The Syndicate

Yeah, it's MP. Good case Canuck.

The part that frustrates me is I wanted to come back into this thread for days saying 'Why are you saying MP sounds civ???? He can easily give that kind of meltdown when he knows he will survive! I've done it before!!!' I used a very similar tactic when bad in RM Mafia. But by the time I actually came back... I'd spent my time focussing on what Zombs had said and that put me on a different track.

But to me, it has always made sense that the lynch to me would not have happened if I didn't have a baddie on the hook - it had to be one of MP, rabbit, sophie... I just cleared the wrong one first. I don't think lynch switches get used as revenge - they get used as defence.

All I'm saying, bf, is that on that first night... on that first night....... lol.

BF, that is exactly why I began to buy you could be bad yesterday.

Honestly, I'm amazed you are still alive!

Now I can see what your role is though, and its the role I had fs pegged as. Which is why I no longer think fs must be good. I feel very good about both you and rabbit, and still 99% good about canuck. I think we can now trust that we are down to only one baddie.

FS seems civvie, but I no longer feel I have her absolutely cleared. Her vouch for bea and call for elo to get the rezz votes were both two very civvie things. MP is more of an enigma. I feel like it absolutely must be one of those two, and I'm quite willing to go MP first.

Looking forward to Canuck's case. linki, there is the start of it. And Canuck - thanks for reminding me exactly why I found MP so suspish on day one. I can't wait for 'the Bass lunch' too thats lynch in a New Zealand accent, for anyone who didn't know.

Or fully genuine if he is good, of course.

But I also don't want to minimise that MP was probably genuine to an extent as well.

The one thing I will say about MP is this...

When I died, I did not buy his stuff at all. I've done exactly that kind of emotional plea once before to try to avoid my own lynch, and I definitely would have done it just before something like what went down. I bought it when reading it a lot later. It's a very good way to not immediately be lynched the following day since, without it, everyone would just have probably said 'rinse and repeat'.

I think sophie targetted rabbit and didn't kill him (ie he wasn't bad) last night.

OK, MP? Like, at this point... I'm pretty much doing what I'm told lol.

MP would make a lot of sense... and MP doing exactly what I said he was doing on day one would make a lot of sense.

Still don't understand Zombs posts if it is MP, or why bf says it isn't MP, though...

OK, I have all the answers I need.

I'm pretty convinced its fs too.

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Lena Hyena wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Wow. This game is crazy. bea's reveal is crazier than a fox with a lady fox!

RIP bea. Sorry.

Lena, you say that my vote makes you trust me less, but I thought my process was transparent, and I don't know how voting for Sophie or BF would have been better options.

MP, I trust you pretty well because I think Zombs posts clear you, honestly...

But right now I'm paranoid in every direction.

I really had cleared all of fs, bf and canuck in my head, and right now I think it must be one of the three of them.

Oh, okay.

Why do you think that? I don't have any reason to think it's one of them.

Because I trust you and rabbit, and thats all I got left...

Those three used to be my MOST trusted... but one of them is pulling the wool. I think I know which one.

BF...

Did you forget to send in a PM yesterday?

If this was the only game happening, maybe...

But, gotta keep up with keeler as well.

blindfaeth wrote:Ok well give me better ideas.

My role is so easy to figure out it isn't funny.

I haven't figured out your role...

I have figured out a few, but not yours.

Oh, I see sophie's theory is that llama was the other baddie and come back looking civvie.

That's just not what has happened here, I promise. I dunno which of your votes brought me back but I ain't bad.

Sophie wrote:I mean, this is impecable. A civvie so sharp that discoveres the entire mafia team in one post at the beginning of the game. He could never be questioned.
Or a baddie that knew because he was part of this team?

Sophie - this is the post I have been thinking of all game when I call bf super civ and say his instincts have been super good and he was amongst the first to call out every baddie.

I'll be honest, I have been thinking all game that bf was playing the most superb game ever. Which is actually true, whether he is good or bad.

So one thing is for sure - I don't think I've ever seen anyone distance themselves from their entire team in this way before. But I also did find it interesting bf never died when he was so on the mark.

Paranoia!!! I need to do a proper reread of bf.

Honestly though, I think I need to reread bf, fs AND canuck... all three. I now think one of them must be bad.

MovingPictures07 wrote:Wow. This game is crazy. bea's reveal is crazier than a fox with a lady fox!

RIP bea. Sorry.

Lena, you say that my vote makes you trust me less, but I thought my process was transparent, and I don't know how voting for Sophie or BF would have been better options.

MP, I trust you pretty well because I think Zombs posts clear you, honestly...

But right now I'm paranoid in every direction.

I really had cleared all of fs, bf and canuck in my head, and right now I think it must be one of the three of them.

Before you go too far down the 'golden was a baddie' route, I just want to remind you...

The game was not over when niju died. I came back in to the game much later. So there is someone out there who is bad, and is not me. Even if I was rezzed bad. Which I wasn't.

I can understand why I might take suspicion if another baddie is lynched and I'm still alive. But until that point, there is really no reason to lynch me.

I just wish I knew why all the vouching... splints for bea, bf for MP, sophie for rabbit...

It's no wonder we are paranoid.

Yeah, ignore that splints... I'm wrong about the curse anyway.

Yeah lol, but I currently trust sophie's vouch. For now. I may not in three hours lol. I go back and forth.

I can't believe I have to leave in ten minutes!!! I want to know what happens, but I'm out for the next 10 hours!

Except... zombs had the curse without dying, so I am wrong lol.

But I still think herman silenced rabbit.

And we KNOW... I think... that someone is still around blocking people, so the night before can be seen as an anomaly.

This is paranoia central lol.

BF, you trust MP? I was just gonna say his vote of bea leaves me mistrusting him lol...

Hopefully it is bea.

@splints - is rabbit not cursed? Has he spoken today?

I also lean towards trusting sophie because...

Rabbit is silenced. I think he WAS targetted by herman last night. I think herman insanifies/silences/curses etc good people... and kills baddies.

But I think... I was wrong, and Canuck is right.

I think bf might be the one. Sucks to be bf if he is lynched without right of reply, but we can't just let baddies survive, the numbers could be too tight.

Something gotta give!

Canuck - I really don't think a tie is a good idea.... if we are being fooled, there could be two baddies left. Like - it could be you and sophie, for instance.

A tie seems like a really bad idea to me.

I'm happier being wrong about sophie. At least if we lynch sophie and she was honest we know about rabbit and niju. Otherwise we just are still paranoid.

But I think a tie would just leave us still paranoid tomorrow. Make a call and go with it. Bf or sophie.

Honestly... bf... like, even I'm considering this could be right!

But... he did vote aces first, but then I guess they had a whole baddie team that could come in and vote MM, so it was safe. It gave bf a lot of cred. He was also amongst first to raise bass and niju as possibly bad...

Did he just come off as super civ because he knew who all the baddies were? Lol... I can see a scenario in which its bf, actually.

I'm paranoid too!

An interesting idea that the civvie killer would know their target was bad.

But it's not the way I've seen it work in the past. Doesn't mean it couldn't work like that. It's a big assumption to make.

OK, I just have to go with my gut here:

If Sophie is good, then she is being truthful that Niju is bad. That means there is only one baddie left.

Fs is vouching for bea hard out. A bold play if they were baddie teammates, but this late in the game it might be worth it. But in this scenario they can't both be bad. And I don't see why fs would be vouching for bea if bea is bad and fs is not.

On the other hand, if Sophie is bad, she could still be a lone wolf.

I agree with the assessment that there are elements of everyone that seem civ. So I need to go back to the things I see as evidence. Voting patterns. The posts made by baddies. Who has caught baddies. Etc.

These things, for me, all collectively say to me that sophie is the most likely candidate to be bad.

And sophie, if you are who I think you are claiming to be, then I hope your death does bring us information.

My vote is worth zero, but at least it indicates who I think is the right person to lynch today. Maybe I won't feel this way if you are still around tomorrow soph. I dunno. But after not following my gut yesterday, I need to today.

I picked up on what you were saying yesterday. But I have no info in this game and others do, so I have to listen to them.

I dunno, I'm so torn. But I also don't like being constantly pushed off my gut feel.

FS really does seem good to me though, for many reasons. Not least that she was campaiging to bring elo back.

Is it possible it could be bea AND fs??

fingersplints wrote:It was already called into question whether Dom was even the original target. I believe it was rabbit who said that.

I believe rabbit thought he was the intended target.

Unfortunately my vote is worth zero.

I think it is worth making sure all the peeps out there know that.

But listening to FS today makes me convinced I was right in my case on sophie. Actually, everything fits with sophie being bad. She is playing one hell of a game going down swinging, and sophie I admire you so much for that (mafia or civilian). But it doesn't change my vote.

Sophie, there have not been 'many, many times' I've had to say 'sorry soph, I thought you were bad'...

And don't you see it's exactly that kind of statement that is why I think you are?

I'm listening to people I know I can trust, I'm looking at people we know are bad, I'm looking at your voting patterns, I'm looking at other peoples voting patterns, and at the end one simple fact remains...

You and rabbit are the only two people who I don't feel anyone has cleared.

Unfortunately, you know what I think? I think you are bad, and trying to take rabbit out the door with you behind you.

fingersplints wrote:I'm really opposed to a Bea lynch today.

I'm willing to take fs at face value, honestly. Splints, I really trust you.

Plus... as you know... I've been trying to say sophie is bad all game lol, so it doesn't hurt that you agree with me.

I disagree completely that we should be buying in to her argument that this isn't her baddie meta. I don't think sophie has a baddie meta. I think she has a civilian meta. And this isn't it.

Sophie wrote:Fs, about your justifixations

This is the best new word I've ever seen! It is so perfect for mafia.

Also, the reason I clear MP - which I've said before, is that after I was lynched on day 2, Zombie jumped straight into 'MP must be bad because of this'. I truly believe part of the strategy of that lynch was that Zombs would also take out a person close to her who might be on to her more easily as well - ie MP. Zombs attitude to MP after that lynch makes me feel as confident about MP as any other civ.

fingersplints wrote:I'm not going allow myself to be convinced otherwise either. I knew llama was a civvie and I allowed myself to be paranoid and question my trust in him. turns out he was Exactly who I thought

Sophie's insisted he was bad. I think her outbursts were strange (like canuck said no one is really getting credit for any lynches. It's a team game) and now I wonder if that was all staged since it seems unlikely

Linki - I do have roles pencilled in and she doesn't have one. Rabbit I have one in mind for but may be wrong

Splints, in many ways this is how I feel too... like sophie is playing hard to the death, and she would. She is definitely the kind of person who would.

She has relied so much on saying 'everyone, you know me, this is not my baddie game'... she has been saying it all game.

She is relying on us buying in to her meta.

I've caught sophie as baddie once before, viral vids. We had btsc one night, and I caught her from the btsc, and in there - this is exactly the kind of sophie I saw.

I wouldn't just trust me because I'm golden if I were you either canuck.

I haven't been told why I am back but I am making the same assumption as everyone else - some people put their votes from all the various contests towards me and my name was drawn out of the hat. I don't know if I would have been recruited if it was a baddie vote for me that got pulled out of the hat, but I also don't know why a baddie would have voted for me. What I do know is that I was told I was still me. The sock was for my protection (epi lets me choose not to come straight out of the gate as golden) but I'm sure it was also for your paranoia, as well.

So hopefully the best thing you have to work on is this - I'm not forcing my will on anyone, I'm getting myself involved in proper, robust, analytical discussion with the people I think are most likely to be civs, and I'm really seeing the game the same way you guys are seeing the game.

Truth be told, I do think the civs will probably win this game... unless someone has us really fooled...

Like, if there is genuinely one baddie left against seven civs, one kill every two days isn't going to cut it... you have to rely on the civs lynching each other.

So phoning it in wouldn't surprise me, really.

What I'm worried about, sophie, is that rabbit has YOU fooled... not that I don't have to trust you. That's why I'm asking you about your change in opinion.

I'd be up for a bea vote.

Sophie - for the first time in this game... I believe you.

Btw - bea sits in the same category you did on aces... voted for him after it was too late.

Sophie - I'm trying to listen to you and keep an open mind, so keeping on telling me I have tunnel vision is not helping.

I don't have tunnel vision, but I want you to help... yesterday you had rabbit at number two in your suspect lynch, today you said under no circumstances lynch him... why the shift?

@bf -

JC is what I was going for.

@sophie... not based on lynch record? It's this stuff that makes you look bad...

Day aces - last vote on aces, when he appeared way behind. Perfect place for a baddie to hide.
Day bass - FIRST on bass... when I think bass wanted to go out and take LC with him to assist his team.
Day zombs - second to last on zombs

I think I know who Eloh was, and I'm sad we didn't both get to play together. I'm sorry for Eloh that she didn't get the win, because it does sound like she has hooked a whole lot of this together and deserves it.

Sorry that my ability may not be so useful any more. It did get us aces, though, so it was useful at the time.

And honestly, I see something which could hook together sophie as being good too. I dunno why she trusts rabbit but right now I do too, ironically. I can understand the paranoid theory about MP but I do think Zombie's approach to him speaks volumes. I already got turned around into believing maybe zombs had practiced distancing yesterday. I really don't think she did in respect of MP, any more than I did in respect of llama.

Bea does seem like a good option.

I mean, I think she has taken some risks if she is BAD.

Sophie...

if you are civilian, just keep aiding my thought processes. If I see logic in what we discuss, I could be persuaded to vote a different way.

I want a baddie lynched. If it's you, then yes I want you lynched. If it's not, then lets figure it out.

I think the clearing of FS is slightly weaker than others, but I still think she has taken some risks if she is good. I wonder if she was targetted by someone last night. If she was, I think that person was our villain.