Mafia: A World Reborn Game Thread - Game Over

#2451

You read some of the posts in that Talking Heads game right? Your post wasn't that long LoRab.

I thought we were friends early in the game. What happened? You changed. You used to be friendly to unusual creatures such as me but you turned on me LoRab. You turned on me bad and now we're not friends anymore and it pains me. It pains me LoRab.

#2452

Thanks for the clarification Long Con. I will then say that I was in the Chaos Wizard's tower is roughly in the southwest region of the map on day 5, and that there was someone already in the tower. Prior to reaching it, I had intended to meet a player (with whom I had earlier BTSC) a little north of where the tower is located, and ended up separated. The player I intended to meet is still alive, and someone I more or less trust. Of course, the separation should be unrelated to proximity to the tower due per the role description in the OP, but that's what happened.

#2453

timmer wrote:Golden you are trying to decide if it is fair to extrapolate? You already HAVE extrapolated, and are voting me and causing others to vote me as well even though you admit to thinking juliets is bad which I agree with you on. But now that you have sat this in motion you sure are hedging your statements fast and making sure people know you aren't sure. This is blatant. and in a previous post you suggested I need to die urgently. Why?

Because I believe that, as the sole survivor of a square with two other people, you probably now hold items that are bad news in the hands of a baddie.

"Now that I have set this in motion I am hedging my statements"

I've been very clear all along about what things I am sure about and what things I am not. Is your preference that I don't do this? Don't you think it's better that the civilians are told exactly where my thought processes are at? I don't think it does you or the town any favours for me to pretend or lie about exactly why I think you might be bad, better that I be honest.

#2454

HamburgerBoy wrote:Thanks for the clarification Long Con. I will then say that I was in the Chaos Wizard's tower is roughly in the southwest region of the map on day 5, and that there was someone already in the tower. Prior to reaching it, I had intended to meet a player (with whom I had earlier BTSC) a little north of where the tower is located, and ended up separated. The player I intended to meet is still alive, and someone I more or less trust. Of course, the separation should be unrelated to proximity to the tower due per the role description in the OP, but that's what happened.

The scarecrow walks at midnight

LoRab wrote:Why I find Mac suspish, as per request:

Day 0, he makes a jokey post about voting for Matt on principle. It struck me as pseudo-on-topic-joke-post baddies sometimes make, but not as suspicious in and of itself. However, when called out on it, he waffled between it having been just a joke and he really meant it and votes for Matt until he's out of the game as a policy vote. Because Matt isn't helpful as a player in finding baddies and he, on principle, will always vote for Matt until Matt is dead in every game (which he seems to have dropped at some point). -

Also, retorting that finding valid reasons to vote for someone is pingy to him. Which actually fits in with his ongoing seemingly random naming of people.

Also, he put forth the question of there not being any bad roles, which perhaps was trying to get the focus away from there actually being baddies in this game. And trying to blow off suspicion from himself because we don't know the alignment of roles and if one suspects him of being a certain role, we can't konw if that role is good or bad. This section of conversation struck me as doubletalk, trying to evade suspicion.

He repeatedly mentions players and a sure sense of them being bad--or posts absolute statements of his opinion of players without qualifying why he feels that way or explaining anything. He often does this late in lynches, which strikes me as suspicious in and of itself.

Also, he claims that anyone who votes for him has bad consequences happen, and yet, I have not had any and voted for him day 1.

He calls anyone who suspects him opportunistic for pointing things that they find suspicious. And yet calls pingy anything that anyone posts that he doesn't agree with.

Also, he makes lots of posts, many of which are just 1 or 2 lines, wihch is a great way to keep one's post count up, without needing to add a great deal of content.

He ignores questions to him and about him that he doesn't feel like answering. And outright states that he's ignoring them, so it's not like he's missing them.

Also, he posted that he was scum--which could have been just joking around, but also why say that if you're civ?

He posted RIH to TH, which seemed like an odd response to a death caused by an apparent baddie.

He has waffled back and forth on Sig so many times that it makes my head spin.

He also impllied thathe can't be lynched at some point, but htat could have just been to get ttention of of him. It didn't seem like an honest plea at the time, as I pointed out at the time. It felt like a bluff.

He has been so wrapped up in his own opinions, that he has barely commented on anyone who has been lynched. Even though he has actively posted in lynches.

All in all, all that adds up to me suspecting him.

This MacDougall guy seems almost too evil. I like him.

#2455

MacDougall wrote:You read some of the posts in that Talking Heads game right? Your post wasn't that long LoRab.

I thought we were friends early in the game. What happened? You changed. You used to be friendly to unusual creatures such as me but you turned on me LoRab. You turned on me bad and now we're not friends anymore and it pains me. It pains me LoRab.

We can still be friends. I mean, I think you're evil in this game, but that doesn't change friendship. I welcome you and I'm happy to have you playing--but I still think you're bad.

Hey--I've made some great friendships through accusations. I mean, some of my best friends are FEBS.

And that post was long by my current standards. I used to do really long posts (I once discovered that LP had a length limit, actually), but I gave that up long ago. I say what I need to say.

At any rate, yeah, I suspect you. I haven't changed. I just think you're bad.

#2456

Golden wrote:
Because I believe that, as the sole survivor of a square with two other people, you probably now hold items that are bad news in the hands of a baddie.

"Now that I have set this in motion I am hedging my statements"

I've been very clear all along about what things I am sure about and what things I am not. Is your preference that I don't do this? Don't you think it's better that the civilians are told exactly where my thought processes are at? I don't think it does you or the town any favours for me to pretend or lie about exactly why I think you might be bad, better that I be honest.

I have no items in my possession, Golden.

#2457

LoRab wrote:
MacDougall wrote:You read some of the posts in that Talking Heads game right? Your post wasn't that long LoRab.

I thought we were friends early in the game. What happened? You changed. You used to be friendly to unusual creatures such as me but you turned on me LoRab. You turned on me bad and now we're not friends anymore and it pains me. It pains me LoRab.
We can still be friends. I mean, I think you're evil in this game, but that doesn't change friendship. I welcome you and I'm happy to have you playing--but I still think you're bad.

Hey--I've made some great friendships through accusations. I mean, some of my best friends are FEBS.

And that post was long by my current standards. I used to do really long posts (I once discovered that LP had a length limit, actually), but I gave that up long ago. I say what I need to say.

At any rate, yeah, I suspect you. I haven't changed. I just think you're bad.

As a friend, and one who suspects me, I have a fairly easy request to make of you.

Can you please vote for me?

#2458

MacDougall wrote:
LoRab wrote:
MacDougall wrote:You read some of the posts in that Talking Heads game right? Your post wasn't that long LoRab.

I thought we were friends early in the game. What happened? You changed. You used to be friendly to unusual creatures such as me but you turned on me LoRab. You turned on me bad and now we're not friends anymore and it pains me. It pains me LoRab.
We can still be friends. I mean, I think you're evil in this game, but that doesn't change friendship. I welcome you and I'm happy to have you playing--but I still think you're bad.

Hey--I've made some great friendships through accusations. I mean, some of my best friends are FEBS.

And that post was long by my current standards. I used to do really long posts (I once discovered that LP had a length limit, actually), but I gave that up long ago. I say what I need to say.

At any rate, yeah, I suspect you. I haven't changed. I just think you're bad.
As a friend, and one who suspects me, I have a fairly easy request to make of you.

Can you please vote for me?

Perhaps. I've voted for you before. I likely will again. It all depends on how this lynch is going as to how I vote this round.

#2459

Well I'm gonna disappear for the next three phases so have at it.

#2460

Golden wrote:
timmer wrote:Golden you are trying to decide if it is fair to extrapolate? You already HAVE extrapolated, and are voting me and causing others to vote me as well even though you admit to thinking juliets is bad which I agree with you on. But now that you have sat this in motion you sure are hedging your statements fast and making sure people know you aren't sure. This is blatant. and in a previous post you suggested I need to die urgently. Why?
Because I believe that, as the sole survivor of a square with two other people, you probably now hold items that are bad news in the hands of a baddie.

"Now that I have set this in motion I am hedging my statements"

I've been very clear all along about what things I am sure about and what things I am not. Is your preference that I don't do this? Don't you think it's better that the civilians are told exactly where my thought processes are at? I don't think it does you or the town any favours for me to pretend or lie about exactly why I think you might be bad, better that I be honest.

Has it occurred to you that a baddie may have been traveling parallel to them?

I am sorry, but this is just too speculative for me. I will reread BWT, and Timmer 2.0 but it could be other things, too.

#2461

#2462

MacDougall wrote:I need to get to the bottom of why LoRab thinks I am bad.

Out with it you lot. Who else thinks I am bad. Sheepishly raise your hands if you think I am a bad guy!?

I think you might be but a Juliets lynch & her flipping bad could lessen my suspicion of you a bit. I agree that she's bad so I'm going to vote there today.

If I had two votes I'd go with Floyd. I trust that Tranq knows what he is talking about.

I am skeptical of this timmer thing but I''m putting timmer on my to watch list because I feel good about Golden.

#2463

I have considered all possibilities SVS, which is why I am trying to be very clear that I am not certain timmer is bad. I present the facts for what they are. I see it more as enhancing my existing suspicion, not as standing alone as damning evidence. I expect of you, that you take a cautious approach to jumping in to something like this.

Also, timmer's assertion that he has no items in his possession... I find that spectacularly difficult to believe.

#2464

I got in earlier than expected and have read through today's posts.

First RIPIYWG sig and Epi. Sig I don't know for sure but I'm pretty sure you are good. Epi I thought you looked good too but you never know.

Golden, you've at least convinced me to go back and read timmer 2.0.

And I see people are still thinking about voting me. Sorsha, could you give me just the short and sweet on why you think I'm bad? Lorab, could I ask the same from you?

Also I am happy to answer any questions. I will be here tonight, early tomorrow morning then gone to an appointment from 10:45 - 4:00 then back in the thread.

#2465

juliets do you resent being made scum by the host?

#2466

MacDougall wrote:juliets do you resent being made scum by the host?

I think that's a question you should ask yourself.

#2467

Well, there seems to be nobody here tonight well, except Mac showing his pretty face. So, I'm going to bed. Feel free to leave any questions and I will get to them in the morning.

#2468

juliets, what are your opinions on Bass_the_Clever and DFaraday (who I just realized isn't on the poll)? In addition to your view on what their alignment may be, do you have any meta-related insights regarding them for someone like me that hasn't played with either before?

#2469

What's goin on over here. Someone tell me where to vote. Who is inviting me to their shin dig today?

#2470

LoRab wrote:
MacDougall wrote:You read some of the posts in that Talking Heads game right? Your post wasn't that long LoRab.

I thought we were friends early in the game. What happened? You changed. You used to be friendly to unusual creatures such as me but you turned on me LoRab. You turned on me bad and now we're not friends anymore and it pains me. It pains me LoRab.
We can still be friends. I mean, I think you're evil in this game, but that doesn't change friendship. I welcome you and I'm happy to have you playing--but I still think you're bad.

Hey--I've made some great friendships through accusations. I mean, some of my best friends are FEBS.

And that post was long by my current standards. I used to do really long posts (I once discovered that LP had a length limit, actually), but I gave that up long ago. I say what I need to say.

At any rate, yeah, I suspect you. I haven't changed. I just think you're bad.

10,000 character limit, I think.

juliets wrote:
MacDougall wrote:juliets do you resent being made scum by the host?
I think that's a question you should ask yourself.

OUCH

#2471

I'm open to lynching either Mac or Juliets.

#2472

TheFloyd73 wrote:
Tranq wrote:
DrWilgy wrote:Tranq, why do you think you were brought back so quickly?
The Island wasn't done with me yet.

Floyd, why did you NK me?
???

What does this mean Floyd? That you don't know why you killed Tranq?

#2473

juliets wrote:I got in earlier than expected and have read through today's posts.

First RIPIYWG sig and Epi. Sig I don't know for sure but I'm pretty sure you are good. Epi I thought you looked good too but you never know.

Golden, you've at least convinced me to go back and read timmer 2.0.

And I see people are still thinking about voting me. Sorsha, could you give me just the short and sweet on why you think I'm bad? Lorab, could I ask the same from you?

Also I am happy to answer any questions. I will be here tonight, early tomorrow morning then gone to an appointment from 10:45 - 4:00 then back in the thread.

It was mostly your defensive posts that pinged me. You seemed to change your mind once you were under pressure, changing who you were voting for to appease those who were suspicious of you... Makes me think that you don't really care who gets lynched as long as it's not you/someone on your team.

#2474

Before you lynch me I will undertake a full ISO of all surviving players and present it to you, my wonderful new friends.

#2475

Dom wrote:I'm open to lynching either Mac or Juliets.

If Juliets comes back bad will it change your thoughts on Mac?

#2476

Sorsha wrote:
TheFloyd73 wrote:
Tranq wrote:
DrWilgy wrote:Tranq, why do you think you were brought back so quickly?
The Island wasn't done with me yet.

Floyd, why did you NK me?
???
What does this mean Floyd? That you don't know why you killed Tranq?

No, I just have no clue what NK means.

#2477

Nk = nightkill

#2478

HamburgerBoy wrote:juliets, what are your opinions on Bass_the_Clever and DFaraday (who I just realized isn't on the poll)? In addition to your view on what their alignment may be, do you have any meta-related insights regarding them for someone like me that hasn't played with either before?

I haven't paid much attention to Bass or to DFaraday this game because they both are so quiet. I went over Bass's posts and the only thing that stood out to me is except for the vote about the lynch, he tends to not be a part of discussions until it's time to vote. When he votes he provides some context for the vote. Mainly, from a meta point of view I see him as quiet, many times blendy. He is neutral to me at the moment.

DFaraday is a little different. From a meta standpoint he is another one that does not post much but is likely to have good insights when he does. Like this game, he goes his own way by which i mean if his vote looks like a bandwagon vote he doesn't back off because of that. He votes who he votes - he doesn't seem to care if others are poo-pooing the vote, it's what he believes and he's going with it. He's sometimes called blendy in games. The trouble is from what i have seen he is this way no matter his alignment. I am leaning good on him this game.

Others may provide a better insight than I can give on these two.

#2479

Sorsha wrote:
juliets wrote:I got in earlier than expected and have read through today's posts.

First RIPIYWG sig and Epi. Sig I don't know for sure but I'm pretty sure you are good. Epi I thought you looked good too but you never know.

Golden, you've at least convinced me to go back and read timmer 2.0.

And I see people are still thinking about voting me. Sorsha, could you give me just the short and sweet on why you think I'm bad? Lorab, could I ask the same from you?

Also I am happy to answer any questions. I will be here tonight, early tomorrow morning then gone to an appointment from 10:45 - 4:00 then back in the thread.
It was mostly your defensive posts that pinged me. You seemed to change your mind once you were under pressure, changing who you were voting for to appease those who were suspicious of you... Makes me think that you don't really care who gets lynched as long as it's not you/someone on your team.

Thanks Sorsha. I did change my mind twice but it's because I was convinced by others that my vote was wrong. First was sig. I voted for him because of what I saw as a slip-up. I did not know anything about sig when I voted. Then, multiple people including Golden, Epi and HamBoy began to speak out and say that this was a very common thing for sig and if I knew him I would understand that. I became concerned that they were right - I certainly didn't know sig and certainly didn't know his meta. Thats why I changed my vote to nutella who I also suspected.

The next change was from Luke to nutella. I explained that change in the post I made last night so I won't go through it again but I would like to point out that nutella was the Darkness, not exactly a benign role.

I do care who gets lynched and in fact thats why I took the risk of changing my mind.

#2480

Juliets build a case on me plz

#2481

TheFloyd73 wrote:
Sorsha wrote:
TheFloyd73 wrote:
Tranq wrote:
DrWilgy wrote:Tranq, why do you think you were brought back so quickly?
The Island wasn't done with me yet.

Floyd, why did you NK me?
???
What does this mean Floyd? That you don't know why you killed Tranq?
No, I just have no clue what NK means.

Mac, Bullz, Wilgy - You were bad with Floyd in Talking Heads. Did nobody in your btsc explain to Floyd what NK means?

#2482

Nope

#2483

Lol

Poor Floyd

#2484

Matt F wrote:
TheFloyd73 wrote:
Sorsha wrote:
TheFloyd73 wrote:
Tranq wrote:
DrWilgy wrote:Tranq, why do you think you were brought back so quickly?
The Island wasn't done with me yet.

Floyd, why did you NK me?
???
What does this mean Floyd? That you don't know why you killed Tranq?
No, I just have no clue what NK means.
Mac, Bullz, Wilgy - You were bad with Floyd in Talking Heads. Did nobody in your btsc explain to Floyd what NK means?

I feel like it must have come up at some point. I for one regularly use "NK" instead of kill so I'm sure it must have been brought up around Floyd at least a couple of times.

#2485

I feel like voting MM again but I don't think that'll gain any traction (prolly cuz I haven't laid out a case).

Floyd not knowing what "NK" is seems false.

Golden seems pretty sure on Timmer 2.0, though.

Timmer

#2486

@Juliets: You asked, so here you go:

Here is my post where I explain why I suspect you:

LoRab wrote:Just read through Juliets. Her post where she votes Luke does read like a teammate begrudingly voting. Not quite defending, but pointing out weaknesses in the argument against him even as the vote goes that way. Because jumping on a running bandwagon is generally a good way to try to distance yourself--but you don't want to accuse the person that hard, in case there's a chance to turn it around.

It's also a tone thing. I'm just not feeling like you're civ.

#2487

TheFloyd73 wrote:No, I just have no clue what NK means.

NK is a symbol for the nanokelvin, an SI unit of temperature equal to 10−9 kelvins.

Why did you murder me?

Sorsha wrote:If I had two votes I'd go with Floyd. I trust that Tranq knows what he is talking about.

How about a triple lynch this time?

#2488

Voted Floyd, again. I think he's Luke's teammate, and i think he's the one that killed me. Also he still hasn't answered DFaraday's questions other than the "RIP Luke" part:

TheFloyd73 wrote:
Tranq wrote:
TheFloyd73 wrote:
Tranq wrote:Floyd, why did you NK me?
???
You reply to this but not to DFaraday's 3 posts directly above mine in which he mentions you? You don't think the quote below is worth addressing?

DFaraday wrote:
Dom wrote:Dfaraday-- why Floyd?
I felt his RIP for Luke was a bit odd, and paired with his vote for Nutella when the votes were very close makes me think he could be Luke's teammate. Also, Tranq went after Floyd (including a post pointing out a comment of Floyd's which sounded coached) and was summarily NKed. It could be a setup, but I think it's more likely that he's part of Luke's team.
I'm a mate of Luke's IRL, what's wrong with paying respects?

Tranq wrote:Why didn't you answer this when DFaraday brought it up? What about the other points mentioned in the quote?

#2489

Tranq wrote:
TheFloyd73 wrote:No, I just have no clue what NK means.
NK is a symbol for the nanokelvin, an SI unit of temperature equal to 10−9 kelvins.

Why did you murder me?

Sorsha wrote:If I had two votes I'd go with Floyd. I trust that Tranq knows what he is talking about.
How about a triple lynch this time?

That would be ideal. Lol.

I'm pretty happy with where my vote is today.

Also, I'm sorry folks, I'm going to be even more absent today. I haven't been feeling well at all today, and being sick at work just sucks ass.

< This is about the same pale, sickly look I have right now.

#2490

I'm also quite happy with your vote

#2491

I'm going to have to hold my vote for self-preservation, but I do believe a juliets lynch will catch a baddie, and if I must vote Floyd to save my life, it seems Tranq is pretty certain of his guilt and Floyd has not said anything to dissaude me from thinking that.

#2492

I think there are some decent arguments flying around. The timmer case is something I'd rather keep an eye on and allow to develop, since it's not really much to go on at present. Floyd's claim to not know what an NK is seems false to me and that gives me cause for concern. Haven't decided how I feel about JC yet and I'm too tired to do a proper read on anyone tonight. I will be *Voting Mac* because his attitude has been giving me weird vibes for a while now and I think he's trying too hard to look like he's playing the "zany, unconventional civ" card.

#2493

Matt F wrote:I feel like voting MM again but I don't think that'll gain any traction (prolly cuz I haven't laid out a case).

Floyd not knowing what "NK" is seems false.

Golden seems pretty sure on Timmer 2.0, though.

Timmer

You and I are very much on different pages. I need more than circumstantial, and if Golden IS in fact info dumping (and he denies it) then he needs to work harder on his case. Golden is always sure.

I have not seen anything alarming about MM. I think I got a fairly good grasp on his bad game in Recruitment, and I am not seeing that MM here.

I won't be voting for Timmer. While i can see some of the points others have made on Juliets, I am not personally feeling that as much, and was kind of weirded out by TH repeatedly asking where she was. I am going to reread the points on Floyd.

#2494

Yeah, I'm not in fact info dumping. I've said what 'info' I have, it was all above board to share. It isn't code for 'I have info that timmer is definitely bad'.

But I don't think I do need to put a lot more into the case. Timmer has barely posted anything until I called him out for a vote, and so you can't much build a case on it. Timmer has struggled to contribute recently with real life pressures, but I think there is a big difference between his civ and baddie contributions, not in terms of frequency but in terms of content. He has been pretty good at trying to get something in there. Timmer's posts really didn't have a lot of content this time.

Plus, I believe timmer to be lying about having no items. That was the point at which he guaranteed my vote, because there is no way that is true.

#2495

So you honestly believe that he is straight up lying about having items, despite saying so under duress from you and an insinuation that you knew he had them. So you're basically saying he chose to say he had no items rather than just lying about his having them?

It seems to me the smart scummy would not make that play. I'm not convinced. Timmer seems pretty genuine to me.

#2496

Golden wrote:Yeah, I'm not in fact info dumping. I've said what 'info' I have, it was all above board to share. It isn't code for 'I have info that timmer is definitely bad'.

But I don't think I do need to put a lot more into the case. Timmer has barely posted anything until I called him out for a vote, and so you can't much build a case on it. Timmer has struggled to contribute recently with real life pressures, but I think there is a big difference between his civ and baddie contributions, not in terms of frequency but in terms of content. He has been pretty good at trying to get something in there. Timmer's posts really didn't have a lot of content this time.

Plus, I believe timmer to be lying about having no items. That was the point at which he guaranteed my vote, because there is no way that is true.

This is good to know becasue people, like Matt F, seem to be voting based on your "sureness" which tends to be a code for "I think he has info".

I know the letter of the rules say one thing, but i was under the impression that we are lynching based on what happens in the thread, not the map. While I agree that Timmers responses to you sound sketchy, i also think he was put into a postion that is fairly indefensible.

And like I said, you always sound sure.

#2497

SVS, please don't, though, miss the point of my second and third paragraphs, because they are about things that happened in the thread. I've tried to be very clear that this is also based on the thread... from the very start. It feels like sometimes you may not have given as much notice to that.

I've said that first paragraph over and over and over again all day... over and over. So, if anyone saying 'golden seems sure' actually thinks 'golden has info', it is only because they aren't reading well, and we should be suspicious of that. I'll be honest, Matt F's vote did ping me a bit. It seems an easy way to vote and point it back to me, eh?

And, I believe, we are doing things based on what happens in the thread AND the map. There are a lot of roles that can learn stuff about what is going down on the map. I watched the Flash mafia play out from the sidelines, and what happened on the map was central to how the game was won. I think both aspects of the game are equally important and valid in figuring out who the baddies are.

(I do always sound sure. But sometimes it feels like people go on tone and don't read my words. I am honest when I'm not sure)

#2498

Golden do you think you have a bit of an issue stating opinions as facts? Honest question.

#2499

MacDougall wrote:Golden do you think you have a bit of an issue stating opinions as facts? Honest question.

Why would you frame it as an 'issue'?

#2500

Golden wrote:
MacDougall wrote:Golden do you think you have a bit of an issue stating opinions as facts? Honest question.
Why would you frame it as an 'issue'?

Why wouldn't you just answer the question?

Who to lynch? 24 hour day!