The Syndicate

S~V~S wrote:The thing that bothered me most in the after life, and during the body of the show,

Spoiler: show

actually, was Sayid & Shannon.

He had this deep intense backstory about Nadia, the love of his life. The woman he risked it all for, and whose loss drove him into a spiral of despair. The fact that he hooked up with Shannon just seemed WRONG for him when it happened, but the fact that she was his eternal true love was such a huge *W*T*F* for me. Out of all the bitter awfulness of that ending, that irked me the most. He had his eternal, deep forged-in-fire true love, and he's spending eternity with a vapid beach bunny?

A big thing for me was

The mastery of Lost was the character development, interaction, and backstories, and, yes, the sense of mystery is excellent throughout. Unfortunately, I don't think the writers knew how to resolve the web they had woven (perhaps its true they never meant to, but I don't believe that- I think any writer worth his salt would rather seek resolution rather than choose to jump the shark smoke monster). Excellent show with a bullshit final season.

Golden wrote:I do declare that svs has an unassailable lead in the mvp vote.

Well chosen, she would have been my pick too.

Fuckin' A.

Thanks for the diversion, Golden. I had fun with my role and being a complete shit at the game.

I could've saved myself a lot of time and effort if I had just said, "Okie Dokie S~V~S."

Typhoony wrote:Why was there no kill last night?

I assumed it was to avoid a potential endgame coin flip.

I should know by now that if I'm not killed by Night 3, I'm not doing it right.

Well, I don't normally participate in the MVP business, but I have to make an exception for this one.

Golden wrote:Thank you to all players for being a great lineup. I hope to see you all in Season 2.

Ps... Floyd didn't check Matt.

lol

S~V~S wrote:If I am wrong I will be amazed.

Same here if you're right.

DrWilgy wrote:While my history is murky Epi, are there any inconsistencies that you can point out or have questions about?

I wasn't looking for inconsistencies necessarily. My purpose in my little exercise was to look at the interactions among Tuft-Head, Scooter, and the remaining people. Of everybody, your interactions look the worst.

Mr. Wiggler.

Scotty wrote:Also, I'm not voting for Wilgy today because of what happened last time.
Day 2 is fair game tho

DrWilgy wrote:Eyo everyone.

Lol, not wanting to murk me already Scotty? give me at least a chance to act good before I get my cookie.

This is the first interaction between him and Scooter.

DrWilgy wrote:

Scotty wrote:I just caught on to the fact that there is no Day 0. Apparently we start fast round these parts.

DrWilgy wrote:Eyo everyone.

Lol, not wanting to murk me already Scotty? give me at least a chance to act good before I get my cookie.

Is this you acting good?
Also, why do you have to act?

My pattern this game will be get along with someone I like --> solve the game. EZPZ bb!

I'll be your marmot this game!

I don't wanna get lynched DUH!?!

Ok then! who are we voting for?

"Who are we voting for?"

DrWilgy wrote:Scotty you're gonna wreck me here. We should vote somewhere else.

DrWilgy wrote:@Scotty eh... Probably Zebra, I've noticed that baddies have a tendency to target me day one for Meta reasons simply because it's hard to punish. I change my game all the time so "let's slap a suspish sticker on it" seems to be the opportunism that is generated.

And Dfaraday's I'm self preserving early is also suspish. I don't see anyone doing that so early without a team commitment.

Lots of early interactions with Scotty, but none with Matt.

DrWilgy wrote:@Scotty, yeh

This was in response to Scotty asking him "Are you still suspicious of Zebra?" and it occurred in the same post where Scotty was telling Matt he was crawling around like a worm and that the mafia wouldn't night kill him.

DrWilgy wrote:@Scotty eh... Probably Zebra, I've noticed that baddies have a tendency to target me day one for Meta reasons simply because it's hard to punish. I change my game all the time so "let's slap a suspish sticker on it" seems to be the opportunism that is generated.

And Dfaraday's I'm self preserving early is also suspish. I don't see anyone doing that so early without a team commitment.

This is the only mention of Danny Boy, who got Wiggler's Day 1 vote right after Scotty planted one there, even though Zebra was Wilgy's top suspect.

DrWilgy wrote:Not really much more for me to say here. I don't see Matt doing what he's doing as scum, too flashy, not worth the risk... Especially when he can win by y'know doing nothing (see pet sounds).

Zebra is completely opposite of when I called her out last time... (see pet sounds) where she practically gave up upon stupid accusation. This time she challenges me in response...

Why the exception for my buddying Scotty?

This mentions BOTH Matt and Scotty in the same post. He outright defends Matt, accuses Zebra, and asks a question about Scotty.

Scotty wrote:-As for the Wilgy thing, I see nothing suspicious as of now with how he has acted/voted. (But I swear to god I will kill him in his sleep if he backstabs me) He said he was voting with me, so what's the big deal?

Knowing Scotty's allegiance, this comment stands out to me.

DrWilgy wrote:Voted fer Matt.

Matt, who is definitely not on your team other than Zebra?

Matt, what do you think of my friend Scotty?

Scotty, what do you think of SVS?

Again, Wilgy interacts with both Matt and Scotty in the same post, calling Scotty his friend.

Before Matt outs himself, Wilgy says:

DrWilgy wrote:Anyone care to talk about how if Matt flips civ, Zebra is Scum?

After Matt's death, Wilgy goes to speculating about who the other two are:

DrWilgy wrote:I haven't payed too much attention, but I think either Zebra or Scotty are.

DrWilgy wrote:Actually... It's Scotty and Nutella. Just looked at Matt's ISO.

There's a post where he calls me civ, while not mentioning Scotty. I think at that point I was still purposely parroting Scotty though, so it doesn't make sense.

His only mentioning of both Epi and Nutella was done jokingly, so one of those two. Nutella's vote last round is the one off key though.

Linki - Will someone explain why I'm suspect instead of just throwing my name?

Linki linki - A jab at Zebra, nothing more.

Wilgy names Scotty in both pairings, but follows up with this:

DrWilgy wrote:I'm not breaking my word, so I won't vote Scotty.

Typh, lets make a 3 way tie.

DrWilgy wrote:Didn't have time to do so earlier, just looked at the votes and posted. I suppose I'll do that now.

I don't think we should make a tie, but the only way to save either Scotty or I at this point would be for us to put three on Epi, meaning Scotty would have to move his vote.

DrWilgy wrote:Someone ISO Nutella. Odd that she thought I was scum with Zebra at one point. Also odd that she was the one vote on Floyd day 1. Also odd that she, Matt, scotty and I all voted Zebra day 2. Also odd that she remained on Zebra yestderday. Even oddest... Her constant shift from voting Zebra 2 days in a row, one of which the cop basically stated "hey Matts bad" and is now agreeing with her.

G2g again peeps *snaps and points while backing out of the room*

Someone should look at nutella...even though Scotty had just done that.

DrWilgy wrote:

Typhoony wrote:

DrWilgy wrote: <with regards to Scotty>
I thought I had stated I wouldn't betray you? I don't intend to.

Where the hell did you say this, except for earlier today?

I'm not sire at this point... I keep thinking I stated that, but then I look over my posts and I dont see it. It's causing emotional conflict. dying... Send help...

a2thezebra wrote:You probably said that you wouldn't betray him in BTSC.

DrWilgy wrote:But I dont have btsc to say that in.

That would also imply that we both have btsc... Making him bad. Vote for scotty today and me tomorrow. It's a Wilgy promise that I'm civ.

Wilgy can't find where he said he would never vote Scotty.

After spamming the thread with symbols, Wilgy makes some (joke?) posts suspecting Ty Fighter. Predictably, Typh dies.

After that, Wilgy guns hard for Zebra.

DrWilgy wrote:Thinking on it, it was pretty obvious,
Floyd comes in -> drops a vote on a baddie saying "Dude bros just trust me he's bad" ?

If Matt was on my team that would've stood out like a swollen hamster in a field of lasagna.

Indeed.

Matt wrote:Matt

Long Con, MY DUDE, just know I did request that we leave you alone Night 1 for precisely the reason I stated earlier, i.e. "why I wouldn't kill Long Con".

Floyd, no hard feeling my bro. I know your relatively new so I'm not sure you knew what you were doing with that last post. The reason I'm not freaking out at you right now is because I've also accidentally said too much before, though never after I was dead. Oh, and also because your role reveal almost guaranteed my lynch today anyway.

I won't be posting any further but I did have a blast peeps. Oh, and Wilgy requested I tell you all he's my teamie because wifom.

After Matt outed himself, he told us WIlgy was his teammate.

DrWilgy wrote:Hmmm... That is what I would have a mafia temmie do... Well played Matt, well played.

++++

Something else that stands out is the voting evidence:

Day one

Zebra 0
Long Con 0
DrWilgy 0
Sorsha 0
Floyd 1 nutella (3) 6%
Nutella 1 Epignosis (10) 6%
DFaraday 6 Scotty (4), DrWilgy (7), Typhoony (13), Matt (14), a2thezebra (15), Long Con (18) 33%
Scotty 0
Bullzeye 0
Typhoony 0
Matt 5 S~V~S (8), Sorsha (9), TheFloyd73 (11), Bullzeye (12), DFaraday (17) 28%
S~V~S 0
Epignosis 0
Anyone from New Zealand (host) 5 Golden (1), Tranq (2), Metalmarsh89 (5), Turnip Head (6), MovingPictures07 (16) 28%

++++

Day 2

Zebra 4 DrWilgy (2), Scotty (6), Matt (10), nutella (11)
Long Con 0
DrWilgy 0
Sorsha 0
Floyd 5 Epignosis (12), a2thezebra (13), Typhoony (14), Long Con (15), S~V~S (16)
Nutella 0
Scotty 0
Bullzeye 0
Typhoony 0
Matt 2 TheFloyd73 (3), Bullzeye (4)
S~V~S 1 Sorsha (9)
Epignosis 0
Golden (host/np) 5 Golden (1), MovingPictures07 (5), Metalmarsh89 (7), Turnip Head (8), G-Man (17)

++++

Day 3

Zebra 1 nutella (5)
DrWilgy 0
Sorsha 0
Nutella 0
Scotty 0
Bullzeye 0
Typhoony 0
Matt 8 Epignosis (4), Sorsha (7), Bullzeye (8), Scotty (9), S~V~S (10), DrWilgy (11), Typhoony (12), Matt (14)
S~V~S 0
Epignosis 1 a2thezebra (3)
Golden (host/np) 4 Golden (1), MovingPictures07 (2), TheFloyd73 (6), Enrique (13)

++++

Who murdered Sorsha?

Poll ended at Sat Jan 16, 2016 10:40 am

Zebra
1
Epignosis (14) 7%
DrWilgy
3
nutella (3), a2thezebra (6), Scotty (9) 21%
Nutella
0
No votes
Scotty
4
Typhoony (2), S~V~S (4), Bullzeye (8), DrWilgy (12) 29%
Bullzeye
0
No votes
Typhoony
0
No votes
S~V~S
0
No votes
Epignosis
0
No votes
Golden (host/nons)
6
Golden (1), MovingPictures07 (5), TheFloyd73 (7), Turnip Head (10), Sorsha (11), Matt (13) 43%
Total votes : 14

++++

Who killed typh?

Poll ended at Tue Jan 19, 2016 10:46 am

Bullz
0
No votes
Drwilgy
1
a2thezebra (7) 8%
Epi
1
nutella (6) 8%
Nutella
1
Epignosis (12) 8%
Svs
0
No votes
Zebra
3
DrWilgy (8), Bullzeye (9), S~V~S (10) 25%
Golden (host)
6
Golden (1), Typhoony (2), Sorsha (3), Metalmarsh89 (4), TheFloyd73 (5), Turnip Head (11) 50%
Total votes : 12

++++

Points to consider:

-Day 1, Wilgy votes alongside Scotty, setting up DF for the lynch in which Matt was a close second.
-Wilgy suspected Zebra but didn't push for that lynch option at all Day 1.
-Day 2, Wilgy votes Zebra and Scotty joins in (as does Matt)
-If S~V~S is good, then the Floyd wagon was all civilians
-Finally votes Matt Day 3 and makes comments about teammates
-Matt outs himself and singles out Wilgy as a teammate.
-The day Scotty was lynched, Wilgy had his vote on me for much of the phase, and along with Scotty, was trying to get something going on nutella.
-Matt, Scotty, and Wilgy all voted together the first three phases.

Sun-Charlie-Michael?

It's looking like it.

nutella wrote:I'm seriously very busy IRL. Sorry but I just cannot put much time into this each day and I am trying to respond to questions that are asked of me.

I guess you brought up the fact that I also role hinted early -- yeah, I did. I kind of talked about this already though -- it wasn't even really an intentional hint, and it's no different from how I might slip in a hint in a regular game. I had no idea how pivotal role claiming would end up being in this game. Yours however was so goddamn overt, you quickly got so devoted to calling people nicknames. There is a difference in how confidently you assumed your role.

And I think Sawyer is a very likely candidate for the third impostor. Like Sun and Charlie, he's a pretty major character but not as major as, say, Jack and Locke. Sayid is probably at a similar level but I trust SVS. I'd be kinda surprised if it's Kate but not hugely. I highly doubt it is Michael.

Thank you for this. Your vote is still sitting in a stupid place.

nutella wrote:I am trying to defend myself though. SVS is right, this always happens to me. So you know what, It will not be my fault if you decide to lynch me

It absolutely will be your fault. Get your head in the game.

S~V~S wrote:I am gonna wake up in the AM to an outraged Bullz,and he is right to be outraged, I guess.

But the way Matt did it,from it being about a joke about Bullz, to it being a real thing,and the way he lumped us together, and the way Bullzlet him ... I don't buy it.

Caught in a trap
I can't get out
Suspicious minds etc.

But I really would be surprised if Wilgy, Nutella or you were bad. Thats kind of why I fell on Zeebs yesterday.

Process of elimination. I may be an Iraqi torturer, but i was still on the plane I think Epi, Wilgy & Nutella were on the plane.

I'll give it a look. Promise. It would seem I have to vote him or nutella today anyway, the way the votes are.

S~V~S wrote:When I look at everyone else, it is the only thing that makes sense.

I just KNOW, in my gut, that you, Nutella & Wilgy are not bad. That leaves me or Bullz, and it isn't me.

What in your gut says Mr. Wiggles ain't bad?

S~V~S wrote:I can't prove it, but yes, that is what I believe.

When I'm done with Mr. Wiggles (yes Mr., because he ain't no doctor), I'll read Day 1 again and see if I can work my pee brain around your thinkin'.

So, just to be clear, you're asking me to believe that

1) Bully Boy bussed his entire team from the getgo, and
2) Kate ain't on the island? Then who did I...?

S~V~S wrote:She always looks bad. She will say this too. I just don't think that she is.

But if you insist, lynch her today, and Bullz tomorrow, becasue I think there will be a tomorrow.

Hold ya horses, now Sassafras. I ain't through. Got Mr. Wiggles left.

But how do you catch a bad nutella if she's always lookin' bad?

Nutty Bar.

Thirty-two posts. She votes for Floyd for no reason.

nutella wrote:Whoops, sorry, I kinda forgot about this game today.
RIP DF. I've caught up but I don't really get all the hullabaloo between him and Matt and as usual I'm really not taking anything away from Day 1 nonsense. There's really no way to glean much of anything from that, and if anything I'd lean towards thinking the people getting more involved in the discussion are not the baddies.

Epignosis wrote:I'm votin for my spottieottiedopaliscious nutella. Damn damn damn damn.

????? What even

Yeah, sorry I've been under the radar so far, but I didn't really have any thoughts yesterday since it was just getting started and I didn't remember to catch up until after the lynch. (I'll be gone all day tomorrow too but it'll be night so hopefully I won't miss as much discussion) otherwise I'll try to pay more attention and start to form some thoughts on day 2. Honestly even though my vote for Floyd was pretty pseudo-random I wouldn't mind pursuing him a bit since he also seems to have remained pretty under-the-radar.

She called the "hullabaloo" about Matt nonsense. She ironically would pursue a Jumbotron lynch because he ain't much for talkin.

When the doc (the real one) called her out...

nutella wrote:Huh, nobody died. I can dig it.

Sorsha wrote:

nutella wrote:Whoops, sorry, I kinda forgot about this game today.
RIP DF. I've caught up but I don't really get all the hullabaloo between him and Matt and as usual I'm really not taking anything away from Day 1 nonsense. There's really no way to glean much of anything from that, and if anything I'd lean towards thinking the people getting more involved in the discussion are not the baddies.

Epignosis wrote:I'm votin for my spottieottiedopaliscious nutella. Damn damn damn damn.

????? What even

Yeah, sorry I've been under the radar so far, but I didn't really have any thoughts yesterday since it was just getting started and I didn't remember to catch up until after the lynch. (I'll be gone all day tomorrow too but it'll be night so hopefully I won't miss as much discussion) otherwise I'll try to pay more attention and start to form some thoughts on day 2. Honestly even though my vote for Floyd was pretty pseudo-random I wouldn't mind pursuing him a bit since he also seems to have remained pretty under-the-radar.

Ok... So the people participating in the discussion are not the baddies but you are not participating in the discussion.

And you vote for Floyd for being under the radar but he's really been more present than you have been...

Yeah I do recognize I was somewhat hypocritical in saying that, but then again I wasn't because it doesn't contradict at all. I know that I'm sort of in the background, I just think that the baddies are also in the background. I just don't feel that the players who were most vocal on day 1 are likely to be bad. On that note, can someone explain what the whole deal with Matt is and why Bullz is so sure he's bad?

Btw, Floyd only has 2 more posts than I do. Maybe he's contributed a little more content than I have, but I sure haven't noticed.

...she rationalizes her hypocrisy...somehow? Her thinking was that them Uzzers were hanging out in the background. She'd already named Floyd...so who else was there?

Zebra - Talker
Long Con - Talker
DrWilgy - Talker
Sorsha - Talker
Floyd - Quiet
Nutella - Quiet
DFaraday - Usually quiet but was up for a lynch (and Nutty Bar didn't vote him)
Scotty - Talker
Bullzeye - Talker
Typhoony - Talker
Matt - Talker
S~V~S - Talker
Epignosis - Talker

So this rationale is empty. There were no quiet people except Nutty Bar and Floyd.

nutella wrote:

Scotty wrote:

nutella wrote: Yeah I do recognize I was somewhat hypocritical in saying that, but then again I wasn't because it doesn't contradict at all. I know that I'm sort of in the background, I just think that the baddies are also in the background.

That's like wearing a purple unitard while giving your testimony as a witness to a detective about your murdered mother-in-law, and exclaiming that you saw a person in a purple unitard running away from the scene of the crime. I do actually think that's a little contradictory. But to each her own

Maybe I should draw a venn diagram or something. I'm really just saying that the baddies are a subset of people who are under the radar and I'm one of the non-baddies who happens to also be under the radar. I think it's a fairly simple thought process.

Scotty poked her, but stopped short of calling her suspicious at that point.

nutella wrote:

Scotty wrote:I wonder what nutella thinks about all this game stuff.

I too am interested in whether Zebra has info. I might decide to vote for Matt with that hope, but I'm kinda skeptical about him. I still have an odd hunch about Floyd, and tentatively also Long Con, but idk how to explain it. I guess I'm tired of overanalyzing and manufacturing suspicions and would rather listen to my gut unless something more convincing comes up.

linki @ zebra hmm okay

Another poke.

nutella wrote:I'm voting for Zebra. I believe Matt's claim and I'd very much prefer that he not die and besides I find myself not trusting a word from Zebra lately.

I am fine with role claiming if you guys make up your mind about it. Tbh I sorta hinted at my role way at the beginning

In this post, she defends Matt, suspects Zebra, and talks about hinting her role from the beginning (even though she criticized me for doing the same thing).

nutella wrote:Yeah, it does make sense to me now that Floyd probably checked Matt. And this may be really unkosher to say (idk punish me if it's breaking the rule) but part of why I think so is based on what Golden said.

But, my major hesitation is that I really believed Matt's claim, and given I know Jin is in this game I'd be surprised if Sun wasn't. If that's true and the baddies indeed have fake roles to claim, then kudos Golden for seriously messing with my brain. But based on how the role claiming fest went down, I still hella don't trust Zebra.

Conclusion: I'm not sure whether I want to change my vote or not. Probably Matt will be lynched anyway, but I'd feel bad if he's my dear wife. And seriously, what is going on with zebra, has everyone else picked up on something that I haven't? And wtf is wrong with that rainbow list? Is that a self-outing?

She defends Matt after it's clear that Matt got checked. I actually think this is a point in her favor, since there would be no payout for doing that.

nutella wrote:So the fake role claim thing is confirmed. Well that's pretty fucked up. But great that we're one baddie down!

I bet the other two are Wilgy and Zebra. And if by some crazy chance that's not the case, I'd entertain that crazy theory about Sorsha and Typh.

nutella wrote:

a2thezebra wrote:It's Epi and Wilgy folks.

Or this actually.

I think these posts just show that nutella isn't paying very good attention.

nutella wrote:Scotty, idk what kind of case that was, you basically summarized some things I said without any analysis. Nice try. Like I said, my "flip" on Zebra was not sudden but gradual as I found myself trusting her opinions more (Typh's contributions helped bc I trusted him). As for Floyd, my reaction to his lynch was exactly how I said -- I was surprised that all those votes appeared on him and I was unclear on the motivation for it, and it had nothing to do with my earlier gut suspicion of him.

Looks like Wilgy is digging his hole deeper. I think either Scotty or Epi could be his teammate. Part of me wants to think Scotty is genuine, so I want to hear more from Epi for sure.

Nutty Bar comes out and describes Scooter's case against her as a mere summary. I myself thought it was a good one at the time.

The takeaway here is that nutella thought Scotty was genuine and that she wanted to hear more from me (I don't know why...she hasn't said anything about my counterpoints).

nutella wrote:Wow I missed a lot of interesting content today o.O As I was reading through everyone's posts from earlier I became less convinced Wilgy was bad and more convinced Scotty was, but alas I was too late to change my vote. Glad to see another baddie got lynched. And lol you guys are going to pick me apart and roast me for saying that I so conveniently but unhelpfully changed my mind yet again, but it's just the truth I really just flip-flop on my opinions a lot and it always looks suspicious but it's always just me being honest with my indecisive thought process. This has been a problem for me in so many games and is always what gets me in trouble as a civ. This game I've been using a combination of gut feelings and process of elimination, along with recently trusting the opinions of Typh and Zebra since they seem so confident, and through all this I felt I had narrowed down the baddies to 2 of Scotty, Epi, or Wilgy. Now that scotty is down I am more inclined for now to pursue Epi. I know my voting record is absolute shit but I just keep rethinking things every day. :\

Some things haven't changed.

Finally, nutella's big post against me is nonsensical on so many levels. I've already responded to it, but she won't address it. I don't know what that means.

Nutty Bar just looks bad, a few points notwithstanding. If she's good, she hasn't been of any use at all (no offense Nutty Bar).

Sassafras.

S~V~S wrote:

Long Con wrote:

S~V~S wrote:I think it is known throughout the land that Bullz has the same chance mathematically of being bad or good each game as anyone else.

Real suspicion or jokey suspicion?

Is this a question or a suspicion?

It's a question, but also a bit of a "hrm".

Two different people had jokey suspicions of Bullz. And Bullz can be an easy lynch cause he gets defensive. So an early thrust towards Bullz, especially a jokey one like Matts, gets my eye.

Her first suspect is Matty Poo.

S~V~S wrote:

Matt wrote:I think Bullz knows I'm having fun with him, SVS, but yeah, don't trust that guy! He's dangerous.

Also Bullz, again, why shouldn't everyone vote for you Day one?

And if he gets lynched you say what? "hey it isn't my fault they voted for him I was just joking"

I don't think bernie would approve

Linki~ in LOST jin called the Others the Uzzers (or Udders), LOST joke

S~V~S wrote:I don't have enough of an opinion about Wilgy to vote for him, or to want to save him at this point, at least, by voting for faraday, although Typh made a good point about faradays seriously preemptive save move.

So gonna drop a starter vote on Matt for picking on Bullz.

The initial suspicion turned into a starter vote which turned into a finishing vote. There was also plenty of back and forth between them about her vote. I won't quote all of that. But this:

S~V~S wrote:Someone I want to trust is consistently deflecting any suspicion of Matt, and Matt is accusing me of being personal and saying I am bad becasue i suspect him. Awesome. I need to think about this. Becasue a consistent low level bolstering of Matt is coming from the same direction, and it concerns me.

Epi,I trust you. What do you think of Matt.

Linki, lol. I am buying what you are putting out. We haven't always gotten along on the beach, but we are on the same side.

And my response.

What I ultimately did is give S~V~S a perfect opportunity to back out of her Matt suspicion gracefully if she was so inclined. She didn't.

S~V~S wrote:So lynch me to cut old tuft head some slack becasue you felt sorry for him in another game. When I got accused of going personal, I lost a lot of interest to be honest. And I caught what you were putting out right away; sorry you did not do the same.

S~V~S wrote:And there is a differnece between ruining someones game over a joke and ruining it over a suspicion, regardless how mild.

S~V~S wrote:So it comes down to who feels sorrier for whom? OK. Vote for me.

I am exceedingly susceptible to guilt, and Matt does a good enough job of making me feel guilty for suspecting him without this.

Now, I still maintain that S~V~S somewhat misunderstood my point about Matt at the time, but the takeaway here is the reaction. She second guessed herself, and ultimately voted Floyd Day 2.

Pause.

S~V~S wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:

S~V~S wrote:wow I should have my coffee before posting, lol.

"shorter acquaintance"

And I also wanted to add that I will not be voting for Zeebs. Based on a few things she said, and a general demeanor, I don't really think she is bad.

Point out these things please SVS.

I don't like to do that, point out reasons why I think someone is a civ. It is one of the many, many reasons I HATE rainbow lists or any list that involves drawing targets on civvies. Although in a game like this with one set of baddies, they already know who the civvies are so meh. Force of habit, I guess. I prefer to not play games with only one set of baddies if possible, and don't plan on playing many heists, but I could not resist LOST.

But I think she has been hinting at something. I could be wrong, but that is what I think. Plus her demeanor is a bit more subdued than I expect from her, which would work with what I think she has been putting out.

And Typh, becasue I was not sure what I think about your general line on Matt. And I wanted to think about it before I came right out with it; and I still need to think about it, maybe until we get the results of this lynch. Since Scotty came straight out and asked, I clarified, but I like to know what I think of certain people, if that makes sense. In this game, Epi is one, you are another. I know what I think of Epi. I am not sure what I think of you.

S~V~S wrote:

Typhoony wrote:Scotty could you elaborate on the things that can go wrong if we all claim?

You seem to be against it the most.

Are we all claiming? I kind of already did leave a gross big hint, more than one actually.

This is why I probably will not play more of these ha ha.

I really do not want to see Zeebs lynched. I should have some time this after noon to catch back up, Saturdays are already a bitch for me, plus the post a thon I am cohosting.
So Typh, you really actually think I would kill you Night 1? That surprises me, fun> win in my books, and a challenging game is more fun. But OK.

Fast-forward.

S~V~S wrote:In other games like this it often is the Godfather iirc, can't die until his other teammates do. But anything is possible.

I have not played many of these on other forums. But I have never heard of baddies being given fake roles to claim, but what do i know?

S~V~S wrote:I am shocked about that fake identity thing.

Pause.

If S~V~S was bad, the large comments above make no sense, so it makes her shock at that revelation genuine in my book.

Play.

S~V~S wrote:

a2thezebra wrote:So what'll it be, S~V~S?

I do trust Epis gut in general, and think he is civ this game. So I will trust him here, and go with Floyd. I don't want to see you lynched, and honestly don't know what to think about Matt.

I instilled enough doubt regarding Matt that S~V~S was willing to vote Floyd instead Day 2. There was little reason to vote Matt, as it was breaking the tie between The Striped Crusader and Jumbotron.

S~V~S wrote:Also gonna vote Scotty for now for trying to make a something out of a nothing, repeatedly. And trying to imply things are something they are not.

S~V~S didn't interact much with Scotty, but she voted for him.

All of this is enough for me to conclude that Sassafras is all right.

Something goin' through my mind...

Sun-Charlie-Kate?
Sun-Charlie-Sayid?
Sun-Charlie-Sawyer?
Sun-Charlie-Michael?
Sun-Charlie-Jin?

If you were The Golden Light, which of these five combinations would you use to construct your island inhabitants?

DrWilgy wrote:What's with the sudden urdge to step up your game Epi?

Don't worry, I'll get to you.

S~V~S wrote:How'd you know what I was thinking, Redneck Man?

It was the first thing to spring to mind. My conclusion is different than yours though. What do you think of my points in Bully Boy's favor? In my experience, he ain't the bussin' type, at least not that hard and not that early. And not everybody.

nutella wrote:If there is something specific I haven't addressed please let me know. I'd love to stay alive for a win.

This.

Bully Boy.

The first on-topic interaction is with Matt.

Bullzeye wrote:

Matt wrote:I've never played a Lost game before, this will be fun!

Liking Zeebs right now, she seems like her scary civ self...

Bullz, why shouldn't everyone vote for you Day one?

Because I'm not a baddie. Why shouldn't we vote for you?

TheFloyd73 wrote:Bullz, thoughts?

I think Matt is a big noob with no real sense of logic to any of his actions. He's my favourite muppet, but a muppet nonetheless.

Matt wrote:If Bullz were lynched and ended up civvie, just know deep down he was really mafia and wanted a town loss. I'm surprised more players aren't aware of Bullzeye's consistent anti-town sentiment.

I think everyone knows I rarely want to be a civ, but what I want has never had anything to do with it. When I am civ, I want the civs to win. Sometimes I even do when I'm not a civ if they really deserve it.

In conclusion, Matt is still a crazy person, the sky is still blue, and I don't think much else has happened so far that I find worthy of comment.

If Bullzeye is bad, then this is a calculated post, and I encourage people to read it both ways.

Bullzeye wrote:I might end up voting Matt just for being a butt but I've not yet decided. From looking at the way votes have fallen I wouldn't be surprised if we end up having a tie between everybody!

This is indecisive, and later Bullzeye votes LC.

Bullzeye wrote:I suppose I can get behind a five-way tie for the time being... May change later though!

*LC*

He says the tie is for novelty:

Bullzeye wrote:In fact I almost definitely will change my vote at some point but this huge tie just looks cool.

Okay. That's a relief.

Bullzeye wrote:

Matt wrote:

Bullzeye wrote:I suppose I can get behind a five-way tie for the time being... May change later though!

*LC*

Originally, it was a fun changeable vote, but after several players have looked at me hardcore for daring to suspect poor Bullz, and then posts like this...

Why do you want a five way tie?

Why shouldn't I? Should I be taking day 1 more seriously? This is ridiculous. You say you always suspect me and all this but you never come right out of the gate before I've even had the chance to contribute and start trying to set me up for a lynch. Now you've found fault with a fun vote as if that justifies your weak arguments in any way. I'll break the tie if it means so much to you. *Votes Matt*

Bullzeye implies that he shouldn't have to take Day 1 more seriously than he did.

Time out for a moment.

At this point, I am going to go through all of Matt's interactions with Bullzeye to see if there is truly a "thing" where Matt votes Bullzeye Day 1. If I am unimpressed with that, then I am going to vote Bullzeye.

Homestar Runner - Bullzeye participated. Bullzeye (m) - killed Night 1 by Trogdor, rezzed, Night 2, killed Night 10 by Blue Laser, Homsar Matt made several mentions Day 1 of Bullzeye being bad. Matt got replaced though: Indiglo (f, replaced Matt F) - Winner, Blue Laser minion #3. Matt was bad. Bullzeye was good.

Sherlock - Bullzeye participated. This particular instance was an INH affair, and not proper mafia. However, Bullzeye is mentioned like four million times on Matt's first page of posts.

Talking Heads - Bullzeye participated, but replaced in Day 2. Bullzeye was bad and Matt was good. Matt calls Bullzeye bad Day 4 after some friendly banter.

A World Reborn- Bullzeye participated, and Matt talked about Bullzeye always being bad.

Dune- Bullzeye out.

I'm going to stop there. I think enough evidence exists to show that Tuft-Head does give Bully Boy crap on a regular basis. The question is, was it just for fun or was Matt using that to his advantage?

Bullzeye wrote:

Matt wrote: Bullz - I don't see how a five way tie benefits town at all. Please explain why you do.

Quote me saying anything remotely close to "I think a five way tie benefits town" and then I will.

The retort appears organic enough.

Matt wrote:Bullz, do you really think I'm bad or are you just sour because I suspected you? Maybe SVS is right and you don't enjoy my poking and prodding of you in every game? If so, my bad. Just havin' funsies, dude, I figured you knew that.

And no, I will not find a quote like that. However, you just agreeing with Typh on creating a five way tie is definitely suspish, and I'm amazed that nobody else sees that.

To anyone saying it's weird that my vote started as a joke and then developed into a real ping, are you saying I'm no longer allowed to suspect Bullz because I already jokingly suspected him? Someone please inform Metalmarsh of this new rule, I don't know what he'll do with hiimself.

Zebra - Thanks dudette! However, if you think we can get a bunch of people to pull their votes off of me AND DF and put them where they belong, on Bullz, I'm down!

Matt pushes a Bullzeye lynch still.

Matt wrote:

a2thezebra wrote:Bullz is fine. Wilgy is bad.

If you think Wilgy is bad, and Wilgy voted DF and DF voted Wilgy, and you voted DF...does this mean you think DF and Wilgy are partners who are distancing?

Why not Bullz? You don't find him agreeing with Typh on a five way tie is suspish? Bullz said it was a joke but...

Which reminds me. SVS. You apparently hate Day 1 joke votes. What is your opinion of Bullzeye voting for Long Con just for laughs and giggles to create a five way tie on Day one? You must take some kind of issue with that, yes?

Matt tries to twist S~V~S's arm into voting Bullzie.

Bullzeye wrote:To be fair, Faraday's recent hints have been as subtle as a plane falling off a cliff. I mean I guess he could be lying but I think Matt is definitely more likely to be bad.

This post looks great to me, knowing what I know about Bullz...

Bullzeye wrote:*Voting Matt*. I'm 99.9% sure he's bad at this point.

...but this one still vexes me. I've never known Bullzie to express such certainty so early on.

Bullzeye wrote:

Long Con wrote:

Bullzeye wrote:I really don't understand what's going on now.

In an alternate timeline, you are getting lynched today.

Because Matt says so and picked a role at random to claim?

Matt picked a random role to claim? If Bullzeye were bad, I don't think he would have phrased it this way.

That seals it for me. I examined his experiences with Scotty, but Bullzeye voted for him too, and this was his reason

I'm still in favor of Bullzeye being good. From my experience with him, he is an excellent teammate- one of my favorites. He is only bad if Matt constructed this plan with him in BTSC about going at each other and Bullzeye actually agreed with him. I don't think that's the case. If he is bad and did an elaborate dance with Matt that early (and then Scotty), then he deserves an award. I cannot find many holes to poke in it, at least not big ones.

Unless someone raises serious issues against him, I'm not voting Bullzeye.

I see I've got some work to do.

Yeah, those bozos shoulda hired me to write seasons 5 and 6.

Bullzeye wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

Bullzeye wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:What about Epi Bullzeye?

Yeah, what about me?

What about you?

Wiggler asked.

That was a reference to Jacob's question to Ben before he got shanked. Do you even Lost, bro?

Hell yeah I do!

4 8 15 16 27 42

Boss.

Bullzeye wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:What about Epi Bullzeye?

Yeah, what about me?

What about you?

Wiggler asked.

DrWilgy wrote:What about Epi Bullzeye?

Yeah, what about me?

Nope, never mind me. That was Sorsha who called me a stupid redneck.

a2thezebra wrote:You think he tried bussing the crap out of her?

It just stands out is all. And look at the payout- if nutella did get lynched and was bad, the suspicion around Scotty would dissipate in the the damn ether.

It's just what's on my mind. That, and the fact that Nutty Bar kept calling me stupid redneck and things like that, and only recently came up with this notion that for some reason, I'm an impostor, but can't say why.

I also just went through Scotty's posts and saw that nutella was the only person he put together a big case on- I didn't see that with anybody else.

nutella is still number one on my list to lynch. She came by and never responded to anything I had to say.

a2thezebra wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

a2thezebra wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

a2thezebra wrote:

Epignosis wrote:Who are you?

My role, or are we about to get into a deep philosophical discussion? I'm down for either.

The former.

Claire Littleton.

Why were you reluctant to share that early on?

Because I felt that claiming roles would be more likely to benefit mafia than the civilians. I still feel that way to an extent, but now I doubt that it could benefit earlier. I said I was Claire earlier actually, if you were paying attention.

I know you claimed Claire earlier. That wasn't why I asked.

a2thezebra wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

a2thezebra wrote:

Epignosis wrote:Who are you?

My role, or are we about to get into a deep philosophical discussion? I'm down for either.

The former.

Claire Littleton.

Why were you reluctant to share that early on?

a2thezebra wrote:

Epignosis wrote:Who are you?

My role, or are we about to get into a deep philosophical discussion? I'm down for either.

The former.

Who are you?

a2thezebra wrote:linki - I'm bad at gauging reactions.

That's what I said. You're good at getting reactions. You're bad at gauging them.

a2thezebra wrote:At no point have I laid the responsibility on you. For one, I don't think any one person can lay the majority of the responsibility on another person, or even objectively attempt to do so. Just because I gave up my own vote to follow you (because I trusted you, heaven forbid) doesn't mean that I was going to go after you if it led to a civilian's death. I only went after Epi for the death of Floyd to gauge his reactions, and that was after I made clear to Long Con (I think?) that I didn't blame Floyd's death on him.

You're either full of it or bad at gauging reactions.

S~V~S wrote:OMG another person laying responsibility for their actions on me

I've been saying this much since Scotty got lynched.

I realize I am among those considered to be bad, even after I stepped out of the way to let Scotty be lynched. I made no effort on his behalf. My plan is to let you and Bullzeye run the show. I trust the two of you, as my belief is that the last mafia is Wilgy, zebra, or nutella.

If you decide I'm bad, then there isn't much I can do about that, because nutella, zebra, and Wilgy have all at one point or another shown a willingness to vote me.

a2thezebra wrote:linki - You already have wasted your time with me (and my time as well). If you're under the assumption that I want someone else lynched today then it shows how ignorant of the thread (as well as my play in general) you've been. I know what intention you claim and you know what intention I claim. Neither of us believed each other then as well as now, so I'm not sure what you're trying to prove. All I want before I die is to get some answers, or at the very least instigate content that will lead to answers in the future. That's all I've been trying to do the entire game.

If all that's true, then grow a little humility. Because you look foolish, raging against me for saving Wilgy when Scotty was bad.

I don't think it's true though.

My personal preference would be to lynch nutella, but I'm going to support S~V~S and Bullzeye. So your argument lies with them.

a2thezebra wrote:linki - You mean bus, right? And no.

No, I don't mean that.

Look, I'm not going to waste my time with you. I already said my intention was to support the two voters I trust. Those voters took down Scotty against my thinking, and they're voting you. If you want someone else lynched, then my suggestion is you make a damn good case on someone else.

a2thezebra wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:I read it as pressure too Zebra... If that opinion helps.

In what way is calling someone out on what I perceive to be their bullshit a tactic to get them to change their mind? If I perceived Epi to be civilian then I could maybe understand how criticizing his vote could be seen as pressuring, but since it's well-established that I was accusing him of saving Wilgy at that time, what exactly was I pressuring him to do? Confess?

Pressuring me to save a teammate. That's what.

a2thezebra wrote: linki - THAT's the best example you can pull up? How in heaven's name am I pressuring you there of all places??? That could be argued as criticism, accusation, reaction-gauging, pretty much anything BUT trying to get you to change your mind. I'm disappointed, son.

Son. Heh. My father wasn't on that plane.

a2thezebra wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

a2thezebra wrote:Epi trying to suggest that I was trying to pressure him is a laughable accusation. Trying to pressure you to do anything is a pointless exercise, Epi. You know that, I know that, and you know that I know that.

Then why did you try?

I didn't. That idea is your invention as it always has been.

Nope, no pressure here.

a2thezebra wrote:Epi trying to suggest that I was trying to pressure him is a laughable accusation. Trying to pressure you to do anything is a pointless exercise, Epi. You know that, I know that, and you know that I know that.

Then why did you try?

a2thezebra wrote:linki - I didn't pressure you into anything. You made your decision, Scotty was lynched because of it, and it ended up being the right way to go. Because at the time I believed that the two of you were teammates, your hesitance to take a firm stance in voting for either Wilgy or Scotty seemed to me like you didn't want to be implicated.

Quite right. You didn't pressure me into anything. You tried to. I commented on your attempt and called it pitiful.

zebra, you pressured me into saving Scotty, while making anything I could possibly do except vote Wilgy as saving Wilgy. That's a case against you.

Talk about that.

nutella wrote:RIP Typh

I am voting for Epi. I'd bet 10 SmashCoins he's the baddie.

You have a bet.

nutella wrote:He really just swooped right in trying to manipulate Zebra into going after me instead. Your teammate Scotty already tried to deflect attention to me buddy, I know I'm an easy target but this ain't a new trick, and from my perspective it's pretty painful to watch just how hard you're grasping.

No really.

Read this page again and see who brought up your name first, me or zeebs. Pretty weak that zebra thinks it's me or you, and when I try to convince him it's you (and not me), it's manipulation.

nutella wrote:I mean, hey, you could lynch me first to make sure, but we could also just end this today if Epi is the one

If.

nutella wrote: (and honestly I'd hate to just miss out on being alive at the end of a game again, it keeps happening to me I can't remember the last time I actually won). I am not 100% sure that it is Epi and if he isn't then I'd go for Wilgy after that. But I'd be surprised.

This is an unnecessary appeal to emotion.

nutella wrote:Here is what I know:
- Publicly confirmed actual civilian characters: Boone, Shannon, Jack, Locke, Hurley.
- I know to be actual civilian character: Jin.
- I believe to be true claims: Sayid, Claire, Kate, Michael.
- Claims that have been confirmed as baddie fakes: Sun, Charlie.
- Claim I believe to be a baddie fake: Sawyer.

What is about Sawyer that leads you to believe he doesn't exist on this island? What sets him apart?

nutella wrote:Golden was quite deviously tricky in the way he set up this game. He made it so that every player could plausibly claim a role, and the baddies' fake claims would blend in perfectly -- what's more, he seemed to either randomize it or deliberately distribute it so that the baddies' fake roles to claim would be pretty major characters that people would expect to be actual civilian roles, and he split up Jin and Sun just to mess with my goddamn mind.

The Golden Light was not "quite deviously tricky" (two adverbs in a row, my my) in setting up the island. As I learned that one Christmas, fake roles are a pretty common thing for Mafia. I'd never heard of that before, even though they were apparently a thing in the trees back there.

nutella wrote:Since Epi knew from the beginning that he could claim Sawyer, he had a hell of a fun time with it, calling everybody nicknames and playing the part. He knew Sawyer was a major character, so people would probably assume he was a civilian role, and nobody could counter his claim. (lol, imagine me saying all this in a detective-show-how-he-did-it-reveal voice. "Being the attention whore we all know and love, he relished this opportunity for performance and fell naturally into the spotlight." ) Anyway, I think my point is kind of that he really embraced the role-claiming right away, since he knew it would come up eventually --

nutella's first post.

nutella wrote:meanwhile, the rest of us didn't know about the fakes and how pivotal role claims would be, so although a few of us (myself, SVS whose hints I never even got, surely others) hinted subtly early on, we were probably only doing so to the extent that we might subtly hint in a game without roleclaiming -- I at least had only skimmed that part of the rules and had no concept of this type of setup. Most of the civvies didn't claim until the thread collectively decided to do role claims -- which started with (a) Epi pressuring Sorsha into claiming and (b) Matt overtly claiming his fake. The claim avalanche was provoked largely by Epi.

"The rest of us didn't know about the fakes?" Why do you presume to know what other people knew but assume I was in the know? What thread evidence suggests that I knew there were fake roles involved? I already told y'all about the time I was left home alone and this strange guy sent a card to my house asking me about fake roles and how the mafia would be screwed without them since roles were on the front page (whatever that meant- like I said, I was a kid).

With no roles listed on the front page, I didn't think such things were necessary, as evinced by this post.

And yeah, real subtle hint, Mr. Miyagi.

nutella wrote:Sorry this is really rambly and maybe not going anywhere but the more I think about it the more confident I am Epi is badbadbad. And I am much more inclined to believe Wilgy's claim of Michael bc he was so low-key about it. And I'm just going to stop here because there are actually a few more reasons I think Sawyer is the most likely fake claim, but they may be crossing into the realm of overanalysis.

See, I know all about manipulation, and trying to be somebody's buddy is the first step in a beautiful long con.