The Syndicate

Metalmarsh89 wrote:I'm voting for sig because I 100% disagree.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:I'm voting for sig because I 100% disagree.

a2thezebra wrote:I'll fully catch up tomorrow.

I'll say for now I don't suspect Soneji, I do believe his suspicion of me is completely disingenuous but I think it's more likely because he wants revenge on me for failing him as a teammate in the previous game than him being an opportunistic baddie. As for Golden, thanks for defending me but no I most definitely did suspect both Jack and DDL for their opportunistic jumping on Snow Dog and made that clear from the start. Jack's recent claim that it was likely from the beginning that Snow Dog was joking speaks wonders considering neither he nor I brought up that possibility in our original back and forth. DDL looks better to me now, I was going to reply to his dropping out in Haiku Mafia that it wasn't his fault he got a mafia rolecard in two games but I can't say that now since I no longer view him as disingenuous, moreso confused. As far as the Snow Dog jumpers are concerned, it's actually MM who looks the worst to me in hindsight, considering he avoided the discussion altogether but afterwards continued to express unwarranted suspicion of Snow Dog. That's everyone regarding me and Snow Dog, as for everyone else I'll need a more in-depth catch up before I deliver more reads. I'm voting MM.

linki - mother of god

a2thezebra wrote:If it is, I call bullshit. If you didn't suspect him at all you should have and would have made that abundantly clear.

insertnamehere wrote:

Dragon D. Luffy wrote:

Dragon D. Luffy wrote:I'm still reading Day 1 and I already want to punch Golden in the face. That's a good sign, he's probably a civ.

Not sure that I feel the same way about this.

Long Con wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

Spacedaisy wrote:Oh also, MM I laughed really hard at your response to my offer of giving you my vote.

I'm going with a low/non poster to vote today. Who should I pick?

I may just join you. I have no real suspicions right now, I'm just lame. Nothing about any of the main arguments today struck me as particularly bad. I didn't even read the latest one between Golden and Jack. Total tl;dr. Sorry guys!

sprityo wrote:Let me go over what glorf had said yesterday to see what youre talking about sig, cause i dont remember much outside of he was having a bad_time.jpg

Dragon D. Luffy wrote:

Long Con wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

Spacedaisy wrote:Oh also, MM I laughed really hard at your response to my offer of giving you my vote.

I'm going with a low/non poster to vote today. Who should I pick?

I may just join you. I have no real suspicions right now, I'm just lame. Nothing about any of the main arguments today struck me as particularly bad. I didn't even read the latest one between Golden and Jack. Total tl;dr. Sorry guys!

You keep repeating that. Why the need to make it clear you have no opinion?

sig wrote:

sprityo wrote:Let me go over what glorf had said yesterday to see what youre talking about sig, cause i dont remember much outside of he was having a bad_time.jpg

It's more of a lack of reads and his meta, and my opinion won't be changed on it, since your a better scum player. This vote is all meta based and it would have happened if Glorf was alive. I suggest people follow me, but like I said it is meta based.

linki: Yeah that is my point he didn't do anything, that is a clear scum tell for Glorf. If he was a civ he'd have been reading people and doing things. He also would have voted or at least said he wasn't going to vote.

Quin wrote:That's not a vote I'd oppose.

Snow Dog wrote:

Dragon D. Luffy wrote:

Long Con wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

Spacedaisy wrote:Oh also, MM I laughed really hard at your response to my offer of giving you my vote.

I'm going with a low/non poster to vote today. Who should I pick?

I may just join you. I have no real suspicions right now, I'm just lame. Nothing about any of the main arguments today struck me as particularly bad. I didn't even read the latest one between Golden and Jack. Total tl;dr. Sorry guys!

You keep repeating that. Why the need to make it clear you have no opinion?

Because he is bad. Possibly.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:I won't be voting DDL, Long Con, or Snow Dog today.

DDL because of that one post, and arguing game theory shouldn't get you lynched (unless of course I disagree )
Snow Dog because I think he's having fun and messing with us, the first part an important part of mafia, and the second part I can sympathize with.
Long Con because, well, he's Long Con. It's too early for me to form a read on him yet, because that would read would likely lean mafia.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote:

Snow Dog wrote:

Dragon D. Luffy wrote:

Long Con wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

Spacedaisy wrote:Oh also, MM I laughed really hard at your response to my offer of giving you my vote.

I'm going with a low/non poster to vote today. Who should I pick?

I may just join you. I have no real suspicions right now, I'm just lame. Nothing about any of the main arguments today struck me as particularly bad. I didn't even read the latest one between Golden and Jack. Total tl;dr. Sorry guys!

You keep repeating that. Why the need to make it clear you have no opinion?

Because he is bad. Possibly.

Don't spoil it.

Also I finally finished reading day 1. Gonna read the rest later. One question though: why is spirtyo stiill in the poll and why are there people voting for him?

Nachomamma8 wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:I won't be voting DDL, Long Con, or Snow Dog today.

DDL because of that one post, and arguing game theory shouldn't get you lynched (unless of course I disagree )
Snow Dog because I think he's having fun and messing with us, the first part an important part of mafia, and the second part I can sympathize with.
Long Con because, well, he's Long Con. It's too early for me to form a read on him yet, because that would read would likely lean mafia.

This is a pretty weird trio of townreads.
Why should the reasons that other people are voting for DDL have anything to do with your read on him?
Snow Dog is someone who looks completely different from last game when he was town, and I don't see him as the type to dial down his play in fear of being nightkilled so that he would have a higher chance of winning.
Wanting to give Long Con space is fine, but I'm interested in Golden's read there because I don't think space is needed, but wouldn't mind reaffirmation from a certified Long Con reader.

Do you not have any real town reads yet?

sig wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:I'm voting for sig because I 100% disagree.

That is kinda scummy? Also why do you disagree? How many times have you played with glorf? I have never been wrong about a Glorf mafia read, now there is a first time for everything but I doubt this will be that time.

Glorfindel wrote:Aaahh, welcome back my friends to the 'Glorfindel Hour'

I've read the recent posts in this game and refuse any longer to be exploited as a potential distraction any further this game by certain players for their own ends. I will deal with this matter right here, right now!

By way of background (for those of you who were not involved) in my last game here (Mad Max) I was asked by Jay to directly and explicitly respond to a series of questions that he put to me that amounted to a declaration of my alignment in that game. His questions were prompted by statements that I'd made in previous games to the effect that I would not lie if asked a direct question as to my alignment in any Mafia game. I have included both his questions and my response to them here for your information.

Spoiler: show

Glorfindel wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:Glorfindel, I still need answers to these questions:

1. Are you bad?

2. Are you a member of a team that killed anyone in this group: MovingPictures07, MacDougall, motel room?

I'm going to adjust the first question.

1. Are you a member of the team in this Mafia game called the Skags?

Please still answer both.

Thank you Jay for your patience in awaiting my reply to your questions. I now ask your indulgence one more time - to grant me the courtesy of reading my response carefully and thoughtfully before jumping to any conclusions. I thank you sincerely in advance for your courtesy in this regard.

It's been six days and nights now and things look grim for us and it's in this context that you ask me these questions. Though you may deny it, the truth is that these questions are NOT about my role in this game, they speak directly and unequivocally to my personal character.

In posts I've made in earlier games on this site (and others) I have (somewhat naively) traded on my personal integrity and honesty in never having lied about my alignment in any Mafia game I've ever played. My protestations however have been to no avail and have gone almost completely unheeded. And now, as this game draws to a bitter end, you (someone whose respect I genuinely cherish) come to me asking me to confirm my alignment.

If I recall correctly, my approach (as referred to above) was a topic of discussion between the two of us and Epi in the Town BTSC Chat last game (The Garden of Peaches). In our conversation, you or Epi (I can't recall now who) asked me to consider what that might mean in future games I play for the other members of a non-Town team (and specifically Mafia teams I suppose) of which I may find myself a part. The two of you challenged me to consider the price of my approach with respect to the enjoyment of others who play these games and whose experience of them may be seriously diminished by the selfishness of my approach. I did consider your points carefully and find myself left in a dilemma in respect of my playing Mafia games in the future.

It is for this reason, that I am not going to avoid or dance around your questions. I simply categorically refuse to answer them because to do so, would continue to perpetuate what I now fear is a bad approach to these games on my behalf. When I say that I refuse to answer them, let me be absolutely explicit here, I mean not now and not ever again. I trust you will understand what I've tried to explain here in all sincerity. I accept that some more cynical minds will question why I've taken this stance right now, in this game and whether it wouldn't be easier for me to simply answer your questions and adopt my new approach next game. To me, this is a moral question. If I am unable to stand by my principles in a time when (it appears) it counts the most, then when can I?

As for this game, I'd ask you, my friend to apply the same measure to me that you would to everyone else. Consider my actions and my comments throughout this game and if you find them wanting, then by all means, you should vote for me. If however you find they are reasonable under what you believe to have been my circumstances and ability, then you should look elsewhere.

Whilst (as I indicated in the post above) my decision to adopt this approach was made independent of my alignment in that game, I'm pretty sure only Jay actually understood what I meant there and every other player interpreted my response as simply a feeble and expedient means of dodging Jay's questions for that game.

As I said in the coloured section of that post, I will no longer declare my alignment in any game I play on this site irrespective of my alignment then, now or in the future. Let me be crystal clear about this - if you are uncomfortable with me taking this approach or unwilling to accept my adopting it, then you should vote to remove me from this game, AND the next game AND the one after that because this is a matter of deeply held principle to me upon which I will not compromise.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

sig wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:I'm voting for sig because I 100% disagree.

That is kinda scummy? Also why do you disagree? How many times have you played with glorf? I have never been wrong about a Glorf mafia read, now there is a first time for everything but I doubt this will be that time.

I'll explain later meeting my dad and brother for lunch now.

sig wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

sig wrote:hm Glorf replaced out, that is interesting.

What do you make of it?
:

I think it could mean Sprityo is mafia, in fact I'd be willing to lynch on it. Glorf was alreayd a suspect of mine, for not giving reads not talking much and a general gut read. Two things to know about Glorf is he hates lying, even in a game he won't do it and he hates being mafia. His refusal to answer the good/bad question was a tip off, he wouldn't lie about it, he'd just not say it either way. I'm thinking his BTSC mates told him that. He went with it, but hated it and asked to be replaced. Since even if he was bad, he wouldn't want to let his team down. So he replaced out since he couldn't be a mafia member and he did this soon enough that most people wouldn't consider it.

He attempted to do the same thing in Star wars mafia when he was bad as well.

So I'm voting there and I'll be voting there now, since I am 80% sure Sprityo 2.0/Glorf are mafia and that is why Glorf acted the way he did day 1 and was replaced.

I'm feeling good about the SDs and Golden. I won't be lynching Jack today since he is a civ lean, or Epi/LC since I need time to read them.
I never saw the case on MM so he won't get my vote either.

sig wrote:

Glorfindel wrote:Aaahh, welcome back my friends to the 'Glorfindel Hour'

I've read the recent posts in this game and refuse any longer to be exploited as a potential distraction any further this game by certain players for their own ends. I will deal with this matter right here, right now!

By way of background (for those of you who were not involved) in my last game here (Mad Max) I was asked by Jay to directly and explicitly respond to a series of questions that he put to me that amounted to a declaration of my alignment in that game. His questions were prompted by statements that I'd made in previous games to the effect that I would not lie if asked a direct question as to my alignment in any Mafia game. I have included both his questions and my response to them here for your information.

Spoiler: show

Glorfindel wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:Glorfindel, I still need answers to these questions:

1. Are you bad?

2. Are you a member of a team that killed anyone in this group: MovingPictures07, MacDougall, motel room?

I'm going to adjust the first question.

1. Are you a member of the team in this Mafia game called the Skags?

Please still answer both.

Thank you Jay for your patience in awaiting my reply to your questions. I now ask your indulgence one more time - to grant me the courtesy of reading my response carefully and thoughtfully before jumping to any conclusions. I thank you sincerely in advance for your courtesy in this regard.

It's been six days and nights now and things look grim for us and it's in this context that you ask me these questions. Though you may deny it, the truth is that these questions are NOT about my role in this game, they speak directly and unequivocally to my personal character.

In posts I've made in earlier games on this site (and others) I have (somewhat naively) traded on my personal integrity and honesty in never having lied about my alignment in any Mafia game I've ever played. My protestations however have been to no avail and have gone almost completely unheeded. And now, as this game draws to a bitter end, you (someone whose respect I genuinely cherish) come to me asking me to confirm my alignment.

If I recall correctly, my approach (as referred to above) was a topic of discussion between the two of us and Epi in the Town BTSC Chat last game (The Garden of Peaches). In our conversation, you or Epi (I can't recall now who) asked me to consider what that might mean in future games I play for the other members of a non-Town team (and specifically Mafia teams I suppose) of which I may find myself a part. The two of you challenged me to consider the price of my approach with respect to the enjoyment of others who play these games and whose experience of them may be seriously diminished by the selfishness of my approach. I did consider your points carefully and find myself left in a dilemma in respect of my playing Mafia games in the future.

It is for this reason, that I am not going to avoid or dance around your questions. I simply categorically refuse to answer them because to do so, would continue to perpetuate what I now fear is a bad approach to these games on my behalf. When I say that I refuse to answer them, let me be absolutely explicit here, I mean not now and not ever again. I trust you will understand what I've tried to explain here in all sincerity. I accept that some more cynical minds will question why I've taken this stance right now, in this game and whether it wouldn't be easier for me to simply answer your questions and adopt my new approach next game. To me, this is a moral question. If I am unable to stand by my principles in a time when (it appears) it counts the most, then when can I?

As for this game, I'd ask you, my friend to apply the same measure to me that you would to everyone else. Consider my actions and my comments throughout this game and if you find them wanting, then by all means, you should vote for me. If however you find they are reasonable under what you believe to have been my circumstances and ability, then you should look elsewhere.

Whilst (as I indicated in the post above) my decision to adopt this approach was made independent of my alignment in that game, I'm pretty sure only Jay actually understood what I meant there and every other player interpreted my response as simply a feeble and expedient means of dodging Jay's questions for that game.

As I said in the coloured section of that post, I will no longer declare my alignment in any game I play on this site irrespective of my alignment then, now or in the future. Let me be crystal clear about this - if you are uncomfortable with me taking this approach or unwilling to accept my adopting it, then you should vote to remove me from this game, AND the next game AND the one after that because this is a matter of deeply held principle to me upon which I will not compromise.

This was the major pingy post, he quotes a post from a game where he was bad correct? In which he refused to say whether he was good or not since he was bad and didn't want to lie? Plus he replaced out! Glorf wouldn't do this unless there was an emergency or he was mafia.

Him not voting was also slightly out of place, but not unusually for Glorf regardless of alignment.

Snow Dog wrote:My only problem with, well one of the problems with lynching spirtyo is that the poor chap has already been lynched once and lynching him again appears unduly harsh.

Soneji wrote:I'll be voting spirityo this phase. Glorf's fence-sitting, lack of contributions and straight avoidance of accusing anyone put her high up on my scum scale.

Snow Dog wrote:

Dragon D. Luffy wrote:

Long Con wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

Spacedaisy wrote:Oh also, MM I laughed really hard at your response to my offer of giving you my vote.

I'm going with a low/non poster to vote today. Who should I pick?

I may just join you. I have no real suspicions right now, I'm just lame. Nothing about any of the main arguments today struck me as particularly bad. I didn't even read the latest one between Golden and Jack. Total tl;dr. Sorry guys!

You keep repeating that. Why the need to make it clear you have no opinion?

Because he is bad. Possibly.

Snow Dog wrote:

Nachomamma8 wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:I won't be voting DDL, Long Con, or Snow Dog today.

DDL because of that one post, and arguing game theory shouldn't get you lynched (unless of course I disagree )
Snow Dog because I think he's having fun and messing with us, the first part an important part of mafia, and the second part I can sympathize with.
Long Con because, well, he's Long Con. It's too early for me to form a read on him yet, because that would read would likely lean mafia.

This is a pretty weird trio of townreads.
Why should the reasons that other people are voting for DDL have anything to do with your read on him?
Snow Dog is someone who looks completely different from last game when he was town, and I don't see him as the type to dial down his play in fear of being nightkilled so that he would have a higher chance of winning.
Wanting to give Long Con space is fine, but I'm interested in Golden's read there because I don't think space is needed, but wouldn't mind reaffirmation from a certified Long Con reader.

Do you not have any real town reads yet?

As I explained earlier I am having difficulty pre Christmas to find the time to read all these posts and engage. Plus I like to change things up a bit from game to game.

Soneji wrote:

Snow Dog wrote:My only problem with, well one of the problems with lynching spirtyo is that the poor chap has already been lynched once and lynching him again appears unduly harsh.

There is no such thing as harsh in mafia. If you find a person suspicious, nothing in their personal life or game situation should stop you from voting them. The whole purpose of the replacement "tactic" is to play on emotion fueled leniency like you are displaying here.

Soneji wrote:

Snow Dog wrote:My only problem with, well one of the problems with lynching spirtyo is that the poor chap has already been lynched once and lynching him again appears unduly harsh.

There is no such thing as harsh in mafia. If you find a person suspicious, nothing in their personal life or game situation should stop you from voting them. The whole purpose of the replacement "tactic" is to play on emotion fueled leniency like you are displaying here.

Soneji wrote:I'll be voting spirityo this phase. Glorf's fence-sitting, lack of contributions and straight avoidance of accusing anyone put her high up on my scum scale.

Long Con wrote:

Snow Dog wrote:

Dragon D. Luffy wrote:

Long Con wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

Spacedaisy wrote:Oh also, MM I laughed really hard at your response to my offer of giving you my vote.

I'm going with a low/non poster to vote today. Who should I pick?

I may just join you. I have no real suspicions right now, I'm just lame. Nothing about any of the main arguments today struck me as particularly bad. I didn't even read the latest one between Golden and Jack. Total tl;dr. Sorry guys!

You keep repeating that. Why the need to make it clear you have no opinion?

Because he is bad. Possibly.

Who's asking you anything? No, I haven't stated that I have no opinion because I'm bad.

I said it because it was crunch time, time to vote, and I just had no suspicions yet. The poll was like "Yo Long Con, it's time to say who you suspect and why, and then cast a vote!" and I was like "Dude... I don't have that."

Have I really repeated it so much that it earned a comment? I didn't think I had been that repetitive.

And go to hell, Snow Dog my friend!

sprityo wrote:Let me go over what glorf had said yesterday to see what youre talking about sig, cause i dont remember much outside of he was having a bad_time.jpg

Nachomamma8 wrote:

sig wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

sig wrote:hm Glorf replaced out, that is interesting.

What do you make of it?
:

I think it could mean Sprityo is mafia, in fact I'd be willing to lynch on it. Glorf was alreayd a suspect of mine, for not giving reads not talking much and a general gut read. Two things to know about Glorf is he hates lying, even in a game he won't do it and he hates being mafia. His refusal to answer the good/bad question was a tip off, he wouldn't lie about it, he'd just not say it either way. I'm thinking his BTSC mates told him that. He went with it, but hated it and asked to be replaced. Since even if he was bad, he wouldn't want to let his team down. So he replaced out since he couldn't be a mafia member and he did this soon enough that most people wouldn't consider it.

He attempted to do the same thing in Star wars mafia when he was bad as well.

So I'm voting there and I'll be voting there now, since I am 80% sure Sprityo 2.0/Glorf are mafia and that is why Glorf acted the way he did day 1 and was replaced.

I'm feeling good about the SDs and Golden. I won't be lynching Jack today since he is a civ lean, or Epi/LC since I need time to read them.
I never saw the case on MM so he won't get my vote either.

So Glorf replacing out is closely correlated with him being a baddie?

Nachomamma8 wrote:I like DDL's catch-up posts. Snow Dog's Long Con centric snark makes me feel a little better about the slot. Epi still feels okay. I don't understand any of the early votes unless Glorf replacing out is a baddie thing in which case gross.

sig wrote:

Nachomamma8 wrote:I like DDL's catch-up posts. Snow Dog's Long Con centric snark makes me feel a little better about the slot. Epi still feels okay. I don't understand any of the early votes unless Glorf replacing out is a baddie thing in which case gross.

I mean in theory, if I hadn't jumped on it, then there wouldn't be a problem. Since nobody else suspected Glorf. However, like I said I'd have been pursuing this tomorrow regardless it'll just be harder now since Glorf is easier to expose as mafia.

Snow Dog wrote:Sprityo, what is your opinion of Glorfindel. Good or bad?

Nachomamma8 wrote:

Soneji wrote:I'll be voting spirityo this phase. Glorf's fence-sitting, lack of contributions and straight avoidance of accusing anyone put her high up on my scum scale.

I don't think holding lack of contributions against a player who replaced out shortly after is fair. I don't think that "fence-sitting" and "avoidance of accusing anyone" AR really strong accusation either; he didn't agree with the two wagons and then replaced out shortly after, but you're making it seem like he was avoiding contributing during a time when everyone had awesome fleshed out scumreads and refusing to give a position on a bunch of people.

Nachomamma8 wrote:And what makes you think he replaced out of that game because he was bad as opposed to because he was busy? Has he replaced out of other games?

sprityo wrote:You are correct though sig, in that replacing out under suspicion equals mafia a lot of the times, but it also can mean just a player is under stress inbetween game and real life and just cant find the time or energy to commit to a game. (that's what happened to me in Mad max)

Glorfindel wrote:

Bubbles wrote:i agree with golden don't think glorfindel is bad, seems genuine to me. voting S~V~S on his behalf

on a side note what is your username based upon glorfindel? it reminds me of lord of the rings

Thank you, Bubbles. It's nice to see that there are some players here that can see the truth.

Yes, Glorfindel is a Tolkein creation https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glorfindel He is a great and noble character and one to which I seek to aspire (Mafia game-wise).