The Syndicate 2014 Game of Champions [ENDGAME]

[Mongoose]

Civilians (18)
Must defeat the Suits and the Sorcerers. The game ends if this happens.

I have no reason to believe this isn't the case. Neither do any of you.

Well dang that seems pretty straightforward.

[S~V~S]

Just had another look at the roles and I'd say Snape.

Do you know why I have it now? Between us questioners?

And would I agree that MP likely recruited Daisy first of all were I asked? How much longer till the post?

[S~V~S]

Also, Daisy, i know I asked this before, sorry if i missed the answer~ why is wanting to figure out a way to rezz a civvie I had a big part in lynching a baddie thing to do? What was so "weird" about it? Haven't you ever played a game with "objects" that we have to figure out how to use?

Also are Rey & Lorab ever coming back? Will Hedgeowl ever show up at all ?

[juliets]

And are Lizzy and sabie ever coming back (unless I missed a post of theirs)?

[juliets]

SVS 3 minutes til the poll ends but i don't know about the post. I was confused when I was cursed or hexed or whatever about when I could post again.

[S~V~S]

Did I think I knew everything about this potion? Was I wrong? Is it possible that I don't know if it ends after the post?

@ Epi~ Dear Hostie, does it end at the post?

[Made]

Did I think I knew everything about this potion? Was I wrong? Is it possible that I don't know if it ends after the post?

@ Epi~ Dear Hostie, does it end at the post?

SVS, do you know who cursed you, and are you allowed to share your theories?

[Epignosis]

Through Time, Space, and Literature?

The TARDIS brought everyone to a strange world. A sign nearby said, “The Shire.”

“Well, this can’t be right. Middle Earth isn’t actually a place that exists. Ow! Old man, you’ve hit me with your stick! I beg your pardon!”

“If this world didn’t exist, that would not have hurt.” A grey wizard wearing a pointy hat was the speaker. “Also, you’re late.”

“I am not. I’m always on time.”

The wizard grumbled. “Speaking of time, there’s not much of it. I have taken this,” he said, producing a gold ring. “Bilbo doesn’t know I have it, but it’s a dangerous ring- one that has ruined many.”

“That sounds as frightening as Weeping Angels! One minute you think they’re stone, and the next-”

The grey wizard shook. “Weeping Angels? Stone? You mean trolls. Please be quiet, you know-nothing fool-of-an-Eccleston!”

The old wizard gained his composure. “I need one of you to assume stewardship of this ring for but a time. If you accept it, you will not be thought a coward when you decide to give it back; instead, you will be thought braver than many. But know that even though this ring may serve you wonderful ways, it is really a servant of someone darker. Moreover, there are two that I know of who are trying to acquire the ring. If you wish to bear it (by PMing the Host), there could be unwanted consequences if you are unwise.

“And one of you were already unwise to come here, you evil queen of Nockmaar, maker of swine!” The old man raised his staff and sent Dom flying through the air to his doom.

Dom has been lynched. He was Bavmorda. It is now Night 5. You have 25 hours to submit your PMs.

[Epignosis]

Who tried to bludgeon MP?

Poll ended at Mon Jan 19, 2015 7:17 pm

bea
0
No votes

Boomslang
0
No votes

Dom
16
Spacedaisy (2), DharmaHelper (3), Dom (4), MovingPictures07 (5), Elohcin (6), juliets (7), S~V~S (8), timmer (10), Roxy (11), Long Con (12), zeek (13), Made (15), Snow Dog (17), nijuukyugou (18), Russtifinko (20), Boomslang (21)
76%

DharmaHelper
0
No votes

Elohcin
0
No votes

Hedgeowl
0
No votes

juliets
0
No votes

Lizzy
1
Mongoose (19)
5%

Long Con
1
Turnip Head (14)
5%

Lorab
0
No votes

Made
0
No votes

Mongoose
0
No votes

MovingPictures07
0
No votes

nijuukyugou
0
No votes

reywaS
0
No votes

Roxy
0
No votes

Russtifinko
0
No votes

sabie12
0
No votes

Snow Dog
0
No votes

spacedaisy
1
Lily Potter (16)
5%

S~V~S
0
No votes

timmer
0
No votes

Turnip Head
0
No votes

zeek
0
No votes

Vompatti (The Host, the Non, the Dead)
2
Epignosis (1), Metalmarsh89 (9)
10%


Total votes : 21

[S~V~S]

Did I think I knew everything about this potion? Was I wrong? Is it possible that I don't know if it ends after the post?

@ Epi~ Dear Hostie, does it end at the post?

SVS, do you know who cursed you, and are you allowed to share your theories?

I do know exactly how I wound up posting in questions, but not sure if I can/should talk about it~ I think you might know soon. I think it's more of a contagion than a hex, you know?

[Roxy]

I have the sickness fyi
I am become death

[Long Con]

I have the sickness fyi
I am become death

Can you elaborate?

Host, do we PM the name of someone we think should have the ring, or do we just PM our own names if we wants it?

[Epignosis]

Host, do we PM the name of someone we think should have the ring, or do we just PM our own names if we wants it?

If you wants it, ask for it. Only one person gets it.

[S~V~S]

I have the sickness fyi
I am become death

This seems apropos~ I hope it is not rl sickness

[DharmaHelper]

Oh wow oh man what an incredibly unforeseeable result.

[Dom]

avenge me

[Snow Dog]

Did I think I knew everything about this potion? Was I wrong? Is it possible that I don't know if it ends after the post?

@ Epi~ Dear Hostie, does it end at the post?

SVS, do you know who cursed you, and are you allowed to share your theories?

I do know exactly how I wound up posting in questions, but not sure if I can/should talk about it~ I think you might know soon. I think it's more of a contagion than a hex, you know?

Mine was definitely a hex and i have no idea where t came from. So maybe it was from a different person.

[S~V~S]

Did I think I knew everything about this potion? Was I wrong? Is it possible that I don't know if it ends after the post?

@ Epi~ Dear Hostie, does it end at the post?

SVS, do you know who cursed you, and are you allowed to share your theories?

I do know exactly how I wound up posting in questions, but not sure if I can/should talk about it~ I think you might know soon. I think it's more of a contagion than a hex, you know?

Mine was definitely a hex and i have no idea where t came from. So maybe it was from a different person.

I am pretty sure it is the same thing. Something that was set in motion once. Time will tell.

It's an odd night. The Suits kill, Bass & Faradays team. Are they gonna play it safe, or be bold and go for the WIFOM?

The baddies are gonna all vote to give the Ring to a teammate, so Voldemort is likely gonna get it (or the most publicly trusted member of that team). If we all just vote for ourselves, the baddies are gonna get it. So I don't want to discuss who we trust, but we might want to give that some thought when we send in our votes, presuming that people ask for it via PM, not in the thread.

I asked to give it to someone, it wasn't me, that I think I trust. I was told they have to ask for it, so I hope they do

[Roxy]

I have the sickness fyi
I am become death

Can you elaborate?

Host, do we PM the name of someone we think should have the ring, or do we just PM our own names if we wants it?

elaborate that I am sick? Ok. I have the flu and been running a high fever there was talk of the hospital but I promised my doc I would take a couple of days off which I have.

[zeek]

S~V~S, I read the Host post to mean we're not voting, but volunteering. Like Epi would decide out of the volunteers. Is not that right?

Roxy

[S~V~S]

Well, I PMed in a name, not my own, and was told that it would only count if that person asked for the ring. So I presume that if the someone whose name I sent in asks for it, they will have my vote. I do not want to say the name of the person I most trust, but I did want to throw this out there. If he was just going to randomize amongst those who asked for it, why bother having us PM?

So if that is the case, and we all self vote, the baddies are gonna get the ring.

I think that if you are a civvie who has taken suspish you should consider NOT self voting and voting instead for someone you trust (i did not ask for it, so if you think I am a civvie, don't ask to give it to me) perhaps after PMing the host to check up on if what I am saying is correct (or if he clarifies this in thread).

[zeek]

I'll do as you say and PM to check up. I thought only those who wish to bear it had to PM.

[zeek]

I just wanna put this out there. I don't trust MP's motivations at all, but would it be the end of the world if he got the Ring? (If it is a voting thing.) At least we know he's not Gollum or Sauron, and if we have to paint a target on someone's back by openly trying to keep out out of their hands who better than an Indy?

[Tangrowth]

Frankly, my gut reaction was to NOT want the ring. But I will admit I'm really tempted.

So it seems some more clarification about my position needs to be given. I'm fine with this. I will do so in response to zeek's quote below.

What reasons are there for civilians, of all people, to lynch me? It's wasting your time. Better to take a chance on someone who could actually be a threat than someone who isn't at all.

This may be true, MP, but I don't see why your recruits have to be civ. It would be foolish for us to accept you're acting in our interests. You could simply advocate lynching people you haven't recruited, instead of those you actually think are bad.

Fair enough. Let me see your situation and raise you another, however:

- No one knows whether they have been recruited by me. They are not made aware. Similarly, the Narrator is not made aware. So no one should have their feelings hurt over whether they are recruited or not. Because you don't know who has been recruited and who hasn't.

- I am not recruiting people I "like", as some have suggested, because that would not only be possibly hurtful but more importantly a ridiculous strategy. I have been recruiting based on maximizing my win condition.

- Although it is evident that I can win with anyone, regardless of alignment. Despite this, I made a decision at the beginning of this game to completely play civilian. Why? Well, a few reasons. First, civilians and baddies rank in different levels of threats to me. One of them has an NK and the other doesn't. That simple. Second, I can genuinely baddie hunt all I want. I don't know who the baddies are better than any of you guys. The only role I know is the Narrator's role. The only thing I need to do is survive and HOPE that the players I've chosen, once either the civilians or baddies are eliminated, survive along with me, and that the math works out. It has made much more sense to me, then, to try to pick players for my recruits who are civilian and to further the civilian cause. Of course, I don't know who is or who isn't, so I'm just making my best guess. Same goes with my baddie hunting. I haven't lied once this game. I've been trying to catch the baddies along with you. If I had a 100% track record, that would be bad for me, since it wouldn't give me enough time to recruit enough players probably, but we all know that's impossible. Not only that, but we're already headed into D6 and as many as 5 baddies are still alive. Even if we lose one a day via either lynch or NK, that takes the game until roughly N10 or D11, which I think is doable for my win condition -- assuming I stay alive and I've chosen players correctly, not an easy feat.

- So why should you trust me? Think about it this way. No one knows anyone else's alignment. If you're deciding whether to trust another player, one must surely consider that. But everyone knows my alignment. Why go out of your way to ignore what I'm saying or consider me a threat but instead consider the ideas of others?

I believe I've proven my trust through this last ordeal. I didn't have to go after Dom. I didn't have to go after DF. I didn't have to go after any of the players I have this game. Instead, I've been baddie hunting and doing everything I can to nail down the baddies. Because it's in my best interest just as much as it is in the civilians'.

Now: Why don't you trust my motivations?

[Tangrowth]

In fact, zeek, you've given me next to no reason to believe you're civilian this game thus far. Why should we trust YOUR motivations?

[Elohcin]

Just in case anyone is still confused.....
I think Epi was pretty clear. If YOU want the ring. You must PM him and tell him you want it. It's not a voting thing. We don't PM him and give him a name of a player we want the ring to go to. You can only ask for it for yourself. How he will decide who to give it to among those who want it, I don't know.

[zeek]

In fact, zeek, you've given me next to no reason to believe you're civilian this game thus far. Why should we trust YOUR motivations?

We? You're not civ, I am. It's up to the other civs to trust me or not.

I never said I was going to ignore you, MP, but it doesn't mean I'm going to believe you either. Everything you said may well be true but as an Indy your primary concern is your win conditions. Are you going to vote for a player if they're one of your recruits and you believe they're a baddie?

Now nobody is going to target you at night incase they end up in a 1 on 1 lynch, so whether to trust you or not is, in my opinion, our highest concern moving into a new lynch. Seen as you outted yourself, it's only fair you accept this (hopefully short) debate and not throw a NO U back.

Epi has said this isn't a voting thing. I want you to take the Ring so the rest of us aren't in danger from having it.

[Tangrowth]

In fact, zeek, you've given me next to no reason to believe you're civilian this game thus far. Why should we trust YOUR motivations?

We? You're not civ, I am. It's up to the other civs to trust me or not.

I never said I was going to ignore you, MP, but it doesn't mean I'm going to believe you either. Everything you said may well be true but as an Indy your primary concern is your win conditions. Are you going to vote for a player if they're one of your recruits and you believe they're a baddie?

Now nobody is going to target you at night incase they end up in a 1 on 1 lynch, so whether to trust you or not is, in my opinion, our highest concern moving into a new lynch. Seen as you outted yourself, it's only fair you accept this (hopefully short) debate and not throw a NO U back.

Epi has said this isn't a voting thing. I want you to take the Ring so the rest of us aren't in danger from having it.

Fair enough, but I'm just saying I don't understand why I warrant any more healthy skepticism than should anyone else. If anything, I would argue I should receive less, since my intentions are known. I won't deny that my primary concern is my win condition; that would be foolish.

Considering I need the game to end as well at some point, it would be counterproductive for me to recruit every alignment; since I don't know if that's what I'm doing, sure, I suppose there could be a situation where I would vote for a recruit. I could have already done it. It all depends on the situation and the math, really.

How is it "our highest concern"? You get on me for saying "we", then you say "our"? Not only that, but this is an absolutely absurd statement. If you are a civilian, your "highest concern" should be baddies and definitely NOT me. Do you want to waste a lynch talking about me when you have no reason to even consider lynching me? Seems counterproductive and a good way to keep attention off of lynching baddies.

I see how you write it off and say it's a NO U, but really, I'd just like for you to address the question and the concerns that have been put forth against you by not only me but other players. I think that's a fair request. Why should we trust you? Why aren't you a Suit or a Sorcerer? Who do you think is bad?

Are you demanding that I take the ring? That's rich.

[zeek]

You're being absurd. You're saying you should have less skeptism but your win conditions aren't known because you have secrets. We don't know if they affect the win conditions we know about.

It is our highest concern. We should decide, right now at night, whether to give you a pass or not. Fact is you're not civ and we all know it. We should decide whether to trust you at your word or not. Then when lynch time does approach we can focus on lynching a bad guy. Stop saying we shouldn't consider lynching you because we should, you may have no interest in helping us. You can be very influential because everybody knows and likes you but not considering lynching you is the truly absurd concept here, don't pretend it isn't. You don't get trust points because we know you're not on a team.

What concerns can I speak to? The ONLY person who has actually given ANY reason to suspect me is Roxy, which I have addressed. My voting record. I voted very early for Bass. None of my other votes have counted yet. What do you want me to say about that? Everybody else have only mentioned me in passing, like yourself, despite the fact I'm not on any suspect list. Suspecting me for suspecting's sake. You've given no reason yourself, just I should be looked at. I don't want to invite you to try to make a case against me, but what reason have I given you not to trust me? (Asking for an Indy's trust, priceless ) People should trust me because I'm a civ trying my best. I can't give you any evidence or out myself, sorry about that.

My top suspects are Snow Dog and DharmaHelper. Try looking at their voting records.

Did I say I demand you take the Ring? Don't be dramatic, ask for the Ring and actually help us out. I won't ever vote for you if you do.

[Turnip Head]

I do not think I want the ring

Bloops, Juliets, there was nothing really new involved in my decision to vote LC. I do have residual feelings of concern from the early game, so I've been watching LC very closely since then. I'm not quite to the point where I'm building a case on him, but if I get to that point, you will no doubt hear about it For now the plan is to continue observing him.

Zeek, I'm not sure what exactly you'd like us to discuss re: MP. If we decide we don't trust him, well where do we go from there, do we lynch him? That seems like a waste of time and a great baddie stalling tactic.

I plan to use MP's perspective and insight as we move forward but I trust my own judgment and intuition above his when I make my votes. I think that's what we all should do.

I don't feel great about an Indy having the ring though, tbh. Actually I don't think anyone should have that thing

[DharmaHelper]

You're being absurd. You're saying you should have less skeptism but your win conditions aren't known because you have secrets. We don't know if they affect the win conditions we know about.

It is our highest concern. We should decide, right now at night, whether to give you a pass or not. Fact is you're not civ and we all know it. We should decide whether to trust you at your word or not. Then when lynch time does approach we can focus on lynching a bad guy. Stop saying we shouldn't consider lynching you because we should, you may have no interest in helping us. You can be very influential because everybody knows and likes you but not considering lynching you is the truly absurd concept here, don't pretend it isn't. You don't get trust points because we know you're not on a team.

What concerns can I speak to? The ONLY person who has actually given ANY reason to suspect me is Roxy, which I have addressed. My voting record. I voted very early for Bass. None of my other votes have counted yet. What do you want me to say about that? Everybody else have only mentioned me in passing, like yourself, despite the fact I'm not on any suspect list. Suspecting me for suspecting's sake. You've given no reason yourself, just I should be looked at. I don't want to invite you to try to make a case against me, but what reason have I given you not to trust me? (Asking for an Indy's trust, priceless ) People should trust me because I'm a civ trying my best. I can't give you any evidence or out myself, sorry about that.

My top suspects are Snow Dog and DharmaHelper. Try looking at their voting records.

Did I say I demand you take the Ring? Don't be dramatic, ask for the Ring and actually help us out. I won't ever vote for you if you do.

You seem oddly obsessed with voting records.

[zeek]

We discuss whether to trust him at his word, if we don't lynch him later. It's best we talk about it now, at night, so it doesn't distract. I just feel like he's been given a winning ticket cause nobody is questioning his motivations. Is this the consensus - take him with a pinch of salt?

Nobody should have the Ring but somebody has to. I'd feel better about MP if he put himself forward for it, seen as he says he's trying to help.

linki - DH, I have nothing else to work with.

[juliets]

I have a couple of mechanics questions I need to ask.

First, what is the difference between a hex and a curse? I actually looked them up online and they were synonyms.

Second, for those of you who have knowledge of the ring what does it do exactly? People are saying it's too dangerous and I can't figure out if you're just talking about what the post says or if there is some common knowledge about the ring that I don't know (or don't remember from the Hobbit game). Thanks to whoever can answer these questions.

[zeek]

My knowledge of the Ring is from the literature and media. It corrupts its bearer and tries to get back to its creator, Sauron. Powerful individuals could become vengeful god-like beings if corrupted by its power. Normal men are most easily corrupted I believe. If a civ bears it they will most likely be in a lot of danger and if a baddie gets it they will probably be more powerful.

[Turnip Head]

Oh come on Jules I know you've seen Lord of the Rings The Ring corrupts and manipulates its owner. It belongs to The Necromancer, and while he had it (in the stories) he basically ruled the world.

I guess this ring is from The Hobbit where it was a little more low key and belonged to Gollum, but Epi stressed its dark nature.

[juliets]

Oh come on Jules I know you've seen Lord of the Rings The Ring corrupts and manipulates its owner. It belongs to The Necromancer, and while he had it (in the stories) he basically ruled the world.

I guess this ring is from The Hobbit where it was a little more low key and belonged to Gollum, but Epi stressed its dark nature.

I don't even want to count the years it's been since I saw LOTR! All I remember about the ring is Gollum wanted it. But thank you both zeek and TH for explaining it to me. Maybe SVS can bring me up to date with hex and curse.

[S~V~S]

Just in case anyone is still confused.....
I think Epi was pretty clear. If YOU want the ring. You must PM him and tell him you want it. It's not a voting thing. We don't PM him and give him a name of a player we want the ring to go to. You can only ask for it for yourself. How he will decide who to give it to among those who want it, I don't know.

I pmed him a name other than my own and said I wanted to give that person the ring. He said, "OK but they have to ask for it". Paraphrased because we can't reproduce host PMs, but not by much.

So we can send in another name. If he told someone otherwise I am ultra confused.

[DharmaHelper]

Just in case anyone is still confused.....
I think Epi was pretty clear. If YOU want the ring. You must PM him and tell him you want it. It's not a voting thing. We don't PM him and give him a name of a player we want the ring to go to. You can only ask for it for yourself. How he will decide who to give it to among those who want it, I don't know.

I pmed him a name other than my own and said I wanted to give that person the ring. He said, "OK but they have to ask for it". Paraphrased because we can't reproduce host PMs, but not by much.

So we can send in another name. If he told someone otherwise I am ultra confused.

Given that the ring is rather dangerous, could you walk me through your thought process in giving it to someone you think is civ, as opposed to just not sending a PM?

[timmer]

Sorry I've been absent a bit. I would like the ring, if people need someone to choose. I will PM-ing the host now.

[DharmaHelper]

Sorry I've been absent a bit. I would like the ring, if people need someone to choose. I will PM-ing the host now.

That's such a Boromir thing to say.

[timmer]

[Elohcin]

Just in case anyone is still confused.....
I think Epi was pretty clear. If YOU want the ring. You must PM him and tell him you want it. It's not a voting thing. We don't PM him and give him a name of a player we want the ring to go to. You can only ask for it for yourself. How he will decide who to give it to among those who want it, I don't know.

I pmed him a name other than my own and said I wanted to give that person the ring. He said, "OK but they have to ask for it". Paraphrased because we can't reproduce host PMs, but not by much.

So we can send in another name. If he told someone otherwise I am ultra confused.

Sure we can. Send in a name other than your own. It won't do any good for that person. Epi was very clear. If you want the ring, you ask for it.

[Elohcin]

Sorry I've been absent a bit. I would like the ring, if people need someone to choose. I will PM-ing the host now.

Need someone to choose? We can't choose someone. This is not a voting thing.

[timmer]

Oh I saw that people were submitting other people's names so I assumed that's how it worked.

[Tangrowth]

Elo, I'm not sure I understand. S~V~S said that she PMed a name to Epig and Epig said that that person must volunteer first. So clearly there must be a voting mechanism, right?

You're being absurd. You're saying you should have less skeptism but your win conditions aren't known because you have secrets. We don't know if they affect the win conditions we know about.

It is our highest concern. We should decide, right now at night, whether to give you a pass or not. Fact is you're not civ and we all know it. We should decide whether to trust you at your word or not. Then when lynch time does approach we can focus on lynching a bad guy. Stop saying we shouldn't consider lynching you because we should, you may have no interest in helping us. You can be very influential because everybody knows and likes you but not considering lynching you is the truly absurd concept here, don't pretend it isn't. You don't get trust points because we know you're not on a team.

What concerns can I speak to? The ONLY person who has actually given ANY reason to suspect me is Roxy, which I have addressed. My voting record. I voted very early for Bass. None of my other votes have counted yet. What do you want me to say about that? Everybody else have only mentioned me in passing, like yourself, despite the fact I'm not on any suspect list. Suspecting me for suspecting's sake. You've given no reason yourself, just I should be looked at. I don't want to invite you to try to make a case against me, but what reason have I given you not to trust me? (Asking for an Indy's trust, priceless ) People should trust me because I'm a civ trying my best. I can't give you any evidence or out myself, sorry about that.

My top suspects are Snow Dog and DharmaHelper. Try looking at their voting records.

Did I say I demand you take the Ring? Don't be dramatic, ask for the Ring and actually help us out. I won't ever vote for you if you do.

Except I'm NOT being absurd.

Have you read my win condition? They are clearly stated in my role. Why would there be a secret aspect? Even if there was, would it not contradict win conditions that are very fully explained in the non-secret part of my role? Sure you don't know, but what logic would give you reason to believe they are different? Did you not see where Epig said civilians win when both baddie teams are eliminated? At that point the game will end? Clear as day to me.

Seriously? It is our highest concern? No, it isn't. zeek, think about my role. What motivation do I have to play a baddie-leaning game; and even if I did have such motivation, how could I logistically pull that off? It makes no sense. I know just as much (or as little) as every civilian does, with the exception of my own role and the Narrator's role.

Why are you bringing the fact that everyone "likes and knows" me back into this again? This is the second time you've said this during the game. I don't understand how I'm any more trusted in mafia games than anyone else, and I'm not sure that statement is even true.

Yes, I haven't stated reasons for you to respond to, sure. But the fact that Rox did and it took you this many times to address it is odd to me. And since when are voting records all that we can go on? If that's the case, then why don't you find yourself suspicious?

Your behavior is concerning.

Zeek, I'm not sure what exactly you'd like us to discuss re: MP. If we decide we don't trust him, well where do we go from there, do we lynch him? That seems like a waste of time and a great baddie stalling tactic.

I plan to use MP's perspective and insight as we move forward but I trust my own judgment and intuition above his when I make my votes. I think that's what we all should do.

This is all I'm asking.

I'm trying to help find baddies like any civilian is because it's the way I've chosen to play this role, and it's the way I thought I would best satisfy my win condition and have the most fun. Even if you don't believe that, if you choose to ignore my opinions, that's fine, but I don't understand how a flat out ignore of everything I say or lynching me is warranted.

[Tangrowth]

Tyler Durden– On Day 0, Tyler Durden chooses one player to be The Narrator. He will learn that player’s role. If that person dies, he dies. Durden recruits someone into Project Mayhem each Night. Recruits do not change roles or alignments. Tyler Durden must have more recruits alive than non-recruits at the end to win. If he is targeted by two or more people in the same Night, he will force them to fight, and only those people will be on the poll the next Day. *Secrets*

Tell me what about this is unclear, zeek. There's my win condition, right there, along with exactly how my role functions.

If the *Secrets* said anything about my win condition... which they don't, but even if you assume I'm lying, they would have to contradict what's already been said about my win condition. I can't recall a time I've ever seen secrets do that. It says right there how I win.

[Elohcin]

MP, no....he said if you want the ring, ask for it. And according to SVS, she sent in a name other than her own and he said. "OK, but they have to ask for it." Meaning, if they want the ring, they have to ask for it. Lets say SVS sent in your name. Well, okay, she sent in your name. Fine. But if YOU want it, YOU have to ask for it. It's not as complicated as you all are making it.

Quoted from Epi's Post: " If you wish to bear it (by PMing the Host), there could be unwanted consequences if you are unwise."

[Elohcin]

Haha, it's pretty bad when Elo is the only one that understands. Y'all are the smart ones.

[Elohcin]

Okay, maybe I will try to be even a bit clearer. I can send in the name of MovingPicture07 but it wouldn't mean a hill of beans to the host. BUT, if I send a PM to the host saying, "I want the ring" it would count.

[Elohcin]

But whatever, y'all can go ahead and ignore me and floor the host's inbox with names of other players who you think should have the ring. Par for the course.