Hot Fuzz Mafia [GAME OVER]

[Porscha]

Yeah but I also imagine there is no good reason for a wolf nook to even bring up his mistake either
He is just outting his role entirely

[Porscha]

Ranking whoever are aliving.

Phraze

Obscurity
Falcon
Porscha
Seanzie
pxxy
Schiavetto
Anne
Neon
DrWilgy
Creature
Nanook

Based off limited impression from posts seen at random. Middle is null. Bottom is a mixup of rands. Nanook I dislike for the fake checks.

I think list not very informed (bad). Ruri probs town

[obscurity]

Yeah but I also imagine there is no good reason for a wolf nook to even bring up his mistake either
He is just outting his role entirely

That's a fair point. I'm just a bit skeptical of stuff he claims regardless after what he pulled previously. But it's sloppy enough it likely comes from town, in addition to the other things in his favor.

I will try to neatly pull up the stuff I feel looks bad for Neon at some point.

[obscurity]

Alright

Reads

Because you want those

Mac town
Creature town
Jack lock town

Sabi is scum yall blind

So Neon is claiming the Jack read was a meme but seemed to carry it to the point where it made their list.

[Porscha]

Does wolf neon include partners: 1 jack town read and 1 wolf sabi read tho?

[Porscha]

I kinda feel like unless neon and anne are exactly wolf paired and the plan was to throw sabi into the well right off the bat then it is town vision

[obscurity]

*shrug*

Aside from the meme Jack read, their treatment around Jack is kind of limp. It's hard to say because they were basically absent the day he got chopped though.

[obscurity]

Can you pull the quotes you think look the worst for Wilgy?

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

I didn't even realize you moved your vote. I was watching votes EOD though and yeah, it wouldn't have mattered.

I guess NANOOK calling out Jack for looking bad after his reaction test was a plus point too, though I'm not sure how much stake to put into that since there was already a lot of momentum against Jack.

Jack probably mafia lol, probably with one of falcon/schia/ruri

This is really just falcon/schia imo, I think ruri had a pretty town reaction

Can you elaborate on this? Do you still believe one of Falcon/Schia is mafia?

He was setting up to push a world where all three are town and I am too, which is...not a super viable approach if we're all three town, I think? Might be straight tmi, idk, but I tend to think it means I included a partner

Alright, will look at that though I think Jack did TMI a couple things.

So you have a no motion on Creature? Do you have any other checks?

I was reading NANOOK as unpaired with Jack, mostly because he pushed Jack without any wiggle room and Jack had a lamesauce reason to clear NANOOK, but possible I'm off-base here, I don't find him very villagery outside of that. The motion detect thing is kind of weird. But I dunno.

What makes it the motion detection weird?

I don't get how you confuse Creature and Wilgy.

I have a motion on him

I just conflated which one defended and which one pushed him. Im...kinda out of it.

[pyxxy]

I should probably also be town cause what mafia team has two motion detects lol

o you think that town has multiple motion detectors in this setup?

Cough cough.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

I should probably also be town cause what mafia team has two motion detects lol

o you think that town has multiple motion detectors in this setup?

Cough cough.

Much more likely than mafia having two lol

Particularly given mine is one shot

[obscurity]

You have a positive motion on Creature?

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Yes thats what I said

[obscurity]

Lol if Creature got outed by an error.. that's not a red check though, but that increases odds of being mafia, no?

[obscurity]

But I feel like Creature's treatment around Jack was extremely unpaired.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Idk there seem to be a lot of moving roles, and they could have visited by someone to trigger it

Its also possible they're a mason lol

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Thats why I dont really want to push it atp

[obscurity]

Yeah sure. If they have any results or W/E they should out it at this point through because that's basically a death sentence check if they're town PR.

[pyxxy]

ounds like we should drop it.

[Seanzie]

I was reading NANOOK as unpaired with Jack, mostly because he pushed Jack without any wiggle room and Jack had a lamesauce reason to clear NANOOK, but possible I'm off-base here, I don't find him very villagery outside of that. The motion detect thing is kind of weird. But I dunno.

I'm having a hard time with some of your takes. Nook ended up pivoting off Jack when it mattered. How is that "without any wiggle room"?

[obscurity]

I was reading NANOOK as unpaired with Jack, mostly because he pushed Jack without any wiggle room and Jack had a lamesauce reason to clear NANOOK, but possible I'm off-base here, I don't find him very villagery outside of that. The motion detect thing is kind of weird. But I dunno.

I'm having a hard time with some of your takes. Nook ended up pivoting off Jack when it mattered. How is that "without any wiggle room"?

did this happen the day Lily died?

i'm having a little trouble with the specifics in votes/remembering that when I can't pull it up and it's not posted frequently like on FoL, i'm more-so thinking Nanook was calling Jack mafia all day. it was part of why I was 98% sure that there was a mafia in NOOK/Jack, the dynamic seemed unpure.

[Seanzie]

I was reading NANOOK as unpaired with Jack, mostly because he pushed Jack without any wiggle room and Jack had a lamesauce reason to clear NANOOK, but possible I'm off-base here, I don't find him very villagery outside of that. The motion detect thing is kind of weird. But I dunno.

I'm having a hard time with some of your takes. Nook ended up pivoting off Jack when it mattered. How is that "without any wiggle room"?

did this happen the day Lily died?

i'm having a little trouble with the specifics in votes/remembering that when I can't pull it up and it's not posted frequently like on FoL, i'm more-so thinking Nanook was calling Jack mafia all day. it was part of why I was 98% sure that there was a mafia in NOOK/Jack, the dynamic seemed unpure.

The day Lily died, Nook stayed on Jack, and Nook also knew Jack was in no danger. The day Jack died, Nook found a reason to get off Jack's wagon at a time where it really could have gone either way.

[obscurity]

I was reading NANOOK as unpaired with Jack, mostly because he pushed Jack without any wiggle room and Jack had a lamesauce reason to clear NANOOK, but possible I'm off-base here, I don't find him very villagery outside of that. The motion detect thing is kind of weird. But I dunno.

I'm having a hard time with some of your takes. Nook ended up pivoting off Jack when it mattered. How is that "without any wiggle room"?

did this happen the day Lily died?

i'm having a little trouble with the specifics in votes/remembering that when I can't pull it up and it's not posted frequently like on FoL, i'm more-so thinking Nanook was calling Jack mafia all day. it was part of why I was 98% sure that there was a mafia in NOOK/Jack, the dynamic seemed unpure.

The day Lily died, Nook stayed on Jack, and Nook also knew Jack was in no danger. The day Jack died, Nook found a reason to get off Jack's wagon at a time where it really could have gone either way.

what I remember is it was 6-3 around EOD time. I think the closest it got was 6-4. I was watching the votes at this point because I was going to vote for Jack rather than my vanity wagon if Creature was in any sort of real danger, so I didn't really see it as "could go either way" or I may have viewed it differently. i kind of feel like bussing Jack all day only to pivot that EOD in a way that didn't really impact anything would be a lame W/W strategy, though.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

I was reading NANOOK as unpaired with Jack, mostly because he pushed Jack without any wiggle room and Jack had a lamesauce reason to clear NANOOK, but possible I'm off-base here, I don't find him very villagery outside of that. The motion detect thing is kind of weird. But I dunno.

I'm having a hard time with some of your takes. Nook ended up pivoting off Jack when it mattered. How is that "without any wiggle room"?

did this happen the day Lily died?

i'm having a little trouble with the specifics in votes/remembering that when I can't pull it up and it's not posted frequently like on FoL, i'm more-so thinking Nanook was calling Jack mafia all day. it was part of why I was 98% sure that there was a mafia in NOOK/Jack, the dynamic seemed unpure.

The day Lily died, Nook stayed on Jack, and Nook also knew Jack was in no danger. The day Jack died, Nook found a reason to get off Jack's wagon at a time where it really could have gone either way.

Who did I move to, sean

[pyxxy]

I was reading NANOOK as unpaired with Jack, mostly because he pushed Jack without any wiggle room and Jack had a lamesauce reason to clear NANOOK, but possible I'm off-base here, I don't find him very villagery outside of that. The motion detect thing is kind of weird. But I dunno.

I'm having a hard time with some of your takes. Nook ended up pivoting off Jack when it mattered. How is that "without any wiggle room"?

did this happen the day Lily died?

i'm having a little trouble with the specifics in votes/remembering that when I can't pull it up and it's not posted frequently like on FoL, i'm more-so thinking Nanook was calling Jack mafia all day. it was part of why I was 98% sure that there was a mafia in NOOK/Jack, the dynamic seemed unpure.

The day Lily died, Nook stayed on Jack, and Nook also knew Jack was in no danger. The day Jack died, Nook found a reason to get off Jack's wagon at a time where it really could have gone either way.

Who did I move to, sean

ou moved to the NK. Nook.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Like think about it for 2 seconds and look at the vc and tell me that's where I land if im Jack's partner that decided "you know what actually I dont want to bus now"

Try to make a smart read on me for once in your life

[pyxxy]

I was reading NANOOK as unpaired with Jack, mostly because he pushed Jack without any wiggle room and Jack had a lamesauce reason to clear NANOOK, but possible I'm off-base here, I don't find him very villagery outside of that. The motion detect thing is kind of weird. But I dunno.

I'm having a hard time with some of your takes. Nook ended up pivoting off Jack when it mattered. How is that "without any wiggle room"?

did this happen the day Lily died?

i'm having a little trouble with the specifics in votes/remembering that when I can't pull it up and it's not posted frequently like on FoL, i'm more-so thinking Nanook was calling Jack mafia all day. it was part of why I was 98% sure that there was a mafia in NOOK/Jack, the dynamic seemed unpure.

The day Lily died, Nook stayed on Jack, and Nook also knew Jack was in no danger. The day Jack died, Nook found a reason to get off Jack's wagon at a time where it really could have gone either way.

Who did I move to, sean

ou moved to the NK. Nook.

ops that's me confusing D3 and D4 again, ignore this

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

No its accurate I moved to lucy

Does that seem like the most viable place to try and save a partner to you?

[Creature]

Alright I am feeling lazy rn because there's no one who clearly needs to be resolved like Jack yesterday.

idk what to make out of NANOOK's motion detector claim. It looks so weird to come from either alignment.

[Creature]

Oh did I just become a Made Man?

[Creature]

I guess Ruri should be pretty much clear atp? She's claiming 2-shot doctor and a strongman already flipped.

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Alright

Reads

Because you want those

Mac town
Creature town
Jack lock town

Sabi is scum yall blind

So Neon is claiming the Jack read was a meme but seemed to carry it to the point where it made their list.

I literally TRd Jack because and I quote "I like the Miz."

If you actually believe that I seriously town read Jack I have a bridge to sell you in London.

Like seriously go reach somewhere else. Wolf Neon is more capable than TRing a team mate because of a wrestling gimmick and now capable of distancing than... any of this. And town Neon does stupid shit like TR people early based on things like how much I like their avatars or how they respond to whatever stupid question I make up that day. Sometimes I even carry that read forever lol.

[Creature]

Alright so who can we clear?

I think Ruri is pretty much clear for her doctor claim unless there's a counterclaim.

Seanzie should be pretty much clear for actively pushing Jack D3 and D4.

I'm tempted to clear pyxxy too because idk if they would bus Jack yesterday but I might be underestimating them.

What are your all thoughts on Porscha? Is she out of wolf range?

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

*shrug*

Aside from the meme Jack read, their treatment around Jack is kind of limp. It's hard to say because they were basically absent the day he got chopped though.

Just to be clear I don't know what the end wagons were but I always consolidate EoD and would've ended up on Jack based on my read back.

[Seanzie]

Like think about it for 2 seconds and look at the vc and tell me that's where I land if im Jack's partner that decided "you know what actually I dont want to bus now"

Try to make a smart read on me for once in your life

I'm trying to get insight into Obscurity's head right now, not yours. Their take that you were on Jack without wiggle room is patently false. I am trying to figure out what that means about Obscurity, so let me speak to them.

[obscurity]

Alright

Reads

Because you want those

Mac town
Creature town
Jack lock town

Sabi is scum yall blind

So Neon is claiming the Jack read was a meme but seemed to carry it to the point where it made their list.

I literally TRd Jack because and I quote "I like the Miz."

If you actually believe that I seriously town read Jack I have a bridge to sell you in London.

Like seriously go reach somewhere else. Wolf Neon is more capable than TRing a team mate because of a wrestling gimmick and now capable of distancing than... any of this. And town Neon does stupid shit like TR people early based on things like how much I like their avatars or how they respond to whatever stupid question I make up that day. Sometimes I even carry that read forever lol.

Who do you think is mafia?

Like, I don't know what "wolf!Neon" is capable of. I will say that I don't want to ignore Mac's dead on you and I'm not locked on your being mafia.I think the read on Jack could reasonably come from v!you, but I was weighing it in addition to a couple other things (a lot of people looking really good in relation to Jack, you falling off a bit, Jack/Sabi's respective treatments of you having some pingy moments). I felt like the Jack thing was pressed enough to seem like a real thing that came out of a meme, but the read was more of an overall thing. I'd rather not waste time with people defending themselves though, because when this happened in the past with Jack + Lucy it just came off as an attack at me, and I'm just trying to figure out the mafia. It's not helpful when a lot of people's pushes have seemed meta founded and I haven't been able to follow.

[Seanzie]

I was reading NANOOK as unpaired with Jack, mostly because he pushed Jack without any wiggle room and Jack had a lamesauce reason to clear NANOOK, but possible I'm off-base here, I don't find him very villagery outside of that. The motion detect thing is kind of weird. But I dunno.

I'm having a hard time with some of your takes. Nook ended up pivoting off Jack when it mattered. How is that "without any wiggle room"?

did this happen the day Lily died?

i'm having a little trouble with the specifics in votes/remembering that when I can't pull it up and it's not posted frequently like on FoL, i'm more-so thinking Nanook was calling Jack mafia all day. it was part of why I was 98% sure that there was a mafia in NOOK/Jack, the dynamic seemed unpure.

The day Lily died, Nook stayed on Jack, and Nook also knew Jack was in no danger. The day Jack died, Nook found a reason to get off Jack's wagon at a time where it really could have gone either way.

what I remember is it was 6-3 around EOD time. I think the closest it got was 6-4. I was watching the votes at this point because I was going to vote for Jack rather than my vanity wagon if Creature was in any sort of real danger, so I didn't really see it as "could go either way" or I may have viewed it differently. i kind of feel like bussing Jack all day only to pivot that EOD in a way that didn't really impact anything would be a lame W/W strategy, though.

I don't remember the exact VC, but there was a time when it was something like

Jack (3): Seanzie, Creature, Nanook

Creature (3): Jack, Falcon, Wilgy

Possibly Jack (4) or something, within the last hour of D4. There was some support for further Jack votes in thread, but Nook got off Jack around this point, and I think shortly after Lucy got on Jack, which then lead to a few others to get on Jack. At that point, it definitely could have gone either way, Wilgy was in the thread pushing for Creature, I think maybe you were in the thread pushing for creature, and some people were saying they'd vote Jack, but weren't voting.

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Alright

Reads

Because you want those

Mac town
Creature town
Jack lock town

Sabi is scum yall blind

So Neon is claiming the Jack read was a meme but seemed to carry it to the point where it made their list.

I literally TRd Jack because and I quote "I like the Miz."

If you actually believe that I seriously town read Jack I have a bridge to sell you in London.

Like seriously go reach somewhere else. Wolf Neon is more capable than TRing a team mate because of a wrestling gimmick and now capable of distancing than... any of this. And town Neon does stupid shit like TR people early based on things like how much I like their avatars or how they respond to whatever stupid question I make up that day. Sometimes I even carry that read forever lol.

Who do you think is mafia?

Like, I don't know what "wolf!Neon" is capable of. I will say that I don't want to ignore Mac's dead on you and I'm not locked on your being mafia.I think the read on Jack could reasonably come from v!you, but I was weighing it in addition to a couple other things (a lot of people looking really good in relation to Jack, you falling off a bit, Jack/Sabi's respective treatments of you having some pingy moments). I felt like the Jack thing was pressed enough to seem like a real thing that came out of a meme, but the read was more of an overall thing. I'd rather not waste time with people defending themselves though, because when this happened in the past with Jack + Lucy it just came off as an attack at me, and I'm just trying to figure out the mafia. It's not helpful when a lot of people's pushes have seemed meta founded and I haven't been able to follow.

Asking me who the mafia is will rarely return the results you want. Unless i see something that pings me hard I have nothing to say.

I probably don't have something to say if I don't say it. Right now I'm looking at you and wilgy. I think Jack was at points savable yesterday and I think that woofs are in a bad position with Jack dying on this situation so I think at the very least 1 woofer would go all in on trying to save Jack.

In my experience people who treat my slot the way you are generally are woofs. I do not think your approach to me is fair or valid. I wonder because you are loud and leading town but you've been loud and leading town away from woofs and knowing that I'm town your leading them into town.

[obscurity]

I was reading NANOOK as unpaired with Jack, mostly because he pushed Jack without any wiggle room and Jack had a lamesauce reason to clear NANOOK, but possible I'm off-base here, I don't find him very villagery outside of that. The motion detect thing is kind of weird. But I dunno.

I'm having a hard time with some of your takes. Nook ended up pivoting off Jack when it mattered. How is that "without any wiggle room"?

did this happen the day Lily died?

i'm having a little trouble with the specifics in votes/remembering that when I can't pull it up and it's not posted frequently like on FoL, i'm more-so thinking Nanook was calling Jack mafia all day. it was part of why I was 98% sure that there was a mafia in NOOK/Jack, the dynamic seemed unpure.

The day Lily died, Nook stayed on Jack, and Nook also knew Jack was in no danger. The day Jack died, Nook found a reason to get off Jack's wagon at a time where it really could have gone either way.

what I remember is it was 6-3 around EOD time. I think the closest it got was 6-4. I was watching the votes at this point because I was going to vote for Jack rather than my vanity wagon if Creature was in any sort of real danger, so I didn't really see it as "could go either way" or I may have viewed it differently. i kind of feel like bussing Jack all day only to pivot that EOD in a way that didn't really impact anything would be a lame W/W strategy, though.

I don't remember the exact VC, but there was a time when it was something like

Jack (3): Seanzie, Creature, Nanook

Creature (3): Jack, Falcon, Wilgy

Possibly Jack (4) or something, within the last hour of D4. There was some support for further Jack votes in thread, but Nook got off Jack around this point, and I think shortly after Lucy got on Jack, which then lead to a few others to get on Jack. At that point, it definitely could have gone either way, Wilgy was in the thread pushing for Creature, I think maybe you were in the thread pushing for creature, and some people were saying they'd vote Jack, but weren't voting.

It was around the last 5-10 minutes of EOD (after I was post-capped) that I was following the vote, and at this point Jack had 6 (I think Anne hopped on) and it wasn't particularly close, so this is what I was weighing in - I just checked and you're correct about NOOK switching but I stand by believing it wouldn't have impacted anything at this point which is why I wasn't factoring it in.

I was not in the thread pushing for Creature though - I've had Creature as probably my most unwavering townread since early. I said a few times that I thought Jack would flip town, but I also believed that flipping Jack was the right thing to do because he needed to be resolved, so if I thought Creature was going to be in danger at any point I would've voted Jack (I was post-capped on Falcon so this is me saying take my word for it), but it is consistent with what I talked about all day and wanting the end vote to be in Jack/NANOOK.

[Seanzie]

I was reading NANOOK as unpaired with Jack, mostly because he pushed Jack without any wiggle room and Jack had a lamesauce reason to clear NANOOK, but possible I'm off-base here, I don't find him very villagery outside of that. The motion detect thing is kind of weird. But I dunno.

I'm having a hard time with some of your takes. Nook ended up pivoting off Jack when it mattered. How is that "without any wiggle room"?

did this happen the day Lily died?

i'm having a little trouble with the specifics in votes/remembering that when I can't pull it up and it's not posted frequently like on FoL, i'm more-so thinking Nanook was calling Jack mafia all day. it was part of why I was 98% sure that there was a mafia in NOOK/Jack, the dynamic seemed unpure.

The day Lily died, Nook stayed on Jack, and Nook also knew Jack was in no danger. The day Jack died, Nook found a reason to get off Jack's wagon at a time where it really could have gone either way.

what I remember is it was 6-3 around EOD time. I think the closest it got was 6-4. I was watching the votes at this point because I was going to vote for Jack rather than my vanity wagon if Creature was in any sort of real danger, so I didn't really see it as "could go either way" or I may have viewed it differently. i kind of feel like bussing Jack all day only to pivot that EOD in a way that didn't really impact anything would be a lame W/W strategy, though.

I don't remember the exact VC, but there was a time when it was something like

Jack (3): Seanzie, Creature, Nanook

Creature (3): Jack, Falcon, Wilgy

Possibly Jack (4) or something, within the last hour of D4. There was some support for further Jack votes in thread, but Nook got off Jack around this point, and I think shortly after Lucy got on Jack, which then lead to a few others to get on Jack. At that point, it definitely could have gone either way, Wilgy was in the thread pushing for Creature, I think maybe you were in the thread pushing for creature, and some people were saying they'd vote Jack, but weren't voting.

It was around the last 5-10 minutes of EOD (after I was post-capped) that I was following the vote, and at this point Jack had 6 (I think Anne hopped on) and it wasn't particularly close, so this is what I was weighing in - I just checked and you're correct about NOOK switching but I stand by believing it wouldn't have impacted anything at this point which is why I wasn't factoring it in.

I was not in the thread pushing for Creature though - I've had Creature as probably my most unwavering townread since early. I said a few times that I thought Jack would flip town, but I also believed that flipping Jack was the right thing to do because he needed to be resolved, so if I thought Creature was going to be in danger at any point I would've voted Jack (I was post-capped on Falcon so this is me saying take my word for it), but it is consistent with what I talked about all day and wanting the end vote to be in Jack/NANOOK.

I'll take your word on you not being the one I was thinking about vocalizing a creature scum-read at a critical time..

However I still have a hard time following your logic. Regardless of what the VC was 5 minutes before EoD, that wasn't the gamestate when Nook moved, so I don't see why you would judge Nook's movements based on a later gamestate. The 6 votes on Jack came, at least partially, from me strongly sensing that Town!Creature was going to go over, and strongly pushing the thread to vote Jack, all which happened after Nook moved.

So, knowing now the gamestate how it was when Nook moved, what do you think of them?

[obscurity]

Alright

Reads

Because you want those

Mac town
Creature town
Jack lock town

Sabi is scum yall blind

So Neon is claiming the Jack read was a meme but seemed to carry it to the point where it made their list.

I literally TRd Jack because and I quote "I like the Miz."

If you actually believe that I seriously town read Jack I have a bridge to sell you in London.

Like seriously go reach somewhere else. Wolf Neon is more capable than TRing a team mate because of a wrestling gimmick and now capable of distancing than... any of this. And town Neon does stupid shit like TR people early based on things like how much I like their avatars or how they respond to whatever stupid question I make up that day. Sometimes I even carry that read forever lol.

Who do you think is mafia?

Like, I don't know what "wolf!Neon" is capable of. I will say that I don't want to ignore Mac's dead on you and I'm not locked on your being mafia.I think the read on Jack could reasonably come from v!you, but I was weighing it in addition to a couple other things (a lot of people looking really good in relation to Jack, you falling off a bit, Jack/Sabi's respective treatments of you having some pingy moments). I felt like the Jack thing was pressed enough to seem like a real thing that came out of a meme, but the read was more of an overall thing. I'd rather not waste time with people defending themselves though, because when this happened in the past with Jack + Lucy it just came off as an attack at me, and I'm just trying to figure out the mafia. It's not helpful when a lot of people's pushes have seemed meta founded and I haven't been able to follow.

Asking me who the mafia is will rarely return the results you want. Unless i see something that pings me hard I have nothing to say.

I probably don't have something to say if I don't say it. Right now I'm looking at you and wilgy. I think Jack was at points savable yesterday and I think that woofs are in a bad position with Jack dying on this situation so I think at the very least 1 woofer would go all in on trying to save Jack.

In my experience people who treat my slot the way you are generally are woofs. I do not think your approach to me is fair or valid. I wonder because you are loud and leading town but you've been loud and leading town away from woofs and knowing that I'm town your leading them into town.

I was definitely not trying to save Jack though. The Creature wagon that popped up I believe was Wilgy/Falcon/+1, not sure the +1 or +2 actually? But that would've been the main attempt to save Jack.

I mean, I also would've played it very differently as mafia, and actually taken a strong stance against Jack to look good there, either bussed hard or tried to save him, rather than a limp fish "well Jack will prob flip town but he needs to die" type thing.

And like.. I think it was pretty obvious that Jack was trying to specifically appeal to me/pocket me. When I tried to switch onto him/started to come around on Lily being V D2, he basically pinged me and said he thought I was better than that.

And idk, I came into today thinking you were mafia but I'm not sure anymore. Can you elaborate on why you don't think it's fair? Like, the Jack flip basically turned my entire POE around, and the having been "loud and wrong" part is why I'm considering you in the first place, because I'm one of the people who had been loudly calling you town, and I'm struggling because I realize I've been wrong on my main reads this game. That said I don't think anything wrong I've done has majorly impeded things as I did accept Jack needed to die.

[obscurity]

Vote: Jack

To be great like Mac I must channel my inner Mac

Also he probably doesn't die if he's wrong about all of his other reads so Seanzie/Jack likely has one.

@obscurity

Fucking why?

Look at my exchanges with Sabi and tell me we're paired. She was my very first suspect and I pointed out scummy thing they said that nobody else did. I'm in my town meta. Some of the votes on me are nonsense gut reads but I expect better from your slot.

This AtE specifically is a lot of why I was struggling with him in the first place.

[anne]

Hi. Was gonna do some backreading and make reads and stuff but work was unexpectedly busy today so will attempt to do that now-ish

[obscurity]

I'm having a hard time with some of your takes. Nook ended up pivoting off Jack when it mattered. How is that "without any wiggle room"?

did this happen the day Lily died?

i'm having a little trouble with the specifics in votes/remembering that when I can't pull it up and it's not posted frequently like on FoL, i'm more-so thinking Nanook was calling Jack mafia all day. it was part of why I was 98% sure that there was a mafia in NOOK/Jack, the dynamic seemed unpure.

The day Lily died, Nook stayed on Jack, and Nook also knew Jack was in no danger. The day Jack died, Nook found a reason to get off Jack's wagon at a time where it really could have gone either way.

what I remember is it was 6-3 around EOD time. I think the closest it got was 6-4. I was watching the votes at this point because I was going to vote for Jack rather than my vanity wagon if Creature was in any sort of real danger, so I didn't really see it as "could go either way" or I may have viewed it differently. i kind of feel like bussing Jack all day only to pivot that EOD in a way that didn't really impact anything would be a lame W/W strategy, though.

I don't remember the exact VC, but there was a time when it was something like

Jack (3): Seanzie, Creature, Nanook

Creature (3): Jack, Falcon, Wilgy

Possibly Jack (4) or something, within the last hour of D4. There was some support for further Jack votes in thread, but Nook got off Jack around this point, and I think shortly after Lucy got on Jack, which then lead to a few others to get on Jack. At that point, it definitely could have gone either way, Wilgy was in the thread pushing for Creature, I think maybe you were in the thread pushing for creature, and some people were saying they'd vote Jack, but weren't voting.

It was around the last 5-10 minutes of EOD (after I was post-capped) that I was following the vote, and at this point Jack had 6 (I think Anne hopped on) and it wasn't particularly close, so this is what I was weighing in - I just checked and you're correct about NOOK switching but I stand by believing it wouldn't have impacted anything at this point which is why I wasn't factoring it in.

I was not in the thread pushing for Creature though - I've had Creature as probably my most unwavering townread since early. I said a few times that I thought Jack would flip town, but I also believed that flipping Jack was the right thing to do because he needed to be resolved, so if I thought Creature was going to be in danger at any point I would've voted Jack (I was post-capped on Falcon so this is me saying take my word for it), but it is consistent with what I talked about all day and wanting the end vote to be in Jack/NANOOK.

I'll take your word on you not being the one I was thinking about vocalizing a creature scum-read at a critical time..

However I still have a hard time following your logic. Regardless of what the VC was 5 minutes before EoD, that wasn't the gamestate when Nook moved, so I don't see why you would judge Nook's movements based on a later gamestate. The 6 votes on Jack came, at least partially, from me strongly sensing that Town!Creature was going to go over, and strongly pushing the thread to vote Jack, all which happened after Nook moved.

So, knowing now the gamestate how it was when Nook moved, what do you think of them?

mm okay I see your point re: the move. I still sort of feel like it's unlikely that a wolf takes a hard stance onto a partner for most of the day only to waver later. I guess I'm viewing it as NANOOK/you/Creature all being the crux of the momentum against Jack, but I would not outrule the possibility of him being mafia and it's something I've mulled over today back and forth because I was scumreading him yesterday, but viewing him/Jack as different.

@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME can you explain your mindset behind moving at this point?

[anne]

okay, so i immediately know nanook's motion detect on creature isnt real lol

[anne]

looks like wolves were looking to bus sabi p early on into the game according to jack's early posting, it wasn't until a bit later they thought maybe they could save her. jack seems like the kind of wolf that can't resist tmi'ing his partners as wolf so the early iso also looks sort of bad for neon, but there is some outside stuff that makes me doubt that.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

okay, so i immediately know nanook's motion detect on creature isnt real lol

This one is, hard claim never rescind

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

did this happen the day Lily died?

i'm having a little trouble with the specifics in votes/remembering that when I can't pull it up and it's not posted frequently like on FoL, i'm more-so thinking Nanook was calling Jack mafia all day. it was part of why I was 98% sure that there was a mafia in NOOK/Jack, the dynamic seemed unpure.

The day Lily died, Nook stayed on Jack, and Nook also knew Jack was in no danger. The day Jack died, Nook found a reason to get off Jack's wagon at a time where it really could have gone either way.

what I remember is it was 6-3 around EOD time. I think the closest it got was 6-4. I was watching the votes at this point because I was going to vote for Jack rather than my vanity wagon if Creature was in any sort of real danger, so I didn't really see it as "could go either way" or I may have viewed it differently. i kind of feel like bussing Jack all day only to pivot that EOD in a way that didn't really impact anything would be a lame W/W strategy, though.

I don't remember the exact VC, but there was a time when it was something like

Jack (3): Seanzie, Creature, Nanook

Creature (3): Jack, Falcon, Wilgy

Possibly Jack (4) or something, within the last hour of D4. There was some support for further Jack votes in thread, but Nook got off Jack around this point, and I think shortly after Lucy got on Jack, which then lead to a few others to get on Jack. At that point, it definitely could have gone either way, Wilgy was in the thread pushing for Creature, I think maybe you were in the thread pushing for creature, and some people were saying they'd vote Jack, but weren't voting.

It was around the last 5-10 minutes of EOD (after I was post-capped) that I was following the vote, and at this point Jack had 6 (I think Anne hopped on) and it wasn't particularly close, so this is what I was weighing in - I just checked and you're correct about NOOK switching but I stand by believing it wouldn't have impacted anything at this point which is why I wasn't factoring it in.

I was not in the thread pushing for Creature though - I've had Creature as probably my most unwavering townread since early. I said a few times that I thought Jack would flip town, but I also believed that flipping Jack was the right thing to do because he needed to be resolved, so if I thought Creature was going to be in danger at any point I would've voted Jack (I was post-capped on Falcon so this is me saying take my word for it), but it is consistent with what I talked about all day and wanting the end vote to be in Jack/NANOOK.

I'll take your word on you not being the one I was thinking about vocalizing a creature scum-read at a critical time..

However I still have a hard time following your logic. Regardless of what the VC was 5 minutes before EoD, that wasn't the gamestate when Nook moved, so I don't see why you would judge Nook's movements based on a later gamestate. The 6 votes on Jack came, at least partially, from me strongly sensing that Town!Creature was going to go over, and strongly pushing the thread to vote Jack, all which happened after Nook moved.

So, knowing now the gamestate how it was when Nook moved, what do you think of them?

mm okay I see your point re: the move. I still sort of feel like it's unlikely that a wolf takes a hard stance onto a partner for most of the day only to waver later. I guess I'm viewing it as NANOOK/you/Creature all being the crux of the momentum against Jack, but I would not outrule the possibility of him being mafia and it's something I've mulled over today back and forth because I was scumreading him yesterday, but viewing him/Jack as different.

@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME can you explain your mindset behind moving at this point?

Sorry I have to ask Sean if im allowed to weigh in yet or not

[anne]

probably one between falcon and wilgy just based off of the way jack positioned them. jack's townread on falcon really made no sense and i can sooner believe he was tmi'ing wilgy town over falcon of all people lol. plus he treated wilgy more similarly to how he treated me. also porscha interactions with jack look p good.

[anne]

pxxy probably spewed town for dumb reasons