The Game of Champions 2018 [ENDGAME]

[S~V~S]

Feels like the goalposts are being moved. It was Eloh looks bad because of her EoD shying from the DH's lynch, she must be his teammate. Now it's, she's compatible with Luna.

Same goalposts, referees are just coming from different places.

As I said, she's at the back of my list. I can't clear her to my satisfaction becasue of her thread, but I don't particularly want to lynch her.

[S~V~S]

And speculating on what someone "would" or "would not" not is fruitless imo. Anyone would do anything, and in some game probably has. "Would" should be banned from Mafia, lol. J/K I say it too. But I won't clear (or vote to lynch) based on "would".

[sig]

Haha told ya so. :P

Good job all around this time I'll be reading over what I missed later but barring the mafia doing more extreme busting and civs being very lucky I'd say Eloh isn't mafia. I'd say svs, nutella, and nova all look really good from this lynch virtually cleared.

Also I'm back to agreeing there's just one mafia team.

[juliets]

Sorry, I should have made clear that my list was not in any order. Elo is still on my list because she looked Luna and DH compatible. I'm not saying she is my number 1 suspect.

Ah, S~V~S good point about Enrique. I'll leave him on my list for now but keep what you said in mind.

[S~V~S]

Haha told ya so. :P

Good job all around this time I'll be reading over what I missed later but barring the mafia doing more extreme busting and civs being very lucky I'd say Eloh isn't mafia. I'd say svs, nutella, and nova all look really good from this lynch virtually cleared.

Also I'm back to agreeing there's just one mafia team.

I would agree, I doubt she is bad, but I can't clear her. I would argue against her lynch at this stage should anyone suggest it, we have people who look was worse than her.

Linki @Jules, just like I would with Eloh, I would argue against an Enri lynch at this point. I would rather lynch based on a real thread based suspicion as opposed to being a low poster unless there is a reason for it. In a closed set up, there is no way to know what is *not* happening like there was in Asunder, which makes pinpointing low posters harder. But my qualification is based on "would", so like I said this is grain of salt. I have seen Enri lose interest and split before. I don't recallhim doing it as a baddie, but I have not played every game he has, either, so I could totes be wrong.

[ColinIsCool]

GOTCHA

[Elohcin]

I have never been more happy with a lynch result!!! I don't care what people say about me being compatible with luna. I thought she was civ for a long time and that could be why. But if we were bad together, don't you think we would intentionally NOT be compatible. Derp!

-----------------------------------------------

@S~V~S and @Juliets - Can you explain your thoughts on Jay and Kyle?

[juliets]

Haha told ya so. :P

Good job all around this time I'll be reading over what I missed later but barring the mafia doing more extreme busting and civs being very lucky I'd say Eloh isn't mafia. I'd say svs, nutella, and nova all look really good from this lynch virtually cleared.

Also I'm back to agreeing there's just one mafia team.

I would agree, I doubt she is bad, but I can't clear her. I would argue against her lynch at this stage should anyone suggest it, we have people who look was worse than her.

Linki @Jules, just like I would with Eloh, I would argue against an Enri lynch at this point. I would rather lynch based on a real thread based suspicion as opposed to being a low poster unless there is a reason for it. In a closed set up, there is no way to know what is *not* happening like there was in Asunder, which makes pinpointing low posters harder. But my qualification is based on "would", so like I said this is grain of salt. I have seen Enri lose interest and split before. I don't recallhim doing it as a baddie, but I have not played every game he has, either, so I could totes be wrong.

This helps. It's been so long since I've played with him I don't remember anything about him leaving games so that's good insight for me. And yeah, I hadn't thought about it but closed set-up does make it more difficult. I'm convinced enough to take him off my list for now, I'll just keep in my mind I don't have a way to conclusively clear him like I do a lot of others.

[juliets]

I have never been more happy with a lynch result!!! I don't care what people say about me being compatible with luna. I thought she was civ for a long time and that could be why. But if we were bad together, don't you think we would intentionally NOT be compatible. Derp!

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@S~V~S and @Juliets - Can you explain your thoughts on Jay and Kyle?

Elo, I will as soon as I get off work today. For now I have to go get ready.

[ColinIsCool]

I’m really not putting anybody in as lock town until I can reanalyze the DharmaHelper lynch. We also should look at the Luna lynch — just a basic theory but I think the remaining scum would have tried to establish alternative candidates while also voicing (tepid) support for Luna as an in-case distancing move — but their preference would have been to not lose a powerful role.

[S~V~S]

I have never been more happy with a lynch result!!! I don't care what people say about me being compatible with luna. I thought she was civ for a long time and that could be why. But if we were bad together, don't you think we would intentionally NOT be compatible. Derp!

-----------------------------------------------

@S~V~S and @Juliets - Can you explain your thoughts on Jay and Kyle?

See it's posts like that that are the reason I can't clear you. That "Derp". Making someone feel silly for having a suspicion most don't is baddie 101. It's also not something I associate with you as an individual. I don't know you IRL, but you don't strike me as someone who says things like "derp" to people. And as I said, "would" is like the word "but" to me. Everything that comes after it is questionable. It's speculation. I have seen a team NK their own member for cred; ALL the teammates violently bus each other out of the gate; out another teammate with fake info, lots of other things I can't recall. Most of us playing in the 10 or 10+ year range have seen more shenanigans than we can remember.

So "would" has a place, but it should not be at the head of the table in pride of place.

Jay is being opportunistic in his votes and vague in his suspicions. I know he said he was going to low ball this game, but in the time it took him to write some of those "Dear Dad" schtick posts early in the game he could have written three earnest, real posts. I don't buy the schtick, it felt to me like he was hiding behind it. He felt like he was pocketing people right and left. He does not feel even remotely genuine to me. With love, Jay

Kyle I have to pull quotes etc. But it is more thread based with him. His waffly thing yesterday followed by no actual vote ... I actually did that in a game once to avoid voting for a teammate. Said I was voting the teammate but "forgot" in a close lynch. I am not seeing the same person I saw in a recent game where he was civ. When I have more time later I will pull quotes for you. If I forget to do it, tag me this evening.

I would be interested in Juliets take on Kyle as well becasue I believe he replaced MP, who Juliet took flak for poking out of the gate.

Who is on your short list, Eloh?

[S~V~S]

re Kyle, for me it is not unlike how it was for Luna. In that recent game, I suspected her so I paid ALOT of attention to her. And she flipped civ, and I was wrong. So I wanlked away with a fairly deep image of what a civ Luna looks like. When I go hard, and I am wrong, I learn from it. Like last years GOC, I learned alot about Chuck becasue I tunnelled him so hard, and I was wrong.

Then, in here, Luna looked NOTHING like that person. Nothing. So I paid alot of attention to her, and looked for thread to bolster my feelings. It's how I play.

Kyle does not look even a bit like he did as a civ, when for various reasons, I paid a great deal of attention to him in that game as well, becasue sorting him was very important to me. Kyle and Luna are the two people in this thread whom I feel strongest about in my reads for this reason. I spent a lot of time assessing their games in the recent past.

[Elohcin]

I'm in purple

I have never been more happy with a lynch result!!! I don't care what people say about me being compatible with luna. I thought she was civ for a long time and that could be why. But if we were bad together, don't you think we would intentionally NOT be compatible. Derp!

-----------------------------------------------

@S~V~S and @Juliets - Can you explain your thoughts on Jay and Kyle?

See it's posts like that that are the reason I can't clear you. That "Derp". Making someone feel silly for having a suspicion most don't is baddie 101. It's also not something I associate with you as an individual. I don't know you IRL, but you don't strike me as someone who says things like "derp" to people.

This is not RL. It is a game. And yes, those that I am close to and know me well, I have no problem saying derp to them. I also say derp to myself. For instance, I am about to put the milk in the cabinet instead of the fridge..."derp!"

And as I said, "would" is like the word "but" to me. Everything that comes after it is questionable. It's speculation. I have seen a team NK their own member for cred; ALL the teammates violently bus each other out of the gate; out another teammate with fake info, lots of other things I can't recall. Most of us playing in the 10 or 10+ year range have seen more shenanigans than we can remember.

This is Mafia. Almost EVERYTHING is speculation.

So "would" has a place, but it should not be at the head of the table in pride of place.

Jay is being opportunistic in his votes and vague in his suspicions. I know he said he was going to low ball this game, but in the time it took him to write some of those "Dear Dad" schtick posts early in the game he could have written three earnest, real posts. I don't buy the schtick, it felt to me like he was hiding behind it. He felt like he was pocketing people right and left. He does not feel even remotely genuine to me. With love, Jay

Kyle I have to pull quotes etc. But it is more thread based with him. His waffly thing yesterday followed by no actual vote ... I actually did that in a game once to avoid voting for a teammate. Said I was voting the teammate but "forgot" in a close lynch. I am not seeing the same person I saw in a recent game where he was civ. When I have more time later I will pull quotes for you. If I forget to do it, tag me this evening.

Thank you for your input. It will be taken into consideration.

I would be interested in Juliets take on Kyle as well becasue I believe he replaced MP, who Juliet took flak for poking out of the gate.

Who is on your short list, Eloh?

chuck and sprit

[JaggedJimmyJay]

It's comforting to know that I can be completely useless for the whole game and y'all can make the magic happen without me. I'm proud of you. Also I think Kyle is good. His exploratory self-dialogues of the previous day look nice to me at a glance, in that they represent an authentic trove into a largely unknown thread with impartiality. They fill me with warmth. KYLE.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

i just don't know about u sbrityo

[speedchuck]

TBH Sprityo's "I totally have non-cop info on Luna" feels more like an oh-crap-we-just-lost-half-our-scum-team gambit than a real thing that he misread somehow.

[speedchuck]

I agree with S~V~S that anyone could and would do anything, scum or not. Regarding the next moves however, I've got some people I'm treating as town lock and townreads until further notice.

Town Lock IMO:
nutella
S~V~S
sig
novaselinever

Almost Town Lock:
Long Con
ColinisCool

Reading Rainbow
colonialbob
Kylemii
JaggedJimmyJay
Elochin
Enrique
juliets
nijuukyugou
sprityo

[colonialbob]

I agree with S~V~S that anyone could and would do anything, scum or not. Regarding the next moves however, I've got some people I'm treating as town lock and townreads until further notice.

Town Lock IMO:
nutella
S~V~S
sig
novaselinever

Almost Town Lock:
Long Con
ColinisCool

Reading Rainbow
colonialbob
Kylemii
JaggedJimmyJay
Elochin
Enrique
juliets
nijuukyugou
sprityo

Talk to me about Jules and Kyle please.

[Elohcin]

[mention]nutella[/mention] Please tell me your thoughts on Kyle and Jay, and/or anyone in your top 3 of baddiness.

[nutella]

I agree with svs's point about Kyle's "forgetting" to vote. I mean, I could see it either way, I definitely have posted vote tags and forgotten to actually vote until later a few times, but since I already suspect him for behavior in the DH lynch it is sketchy to me.

Then again idk how I feel about Jay townreading him and suspecting sprityo.... hmmm. Do we think we have two mafia left or just one? Team of 5 sounds right to me but we can't be sure. If there are two more I'm trying to figure out if Jay and Kyle or Jay and Sprit would be compatible. That may not be the right way to think about it though. My inclination atm is to go for Kyle first tomorrow and go from there.

[nutella]

@nutella Please tell me your thoughts on Kyle and Jay, and/or anyone in your top 3 of baddiness.

Just talked a bit about Kyle obviously, he stayed aloof during both scum lynches in a suspicious way. Jay has also been aloof with wagony votes.

[Kylemii]

JAY.

[Elohcin]

JAY.

what is this supposed to mean?

[Kylemii]

JAY.

what is this supposed to mean?

Jay shouted at me, so I'm shouting back. Idk what it means, I just like to be part of something.

[nutella]

JAY.

what is this supposed to mean?

I believe it's an inside joke. Far from game content. Kyle do you have reads or anything?

[Kylemii]

[mention]nutella[/mention] [mention]s~v~s[/mention] I've seen your concerns, let me know if there's anything imminent you'd like me to respond to

[Kylemii]

JAY.

what is this supposed to mean?

I believe it's an inside joke. Far from game content. Kyle do you have reads or anything?

no

[Kylemii]

jk I'm working on something upstairs, but I'm making breakfast right now so it'll be a minute

[Kylemii]

my post got deleted overnight x_x

[speedchuck]

I agree with S~V~S that anyone could and would do anything, scum or not. Regarding the next moves however, I've got some people I'm treating as town lock and townreads until further notice.

Town Lock IMO:
nutella
S~V~S
sig
novaselinever

Almost Town Lock:
Long Con
ColinisCool

Reading Rainbow
colonialbob
Kylemii
JaggedJimmyJay
Elochin
Enrique
juliets
nijuukyugou
sprityo

Talk to me about Jules and Kyle please.

Juliet's vote was in a bad place today, and she was on Mac's increasingly accurate list of baddies. She also spent a lot of time talking about the curse mechanics, which could be a way of blending by talking mechanical content. AND she was possessed at the time time I was. If the mafia team coordinated that, it may have been a way of diverting suspicion.
On the other hand, something I just noticed: Juliets has a heckin' TON of content. 2nd highest poster in the game. I don't think Juliets is this talkative while scum, not usually. I'm open to looking into that, but she might be more green in my list after a closer look.

Kylemii's just too genuine to be bad IMO. He posted a vote for Luna and forgot to vote in the poll. I completely believe that. Maybe it's because, where I came from, there were no polls, just thread votes. Or maybe it's just so blatant and borderline metaruling that I can't see him doing it on purpose. I definitely can't see him voting a teammate and forgetting to hit the poll on accident.
He also asks questions that show a genuine effort to get a feel for the game after replacing in. They don't strike me as questions like "I totally don't know who the mafia used possession on you guys."

I'd love to hear other takes, though.

[nutella]

I feel like juliets looks really townie but speed you make some good points and she has fooled me before/had a lot of content in asunder for example.

[nutella]

Also she had that weird deal with the wand nearly mechanically solidifying Luna as bad for her but then she backed off when I showed any doubt about it and didn't end up voting for Luna. Could have been like "hmm looks like she's pretty screwed so I better look convinced, wait never mind the townies don't actually want to lynch her cool let's go with that"

[nutella]

Your take on Kyle is fair as well. Maybe we should pivot focus to Jay (or juliets as we are now)

[nutella]

Actually on the other hand juliets kind of brought luna back into focus, some of us felt more like she was town after the DH lynch and juliets brought up a claim of new info. I don't think she fakes learning about the wand at that time. So never mind I think she's town. I guess she voted for eloh bc she trusted my/others' instincts over her own and that seems genuine.

[speedchuck]

Actually on the other hand juliets kind of brought luna back into focus, some of us felt more like she was town after the DH lynch and juliets brought up a claim of new info. I don't think she fakes learning about the wand at that time. So never mind I think she's town. I guess she voted for eloh bc she trusted my/others' instincts over her own and that seems genuine.

I forgot about that development and missed it when skimming earlier days.

Yeah that sounds good. I can buy Juliets as town.

[speedchuck]

Sprit Niju JJJ Elohcin Enrique

This is my pool at the moment.

If Elohcin is also scum then this will go down as the towniest town that ever towned. All wagons are scum/3p, and all counter wagons are also scum/3p.
Seriously, our only town lynch so far was on a day where everyone was insane.

[Kylemii]

jesus fuck am i glad that i replaced in after day 2,

[speedchuck]

jesus fuck am i glad that i replaced in after day 2,

So you can claim credit for the two scumlynches?

[Kylemii]

ColinisCool - good
Elochin - good
juliets - good
Kylemii - excellent
Long Con - soft good
nutella - good
S~V~S - good
sig - good
speedchuck - good? i think? i feel it in my bones.

Enrique - ??????????????????

JaggedJimmyJay - i don't know what to do with this? he put a little pressure on lunalee in a big long read post early on but didn't seem to do anything with it, listed DH as a positive read and Quin as a nullread. i didn't translate any of his Greek(?) posts so maybe there's something in there. this jay is significantly different from the standard jay experience i'm used to and i don't know what to do with it.

colonialbob - i don't see anything in particular that distances him inexorably from DH or Luna, he's been on and off of both of them at different times, but never to an extent that i'd be like "geez that's harsh" about it, but nothing sets off loud alarm bells either, aside from being on the wrong side of the Luna lynch. i feel like at some point he said or did something that made me think "cbob seems good" but i don't remember what it was, and i think it might have been based on something someone else said cus i don't see it in his posts. needs review

nijuukyugou - nijuu is suspicious because her icon on switch friendlist is a mii rather than a blooper or even an inkling or something thematically consistent and idk, it just feels like i've been catfished i guess. blooper was against luna fairly early on which is a good look. when luna was actually lynched she voted for eloh instead though for these reasons i don't see much that's damning but not much clearing either

novaselinever - nova doesn't have a lot of interaction with mafia members early on but he did ask luna some pretty armor piercing questions, prompting her to reveal her targets, before luna was at real risk of being lynched. if they were teammates this would have had to have been the point he decided to bus her, but i think elohcin was still in the lead at that point(?), it's a lengthy exchange that seems like it may have been pivotal in her lynching. possibility exists that this was a purposeful bus dunking to help him specifically survive til the endgame but my instincts say "nah"

sprityo - there's a little bit to unpack here. mafia!sprityo specifically requires him to have made a bold plan to clear luna by declaring/implying information or i guess just figuring stuff out really well, it'd be a nice desperation move. he did go from implying info to implying not info and then implying info again after she died and flipped mafia which is a little shady. saying "i guess i read the info wrong". sprityo is a valid place to look next. except maybe not? it appears he has said some other info stuff, regarding blooper, it'd be good to review his stuff again i guess to see what impact it's had and whether or not it could be fake

[Kylemii]

jesus fuck am i glad that i replaced in after day 2,

So you can claim credit for the two scumlynches?

no cus everything before that was incomprehensible garbage, i'm well aware that if/when this game results in a win it won't be because of me being here.

but i'll do what i can.

[Kylemii]

top 10 reasons to trust cbob, go go go go go

[nutella]

Mmmm Nova is totally lock town but you may have a point that I should take another look at cbob. I don't remember how good he looked in the DH lynch.

[sprityo]

Y’all can hypothesize all you want, I’ll just claim my role when the time comes, so go ahead and look at someone else

At the very least I can screw over the mafia one last time before I’m offed

[Kylemii]

nova was supposed to be light green or yellow, i fucked up my color scheme

[Long Con]

WTF why am I "soft good" and everyone else is "good"?

[speedchuck]

top 10 reasons to trust cbob, go go go go go

1. He's literally all of the Presidents.
2. He was vote forced d3
3. Voted DH at some point in the day of DH's death
4. One of the ones who pushed Luna to reveal things which sorta lead to her lynch
5. We already lynched the poor dude once, give him a break
6. Most of the points he's made are reasonable and fair
7. He did something useful with his curse when he could have hidden behind it
8. He's not Sprityo or Niju
9. He plays Smash Bros.
10. Trusting people is better than being distrustful

[speedchuck]

WTF why am I "soft good" and everyone else is "good"?

*poke poke*

Because u soft

[sprityo]

I mean lynching me double confirms long con and nijuu as not mafia

so I’m not entirely against it.

[speedchuck]

I mean lynching me double confirms long con and nijuu as not mafia

so I’m not entirely against it.

In the same way you confirmed Luna to be not-mafia orrrrr

[sprityo]

I mean lynching me double confirms long con and nijuu as not mafia

so I’m not entirely against it.

In the same way you confirmed Luna to be not-mafia orrrrr

Nono, Luna was actually me misreading

Long con and nijuu were specifically mafia targets