The Syndicate

Well Spies can check each other.
We just have Wiggly vote one of the spies which will drop their disguise unless they are Mafia.
The other Spy can then investigate them and will be able to tell if their disguise dropped or not.

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 3:52 pm Well Spies can check each other.
We just have Wiggly vote one of the spies which will drop their disguise unless they are Mafia.
The other Spy can then investigate them and will be able to tell if their disguise dropped or not.

Can this plan be Roleblocker or messed with by mafia?

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 3:54 pm

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 3:52 pm Well Spies can check each other.
We just have Wiggly vote one of the spies which will drop their disguise unless they are Mafia.
The other Spy can then investigate them and will be able to tell if their disguise dropped or not.

Can this plan be Roleblocker or messed with by mafia?

Spy check is a day ability so I can't think of a way it would be possible to do so.
As long as a Pyro votes a Spy the Spy looses their disguise unless they are Mafia.
If one Spy investigates the other while the Pyro votes them then they should be revealed as their disguise.

To put it another way.
If Blue Spy disguise as Red Soldier...
Red Spy investigates Blue Spy D2 as Wiggly Pyro votes Blue Spy.
Red Spy sees Blue Spy as Blue Spy if Blue Spy is Town.
Red Spy sees Blue Spy ad Red Solider if Blue Spy is Mafia.

Possible problems include...
Mafia killing or roleblocking one or both spies (Mostly prevented by not claiming D1)
Red Spy being Mafia and lying about Blue Spy (results in a 1 for 1)
This is a 1 way check so for both spies to be confirmed both need to live to day 4 effectively.

Note I'm just using the example. Blue and Red are really interchangeable. It doesn't matter who checks who.

OK I suppose another problem is both Spies rolled Mafia.
In which case, we were fucked to begin with since Mafia were given 2 vigilantes.

Has Sabie been scummy enough to warrant 7 votes atm?

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:00 pm To put it another way.
If Blue Spy disguise as Red Soldier...
Red Spy investigates Blue Spy D2 as Wiggly Pyro votes Blue Spy.
Red Spy sees Blue Spy as Blue Spy if Blue Spy is Town.
Red Spy sees Blue Spy ad Red Solider if Blue Spy is Mafia.

Possible problems include...
Mafia killing or roleblocking one or both spies (Mostly prevented by not claiming D1)
Red Spy being Mafia and lying about Blue Spy (results in a 1 for 1)
This is a 1 way check so for both spies to be confirmed both need to live to day 4 effectively.

"- Disguise Kit: Once per night, the Spy can choose a class/color combo that is still alive and disguise himself as them. While disguised, every day phase, the Spy will be allowed to check a player and learn their class/color (but not if they are town or mafia), and will be able to use his other abilities at following nights.

Starting from the next day after disguising, the Spy will have to work to maintain his disguise. He will lose it if he is targeted by anything at night, voted by a Pyro, if the Spy himself targets the player he is disguised as, or if he successfully kills a player. If his cover is blown, he will have to disguise again next night. If it was blown because he killed a player, he will also have to spend a night laying low and doing nothing to disguise again."

Ok, I think I get it.
But they will have to wait until after N2? Because the Pyro vote effect only counts from votes and the end of each day?

So Blue Spy is disguised. Says what role they are disguised as. Is voted by a Pyro at EoD. Next day, the other Spy can check to see if they really are successfully disguised still?

Seems complicated, but it's worth a try.
But if I'm not mistaken, this doesn't really need any preparations, as long as both spies use their disguise action this night?

I suppose host would need to be pinged for clarification on that part.
It kind of depends on if Spy looses the disgusie before or after the other Spy checks them.

ngl I don't remember a single one of Sable's posts

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:09 pm I suppose host would need to be pinged for clarification on that part.
It kind of depends on if Spy looses the disgusie before or after the other Spy checks them.

But if I'm not mistaken, first step would be for spies to just use their disguise action. And every role should use their action if there's no draw back, I think. So we don't have to scramble to get a plan set up in these final hours?

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:11 pm

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:09 pm I suppose host would need to be pinged for clarification on that part.
It kind of depends on if Spy looses the disgusie before or after the other Spy checks them.

But if I'm not mistaken, first step would be for spies to just use their disguise action. And every role should use their action if there's no draw back, I think. So we don't have to scramble to get a plan set up in these final hours?

Well yeah Spy can't do any action aside from Disguising when they have no disgusie.

Do we know what roles are in the game? I thought this game had some kind of cartoon theme. lel

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:13 pm Do we know what roles are in the game? I thought this game had some kind of cartoon theme. lel

They're in the OP

Its based on a popular moba

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:13 pm Do we know what roles are in the game? I thought this game had some kind of cartoon theme. lel

Derp clear denied

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:12 pmWell yeah Spy can't do any action aside from Disguising when they have no disgusie.

Alright. Make note of this plan, and maybe we can do something if we have a town Spy who is successfully disguised on D2.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:07 pm Has Sabie been scummy enough to warrant 7 votes atm?

Not really, but what 'cha gonna do?

Seanzie wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:17 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:07 pm Has Sabie been scummy enough to warrant 7 votes atm?

Not really, but what 'cha gonna do?

Yeah, I just read her ISO now and was like

Seanzie wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:17 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:07 pm Has Sabie been scummy enough to warrant 7 votes atm?

Not really, but what 'cha gonna do?

Take a look at the wagon, and see who looks opportunistic?

Town
LP
Dolby
Seanzie
TonyStarkPrime

Nulls/Mixed feelings
MacDougall
Marmot
Nanook
Dyslexicon
Lime Coke
DrWilgy
NotAnAxehole
JackOfHearts
Falcon

Scum
Gavial
Sabie
Sig
MartinGG99


I need to try to sort my nulls, i got too many.

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 3:52 pm Well Spies can check each other.
We just have Wiggly vote one of the spies which will drop their disguise unless they are Mafia.
The other Spy can then investigate them and will be able to tell if their disguise dropped or not.

yeah you're town

I think I'm gonna [VOTE: Seanzie] aubergine. I don't really remember him outside the color claiming thing that I didn't like

Sabie is just w/e, don't think it hits vibe tell

would not vote Gav just for the sheer involvement he has in the game rn

sig exists, the two game I played with him he seemed like a easy misyeet

sabie12 wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 3:04 pm Okay so I guess voting marmot when others also voted marmot makes me scum. I'm trying to figure things out as best I can. I thought his post was sketchy and could be from a disinterested mafia and EOD still was a bit away when I put my vote there. I take awhile to process things sometimes so my responses and analysis isn't as quick as others. I guess I'm just a bit out of practice.
I'm in agreement that a gavial flip gives us more info than a marmot one and his deflections and weird theories make sense as mafia so moving my vote there.

[VOTE: gavial] aubergine

This is somehow worse

Dolby wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:25 pm I think I'm gonna [VOTE: Seanzie] aubergine. I don't really remember him outside the color claiming thing that I didn't like

Why not compromise with a vote that can affect the game instead of that one that will lead nowhere Dolby?

I think we got 30ish until votes are locked.
I think the other people aside from Sabie I'm fine with are Gav or Sig.

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 3:55 pm

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 3:54 pm

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 3:52 pm Well Spies can check each other.
We just have Wiggly vote one of the spies which will drop their disguise unless they are Mafia.
The other Spy can then investigate them and will be able to tell if their disguise dropped or not.

Can this plan be Roleblocker or messed with by mafia?

Spy check is a day ability so I can't think of a way it would be possible to do so.
As long as a Pyro votes a Spy the Spy looses their disguise unless they are Mafia.
If one Spy investigates the other while the Pyro votes them then they should be revealed as their disguise.

It’s a waste of spy actions IMO and any wolf can disrupt

Guillotine wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:27 pm

Dolby wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:25 pm I think I'm gonna [VOTE: Seanzie] aubergine. I don't really remember him outside the color claiming thing that I didn't like

Why not compromise with a vote that can affect the game instead of that one that will lead nowhere Dolby?

if this is trying to get me to vote gav, nah

if sig, sell me

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 3:49 pm @TonyStarkPrime or @LinearPoint or anyone who's good at mech. Did we get any closer to having roles who can be confirmed?

I think the Spy plan just is too hard but I still think we can confirm one engineer if one engineer claims

I could vote sabie sig or maybe nanook

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:29 pm

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 3:55 pm

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 3:54 pm

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 3:52 pm Well Spies can check each other.
We just have Wiggly vote one of the spies which will drop their disguise unless they are Mafia.
The other Spy can then investigate them and will be able to tell if their disguise dropped or not.

Can this plan be Roleblocker or messed with by mafia?

Spy check is a day ability so I can't think of a way it would be possible to do so.
As long as a Pyro votes a Spy the Spy looses their disguise unless they are Mafia.
If one Spy investigates the other while the Pyro votes them then they should be revealed as their disguise.

It’s a waste of spy actions IMO and any wolf can disrupt

Why do say this?

I thought wolves had duplicates of town roles but not certainty of which they are?
I need to read the entire set up again today that i have time.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:31 pm I could vote sabie sig or maybe nanook

Sabie not fighting their chop and going silent is probably scum avoiding spew now.

Actually Engineer doesn't need to out themselves in order to confirm if the Engie is Town or Mafia.
Though obviously a bit more useful if we out the Endies and it's confirmed Mafia.

Basically the Engineer's night action is publicly announced each day.
Optimally we have both build Sentries N1 and reveal who they are D2. N2 we have one player RB both. If either has a building still standing they are confirmed Mafia.

Guillotine wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:33 pm

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:31 pm I could vote sabie sig or maybe nanook

Sabie not fighting their chop and going silent is probably scum avoiding spew now.

Is there any indication they are aware of their wagon?

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:36 pm

Guillotine wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:33 pm

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:31 pm I could vote sabie sig or maybe nanook

Sabie not fighting their chop and going silent is probably scum avoiding spew now.

Is there any indication they are aware of their wagon?

Yes they commented before and then went poof. ISO them.

Soldiers can also watch both Engie's N2 so Mafia can't just kill them.
It also prevents a Mafia Pyro from interfeering by reflecting the Roleblock attempt and confirming they were Roleblocked in the first place.

[VOTE: Guillo] aubergine


Feel opportunistic on Sabie

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:34 pm Actually Engineer doesn't need to out themselves in order to confirm if the Engie is Town or Mafia.
Though obviously a bit more useful if we out the Endies and it's confirmed Mafia.

Basically the Engineer's night action is publicly announced each day.
Optimally we have both build Sentries N1 and reveal who they are D2. N2 we have one player RB both. If either has a building still standing they are confirmed Mafia.

given both the combination of roleblockers and watchers, and numbers of both (6 and 2) in this game, I'd be concerned about this giving false positives or negatives

oh wait I get what you're saying now re: mafia engy having a buff

Guillotine wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:37 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:36 pm

Guillotine wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:33 pm

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:31 pm I could vote sabie sig or maybe nanook

Sabie not fighting their chop and going silent is probably scum avoiding spew now.

Is there any indication they are aware of their wagon?

Yes they commented before and then went poof. ISO them.

Can you show me where they commented on their wagon?


I do see them mentioning trying to be here for EOD, which would indicate they wouldn't be around for awhile.

Watchers should be enough to deter Mafia from trying to use a Pyro airblast to create a False Mafia confirm.
And if Mafia does try to double roleblock one of their own to manually destroy the building the Waters should pick that up and we heavily push the roleblocker who was not supposed to be there.

@sabie12 December 28th at 6pm we're playing video mafia, you should come if you can, maybe you'll actually survive a game day lol

Of course issues arise should some roles not make it to day 2.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:38 pm [VOTE: Guillo] aubergine


Feel opportunistic on Sabie

Yes, im making sure to take advantage of the opportunity to lynch scum, if that is what you mean with being opportunistic.

Do you townread Sabie then?

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:42 pm Watchers should be enough to deter Mafia from trying to use a Pyro airblast to create a False Mafia confirm.
And if Mafia does try to double roleblock one of their own to manually destroy the building the Waters should pick that up and we heavily push the roleblocker who was not supposed to be there.

It's the very post they voted for Gavial, at that time they already had 6 votes on them, SABIE DEFINITELY KNOWS THAT THEY ARE MAIN WAGON

Guillotine wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:44 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:38 pm [VOTE: Guillo] aubergine


Feel opportunistic on Sabie

Yes, im making sure to take advantage of the opportunity to lynch scum, if that is what you mean with being opportunistic.

Do you townread Sabie then?

I don't see a reason for 7 votes on them currently, which makes me think there's a wolf push on the slot.


My read off their ISO is null, I don't feel strongly either way. It doesn't read scummy enough for 7 votes, so by that virtue I'm town leaning them.

This plan should work I think.

N1 - Both Engies build Sentries because duh those are the best
D2 - Both Endies reveal who they are. Soldiers optionally can reveal, but I prefer not to have them do that. Pyros can protect Soldiers if they do.
N2 - Red Solider watch Red Engie, Blue Soldier watch Blue Engie. Red Demo roleblock Red Engie, Blue Demo roleblock Blue Engie. NO OTHER PLAYERS VISIT ENGIES. Lynch anyone visiting who shouldn't be visiting.
D2 - If an Engie still has a building and the Soldier confirms only the Demoman visited them lynch them.

Backup plans.
1 Engie dies before D2...
Run the plan with just that Engie. Have both soldiers watch the Engie in this scenario to confirm neither is lying about visits. Only send one Demoman, chose which color beforehand. Preferably just the Engie's color to make things easier.

If a Demoman is dead before N2...
Use Scout as a stand in for Demoman. Always send same color to same color to keep things simple and trackable.
If Blue Demo dies, Blue Scout takes his spot. If Red Demo dies, Red Scout take his spot.
If Blue Demo dies, Red Scout DO NOT ROLEBLOCK, same for if Red Demo dies for Blue Scount.

Yeah sounds right

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:50 pm This plan should work I think.

N1 - Both Engies build Sentries because duh those are the best
D2 - Both Endies reveal who they are. Soldiers optionally can reveal, but I prefer not to have them do that. Pyros can protect Soldiers if they do.
N2 - Red Solider watch Red Engie, Blue Soldier watch Blue Engie. Red Demo roleblock Red Engie, Blue Demo roleblock Blue Engie. NO OTHER PLAYERS VISIT ENGIES. Lynch anyone visiting who shouldn't be visiting.
D2 - If an Engie still has a building and the Soldier confirms only the Demoman visited them lynch them.

Backup plans.
1 Engie dies before D2...
Run the plan with just that Engie. Have both soldiers watch the Engie in this scenario to confirm neither is lying about visits. Only send one Demoman, chose which color beforehand. Preferably just the Engie's color to make things easier.

If a Demoman is dead before N2...
Use Scout as a stand in for Demoman. Always send same color to same color to keep things simple and trackable.
If Blue Demo dies, Blue Scout takes his spot. If Red Demo dies, Red Scout take his spot.
If Blue Demo dies, Red Scout DO NOT ROLEBLOCK, same for if Red Demo dies for Blue Scount.

A few other notes.
On the off chance Mafia tries to use Pyro reflect to create a false Mafia positive for an Engie...
The Soldier watching will fail to see the Demoman visiting. If they don't see the Demoman visiting then this is a clear sign a Pyro messed with the result and the Engineer shouldn't be lynched in this scenario.
Find and kill the Pyro who airblased the Soldier and Demoman. Obviously we know one is Wiggly.