The Syndicate

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:50 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:49 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:46 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:42 pm You guys are making a mistake voting for me. I might not be right about speed or about lap for that matter but at least I am not holding back on stating an unpopular opinion. Why does that look bad?

You're, like, the only suspicious player that's actually around, except for Vompatti and nobody thinks anything about Vomp for some reason.

Would you rather lynch Long Con or Vompatti, if given the options?

Long con

Why?

Luna had good reasons. Mostly he's not contributing much at all other than the Ramses reactions.

Fractal wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:04 pm @Turnip Head Why do you like lapluie?

idk she just feels real to me

Fractal wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:12 pm

Fractal wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:02 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 2:11 pm Back from lunch.

Lots of tasty giblets being posted.

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 1:51 pm Ugh I have the worst headache in the world today and am barely functional at work so I apologize in advance if I don't get much hunting in today. I still have a bad feeling about speed, it feels like he is trying too hard. I also think Kyle is not looking good and would like to see more content from him.

I don't actually know whether this is genuine or not. My last two town games (and my last scum game) have been super undisciplined, so I could see where you are drawing that from.

And my problem with it not being 'genuine' is that, if you are scum, you chose me as someone to lead a train against. Am I really the easy mislynch scum looks for? (Granted, I was lynched first in a few of my games on this site, but still.)

I lean toward this line of suspicion being genuine. Colin was bothered by it too, and he's in my top town ranks.

Nutella's suspicion toward me is her one biggest towny redeeming factor. I want thoughts on this.

If Nutella is scum, i don't think she was trying to necessarily get you lynched by giving that read. She already gave a negative read of you yesterday, so it feels more like a continuation of that than an actual push to lynch.

From what I can see, her D1-read on you it was basically just a hunch, and today she's picked up the reasoning of Colin and sig, that you're "supertowning" as scum.

Or is there any sign of her thinking around these lines yesterday? I don't remember it in that case. I just don't see a clear progression, or that townie spark that often appear when someone is pushing a non-consensus read and feel like people aren't listening. Her reaction now is basically "I didn't even try to lynch him, stop misrepresenting me!". That's exactly my problem though. Her attitude is basically "would be cool if people scumread speedy with me, but that's not probably not gonna happen, that's ok". I'm used to people heating up and trying to convince people they're right, or at the very least to see their viewpoint on it. She's not doing that.

speedchuck

I get notified if you quote me, or if you mention me. No need to do both.

I'm trying to figure out whether nutella looks bad if I genuinely looked suspicious. Like, I don't want to lead a lynch on her if the only suspicion is that she doesn't agree on my super town-ness.

My bias has me struggling with this.

any specific posts T.H?

juliets wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:59 pm

Kylemii wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:57 pm

ColinIsCool wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:20 pmI hesitated with Kyle because I was too eager to give him town cred in UP and it was not good. He feels like he’s just dipping his toes in.

thats just who i am as a person. like ddl said I'm a trash man that crawls out of the trash can as the game moves forward

haha yes but in the last game you crawled out of the can as mafia and if I hadn't had a peak at c-bob and TH you probably would have won because none of us suspected you! You are dangerous (but I love you anyway).

lol yeah fair enough

[mention]Fractal[/mention] I would push my suspicion of speed more if I could back it up substantially. Since it's a gut based thing for reasons that are usually interpreted as town tells, I'm not really expecting to convince anyone

oh sorry, i didn't know quotes created mentions.

I don't think her suspicion on you is the biggest point against her. I just think her ISO lacks real indepth solving, apart from the posts about ramses. Which tells me she has potential to actively solve, which is why it's a little suprising to me there's so little elsewhere

has LC played actively as a civ in any recent games? he was walking around hitting things with sticks in upick and incredibly active in btsc.

actively as a civ and/or passively as mafia

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:25 pm @Fractal I would push my suspicion of speed more if I could back it up substantially. Since it's a gut based thing for reasons that are usually interpreted as town tells, I'm not really expecting to convince anyone

Okay. Are you referring to the try-hard point, or other gut-related feelings aswell?

Also, I've found that a big part about mafia is trying to put gut-feelings into words best one can. They're more meaningful than straight up logic-based arguments. So even if it sounds a bit silly, it can be really helpful to try to describe the reads. Not only to convince others but also to show people your thoughtprocess so it can be townread. Because tbh I can't really follow your process on him

Fractal wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:29 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:25 pm @Fractal I would push my suspicion of speed more if I could back it up substantially. Since it's a gut based thing for reasons that are usually interpreted as town tells, I'm not really expecting to convince anyone

Okay. Are you referring to the try-hard point, or other gut-related feelings aswell?

Also, I've found that a big part about mafia is trying to put gut-feelings into words best one can. They're more meaningful than straight up logic-based arguments. So even if it sounds a bit silly, it can be really helpful to try to describe the reads. Not only to convince others but also to show people your thoughtprocess so it can be townread. Because tbh I can't really follow your process on him

Well yeah it's the try hardy thing mostly. But there is more to it as a gut read, idk if I can point to any meta reason that backs it up since he provided examples of previous games that I guess illustrate meta in his own favor, but I still tend to think he is very good at looking town when bad. I might try to revisit MK where I was his teammate and see how I feel comparing that.

Also I am trying to hunt more today, what about when I talked about lap? Does that count? I don't think the accusation that Ramses is the only thing Ive tried to solve is fair.

I had a read of Juliets's 10 most recent posts that gave me a powerful gut scumread. I tried to go back and quantify/qualify it, and completely lost the gut feeling.
This means that either:
A. Juliets is a witch.
B. The smoothie I was drinking acted up on me.

Probably not going to happen today, but if anyone is caught up and looking for something to do, I'd love thoughts on D2 Juliets.

So nutella, in all of these posts talking about your speed read, it was because he was trying hard?

Options for nutella:

A. She is scum, has seen me get lynched early on for my eager mistakes in the past, and is having a go at it despite thread consensus.
B. She is town, doesn't know my alignment, and has mistaken my eagerness and energy for the confidence I have while scum.

I think B is more likely, at a base level. Yet, I don't like the way she has approached her suspicion of me, and it doesn't look good for that reason. So...
I'm back to where I started.

Fractal wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:37 pm

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:21 pm Let's lynch speedchuck who's with me

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:27 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:25 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:21 pm Let's lynch speedchuck who's with me

Me!

Knew I could count on you buddy

Let's just wait and see if I actually want to though. Kind of a whimsical impulse but who knows

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 6:08 pm I agree with DDL on the lap votes and I'm gonna [VOTE: dom] aubergine for now since there's at least somewhat of a case on him. I would vote for speed if anyone wanted to join me but it seems unlikely.

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:11 am

juliets wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:00 am

sig wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 6:08 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 6:08 pm I agree with DDL on the lap votes and I'm gonna [VOTE: dom] aubergine for now since there's at least somewhat of a case on him. I would vote for speed if anyone wanted to join me but it seems unlikely.

If you've already answered this sorry, but why Speed? He's a town lean for me.

nutella, when reading through your ISO I also wondered why speed. I don't see a post where you answered sig's question but maybe I missed it. If so would you direct me to it and if not, would you answer please?

I don't have a good answer. It's just a funky hunch

So nutella, in all of these posts talking about your speed read, it was because he was trying hard?

I think at the very beginning it wasn't, sometimes early game I throw out an impulse like that and see how it evolves.

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:35 pm Also I am trying to hunt more today, what about when I talked about lap? Does that count? I don't think the accusation that Ramses is the only thing Ive tried to solve is fair.

the main reason you ended up voting there was for the thing Speedy brought up, which isn't really your own analysis.

With that said, looking at it again, i kind of DO like how you were going to look for reasons to defend lap's meta, and ended up something pointing the other way, like you had a goal but ended up finding something else. Doesn't seem agenda-y

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:40 pm

Fractal wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:37 pm

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:21 pm Let's lynch speedchuck who's with me :smile:

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:27 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:25 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:21 pm Let's lynch speedchuck who's with me :smile:

Me!

Knew I could count on you buddy

Let's just wait and see if I actually want to though. Kind of a whimsical impulse but who knows

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 6:08 pm I agree with DDL on the lap votes and I'm gonna [VOTE: dom] aubergine for now since there's at least somewhat of a case on him. I would vote for speed if anyone wanted to join me but it seems unlikely.

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:11 am

juliets wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:00 am

sig wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 6:08 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 6:08 pm I agree with DDL on the lap votes and I'm gonna [VOTE: dom] aubergine for now since there's at least somewhat of a case on him. I would vote for speed if anyone wanted to join me but it seems unlikely.

If you've already answered this sorry, but why Speed? He's a town lean for me.

nutella, when reading through your ISO I also wondered why speed. I don't see a post where you answered sig's question but maybe I missed it. If so would you direct me to it and if not, would you answer please?

I don't have a good answer. It's just a funky hunch

So nutella, in all of these posts talking about your speed read, it was because he was trying hard?

I think at the very beginning it wasn't, sometimes early game I throw out an impulse like that and see how it evolves.

Wanna try to talk through the parts where it wasn't, even if it's not gonna be anything strong?

Which post started the gut-reaction etc. Hearing you talk about it might actually help me a lot

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:40 pm Options for nutella:

A. She is scum, has seen me get lynched early on for my eager mistakes in the past, and is having a go at it despite thread consensus.
B. She is town, doesn't know my alignment, and has mistaken my eagerness and energy for the confidence I have while scum.

I think B is more likely, at a base level. Yet, I don't like the way she has approached her suspicion of me, and it doesn't look good for that reason. So...
I'm back to where I started.

I definitely don't think of you as an easy lynch, lol. The only time I can think of that I really went after you (correct me if it happened other times though) was when we were scummates in MK. You're not someone I would target if I were scum and you town.

[mention]nutella[/mention] im sorry you're not feeling well, would you mind expanding on your suspicion of kylemii

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:40 pm Options for nutella:

A. She is scum, has seen me get lynched early on for my eager mistakes in the past, and is having a go at it despite thread consensus.
B. She is town, doesn't know my alignment, and has mistaken my eagerness and energy for the confidence I have while scum.

I think B is more likely, at a base level. Yet, I don't like the way she has approached her suspicion of me, and it doesn't look good for that reason. So...
I'm back to where I started.

Option C. She is scum, gives a fake scumread of you (not all stated scumreads from scum are intended to drive a mislynch necessarily) and decides to keep at it later on because Colin brought up the supertowning thing and she had already started.

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:44 pm I definitely don't think of you as an easy lynch, lol. The only time I can think of that I really went after you (correct me if it happened other times though) was when we were scummates in MK. You're not someone I would target if I were scum and you town.

IKR.

And then I survived to near endgame and you died and everyone thought you were town. And then I claimed? Trying to remember.

I'll have something game-relevant here in a minute.

It may just be because nutella isn't feeling well but her game here is nothing at all like her MK scumgame.

Can anyone briefly summarise nut vs LC for me.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:49 pm It may just be because nutella isn't feeling well but her game here is nothing at all like her MK scumgame.

expand?

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:51 pm Also nutella I got distracted and found your blog and !!! Parahumans! Pact!

We need to run a mafia game or keep up with Ward in a PM/topic or something!

omg yes I love worm and pact!!!! I'm like 2 arcs behind on ward ATM but it's good so far too. Haven't read twig at all.

Lunalee wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:27 am Long Con seems more excited about screaming at the music videos than posting real content, so I'm going to look at him for a second.

He shoots down sig's proposition on day 1, but come on, who didn't.
He missed the day one vote.
He ended up on DDL's list of screaming banshees, but I'm not convinced that means anything.
Put off replying to sig with what he thought about the day 1 lynch.
Continues to scream back at King Ramses
Asks speedchuck and Kylmii why they voted for him (on what I assume was the day one poll?).

Overall feel on Long Con: He seems lazy in this game, and not very helpful. I give him a read of probably scum.

Lunalee wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:11 pm From what I see of nutella's posts, she is very set on getting speed lynched. And speed is trying very hard in this game, which makes him a threat to town. I don't like that look on nutella. She also seems needlessly concerned with the King Ramses sock puppet account. At this point I don't see a reason to be concerned with a sock puppet account that posts random weird videos. And she's voting Lapluie, who I'm also looking at. So they are probably not team mates.

Lapluie looks like low-hanging fruit to me right now. She had a bit of a slow start, and appears to be struggling to keep up. I don't have reason to think she's not town, and I don't want to lynch her today, but I'll definitely be keeping my eye on her.

In fact, after looking at lapluie's posts, if just makes nutella seem that much more scummy for jumping from speed to lapluie. It's like she realized speed wasn't going down easy, so she found a easier target.

[mention]Golden[/mention]

Nutella hasn't been after me as hard as what Luna said, but these posts are basically the consensus? Feel free to chip in, guys.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:28 pm has LC played actively as a civ in any recent games? he was walking around hitting things with sticks in upick and incredibly active in btsc.

This is a good observation

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:53 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:51 pm Also nutella I got distracted and found your blog and !!! Parahumans! Pact!

We need to run a mafia game or keep up with Ward in a PM/topic or something!

omg yes I love worm and pact!!!! I'm like 2 arcs behind on ward ATM but it's good so far too. Haven't read twig at all.

I tried the first chapter of Twig and meh. It didn't hook me.

Ward is not as good as Worm or Pact yet but it's getting better, especially with the Damsel of Distress arc that just happened and the Rain arc that you're probably in the middle of.

Ahhhhh Worm is tied for my favorite work of fiction and is my second largest influence in my writing. I love it.

But I'll stop derailing the game. If you want to chat about it, we can PM or make a topic. Preferably a topic, in the OT boards.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:54 pm

Lunalee wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:27 am Long Con seems more excited about screaming at the music videos than posting real content, so I'm going to look at him for a second.

He shoots down sig's proposition on day 1, but come on, who didn't.
He missed the day one vote.
He ended up on DDL's list of screaming banshees, but I'm not convinced that means anything.
Put off replying to sig with what he thought about the day 1 lynch.
Continues to scream back at King Ramses
Asks speedchuck and Kylmii why they voted for him (on what I assume was the day one poll?).

Overall feel on Long Con: He seems lazy in this game, and not very helpful. I give him a read of probably scum.

Lunalee wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:11 pm From what I see of nutella's posts, she is very set on getting speed lynched. And speed is trying very hard in this game, which makes him a threat to town. I don't like that look on nutella. She also seems needlessly concerned with the King Ramses sock puppet account. At this point I don't see a reason to be concerned with a sock puppet account that posts random weird videos. And she's voting Lapluie, who I'm also looking at. So they are probably not team mates.

Lapluie looks like low-hanging fruit to me right now. She had a bit of a slow start, and appears to be struggling to keep up. I don't have reason to think she's not town, and I don't want to lynch her today, but I'll definitely be keeping my eye on her.

In fact, after looking at lapluie's posts, if just makes nutella seem that much more scummy for jumping from speed to lapluie. It's like she realized speed wasn't going down easy, so she found a easier target.

@Golden

Nutella hasn't been after me as hard as what Luna said, but these posts are basically the consensus? Feel free to chip in, guys.

nutella: The only thing i've seen nutella put genuine effort into this game is the ramses theory stuff. That's worrying to me because of my earlier point on ramses hunting, and that scum feel more comfortable hunting for ramses than scum because they don't already know who ramses is so they can genuinely hunt.
Like, i went through her ISO looking for reads apart from the ramses stuff she's contributed. There's the speedchuck thing which i already had problems with yesterday, and then there's the "Kyle maybe looking good for not breaking the tie, but maybe it's also TMI" post. I think there's a pretty good chance Nutella is scum here.

[mention]Golden[/mention]

here's my earlier thoughts on nutella to add onto Speed's recap. She's done some stuff since then

whoops, quote-fail

The ISOs of Nutella and LC aren't so long if you want to skim them

have i been blocked

no one is responding to my posts

[mention]speedchuck[/mention] can you expand on the differences between nut's play here and her play in fire emblem

or whatever the game it was you mentioned

Gonna try to be around at EOD but no promises.

In response to Luke’s question - he was decently active in Ancient Greece but so obtuse in syndicate mafia that I incorrectly lead a lynch on him.

What I look for in town LC is usually evidence of sincerity in something that would otherwise seem out there.

I might try to iso them both. Have there been any other candidates raised that just don’t currently have votes?

Kyle. Not fucking Luke, phone.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:59 pm have i been blocked

no one is responding to my posts

Look for people responding to Luke.

I love Luna’s huntiness.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:00 pm @speedchuck can you expand on the differences between nut's play here and her play in fire emblem

Nut here is hesitant. She isn't giving out a whole lot of reads, and the reads that she is giving out she is having trouble articulating and stuff because they are gut.

In MK, she didn't do this. Why? Because scum don't have gut reads. They look for reasons to condemn, instead of trying to figure things out. Fractal/Colin (I forget which) had a point on Nutella where Nut was looking at Lapluie, seeing if there was reason to support a vote, and ended up going against agenda.

Combines with her motives in going after me...

I'm not saying nutella is town, but there are enough marks against it to where I don't really want her gone today.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:28 pm actively as a civ and/or passively as mafia

Kyle, I don't remember him being really active at the beginning of U-Pick where he was bad. Maybe I should go back and take a look.

Anyone knows if lapluie getting stuck in scumreading the people voting/suspecting her is in her scummeta or townmeta? Because that's the only suspicions she was throwing out there at EoD yesterday

And, having read the summary, I can see the reasons for both, but now I’ll have to read heir posts and see if I get the same impressions.

I apologise that my vote is probably ill informed today. Also, unfortunately, my father has been taken into hospital this morning so I don’t know what that might mean for my participation.

All right, I gotta go soon for Appointment #5343256 today (actually it's #4, but still that's a lot for one day), but I have caught up enough to give a vote.

[mention]ColinIsCool[/mention], thanks for answering my question. Makes sense. I like gathering reads and reactions.

I see a linki for Golden - from what I see between the two, it's Luna's (I hope I'm right - I'm just typing from memory rather than going back meticulously through the thread) breakdown of LC's behavior. Missing the vote, contributing fluff, etc. I considered him, as well as lapluie again, for a vote, for being mostly absent and fluffy (awwww), especially lap - she disappeared after suspicion died pretty quick, but I also see others saying this is "normal" for her. I know LC's a busy dude, and the last couple of games I've played with him, he's been like this, IIRC. Mixed alignments, IIRCA (the A is for Again). But I don't like letting possible baddies lie low for long, busyness or "playstyle" or not.

I'm most pinged today, however, by nutella, especially in regards to suspicion of speedchuck. I get it - you're looking at his previous games as a baddie and playing at Supatown. But I found myself asking the same question as someone else (sorry, don't remember who, even though I think it's even on this page): since when did apathy indicate civvieness? I know I've been burned a few times by super active people fooling me into thinking they're good because of their activity, but I feel like I've been fooled more often by those lying close to the surface (literally and figuratively, different verbs).

Yes, my vote is slightly contradicting what I've just said about low-lying players (hell, even as I'm writing it, I'm second-guessing the crap out of myself, as this tie is more favorable than yesterday's IMO), but I'm going with nutella since I feel the stronger ping the more I read her.

(Do y'all want an aubergine with that? They're pretty all right, but I prefer squash in the summer.)

Good god the linki (yes I'm going to comment on it every time it happens)

Golden wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:03 pm I love Luna’s huntiness.

Sorry to hear about your father, Golden. Send our best wishes his way!

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:11 pm

Golden wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:03 pm I love Luna’s huntiness.

:srsnod:

Sorry to hear about your father, Golden. Send our best wishes his way!

Agreed to both

Fractal wrote: ↑Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:09 pm Anyone knows if lapluie getting stuck in scumreading the people voting/suspecting her is in her scummeta or townmeta? Because that's the only suspicions she was throwing out there at EoD yesterday

I’ve played several games with her now and she’s still a bigger mystery to me than vompatti.