The Syndicate

Camilla wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 12:56 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 12:48 pm

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu May 25, 2023 5:35 pm

tutuu wrote: ↑Thu May 25, 2023 5:33 pm

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu May 25, 2023 5:29 pm

tutuu wrote: ↑Thu May 25, 2023 5:21 pm im looking at camilla and rondo as top mafia suspects

then tinfoil category is pyxxy and roxy

then falcon category coz its falcon

everyone else is super town

What about Wilgy?

I basically have him in my "kinda villagery" area for his last vote on Porscha but in the end it I don't think that it was as good a reason for me to towncore him as Alison/You/Seanzie/Zenon.

i had a villager read on him from his opening post of him being exhausted with his quirk

so basically he says that every game

one time he didn't - he was actual doctor. the next time he was doctor he said it, but im making the argument that wilgy attaches some ... lets say stress/anxiety/effort to his one-liner copy paste gimmick.

him expressing that he got tired of it this game, just like stopping it midway and being like "nvm" basically just reprents to me that he's a vanilla town. so in a way he "let jesus take the wheel"

i might be clearing him too easily, you are making me feel paranoid, but ...

he did sheep. which. hm.

if i try to justify my townread on wilgy im falling flat.

so lets say ... im just going with gut here. i cant provide solid logical argumetns for why wilgy is mega town

also to clarify im NOT softing a green on him

Yh, I'm fine with not voting Wilgy for today.

I don't wanna say anything more as I feel like I've already fucked up enough rn.

Just pulling some Camilla/Wilgy interactives.

I interpreted this as Tutuu having a green check on Wilgy. Which shows a lack of TMI rather than agenda.

Then how come you have Wilgy in your nulls (or if there are supposed to be 3 green categories, at the bottom of your townleans) in your next readlist?

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu May 25, 2023 5:42 pm Camilla
Zenon
Alison
tutu

Scotty

J
Wilgy

falcon
pyxxy

Roxy
Rondo

Currently where I'm at, tbh.

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 12:45 pm I’m just in a mindset where you are still in the POE when and if Wilgy flips wolf.

And if you’re town, I feel like you’d be even more accepting of that. That you are flabbergasted that you would even be conceived as a suspect at this point is boggling to me

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 10:55 am For entertainment purposes, watch the comfort level of Wilgy/Camilla/Jack as that becomes the plan. Cause if that contains all wolves, and I think it does, two of those players know they're about to lose and one thinks he's about to win.

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu May 25, 2023 5:35 pm

tutuu wrote: ↑Thu May 25, 2023 5:33 pm

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu May 25, 2023 5:29 pm

tutuu wrote: ↑Thu May 25, 2023 5:21 pm im looking at camilla and rondo as top mafia suspects

then tinfoil category is pyxxy and roxy

then falcon category coz its falcon

everyone else is super town

What about Wilgy?

I basically have him in my "kinda villagery" area for his last vote on Porscha but in the end it I don't think that it was as good a reason for me to towncore him as Alison/You/Seanzie/Zenon.

i had a villager read on him from his opening post of him being exhausted with his quirk

so basically he says that every game

one time he didn't - he was actual doctor. the next time he was doctor he said it, but im making the argument that wilgy attaches some ... lets say stress/anxiety/effort to his one-liner copy paste gimmick.

him expressing that he got tired of it this game, just like stopping it midway and being like "nvm" basically just reprents to me that he's a vanilla town. so in a way he "let jesus take the wheel"

i might be clearing him too easily, you are making me feel paranoid, but ...

he did sheep. which. hm.

if i try to justify my townread on wilgy im falling flat.

so lets say ... im just going with gut here. i cant provide solid logical argumetns for why wilgy is mega town

also to clarify im NOT softing a green on him

Yh, I'm fine with not voting Wilgy for today.

I don't wanna say anything more as I feel like I've already fucked up enough rn.

Just pulling some Camilla/Wilgy interactives.

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 12:36 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 11:26 am

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 11:22 am Really curious as to who mafia chooses to shoot tonite.

Some tough decisions

Go look at Wilgy's iso. It's 25 posts.

??

I’ve read Wilgy’s iso. What does that have to do with the NK?

I meant wrt the stuff I'm saying about how he interacted with Porscha and Camilla. In that he didn't until he was forced by gamestate to spontaneously generate scumreads on them based on nothing.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 12:22 pm And just for @Scotty and @Roxy worrying about me not voting fast enough, here are the receipts for that being normal town Jack behavior.

viewtopic.php?t=2485
Scooby Doo Monster Collective. I'm the D2 (mis)elimination. I vote once all game and it's on the last page of my iso.

viewtopic.php?t=2458
Cartomancy. Wolves conceed D5. I vote 4 times all game.

viewtopic.php?t=2445
Nanook's Anniversary Game. I suicide kill w!Doby middle of D2. I cast 1 vote all game.

Me not voting has nothing to do with...whyever a wolf player in my situation might not vote and everything to do with the way I play the game, which is to treat my vote like a gun. I only aim it at something I intend to kill.

Full disclosure, I vote similarly when I'm a wolf. For instance, voting twice in 4 days of Hot Fuzz mafia. My wolfgame is largely me larping my towngame.

And just for @Scotty and @Roxy worrying about me not voting fast enough, here are the receipts for that being normal town Jack behavior.

viewtopic.php?t=2485
Scooby Doo Monster Collective. I'm the D2 (mis)elimination. I vote once all game and it's on the last page of my iso.

viewtopic.php?t=2458
Cartomancy. Wolves conceed D5. I vote 4 times all game.

viewtopic.php?t=2445
Nanook's Anniversary Game. I suicide kill w!Doby middle of D2. I cast 1 vote all game.

Me not voting has nothing to do with...whyever a wolf player in my situation might not vote and everything to do with the way I play the game, which is to treat my vote like a gun. I only aim it at something I intend to kill.

Camilla wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 11:52 am

Roxy wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 11:48 am

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:24 pm

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:22 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:19 pm

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:09 pm Jack/Scotty fits in better as teammates with Wilgy than Pyxxy. I don't think Pyxxy/Wilgy would spend the entire game trying to hellbus each other like this, tbh.

Most likely Jack as I liked Scotty's paranoia on me while Jack's push on me kind of just feels like he's piggy-backing on Roxy's paranoia than actually doing anything to move the game-state forward.

Lul

Classic wolf Jack tactic. Sheep paranoia of low end poster from two days ago.

Moving to a three player poe is moving the gamestate forward. You just don’t like where I’m moving it.

What about Alison/Scotty/Roxy?

There's been very little suspicion on me and you only started turning on me the moment the latter two started to do so.

Suspicion on them, as I meant the three ones. Why me over Scotty/Alison since we've basically been roughly in the same tier until Roxy/Scotty began tinfoiling me.

but I have had you as a tinfoil since D 1 it's just that no one looks at my posts until today. So it did -not- just begin --- it began 2 days (mafia days) ago.

I mean, you've consistently had tinfoil on me. Thing is this sudden shift on Wilgy/Jack's PoV on me basically coincided with how Zenon/Tutu died who were the people that were TR'ing me the strongest and Scotty started tinfoiling me.

Like, Wilgy/Jack barely mentioned me at all and I only became PoE when it became convenient as my defenders died.

I don't get how you/Scotty aren't exactly seeing how opportunistic both of these two's suspicion on me have been as none of those two voice these suspicions until today and it was basically just tunneling more LHF-y acceptable people like Falcon or Pyxxy.

Okay but you're looking at me going back and doing a fuckton of work on everybody and interaction with you and working things out until I'm at "Camilla is for sure a wolf" and Wilgy randomly putting you in a POE for no stated reasons and being like "They're the same picture."

Which is just.....none of what you're doing this day phase makes any sense at all from t!Camilla.

I got the shoes of a townie.

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 11:22 am Really curious as to who mafia chooses to shoot tonite.

Some tough decisions

Go look at Wilgy's iso. It's 25 posts.

Camilla wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 11:17 am

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 11:15 am Seriously, Wilgy's interactions with Pyxxy and Camilla are night and day (with his interactions with me being in the middle).

Camilla handwaves it without looking at it.

Her takes are motivated by where she wants yeets to go, not by evidence.

What?

I don't think Pyxxy's wolfing with Wilgy.

I didn't say you did. I said you're handwaving MY analysis that Wilgy didn't really push or interact with you or Porscha but interacted a lot with Pyxxy by saying "Wilgy didn't really interact with anybody tbf" which is flat not true.

Camilla wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 11:09 am

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 11:05 am

Camilla wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 10:59 am Y'know what?

I'm pretty much settled on the Jack/Wilgy world atp.

Jack's basically spending much of his time trying to tie me to Wilgy without giving much attention to the possibility that Pyxxy is a wolf or little paranoia outside of this PoE in a fairly transparent attempt that he knows that once Wilgy flips that the main mountain separating the wolves from winning is that I'll basically go the full Amrock to elim him.

This is basically textbook endgame wolf play to seal the game.

It makes sense too- this perspective. Because Jack wasn’t exactly gunning for Wilgy, and once the tides had changed to that as the possible yeet, he’s keeping options open.

But a wrinkle- he has just reasoned out that the team is just Wilgy/you. Not a lot of wiggle room. What happens when we yeet w!Wilgy and then t!you?
(Ignoring doc atm) After Wilgy, it’ll be 4v1. Miselim on you leads to f3. How does jack win in that scenario?

Because in a Pyxxy/Jack/You or Roxy endgame it's basically extremely easy for a wolf with WiM, which is basically the archetype that Jack is, to shift the elim on Pyxxy.

The guy nearly got chopped d1 and he's kind of been in the PoE and would've died if it was for Alison shielding him. Once Alison's dead he's basically easy pickings.

This is nonsense.

If it's Wilgy/Jack, I'm laying out the argument that Pyxxy and Wilgy are never wolves together.

I bus Wilgy here. Shoot Alison. Then it's Roxy/Camilla/Scotty/Pyxxy vs Jack and I have to misyeet 2 of them. And I'm arguing that Roxy is always town, Scotty is always town and if Wilgy flips wolf (which he's about to), Pyxxy is always town. Roxy earlier today declared her intention to look at/vote for me or Camilla. Scotty earlier voted for me. Pyxxy earlier voted for me iirc.

You're proposing that my master plan is to bus Wilgy, misyeet you, then go into final 3 with two players who suspect me that I have as lock town.

Fucking hell. I'm a good wolf but I ain't that good. I'd lose that every single time.

Total nonsense. You don't think this is what's happening. You're saying things that would be convenient for w!Camilla for townies to believe, not things that t!Camilla would actually believe.

Seriously, Wilgy's interactions with Pyxxy and Camilla are night and day (with his interactions with me being in the middle).

Camilla handwaves it without looking at it.

Her takes are motivated by where she wants yeets to go, not by evidence.

Camilla wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 11:11 am

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 11:09 am

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 9:51 am

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 5:15 pm

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 12:42 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 5:51 am @DrWilgy @Roxy Can I hear you two's detailed thoughts on reads/solve/gamestate

I don't really know where your heads are at and id like to get a clearer read on you

There hasn't been much evolution. Falcon was a sleepwalk misyeet I think. Feel that Falcon should've been somewhat threadspewed.

There's one in Pyxxy/Scotty, probably just Pyxxy

There's one in Camilla/Roxy/Jack and that should be solved after we resolve the d1 tomfoolery.

Talk to me about "one in Pyxxy/Scotty." I get the Pyxxy case. I get that Scotty is somewhat antialigned with Pyxxy (and Falcon before he died). I get that there was a post or two from Scotty that were bad and Tutuu really suspected him.

Is that the whole thing? Is there more to it than that?

Cause Pyxxy/Scotty -> if necessary Scotty/Pyxxy is a super convenient yeet for me if there really is a wolf there. We get a second wolf. We have two wolves dead and lots of important eod and interactives to find the last wolf. I think we can win no matter who the third wolf is in that scenario.

But if there are zero wolves in Pyxxy and Scotty? We lose if we misyeet both.

If you're sure there's a wolf there, convince me there's for sure a wolf there.

So, like I'm pretty sure after the Falcon misyeet, we don't have the wiggle room to yeet Scotty. Scotty has had a very townie voice all game and I only reconsider that in a T Pyxxy world.

Re the dif check between them, it's because the Pyxxy CW to a wolf yeet was very real. I think it's hard for me to think that there weren't more wolves involved in the CW than just Porscha, especially due to Rondo voting off wagon was just town.

Further, d1 players that are still around
On CW or target of CW Scotty/Pyxxy
Off wagon Camilla/Prince
Potential bus Alison/Roxy

I do not feel comfortable assessing the off wagon nulls until we get another pelt Unless it's just you/Camilla, especially after being wrong on Rondo. I don't think Roxy or Alison are wolves.

Effectively my PoE is Pyxxy, you, Camilla.

Wilgy's interaction with Porscha is that he throws down a naked fourth vote on her and dips. Jokingly calls the vote scummy. Does not provide reasoning beforehand. It tells us very little about Wilgy's alignment tbh.

Wilgy's interaction with Pyxxy is overwhelmingly negative. He basically stakes the game on trying to get Pyxxy eliminated. Wilgy and Pyxxy are not packmates.

Wilgy's interactions with Camilla hardly exist. The first negative thing he says about her is in the above post, putting her in the final 3 player POE. Level 1 distancing. Forgot to read or address his partner all game.

It's Wilgy/Camilla.

Somebody else can do Wilgy/Prince Jack. It's different from Wilgy/Camilla but I don't feel the need to evaluate Wilgy's interactions with my slot wrt looking for partnering because I know we aren't partners. @Scotty and @Alison should, though.

Wilgy basically had very little interactions with most of the players here aside from Pyxxy, but at least I'm voting him.

Git rekt

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 11:05 am

Camilla wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 10:59 am Y'know what?

I'm pretty much settled on the Jack/Wilgy world atp.

Jack's basically spending much of his time trying to tie me to Wilgy without giving much attention to the possibility that Pyxxy is a wolf or little paranoia outside of this PoE in a fairly transparent attempt that he knows that once Wilgy flips that the main mountain separating the wolves from winning is that I'll basically go the full Amrock to elim him.

This is basically textbook endgame wolf play to seal the game.

It makes sense too- this perspective. Because Jack wasn’t exactly gunning for Wilgy, and once the tides had changed to that as the possible yeet, he’s keeping options open.

But a wrinkle- he has just reasoned out that the team is just Wilgy/you. Not a lot of wiggle room. What happens when we yeet w!Wilgy and then t!you?
(Ignoring doc atm) After Wilgy, it’ll be 4v1. Miselim on you leads to f3. How does jack win in that scenario?

You can even take me first tomorrow as long as Camilla goes the day after. It's Wilgy/Camilla. It's always Wilgy/Camilla. She's looking so desperate and dishonest it's crazy. Take for instance that in all her accusations of me leaving my options open and your concern that I'm doing the same, I came to my surefire 3 player POE and 2 player POE before Camilla came to hers and hers is 100% in response to mine, attempting to call my bluff. But I'm not bluffing.

[VOTE: Wilgy] aubergine

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 9:51 am

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 5:15 pm

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 12:42 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 5:51 am @DrWilgy @Roxy Can I hear you two's detailed thoughts on reads/solve/gamestate

I don't really know where your heads are at and id like to get a clearer read on you

There hasn't been much evolution. Falcon was a sleepwalk misyeet I think. Feel that Falcon should've been somewhat threadspewed.

There's one in Pyxxy/Scotty, probably just Pyxxy

There's one in Camilla/Roxy/Jack and that should be solved after we resolve the d1 tomfoolery.

Talk to me about "one in Pyxxy/Scotty." I get the Pyxxy case. I get that Scotty is somewhat antialigned with Pyxxy (and Falcon before he died). I get that there was a post or two from Scotty that were bad and Tutuu really suspected him.

Is that the whole thing? Is there more to it than that?

Cause Pyxxy/Scotty -> if necessary Scotty/Pyxxy is a super convenient yeet for me if there really is a wolf there. We get a second wolf. We have two wolves dead and lots of important eod and interactives to find the last wolf. I think we can win no matter who the third wolf is in that scenario.

But if there are zero wolves in Pyxxy and Scotty? We lose if we misyeet both.

If you're sure there's a wolf there, convince me there's for sure a wolf there.

So, like I'm pretty sure after the Falcon misyeet, we don't have the wiggle room to yeet Scotty. Scotty has had a very townie voice all game and I only reconsider that in a T Pyxxy world.

Re the dif check between them, it's because the Pyxxy CW to a wolf yeet was very real. I think it's hard for me to think that there weren't more wolves involved in the CW than just Porscha, especially due to Rondo voting off wagon was just town.

Further, d1 players that are still around
On CW or target of CW Scotty/Pyxxy
Off wagon Camilla/Prince
Potential bus Alison/Roxy

I do not feel comfortable assessing the off wagon nulls until we get another pelt Unless it's just you/Camilla, especially after being wrong on Rondo. I don't think Roxy or Alison are wolves.

Effectively my PoE is Pyxxy, you, Camilla.

Wilgy's interaction with Porscha is that he throws down a naked fourth vote on her and dips. Jokingly calls the vote scummy. Does not provide reasoning beforehand. It tells us very little about Wilgy's alignment tbh.

Wilgy's interaction with Pyxxy is overwhelmingly negative. He basically stakes the game on trying to get Pyxxy eliminated. Wilgy and Pyxxy are not packmates.

Wilgy's interactions with Camilla hardly exist. The first negative thing he says about her is in the above post, putting her in the final 3 player POE. Level 1 distancing. Forgot to read or address his partner all game.

It's Wilgy/Camilla.

Somebody else can do Wilgy/Prince Jack. It's different from Wilgy/Camilla but I don't feel the need to evaluate Wilgy's interactions with my slot wrt looking for partnering because I know we aren't partners. @Scotty and @Alison should, though.

Camilla wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 10:59 am Y'know what?

I'm pretty much settled on the Jack/Wilgy world atp.

Jack's basically spending much of his time trying to tie me to Wilgy without giving much attention to the possibility that Pyxxy is a wolf or little paranoia outside of this PoE in a fairly transparent attempt that he knows that once Wilgy flips that the main mountain separating the wolves from winning is that I'll basically go the full Amrock to elim him.

This is basically textbook endgame wolf play to seal the game.

Fantastic. Lettuce play chicken.

For entertainment purposes, watch the comfort level of Wilgy/Camilla/Jack as that becomes the plan. Cause if that contains all wolves, and I think it does, two of those players know they're about to lose and one thinks he's about to win.

Strongly feeling Wilgy/Camilla atp. Gonna reread first Wilgy and then Camilla, esp wrt flipped players but the play today for the Scotties in the crowd that really want me to vote is an eventual vote on Wilgy unless I find something that explodes this worldview.

Roxy wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 10:47 am

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 5:54 pm

Roxy wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 1:34 pm I would like to sort Prince J aka Jack.

And go from there. Probs to Camilla.

Yep I am believing they are it.

So sort me. Who is “they” and why are “they” “it?”

"they" and "it" are generic pronouns I use in games of mafia for kindness as I can't always remember which pronouns some people prefer.

Sorry. I was asking if you were saying "Jack or Camilla is probably mafia" or "Jack AND Camilla are probably mafia."

Also, so glad you're back. Let's fucking win this thing.

That is, I was asking Wilgy to explain what I took as an irrational read on there being a wolf in Scotty/Pyxxy. I was concerned that I was either failing to understand town Wilgy or that scum Wilgy was putting forth a fake read and I wanted Wilgy to explain his read so that I could see if I was missing something or that Wilgy was or wasn't being opportunistic.

But the w!Scotty part of the read is just "Scotty voted for Pyxxy over Porscha D1" which isn't that convincing when you consider (as Wilgy does) that Scotty has acted very townie all game. So it's easy for me to read Wilgy's read on Pyxxy/Scotty being a difference check as a scum motivated read on two townies. It doesn't hurt w!Wilgy to call Scotty town atp because he's only ever getting a misyeet on one of those players anyway. His post makes complete sense in a Porscha/Wilgy/Camilla world.

In a town Wilgy world? I'm unsatisfied with the reasoning on Pyxxy/Scotty, particularly the reasoning on Scotty.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 9:51 am

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 5:15 pm

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 12:42 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 5:51 am @DrWilgy @Roxy Can I hear you two's detailed thoughts on reads/solve/gamestate

I don't really know where your heads are at and id like to get a clearer read on you

There hasn't been much evolution. Falcon was a sleepwalk misyeet I think. Feel that Falcon should've been somewhat threadspewed.

There's one in Pyxxy/Scotty, probably just Pyxxy

There's one in Camilla/Roxy/Jack and that should be solved after we resolve the d1 tomfoolery.

Talk to me about "one in Pyxxy/Scotty." I get the Pyxxy case. I get that Scotty is somewhat antialigned with Pyxxy (and Falcon before he died). I get that there was a post or two from Scotty that were bad and Tutuu really suspected him.

Is that the whole thing? Is there more to it than that?

Cause Pyxxy/Scotty -> if necessary Scotty/Pyxxy is a super convenient yeet for me if there really is a wolf there. We get a second wolf. We have two wolves dead and lots of important eod and interactives to find the last wolf. I think we can win no matter who the third wolf is in that scenario.

But if there are zero wolves in Pyxxy and Scotty? We lose if we misyeet both.

If you're sure there's a wolf there, convince me there's for sure a wolf there.

So, like I'm pretty sure after the Falcon misyeet, we don't have the wiggle room to yeet Scotty. Scotty has had a very townie voice all game and I only reconsider that in a T Pyxxy world.

Re the dif check between them, it's because the Pyxxy CW to a wolf yeet was very real. I think it's hard for me to think that there weren't more wolves involved in the CW than just Porscha, especially due to Rondo voting off wagon was just town.

Further, d1 players that are still around
On CW or target of CW Scotty/Pyxxy
Off wagon Camilla/Prince
Potential bus Alison/Roxy

I do not feel comfortable assessing the off wagon nulls until we get another pelt Unless it's just you/Camilla, especially after being wrong on Rondo. I don't think Roxy or Alison are wolves.

Effectively my PoE is Pyxxy, you, Camilla.

"Actually nm Scotty is town."

Not the best, ya'll.

And the more I think about it (without yet reading Wilgy's explanation), the more I hate the insistence off a wolf in Scotty/Pyxxy. Weak though it may be, the Porscha point I just replied about might be valid. I can see the reason for scumreading Pyxxy. And I can see why you antialign Scotty/Pyxxy. But why always a wolf there? I don't think that's the case. Let's find out.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 9:44 am

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 4:44 pm

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 12:42 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 5:51 am @DrWilgy @Roxy Can I hear you two's detailed thoughts on reads/solve/gamestate

I don't really know where your heads are at and id like to get a clearer read on you

There hasn't been much evolution. Falcon was a sleepwalk misyeet I think. Feel that Falcon should've been somewhat threadspewed.

There's one in Pyxxy/Scotty, probably just Pyxxy

There's one in Camilla/Roxy/Jack and that should be solved after we resolve the d1 tomfoolery.

Why exactly can't it be Pyxxy/Scotty?

I think Pyxxy/Jack is the simplest world but with Falcon/Rondo both villagers it shows that we're not living in the easy world anymore.

Because Porscha was not a wagon without resistance. Every time I've seen that resistance it's due to there being an unpure element in the CW.

Plus Pyxxy flipping W would really explain why Porscha was still gunning for the lhf in spite of the self save vote just being the best option. I really feel hung up on that interaction. Porscha had no reason to call out, you, me or Prince J if they were content on their Pyxxy self pres.

But Porscha barely did this.

Like you can follow Scotty's train of logic on Roxy and you can see where he makes a logical and genuine scumread on her based on her behavior wrt Porscha and then makes a genuine turnaround on it based on agreeing with the meta she points out and then as Roxy goes after Scotty for his incorrect prior scumread on her like an hour or two (I have no idea how many hours, just that it was in the past and Scotty was present with different reads than Roxy was going after him for having), Scotty is just like "keep reading" which makes sense from the perspective of a townie that now townreads Roxy and knows that she will come to more correct conclusions once she catches up. It's the mindset of a townie. It's not defensive or opportunistic or anything.

Contrast Camilla's push on Roxy, which starts with her piggybacking Tutuu suspicion and throwing out a POE of Falcon/Pyxxy/Roxy/Rondo/Falcon (lol double Falcon what does it mean), which contains at most 1 wolf and imo contains 0 wolves, advances to calling Roxy "slimey" for saying Camilla wasn't doing anything when she had real life shit going on (defensive, granted, defensiveness isn't necessarily wolfy), then calls Roxy's readlist too hedgey, then votes Roxy. It's stilted. Constructed. Does not feel like a natural progression but a calculated one. And when Scotty initially turns on his Roxy scumread, Camilla questions it. Scotty comes back being more sure of his read on Roxy and then Camilla drops the whole thing and blames others for not making Roxy's meta clear. Not everything in here is fully wolf motivated but everything fits wolf motivation and nothing fits townie only motivation.

Also in looking back at this, I'm seeing nothing in the Camilla/Wilgy interactions that looks unaligned.

Camilla wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 2:04 am

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 1:33 am I have liked jack's recent solving. Feels thoughtful even if i dont agree with all of it, and forcibly taking roxy and scotty out of his POE would make his life hard and commit him to a very narrow worldview as mafia.

In a W!Jack world then it doesn't really mean much.

If he's W then he needs two MLs and even if his teammate is in Wilgy/Pyxxy then he just needs to mislynch the villager there then take Scotty/Roxy to the F3 with me for the win.

He doesn't even need to re-open the PoE for a win.

I also just want to believe in a Wilgy/Camilla world because Camilla seems desperate to add people to the POE that shouldn't be in it. On D2, that was Roxy. On D4, it's me. All Camilla's solving around these two slots seems illogical and/or desperate.

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 1:26 am

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 7:16 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 6:12 pm

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 6:11 pm @Alison

If he's a wolf then who do you think is his most likely partner?

So far pretty much everyone has been TRing him or giving him a pass which basically mean that if he's W then pretty much none of the PoE is cleared.

probs not scotty/pyxxy given his eagerness to force there today

Probably just roxy or jack

Hmm. But if I believe my townreads, the solve is Wilgy and one of Scotty/Pyxxy.

And indeed, Alison and Camilla voting Wilgy so (granted, it’s easy for Camilla to switch and winnable for her to bus Wilgy) surely not Alison/Wilgy and less likely to be Camilla/Wilgy.

So is Alison right about w!Wilgy but wrong about Wilgy being antialigned w/Scotty/Pyxxy (requires Wilgy to endgame alone, kinda unlikely, or to assume his partner wins the thunderdome…probably exactly Scotty)?

Or is Alison wrong on Wilgy? And if she’s wrong on Wilgy, what other team even makes sense? A reevaluation on Alison/Camilla necessary if Wilgy is town because I’m town, Roxy is town and Scotty and Pyxxy has max 1 wolf. Literally nowhere else for a wolf to exist. (Also, this line of thinking really leans into Wilgy+Jack world from t!Alison’s pov but it can’t be helped.)

why does wolf wilgy flip the coin on his partner winning the dome instead of going "maybe it's not pyx/scotty" to widen the poe like everyone else was?

I'm not really in this world anymore (seeing Scotty as very very likely town) but from the pov of me at the time, I'm agreeing with you.

I'm saying "If Alison is right about w!Wilgy but wrong about him being antialigned with Scotty/Pyxxy, it would require Wilgy to endgame alone or assume his partner wins the dome. I don't think w!Wilgy thinks he will endgame alone so I don't think that's the case. I don't think w!Wilgy assumes his partner, w!Pyxxy, wins the Scotty/Pyxxy dome so I don't think that's the case. Maybe if it's Wilgy+Scotty."

But to your point, if it's Wilgy+Scotty (which I don't think because I think Scotty is town), it would make more sense for Wilgy to not lean into that dome.

And to your point, if it's Wilgy+Pyxxy, it makes even more sense to not lean into that dome.

If POE is Pyxxy/Wilgy/Camilla, it makes more sense to see Wilgy/Camilla as the solve based on this. It's not gonna be based just on this but this could be key.

I’m out of my own poe and replacement or not, recent history or not, I can still outdance the others. If the game has a correct consensus 4 player poe with me in it and it needs a winning 3 player poe, that’s good enough. I’ll carry.

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 12:38 am I see you still haven’t voted, Jack

And I won’t be voting until I take another look at all three of them individually. If you think that makes me more likely wolves with one of them, I can live with that too.

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 11:49 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 11:45 pm If pyxxy is partners with Wilgy, I scratch my head at how Wilgy firmly was in the camp of falcon good, pyxxy bad. I mean, it could just be that falcon was going over regardless so it was just firm-sounding words.

But then he comes into today basically with ‘we need to resolve pyxxy/Scotty, and I think Scotty is good’

Like, what kind of strategy is that from your partner? It’s a bit less believable to me

Yeah, yikes, I think I’m coming around on an angle where I can easily see Wilgy having an agenda, and I’m not as sure with his partner being pyxxy.

[VOTE: drwilgy] aubergine

I kind of don't think that D3's vote actually means much in the long run since on D3 it was pretty much guaranteed that falcon would've gone over.

Wilgy's posts today have been odd but he also hasn't really tried to push Pyxxy at all as I don't remember him casing or putting a vote on them.

Scotty wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 11:52 pm

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 11:49 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 11:45 pm If pyxxy is partners with Wilgy, I scratch my head at how Wilgy firmly was in the camp of falcon good, pyxxy bad. I mean, it could just be that falcon was going over regardless so it was just firm-sounding words.

But then he comes into today basically with ‘we need to resolve pyxxy/Scotty, and I think Scotty is good’

Like, what kind of strategy is that from your partner? It’s a bit less believable to me

Yeah, yikes, I think I’m coming around on an angle where I can easily see Wilgy having an agenda, and I’m not as sure with his partner being pyxxy.

[VOTE: drwilgy] aubergine

I kind of don't think that D3's vote actually means much in the long run since on D3 it was pretty much guaranteed that falcon would've gone over.

Wilgy's posts today have been odd but he also hasn't really tried to push Pyxxy at all as I don't remember him casing or putting a vote on them.

Actually, Wilgy voted for pyxxy in thread about 12 hours ago, but didn’t vote in the poll.

And gunning for pyxxy is basically all Wilgy has done today

I should stop replying to single posts while Scotty goes through and finds new evidence. So now Wilgy and Pyxxy without Camilla is a possibility. Yeah, I’m going over all of this myself tomorrow.

But the most important bit of all of this is that it’s reinforcing my town Scotty feeling. I don’t think wolf Scotty puts in this effort and finds contradicting evidence. It’s the opposite of agenda. Frustrating he has me as a wolf but taking him out of the poe entirely is very good for the gamestate.

Scotty wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 11:45 pm If pyxxy is partners with Wilgy, I scratch my head at how Wilgy firmly was in the camp of falcon good, pyxxy bad. I mean, it could just be that falcon was going over regardless so it was just firm-sounding words.

But then he comes into today basically with ‘we need to resolve pyxxy/Scotty, and I think Scotty is good’

Like, what kind of strategy is that from your partner? It’s a bit less believable to me

Yeah, yikes, I think I’m coming around on an angle where I can easily see Wilgy having an agenda, and I’m not as sure with his partner being pyxxy.

[VOTE: drwilgy] aubergine

Mmm. Yeah okay.

Then the question fmpov is if Camilla works better with Wilgy or Pyxxy. It would be convenient if the answer is “Wilgy” cause that’s just easier but that’s probably a tomorrow question.

Scotty wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 11:37 pm I know Camilla said mafia doesn’t vote for their RB and bounce, but I just painstakingly read through D1 again…this is what I see.

I first voted for pyxxy early.
Porscha ‘parks’ her vote on pyxxy at the 24 hour mark:

Porscha wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 5:01 pm i'm parking vote on pyxxy until he play game

Porscha wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 5:07 pm google says I have to vote her in a mafia game as punishment so if pyxxy ever comes back today then you all know what I am doing next

so here, I think she is referring to tutuu, her pet clown.

Here’s the rub- pyxxy DOES show up and makes posts and reads, and Porscha NEVER mentions pyxxy again, or even interacts with pyxxy. That’s bonkers to me.

Porscha made her last post at 1:20p, almost 4 hours before eod.
At this time, Wilgy had just voted for her a few hours before, in an apparent 3-3 porscha/Wilgy tie, to make it 4-3. Tutuu tied it up again an hour before EoD.

It wasn’t until then that pyxxy showed up to make a flurry of desperate posts, where he ultimately (almost begrudgingly) self preserved onto Porscha.

So in terms of optics:
-Porscha seemingly forgot about her pyxxy vote, or else made a conscious decision not to come back to it, but at the same time, Porscha was in the lead 4-3 when she bounced. If pyxxy is her partner, what difference would voting elsewhere accomplish?
-Wilgy, as his 3rd post and with no reasoning, votes for Porscha. If pyxxy is bad, Wilgy voting for Porscha almost takes away all cred I was giving him for that vote.

This all just further reaffirms that I think pyxxy is bad. And if pyxxy is bad, Wilgy totally fits.

Oof I need to get out of my tunnel. I’m definitely in a tunnel right now and am having trouble not just confbiasing myself

This is what I was wanting Camella to give me.

Wilgy/Pyxxy/Camilla is a winning poe.

Scotty wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 11:53 pm I currently see a world of jack/wilgy

Him first.

Scotty wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 11:06 pm My favorite part about reading back the last few pages is how in depth jack has been and bringing a bunch of original thoughts to the table

And still not voting

Scotty wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 11:07 pm [VOTE: Jack] aubergine

Are these posts related? Go back and read any of my town games and you'll see that I average like 1 or 2 votes a phase and don't vote until I either am sure of who I want dead or until it's getting near EOD.

Alternative joke: that’s what she….said?

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:31 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:30 pm

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:24 pm

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:22 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:19 pm

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:09 pm Jack/Scotty fits in better as teammates with Wilgy than Pyxxy. I don't think Pyxxy/Wilgy would spend the entire game trying to hellbus each other like this, tbh.

Most likely Jack as I liked Scotty's paranoia on me while Jack's push on me kind of just feels like he's piggy-backing on Roxy's paranoia than actually doing anything to move the game-state forward.

Lul

Classic wolf Jack tactic. Sheep paranoia of low end poster from two days ago.

Moving to a three player poe is moving the gamestate forward. You just don’t like where I’m moving it.

What about Alison/Scotty/Roxy?

There's been very little suspicion on me and you only started turning on me the moment the latter two started to do so.

Suspicion on them, as I meant the three ones. Why me over Scotty/Alison since we've basically been roughly in the same tier until Roxy/Scotty began tinfoiling me.

It’s not about tiers. It’s about Scotty and Alison doing things I expect Scotty and Alison to do as townies and of the three of you, you’ve got the wolfiest reactions, specifically towards Roxy when contrasted with Alison and Scotty and towards me when contrasted with Alison.

I want you to go deeper here.

If Scotty/Alison were wolves then how would you really expect them to act?

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:29 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:27 pm

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:22 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:19 pm

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:09 pm Jack/Scotty fits in better as teammates with Wilgy than Pyxxy. I don't think Pyxxy/Wilgy would spend the entire game trying to hellbus each other like this, tbh.

Most likely Jack as I liked Scotty's paranoia on me while Jack's push on me kind of just feels like he's piggy-backing on Roxy's paranoia than actually doing anything to move the game-state forward.

Lul

Classic wolf Jack tactic. Sheep paranoia of low end poster from two days ago.

Moving to a three player poe is moving the gamestate forward. You just don’t like where I’m moving it.

What about Alison/Scotty/Roxy?

There's been very little suspicion on me and you only started turning on me the moment the latter two started to do so.

Town/ProbablyTown/Town

I just like fifty posted in a row and you’re accusing me of sheeping the reads others? There’s no others around…

I meant that you only became suspicious of me after the threadstate put me in the PoE such as with Scotty and Roxy being paranoid of me.

Not something that exclusively comes from wolves but yeah.

Fiddle faddle and rot. Roxy has only posted once today and she was like “I need to sort Jack.” The idea that I waited until Roxy pushed you into the poe is absurd.

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:24 pm

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:22 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:19 pm

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:09 pm Jack/Scotty fits in better as teammates with Wilgy than Pyxxy. I don't think Pyxxy/Wilgy would spend the entire game trying to hellbus each other like this, tbh.

Most likely Jack as I liked Scotty's paranoia on me while Jack's push on me kind of just feels like he's piggy-backing on Roxy's paranoia than actually doing anything to move the game-state forward.

Lul

Classic wolf Jack tactic. Sheep paranoia of low end poster from two days ago.

Moving to a three player poe is moving the gamestate forward. You just don’t like where I’m moving it.

What about Alison/Scotty/Roxy?

There's been very little suspicion on me and you only started turning on me the moment the latter two started to do so.

Suspicion on them, as I meant the three ones. Why me over Scotty/Alison since we've basically been roughly in the same tier until Roxy/Scotty began tinfoiling me.

It’s not about tiers. It’s about Scotty and Alison doing things I expect Scotty and Alison to do as townies and of the three of you, you’ve got the wolfiest reactions, specifically towards Roxy when contrasted with Alison and Scotty and towards me when contrasted with Alison.

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:22 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:19 pm

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:09 pm Jack/Scotty fits in better as teammates with Wilgy than Pyxxy. I don't think Pyxxy/Wilgy would spend the entire game trying to hellbus each other like this, tbh.

Most likely Jack as I liked Scotty's paranoia on me while Jack's push on me kind of just feels like he's piggy-backing on Roxy's paranoia than actually doing anything to move the game-state forward.

Lul

Classic wolf Jack tactic. Sheep paranoia of low end poster from two days ago.

Moving to a three player poe is moving the gamestate forward. You just don’t like where I’m moving it.

What about Alison/Scotty/Roxy?

There's been very little suspicion on me and you only started turning on me the moment the latter two started to do so.

Town/ProbablyTown/Town

I just like fifty posted in a row and you’re accusing me of sheeping the reads others? There’s no others around…

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:09 pm Jack/Scotty fits in better as teammates with Wilgy than Pyxxy. I don't think Pyxxy/Wilgy would spend the entire game trying to hellbus each other like this, tbh.

Most likely Jack as I liked Scotty's paranoia on me while Jack's push on me kind of just feels like he's piggy-backing on Roxy's paranoia than actually doing anything to move the game-state forward.

Lul

Classic wolf Jack tactic. Sheep paranoia of low end poster from two days ago.

Moving to a three player poe is moving the gamestate forward. You just don’t like where I’m moving it.

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 8:55 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 8:54 pm

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 8:53 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 8:49 pm My current solve is Wilgy and Camilla. But that’s like a fancy pants threadstate+poe read. Pyxxy is still a possibility but I kinda think that if the wolf team is dead Porscha and non impactful Wilgy, like at what point does Pyxxy drop the gd gimmick? Probably earlier. I know this is easy to fake but still.

...didn't your previous solve include Pyxxy?

What happened with it?

You’re quoting it.

Who's more likely?

Which team fits better? Me/Pyxxy, Me/Wilgy, or Wilgy/Pyxxy?

Dunno.

Camilla wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 8:53 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 01, 2023 8:49 pm My current solve is Wilgy and Camilla. But that’s like a fancy pants threadstate+poe read. Pyxxy is still a possibility but I kinda think that if the wolf team is dead Porscha and non impactful Wilgy, like at what point does Pyxxy drop the gd gimmick? Probably earlier. I know this is easy to fake but still.

...didn't your previous solve include Pyxxy?

What happened with it?

You’re quoting it.

Porscha wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 10:30 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 9:48 pm

Porscha wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 9:46 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 7:44 pm I have not reviewed the linked game in detail but if it is true that Porscha is no longer volume polarized then it she is actually kind of scummy... the noise to signal ratio is really bad

it isn't my fault that half the people who signed up aren't playing and the other half are actually roleplaying the title of the game.

Who do you think is mafia?

I dont care if pyxxy dies the most but until wilgy / camilla / falcon make any real posts it's hard to sort the people who are posting

Does Porscha say this if I’m right?

Probably.

The natural state of things. Jack talking to himself.

Gah, I love postcapless games.

My current solve is Wilgy and Camilla. But that’s like a fancy pants threadstate+poe read. Pyxxy is still a possibility but I kinda think that if the wolf team is dead Porscha and non impactful Wilgy, like at what point does Pyxxy drop the gd gimmick? Probably earlier. I know this is easy to fake but still.

Alison wrote: ↑Sat May 27, 2023 12:32 am I'm tired and sick and distracted for IRL reasons so I won't post by post react but my general sentiment upon reading is that people are putting on tinfoil hats way too quickly after a d1 pelt

Porscha was caught early and went down without a fight. She complained about afks. The mafia team is prolly not in control and likely have at least one if not two passive players in it.

Everyone has different views on who to trust but thats fine. Just look at the people with no compelling reasons to trust them and play a straight poe game. Wagoning people like tutuu is trolling hard

Alison wrote: ↑Sat May 27, 2023 12:34 am Falcon and rondo have no reason to be trusted

Prince J has the "porscha would have pinged him to play in wolf chat" but maybe he was genuinely busy IRL and couldnt regardless

Just kill in one of these ig

Alison wrote: ↑Sat May 27, 2023 12:35 am I started off suspecting zenon but dont think shes the right kill d2, even if shes mafia shes townsiding right now and has a partner to be caught

roxy is bleeding town even if her reads/playstyle are questionable

Alison wrote: ↑Sat May 27, 2023 12:36 am It could be wilgy. Maybe he just didnt take credit for the bus because he was genuinely afk and didnt feel like playing

Alison wrote: ↑Sat May 27, 2023 12:36 am I still think pyxxy is townie

The list is almost entirely wrong but I still love this series of posts and it makes me want to kill Wilgy because the idea is right but the players except Wilgy are just town.

And I don’t think it’s Scotty, either. Based on this and Scotty’s posts wrt his turnaround on Roxy D2.

Camilla wrote: ↑Sat May 27, 2023 12:07 am @~Prince J~ WAKE THE HELL UP AND COME POST YOU LITTLE FISH NUGGET OR ELSE I'LL DUNK ON YOU SO HARD THAT EVEN YOUR GREAT-GRANDCHILDREN WON'T BE ABLE TO PLAY BASKETBALL FROM THE PTSD I'LL GIVE YOU!

tutuu wrote: ↑Sat May 27, 2023 12:04 am

Camilla wrote: ↑Fri May 26, 2023 11:59 pm

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri May 26, 2023 11:57 pm Maybe if we all say Prince J three times while holding a candle and looking into a bathroom mirror in the dark, he’ll come out to play

Prince J

Prince J

Prince J

Unleash your secret killer move !

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Fri May 26, 2023 6:32 pm Yeah, I don't see Aliso/tutuu/neon not containing a wolf

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Fri May 26, 2023 6:32 pm [VOTE: tutuu] aubergine

Zenon wrote: ↑Fri May 26, 2023 6:34 pm If it does its Alison