The Syndicate

Porscha wrote: ↑Tue Jul 05, 2022 10:56 pm

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Tue Jul 05, 2022 10:55 pm Ngl Porscha saying people scum reading her are trolling seems sussybaka

it isn't sussy when rondo has 180'd on his play style and flanders literally just hard TR'D me on repeat while popping in to make 3 word posts with no explanations. pretty obvious to me they aren't playing seriously right now

Creature wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 7:31 pm I think wolves are in here:

Porscha
DaughterOfOmega
MartinGG99
MacDougall
Cobalt
Stupid Sexy Flanders

Seanzie wrote: ↑Mon Jul 04, 2022 2:19 pm Wait, actually don't ignore it. 3p and mafia both would have incentive to self-pres there (and actually town would as well), so how does us not self-presing make 3p make sense?

Seanzie wrote: ↑Mon Jul 04, 2022 10:54 am

Marmot wrote: ↑Mon Jul 04, 2022 10:37 am I'm going to be away all day today, but I'll be around tomorrow

*Insert gif with bald eagles and freedom and lack of healthcare for the poor and stuff*

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Mon Jul 04, 2022 2:16 am I think Marmot is likely town. Not impossibly mafia, but unlikely.

So I'm at:

Seanzie
Flanders
Porscha
Marmot

as all likely or very probably town

I suspect something like

rondo -> creature -> one of cobalt/lp, probably cobalt as I dont want to ever lose to an afk slot -> one of lp/marmot

Creature is quite low simply because I don't have any confidence in reading them, and also I kinda feel like they're the sort to not care about a double-yeet all that much even if scum.

Marmot wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 11:57 pm As it stands, one of sean or flanders will die too

Marmot wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 11:56 pm LP, why are you voting me?

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 11:51 pm

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 11:49 pm Honestly I think Seanzie is trying to shield of Marmot here. I don't see how you go form unwilling to untie a 3-way to explicitly tying a 3-way.

I am trying to shield Marmot. The only time I tied a 3-way was after you made this post, in order to increase the chance of Falcon/Flanders getting chopped.

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 11:39 pm

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 11:38 pm Well Falcon is being top lynch and I think Marmot is probably more likely than Flanders.

Sell me on Marmot

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 2:27 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 1:59 pm

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 1:16 pm Martin's reaction to that lynch seems pretty townie to me.

I still got a bad feeling about Marmot though. Doesn't help they tried faking being a Cop at the start of the day.

Nor does it help they immediately went to cast doubt on Doom reanimating as Town.

Marmot jokingly claiming cop like that is probably NAI (in particular he did it only after another claim, not like to bait a claim) for him. Aside from that and DoOm (which tbh I'm not sure of what to think of the whole reanimation thing so I'm a little wary there too), can you articulate your bad feeling about Marmot at all?

Yeah it was just a bunch of small things over the course of D1.

Spoiler: show

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 10:29 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 10:15 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 10:08 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 10:00 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 9:57 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 9:57 pm Y'all should vote Martin.

Why martin?

His take on Flanders didn't really seem like "let me pull us out of fluff" and instead felt like he was coming in too hot to a game that wasn't hot yet. Like he had something to prove.

Do you think that is AI?

Part of why I ask is that I remember a scenario where Dizzy suspected you for a very similar thing (It was the Mad 17er setup) in a game on MU last year, and you were town in that scenario (and he was a wolf).

I remember the game (it was on MafC, not MU, but whatever), and I do see how you could draw a parallel, but I still think you should vote Martin.

Oops, that's what I meant.

But I am now thoroughly convinced. [VOTE: martin] aubergine

This was the first one which I found weird. He gave a slight pushback to one of your reads, but switched to supporting it after a brief explanation which I don't even personally think was amazingly compelling.

It's just a post which seemed to be like he was wanting to make an interaction with someone, but didn't actually want to commit to properly scrutinizing a read. It comes across as someone with an agenda that didn't want to defend Martin but rather fish for any possible explanation to vote for them. To top it off it's worded in such a way that it can easily be laughed off as a joke vote since it has such a non-serious tone for an otherwise seemingly serious conversation. It doesn't feel genuine.

Marmot wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 1:13 pm

Stupid Sexy Flanders wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 12:44 am

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 12:38 am

Seanzie wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 12:25 am

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 12:21 am

Seanzie wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 12:20 am

You seem oddly worried about being chopped considering we aren't even halfway through D1.

yes I am

because I have quite a few games with you seanzie and your choice is to chop me out of all people in a game with so few posts

Oooor... you're a wolf who bit too hard on early pressure.

well then I would very much like to make you regret d1 chopping me somehow because quite frankly I find d1 chops of people I know / could more confident solve to be suboptimal, and in absence of any significant content in the game, a really stupid choice

I currently got no ideas as to how I would make you regret that though, outside of "oh no martin was town"

Gonna assume you'll be reanimated after your flip, and if we're all wrong you get to come back and be all like "I told you so", if you're town.

Which is looking doubtful

How does this reanimation work?

Marmot wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 1:23 pm

Stupid Sexy Flanders wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 1:17 pm
[snip]

Never played a reanimation setup before, and the OP doesn't really tell me much.

Have you played this setup before? I asked about it in the sign up thread and mo one told me how or why players are reanimated.
I'm going in blind here. Just kinda figured host reanimated and rands shit until they get tired if hosting.. lol

I haven't played this setup either, I was hoping you might know something we didn't

I've played games with rezzes here in the past, which is where Wilgy got the idea from iirc from when he submitted the idea for this game. Generally, there is some mechanic in the game that triggers such rezzes, and I'd wager it's related to the secret 3P role listed in the OP.

These two posts are actually just straight fishing, possibly TMI since it almost sounds like he has the answer to the question.

Marmot wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 7:53 pm

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 6:11 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 1:12 pm

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 12:21 am

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 12:13 am So your position is that Seanzie is a wolf?

My position is that seanzie is worth looking into because he more or less said he wasn't going to do any interaction with me

by not doing that after my passive-aggressive post that implicitly referred to him

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 7:27 pm This looks like a great way to generate discussion!

Also: I don't think anyone can be certainly wolf. No one can figure that out in 100 posts, at least in my personal experience.

What needs to happen is more things and more interactions. I've been trying to do that that with my earlier posts.

Last town game I had on another site, I lost to a wolf because there wasn't enough posts in the game. if there had been more posts that game, I would've been able to figure out who was more likely to be the wolf partner there, instead of just relying on my world-building bias. Admittedly though, it was only 300ish posts because it was a light-ish game, but I want to get the ball rolling this game just so we avoid the scenario of finding out there was too little to go on too late.

Valid, ok you keep doing you.

Does this make you change your mind that Martin could be scum?

Mmmm, I still think is one post is bad enough that I feel he's more likely scum than anyone else, but that did wane a bit, especially since someone (I forget who) claimed that Martin does get quite defensive as town.

This was the read in particular that really set off my red flag alarms near the end of D2.

It reads as someone who really does not want to close the door on possibly lynching Martin. Not only that, but they also made a move to shift blame and downplay the severity of responsibility for a mislynch.

Marmot wrote: ↑Thu Jun 30, 2022 12:59 am

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 30, 2022 12:42 am when I went to sleep

was genuinely not expecting thread to double in size over 8-ish hours

anyways I was thinking more about Marmot + Seanzie

and I was suspecting that the latter is town (primarily on the basis that, even though I found the reasons to be dubious, doesn't look like nearly all d1 !wolf seanzies I have seen)

and the former to be suspicious of given that I don't think anything Marmot has done is towny for him; he is one of the most successful wolfs on The Syndicate iirc and him jumping between Seanzie and I earlier makes me sus of him

lets see if the last roughly 250 posts support that

I haven't won a game as wolf since 2020 (and that's in like 9 attempts), I don't think anyone would call me a good wolf.

This is a minor thing I noticed, but the calling themselves bad at playing scum almost just comes across as trying to say they can't be scum because it would be super obvious.

Outside of these specific posts I've just been looking at their ISO ocassionalyl and reading their reads. They aren't super egregious, but I find that they explain their reads to a large degree and keep people close to neutral reads which I view as a bit more on the scum side than town. They also just kind of had a sort of echo style of reads where they point to things other people have been saying about the person to justify reads and never using specifics from their own research.

That's kind of why I describe it as more of a bad feeling than a super hard evident of scummyness. They are participating, but all of it feels ever so slightly off like it's trying to blend in and not rock the boat.

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 10:31 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 10:27 pm

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 10:21 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 10:17 pm

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 9:59 pm

Porscha wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 9:56 pm

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 9:51 pm

I dont know Falcon well enough to say if its a hit or not. I am leaning town and Marmot I am ok with but I want to set up a possible third wagon and someone who I just want to resolve more than anyone else in the game

cobalt is who you want to resolve more than anyone? am I reading that right

Yes

They are on everyones mind, everyone wants them to post. They have been a 1 post day 1 and 0 post day 2. I just want them out so we can stop talking about them. I dont care if they are town or wolf. It would be great if they are wolf. Sure its low hanging fruit but its removing focus from the game.

I had a similar thought earlier (not necessarily removing focus since I don't think they've gotten that much attention, but dealing with a slot we can't take to FX), but I'd also like to hear who you'd vote for if you weren't voting to deal with a troublesome slot.

LP/Martin/Flanders, I didnt like martins explosion eaerlier, It could have been a wolf exhasperated about his slot being tunneled so early in the day and his pop in after the votes had dissipated looked wolfy to me but I will be honest and say I didnt put much time in to reading them fully.

LP I didnt like for the double freeze

Flanders because he keeps sussing my spot and I know I am town and I have been the most solvy day 1

GTH I think Flanders might be town but I also dont like how he has treated your slot. it could have been T/T but I also tinfoil For W/W because we could be in a terrible spot being lead by Seanzie/Fladers into oblivion because of holidays and low wim.

I don't know what you mean by "double freeze".

How has Flanders treated my slot?

In the last 100 posts he was fairly agressive towards calling you scum then doesnt really push it fully

And in my ISO I got LP to freeze and bail from chat for a bit at one point. I saw it as scum indicative. However I could be wrong so I didnt push it too hard because I tunnel sometimes. So Cobalt is the obvious choice for me so I have more info for tomorrow

Marmot wrote: ↑Thu Jun 30, 2022 1:10 am

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 30, 2022 1:06 am

Marmot wrote: ↑Thu Jun 30, 2022 1:02 am Martin, when did I jump between you and sean? I don't think I've suspected sean at all this game?

Between these two posts

technically jumped to and from a mac vote, but this all happened in the time-span of an hour

Spoiler: show

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 9:49 pm [VOTE: seaneize] aubergine

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 10:29 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 10:15 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 10:08 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 10:00 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 9:57 pm


Why martin?

His take on Flanders didn't really seem like "let me pull us out of fluff" and instead felt like he was coming in too hot to a game that wasn't hot yet. Like he had something to prove.

Do you think that is AI?

Part of why I ask is that I remember a scenario where Dizzy suspected you for a very similar thing (It was the Mad 17er setup) in a game on MU last year, and you were town in that scenario (and he was a wolf).

I remember the game (it was on MafC, not MU, but whatever), and I do see how you could draw a parallel, but I still think you should vote Martin.

Oops, that's what I meant.

But I am now thoroughly convinced. [VOTE: martin] aubergine

That was a joke vote, I had no suspicion of him.

Stupid Sexy Flanders wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 12:09 pm Not a lot of action since yesterday but for whatever reason, maybe the hangover, I'm actually feeling a lot better about Rondo.
Porcha 100% town unless she's trying to pocket a towny who's about to get mischopped. He work to point out the error in omega thought process is something only town does imo. No wolf bothers with that excerice. Just like no wolf bother with wagon racing, when they can drop their votes away from lead (town) wagon and hide.

Still like Seanzie as town.

Didn't like Marmot and LP's wagon work. Not at all. Let's say I'm wrong on Martin, and he is town. If thats the case LP and Marmot both look brutally scummy for running away from town wagons to avoid any heat from a mis.

Falcon has is playing outside his town meta. There's no questioning, just commentary. Posting is way too passive and he's not expanding his reads on players. I don't like it.
I'm not sure 8ve seen this side of wolf falcon though, but if we need to find a 3p, there's a good place to look.

Looking at the list, I don't think I've read a post from cobalt. Pretty null on creature. Guess I'll iso later after shaking off thing hangover.

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 7:01 pm doom, at no point does flanders explicitly say whether the person is inactive, flanders says THE WAGON IS INACTIVE, to which LP also understands this by using "it" to refer to the wagon immediately after. flanders was NOT talking about the person being inactive. (I did find an earlier day 1 post from him tho that says he doesnt like chopping MIA players day 1, but I believe that post was outside of this bubble of conversation.)

Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 3:43 pm

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 2:31 pm And I do believe Marmot is a good player despite their half joking posts saying they are bad.

The main issue is that pretty much everyone outside of a few people are putting in a good deal of effort to make reads and actively participate. And like I said with DoOm's lynch yesterday that I didn't feel they were being scummy with thier inactivity. I really doubt that the scum are all in the people not posting, this seems like a game where the scum are actually trying to put an effort to blend in.

So I really don't think it's enough anymore to say "X is Town because they are giving reads" because only Cobalt is really reaching that standard.

Was that ever enough? This feels a little CWAC'y, like in every mafia game ever giving reads is only a bare minimum that people must do to be found as town.

DaughterOfOmega wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 2:36 pm I think Flanders is kind of openwolfing and screaming mafia to my brain

But nobody else seeing it makes me more hesitant

Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 1:59 pm

LinearPoint wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 1:16 pm Martin's reaction to that lynch seems pretty townie to me.

I still got a bad feeling about Marmot though. Doesn't help they tried faking being a Cop at the start of the day.

Nor does it help they immediately went to cast doubt on Doom reanimating as Town.

Marmot jokingly claiming cop like that is probably NAI (in particular he did it only after another claim, not like to bait a claim) for him. Aside from that and DoOm (which tbh I'm not sure of what to think of the whole reanimation thing so I'm a little wary there too), can you articulate your bad feeling about Marmot at all?

Stupid Sexy Flanders wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 2:35 am

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 2:33 am

Stupid Sexy Flanders wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 2:31 am

Porscha wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 2:29 am i'm gonna be real I kinda hate all day 2 entry posts so far

I like mine

would you be interested in elaborating on it

Rondo is mafia