The Syndicate

Marmot wrote: ↑Fri Dec 08, 2017 11:53 am
speedchuck wrote: ↑Fri Dec 08, 2017 11:40 am I'm assuming that the "learn truth on one of these occasions" means he is fed a lie on the other occasion? Marmot
Also how would the 3P show up for cBob's check?

That's an accurate assumption. One of his checks will be true, one will be false.

What is a 3P?

Third party. Mars hill.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 08, 2017 11:43 am It's true that it could be due to no posts, but this is contrast to his earlier "No reads on Dom, Wilgy, INH, sprit."

Did anything really warrant a change there? Out of us four why did only INH get the "uhhhhhh?" (I promise I'm not jealous or anything... It's not like I wanted Cbob's uhhhhh.)

I mean, INH is the only one with ZERO posts. None whatsoever. GTH forces you to look and make a gut read. There was nothing on INH to influence his read at all, especially before any flips.

It's a fair theory, but I buy the sloonei one.

colonialbob wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 8:41 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 3:47 pm Sloonei tinfoil is definitely interesting (especially considering his Mesk vote switch that saved jay), but I thought that pretty much all of the theories as to how he survived Day 2 involved him being town. Unless... wait, there is one possibility. Hold on, I'm rethinking everything I had in mind for Jack and Sloonei and recalculating.... hmm I'll have to think about this more, it's really confusing. Bottom line is I think the chances of Sloonei being bad are very, very, very slim.
Yeah Sloonei tinfoiling is understandable (I don't get why he refuses to consider Mal at all either, Jack), but it's a waste of time. I'm firm town on him.

If I were in cBob's position, I would have checked Sloonei too.

I'm assuming that the "learn truth on one of these occasions" means he is fed a lie on the other occasion? [mention]Marmot[/mention]
Also how would the 3P show up for cBob's check?

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 08, 2017 11:32 am Thanks for this Speedchuck.

Something that caught my eye was the "INH/BLP - uuuuuuh good." To your knowledge, did Cbob ever attempt or push an INH lynch?
"Mount Elbrus - Twice in the game, Elbrus may peek at another player’s alignment, though he will only learn the truth on one of these occasions."

It is possible that Elbrus checked INH but responded with "uuuuuuh" because he didn't know if he could trust his double edged sword result.

Linki - Interesting, I can toss that theory a bone. How was Cbob's interactions with Sloonei before and after the JJJ lynch?

I think the uuuhhhh is due to no posts.

For the sloonei theory:
#1: Sloonei's actual votes looked bad leading up to the JJJ lynch.
#2: Sloonei was after cBob, and cBob probably would want to know whether he should send suspicion in return.
#3: cBob has a good check after JJJ gets lynched, and after that night, I don't think he EVER suspected sloonei for anything. Still verifying, but I think this is it.

Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Dec 08, 2017 11:28 am "I mean heck Sloonei voted with JJJ and I'm almost positive they're not w/w"

Sloonei confirmed town. Bob either got a good check on both, or a bad check on both.

. . . Probably so. Yeah. Good catch.

Please offer your thoughts. Use my shortlist if you're too lazy to ISO cbob.

I think this makes Kylemii and Sig look worse.

On the other hand, the lack of conviction leads me to believe that cbob ended up with town checks and figured out that he ended up with town checks.

Shortlist of Cbob's early day reads, lynch reactions, and stuff. This is not comprehensive at all, but these are the places I'd hide my checks.

colonialbob wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2017 6:00 pm Sorry, what with family time I don't really have the ability to go through and make good cases or long posts. Butt I'm following as best I can.

Reads (mostly gut):

Daisy
Speedchuck
Epi
Sloonei
Quin
JJJ
nutella
DDL
Eloh
Kyle
Mesk
Long Con
Jack
Sig

No reads on Dom, Wilgy, INH, sprit

Start of D2. Sig is cBob's scummiest read. Like, literally the worst. He immediately votes for Sig. (Keep in mind, he can't possibly know if his check is a truth or lie at this point. But 50-50 shot is pretty decent.)

colonialbob wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:13 pm As of now I'm probably voting into jack/LC/speedchuck. But I've been relatively unplugged for a few days so I want to go back and do some rereading.

Beginning of D3. If cBob has used both of his checks at this point, and gotten a possible scumread, he may be disguising it in here.

Cbob's D3 GTH:
JOHEART - bad
NUTELLA - good
DRWILGY - good
SY/DNYA - bad
SIG ----- bad
EPINOSS - good
SLOONEI - good
DDLUFFY - good
COL.BOB - supatown
MP7/JJJ - good
LONGCON - good
MESK514 - bad
INH/BLP - uuuuuuh good
SPDAISY - good
DOM ----- bad
ELOHCIN - good
KYLEMII - good
SPCHUCK - bad
QUIN ---- good

I'm inclined to believe that, by D4, cBob would have used his two checks. If nothing else, because he was facing lynch pressure from Sloonei.

D4 starts with

colonialbob wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 12:25 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 10:10 am I don't think J is bad with Dunya or Quin.

Bad Jimmy and bad Quin don't team up to save bad Dom. That's really dangerous for little return, given Dom has been inactive.

I still think Wuin is good.
Disagree. The first death being a mafia death is very bad thing for mafia. Bad Quin has cover from pushing after lasagne from the beginning, plus it's easier to justify votes swapping around in a CFD type EOD. I mean heck Sloonei voted with JJJ and I'm almost positive they're not w/w. I think JJJ/Quin/Dom w/w/w is still very much on the table.

(Plus little return isn't necessarily true. He could be Sutter Buttes, or Gwendol Wreakin's kill might be special in some way. And if his teammates can submit an action for him, doubly so.)

colonialbob wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 12:28 pm Kylemii

I didn't like his push on Jack, I don't feel like he's solving, and I don't want to tunnel in on JJJ this early in the phase.

Thoughts after the JJJ lynch:

colonialbob wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:19 pm Thoughts before I'm out the rest of the day:
I'm almost positive one of the people who voted JJJ after me is mafia. Tinfoiling Jack real hard right now for this push on Sloonei.

Lean town on dunya. I think teammate JJJ is smart enough to not be the only vote on somebody with her.

One of Eloh/mal/LC is also likely mafia. Don't need to elaborate on the first two, Jack/LC feel slightly w/w but the D1 agreement is over the top if so.

colonialbob wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:21 pm Also feel pretty good about everybody on JJJ before me, although speed gets the least bump up because self-preservation. Still he's not atop my suspect list any longer.

You know what I'm doing with JJJ's ISOs? Totally ignoring them. Way too WIFOMy for me to get any real info.

Cbob votes for Kylemii on D5.

There is not a single person in this game that I can trust is town.

Epi was the only one, and he's gone.

dunya wrote: ↑Thu Dec 07, 2017 5:41 pm sorry, I have terrible nausea and stomach pains so I wont be around today as previously indicated. see you all tomorrow (if I dont die)

Don't die!

Kylemii wrote: ↑Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:17 pm
Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:05 am
dunya wrote: ↑Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:00 am I'm not actually thinking that, I'm just debunking any fool proof logic with "there was 5 votes on Quin...why did we stop"
That was not an attempt to "foolproof" anything.

That was a question. And I'm asking it to everyone:

Why did we stop?
this is actually a really good question that's been bugging me. we haven't followed up on a lynch attempt once.

Malakim.

Quin wrote: ↑Thu Dec 07, 2017 8:24 am
Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Thu Dec 07, 2017 7:45 am Wolves are Quin, Kyle and Eloh.
Me and my two biggest suspects for the majority of the game are all teammates? Nah.

Quin, what do you think of Wilgy/Kyle/Eloh.

Better yet, Sloonei/Kyle/Eloh

Kylemii wrote: ↑Thu Dec 07, 2017 12:07 am Alright, hey what's up, I just experienced every single human emotion all at once. How are you guys? Gotta go catch up.

Bad break up?

Elohcin wrote: ↑Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:10 am
Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Thu Dec 07, 2017 8:45 am I don't need new theories.

We were lynching Quin last night. There were 5 votes on him.

Why did we stop, and why can't we come back?
Okay...still sitting and reading with cup #2. I want to carch up!

This is kind of how I feel. We talk about lynching someone, start voting, the votes trickle elsewhere, and we never come back to our original suspicion. Why is this?

Because we stupid.

I don't even think the little mountains are responsible.

Thread is too dang big.

I'm mostly gone for the day. GL.

Quin's genuine-ness is getting him in trouble. As usual. Happened in Phenon too, I think.

Lack of motivation I can understand. He probably lacks motivation for the same reason as me. Or, at least, close to it.

Caught up.

Quin is 80% likely to be town in my estimation. I have changed my vote accordingly.

Voting Cbob. Haven't been around. Sorry. Was sermon-delivering tonight. I think it's probably one of cBob and Quin are town, and it is weird how the suspicion on quin runs amok while suspish on cbob does nothing for dayz.

I may or may not catch up tonight.

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 7:08 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 5:42 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 5:32 pm Are we talking about the same post here?
Actually no. No we are not. Epi's later post in which he voted Quin is about Sig. You should read it.
It's the same post, he just analyses what JJJ said about sig for a bit, then votes Quin for going after sig?

Ah. I assumed it wasn't the same post because you cut the end off.

[mention]Epignosis[/mention] We're stupid. Come in here and clarify your read of Quin and your read of Sig.

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 5:32 pm Are we talking about the same post here?

Actually no. No we are not. Epi's later post in which he voted Quin is about Sig. You should read it.

Marmot wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 4:54 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:39 am
dunya wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:31 am (but everyone thinks Everest is lame whereas I think Everest has the power to change a vote and I believe Everest was responsible for Day 1 no lynch -- so to devalue it is silly).
Well, in a sense, Everest itself has vanilla town value. When Everest dies, it's vote passes town to the next highest living mountain. So killing Everest is pointless. The vote will stay as long as town lives.

Which... raises some questions.
Marmot
With town having an extra vote, will the game go to town if we get it down to 1 town 1 scum? Usually scum would overrun because they have a kill and the vote is deadlocked. But whatever townie is left would have 2 votes...
If the game gets to a state where there is only one possible outcome, the game will end immediately and the winner(s) declared.

The entire Everest ability passes down when it dies, not just the vote.

Cool, thanks.

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 4:29 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 3:38 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 3:21 pm I liked Epi's thoughts on sig, in addition to my own, so I'll cast a vote there right now.

colonialbob wrote: ↑Mon Nov 20, 2017 8:24 pm Speed with the sudden entrance. I like it.

Voting LC for now.

Hey, let me in on the joke!

I'm pretty sure Epi's post was pro-Sig. Like in cbob's post there, where I was pro-LC and then he voted LC. It's amusing when people say they like a post that defends someone and then votes for the defended.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 3:38 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 3:21 pm I liked Epi's thoughts on sig, in addition to my own, so I'll cast a vote there right now.

colonialbob wrote: ↑Mon Nov 20, 2017 8:24 pm Speed with the sudden entrance. I like it.

Voting LC for now.

This game has more content than any game I've ever played and nobody wants to read it.

dunya wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 3:29 pm I think it stupid of me to start with cbob (who I think is town) and not try to look into speed (who I think is scum).

I have no idea right now who I'm voting for. I need good cases made for me that I can agree with.

I told you to do me first. You can't handle me and cBob at the same time, and I figured he'd tire you out.

Good post though. Makes me want to vote sloonei Quin maybe.

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 3:21 pm I liked Epi's thoughts on sig, in addition to my own, so I'll cast a vote there right now.

colonialbob wrote: ↑Mon Nov 20, 2017 8:24 pm Speed with the sudden entrance. I like it.

Voting LC for now.

Missing kills:
N1 - almost everyone was here
N2 - went on for like five days
N5 - INH and Sig completely inactive, all other living players around enough to handle the kill. 3 Scum left unless Jack was scum vig kill which is very unlikely because it would mean a missing mafia kill on N4.

I really don't think inactivity is the problem with the kills. Scumteam is only inactive if JJJ/Jack/Sig/INH is our scumteam. And if that's the case (assuming Jack got vigkilled), then we have an extra nightkill on N4 that didn't happen while Jack was alive to submit it.

linki: eehhhh I guess inactivity could be less absolute, but come on

Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 12:05 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:24 am
dunya wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:07 am
speedchuck wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 12:18 pm Matterhorn, K2, and Elbrus are the most powerful town roles IMO.
why do you think K2 is one of the most important town roles?
To me, most of the town roles are pretty bad. Extra votes or missing votes, Malakim's role being able to copy the higher roles if he manages to target them, etc.
Where does the role say anything about managing to target them?

Assumption of mine, yes.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:24 am K2 gives us an opinion that we 100% know is a town opinion, and that we can take at face value. It is as useful as the person using it can make it, disregarding other votes and random targeting. It's not a game-changer, but it's constantly useful and usable.
The longer that role is alive, the more dangerous it becomes.

Agreed.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:24 amStopping a lynch is useless.
Not at all.

The town's one weapon is their lynch. It is their best method of obtaining information. A role that stops the lynch prevents information gain, gives scum a free kill, and isn't necessarily even protecting town. I consider it to be more likely to do ill than good.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:24 amPermanent BTSC is good, but the mountains have to hope they get lucky to get it.
The same comment regarding K2 applies here.

Agreed. But scum is likely to accidentally kill one of those roles. And as soon as one dies, the other is useless. Independence > dependence.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:24 amSurviving is good, but at the point I posted this, I assumed that the survival was over. And besides, I was talking about who mafia would target. The survival isn't a role that matters until it is targeted. It doesn't threaten scum actively.
Would you consider a protector a powerful civilian role? I would. Survival roles are basically like a protector automatically gets his target right. That's even more powerful.

Protectors can nullify the scum kill multiple times. Survival roles only come into effect when scum targets them... which doesn't make them a priority for scum to target. They are just there. When scum hits them, it'll take two tries to kill them.

Not going to change their priority, which was the original context that I was being asked about.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:24 amKilling a player that helped lynch you is more likely to result in 2 town death than a real vengeance against mafia.
So are lynches. By that thinking, we should never lynch anybody.

Lynches are reasoned by a comittee. Killing a player that tried to lynch you is an individual decision, and thus less well-advised. So this is basically a conditional vig kill that can't be used on an inactive.
I will concede that it can be pretty good if used well. Still conditional and easily misused.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:24 am Kenya is a vig, which is cool, but it's very easy to misdirect. It would be in my top list if it weren't for the chances downgrading over time. I'll bet it tried to kill INH or someone at some point.
How is it very easy to misdirect?

As above, an individually-reasoned kill... is I guess only influenced by town, from one perspective. All vigs are easy to misdirect. The power of this role depends on how quickly it degrades, I suppose.

If the mafia are inactive and only JJJ was active, then he may have killed Spacedaisy, and Kenya could have killed JackofHearts, who was quite suspected. The nightkills are both written in the passive voice, and I have little reason to believe Kenya targeted Spacedaisy. I have some reason to think Kenya targeted JackofHearts, which leaves open the possibility that Jack was indeed bad, but again, we must regard the "if" here, given three deathless Nights. If Jack is bad, he would have to be the unluckiest mafia member I have ever seen.

I didn't even think about this. Hum. Unlikely, but worth considering.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:24 am Insanifying has the targeting problem, and then it's just insanifying. If you insanify mafia, it just gives them an excuse to be silent. If you insanify town . . . Insanifying should be a scum role. Really.
More or less agreed.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:24 am Blanc might be good. I don't know what it means to take a look at 3rd party. The other two roles are a switch, which is situational, and another role that inhibits the lynch, which is meh. We weren't going to lynch Epi anyway.
If anything, removing someone from the poll lets everyone else know Blanc is alive and well.

Fair enough.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:24 am K2 isn't as powerful as an info role. It isn't as powerful as a reliable vig, a desperado, or a gifter of some type. But it's active, not passive, and it works without dependence on lucky targets. It provides town with a reliably honest viewpoint. I'd put it up there.
But hey, I'm weird like that.

linki: is that something you could see someone doing to their teammate? It's an easily waived... accusation? Is it even an accusation?
I'm not altogether sure why you spent an entire post lamenting your perceived lack of civilian firepower.

For one thing, I don't agree with that. When you compare what the civilians are working with to a vanilla killer, a blocker, a -1 vote that has to be called ahead of time, and a singular self-protection each Night, I'd say the civilians are well-equipped.

Pah. This is a role madness game. You can't give Civs all powerful roles and expect to find balance. So we have some weaker roles than normal, and that puts K2 near the top. Which is the point I was trying to make. K2 is a great role.

Of course we're well-equipped, despite our lack of inforoles. 3 nightkills have been blocked (probably, could be 4, could maybe be less if inactivity), two players might have BTSC townfirms by now, one fellow might have an inferred cop check, and so on. I was only justifying that K2 is better than most might think, and IMO one of the best roles we have.

dunya wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:49 am
speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:39 am
dunya wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:31 am (but everyone thinks Everest is lame whereas I think Everest has the power to change a vote and I believe Everest was responsible for Day 1 no lynch -- so to devalue it is silly).
Well, in a sense, Everest itself has vanilla town value. When Everest dies, it's vote passes town to the next highest living mountain. So killing Everest is pointless. The vote will stay as long as town lives.

Which... raises some questions.
Marmot
With town having an extra vote, will the game go to town if we get it down to 1 town 1 scum? Usually scum would overrun because they have a kill and the vote is deadlocked. But whatever townie is left would have 2 votes...
I must have misunderstood. I thought if Everest dies, it'll go to K2/next highest mountain. I had no idea if K2/next highest mountain dies as well it gets passed on again.

Uhhhh
Good point I might have inferred that. Marmot will answer all maybe.

dunya wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:31 am (but everyone thinks Everest is lame whereas I think Everest has the power to change a vote and I believe Everest was responsible for Day 1 no lynch -- so to devalue it is silly).

Well, in a sense, Everest itself has vanilla town value. When Everest dies, it's vote passes town to the next highest living mountain. So killing Everest is pointless. The vote will stay as long as town lives.

Which... raises some questions.
[mention]Marmot[/mention]
With town having an extra vote, will the game go to town if we get it down to 1 town 1 scum? Usually scum would overrun because they have a kill and the vote is deadlocked. But whatever townie is left would have 2 votes...

dunya wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:07 am
speedchuck wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 12:18 pm Matterhorn, K2, and Elbrus are the most powerful town roles IMO.
why do you think K2 is one of the most important town roles?

To me, most of the town roles are pretty bad. Extra votes or missing votes, Malakim's role being able to copy the higher roles if he manages to target them, etc.

K2 gives us an opinion that we 100% know is a town opinion, and that we can take at face value. It is as useful as the person using it can make it, disregarding other votes and random targeting. It's not a game-changer, but it's constantly useful and usable.

Stopping a lynch is useless.
Permanent BTSC is good, but the mountains have to hope they get lucky to get it.
Surviving is good, but at the point I posted this, I assumed that the survival was over. And besides, I was talking about who mafia would target. The survival isn't a role that matters until it is targeted. It doesn't threaten scum actively.
Killing a player that helped lynch you is more likely to result in 2 town death than a real vengeance against mafia.
Kenya is a vig, which is cool, but it's very easy to misdirect. It would be in my top list if it weren't for the chances downgrading over time. I'll bet it tried to kill INH or someone at some point.
Insanifying has the targeting problem, and then it's just insanifying. If you insanify mafia, it just gives them an excuse to be silent. If you insanify town . . . Insanifying should be a scum role. Really.
Blanc might be good. I don't know what it means to take a look at 3rd party. The other two roles are a switch, which is situational, and another role that inhibits the lynch, which is meh. We weren't going to lynch Epi anyway.

K2 isn't as powerful as an info role. It isn't as powerful as a reliable vig, a desperado, or a gifter of some type. But it's active, not passive, and it works without dependence on lucky targets. It provides town with a reliably honest viewpoint. I'd put it up there.
But hey, I'm weird like that.

linki: is that something you could see someone doing to their teammate? It's an easily waived... accusation? Is it even an accusation?

dunya wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:00 am
speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 10:49 am
dunya wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:45 am if both sig and INH were on the scum team, and both inactive, malakim would have replaced in for scum for sure. It's definitely one and not the other or maybe neither.

But let's talk about speedchuck and colonialbob.
You said you had reasons for me to be scum and Cbob town. I think we're still waiting on those?
I'm sorry, I'm slow, but I promise I'm working on it. If for nothing else, I want a clear stance on how I feel about both of you. Clear and inductive, rather than basing it more in instinct.

It's been hard going through so many posts and trying to read through Sloonei's posts omfg. Don't envy me.

If I envied you, I'd be the one doing it. I don't even want to ISO myself.

[mention]Quin[/mention], why vote INH over sig?

dunya wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:45 am if both sig and INH were on the scum team, and both inactive, malakim would have replaced in for scum for sure. It's definitely one and not the other or maybe neither.

But let's talk about speedchuck and colonialbob.

You said you had reasons for me to be scum and Cbob town. I think we're still waiting on those?

Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:42 am
Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 8:17 am
Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2017 12:48 amYAWN
You know you're full of shit when Epi thinks your linguistics argument is boring.
I agree, speedchuck is full of shit.

I wasn't arguing friggin linguistics. There was nothing linguistic about my arguments.

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 11:51 pm I didn't bring up suspicion of nutella. My post wasn't about suspecting nutella.

This is exactly my point. If not that, then what was it about??

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 7:59 pm Can anyone tell me why I have a bad read on Sloonei? I want to see what you think.

I dunno. I listed like 5 reasons in my recent posts. I have a whole tinfoil Sloonei theory.

linki: I'm pretty sure what I'm doing in this game right now is not tunnelling.

Ah, well see, the difference is that I was up-front about it. I disliked the WAY LC made his point, not the point itself. And I outright called it suspicious instead of hemming and hawwing about it. And I don't, I hope, seem as fake and concerned about appearances as LC did.

You're confusing the point with the tone of the point. LC can suspect nutella if he wants to. But he should be more bold and less passive/hidey.

Though . . . are you suspecting me for my 'fake' reaction to LC's 'fake' reaction to nutella's 'fake' reaction?

dunya wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 5:29 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 5:00 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:47 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:41 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:37 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:28 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:25 pm

I feel like you are treating this additional information, which could be a crucial piece to solving the game and/or nailing down Sloonei's alignment, as a negative. Sure, lynching a Civ is not good, but this knowledge might help us win.
eeegeeggggghhhhh

And do you consider this to be possibly alignment indicative?
For whom?
nutella
Well, since you brought it up, it moves the needle two hairs from 'Town' to 'Scum' for nutella, based on the idea that a reaction that doesn't seem quite right to me evokes feelings of possible fakery.
You brought it up bruh. And I didn't like how you did it.

Framing suspicion in a way that town can pick up on, but that doesn't state it directly. I don't like that.
And then nutella's post was obviously lamenting that we got a town flip rather than scum. In most games, a town flip is worst scenario. This game is different, with lynched failing almost half the time, but it's NOT GOOD, even as you said.
And then the way you presented the obversavion, making sure to place yourself as a part of 'us' and reemphasize the bright side and the town win condition.

These weak bits come together to make me feel like you're trying too hard to be the nonchalant townie and fly under the radar while casting shade on nutella.

So, no, I don't like your post. If you had said "no, not alignment indicative" I would have assumed that it was just a post for the sake of posting. But the way you framed your suspicion is sleazy and suspicious.

are you being intentionally hypocritical in this post?

I found LC's triggered alarms not without cause, just as I appreciated Sloonei even doubting DDL's sincerity in his Bob case (which he's been begging us all for).

I am not self-aware. What do you mean by this?

LC Sloonei Dunya JJJ are wolves. (Somebody reality check me, I know I'm tinfoiling REALLY HARD in this game)

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:47 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:41 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:37 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:28 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:25 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 3:57 pm Well shit. That result is disappointing. And specifically the Chimborazo flip kills a few of my theories on what happened on day 2... but I think there are still more sloonei-civ explanations that make more sense than sloonei-bad ones.
I feel like you are treating this additional information, which could be a crucial piece to solving the game and/or nailing down Sloonei's alignment, as a negative. Sure, lynching a Civ is not good, but this knowledge might help us win.
eeegeeggggghhhhh

And do you consider this to be possibly alignment indicative?
For whom?
nutella
Well, since you brought it up, it moves the needle two hairs from 'Town' to 'Scum' for nutella, based on the idea that a reaction that doesn't seem quite right to me evokes feelings of possible fakery.

You brought it up bruh. And I didn't like how you did it.

Framing suspicion in a way that town can pick up on, but that doesn't state it directly. I don't like that.
And then nutella's post was obviously lamenting that we got a town flip rather than scum. In most games, a town flip is worst scenario. This game is different, with lynched failing almost half the time, but it's NOT GOOD, even as you said.
And then the way you presented the obversavion, making sure to place yourself as a part of 'us' and reemphasize the bright side and the town win condition.

These weak bits come together to make me feel like you're trying too hard to be the nonchalant townie and fly under the radar while casting shade on nutella.

So, no, I don't like your post. If you had said "no, not alignment indicative" I would have assumed that it was just a post for the sake of posting. But the way you framed your suspicion is sleazy and suspicious.

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:37 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:28 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:25 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 3:57 pm Well shit. That result is disappointing. And specifically the Chimborazo flip kills a few of my theories on what happened on day 2... but I think there are still more sloonei-civ explanations that make more sense than sloonei-bad ones.
I feel like you are treating this additional information, which could be a crucial piece to solving the game and/or nailing down Sloonei's alignment, as a negative. Sure, lynching a Civ is not good, but this knowledge might help us win.
eeegeeggggghhhhh

And do you consider this to be possibly alignment indicative?
For whom?

nutella

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:25 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 3:57 pm Well shit. That result is disappointing. And specifically the Chimborazo flip kills a few of my theories on what happened on day 2... but I think there are still more sloonei-civ explanations that make more sense than sloonei-bad ones.
I feel like you are treating this additional information, which could be a crucial piece to solving the game and/or nailing down Sloonei's alignment, as a negative. Sure, lynching a Civ is not good, but this knowledge might help us win.

eeegeeggggghhhhh

And do you consider this to be possibly alignment indicative?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:10 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:05 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:01 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 3:57 pm Well shit. That result is disappointing. And specifically the Chimborazo flip kills a few of my theories on what happened on day 2... but I think there are still more sloonei-civ explanations that make more sense than sloonei-bad ones.
Why am I central to malakim's flip?
You aren't Chimborazo. Nutella is puzzling out your D2 survival if Jack is town and you weren't Chimborazo.
We're getting close to an area in which I can't involve myself, so I'll just ask why I would have been Chimborazo and then pretend this conversation isn't happening.

D2 lynch survival. Either you or Jack had some way to survive or the lynch was stopped, IIRC. Rolespec. I know you can't comment on that. :P

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:01 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 3:57 pm Well shit. That result is disappointing. And specifically the Chimborazo flip kills a few of my theories on what happened on day 2... but I think there are still more sloonei-civ explanations that make more sense than sloonei-bad ones.
Why am I central to malakim's flip?

You aren't Chimborazo. Nutella is puzzling out your D2 survival if Jack is town and you weren't Chimborazo.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 3:09 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:56 pmFor the record, this isn't my favorite answer ever. I'll let Kyle pursue it if he wishes.
you're not my real dad, i can do what i want

Back me up here DDL.

dunya wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 3:03 pm LC isn't a primary suspect for anyone, let's not get sidetracked and waste time.

Last I checked this wasn't true, but I'm more interested in what you're doing right now than that.

dunya wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:47 pm
Kylemii wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:46 pm
dunya wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:43 pm
Kylemii wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:40 pm
dunya wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:33 pm(talking about LC) I know you're townie and all,
I have a question, dunya.
what
I was wondering which parts of LC's play have led you to "known townie" status for him

LC is not at the chopping block for now. Keep looking.

For the record, this isn't my favorite answer ever. I'll let Kyle pursue it if he wishes.

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