Pikachu Tribe - Day 9

[Long Con]

Also, how could we lie about whether or not we have died before? Does that imply that there are non-public deaths happening? WTF you guys will be like "Oh, Long Con seems to be silenced today!" and then "Wow, it's lasting through the night!" "Is LC just AFK on vacation or something?" But no I just died and no one knew.

The host said people can keep talking if they've only died once.

A strange rule either way. Why not incorporate death-lies into the game for player interactive fun? There must be some secret behind it, some role that would be exposed or ruined if we revealed these secret deaths that I'm now really afraid of.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Lack of scumhunting is bothering me even tho I'm on phone and not doing anything.

Voted for Nutella because I recall suspecting her yesterday.

Do something guys. Anything.

I gotta say this sounds pretty scummy DDL.

I am sitting in my car waiting for my brother in a horrible freezing ass rain windstorm. This is mega scary. BBL when I get home.

Hope you are safe, SVS.

[Dom]

DDL-- I can't believe I'm saying this-- GTH who's bad?

[Dom]

I also don't mind heping, but I'm not sure I'm the best person.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

DDL-- I can't believe I'm saying this-- GTH who's bad?

Nutella and SVS

Not that I have any confidence in either. Its just that I feel better about everyone else.

Sorry Ill be able to do a better after Day 3 ends.

[nutella]

Puzzles? I'm really good at puzzles pick meee

[S~V~S]

Me and formatting, a match made in Hell

Did you get that, Epi? Where I answered your question in the quote

Where is nutella on my shortlist?

The read of her you had before she made your shortlist seemed to be that you felt good about her. Now she is on your short list.

What changed?

[Paul Stevens]

All puzzles have been sent. Good luck!

[colonialbob]

A puzzle says Probst
Maybe I have the answer
If others choose me?

[colonialbob]

Oh, it appears not
Ah well, no matter, and now
I turn to the hunt

[Quin]

So who's doing the puzzle? DH, LC and who?

[Long Con]

Are we allowed to discuss the puzzles in any way? I assume free public discourse once the puzzles are complete.

[Epignosis]

Me and formatting, a match made in Hell

Did you get that, Epi? Where I answered your question in the quote

Where is nutella on my shortlist?

The read of her you had before she made your shortlist seemed to be that you felt good about her. Now she is on your short list.

What changed?

Where do you see she's on my shortlist?

[Epignosis]

I didn't receive a puzzle.

[DharmaHelper]

I'm assuming puzzle talk counts as infodumping.

[Epignosis]

The goal is not to solve a puzzle.

It is to find mafia.

Those of you who aren't solving puzzles, let's work.

[Epignosis]

I named people I would be comfortable lynching. Is there a reason why we shouldn't?

[Dom]

I'm good with nutella or DDL

[sprityo]

From my understanding of the puzzle situation. Someone gets to watch but not post and can report back to over here? Hopefully that’s the case because otherwise how would be benefit immediately from the hard work?

I’ll check back tomorrow periodically on the thread, weekends I try to spend time with my girlfriend, family, and friends

[S~V~S]

Out of that group, I'm most inclined to vote for DDL, Quin, or nutella.

I feel like I am pulling teeth here. Is this not your short list, Epi?

What changed?

[colonialbob]

Why, I don't know, but
This game has been tough for me
I keep bouncing off

A nut ISO
Reveals a lot of waffles
But also one question

To those who know her
Would bad nut bring up MK
To part Dom and Ep?

[Dom]

^Maybe.

Nutella waffling is not indicative of her alignment, though.

[Dom]

Where she has taken a stance though, bothers me.

It always ties herself to Epi.

[Long Con]

Where she has taken a stance though, bothers me.

It always ties herself to Epi.

If nutella is bad, then how would this make you feel about Epi?

[Long Con]

Ok, a look at Quin. I started looking over his posts, and I still feel the same way as I said on Day 1, so I'll start by quoting myself about it, and then move on to how later Quin posts feel.

Spoiler: show

Also sprit, you gave DDl a plus 1. He came in scolding people for not wanting to talk suspicions, which is not true, and then went on to discuss, not suspicions, but mechanics.

Do you have thoughts on this?

this is a half truth
i can see the cogs turning
in reading his posts

Also sprit, you gave DDl a plus 1. He came in scolding people for not wanting to talk suspicions, which is not true, and then went on to discuss, not suspicions, but mechanics.

Do you have thoughts on this?

this is a half truth
i can see the cogs turning
in reading his posts

I don't think it is a half truth. I see cogs as well, but perhaps different ones than you see. Also Chucks strong reaction to the RR plan got my eye, he seems to be saying he is a laid back guy, but he seemed pretty far from that when he reacted to the suggestion.

Who would you recommend I look at instead? I am not married to this vote.

nut'la's recent post
what if it is their teammate
that didn't haiku?

hmmmm I think I like DDL's perspective but I still see it both ways, like I see the value in learning someone's role if we can but then it sounds like they could change alignment so that could be dangerous. I'm leaning toward DDL's side then and I think even if we get a no-lynch we can still have a productive D1 discussion.

like.... what is the likelihood that there is actually someone who both didn't submit a haiku and is a member of the mafia?

I'm definitely over the haikus. Quin is giving me the feelbad jimjams with his last couple of posts. I have the uncut posts in the above spoiler tag for reference.

this is a half truth
i can see the cogs turning
in reading his posts

This is about DDL, in response to S~V~S' accusation that DDL was not following up adequately after pooh-poohing the Round Robin in favour of more info. What cogs do you see turning? I assume this means you can see Civ thought processes going on from DDL? This seems very off-handed and I'm going to need to hear more about this.

nut'la's recent post
what if it is their teammate
that didn't haiku?

This looks like lazy fearmongering. I don't think it's a true take on a baddie perspective. The risk of lynching anybody is pretty low this time, and I doubt that a baddie nutella would be so concerned that she'd need to start making sure everyone thinks it's unlikely.

At this point, Scumdar10 rating is 6.52. (10 is Revealed Scum, 1 is Confirmed Civ). Moving on...

How's this: Epi and chuck have BTSC and speedchuck didn't send in a haiku. It could explain both contradictions, since it seemed I was the only one with enough votes to save speed. I do think there is value is distancing as civilians who have BTSC.

linki: yeah, why not?

If this were the case, why would I go out of my way to accuse speedchuck, only to turn around and "save him?"

I swear, as someone who has been mafia on this site so many times, people make really silly assumptions about what I would do if I were bad.

I am a civilian who wanted to protect someone who I am confident is a civilian. I did not know how Golden would resolve the lynch, so I voted to tie up Quin and speedchuck.

The fucked up thing here is that nobody died, and so the assumption that I'm mafia is because a) I made a quick decision after trying to digest as much as I could without running out of time, and b) nobody even knows if Quin is bad or not.

That's garbage.

Come at me.

I thought Quin's quote here was on the sketchy side of things, in that it's a bit too far-fetched to believe, and it's more of a talking to be talking than real game-solving... and if it were real game-solving, then why would he point the finger at two Civs with BTSC? Looking at it from a "quin is bad" perspective, the only real value is the buddying of them both. Up that Scumdar10 to 7.1.

quin-- whats up?
whos bad?

To throw a few names out there:

speedchuck for EoD yesterday and subsequent potential slip
Long Con because gut
nutella, maybe. I'm waiting to hear what she has to say about her suspicion of me.

Quin really didn't give much of an attempt for reads until Dom prompted him, and these reads are pretty weak and uninspired. It's only Day 2 I guess, but this does nothing to improve my opinion of Quin.

nutella is highly likely to be town but none of you can ask me why.

Was there ever any follow-up on this?

What if I said I was starting to doubt that there are even bad guys on this tribe?

Scumdar10 rating: 7.5

I don't think any of SVS, DH or Epi are bad. bob is probably town, though he's not really worth worrying about until Day 6.

I call nutella and speedchuck good. That's 2 of my 3 uh-oh reads gone.

I'd rate LC, DDL, sprityo and Dom as bad to good in that order, but I don't have a substantial argument on any of them. I'm not even interested in putting a vote down, to be honest. I ask the masses how they feel about these four.

Quin lays down some tasty Player Salad as Day 2 starts to get older. Basically a GTH exercise, due to there being no real attempt to justify a single read.

Eh no I don't like this round robin plan or whatever it's called. I want to lynch scum.

Lynching at randon just because it gives us a result is worse than trying to lynch and having a good chabce of failure. We learn nothing from the former since votes were meaningless. From the later we at least have a vote tally we can dissect later.

Classic civilian response. I will say that the logic is more pro-civilian here than in a round robin where we leave our votes where they are and primarily twiddle our thumbs just to get a flip. Alright.

Argue about the RR and whether alignments change in the future was all he did on Day 1. Dropped a vote on speedchuck as a starter but never finished. Not great.

I'm still feeling somewhat bad about Speedchuck but it's better than yesterday.

I'm feeling worse about Nutella though.

VOTE NUTELLA

aubergine

First I'm hearing about this. Explain pls.

DDL getting some heat, so Quin hops on a quick ISO. Not too enthused about the timing of it as I look back, as DDL was already under fire and getting votes, but his ISO was at least accurate. Scumdar10 rating: 7

Basically all I see beyond this is that he believes speedchuck is Civ. 84 replies at this time, and this is all the real content I got out of a Quin ISO. I'll settle on a Scumdar10 rating of 7.3. Would lynch. [VOTE: Quin] aubergine

[S~V~S]

I will be home several hours pre Lynch, I am going to hold my vote until I hear Epis answer to my question.

[Dom]

Where she has taken a stance though, bothers me.

It always ties herself to Epi.

If nutella is bad, then how would this make you feel about Epi?

very not good.

Quin-- I'd like to hear your response to LC's points. He made some good ones.

[speedchuck]

Where she has taken a stance though, bothers me.

It always ties herself to Epi.

If nutella is bad, then how would this make you feel about Epi?

very not good.

If you are scum, do you tie yourself to a teammate or to a misguided townie? I think if nutella is scum, then Epi is still town.

[speedchuck]

I was too sick yesterday to do puzzles.

[speedchuck]

DDL-- I can't believe I'm saying this-- GTH who's bad?

Why can't you believe you're saying this? Do you hate GTH or something?

[speedchuck]

Visiting family today, will try to keep up and vote. Weekends.

[Epignosis]

Out of that group, I'm most inclined to vote for DDL, Quin, or nutella.

I feel like I am pulling teeth here. Is this not your short list, Epi?

What changed?

I apologize. It's been a long week.

DDL voted on speedchuck both Day 1 and Day 2, and I don't sense any civilian drive on his part to figure speedchuck out. He referenced the strain of being in two games at once, and while I sympathize, that says nothing of his alignment. However, he has ninety posts, and that's plenty to figure some things out.

I've tried to organize why I think DDL should be lynched below:

Here's my take on speedchuck at this point.

If he's bad, he has to be faking ignorance. He's been adamant that alignments can't change. He's been on colonialbob's ass like twice now. And there's one or two things more I don't really remember and don't feel like digging up.

speedchuck, if he is bad, is a strategist, and a strategist needs to be informed.

The only way speedchuck is mafia right now is if he is acutely aware of his reputation as a strategist and is playing "town fool," as it were.

I'm starting to notice a trend.

You tend to overestimate the ability of baddies to always do informed things.

What was the purpose of this post? Notice that DDL didn't make a judgment about me one way or the other in this context. So what purpose does this observation serve?

I have hosted enough times to know that mafia teams make plenty of sub-optimal plays, and I've hosted enough times to know that some people deliberately make sub-optimal plays because they embrace the chaos. However, I like to proceed based on the mafia making optimal plays. If I'm right, cool. If I'm wrong, the mafia are making sub-optimal plays, and that's cool too.

I guess I could focus on Fire Emblem?

If you guys are going to continue being obtuse, I'll give some legacy reads at the end of the day. When I flip, lynch anyone who doesn't listen to my reads. Lynch them hard.

This post doesn't sound civ at all.

This always kills me. "This doesn't sound civ at all." One of the central means to victory for mafia is to look like a civilian. The people often failing to "look like civilians" (which, in itself is an absurd tautology since what a civilian does is "civilian behavior") are oftentimes the civilians, because they have no interest in caring what they look like.

So I primarily suspect DDL for his treatment of speedchuck. You might argue that you can't fault him for his vote given the tie, but I do. He voted early enough and didn't put much thought into it:

One random post from Nutella has more content than a full ISO page from Speedchuck.

[VOTE: Speedchuck] aubergine

Compare speedchuck's grievance with DDL's commentary about me below:

There is literally nothing to justify your turnabout in momentum. You went from "Yeah, I'll hear this guy out, what do you think DH?" to "I agree, he sucks, let's vote him" without ANY new information being added except for an OMGUS vote from DDL.

What OMGUS

I was voting for you before it was cool.

Out of the people voting for LC is the one I say looks like a civ

The other three are undefined. Epi didn't explain it at all (or I didn't find it in his ISO). Nutella is waffling like crazy. Speed made a super detailed post but it reeks of "forced effort" (what is the point in commenting about my posts? Do I look bad for making those?) and oversimplifications (like I haven't made much effort but he basically downplayed everything I did because I didn't actually go strong against people, when I have no obligatiion to).

DDL's posts are filled with these little ironies, such that I can't help but think that DDL's post about me considering optimal play from the mafia was made because DDL is bad and he knows his team isn't playing optimally, and so in this way would be amusing himself.

I'll comment on Quin and nutella in separate posts.

[Epignosis]

I need to reconsider Quin. One of the reasons I suspected him is something LC quoted, but upon rereading it, I see that Quin wasn't accusing me of being bad with speedchuck. He was saying we might have had civilian BTSC.

But then LC's point stands.

[Epignosis]

I will be gone this afternoon, and I don't know if I will be home before the deadline.

[VOTE: Dragon D. Luffy] aubergine

[Epignosis]

As for nutella, there aren't any specific posts- just the general confidence she's shown to have in me feels "too agreeable" if that makes any sense. I am shit at figuring her out though.

[speedchuck]

[VOTE: Dragon D. Luffy] aubergine

Epi makes good points, and my reasons from yesterday haven't changed much. Speedchuck is out most likely. Sorry I've been sick for the whole day phase.

[Dom]

Where she has taken a stance though, bothers me.

It always ties herself to Epi.

If nutella is bad, then how would this make you feel about Epi?

very not good.

If you are scum, do you tie yourself to a teammate or to a misguided townie? I think if nutella is scum, then Epi is still town.

Baddies do both.

DDL-- I can't believe I'm saying this-- GTH who's bad?

Why can't you believe you're saying this? Do you hate GTH or something?

yes.

[DharmaHelper]

Interesting that once again Speedchuck and Epignosis are voting together. Interesting still that their votes are for a guy who said he'd be not so much active this Day phase

[S~V~S]

As for nutella, there aren't any specific posts- just the general confidence she's shown to have in me feels "too agreeable" if that makes any sense. I am shit at figuring her out though.

You think she is buddying you?

I am going to do an insanity thing (for me) here and go BOTD. I read her, and you, between when you said you felt good about her and when you put her onto your "imma vote for one of these" list, and there was bupkis there that led me to think you changed your mind. But I know you, or I did, and I cannot imagine you as such an inept baddie as to do what it looked like you were doing.

I am going to presume you reread her and came to the same conclusion that I came to about her.

So I can see a world where she is bad and you are not. I was not sure I could, and still waffle since I felt my question was pretty straightforward, and you kept making posts the equivalent of, "Huh?" and when you did finally answer it, you kind of really did not answer it.

I don't see bad Epi doing these things, oddly enough. But that is a question for another day.

So I am going to vote for Nutella

*VOTE Nutella*

I think she is bad, she had been being blendy since the last Epignosis channelling session, and I don't trust her.

BBL, I have to go warm up some left over aubergine

[Dom]

[VOTE: nutella] aubergine

for now

[DharmaHelper]

Ah shit lads its between DDL and Nutella get hyped

[nutella]

I'm still really not clear on what people suspect me for. Ask and I will defend

Guess I'm voting for DDL then. Feel a little bad about it since he said he wouldn't be here all weekend, but I must say I haven't been feeling good things about him since the last lynch, and several of his posts after it sounded fake.

[VOTE: dragon d. luffy] aubergine

[DharmaHelper]

[mention]sprityo[/mention] what if you and me voted Quin and it was a 3 way tie

[DharmaHelper]

I'm gonna [VOTE: DDL

Does anyone know why the vote tag works without a closing tag? ] aubergine

[colonialbob]

Two ISOs, and still
No reason to read as civs
I abhor a tie

Thus, my choice is clear
[VOTE: nutella] aubergine
Also in the poll.

[colonialbob]

EBWOP:
I am a big fat dummy
Who read the poll wrong

Both equal in my sight
[VOTE: DDL ] aubergine
No ties in this poll!

[Epignosis]

Interesting that once again Speedchuck and Epignosis are voting together. Interesting still that their votes are for a guy who said he'd be not so much active this Day phase

Sounds to me like speedchuck is on his second civilian role.

[DharmaHelper]

"I abhor a tie"

*votes to make it a tie*

Please God end my suffering.

[DharmaHelper]

Interesting that once again Speedchuck and Epignosis are voting together. Interesting still that their votes are for a guy who said he'd be not so much active this Day phase

Sounds to me like speedchuck is on his second civilian role.

[Long Con]

Voting from work, ddl, aubergine, Dead red, voice to text