The Syndicate

juliets wrote:

Matt wrote:Sorry to do this, but I have to get ready for work and jet.

I'm voting DH. Don't think he genuinely wanted Nero lynched, and it shows.

Good luck town!

You didn't even let him respond.

I wouldn't panic too much. Responses aren't relevant to Matt

(Sorry Matt!)

Golden wrote:

juliets wrote:

Matt wrote:Sorry to do this, but I have to get ready for work and jet.

I'm voting DH. Don't think he genuinely wanted Nero lynched, and it shows.

Good luck town!

You didn't even let him respond.

I wouldn't panic too much. Responses aren't relevant to Matt

(Sorry Matt!)

Hahahaha!

Golden wrote:

Dom wrote:Bubbles' posts and vote were bad to me regardless of intent. Tone-wise, timing, etc.

How can something be bad 'regardless of intent'?

Her tone is entirely consistent with civ bubbles, as I was saying early and many people pointed out to me after I voted her (and I always agreed with that).
The only thing about the timing and choice of vote would have been to do exactly as she said... save glorfindel... who turns out to be civilian.

So, explain to me how her normal civilian tone and the timing of her vote are bad, exactly?

I didn't read the posts as civ. I read them as bad. I thought she sounded bad. I didn't think about who she might be saving-- I thought she sounded bad.

Golden wrote:I just looked at your four links Dom and...

That's putting pressure on me?

Saying 'lynch golden 2016' - like, to me it doesn't matter who says something like that, out of context it could just as easily be sarcastic as serious. It went right past me if it was a serious accusation.

You've said it's bullsuit I'm not role claiming, but tell me exactly what you thought I was roleclaiming? When I explained myself, you never replied to suggest you disagreed.

None of that felt like pressure to me...

But I will say, all game, you've felt like someone who will push into something very briefly and then back off when it isn't going that way. I don't know if this is a tell of a particular affiliation for you.

I felt like I put some pressure on you. I believe I said I was pestering you at a certain point as well.

Think about it Golden: A World Reborn, did Dom give up on his suspicions?


But still, you've yet to give a single reason for thinking I'm bad. What makes me more bad than other people? You said you won't elaborate, and that's some bullsuit there.

Dom wrote:Think about it Golden: A World Reborn, did Dom give up on his suspicions?

This is a really good jumping off point for me. I'll have to go back and look a bit, because to be fair I wasn't really focussing in that game on trying to figure out your affiliation lol.

Dom wrote:You said you won't elaborate, and that's some bullsuit there.

I didn't say I WON'T elaborate. I just said I've already given the whole reason, there is nothing more to say. Process of elimination, in that I haven't got a reason to have a civ read on you. I mean, I could have picked any of those five names as the one I leant most strongly on, because its so close. So it's really only gut feels. I can't really elaborate on something that is so gut based. But, the flip side of that is, I'm very convinceable through discussion to see some that group of people as more likely good or bad.

Golden wrote:

Typhoony wrote:I don't understand this either. You've basically claimed you have people in mind for almost all named civ roles, so saying you are a cop should really be the same thing as saying you are civilian. Either you are a cop or you are not civilian, it is as easy as that. Nobody is asking you to claim a cop # Golden.
That, coupled with your very careful wording of not having targeted a baddie (why would a cop put that there? They don't have to target anyone) makes me think you are not a cop either, which really only leaves either inmate or bad. Either way, I'm fine with voting you.

I must have answered this over and over and over and over again. My careful wording was very carefully intended to include both targetting and non-targetting roles.

Mac designed a sentence I 'could have said' which would have made it CLEAR I was a non-targetting role.
In return, I designed a sentence that I 'could have said' which would have made it clear I was a targetting role.

My chosen sentence very intentionally did neither.

My point is that a cop would have zero reason to intentionally design that sentence in a very specific way.

OK, Dom, you read bubbles as bad. But I've somewhat made a career out of defending bubbles when she is civ. There's only been one time Bubbles has been bad that I've played and remember... when she was the Beuatiful Beast in World Reborn... and I was nailing her to the wall from about day 2.

I wouldn't ask you to trust my instincts on many people, but I would ask you to trust them on Bubbles. Yeah, I voted for her yesterday, but it was because I had a moment of doubt where I wondered if I'd been reading things badly wrong, her and glorfindel. But, glorfindel was civ, it gives me more confidence in my initial read on bubbles and makes me feel silly for doubting it.

Typhoony wrote:

Golden wrote:

Typhoony wrote:I don't understand this either. You've basically claimed you have people in mind for almost all named civ roles, so saying you are a cop should really be the same thing as saying you are civilian. Either you are a cop or you are not civilian, it is as easy as that. Nobody is asking you to claim a cop # Golden.
That, coupled with your very careful wording of not having targeted a baddie (why would a cop put that there? They don't have to target anyone) makes me think you are not a cop either, which really only leaves either inmate or bad. Either way, I'm fine with voting you.

I must have answered this over and over and over and over again. My careful wording was very carefully intended to include both targetting and non-targetting roles.

Mac designed a sentence I 'could have said' which would have made it CLEAR I was a non-targetting role.
In return, I designed a sentence that I 'could have said' which would have made it clear I was a targetting role.

My chosen sentence very intentionally did neither.

My point is that a cop would have zero reason to intentionally design that sentence in a very specific way.

Why?

Golden wrote:

Typhoony wrote:

Golden wrote:I don't think Matt is bad.

I don't think bubbles is bad. If Glorf had come back bad I would have.

I don't understand your thought process regarding Bubble and Glorfindel.
You had been hesitant about Glorfindel before, then Bubbles came in with her drive by post, then you thought there could be a connection there but preferred to lynch Bubbles because Glorfindel actually contributed, and now you're back to where you were before.
It seems like a lazy way to make us think you are trying to evolve your thoughts based on happenings in the thread but you just wound up at the same point you were at before.
You seemed to not give a damn who was lynched yesterday and that to me is not civ Golden.

It's not hard to understand. Glorfindel was good. Therefore Bubbles did not save him. Therefore, given bubbles conforms to her normal civ behaviour, I see no reason to see her as bad.

Why is this a 'lazy way' to evolve my thoughts? At least they are evolving. As far as I can tell your thoughts haven't evolved in days. I'm the only person I know you suspect.

Key word being "trying". "Trying to evolve your thoughts". Ie you are making it look like your thoughts are progressing in a natural way but you're not doing that at all.

Is "I will never role hint and don't expect me to" not enough for you?

I don't understand why anyone would actually WANT to push me into committing to one side or the other.

Golden wrote: My point is that a cop would have zero reason to intentionally design that sentence in a very specific way.

Why?[/quote]
Because you, with a cop being the last civ role that you can basically be, would have no need to hide that fact.

@Typh - I just don't give a flying f how it appears my thoughts are evolving. Perhaps if I were bad I might put more effort into making them appear to be evolving naturally. Can you recall anyone ever calling me out when I'm bad for the appearance of my thoughts not evolving naturally? Why would you see this as making me bad?

I am not having very much luck today on who to vote for. Someone else said this and I feel similarly that my leaning bad reads are all gone. There has been evidence brought about DH but he has not been around since Friday to respond to it. I don't agree right now with either Typh or Dom being bad. I understand what your saying Golden but I can't suspect someone off of your gut reads. I'm not seeing Golden bad either. Equivocate and ekenat haven't been here to send in kills, and Bass its hard to say because the field that tells the last time you were here in his profile is blank. So anyway, you get the picture. I'm tempted to vote Matt for not letting DH respond before voting him but that seems like a small reason to vote someone. If anyone has other ideas I'd love to hear them (btw I've noticed DH, SVS, and Enrique haven't been here this phase. I could see one of them being silenced but all three? Enrique said he would have declining participating but nothing during the whole phase?).

Typhoony wrote:

Golden wrote: My point is that a cop would have zero reason to intentionally design that sentence in a very specific way.

Why?

Because you, with a cop being the last civ role that you can basically be, would have no need to hide that fact.[/quote]

What need do I have to be open about it either?

I disagree that a cop is the 'last civ role I can basically be'. As I already pointed out.

I could be slotting someone in to another role to make the baddies believe I'm not it.
I could be lying straight up about not being any particular role, just as anyone else would.

You seem to ignore the fact that I just don't want to role hint as being a perfectly reasonable explanation. I don't want to role hint. I've made this clear from the start, that it is something I will not do.

Any inference you draw is your own, and I will not confirm or deny it, no matter how much you might harangue me to.

Civvies thoughts will progress and evolve as the game goes on. They start with 0 knowledge. As information (ie posts etc) gets dropped in the thread, they will learn more about the game. Their thoughts can and will change more often.
Baddies' thoughts less so, simply because they have more knowledge at the start of the game and generally have a better grip on what is going on.

@ Juliets: Who would you vote right now if you had to and why?

Linki: If you were a named civ role, you would put less of a target on your back by hinting at being a cop. Surely you realize that.

juliets wrote:I am not having very much luck today on who to vote for. Someone else said this and I feel similarly that my leaning bad reads are all gone. There has been evidence brought about DH but he has not been around since Friday to respond to it. I don't agree right now with either Typh or Dom being bad. I understand what your saying Golden but I can't suspect someone off of your gut reads. I'm not seeing Golden bad either. Equivocate and ekenat haven't been here to send in kills, and Bass its hard to say because the field that tells the last time you were here in his profile is blank. So anyway, you get the picture. I'm tempted to vote Matt for not letting DH respond before voting him but that seems like a small reason to vote someone. If anyone has other ideas I'd love to hear them (btw I've noticed DH, SVS, and Enrique haven't been here this phase. I could see one of them being silenced but all three? Enrique said he would have declining participating but nothing during the whole phase?).

Yeah, this is basically how I feel.

I'm thinking I'm not feeling Typh because I'm beginning to perhaps see light on what his angle is on me. I think he may be Montoya.

Typhoony wrote:Civvies thoughts will progress and evolve as the game goes on. They start with 0 knowledge. As information (ie posts etc) gets dropped in the thread, they will learn more about the game. Their thoughts can and will change more often.
Baddies' thoughts less so, simply because they have more knowledge at the start of the game and generally have a better grip on what is going on.

Whats your point? On day zero, for example, I was pursuing MP and enrique to the ends of the earth, determined they were my top suspects. Now they are two of my top town reads. I put SVS through the ringer and came out the other side feeling she might be civ after all. Are you honestly trying to tell me my opinions haven't changed at all?

Typhoony, you are completely wrong about me, but you are someone I think would know my game style relatively well, so I think you ought to be able to think about this twice. I think you've been so hung up in this concept that I would be open about my role but this is just not something I'd be willing to do in any circumstances. Not because I'm mafia. Not because I'm an inmate. Just because I'm not willing to do it. If you move past the fact that you suspect me for that, I think you'll recognise that I've played a very open game where I have shared heaps of reads and they have absolutely moved organically as the game has moved.

If I was that role (I'm not), I'd probably be pissed at you for saying you think that.

Typhoony wrote:If I was that role (I'm not), I'd probably be pissed at you for saying you think that.

And yet... you are badgering me to claim.

Typh regarding you asking who i would vote, I just made a post re: how i feel like I have no body to vote. I won't vote you or Dom or Golden at this time. The only person I have any small inkling to vote would be Matt for not letting DH respond to accusations before voting him but thats a mighty slim reason. This is really just a condensed version of the post I made. Maybe you missed it.

Golden wrote:

Typhoony wrote:If I was that role (I'm not), I'd probably be pissed at you for saying you think that.

And yet... you are badgering me to claim.

If you want to say you think I'm a cop, feel free

I haven't even tried to catch up yet, my mind has been taken right out of this game. I guess I need to get started though.

juliets wrote:Typh regarding you asking who i would vote, I just made a post re: how i feel like I have no body to vote. I won't vote you or Dom or Golden at this time. The only person I have any small inkling to vote would be Matt for not letting DH respond to accusations before voting him but thats a mighty slim reason. This is really just a condensed version of the post I made. Maybe you missed it.

I did not miss it. It just felt like a post to make a post really. It's almost the end of the Day and I can't do much with "I will not vote X, Y, Z, A, B, C, D or E." Hence why I asked who you would vote for right now and why.

juliets wrote:Typh regarding you asking who i would vote, I just made a post re: how i feel like I have no body to vote. I won't vote you or Dom or Golden at this time. The only person I have any small inkling to vote would be Matt for not letting DH respond to accusations before voting him but thats a mighty slim reason. This is really just a condensed version of the post I made. Maybe you missed it.

Don't you think that seems like Matt, though?

I felt like people were far too hasty to clear Matt after the Nerolunar lynch. Back then, I felt he could well be bad. But, over time, for example his unflinching suspicion of people like TH and MP despite all evidence to the contrary. I just came out of all of that feeling like this is normal Matt.

I could see Matt as inmate though.

Typhoony wrote:

Golden wrote:

Typhoony wrote:If I was that role (I'm not), I'd probably be pissed at you for saying you think that.

And yet... you are badgering me to claim.

If you want to say you think I'm a cop, feel free

Lol, I can see we are just going around in circles.

OK - I feel very badgered and I'm actually kind of pissed off at you that I'm doing this.

I'm a cop. The reason I said to Mac he could track me all he wanted and he would never see me target the person who died is because, like, even as not the killer I literally can't target the person who dies.

But I shouldn't have had to SAY this. I don't like that you basically force me to admit I'm a cop or else you will scum-read me.

Typhoony wrote:

juliets wrote:Typh regarding you asking who i would vote, I just made a post re: how i feel like I have no body to vote. I won't vote you or Dom or Golden at this time. The only person I have any small inkling to vote would be Matt for not letting DH respond to accusations before voting him but thats a mighty slim reason. This is really just a condensed version of the post I made. Maybe you missed it.

I did not miss it. It just felt like a post to make a post really. It's almost the end of the Day and I can't do much with "I will not vote X, Y, Z, A, B, C, D or E." Hence why I asked who you would vote for right now and why.

I made the post to clarify where i am in my thinking. There are still hours and hours until the vote is due. I realize thats not the same for you but I just can't make something up out of thin air so you will have a solid answer.

Golden wrote: Lol, I can see we are just going around in circles.

OK - I feel very badgered and I'm actually kind of pissed off at you that I'm doing this.

I'm a cop. The reason I said to Mac he could track me all he wanted and he would never see me target the person who died is because, like, even as not the killer I literally can't target the person who dies.

But I shouldn't have had to SAY this. I don't like that you basically force me to admit I'm a cop or else you will scum-read me.

I don't know if this changes anything in how I think about you tbh, so don't simply assume it does. I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt for now, not because of this post, but because of the exchange we had.

That does mean I need to find someone else to vote.

I'm not going to assume it does. Don't assume that you denying you are Montoya makes me think you aren't, either.

Does anyone have a good read on Dom, either civ or bad, based on thread content rather than just gut?

Golden wrote:

juliets wrote:Typh regarding you asking who i would vote, I just made a post re: how i feel like I have no body to vote. I won't vote you or Dom or Golden at this time. The only person I have any small inkling to vote would be Matt for not letting DH respond to accusations before voting him but thats a mighty slim reason. This is really just a condensed version of the post I made. Maybe you missed it.

Don't you think that seems like Matt, though?

I felt like people were far too hasty to clear Matt after the Nerolunar lynch. Back then, I felt he could well be bad. But, over time, for example his unflinching suspicion of people like TH and MP despite all evidence to the contrary. I just came out of all of that feeling like this is normal Matt.

I could see Matt as inmate though.

Yeah Golden I see what you mean. And I can agree that I see Matt more as an inmate than mafia. I just have a real thing about people voting people who haven't been able to respond. If he had voted Bass after making a case I could understand because the chances that he would come around are nil. But DH has been around the whole game. Anyway, I don't know what to do.

He's seemed more like civ Dom than baddie Dom to me. He's involved and seems genuine in his thought processes.

juliets wrote:Anyway, I don't know what to do.

I genuinely don't either. I feel like its the product of quite a few days on top of each other which have been quite stagnant in terms of the development of new content and reads, and quite a few people entirely disengaging with the game. Like, for instance, Enrique felt like one of the best assets we have and I wish he was back.

I'm willing to vote a low poster that has been able to send in the kills. Who are the possibilities then?

Typhoony wrote:I'm willing to vote a low poster that has been able to send in the kills. Who are the possibilities then?

Depends how you define low. You might be looking at only Bubbles, but I feel quite sure bubbles isn't bad.

Other than that, you are looking at someone like LoRab or DF.

COMFORTABLENESS
FORESHADOWED
MAGGOTY
MHO
TEN

Who are both browsing the forum right now.

Let's hear their thoughts

Linki: Hello SVS

Bubbles, maybe Bass we can't tell, and then up in the 70's Lorab and DFaraday but they are posting like they always do. Bubbles too for that matter. Hopefully someone else answers this so they can disagree if they think they can prove Bass hasn't been online.

Dang i didn't realized she was cursed. Another good mind lost.

Typhoony wrote:Who are both browsing the forum right now.

Let's hear their thoughts

Linki: Hello SVS

NYGMA
COMFORTABLENESS
GODFATHERED
WHOSE
MOOT

juliets wrote:Another good mind lost.

Sounds like you are attending SVS' funeral lol.

OK, SVS. Lets see if you can do anything like what TH did.

Please repeat after me.

Yes
No
Suspicious
Agree
Disagree
Town
Mafia
Inmate

Hey Nygma, you punk. Give out some curses that people can work with like you did with me. Asshole.

Golden wrote:Does anyone have a good read on Dom, either civ or bad, based on thread content rather than just gut?

I have a low level civ read of Dom. He tends to have a certain tone of grrrrrr in his posts when he's evil that I'm not seeing.

I think part of the challenge we're all having is that we're playing a game in which a third of the players are vanilla civs, and most of us are used there being no or almost no vanilla civs. So, there's a whole lot of people that we're not sure how to read/who are posting differently than what we're used to, regardless of what they're like as either civ or bad.

Typhoony wrote:Hey Nygma, you punk. Give out some curses that people can work with like you did with me. Asshole.

It might be Poison Ivy. I never noticed you were cursed.

Golden wrote:

Typhoony wrote:Hey Nygma, you punk. Give out some curses that people can work with like you did with me. Asshole.

It might be Poison Ivy. I never noticed you were cursed.

I'm like 99% sure Ivy is dead.

LoRab wrote:

Golden wrote:Does anyone have a good read on Dom, either civ or bad, based on thread content rather than just gut?

I have a low level civ read of Dom. He tends to have a certain tone of grrrrrr in his posts when he's evil that I'm not seeing.

I think part of the challenge we're all having is that we're playing a game in which a third of the players are vanilla civs, and most of us are used there being no or almost no vanilla civs. So, there's a whole lot of people that we're not sure how to read/who are posting differently than what we're used to, regardless of what they're like as either civ or bad.

I agree, and another third who are 'bad' (inmates) but have no btsc ties and may feel they can genuinely win as town.

There aren't very many out and out baddies. That makes them hard to find.

@Bullz, yeah you might be right. I wondered if she died after my memes thing because I never was told I had an antidote but I also never had to do anything else after that.

That's cause I was cursed in a way that allowed that.

Typhoony wrote:I'm willing to vote a low poster that has been able to send in the kills. Who are the possibilities then?

I would agree with this but I don't think Bubbles is bad. I think DF looks slightly sketchy but I'm not sure if he's sketchy enough to vote for. I doubt Bass, Ekeknat, or Equivocate have been sending in anything. What do you think of LoRab? I don't have any opinion at all on her.

Golden wrote:

LoRab wrote:

Golden wrote:Does anyone have a good read on Dom, either civ or bad, based on thread content rather than just gut?

I have a low level civ read of Dom. He tends to have a certain tone of grrrrrr in his posts when he's evil that I'm not seeing.

I think part of the challenge we're all having is that we're playing a game in which a third of the players are vanilla civs, and most of us are used there being no or almost no vanilla civs. So, there's a whole lot of people that we're not sure how to read/who are posting differently than what we're used to, regardless of what they're like as either civ or bad.

I agree, and another third who are 'bad' (inmates) but have no btsc ties and may feel they can genuinely win as town.

There aren't very many out and out baddies. That makes them hard to find.

@Bullz, yeah you might be right. I wondered if she died after my memes thing because I never was told I had an antidote but I also never had to do anything else after that.

I definitely didn't find an antidote because I didn't even look for one, but my curses stopped right when yours did.

Golden wrote:OK, SVS. Lets see if you can do anything like what TH did.

Please repeat after me.

Yes
No
Suspicious
Agree
Disagree
Town
Mafia
Inmate

YES
NO
COMFORTABLENESS
GOD
FATHERED
WOG
OHM
MAT

Golden wrote:

Typhoony wrote:Hey Nygma, you punk. Give out some curses that people can work with like you did with me. Asshole.

It might be Poison Ivy. I never noticed you were cursed.