The Syndicate

Golden wrote:

Elohcin wrote:I'm going to vote before I forget. I'm trusting the people...Dyslexicon.

I think the more appropriate reaction is

Man, this vote minimum thing, and the time we have left. I feel somewhat confident voting sig, but not as confident as voting Long Con.

Golden wrote:I have to say, for me the most bothersome thing about remaining on sig is that Jay is also on it.

Jay isn't returning today, though, he made that clear.

Do you suspect him? I've been focusing on other players; I thought you guys were just in disagreement on certain things.

Strawhenge wrote:Man, this vote minimum thing, and the time we have left. I feel somewhat confident voting sig, but not as confident as voting Long Con.

It provides pressure, makes it so no one gets lynched with a small amount of town voting for them

Yeah, I actually really like it, I probably will steal it if I mod another game.

Strawhenge wrote:Man, this vote minimum thing, and the time we have left. I feel somewhat confident voting sig, but not as confident as voting Long Con.

At this point, this feels much safer than, say, switching it up to Eloh. I'd consider other options but a CFD with this soft lynch concept in play seems unhelpful. In some ways it doesn't feel much different to unchangeable votes.

linki @Straw - no, I suspect him, for sure. It's not urgent right now but it's worth a look back to understand why when you get time. It would be useful to get the perspective of someone else who has a lot of play with Jay, especially since he's so rarely bad on the Syndicate.

Fredwood wrote:Well I thought I was posting content and trying to be "helpful" and giving reads and pointing out posts that I did not like, but I guess they weren't or people are only going to take one post as the entire context for my participation as the basis for their argument so Fuck it. Not really sure what to say, if it isn't good enough, oh well was trying my best.

But yeah, I suck at mafia so it's all good.

This seems oddly defeatist. You aren't even that suspected. Do you expect to go through a game without anyone suspecting you?

Fredwood wrote:Well either I'm not posting content or I am. Not really sure how to defend myself if I'm being accused of both with the later being used as as proof of a deviation of my meta.

You want to say I read scum and not helping fine, but I'm also being accused of trying to fit in and adapt to the playstyle here as proof of my scum...it's all very convenient.

So what does this say about the alignments of the people suspecting you or defending you?

sprityo wrote:

Strawhenge wrote:Man, this vote minimum thing, and the time we have left. I feel somewhat confident voting sig, but not as confident as voting Long Con.

It provides pressure, makes it so no one gets lynched with a small amount of town voting for them

Oh, don't get me wrong, it's a great idea! I'm just not used to it, and am feeling the effect of the pressure, that's all. No worries!

Golden wrote:linki @Straw - no, I suspect him, for sure. It's not urgent right now but it's worth a look back to understand why when you get time. It would be useful to get the perspective of someone else who has a lot of play with Jay, especially since he's so rarely bad on the Syndicate.

He was rarely bad on RYM as well. It's weird, it's like the universe knows to put one of its top scum hunters on town.

In the process of catching up. Not loving either Wilgy or Sig lynch tbh, as they're such low posters that if the flip town it's pretty meh. Would vote Sig over Wilgy, cause the passive-aggressiveness of Wilgy's defense could be town and he has even lower post count and no content.

That vote from Eloh though. WTF. Is this kind of thing normal from her?
If Sig is lynched and flips mafia then Eloh will be highly suspect since she suddenly cares to jump on my wagon.

Ok, I'm liking that we're finally getting enough votes on one person, and one that I suspect.

unvote: wilgy
Vote: sig

I'm voting Fredwood.

Not sure so much about the vote, but not being fully caught up on a thread like this is normal for eloh. My issue is that she must have read enough of the thread to know who was in the lead (since there's no poll) and so she must have known the vote was close - saying you are 'following the people' when it's that close...

I want to see more of Dys, and I can't justify leaving it there because of gut.

Would really like opinions on JJJ's glaring contradiction. The posts he pulled up on Sig and said he had a problem with - those are the exact same posts that when it happened in thread in realtime he commented "I feel okay about Sig". What changed?

Ok, I could see someone read it in a different way when looking back after Sig hasn't posted at all. But there were very specific things JJJ had a problem with. So the result is the initial comment that he felt okay about Sig reads phony.

Dyslexicon wrote:Would really like opinions on JJJ's glaring contradiction. The posts he pulled up on Sig and said he had a problem with - those are the exact same posts that when it happened in thread in realtime he commented "I feel okay about Sig". What changed?

Ok, I could see someone read it in a different way when looking back after Sig hasn't posted at all. But there were very specific things JJJ had a problem with. So the result is the initial comment that he felt okay about Sig reads phony.

Can you pull said posts up?

Dyslexicon wrote:In the process of catching up. Not loving either Wilgy or Sig lynch tbh, as they're such low posters that if the flip town it's pretty meh.

What do you mean by this? We usually consider it a relatively good thing that if someone must flip civ they're a low poster so it's less of a loss to the cause. I guess it means we learn less about other players maybe, but I don't really get what you mean by "if they flip town it's pretty meh." And do you think they will? If so why?

Interesting point about jay though. I don't think he'll be here to respond until d2, but it's sketchy and could be a teammate tell since he made that post after I and some others already started going after a sig lynch. Idk his vote might be too risky in that case but I could see it.

Linki @quin he just did before that post, read up a lil

From the sign up thread.

Quin wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:I'm still waiting for the day where you draw a scum role.

I've seen it twice I suppose. Once you were a sock and acted like S~V~S instead, the person you were playing as. The second was the last game on RYM where literally every player was mafia.

So yeah, just waiting on a game where you're a normal mafia player.

Transistor was the only recent example of a real, jan-yoo-wine, scum JJJ.

You'll be bad this time. I can feel it in my body.

Golden wrote:Colour me surprised to see Dizzy is still in the lead for votes. I admit my opinions are not the be all and end all, but I just don't really get it.

Iknowriiight.

Quin wrote:Can you pull said posts up?

I just did it on this page:

nutella helped me find them. It's something he needs to answer to fo' sho'.

@Quin - Bah. Quote got fucked up. But it's on this page, further up.

TICK

VOTALS:


sig (7): Golden, JJJ, Speedchuck, JackofHearts,Nachomamma,Strawhenge, nutella
Dyslexicon (3): Long con, MetalMarsh89, Eloh
Fredwood (3): DrWilgy, Soneji, Quin
DrWilgy (1): Scotty
MM (1): Dyslexicon
Golden (1): Sig


With 21 Alive, it takes 11 to Lynch, and 6 to soft lynch. Day 1 will end on 14th February, 2017 at 10pm EST, or in approx. 2 hours.

I thought the day ended later. I'm back though.

Quin wrote:I want to see more of Dys, and I can't justify leaving it there because of gut.

But it's ok to lynch me in my first game...I'm confused as to wanting to lynch Dys so aggressively but now wanting to see more of them, and then voting for another person you haven't seen before.

You still haven't given any reason for a read, or your "gut" feeling, as amorphous as that terminology is, so there really isn't much chance for one to respond. Really, it all originated from an aside I made publicly stating my tempered reservations of your playstyle. Which I have explained twice, once to you specifically and once as a clarification to someone else that the concern was from general experience from being mislead before and not a statement about you specifically, and yet you still haven't made a rebuttal to further the discussion.

So either you're not paying attention and still taking a confrontational approach or you are now playing the "My gut" card just trying to sway the vote in the 11th hour to an unlikely lynch target. Feels a bit like CYA after pushing so hard on DYS, and now that it has soured and people are starting to get annoyed at people who are still voting for Dys, you're scrambling to get off the train you started.

nutella wrote:

Dyslexicon wrote:In the process of catching up. Not loving either Wilgy or Sig lynch tbh, as they're such low posters that if the flip town it's pretty meh.

What do you mean by this? We usually consider it a relatively good thing that if someone must flip civ they're a low poster so it's less of a loss to the cause. I guess it means we learn less about other players maybe, but I don't really get what you mean by "if they flip town it's pretty meh." And do you think they will? If so why?

Interesting point about jay though. I don't think he'll be here to respond until d2, but it's sketchy and could be a teammate tell since he made that post after I and some others already started going after a sig lynch. Idk his vote might be too risky in that case but I could see it.

Linki @quin he just did before that post, read up a lil

Again, difference in game philosophy, I guess. There's less information to go off of if they flip town as they've had few interactions. I mean, that shouldn't exclude them from the lynch pool, it's just less to go off of if we lynch a lurker and they flip town (actually, even if they flip scum, but then at least the wagon can be telling). However, Sig and Wilgy just dropping the ball is not amusing me.

If Sig is scum that is certainly possible. I also remember JJJ having Eloh as a slight suspicion in his read list, and I remember it being a bit weird since Eloh had barely posted anything, much like Dfray (or whatever his name is), but the latter was a full null read. Why give a read to Eloh? With Eloh's sudden pop in to vote me I could see a world of Sig, JJJ and Eloh.

Probably ambitious with a world building already, but that's where my mind is going.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I thought the day ended later. I'm back though.

Do you mean earlier?

Dyslexicon wrote:And this is giving me serious problems.
This is what you said immediately after the exchange you're bringing in here:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I feel okay about sig.

So why is this exchange giving you problems now? What changed? Iirc Sig hasn't posted after this. Explain.

I changed my mind. sig does well to play the game loosely, and my initial take was to appreciate that he looked the part. What he also does though is contribute to the effort, often making reads against the grain with no concern for appearances. A lot of time has passed since that initial take and I am not inclined to feel like I did before. Reassessment yields different perspectives.

Golden wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I thought the day ended later. I'm back though.

Do you mean earlier?

Yeah, derp. I thought it ended around 7 EST. I think I was confusing it with the NF game I was in.

Dyslexicon wrote:

nutella wrote:

Dyslexicon wrote:In the process of catching up. Not loving either Wilgy or Sig lynch tbh, as they're such low posters that if the flip town it's pretty meh.

What do you mean by this? We usually consider it a relatively good thing that if someone must flip civ they're a low poster so it's less of a loss to the cause. I guess it means we learn less about other players maybe, but I don't really get what you mean by "if they flip town it's pretty meh." And do you think they will? If so why?

Interesting point about jay though. I don't think he'll be here to respond until d2, but it's sketchy and could be a teammate tell since he made that post after I and some others already started going after a sig lynch. Idk his vote might be too risky in that case but I could see it.

Linki @quin he just did before that post, read up a lil

Again, difference in game philosophy, I guess. There's less information to go off of if they flip town as they've had few interactions. I mean, that shouldn't exclude them from the lynch pool, it's just less to go off of if we lynch a lurker and they flip town (actually, even if they flip scum, but then at least the wagon can be telling). However, Sig and Wilgy just dropping the ball is not amusing me.

If Sig is scum that is certainly possible. I also remember JJJ having Eloh as a slight suspicion in his read list, and I remember it being a bit weird since Eloh had barely posted anything, much like Dfray (or whatever his name is), but the latter was a full null read. Why give a read to Eloh? With Eloh's sudden pop in to vote me I could see a world of Sig, JJJ and Eloh.

Probably ambitious with a world building already, but that's where my mind is going.

I have a pretty good history with reading Elohcin both ways. I can't say the same about DFaraday. DFaraday is also a very common low poster, Elohcin not so much. She low posts sometimes and is active sometimes, and I think her mafia-aligned games trend more in the direction of the former.

Moving Dys up my rainbow list. Straw moving up as well.

Jimmy, Long Con moving down.

Hate the Sorsha replacement. Not the mod's fault but it's like a get out of jail free card for a lazy scummer. (Or maybe not, as Spi will confirm.)

Id be suspicious of Fred's last post if I didn't know Fred. But I do so I'm not really.

Dyslexicon wrote:

Fredwood wrote:Well I thought I was posting content and trying to be "helpful" and giving reads and pointing out posts that I did not like, but I guess they weren't or people are only going to take one post as the entire context for my participation as the basis for their argument so Fuck it. Not really sure what to say, if it isn't good enough, oh well was trying my best.

But yeah, I suck at mafia so it's all good.

This seems oddly defeatist. You aren't even that suspected. Do you expect to go through a game without anyone suspecting you?

Fredwood wrote:Well either I'm not posting content or I am. Not really sure how to defend myself if I'm being accused of both with the later being used as as proof of a deviation of my meta.

You want to say I read scum and not helping fine, but I'm also being accused of trying to fit in and adapt to the playstyle here as proof of my scum...it's all very convenient.

So what does this say about the alignments of the people suspecting you or defending you?

It wasn't defeatist, and I went into a few posts later about my reads. I was basically saying if what I'm doing isn't contributing I don't know what else to do because people were either accusing me either not contributing or trying too hard to blend in with the way games are played here, which are two completely different accusations so wasn't exactly sure how to address it. Then people did ISO's and appeared to be appeased.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I have a pretty good history with reading Elohcin both ways. I can't say the same about DFaraday. DFaraday is also a very common low poster, Elohcin not so much. She low posts sometimes and is active sometimes, and I think her mafia-aligned games trend more in the direction of the former.

Any reason to not CFD Eloh here?

Still want Nacho to answer me on Sonjei but it can wait til tomorrow if need be.

Dyslexicon wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I have a pretty good history with reading Elohcin both ways. I can't say the same about DFaraday. DFaraday is also a very common low poster, Elohcin not so much. She low posts sometimes and is active sometimes, and I think her mafia-aligned games trend more in the direction of the former.

Any reason to not CFD Eloh here?

Civil Frontier Department?

I looked it up and I think it means Chinese Fire Drill, trying to get everyone to bandwagon onto someone at the last minute.

@Speed, I want you to explain your read on me. You're tip-toeing around it. You comment a lot on logic, strategy and meta discussions, but you don't give very much in terms of reads. You've stated several times that I'm null-ish to you and that I'm nok exactly looking good and that it's understanable that players want to lynch me etc. But at the same time you're arguing against what these players are saying. So in your own words, what is your read on me and why?

I'm very suspicious of you.

Dyslexicon wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I have a pretty good history with reading Elohcin both ways. I can't say the same about DFaraday. DFaraday is also a very common low poster, Elohcin not so much. She low posts sometimes and is active sometimes, and I think her mafia-aligned games trend more in the direction of the former.

Any reason to not CFD Eloh here?

I'd call her lynchable. I don't really know what to do with her recent vote for you. There's potential for opportunism and potential for "whatever I'm not reading all this shit". Either way it's not a great vote, since I think you're actually one of the stronger town reads in the game at this point.

Fredwood wrote:

Quin wrote:I want to see more of Dys, and I can't justify leaving it there because of gut.

But it's ok to lynch me in my first game...I'm confused as to wanting to lynch Dys so aggressively but now wanting to see more of them, and then voting for another person you haven't seen before.

You still haven't given any reason for a read, or your "gut" feeling, as amorphous as that terminology is, so there really isn't much chance for one to respond. Really, it all originated from an aside I made publicly stating my tempered reservations of your playstyle. Which I have explained twice, once to you specifically and once as a clarification to someone else that the concern was from general experience from being mislead before and not a statement about you specifically, and yet you still haven't made a rebuttal to further the discussion.

So either you're not paying attention and still taking a confrontational approach or you are now playing the "My gut" card just trying to sway the vote in the 11th hour to an unlikely lynch target. Feels a bit like CYA after pushing so hard on DYS, and now that it has soured and people are starting to get annoyed at people who are still voting for Dys, you're scrambling to get off the train you started.

Don't use 'it's my first game here' as a crutch. It's poor sportsmanship.

I'm busy. I can't update my reads, read back through the thread and keep up as I'd like. So my suspicion of you might be outdated or rebutted, but it's not going anywhere for as long as I'm doing my own thing. Sorry.

Quin wrote:

Fredwood wrote:

Quin wrote:I want to see more of Dys, and I can't justify leaving it there because of gut.

But it's ok to lynch me in my first game...I'm confused as to wanting to lynch Dys so aggressively but now wanting to see more of them, and then voting for another person you haven't seen before.

You still haven't given any reason for a read, or your "gut" feeling, as amorphous as that terminology is, so there really isn't much chance for one to respond. Really, it all originated from an aside I made publicly stating my tempered reservations of your playstyle. Which I have explained twice, once to you specifically and once as a clarification to someone else that the concern was from general experience from being mislead before and not a statement about you specifically, and yet you still haven't made a rebuttal to further the discussion.

So either you're not paying attention and still taking a confrontational approach or you are now playing the "My gut" card just trying to sway the vote in the 11th hour to an unlikely lynch target. Feels a bit like CYA after pushing so hard on DYS, and now that it has soured and people are starting to get annoyed at people who are still voting for Dys, you're scrambling to get off the train you started.

Don't use 'it's my first game here' as a crutch. It's poor sportsmanship.

I'm busy. I can't update my reads, read back through the thread and keep up as I'd like. So my suspicion of you might be outdated or rebutted, but it's not going anywhere for as long as I'm doing my own thing. Sorry.

Now you're just pissing me off...I fucking didn't use it as a crutch... In your own explanation for switching off Dys you said you were switching off because you want to see more of her to make a judgment and couldn't justify it with just a gut feeling, then switched to someone who you have just as little experience with and only have expressed a fucking gut feeling.

I'm not fucking playing it's my first time here card, I'm saying your logic makes no sense because you switch from a new player to a new fucking player. It's an inconsistency in your own logic that I am pointing out to you and now you're attacking my gamesmanship. I'm typically laid back, but the accusation rankles me, so apologies to everyone that I'm getting testy.

Fuck. Was writing a read list post and then accidentally x-ed out of the tab lol.

Dyslexicon wrote:Fuck. Was writing a read list post and then accidentally x-ed out of the tab lol.

Right click on the "new tab" button. You might be able to retrieve it with "reopen closed tab". That's Chrome at least. Keep trying until you find it, if you can. Props to LC teaching me this in some game a while back.

@Fred - I think Quin meant "want to see more" from me, not as in "want to see more because I've never played with this player", but as in "want to see more because I'm not as suspicious anymore/uncertain". It doesn't have to do with us being unfamiliar, it's how he reads the game.

Quin wrote:I want to see more of Dys, and I can't justify leaving it there because of gut.

Apparently their gut is still pinging you, so I don't think that's what was meant. There hasn't been any indication that he views you as more "town"

Let's try to keep our cooler heads on, gang. One side effect of an active and aggressive Day 1 is frustration and anger; I know it well. It's just a game though.

Again I do apologize for blowing up, but felt the accusation strayed too personal. If that isn't the intention and misunderstood the statement, I feel even more foolish then I do currently.

Fredwood wrote:Again I do apologize for blowing up, but felt the accusation strayed too personal. If that isn't the intention and misunderstood the statement, I feel even more foolish then I do currently.

Maybe I've misunderstood you, and I think it's because you misunderstood me. Dys is correct in her assumption. I want to see more of her because I'm uncertain about her and a gut bad read isn't enough for me to leave a vote there. It's got nothing to do with being a new player.

Show of good faith. Unvote.

Does anyone out there have a reason to oppose one of the following lynches:

sig
Elohcin
Sorsha/replacement
DrWilgy