The Syndicate

Roxy wrote:Alson sorry to whoever was upset after I died and said GoOld Rogues -r but honestly it was like saying Go Civvies as MR said in the very beginning that the Old Rogues were as close to civvies as possible this game. So sorry to whoevers game I ruined by posting that.

That whole civ/Old Rogue thing was what started me of on a bit of a wrong for, tbh. Not what you said, but what MR said. In my mind, people say "I'm a civ" in games all of the time, it's a standard comment, so I claimed Old Rogue thinking that they were synonymous. But I didn't realize at first just how narrow a claim that really was, and thus by the time a few OR were dead, it amounted to apseido role claim. I sport of went downhill after that.

@LC, here's the situation. I really hate saying this, but it's the reality. The detectives, whether they realize it or not, have aligned themselves with the New Rogues. Either their win conditions have changed somehow and it is deliberate, or they are just really misreading the not-always-true info they get, but whatever the reason, the very people who have the power to take out the NR's at night are actually voting with them consistently in the game.

So Long Con, if you are indy? It makes most sense to just go with the flow. Vote for whoever MM and Sophie say to vote for, and just win the game. Just like SVS, and apparently just like FZ, I'm frazzled by the confusion of what is going on here. I don't understand why people are doing what they are doing. And i won't be able to figure it out. I know 100% who at least one NR is, but no one believes me. So just end it, man. You get the win no matter what. But when the detectives have EVERYTHING backwards, and the New Rogues feed that delusion, the end is a foregone conclusion.

You had the answers, LC, and you've let yourself get blind-sided by complete outright lies. But luckily for you, it's all good.

Long Con wrote:

timmer wrote:I didn't think TH was the top at the time, I thought he was Wally. And I f forgot all about it once the lynch happened, TH flipped bad, my brain moved on, because why assume abaddie targeted a baddie? Contrary to what some people say, im often NOT smart and I often miss the obvious. Combine my posts from that day with the hosts own pay, it's clear as day and I missed it. But lc made me realize it!

I don't quite believe you thought TH was Wally West. Or that you just forgot about your "theory" until now, how do you just forget something like that? This feels like you're grasping at straws.

I have gaps in my memory sometimes.

Ill tell you the biggest thing worrying me right now. Svs, who we know we can trust, said that there was recruiting going on. She wouldn't lie about it. So it is entirely possible that there are people who are proving a role whose alignment has actually changed. Ìm not sure where to go with that, but it adds another layer to this clusterfuck. Consider that when you with the "evidrnce" against me.

FZ. wrote:You said MR answered some questions that eased your mind. Does this have to do with CC's kills?

They touched on that, but I've got followup questions all pending. That's mostly resolved in my mind but not all of the way yet.

I didn't think TH was the top at the time, I thought he was Wally. And I f forgot all about it once the lynch happened, TH flipped bad, my brain moved on, because why assume abaddie targeted a baddie? Contrary to what some people say, im often NOT smart and I often miss the obvious. Combine my posts from that day with the hosts own pay, it's clear as day and I missed it. But lc made me realize it!

Long Con wrote:I just looked back at Day 8, and the Timmer-TH interactions are a good read. This is just after TH tried to kill Girder and failed, or so the "crunching steel" and non-death in the nightpost leads us to believe. I think TH may have tried to kill Timmer for distancing, and discovered to his surprise that he was a fellow New Rogue.

Day 11 already has shenanigans for the lynch. I don't know if it's on a three-day schedule.

Good night.

Holy shit, Long Con! I'm so glad I checked back in, you've given me the answer, it was right in front of me the whole time! im gooing to ask you to read that day one more time! I was so blind sided by THs role that I never put two and two together. Read my posts from that day again!

Votes DEVIN!!!

Long Con wrote:

timmer wrote:Sophie s been gunning for me, youve been gunning for me, but the evidence is right in from of you. I called svs or for using her night action on the wrong night. No new rogue can do that. Find me one.

LC, you think there is an item that tela you someone was using a night action ? If I am bad, why did I fought so hard to get answers out of MR about it? I was the one trying to SAVE her. Some big master long con... long con?

I've seen an item that can teleport, an item that can protect, an item that alter lynches, an item that can render you undetectable, and more. It's pretty reasonable to think there's an item that lets you spy as well.

But only once. Read through my posts, LC, for the whole game. Look at how many times I suddenly changed gears on someone, or asked someone very specific questions. Why did I wonder what Devin thought of TH for a time, for instance. Argh, fuck it. I'm going to bed before I rip my tablet apart.

Sophie s been gunning for me, youve been gunning for me, but the evidence is right in from of you. I called svs or for using her night action on the wrong night. No new rogue can do that. Find me one.

LC, you think there is an item that tela you someone was using a night action ? If I am bad, why did I fought so hard to get answers out of MR about it? I was the one trying to SAVE her. Some big master long con... long con?

Then how t the FUCK did I know svs had done her action on the wrong night, MM? Which New Rogue does that? You are fucking WRONG.

Long Con wrote:

FZ. wrote:OMG, first, I knew it!! I was right about the detectives trying to lay low!

But sadly, I a lot slower when it comes to the message. Does it mean Timmer is lying? I didn't get the two roles that were discussed in the message

It means that Timmer is lying. Timmer must be a New Rogue. And he's off the damn poll today!

You have followed the bouncing ball for too long to suddenly think I'm lying. There is no way I could know SVS had used her night power on the wrong night unless I'm exactly who I've alluded to being. You know this. Pied Piper says he is certain, but the info he gets is NOT certain.

Mister Rearranger wrote:6AM: The signal of Central City's local TV station is hacked into and the following message is displayed on the network for approximately 5 minutes before being shut down.

"Hello everyone, it's been a while. Sorry I haven't been in touch. Anyway, I've talked to various people over the past few days (both NPCs and players alike), and I can say with certainty that our friendly neighborhood spy is no longer with us. In addition, his not so friendly relative from the same realm/universe might be gone too. Happy lynching!"

This is just simply wrong.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

timmer wrote:With 8 players left, I'd guess we've got:

2 Old Rogues
1 or 2 Detectives
2 or 3 New Rogues
2 or 3 Indies

How many Old Rogues again?

Two.

With 8 players left, I'd guess we've got:

2 Old Rogues
1 or 2 Detectives
2 or 3 New Rogues
2 or 3 Indies

Sophie, how do you feel about MM? How do you feel about LC, Devin and Bass? Your opinion is needed on today's lynch!

@MM, I wouldn't normally have even tried to list who I would vote for yet, too many thoughts in my head. But I felt like you wanted an answer. Each of the possible lynch targets today, imo, have signs that point to baddieness, and signs that point Not to baddieness. If I had to vote for someone right now, I'd be practically guessing as I've got to think about some things.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:
I won't answer questions about my own role. I'll leave that for you fellows to discuss.

As for Sophie, I still stand by my Day 2 opinion of her.

I'm a fan of your opinion of her, tbh. MM, I've gotten more of an indy/detective vibe from you than a New Rogue. TBH, I doubt I'll vote your way today, and def. not Sophie's, either.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:Question for both of you.

If you were to vote right now, who would you vote for?

If I had to gut vote right this second? Bass 2.0, maybe? I've got a few nuggets I've got to work out first...

Long Con wrote: She ain't on the poll, that's for sure.

I'm considering that MM might be the real Wally West, and Sophie is a New Rogue.

I'd be curious to hear what MM thinks of that idea.

Long Con wrote:But WHY are you after the New Rogues? You could win with them, couldn't you?

LC, you think MM is not a New Rogue? Are you thinking indy? I won't lynch an indy if I can avoid it, so if you tell me that you think MM's indy, it'll help me weigh things...

Also, where's BR at?

I haven't been the most subtle player in this game, but right now, I will lay down some cards. FZ is my boy girl. Sophie's alright, too. Same with Long Con, I think. BR is an enigma to me, but I've got no reason to doubt her right now. It comes down to either Devin, MM or Bass, for me. One of them, at a minimum, is a New Rogue, and in particular, one of them cannot be NK'd, so we NEED to lynch them as Wally won't be able to touch them. Bass, I think, has been wrong about some things, but that doesn't make him a NR. Devin subbed in, and has bounced around a bit, but I can't place how I feel, yet. MM has been very active, and also has touched on many things.

I have a good list of people I trust or semi-trust. But the list of lynch targets, of possible New Rogues, is too big, still. I need to work some things out.

So, uhm... I won't be voting for FZ. I got some answers to some PM'd questions, and FZ's my boy.

We all have the same goal at this point: find the new rogue or rogues left. i think wally west needs some help as there is at least one nr left who can't be nk'd. unfortunately I'm thinking walky's current focus of attention is in the wrong place.

FZ. wrote:

timmer wrote:You would if the real one was dead, though?

Has weather wizard ended a day early, yet? Was that what happened when lightning hit star labs? Because SpaceDaisy could have been weather wizard, saved herself by ending that day early (no realizing that aces was leading the lynch somehow), then ended night 5 early, then she died night 6? Can anyone show how that wasn't possible?

Do you want to test it now? Because the day hasn't ended early yet...

Well, let me say this. FZ, if you are weather wizard, then I believe capt cold got a kill due to BF's lynch. If MR confirms that, then I won't be voting for you ever, as you will become my best buddy. But if he does NOT say anything that lends credence to your claims, and you still have the end-day-early move in your pocket, you will obviously have that as a way to prove your claim and save your bacon, so I see this as a win-win, if you are telling the truth!

I'm withholding any more judgment on this until MR responds.

Hmm, no Roxy had died night 3, so no, either FZ is weather wizard and there is a cock-up in our thinking about the capt cold kills, or FZ somehow borrowed the wizard's power.

We definitely need MR to confirm about Capt Cold's kills working correctly, tbh.

You would if the real one was dead, though?

Has weather wizard ended a day early, yet? Was that what happened when lightning hit star labs? Because SpaceDaisy could have been weather wizard, saved herself by ending that day early (no realizing that aces was leading the lynch somehow), then ended night 5 early, then she died night 6? Can anyone show how that wasn't possible?

FZ. wrote:

timmer wrote:Considering the front page hasn't been updated in a long time, could you expand on this? What happened on night 5 that would make you trustworthy?

The night ended due to a blizzard.

Okay, so my working logic about the Old Rogues is this: I believe that Capt. Cold's secret interprets that he gets a kill when an old rogue is night killed. I think that's been the common working decryption, right? Cold killed twice, thus two Old Rogues died early, leaving just four. SVS was one. BF was one. That leaves two. But the other working thought is that Roxy was Capt. Cold. Which leaves one. I've been pretty clear about my claims, you are essentially claiming weather wizard.

So, let's break this down.

Could Roxy have maybe not been Capt. Cold? No, at this point I think she must have been. I think we'd have seen more of a sign that someone doubted that idea, or something, so let's continue to assume she was the Captain.

Could I be lying? Absolutely, but I'd like to think that the parameters of what I've been saying, especially considering the way it came out due to MY pressure that SVS' role was not used properly, would lend some weight to my claims.

Could you be lying? Absolutely, but you've got an interesting claim regarding the weather on night 5. So I'll look at it both ways. First, if you are lying. If svs was the trickster, and bf was glider, and roxy was the captain, and there were two early OR deaths, that means one of them was weather wizard. So how did we have the weather come in... I can see two possibilities, one fairly unlikely, the other less unlikely but still a long shot.

1. Going by the common breakdown of Dr. Alchemy's tildes, it says that he can check some players and use their powers "for a time". For a time, i would think, would mean an expiry of a day or two, but it technically could be longer. So, you could be Dr. Alchemy, had checked and borrowed weather wizard's power and chose to use it there. I don't think it's likely that that role gets to hold on to powers for that long, though.

2. I've encountered the corpse of a player on the map and found an item next to the body that indicated who they had been, and was able to take it. Thus, it is possible, if you found the corpse of Weather Wizard, that the same thing happened to you.


But that aside, I think there may be another possibility here, and it is one I hate to ask, but I've got to, because it could mean that we are both telling the truth, which I would actually LIKE to believe.


@MR: Sorry man, but I've gotta ask... Assuming we are right about Capt. Cold's tildes saying that when an old rogue is NIGHT KILLED, he gets a kill, can you confirm that his role was handled exactly as written?

Because we LYNCHED Golden Glider Day 3.2. And then DH was apparently killed by Capt Cold night 3. *IF* Capt Cold was given a kill because golden glider died, even though he was lynched and not night killed, it throws off everything we've all been assuming, and it means that our remaining baddie is one of the bystanders and neither me or FZ.

Considering the front page hasn't been updated in a long time, could you expand on this? What happened on night 5 that would make you trustworthy?

And more specifically, why do you not put any weight on the things that others like LC do? Do you think everything I said yesterday was made up? Don't you think it's pretty darn elaborate as a ruse?

Sophie wrote:Damnve, , i was gonna move my vote to timmer after host clarification, thought we had 24 hours more to go????

Sorry svs, i really did though you were bad
Timmer definetely is though

Sophie, why do you trust FZ?

Well, that's happened. It's bad but I'm not sure there was ever enough time to sort it out...

At least now I know who is our baddie: FZ. It's cut and dried. No one but FZ will ever get my vote from here on out.

Yeah, how did I misread the time that bad? Oh well, nothing to do now but hope that SVS isn't the one whose role was mishandled.

In light of MR's recent posts, I feel like there is a very good chance that SVS is telling the truth, is an Old Rogue, specifically the trickster, had accidentally been sending in night actions every night instead of every even night, and the host didn't correct her. So from my perspective, the only other logical choice for the lynch would be FZ. But I cannot move my vote unless I've got enough people who would move with me to actually lynch FZ, as in my view, if SVS is telling the truth, FZ is a lying lyarson, but if I move my vote to FZ and others don't, then it would seem that an Old Rogue will definitely die this day.

Is there anyone willing to move their vote to FZ? If day isn't extended, we've got only a few hours.

Yeah, I'm not sure what the final call is on the extra time. I want to unvote SVS pending furthur PMs etc. but I cannot take the chance of moving my vote as I'm next in line after her to be lynched. and i'm not sure where to move my vote TO in the meantime. This is a really sucky situation.

S~V~S wrote:Basically I did this to myself.

Yes, but if are my Old Rogue friend, it should be FZ dying, not you. You throwing in the towel due to something that the host should have caught has repercussions, right? It's not potentially giving up, it's the Old Rogues losing the game, or coming very close to it.

Stay tuned.

Sophie wrote: Is this comfirming svs theory??????

it might. I think MR's in a tight spot. If there has been a mistake made, whichever he decides to deal with it will influence one of the factions in the game, which I'm sure has him feeling pretty shitty. I've asked him some more questions in PM, but as of now, my vote is up in the air.

Mister Rearranger wrote:I'm here, everyone.

Terribly sorry for not being available for your questions the past 2 days. I wound up getting scheduled to do a lot more than I anticipated doing for our telethon at work and post-production. But it was to benefit the Children's Miracle Network, so while it's my job and I can't really say no to what needs to be done, it's also a passion of mine and I put extra care and time into it. I hope that's understandable.

I have to sort out an issue because a location result wasn't taken care of last night.

I'm considering extending the phase by 1 additional day to make up for this; though that's not an ideal solution in any game, it may be the only one.

If that seems unacceptable to anyone, please let me know!

An extra day sounds perfect, and no need to apologize MR, that's about the best excuse I could imagine for not being around, cheers buddy!

S~V~S wrote:I thought I did something on night one, and I based a lot of assumptions on it. But it turns out I did nothing. I have been sending in actions, but only the ones supposed to go through do go through.

I thought I was fairly clear in how I explained this, maybe even too clear. My confusion over what happened night one was becasue I thought I had done something when i had not.

The civvies lost this game, and I am kinda tired of this. I give up. Please vote for me. I won't be back.

I'm REALLY hoping MR can delay the end of this day. I have asked many questions, and the answers are needed. My vote stays on SVS, though, unless someone can show me why I shouldn't trust FZ.

SVS, I need you to be more clear. You suggest that you did something in error on night 1, but you've also insinuated that you've been doing actions every night. Which is the accurate statement?

And Mr. Host, can you confirm if any roles have been used in a way that goes against the way they are written? And I second the call for an extra day to be added, this is the whole game on the line here and there are big issues that cannot currently be resolved...

S~V~S wrote:
Yes I do believe she was cc and no, I have found nothing. I have sent in movements, but have only actually been told I moved once since I had BTS with Sophie.

And MM, I have only really discussed the mechanics of one role. My error was that I have sent in an action every night. Doh. So I made a major assumption based on something that never happened.

So, one of the one hand I've got FZ saying that he is an Old Rogue. On the other, I've got SVS saying SHE is, but that she messed up and sent in her night actions every night, and the host was "kind enough to not correct her"?

Look, I'll put this out there. I've had some big issues getting timely answers to some questions from MR. I still haven't gotten an answer to my three PMs I've sent him, which includes finding out the results of my night action last night, an action whose result has a major bearing on my thoughts on this game so the fact we are far into the next day and I still don't have my night action result is problematic. I mention my frustration about this, because I'm now left to decide which of SVS and FZ are lying based on the possibility that the host allowed a role that is only to supposed to be every two nights run every night instead.

I can't honestly do that, but what if that's the case? As of now, I've got to assume that the host wouldn't let a role run every night when he wrote it to be every even night. But MR, some clarity on this might be needed.

FZ, what is your stance on this?

But FZ, to be clear here. If SVS gives me a certain answer, my vote will move to you, and it will never change until one of us is dead. Because her answer will take all doubt out of my mind, and it won't change.

FZ. wrote:Timmer, I'm trying to understand weather you're claiming to be heatwave or Mirror I'm assuming mirror, because I just checked the roles again and you ask about Mirror not being able to see the Trickster's actions or Heatwaves'. I assume that's you, or at least you're hinting to be it. That would mean both Heatwave and the Trickster are dead, and you're trying to find out what you saw SVS doing. I have no idea. I also don't understand how the Trickster and weather wizard and mirror could be alive after Roxy died. It makes no sense. So either Mr. Alchemy took one's power early on, and could hold on to it for longer, or you're lying. Because the only one we don't have proof about using a power is Mirror.

You make good assumptions, I'd say! And Mirror Master's power consists of spying on people, so obviously there is nothing you'd have seen proof of out here in the thread. But depending on SVS' answer to my question, you may see proof of it indirectly. Until I get her answer, she gets my vote.

Or not you, but rather FZ, sorry!