose the game

I called him out for not rocking the boat day 2(?) and you didnt back me up then, why do you back me up now?

I agree him waiting so long is a bad look

Thought experiment: So you vote Aro, Aro votes you, Lily votes you because its consensus(?). Porcha and me????

or
You vote Aro, Aro votes you, Porscha? Lily and Me?

So what its me and Aro? I dont think so. If anything Aro has been engaging me just enough so I dont properly slam on him

You are also not taking into account that I am [REDACTED] into a [REDACTED] and playing differently to any game previous (If you have ready any of my previous games) I have been following consensus because I havent had the time to actually dive deep and do my own scum hunting. I am mostly flying by vibe

[staypositivefriend]

i feel like we are prolonging this lylo when the conclusion won't change tbh

i mean i understand that i need to die for the crime of being wrong in a mafia game but you should at least consider what im saying

i did the incorrect play and considered your words yesterday and it didnt pan out

i can read what you're saying today and still come to the conclusion that it doesn't matter tho it's not like im ignoring you

but why are you coming to the conclusion that it doesn't matter? it's because you already conf biased yourself into voting me today no matter what i say because you dont want to be wrong again, and that post just confirmed that im correct

basically yeah i went for the hype play yesterday disregarding all logic and all legacies and now im centering and going to make the correct play today lol

the only correct play today is voting for the mafia. you're aren't doing the "correct play" by conf biasing yourself into voting me because you want me to be mafia lol

you know what i mean tho

oh i do, i just think that youre conf biased and idk how to talk you out of it because it seems like youre determined to kill me today regardless of what i say or do

[arogame123]

which forces me to vote you to save myself to win the game, if you are town you need to find me

I mean it doesn't save the game if you are town, because I am town, and I don't know what to take of everyone just pairing me with SPF when it's obvious through our interactions and the vote yesterday that it isn't true.

We both agree on SPF, so if you are town, who do you believe is likelier then? Lily or Porscha? I assume you'd be leaning more on Porscha?

Maybe spell it out for me because I dont get what you mean about it unpairing you. Lily had a shitty EOD 1 and Porscha was one of the main wagons so its equal to each other for me. GTH Lily. Porscha is someone I dont mind losing to this game

Ok, so let me discuss about the unpairing again.

When I was going to make my vote EoD, I saw the wagons were 4 SPF v 2 Seanzie.

We know Seanzie flipped town.

If I am mafia with SPF, my vote on Seanzie doesn't have as much meaning since SPF would die anyways and if SPF is mafia, it only makes me look worse for being on the CW.

So if I am mafia with SPF and I see that regardless of my vote that SPF is dying, I always vote on SPF there to not be on the cw and "take some cred."

Also, throughout the entire of the day, SPF was appealing to me, demonstrated a manner of disappointment, and attempted to get me on her side to vote with her on Seanzie. Partners do not appeal to one another in that fashion.

[RondoDimBuckle]

Porchas excuse about swapping the vote is flimsy but she has at least built a rappor with me this game you have just talked about/over/through me but at no point have I felt that Aro wanted to find me town

That's not true. I was town leaning you when giving my big wall when discussing legacies and how people were also tr you, which made me realize that maybe you are town. But when I brought it up with others and how they felt, they were telling me "I'm not sure of Rondo being V."

Yeah people dont want to town read me because its dangerous

[staypositivefriend]

also just ftr, rondo entered today signaling that he was willing to vote for porscha so if im W here the play is probably always to just try to push on porscha and get rondo to vote her with me, unless i am exactly partnered with porscha

[RondoDimBuckle]

so in short, i think that rondo and aro are the mafia team. it's the only world that makes sense to me right now. i also think that we probably lose the game anyway, but at least i probably solved it at the very last minute

This is outing and I think SPF Is giving a 50% wolf team here at best. if she gets Aro over today and not me then he is either wolf and we go to lylo again but SPF looks great or I go over and she wins. Or she is town and self admitted has been terrible this game and is pushing another town. So again another reason why she is throwing the game and 4th wolfing so if you are town here I dont feel bad if I vote you.

[staypositivefriend]

also just ftr, rondo entered today signaling that he was willing to vote for porscha so if im W here the play is probably always to just try to push on porscha and get rondo to vote her with me, unless i am exactly partnered with porscha

wait nvm i cant read

[arogame123]

esooa told me lylo was easy

she lied

You've been in LyLo before.

[RondoDimBuckle]

it's day 6, and i have spent 5 full dayphases in a row pushing on villagers. i have not pushed on a single wolf for this entire game. this is very bad, and it's probably the worst towngame i have ever played in my history of forum mafia

i am embarrassed about the fact that i am not mafia and there's a part of me that honestly just wants to give up and die today instead of enduring another humiliation of trying to take the game back and potentially being wrong for the sixth time in a row

that said, i also believe that i am the person in the game right now who has the most unique vantage point to solve the game. i have the TMI that i'm town, and i also have the TMI that i've been brought to the game today to be the game winning elimination. this makes the question of: "what were the mafia doing on X day?" a lot easier to answer

I guess we lose the game because you are not a bad player from Macs perspective and you have pushed town too much. You're too dangerous to be kept alive, Boq died trying to bury you, you tried to push Seanzie as a self prez to get to lylo and try to argue out of being the lynch like this. Its too wolfy to be wolfy? Too wolfy to live and do better next game imho

you are also not a bad player from mac's perspective but you have failed to push on a single mafia for this entire game. if you're going to hold yourself to the same standard, you should self-vote, right?

Disagree. I pushed Alison day 1 with a shadow vote in the final seconds and she would have gone over too if people didnt chicken out and pivot

[staypositivefriend]

so in short, i think that rondo and aro are the mafia team. it's the only world that makes sense to me right now. i also think that we probably lose the game anyway, but at least i probably solved it at the very last minute

This is outing and I think SPF Is giving a 50% wolf team here at best. if she gets Aro over today and not me then he is either wolf and we go to lylo again but SPF looks great or I go over and she wins. Or she is town and self admitted has been terrible this game and is pushing another town. So again another reason why she is throwing the game and 4th wolfing so if you are town here I dont feel bad if I vote you.

lol vote me then

[staypositivefriend]

put ur money where ur mouth is

[arogame123]

also, your view that me/aro are W/W should be blatantly incorrect if you read our interactions for 5 seconds, which means that your view of the game is off right now in general and that you should reconsider. if aro is mafia then i can never be mafia

lol, the only thing we can agree on

[RondoDimBuckle]

it's day 6, and i have spent 5 full dayphases in a row pushing on villagers. i have not pushed on a single wolf for this entire game. this is very bad, and it's probably the worst towngame i have ever played in my history of forum mafia

i am embarrassed about the fact that i am not mafia and there's a part of me that honestly just wants to give up and die today instead of enduring another humiliation of trying to take the game back and potentially being wrong for the sixth time in a row

that said, i also believe that i am the person in the game right now who has the most unique vantage point to solve the game. i have the TMI that i'm town, and i also have the TMI that i've been brought to the game today to be the game winning elimination. this makes the question of: "what were the mafia doing on X day?" a lot easier to answer

I guess we lose the game because you are not a bad player from Macs perspective and you have pushed town too much. You're too dangerous to be kept alive, Boq died trying to bury you, you tried to push Seanzie as a self prez to get to lylo and try to argue out of being the lynch like this. Its too wolfy to be wolfy? Too wolfy to live and do better next game imho

you are also not a bad player from mac's perspective but you have failed to push on a single mafia for this entire game. if you're going to hold yourself to the same standard, you should self-vote, right?

weird post spf

yep

[RondoDimBuckle]

@staypositivefriend you never answered my question. Why did you think I was town anyways if I had voted you at EoD?

you seemed stressed out and anxious in a way that rung towny to me in the moment and made me think my team of seanzie/rondo was just probably correct, but in hindsight i think it was a bad reason to townread you

ok this is just open wolf anti spew at this point

[Lilypetal]

esooa told me lylo was easy

she lied

You've been in LyLo before.

twice

once as a new player so i fumbled it and once where i got snapvoted within 10 minutes

so my lylo experience is not very good lol this is the longest one i've been in already

and highest stakes personally

[RondoDimBuckle]

I think alison / rondo unaligned

Thank you

[arogame123]

Also another thing, I literally challenged SPF's read of Alison on day 3. If you think we are all w/w/w, that is the most bizare thing ever tbh to have two partners debate over a third partner and try to convince them of their read. That's another one I forgot of why me and SPF are never together lmfao.

Also, SPF trying to pair me with Rondo with the way Rondo has treated me and sort of brushed me aside is really bad lol.

[Lilypetal]

do we have anything to gain by waiting for 24 hours?

[Lilypetal]

Also another thing, I literally challenged SPF's read of Alison on day 3. If you think we are all w/w/w, that is the most bizare thing ever tbh to have two partners debate over a third partner and try to convince them of their read. That's another one I forgot of why me and SPF are never together lmfao.

Also, SPF trying to pair me with Rondo with the way Rondo has treated me and sort of brushed me aside is really bad lol.

if u are town spf's wolf partner is probably obvious

[RondoDimBuckle]

i feel like we are prolonging this lylo when the conclusion won't change tbh

more info is always good

[staypositivefriend]

do we have anything to gain by waiting for 24 hours?

are u trying to rush the vote because you think that if you wait any longer then you'll doubt yourself? lol

[arogame123]

esooa told me lylo was easy

she lied

You've been in LyLo before.

twice

once as a new player so i fumbled it and once where i got snapvoted within 10 minutes

so my lylo experience is not very good lol this is the longest one i've been in already

and highest stakes personally

yea, I was with u in ur first one lol.

[staypositivefriend]

i mean u can vote me and end the game rn lily if ur that impatient. if this game is just a foregone loss i would rather just end it now instead of putting effort into something that you wont attempt to consider

[Porscha]

This should have been posted yesterday
1 hour 10 minutes.PNG

if alison wagon isn't pure aro is only wolf on it
spf voting with alison on aro

aro/spf w/w?

[arogame123]

@staypositivefriend you never answered my question. Why did you think I was town anyways if I had voted you at EoD?

you seemed stressed out and anxious in a way that rung towny to me in the moment and made me think my team of seanzie/rondo was just probably correct, but in hindsight i think it was a bad reason to townread you

ok this is just open wolf anti spew at this point

That's why I felt like if she is mafia, she is just spewing me town lol.

[arogame123]

i mean u can vote me and end the game rn lily if ur that impatient. if this game is just a foregone loss i would rather just end it now instead of putting effort into something that you wont attempt to consider

You literally wanted to vote first, why wouldn't you make the first vote then and instead want others to vote you?

[arogame123]

This should have been posted yesterday
1 hour 10 minutes.PNG

if alison wagon isn't pure aro is only wolf on it
spf voting with alison on aro

aro/spf w/w?

?