The Syndicate

nutella wrote:

Jackofhearts2005 wrote:

Long Con wrote:

Silver Lantern wrote:Dys has not power claimed, right?

Change vote: Dyslexicon

Tell me more about this expectation.

Though I shouldn't make a habit of speaking for others (it always makes me look bad, even if we're both town and even if I'm disagreeing), I'll field this.

It is very common for HCRealms lynches to revolve around believability of a claim.

Playing in an X-Men game and claiming Wolverine? You're gonna get a little slack. Claiming cop but you only have results on dead players (night kills generally flip on our board) or already trusted town? You're gonna get the side eye. It's generally bad form to lynch without allowing for a claim of some sort ("Wth? I'm Wolverine/the cop, you guys! Why didn't you wait before you lynched me?") and it's considered scummy to endure pressure without claiming ("Clearly, he's googling X-Men and trying to find a believable claim. Or else he's just avoiding claiming cause he knows there's a good chance he's be called out for lying").

I don't think claiming is going to be nearly as powerful/standard in this setup as Silver is used to.

This is pretty weird to me. Of course I can't speak for what Dys is used to, but at least here this is not particularly common practice. Sometimes role claims happen in desperate situations, but often they're not even allowed/encouraged, so they're certainly not expected as a normal defense. And even if they were, I don't get why Silver expected as much from Dys now, since (a) there are only a few votes on them, so even if it was normal practice to claim when in danger of being lynched, it wouldn't make sense yet because they're not even really close to the danger zone, and (b) claiming makes very little sense in this game because it is a closed setup, we don't even know what the available abilities are. I mean as you (Silver) said above it could be worth it if you happen to have an easily recognizable ability to claim, but I'm expecting that most of the roles in this game are fairly unique (my only data points are my own and the gimmick Scotty hinted at having, but I get the feeling there are a lot of obscure abilities in this game). It just seems to me that there would be little utility in revealing your power if nobody will recognize it -- sure maybe we'd believe it wasn't just made up, but we'd have no way of corroborating it as a civvie role rather than a scum one. Idk, I could be wrong and there could be plenty of "normal" abilities in this game that would be worthwhile to claim if nobody else could counterclaim them, but it just seems odd that you'd so strongly expect Dys to claim at this stage (again with so few votes) so much that the lack of claim is vote-worthy to you. Probably just a culture thing, but Dys isn't from the same site as silver, right?

Or perhaps I misread the intent of your vote, and you were merely adding another vote so as to attempt to pressure Dys into claiming? I'm still so not used to this style of voting and I usually think of voting as a stronger committment/ultimate expression of suspicion and less used to it just being a temporary way of pressuring someone. I guess I have played several games with changeable votes now, and have tried to get into the practice of voting early to express suspicion that's subject to change to pressure people into defending, but in the past I was so used to saving my vote for as late as possible to ensure I went with my most confident choice. Anyway, was that the intent of your vote? Do you want Dys to be more in danger of a lynch so as to pressure a claim?

I just still can't see it being helpful. Again, as speedchuck said, maybe if Dys had enough votes to be getting worried, but that's not the case, and even then the closed setup means a claim is not a particularly foolproof defense.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote:

Golden wrote:

Jackofhearts2005 wrote:

Golden wrote:I don't think it matters how it went for dizzy. I think more relevant is how he expected it to go. I found him at his most genuine when he indicated surprise at the heat it took - and it makes sense to me that if it's normal in other places he wouldn't expect it to be abnormal here.

For that reason, I disagree with the assertion that it was likely that dizzy got lynched after slip (in his mind) and so he shouldn't have seen it as risky. Likewise, it doesn't seem likely that he expected to have to defend it and so he shouldn't have seen it as giving him huge town cred.

That's why I come to the view it's a marmot-style 'lols' play he'd do from any affiliation, and my own town read comes from his other content and not in any way the slip.

Because I haven't got a vote down yet:

SIG

Loving this evaluation of Dizzy's motivation. Makes me feel better about putting you green.

Why Sig?

His early posts weren't inspiring and I'm waiting for him to come back.

If he doesn't come back, are you gonna try to lynch him?

sig wrote:Is it still day 1 am I still alive? Also stop trying to lynch me

Golden As a placeholder.

speedchuck wrote:Here are some of the people that have been in recent scumreads:

Fredwood
Sig
Strawhenge
Sorsha
LC
Nacho
Me
DrWilgy
Scotty
Marmot

JackofHearts/JJJ? They seem possibly suspicious toward one another. Not w/w at the least.

I'd have to trust others concerning Wigly's usual D1 play. As a matter of fact, I think INH is the only person I've played with before. So I have no metareads.

I'm not feeling great about voting for Strawhenge or Long Con anymore. I don't have a townread on them, but most of my interactions with them was arguing about dizzy logic. I can't read them yet, and they might be helpful.

The rest I am fine with lynching. I like JOH over JJJ at the moment. The big problem is that most of these people aren't memorable. I'd have to scour the pages for their posts.

I may just do that.

Off of the list above, does anyone want to give some reads? Try to get a consensus going? Especially you, SIG. Welcome back.

Golden wrote:I don't think it matters how it went for dizzy. I think more relevant is how he expected it to go. I found him at his most genuine when he indicated surprise at the heat it took - and it makes sense to me that if it's normal in other places he wouldn't expect it to be abnormal here.

For that reason, I disagree with the assertion that it was likely that dizzy got lynched after slip (in his mind) and so he shouldn't have seen it as risky. Likewise, it doesn't seem likely that he expected to have to defend it and so he shouldn't have seen it as giving him huge town cred.

That's why I come to the view it's a marmot-style 'lols' play he'd do from any affiliation, and my own town read comes from his other content and not in any way the slip.

Soneji wrote:[VOTE: ] aubergine[VOTE:

Out of all the people I've had some suspicion on today, this one is the strongest. I had some doubts about culture clash but the more I see from Silver Lantern and JoH, the less his posts are excusable. They both have been in the thick of things, not using their unfamiliarity with the posters/style here to excuse their activity/opinions. posted his opinion on the Dys situation to then turn around and say his opinion should be ignored in favor of others. He posted that seeming scummy is a town method of surviving longer where he is from, which I can't see much of a town motivation for posting here. He at that point could tell that is not the standard here nor was there any suspicion on him at the time, so mentioning it could only ever serve as a preliminary defense for any future scum behavior from him or SL/JoH's. Preemptive defenses are near the top of my scumtell list.

Could still be culture clash but I'm betting my money that it is attempting to abuse culture clash to gain an edge.] aubergine

[VOTE:

This is an interesting take. I haven't had the best feelings about Fred either (he made orange on my list) -- out of the several players in this game that I'm unfamiliar with, he's made the least good impression on me and seemed to blend in pretty blendily. Silver's description of his meta doesn't help his case (trying to counteract usual style? piiiiing)]

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:[VOTE: This exchange with sig is giving me problems:] aubergine

Spoiler: show

sig wrote:

Golden wrote:

sig wrote:

Golden wrote:

insertnamehere wrote:[VOTE: This little flippity flop especially struck me the wrong way.] aubergine

[VOTE:

What am I to do? I said something that was true to me at the time, and then when it was wrong I wanted to correct it.

In the same circumstance, what would you do?] aubergine

[VOTE:

I do agree with INH, those posts did seem strange, but would it be something the mafia would do? I don't think so.] aubergine

[VOTE:

What was strange about them?] aubergine

[VOTE:

The fact you said you didn't have the map then you said you did.

It could have been a PM slip true, but I'm not convinced that's the case. However, I don't see any reason why a mafia member would do this, I view it more as you trying to make it harder to narrow down the map holder and as of right now we have four(?) people claiming the map. Myself, MM, Golden, and JJJ.

So I wouldn't lynch vote you on that and I would find it suspicious for people to use that as a reason to vote for you.

Speaking of voting I should totally get an item tonight. Vote for me then.

Also I voted East since Philadelphia is on a east coast.] aubergine

[VOTE:

That he bothered to qualify Golden's map PM/no PM thing as "strange" while also batting it away as something not suspicious strikes me a pointless combination of thoughts -- i.e. I don't know why "strange" needed to be stated. At the same time I can't tell if this is one of this things with sig and words where he just voices a perspective a little awkwardly or if there's something to be concerned about.

If there's a separate beef to be stated about sig it's that his posts were item-centric when he was around. Hunting was nil/limited.] aubergine

[VOTE:

Yeah, bad look for Sig. Especially with the "would a mafia have any reason to do this?" re: deciding to map claim right as he himself map claims. Hello wifom. Plus as you say he's pretty item-centric, nominating himself, to me this all falls into the same category of self-centered neutrality you also accused Sorsha of.

Leaving my vote on Wilgy for now, but I'm more than willing to switch to Sig or Fred if the tide swings toward either of them. I'll wait and see which if any of them (or Sorsha) come back to defend themselves/participate, and go from there.

Linki: Well there's sig, and not with the most reassuring tone. Might have to switch my vote to you buddy unless you put in some effort. I don't like that attitude.]

Jackofhearts2005 wrote:I think there becomes a point after the third or so claimed map that claiming maps becomes scummy. I.e., it is "helping defend the real map holder" for townie cred while not actually doing anything.

This is already factored into my Sig read.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: To be clear, you like me better than JJJ because you think I'm more town? Or you like me better for a noose?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I can't remember for sure, but did someone here recently switch votes in the poll from North-East to East? Just asking, please say so if you did. I have reasons.

Fredwood wrote:Well I thought I was posting content and trying to be "helpful" and giving reads and pointing out posts that I did not like, but I guess they weren't or people are only going to take one post as the entire context for my participation as the basis for their argument so Fuck it. Not really sure what to say, if it isn't good enough, oh well was trying my best.

But yeah, I suck at mafia so it's all good.

speedchuck wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I can't remember for sure, but did someone here recently switch votes in the poll from North-East to East? Just asking, please say so if you did. I have reasons.

I started out east, switched to Northeast, then back to east. I can explain why, but if you have reasons, go ahead with them.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:At the moment I could vote for anyone among Sorsha, DrWilgy, and sig. They've all been prodded, and they've all appeared to offer nothing. I am a bit concerned though that Wilgy's comment about lynching him affecting the way we perceive his meta was genuine though, because I could see Wilgy being the type to care about that and allow himself to die for it.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote:Kidding. Following JJJ. He seems to care more for whatever that's worth.

speedchuck wrote:About the changing directions: I don't want there to be a tie. I keep switching to the direction that keeps us further from a tie.
To be fair, I didn't get here until after map discussion was about over. So if I should have a reason to follow someone, please, explain.

Fredwood wrote:Well either I'm not posting content or I am. Not really sure how to defend myself if I'm being accused of both with the later being used as as proof of a deviation of my meta.

You want to say I read scum and not helping fine, but I'm also being accused of trying to fit in and adapt to the playstyle here as proof of my scum...it's all very convenient.

Long Con wrote:To the three Map-Holders: Do you think you should be followed? Do you feel like you can look at the map and further a Civ win with your choices?

Just curious because my choice (East) was mostly random.

Scotty wrote:I'm on page 15 but checking in to say I won't be around today per request of the girl. So if something was said of me after page 15, my apologies!

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:

Fredwood wrote:Well either I'm not posting content or I am. Not really sure how to defend myself if I'm being accused of both with the later being used as as proof of a deviation of my meta.

You want to say I read scum and not helping fine, but I'm also being accused of trying to fit in and adapt to the playstyle here as proof of my scum...it's all very convenient.

Do you feel that any of your accusers are trying to take advantage of you?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:

Long Con wrote:To the three Map-Holders: Do you think you should be followed? Do you feel like you can look at the map and further a Civ win with your choices?

Just curious because my choice (East) was mostly random.

The actions I take in this game are in the interest of a civilian victory. I cannot guarantee that I will make every right move or decision map or otherwise, but I will try with the resources available. I want you to choose who you follow based upon who you trust.

Long Con wrote:And it looks like I'm already voting with who I trust the most, so that's good I guess.

Long Con wrote:To the three Map-Holders: Do you think you should be followed? Do you feel like you can look at the map and further a Civ win with your choices?

Just curious because my choice (East) was mostly random.

Golden wrote:If we go to a location that turns out to be favourable, I might be able to help us get back there. It looks like you can't get everywhere from everywhere, though. For now, it's meaningless to me.

Strawhenge wrote:Dang it, I haven't given any thought to the direction. Who has the map? Or is claiming to?

Strawhenge wrote:Dang it, I haven't given any thought to the direction. Who has the map? Or is claiming to?

nutella wrote: This is an interesting take. I haven't had the best feelings about Fred either (he made orange on my list) -- out of the several players in this game that I'm unfamiliar with, he's made the least good impression on me and seemed to blend in pretty blendily. Silver's description of his meta doesn't help his case (trying to counteract usual style? piiiiing)

Jackofhearts2005 wrote:@Realmsers

The "view your posts button is similar to our usercp button if you don't want emails.

There's a setting that lets you disable signatures, which makes the forum more readable.

Silver Lantern wrote:

nutella wrote: This is an interesting take. I haven't had the best feelings about Fred either (he made orange on my list) -- out of the several players in this game that I'm unfamiliar with, he's made the least good impression on me and seemed to blend in pretty blendily. Silver's description of his meta doesn't help his case (trying to counteract usual style? piiiiing)

Just to give a fair assessment of what I meant. I believe that he might be changing up his playstyle to post more, regardless of alignment. Games on our home site don't go 20 pages on D1. Heck, sometimes entire games don't go that long. I feel I am posting more and trying to address everything directed at me too, just because I think that's more the way you guys play. Like I said earlier in the game, it's perfectly normal for townies on our home site to sit by and not do much "scum hunting" at all.

Strawhenge wrote:I was just looking at sig because of Jay's vote, and sig also said he has the map. But then his only game-related posts have been about Golden's flip flop, and sig's language in that case suggests that sig doesn't have it.

I'm confused.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I can confirm this statement. I played a game on HCR, and the threads are definitely a lot smaller. The hunting is definitely a lot thinner. These are NOT criticisms, just acknowledgements of the differences between our sites.

Silver Lantern wrote:

nutella wrote: This is an interesting take. I haven't had the best feelings about Fred either (he made orange on my list) -- out of the several players in this game that I'm unfamiliar with, he's made the least good impression on me and seemed to blend in pretty blendily. Silver's description of his meta doesn't help his case (trying to counteract usual style? piiiiing)

Just to give a fair assessment of what I meant. I believe that he might be changing up his playstyle to post more, regardless of alignment. Games on our home site don't go 20 pages on D1. Heck, sometimes entire games don't go that long. I feel I am posting more and trying to address everything directed at me too, just because I think that's more the way you guys play. Like I said earlier in the game, it's perfectly normal for townies on our home site to sit by and not do much "scum hunting" at all.

Fredwood wrote: Silver still reads town, but the lack of content jibe is annoying, because I actually am trying.