Hot Fuzz Mafia [GAME OVER]

[Porscha]

It's OK if you think I'm scum since the dawn of time. I am non-plussed

[obscurity]

Also I'm in a game for the first time on a new site where literally everyone knows each other so obviously I'm going to have a disadvantage.

[Porscha]

Asking me who the mafia is will rarely return the results you want. Unless i see something that pings me hard I have nothing to say.

I probably don't have something to say if I don't say it. Right now I'm looking at you and wilgy. I think Jack was at points savable yesterday and I think that woofs are in a bad position with Jack dying on this situation so I think at the very least 1 woofer would go all in on trying to save Jack.

In my experience people who treat my slot the way you are generally are woofs. I do not think your approach to me is fair or valid. I wonder because you are loud and leading town but you've been loud and leading town away from woofs and knowing that I'm town your leading them into town.

I was definitely not trying to save Jack though. The Creature wagon that popped up I believe was Wilgy/Falcon/+1, not sure the +1 or +2 actually? But that would've been the main attempt to save Jack.

I mean, I also would've played it very differently as mafia, and actually taken a strong stance against Jack to look good there, either bussed hard or tried to save him, rather than a limp fish "well Jack will prob flip town but he needs to die" type thing.

And like.. I think it was pretty obvious that Jack was trying to specifically appeal to me/pocket me. When I tried to switch onto him/started to come around on Lily being V D2, he basically pinged me and said he thought I was better than that.

And idk, I came into today thinking you were mafia but I'm not sure anymore. Can you elaborate on why you don't think it's fair? Like, the Jack flip basically turned my entire POE around, and the having been "loud and wrong" part is why I'm considering you in the first place, because I'm one of the people who had been loudly calling you town, and I'm struggling because I realize I've been wrong on my main reads this game. That said I don't think anything wrong I've done has majorly impeded things as I did accept Jack needed to die.

Hedgy hedging is rarely a town trait

This feels needlessly dismissive and doesn't even answer my question.

There is literally no question here. And you are scum.

Yes there is. I asked you why you don't think it's fair. And I'm trying to find you if we're both town so I can solve this game but if you're going to act like this I will push on you and have zero regrets if you flip town.

You can kill another town you've been very good at that. I hope town can eventually see that all your bad faith pushes have done nothing but kill town and that your continued weak defense of Jack was so wishy washy and Hedgy that you can sit here and go well clearly I wasn't really protecting him. Which is also scummy.

So if your town your wolf siding and this push your leading on me another town will just get you killed tomorrow and if you're wolf like I REALLY think you are right now because of your approach to me your just another wolf I've found that town is too blind to ever push onto like I dunno that happens a lot and I'm right a lot.

I still have literally no idea what your asking me...

omg queen slay...........

[anne]

you can ate me instead obscurity and take out your frustration that way

[Porscha]

Anyway I may end up sheeping Seanzie on Wilgy after yesterday. But I don't appreciate being told I'm playing anti-town by someone who did nothing to push Jack and was absent when I was part of ensuring he was flipped despite a Jack trying to AtE me hard. I also don't appreciate now being AtE'd by 3 people just for voting them.

are you gonna make it?

[Porscha]

Also I'm in a game for the first time on a new site where literally everyone knows each other so obviously I'm going to have a disadvantage.

that's a mood

[Porscha]

I am impatiently waiting for wilgy to arrive

[pyxxy]

Also I'm in a game for the first time on a new site where literally everyone knows each other so obviously I'm going to have a disadvantage.

ou seem to be doing fine

I too know no one except sabi and neon, and at least one of those two is a wolf

[Porscha]

Also I'm in a game for the first time on a new site where literally everyone knows each other so obviously I'm going to have a disadvantage.

ou seem to be doing fine

I too know no one except sabi and neon, and at least one of those two is a wolf

...Eh?

[Porscha]

nvm I reread it for the 6th time and its just worded weird

[pyxxy]

nvm I reread it for the 6th time and its just worded weird

ehehehe gottem

[obscurity]

It's fine. But like stuff like Mac saying "Sabi is mafia because this is not town Sabi" and people pushing Jack for not being the same as a past town game is obviously not going to register with me the same way, but I'm trying to gather logic and reasons and put stuff together. Jack dying made sense for the game so I wanted it even if I thought he was town. I thought I had solid stuff against Lily, I nearly changed my mind at one point after interacting with her and my switch caused Jack to AtE me in a way that made me waver back. I correctly had Cape as town day 1. And even if I'm wrong on Neon I'm not dead set on it like I had them as top town yesterday and tried to talk to them then they completely disappeared and I've been re-evaluating my reads every day and came to that conclusion today so even if it's a wrong conclusion I'm not someone who can't have their mind changed... all I ask is the same courtesy from other people.

[obscurity]

I am getting deja vu of Jack yesterday with Wilgy today so maybe that is a hit. If so then It's probably Wilgy/Falcon or something and easy game.

[Ruri]

I'm not very familiar with the site too. Just saying.

@Porscha Porschawanna update me so I make an informed decision?

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

How the fuck is my approach to you wolfy? I'm literally trying to solve you but you're making it impossible to work with you. I'm asking you why you think you should be obvious town and you're just OMGUSing like you did with Anne day one. Like if your approach to mafia as town is to push back at everyone suspicious of you then your play fucking sucks. I literally took notes and discussed all of my reads which have constantly changing based on new information. You had no approach to Jack whatsoever except to call him town early based on a on the Lily wagon so you're one to talk in terms of having a hedgy stance on Jack. There's no way in hell my approach as wolf would be to say that I thought Jack should be flipped but I townread him, that would be idiotic. You're acting like you're the lead wagon right into end of day, but im not going to fucking find you if you're town and your approach is this bullshit.

Your approach is wolfy because you're using non existent reasons to push me. Your pushing me off a meme and for not being around and I have yet to see a single valid reason from anyone on my wagon. And lo and behold when a wagon forms on me for no reason its almost always wolf driven. It happens every game I play I am very very used to it and I am very very used to its motivation and it very rarely comes from town and you are pulling the same thing that woofs always do on me. So no its not omgus, blaming a valid counter push on lol omgus is such a buzz word response when someone can legitimately just find your push on them scummy but run the buzz word roulette on me. But hey telling me I suck for how I play is a good way to get the "omgus" off you since that's how you want to play it. This response is never towny.

I never read Jack and the fact you push me for a meme and insist it was a legitimate read is so unbelievably weak.

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Anyway I may end up sheeping Seanzie on Wilgy after yesterday. But I don't appreciate being told I'm playing anti-town by someone who did nothing to push Jack and was absent when I was part of ensuring he was flipped despite a Jack trying to AtE me hard. I also don't appreciate now being AtE'd by 3 people just for voting them.

What? I have used zero AtE. I have not resorted to telling you that you suck at the game you did that to me. I have not resorted to reading anything except your game play. I am playing the game of mafia.

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Anyways wilgy can probably just go over today I don't TR them so they sit comfortably in my can die pile

I also still hate Pyxxys gameplay but I might be biased because Pyxxy destroyed me as wolf recently.

[Porscha]

I'm not very familiar with the site too. Just saying.

@Porscha Porschawanna update me so I make an informed decision?

here is your post:
Ranking whoever are aliving.

Phraze

Obscurity
Falcon
Porscha
Seanzie
pxxy
Schiavetto
Anne
Neon
DrWilgy
Creature
Nanook

I would move creature up quite a bit, doubtful nook should be that low imo, move falcon down quite a bit, sean more confirmed than me, i'm ok with the middle enough in the null-ish area

I guess I don't think there are 2 wolves within wilgy / creature / nook tbh

[obscurity]

How the fuck is my approach to you wolfy? I'm literally trying to solve you but you're making it impossible to work with you. I'm asking you why you think you should be obvious town and you're just OMGUSing like you did with Anne day one. Like if your approach to mafia as town is to push back at everyone suspicious of you then your play fucking sucks. I literally took notes and discussed all of my reads which have constantly changing based on new information. You had no approach to Jack whatsoever except to call him town early based on a on the Lily wagon so you're one to talk in terms of having a hedgy stance on Jack. There's no way in hell my approach as wolf would be to say that I thought Jack should be flipped but I townread him, that would be idiotic. You're acting like you're the lead wagon right into end of day, but im not going to fucking find you if you're town and your approach is this bullshit.

Your approach is wolfy because you're using non existent reasons to push me. Your pushing me off a meme and for not being around and I have yet to see a single valid reason from anyone on my wagon. And lo and behold when a wagon forms on me for no reason its almost always wolf driven. It happens every game I play I am very very used to it and I am very very used to its motivation and it very rarely comes from town and you are pulling the same thing that woofs always do on me. So no its not omgus, blaming a valid counter push on lol omgus is such a buzz word response when someone can legitimately just find your push on them scummy but run the buzz word roulette on me. But hey telling me I suck for how I play is a good way to get the "omgus" off you since that's how you want to play it. This response is never towny.

I never read Jack and the fact you push me for a meme and insist it was a legitimate read is so unbelievably weak.

See this is what I mean though. I very clearly outlined my reasons beyond the meme. And you're acting like I'm trying to push a ML on you when that's not what I want, like I don't want you to be wagoned if you're a villager, I've very clearly shown that I change my reads and adapt a lot but your first instinct is to just assume the worst. You're also acting like my only reason to scumread you is the Jack read and ignoring everything else I've talked about. I accept that your read on Jack was partially a meme or whatever, but that wasn't the crux of my initial issue. And how was I supposed to know that the meme had zero foundation in reality regardless? There was a wagon of literally 2 votes on you when you came at me.

You also try to pull arguments like "it happens every game" and make it into this big blanket thing rather than actually try to look for the motivation/reason behind it or try to engage with it - like, from my perspective, you're also wrongly pushing on a villager and I also get zero impression that you're actually interested in solving me. but despite how yes, I think it's very poor play, I don't necessarily think it's wolf indicative because you're just digging a grave for yourself if I flip. I tend to think this over-reaction comes from town.

Maybe AtE wasn't the right word, or it wasn't intentional, but being told I've been wolfsiding if I'm a villager touched that part of me.

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

I'm not very familiar with the site too. Just saying.

@Porscha Porschawanna update me so I make an informed decision?

here is your post:
Ranking whoever are aliving.

Phraze

Obscurity
Falcon
Porscha
Seanzie
pxxy
Schiavetto
Anne
Neon
DrWilgy
Creature
Nanook

I would move creature up quite a bit, doubtful nook should be that low imo, move falcon down quite a bit, sean more confirmed than me, i'm ok with the middle enough in the null-ish area

I guess I don't think there are 2 wolves within wilgy / creature / nook tbh

I'd think Creature is basically lock town at this point no?

[pyxxy]

Anyways wilgy can probably just go over today I don't TR them so they sit comfortably in my can die pile

I also still hate Pyxxys gameplay but I might be biased because Pyxxy destroyed me as wolf recently.

ey.

This is a distraction from your entanglement with obscurity.

I think you've mentioned that you're always better at town reads than scum reads?

Who are your townreads right now, even better if you could sort them into solid and shaky?

Totally okay if you have a lot of nulls. Consider nulls and scum reads to be the same for this exercise?

[obscurity]

Neon do you have a scum game on another site you can link (or here, but I didn't think I saw one)?

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

How the fuck is my approach to you wolfy? I'm literally trying to solve you but you're making it impossible to work with you. I'm asking you why you think you should be obvious town and you're just OMGUSing like you did with Anne day one. Like if your approach to mafia as town is to push back at everyone suspicious of you then your play fucking sucks. I literally took notes and discussed all of my reads which have constantly changing based on new information. You had no approach to Jack whatsoever except to call him town early based on a on the Lily wagon so you're one to talk in terms of having a hedgy stance on Jack. There's no way in hell my approach as wolf would be to say that I thought Jack should be flipped but I townread him, that would be idiotic. You're acting like you're the lead wagon right into end of day, but im not going to fucking find you if you're town and your approach is this bullshit.

Your approach is wolfy because you're using non existent reasons to push me. Your pushing me off a meme and for not being around and I have yet to see a single valid reason from anyone on my wagon. And lo and behold when a wagon forms on me for no reason its almost always wolf driven. It happens every game I play I am very very used to it and I am very very used to its motivation and it very rarely comes from town and you are pulling the same thing that woofs always do on me. So no its not omgus, blaming a valid counter push on lol omgus is such a buzz word response when someone can legitimately just find your push on them scummy but run the buzz word roulette on me. But hey telling me I suck for how I play is a good way to get the "omgus" off you since that's how you want to play it. This response is never towny.

I never read Jack and the fact you push me for a meme and insist it was a legitimate read is so unbelievably weak.

See this is what I mean though. I very clearly outlined my reasons beyond the meme. And you're acting like I'm trying to push a ML on you when that's not what I want, like I don't want you to be wagoned if you're a villager, I've very clearly shown that I change my reads and adapt a lot but your first instinct is to just assume the worst. You're also acting like my only reason to scumread you is the Jack read and ignoring everything else I've talked about. I accept that your read on Jack was partially a meme or whatever, but that wasn't the crux of my initial issue. And how was I supposed to know that the meme had zero foundation in reality regardless? There was a wagon of literally 2 votes on you when you came at me.

You also try to pull arguments like "it happens every game" and make it into this big blanket thing rather than actually try to look for the motivation/reason behind it or try to engage with it - like, from my perspective, you're also wrongly pushing on a villager and I also get zero impression that you're actually interested in solving me. but despite how yes, I think it's very poor play, I don't necessarily think it's wolf indicative because you're just digging a grave for yourself if I flip. I tend to think this over-reaction comes from town.

Maybe AtE wasn't the right word, or it wasn't intentional, but being told I've been wolfsiding if I'm a villager touched that part of me.

Your other reasons as far as I'm aware are

How other people have treated me which is like not something I can defend

And irl. Which reading into thread absence is frustrating.

What else is there? I've been as town as I ever am. This is Neon take it or leave it. I think that just because you don't know anyone here doesn't mean you should ignore what they know. Ask the people who've played with me how they feel about me. I'm not gonna say read the dead you are well aware of how Mac felt so ask the living they can take into account what Mac's corpse can't. Pyxxy, Porscha they have enough knowledge of my game I'd say. Because frankly everyone plays mafia different and looking at me without meta knowledge of my play is a most dangerous game. I'm town but you will never believe that I'm not going to self meta I can only do what I always do.

You know why I say it happens every game? Because it does... well every time I play with people who haven't played with me anyways. And the push on me always contains a woof. Like look at who's been on my wagon and than let's play a game. Do you think the people who've voted me are all town? Because we have you leading my wagon and than we have Ruri openly sheeping you and than we had Falcon who frankly...I have no idea her levy though. I don't think my wagon is pure. And that's the thing... my wagons are never pure. I'm an easy push as town obscurity and it's not because I'm a bad player and it's not because I play mafia like garbage it's because I don't play mafia the way mafia players expect town to play. Like...if I just didn't second guess every decision I made in mafia I'd win a lot of games I figure things out I get info playing the way I play. It works no matter how many people tell me I play like shit. And mafia is a numbers game and the numbers say people who push me on the basis of nothing are mafia way more often than not.

I'm attacking your game play not you I dunno if I'm being a dick that's not intentional sometimes I'm bad at that...autism or whatever... but I'm trying to play mafia and I think your game play right now is just not good.

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

How the fuck is my approach to you wolfy? I'm literally trying to solve you but you're making it impossible to work with you. I'm asking you why you think you should be obvious town and you're just OMGUSing like you did with Anne day one. Like if your approach to mafia as town is to push back at everyone suspicious of you then your play fucking sucks. I literally took notes and discussed all of my reads which have constantly changing based on new information. You had no approach to Jack whatsoever except to call him town early based on a on the Lily wagon so you're one to talk in terms of having a hedgy stance on Jack. There's no way in hell my approach as wolf would be to say that I thought Jack should be flipped but I townread him, that would be idiotic. You're acting like you're the lead wagon right into end of day, but im not going to fucking find you if you're town and your approach is this bullshit.

Your approach is wolfy because you're using non existent reasons to push me. Your pushing me off a meme and for not being around and I have yet to see a single valid reason from anyone on my wagon. And lo and behold when a wagon forms on me for no reason its almost always wolf driven. It happens every game I play I am very very used to it and I am very very used to its motivation and it very rarely comes from town and you are pulling the same thing that woofs always do on me. So no its not omgus, blaming a valid counter push on lol omgus is such a buzz word response when someone can legitimately just find your push on them scummy but run the buzz word roulette on me. But hey telling me I suck for how I play is a good way to get the "omgus" off you since that's how you want to play it. This response is never towny.

I never read Jack and the fact you push me for a meme and insist it was a legitimate read is so unbelievably weak.

See this is what I mean though. I very clearly outlined my reasons beyond the meme. And you're acting like I'm trying to push a ML on you when that's not what I want, like I don't want you to be wagoned if you're a villager, I've very clearly shown that I change my reads and adapt a lot but your first instinct is to just assume the worst. You're also acting like my only reason to scumread you is the Jack read and ignoring everything else I've talked about. I accept that your read on Jack was partially a meme or whatever, but that wasn't the crux of my initial issue. And how was I supposed to know that the meme had zero foundation in reality regardless? There was a wagon of literally 2 votes on you when you came at me.

You also try to pull arguments like "it happens every game" and make it into this big blanket thing rather than actually try to look for the motivation/reason behind it or try to engage with it - like, from my perspective, you're also wrongly pushing on a villager and I also get zero impression that you're actually interested in solving me. but despite how yes, I think it's very poor play, I don't necessarily think it's wolf indicative because you're just digging a grave for yourself if I flip. I tend to think this over-reaction comes from town.

Maybe AtE wasn't the right word, or it wasn't intentional, but being told I've been wolfsiding if I'm a villager touched that part of me.

Your other reasons as far as I'm aware are

How other people have treated me which is like not something I can defend

And irl. Which reading into thread absence is frustrating.

What else is there? I've been as town as I ever am. This is Neon take it or leave it. I think that just because you don't know anyone here doesn't mean you should ignore what they know. Ask the people who've played with me how they feel about me. I'm not gonna say read the dead you are well aware of how Mac felt so ask the living they can take into account what Mac's corpse can't. Pyxxy, Porscha they have enough knowledge of my game I'd say. Because frankly everyone plays mafia different and looking at me without meta knowledge of my play is a most dangerous game. I'm town but you will never believe that I'm not going to self meta I can only do what I always do.

You know why I say it happens every game? Because it does... well every time I play with people who haven't played with me anyways. And the push on me always contains a woof. Like look at who's been on my wagon and than let's play a game. Do you think the people who've voted me are all town? Because we have you leading my wagon and than we have Ruri openly sheeping you and than we had Falcon who frankly...I have no idea he left though. I don't think my wagon is pure. And that's the thing... my wagons are never pure. I'm an easy push as town obscurity and it's not because I'm a bad player and it's not because I play mafia like garbage it's because I don't play mafia the way mafia players expect town to play. Like...if I just didn't second guess every decision I made in mafia I'd win a lot of games I figure things out I get info playing the way I play. It works no matter how many people tell me I play like shit. And mafia is a numbers game and the numbers say people who push me on the basis of nothing are mafia way more often than not.

I'm attacking your game play not you I dunno if I'm being a dick that's not intentional sometimes I'm bad at that...autism or whatever... but I'm trying to play mafia and I think your game play right now is just not good.

Ebwop I hate phones

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Anyways wilgy can probably just go over today I don't TR them so they sit comfortably in my can die pile

I also still hate Pyxxys gameplay but I might be biased because Pyxxy destroyed me as wolf recently.

ey.

This is a distraction from your entanglement with obscurity.

I think you've mentioned that you're always better at town reads than scum reads?

Who are your townreads right now, even better if you could sort them into solid and shaky?

Totally okay if you have a lot of nulls. Consider nulls and scum reads to be the same for this exercise?

Creature
Nook
Porscha
Ruri
Anne

Of those Ruri and Anne are the weakest.

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Neon do you have a scum game on another site you can link (or here, but I didn't think I saw one)?

Yeah.

Most recent scum game: https://webdiplomacy.net/contrib/phpBB3 ... php?t=4268

Best scum game: https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/th ... le-Madness

[obscurity]

How the fuck is my approach to you wolfy? I'm literally trying to solve you but you're making it impossible to work with you. I'm asking you why you think you should be obvious town and you're just OMGUSing like you did with Anne day one. Like if your approach to mafia as town is to push back at everyone suspicious of you then your play fucking sucks. I literally took notes and discussed all of my reads which have constantly changing based on new information. You had no approach to Jack whatsoever except to call him town early based on a on the Lily wagon so you're one to talk in terms of having a hedgy stance on Jack. There's no way in hell my approach as wolf would be to say that I thought Jack should be flipped but I townread him, that would be idiotic. You're acting like you're the lead wagon right into end of day, but im not going to fucking find you if you're town and your approach is this bullshit.

Your approach is wolfy because you're using non existent reasons to push me. Your pushing me off a meme and for not being around and I have yet to see a single valid reason from anyone on my wagon. And lo and behold when a wagon forms on me for no reason its almost always wolf driven. It happens every game I play I am very very used to it and I am very very used to its motivation and it very rarely comes from town and you are pulling the same thing that woofs always do on me. So no its not omgus, blaming a valid counter push on lol omgus is such a buzz word response when someone can legitimately just find your push on them scummy but run the buzz word roulette on me. But hey telling me I suck for how I play is a good way to get the "omgus" off you since that's how you want to play it. This response is never towny.

I never read Jack and the fact you push me for a meme and insist it was a legitimate read is so unbelievably weak.

See this is what I mean though. I very clearly outlined my reasons beyond the meme. And you're acting like I'm trying to push a ML on you when that's not what I want, like I don't want you to be wagoned if you're a villager, I've very clearly shown that I change my reads and adapt a lot but your first instinct is to just assume the worst. You're also acting like my only reason to scumread you is the Jack read and ignoring everything else I've talked about. I accept that your read on Jack was partially a meme or whatever, but that wasn't the crux of my initial issue. And how was I supposed to know that the meme had zero foundation in reality regardless? There was a wagon of literally 2 votes on you when you came at me.

You also try to pull arguments like "it happens every game" and make it into this big blanket thing rather than actually try to look for the motivation/reason behind it or try to engage with it - like, from my perspective, you're also wrongly pushing on a villager and I also get zero impression that you're actually interested in solving me. but despite how yes, I think it's very poor play, I don't necessarily think it's wolf indicative because you're just digging a grave for yourself if I flip. I tend to think this over-reaction comes from town.

Maybe AtE wasn't the right word, or it wasn't intentional, but being told I've been wolfsiding if I'm a villager touched that part of me.

Your other reasons as far as I'm aware are

How other people have treated me which is like not something I can defend

And irl. Which reading into thread absence is frustrating.

What else is there? I've been as town as I ever am. This is Neon take it or leave it. I think that just because you don't know anyone here doesn't mean you should ignore what they know. Ask the people who've played with me how they feel about me. I'm not gonna say read the dead you are well aware of how Mac felt so ask the living they can take into account what Mac's corpse can't. Pyxxy, Porscha they have enough knowledge of my game I'd say. Because frankly everyone plays mafia different and looking at me without meta knowledge of my play is a most dangerous game. I'm town but you will never believe that I'm not going to self meta I can only do what I always do.

You know why I say it happens every game? Because it does... well every time I play with people who haven't played with me anyways. And the push on me always contains a woof. Like look at who's been on my wagon and than let's play a game. Do you think the people who've voted me are all town? Because we have you leading my wagon and than we have Ruri openly sheeping you and than we had Falcon who frankly...I have no idea her levy though. I don't think my wagon is pure. And that's the thing... my wagons are never pure. I'm an easy push as town obscurity and it's not because I'm a bad player and it's not because I play mafia like garbage it's because I don't play mafia the way mafia players expect town to play. Like...if I just didn't second guess every decision I made in mafia I'd win a lot of games I figure things out I get info playing the way I play. It works no matter how many people tell me I play like shit. And mafia is a numbers game and the numbers say people who push me on the basis of nothing are mafia way more often than not.

I'm attacking your game play not you I dunno if I'm being a dick that's not intentional sometimes I'm bad at that...autism or whatever... but I'm trying to play mafia and I think your game play right now is just not good.

I'm clearing a lot of people off of the stuff with Jack, which frankly means that my POE is narrow. So sometimes thin reasons just become reasons to me, which I do understand may come off in bad faith to you but that's why I'm emphasizing that I'm exploring reads, trying to find scum, I'm not tunneling. I'm also better at finding town than scum as a whole and I realized that I must be misclearing people. As mafia I have no reason to completely 180 my read on you though in that situation, especially when there's 2 mafia left and I would need to survive a lot of MLs.

That's all very well, I'm not trying to ignore meta on you. That's the type of stuff I was looking for because it's my missing piece of the game. Like I just looked at your past game and Sabi won against you as mafia. So you had that background stuff day 1 to find her as mafia. Me, I had none of that. The only meta I was accounting for on you was Mac, who was dead n2, so I wouldn't know if his read would change at this point, but I didn't know those people played with you before, and I do take that into consideration/value.

I don't really understand what's wrong with my gameplay right now. Like, I'm trying to find mafia in a site I'm new to and people I'm new to. I didn't even understand the votes were posted until earlier. Sometimes this involves pushing on people who are town. If I was just pushing and never reflecting or re-considering then that'd be bad, but I'm doing all that stuff. I townread Jack day 2 then realized when I lived to day 3 that meant I was wrong about stuff so said kill should be in Jack/NOOK. But yeah I think viewing something as "my wagon has to have a mafia," especially when it's such a small wagon, is not correct. I mean sometimes by mere mathematics this is the case, but villagers push on villagers all the time. I've probably pushed on every single person here, nearly, at some point, and then often just changed my mind. That's why being mafia is easy sometimes, you can work around people who OMGUS and not push them and have a more static set of reads because you don't need to try to solve anyone. So like, I'm town, Ruri is probably mech town - Falcon could be mafia who voted you, but
not specifically because he voted you - because his vote on you didn't really make sense/I'm not sure where it came from. My reasons for suspecting you may not necessarily have been strong but they at least made sense and I think it's clear I believed them even if I now think I was probably wrong.

Because believe it or not I do listen to you when you say that more people than just Mac have the meta and take that into account and I don't even think you're mafia anymore. I just wanted you to understand that in a world where;
1. A lot of people look good off of Jack
2. I realize that some of my strong townreads have to be wrong
3. I am put off by your immediate reaction, even if I'm reflecting on that
4. You're literally saying that people who don't know you don't understand your style
I don't know why you find it so surprising that I may suspect you here.

Anyway, I'll see what content we get from Wilgy today, this game has taken too much out of me tn and I'm going to sleep.

[pyxxy]

Anyways wilgy can probably just go over today I don't TR them so they sit comfortably in my can die pile

I also still hate Pyxxys gameplay but I might be biased because Pyxxy destroyed me as wolf recently.

ey.

This is a distraction from your entanglement with obscurity.

I think you've mentioned that you're always better at town reads than scum reads?

Who are your townreads right now, even better if you could sort them into solid and shaky?

Totally okay if you have a lot of nulls. Consider nulls and scum reads to be the same for this exercise?

Creature
Nook
Porscha
Ruri
Anne

Of those Ruri and Anne are the weakest.

ay ty

I match you on Creature,
I don't like Nook for all the claim nonsense and repeatedly preempting why his voting record is totally not sus and makes complete sense,
Porscha is more of an unknown for me when before I felt like I scumleaned,
Ruri seems like a strong town since no CC,
Anne is back to unclear for me after I tinfoiled on Sabi's claim post (if I have more time tomorrow I want to re-read Jack + Anne interactions)

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

My voting record is totally not suss and makes sense, some people might tell you differently later, but im saying this first so I am correct and they are foolish and wrong

[pyxxy]

My voting record is totally not suss and makes sense, some people might tell you differently later, but im saying this first so I am correct and they are foolish and wrong

eah that's what I said, it's totally not sus and makes complete sense. One might even call it "very towny, never seen a more town-sided voting record, truly impressive".

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

My voting record is totally not suss and makes sense, some people might tell you differently later, but im saying this first so I am correct and they are foolish and wrong

Making me instantly regret that town read lol

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

How the fuck is my approach to you wolfy? I'm literally trying to solve you but you're making it impossible to work with you. I'm asking you why you think you should be obvious town and you're just OMGUSing like you did with Anne day one. Like if your approach to mafia as town is to push back at everyone suspicious of you then your play fucking sucks. I literally took notes and discussed all of my reads which have constantly changing based on new information. You had no approach to Jack whatsoever except to call him town early based on a on the Lily wagon so you're one to talk in terms of having a hedgy stance on Jack. There's no way in hell my approach as wolf would be to say that I thought Jack should be flipped but I townread him, that would be idiotic. You're acting like you're the lead wagon right into end of day, but im not going to fucking find you if you're town and your approach is this bullshit.

Your approach is wolfy because you're using non existent reasons to push me. Your pushing me off a meme and for not being around and I have yet to see a single valid reason from anyone on my wagon. And lo and behold when a wagon forms on me for no reason its almost always wolf driven. It happens every game I play I am very very used to it and I am very very used to its motivation and it very rarely comes from town and you are pulling the same thing that woofs always do on me. So no its not omgus, blaming a valid counter push on lol omgus is such a buzz word response when someone can legitimately just find your push on them scummy but run the buzz word roulette on me. But hey telling me I suck for how I play is a good way to get the "omgus" off you since that's how you want to play it. This response is never towny.

I never read Jack and the fact you push me for a meme and insist it was a legitimate read is so unbelievably weak.

See this is what I mean though. I very clearly outlined my reasons beyond the meme. And you're acting like I'm trying to push a ML on you when that's not what I want, like I don't want you to be wagoned if you're a villager, I've very clearly shown that I change my reads and adapt a lot but your first instinct is to just assume the worst. You're also acting like my only reason to scumread you is the Jack read and ignoring everything else I've talked about. I accept that your read on Jack was partially a meme or whatever, but that wasn't the crux of my initial issue. And how was I supposed to know that the meme had zero foundation in reality regardless? There was a wagon of literally 2 votes on you when you came at me.

You also try to pull arguments like "it happens every game" and make it into this big blanket thing rather than actually try to look for the motivation/reason behind it or try to engage with it - like, from my perspective, you're also wrongly pushing on a villager and I also get zero impression that you're actually interested in solving me. but despite how yes, I think it's very poor play, I don't necessarily think it's wolf indicative because you're just digging a grave for yourself if I flip. I tend to think this over-reaction comes from town.

Maybe AtE wasn't the right word, or it wasn't intentional, but being told I've been wolfsiding if I'm a villager touched that part of me.

Your other reasons as far as I'm aware are

How other people have treated me which is like not something I can defend

And irl. Which reading into thread absence is frustrating.

What else is there? I've been as town as I ever am. This is Neon take it or leave it. I think that just because you don't know anyone here doesn't mean you should ignore what they know. Ask the people who've played with me how they feel about me. I'm not gonna say read the dead you are well aware of how Mac felt so ask the living they can take into account what Mac's corpse can't. Pyxxy, Porscha they have enough knowledge of my game I'd say. Because frankly everyone plays mafia different and looking at me without meta knowledge of my play is a most dangerous game. I'm town but you will never believe that I'm not going to self meta I can only do what I always do.

You know why I say it happens every game? Because it does... well every time I play with people who haven't played with me anyways. And the push on me always contains a woof. Like look at who's been on my wagon and than let's play a game. Do you think the people who've voted me are all town? Because we have you leading my wagon and than we have Ruri openly sheeping you and than we had Falcon who frankly...I have no idea her levy though. I don't think my wagon is pure. And that's the thing... my wagons are never pure. I'm an easy push as town obscurity and it's not because I'm a bad player and it's not because I play mafia like garbage it's because I don't play mafia the way mafia players expect town to play. Like...if I just didn't second guess every decision I made in mafia I'd win a lot of games I figure things out I get info playing the way I play. It works no matter how many people tell me I play like shit. And mafia is a numbers game and the numbers say people who push me on the basis of nothing are mafia way more often than not.

I'm attacking your game play not you I dunno if I'm being a dick that's not intentional sometimes I'm bad at that...autism or whatever... but I'm trying to play mafia and I think your game play right now is just not good.

I'm clearing a lot of people off of the stuff with Jack, which frankly means that my POE is narrow. So sometimes thin reasons just become reasons to me, which I do understand may come off in bad faith to you but that's why I'm emphasizing that I'm exploring reads, trying to find scum, I'm not tunneling. I'm also better at finding town than scum as a whole and I realized that I must be misclearing people. As mafia I have no reason to completely 180 my read on you though in that situation, especially when there's 2 mafia left and I would need to survive a lot of MLs.

That's all very well, I'm not trying to ignore meta on you. That's the type of stuff I was looking for because it's my missing piece of the game. Like I just looked at your past game and Sabi won against you as mafia. So you had that background stuff day 1 to find her as mafia. Me, I had none of that. The only meta I was accounting for on you was Mac, who was dead n2, so I wouldn't know if his read would change at this point, but I didn't know those people played with you before, and I do take that into consideration/value.

I don't really understand what's wrong with my gameplay right now. Like, I'm trying to find mafia in a site I'm new to and people I'm new to. I didn't even understand the votes were posted until earlier. Sometimes this involves pushing on people who are town. If I was just pushing and never reflecting or re-considering then that'd be bad, but I'm doing all that stuff. I townread Jack day 2 then realized when I lived to day 3 that meant I was wrong about stuff so said kill should be in Jack/NOOK. But yeah I think viewing something as "my wagon has to have a mafia," especially when it's such a small wagon, is not correct. I mean sometimes by mere mathematics this is the case, but villagers push on villagers all the time. I've probably pushed on every single person here, nearly, at some point, and then often just changed my mind. That's why being mafia is easy sometimes, you can work around people who OMGUS and not push them and have a more static set of reads because you don't need to try to solve anyone. So like, I'm town, Ruri is probably mech town - Falcon could be mafia who voted you, but
not specifically because he voted you - because his vote on you didn't really make sense/I'm not sure where it came from. My reasons for suspecting you may not necessarily have been strong but they at least made sense and I think it's clear I believed them even if I now think I was probably wrong.

Because believe it or not I do listen to you when you say that more people than just Mac have the meta and take that into account and I don't even think you're mafia anymore. I just wanted you to understand that in a world where;
1. A lot of people look good off of Jack
2. I realize that some of my strong townreads have to be wrong
3. I am put off by your immediate reaction, even if I'm reflecting on that
4. You're literally saying that people who don't know you don't understand your style
I don't know why you find it so surprising that I may suspect you here.

Anyway, I'll see what content we get from Wilgy today, this game has taken too much out of me tn and I'm going to sleep.

I don't think as many people look good off Jack as everyone else seems to.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

My voting record is totally not suss and makes sense, some people might tell you differently later, but im saying this first so I am correct and they are foolish and wrong

eah that's what I said, it's totally not sus and makes complete sense. One might even call it "very towny, never seen a more town-sided voting record, truly impressive".

Ty I'm glad we agree

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

My voting record is totally not suss and makes sense, some people might tell you differently later, but im saying this first so I am correct and they are foolish and wrong

Making me instantly regret that town read lol

Seize the townread, no regerts, dknt look back

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

My voting record is totally not suss and makes sense, some people might tell you differently later, but im saying this first so I am correct and they are foolish and wrong

Making me instantly regret that town read lol

Seize the townread, no regerts, dknt look back

Never look back. Forward is the only option.

[DrWilgy]

Good evening all.

Chainsaw Man ep 1 was good.

[DrWilgy]

Also lucy said she was gonna go hard in the paint on wilgy today as well so like mmmmmMMMMMM

Microwave noises

Wilgy you tryna die or what

The fact that you even need to question if I'm trying to die means you know how absolutely absurd it is IMO.

ezflip Porscha after me.

[DrWilgy]

I really wanna know what you did or did not do, nook

I motion detected creature instead of wilgy cause I completely mixed up their eods

I'd like to hear their explanation...Jack's push on Creature felt like distancing IMO

Alright, but Creature on Jack is literally the least aligned piece on the planet?

[DrWilgy]

feel weird about Wilgy not showing up yet..

i guess i should ISO him.

Good morning my friend.

I'd have thought by now that my busy/"I have time to burst" play style would've been realized by now just based on when I normally make it to the thread but alas.

While I haven't read everything I've skimmed and thoughts are like this:
I agree with my yeet before lylo. I don't desire to be the easy misyeet that causes us to lose so if the information gained from my yeet pre lylo gets us there then I'm good with that.

With that in mind I do think we are still in a really good position and we should be able to just win by yeeting the last wolves.

I think it's absolutely an absurd thing to think I'd kill Lucy in that position after how hard I shielded Jack.

Porscha's immediate push on me, after they waffled on Jack last cycle, using what I assume is a set up NK is super fucking sketchy and I'd almost recommend that the only wagons be Porscha or I. Flip me with the promise to assess Porscha's push on me gets us a pelt, I think.

I will actually read after work today.

Lmao you tryna thunderdome with me yesterday after your performance? My feelings on jack made sense based on my half ass position in the game yesterday but multiple people waffled on his slot and I wasnt alone in that. I also sheeped lucy read because there had to be a reason she died last night and she had you and me (unsure if she finished eod still having me in poe but regardless she openly stated she was gonna run you up today) in poe. Actually yeah i kinda look like shit now that I've said it out loud lmfao

WHATEVER

I'm not sure how confident I'd be that you are like for sure wolfing or whatever based on the NK because it is painfully obvious that lucy was gonna be on your ass today. But that leaves me thinking if you are town wilgy then wolves did it to explicitly frame you since you look awful from the jack flip and a lucy nk. So I understand why you are suspicious of my push onto you thinking it might be wolf motivated but it's the obvious look that I need to do to entertain why lucy was the NK instead of nook who softed a PR or anne who buried sabi or obscurity who I should probs tinfoil cuz Lucy tinfoiled him too

Yes, and I agree you weren't alone. I misread him, and I think Falc/Nook you wavered. I recall Obscurity having them as town as well. Out of those who tr'd Jack, you seem to just be hyper eager to take the path of least resistance, so no. I think it'd be best to thunderdome that way I can at least ensure that one of my poe is removed.

I don't know what to make of Nooks recent misfire or Falc's insistence on Creature. Nook was on Jack earlier in the game and kept the wagon strong. I don't see wolf Nook not ending on the bus had their game plan been to bus since d1. Likely the misfire was just that I guess.

Falc is either completely out of the loop and has no issue with it OR is just lost wolf. Solving Falc is generally town. I thought, JUST maybe a hint of that prior to EoD last cycle, but then for them to come back and continue their Creature tunnel disproves. Falcon should be removed.

Obscurity may be deep wolf. Obs may be in the similar state of me where I don't desire to imagine a lylo with them.

[DrWilgy]

I was reading NANOOK as unpaired with Jack, mostly because he pushed Jack without any wiggle room and Jack had a lamesauce reason to clear NANOOK, but possible I'm off-base here, I don't find him very villagery outside of that. The motion detect thing is kind of weird. But I dunno.

This

[DrWilgy]

I definitely believe Ruri at this point FWIW, with the Jack flip too.

I don't think that this was even arguable since Nooks gimmick.

[DrWilgy]

Lol if Creature got outed by an error.. that's not a red check though, but that increases odds of being mafia, no?

Don't motion detector roles ping if someone visited Creature as well as they moved?

Creature/Sean are the most cleared, wouldn't surprise me if there was a pro town effect there.

[DrWilgy]

Like think about it for 2 seconds and look at the vc and tell me that's where I land if im Jack's partner that decided "you know what actually I dont want to bus now"

Try to make a smart read on me for once in your life

fucking kek

[DrWilgy]

Alright so who can we clear?

I think Ruri is pretty much clear for her doctor claim unless there's a counterclaim.

Seanzie should be pretty much clear for actively pushing Jack D3 and D4.

I'm tempted to clear pyxxy too because idk if they would bus Jack yesterday but I might be underestimating them.

What are your all thoughts on Porscha? Is she out of wolf range?

Re Porscha, I think today started with them being decently opportunistic, but I won't pretend to know low energy Porscha wolf range.

I inherently feel like I should sr it, but based on death will be my final lover, I can be incorrect there.

I still think Nook is semi-clear. I agree with Pyxxy as well, but more so in terms of semi-cleared.

[DrWilgy]

looks like wolves were looking to bus sabi p early on into the game according to jack's early posting, it wasn't until a bit later they thought maybe they could save her. jack seems like the kind of wolf that can't resist tmi'ing his partners as wolf so the early iso also looks sort of bad for neon, but there is some outside stuff that makes me doubt that.

Care to describe the outside stuff that makes you doubt it?

I need to ISO Neon. They seemed mostly absent yesterday if I recall, but their posts today are somewhat sketch. I also don't think I am misremembering, but I have a firm memory of Neon's TR list prior to the Jack yeet was specifically bad. They claim to be a player who gets TRs instead of hunting for SRs, but I had thought I quoted and asked about a TR list that specifically had nothing/went nowhere.

I think the only firm reason I recall tring Neon was because Mac's accuracy on that slot.

[Ruri]

I think Neon doubtcasting me without factoring mech is a bad look. I'm not familiar with Neon, so...

Will reread wolf flip.

[DrWilgy]

i think gth my poe today would be like falcon/wilgy/neon/schia. i retract my tr on schia because of their play at eod, but have them at the tail end of the poe.

Tell me about Schia.

[Ruri]

Actually I don't remember if there was any wolf flip this game. Might he confusing this for the other game I was wolf in (finished yesterday?).

[DrWilgy]

I'm gonna vote Wilgy but it isn't omgus.

Clearly

[DrWilgy]

Asking me who the mafia is will rarely return the results you want. Unless i see something that pings me hard I have nothing to say.

I probably don't have something to say if I don't say it. Right now I'm looking at you and wilgy. I think Jack was at points savable yesterday and I think that woofs are in a bad position with Jack dying on this situation so I think at the very least 1 woofer would go all in on trying to save Jack.

In my experience people who treat my slot the way you are generally are woofs. I do not think your approach to me is fair or valid. I wonder because you are loud and leading town but you've been loud and leading town away from woofs and knowing that I'm town your leading them into town.

I was definitely not trying to save Jack though. The Creature wagon that popped up I believe was Wilgy/Falcon/+1, not sure the +1 or +2 actually? But that would've been the main attempt to save Jack.

I mean, I also would've played it very differently as mafia, and actually taken a strong stance against Jack to look good there, either bussed hard or tried to save him, rather than a limp fish "well Jack will prob flip town but he needs to die" type thing.

And like.. I think it was pretty obvious that Jack was trying to specifically appeal to me/pocket me. When I tried to switch onto him/started to come around on Lily being V D2, he basically pinged me and said he thought I was better than that.

And idk, I came into today thinking you were mafia but I'm not sure anymore. Can you elaborate on why you don't think it's fair? Like, the Jack flip basically turned my entire POE around, and the having been "loud and wrong" part is why I'm considering you in the first place, because I'm one of the people who had been loudly calling you town, and I'm struggling because I realize I've been wrong on my main reads this game. That said I don't think anything wrong I've done has majorly impeded things as I did accept Jack needed to die.

Hedgy hedging is rarely a town trait

This feels needlessly dismissive and doesn't even answer my question.

There is literally no question here. And you are scum.

Yes there is. I asked you why you don't think it's fair. And I'm trying to find you if we're both town so I can solve this game but if you're going to act like this I will push on you and have zero regrets if you flip town.

You can kill another town you've been very good at that. I hope town can eventually see that all your bad faith pushes have done nothing but kill town and that your continued weak defense of Jack was so wishy washy and Hedgy that you can sit here and go well clearly I wasn't really protecting him. Which is also scummy.

So if your town your wolf siding and this push your leading on me another town will just get you killed tomorrow and if you're wolf like I REALLY think you are right now because of your approach to me your just another wolf I've found that town is too blind to ever push onto like I dunno that happens a lot and I'm right a lot.

I still have literally no idea what your asking me...

[VOTE: Neon] aubergine

Falc is also acceptable.