Disney Cars Mafia [ENDGAME]

[Long Con]

Well, you weren't specific then... ask me what you want to know, it looked like you were doing "illegitimate baddie hunting", to use the apparent parlance of our times.

If there was a baddie to track down for Hedgeowl's death, then Snow Dog would be the one to go after, in equal amounts to Made. Right? I mean, it's a package deal. I just happen to believe that they're Civvie, this vouching is too bold for baddies to do.

You could point to Roxy, maybe she agreed too easily to switch from Made to Hedge. If she's a baddie, then in her eyes, one is just as good as the other if they're both Civ.

Were Mighty Rearranger's motives pure? Was it really something worth coming after Hedge for, just because some other people focused on her on Day One with no real suspicion? Maybe his vote was just a shielding ploy, like "look, I'm doing my own baddie hunting plan here, move along". It certainly seems to have met MP07's standards for who is doing "legitimate" baddie hunting and who isn't. (Unless MP is going after MR already and I have forgotten... pretty late here, going to bed, not worth searching out right now).

So there's some options for you if you're looking for someone to blame for Hedgeowl's lynch. I don't think those ideas are any less apparent than a play by play recounting was. If you thought there was something there, Dom, then why didn't you put forth these ideas? Is there someone in that list that you would prefer we not look at? Why make it my responsibility to think it out for you? Is that what "legitimate" baddie hunters do?

Ok, here's my turn to be Mr Legitimacy: Hey, uh, Sabie, what's your take on the Snow Dog/Made situation? DFaraday, was there a hidden motive behind Dom asking me to dig into the Hedge lynch rather than doing it himself? Simon, who sounds like a baddie to you the most out of everyone, gut response.

That'show you do it, right guys?

Re: the first LC quote.

Is there any other reasons you think they're on the same team beside the vote? I'm not finding anything on rereads, but i'm also exhausted atm.

Fingersplints trusted Roxy very early, and Roxy said that some people trust their friends more easily (as opposed to being a baddies using trust as a blind). Roxy and fingersplints are friends. I'm sure you can see how that could be construed as a baddie Roxy subtly clearing her baddie teammate from the 'truspect' charge.

[Snow Dog]

My problem with a LC vote is that he voted last for Bass when he didn't need to vote for him at all.

Also when answering Dom's question he could have coloured it if bad by saying that I manipulated Roxy into changing votes. Or anything in fact. But he recounted the facts as he saw them. Suggestting a civ that doesn't know to me.

[Snow Dog]

Is there no role checker this game? What does "tracks" mean?

[Roxy]

Voted yesterday.

[sabie12]

Alright I'm here I'm here I still have internet problems at my apartment. I'm really sorry for being the worst at participating this game.

Well, you weren't specific then... ask me what you want to know, it looked like you were doing "illegitimate baddie hunting", to use the apparent parlance of our times.

If there was a baddie to track down for Hedgeowl's death, then Snow Dog would be the one to go after, in equal amounts to Made. Right? I mean, it's a package deal. I just happen to believe that they're Civvie, this vouching is too bold for baddies to do.

You could point to Roxy, maybe she agreed too easily to switch from Made to Hedge. If she's a baddie, then in her eyes, one is just as good as the other if they're both Civ.

Were Mighty Rearranger's motives pure? Was it really something worth coming after Hedge for, just because some other people focused on her on Day One with no real suspicion? Maybe his vote was just a shielding ploy, like "look, I'm doing my own baddie hunting plan here, move along". It certainly seems to have met MP07's standards for who is doing "legitimate" baddie hunting and who isn't. (Unless MP is going after MR already and I have forgotten... pretty late here, going to bed, not worth searching out right now).

So there's some options for you if you're looking for someone to blame for Hedgeowl's lynch. I don't think those ideas are any less apparent than a play by play recounting was. If you thought there was something there, Dom, then why didn't you put forth these ideas? Is there someone in that list that you would prefer we not look at? Why make it my responsibility to think it out for you? Is that what "legitimate" baddie hunters do?

Ok, here's my turn to be Mr Legitimacy: Hey, uh, Sabie, what's your take on the Snow Dog/Made situation? DFaraday, was there a hidden motive behind Dom asking me to dig into the Hedge lynch rather than doing it himself? Simon, who sounds like a baddie to you the most out of everyone, gut response.

That'show you do it, right guys?

Re: the first LC quote.

Is there any other reasons you think they're on the same team beside the vote? I'm not finding anything on rereads, but i'm also exhausted atm.

Fingersplints trusted Roxy very early, and Roxy said that some people trust their friends more easily (as opposed to being a baddies using trust as a blind). Roxy and fingersplints are friends. I'm sure you can see how that could be construed as a baddie Roxy subtly clearing her baddie teammate from the 'truspect' charge.

My thoughts on this are that made and snow dog could be working together. Snow dog is sooo sure that made is good but some of the things made has said makes me think otherwise. I'll be voting made.

[Snow Dog]

Voted yesterday.

Good song.

[Dom]

Well, you weren't specific then... ask me what you want to know, it looked like you were doing "illegitimate baddie hunting", to use the apparent parlance of our times.

If there was a baddie to track down for Hedgeowl's death, then Snow Dog would be the one to go after, in equal amounts to Made. Right? I mean, it's a package deal. I just happen to believe that they're Civvie, this vouching is too bold for baddies to do.

You could point to Roxy, maybe she agreed too easily to switch from Made to Hedge. If she's a baddie, then in her eyes, one is just as good as the other if they're both Civ.

Were Mighty Rearranger's motives pure? Was it really something worth coming after Hedge for, just because some other people focused on her on Day One with no real suspicion? Maybe his vote was just a shielding ploy, like "look, I'm doing my own baddie hunting plan here, move along". It certainly seems to have met MP07's standards for who is doing "legitimate" baddie hunting and who isn't. (Unless MP is going after MR already and I have forgotten... pretty late here, going to bed, not worth searching out right now).

So there's some options for you if you're looking for someone to blame for Hedgeowl's lynch. I don't think those ideas are any less apparent than a play by play recounting was. If you thought there was something there, Dom, then why didn't you put forth these ideas? Is there someone in that list that you would prefer we not look at? Why make it my responsibility to think it out for you? Is that what "legitimate" baddie hunters do?

Ok, here's my turn to be Mr Legitimacy: Hey, uh, Sabie, what's your take on the Snow Dog/Made situation? DFaraday, was there a hidden motive behind Dom asking me to dig into the Hedge lynch rather than doing it himself? Simon, who sounds like a baddie to you the most out of everyone, gut response.

That'show you do it, right guys?

Re: the first LC quote.

Is there any other reasons you think they're on the same team beside the vote? I'm not finding anything on rereads, but i'm also exhausted atm.

Fingersplints trusted Roxy very early, and Roxy said that some people trust their friends more easily (as opposed to being a baddies using trust as a blind). Roxy and fingersplints are friends. I'm sure you can see how that could be construed as a baddie Roxy subtly clearing her baddie teammate from the 'truspect' charge.

LC, I don't think you read my post whatsoever. I said I don't necessarily think you're bad at this point. Please don't conflate my ideas with MPs.

[Long Con]

Well, if YOU read MY post then you'll see I didn't say that you think I'm bad.

Otherwise, I'm quite comfortable integrating a scathing diatribe about MP07's methods in with a post that began with answering you.

[Dom]

Well, if YOU read MY post then you'll see I didn't say that you think I'm bad.

Otherwise, I'm quite comfortable integrating a scathing diatribe about MP07's methods in with a post that began with answering you.

Well, you threw a lot of shade in that post. I see my name in there far more than MP's. You never actually indicted Mr. Sock of anything in that post, but rather, danced around an issue that left both me and MP open to attack.

[Long Con]

Well, if YOU read MY post then you'll see I didn't say that you think I'm bad.

Otherwise, I'm quite comfortable integrating a scathing diatribe about MP07's methods in with a post that began with answering you.

Well, you threw a lot of shade in that post. I see my name in there far more than MP's. You never actually indicted Mr. Sock of anything in that post, but rather, danced around an issue that left both me and MP open to attack.

You're being too sensitive.

[Tangrowth]

Well, if YOU read MY post then you'll see I didn't say that you think I'm bad.

Otherwise, I'm quite comfortable integrating a scathing diatribe about MP07's methods in with a post that began with answering you.

Well, you threw a lot of shade in that post. I see my name in there far more than MP's. You never actually indicted Mr. Sock of anything in that post, but rather, danced around an issue that left both me and MP open to attack.

That's exactly what I've been saying. He keeps dancing around things, not actually accusing anyone outright or baddie hunting.

I'm busy since I'm at campus studying all day, but when I get home I'll go back and look at LC's posts to give him a fair shake. I read his defense post and I realize I don't want to railroad him unfairly, and I did doubt myself. But I also feel his response is along the same lines of the behavior he's been doing all game. There's something off about it, like he isn't willing to actually accuse anyone of being bad.

If I remember correctly, he just kept spreading doubt about me and has never even ONCE tried to argue that I'm actually bad and here's why. That's what he's done with everyone.

BUT I will go back and revisit his posts to either illustrate that point or to clear up a misconception. I don't want to indict him on something that's untrue. But if I remember correctly, that is indeed the case.

BBL

[Long Con]

Don't bother, MP, why waste your time when you've already decided? Just vote for me, stop trying to justify it by pretending to analyze my gameplay.

You want me to tell you who the baddies are. I don't know who they are. I know who I think they're not. I put out some discussion about it, and you just accuse me yet again of "not baddie hunting".

[Tangrowth]

Don't bother, MP, why waste your time when you've already decided? Just vote for me, stop trying to justify it by pretending to analyze my gameplay.

You want me to tell you who the baddies are. I don't know who they are. I know who I think they're not. I put out some discussion about it, and you just accuse me yet again of "not baddie hunting".

So many things wrong with this response. I realize you're upset, especially if falsely accused, but:

- I'm not "pretending". If you believe I am, then do you believe I'm bad or not? You've never actually said. Nor have you said who you're voting.
- I don't want you to "tell me who the baddies are", I want you to tell me who you think they are and why, make definitive statements instead of just casting statements like you did above, where you never actually accuse me of being bad.

[Tangrowth]

Well, you weren't specific then... ask me what you want to know, it looked like you were doing "illegitimate baddie hunting", to use the apparent parlance of our times.

If there was a baddie to track down for Hedgeowl's death, then Snow Dog would be the one to go after, in equal amounts to Made. Right? I mean, it's a package deal. I just happen to believe that they're Civvie, this vouching is too bold for baddies to do.

You could point to Roxy, maybe she agreed too easily to switch from Made to Hedge. If she's a baddie, then in her eyes, one is just as good as the other if they're both Civ.

Were Mighty Rearranger's motives pure? Was it really something worth coming after Hedge for, just because some other people focused on her on Day One with no real suspicion? Maybe his vote was just a shielding ploy, like "look, I'm doing my own baddie hunting plan here, move along". It certainly seems to have met MP07's standards for who is doing "legitimate" baddie hunting and who isn't. (Unless MP is going after MR already and I have forgotten... pretty late here, going to bed, not worth searching out right now).

So there's some options for you if you're looking for someone to blame for Hedgeowl's lynch. I don't think those ideas are any less apparent than a play by play recounting was. If you thought there was something there, Dom, then why didn't you put forth these ideas? Is there someone in that list that you would prefer we not look at? Why make it my responsibility to think it out for you? Is that what "legitimate" baddie hunters do?

Ok, here's my turn to be Mr Legitimacy: Hey, uh, Sabie, what's your take on the Snow Dog/Made situation? DFaraday, was there a hidden motive behind Dom asking me to dig into the Hedge lynch rather than doing it himself? Simon, who sounds like a baddie to you the most out of everyone, gut response.

That'show you do it, right guys?

Re: the first LC quote.

Is there any other reasons you think they're on the same team beside the vote? I'm not finding anything on rereads, but i'm also exhausted atm.

Fingersplints trusted Roxy very early, and Roxy said that some people trust their friends more easily (as opposed to being a baddies using trust as a blind). Roxy and fingersplints are friends. I'm sure you can see how that could be construed as a baddie Roxy subtly clearing her baddie teammate from the 'truspect' charge.

I'm sorry, is this baddie hunting? You've never actually said who you suspect here. You just raised a bunch of questions.

[Snow Dog]

Stop voting for Made! Boogs move your vote. Made is civ!

[Snow Dog]

Made voters, vote for me instead.

[Roxy]

Eww I smell a drive by - on boogs

[Roxy]

I may switch my vote to made since no one will vote with me for Ambray.

[Long Con]

Dom's game:

Please feel free to click that link and follow along Dom's posts yourself.

First couple of days, some nothing posts.

Next six days, focus on MP for making a Seemer comment, and for leading the FZ. lynch.

Then he realizes that MP getting targeted makes him not a baddie, drops MP. Barely questions whether or not it was MP or DF that got targeted.

Next five days, goes after Made for, let's call it the "suspicious analysis" for brevity.

That takes us to yesterday when he asked me about the Hedge/Made lynch.

At no point to MP call Dom out for "not baddie hunting", despite Dom having only two suspicions all game, and extremely minimal discussion of anything else.

Theory: Dom's pursuit of MovingPictures07 in the early game was distancing, because he's a baddie with MP07. DFaraday was the actual target for the Night 1 kill, targeted by Dom, MP, and team. When the failed kill didn't show a specific player, they took advantage of it to lead the thread into accepting that MP was targeted, and therefore not a baddie. This also led to a convenient point for Dom to stop his distancing accusations of his teammate, to move doggedly on to the next target, Made.

Despite earlier declarations of trust for Snow Dog, Dom uses the Made case to also cast a shadow of doubt on Snow Dog, saying "Snow Dog is either bad or is hugely misguided". This is an attempt to seize the opportunity to lynch a possible Civvie BTSC team. I can only imagine the Seemer talk that would likely come up when Made gets lynched as Finn McMissile or something.

So, yeah, after this analysis of Dom's gameplay, coupled with MP's lack of criticism for it, makes these guys my top two suspects for this lynch.

[Tangrowth]

So I needed a break from studying anyway so I just looked through LC's posts this game. Seems my memory was correct. His baddie hunting is lacking and he doesn't make any definitive questions.

I highlight here which statements he's made that are actually definitive suspicions of his own:

I was surprised to come back into the thread and see all the votes on nijuu. The poll looked very different from the one I had last seen. I don't think it looks like a save of Llama though, who only had two votes when nijuu got four in a row.

I don't agree with MP that Snow Dog's case sounds forced at all, it's a possibility. It wouldn't be the first time that I've seen a baddie bring up something in the thread that they were hoping someone else would have noticed. I've done it myself before... a night action or lynch reveals something that the baddies wanted the Civvies to be misled by, but no one brings it up! It's very frustrating.

MP's immediate 'no u' vote is what raises my eyebrow more.

And that's really about it. He doesn't even say he thinks I'm bad, ever. He never makes that statement in this game, except here, ironically:

How have I had a lack of baddie hunting?

I thought that MP was seeming like a baddie, so I came after him. I thought a Roxy truster might be bad, so I reread them. I found a connection that Roxy and fingersplints might be baddies, and I brought it up.

This is an untrue accusation of me. You expect more of me, I'm sorry, but I was busy for much of this game. You're just accusing me because I've been busy when you say I haven't baddie hunted enough. If you can't see that, then I don't think anything I can say will convince you, and you're the one(s) with tunnel vision.

First, I will highlight every time LC has mentioned me, except for the times above. He has never really pursued me, just tried pushing the thread in my direction without ever saying I'm bad. Here they are in chronological order:

LC's first post about me was the one I quoted at the top, about my apparent NO U onto Snow Dog (which wasn't a no u): http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 47#p100247

He then votes me on D2: http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 65#p100265

Then he says this:

Well, that was something. I doubt a Seemer would choose Guido, since he is likely to have secret BTSC with Luigi. At least that's what I assume, since they're joined at the hip.

It's strange to me that MP's main case was based on a supposed goof-up that Bass made, and yet Bass got no votes and FZ got lynched.

"It's strange" and then he makes an observation. Tons of posts like this that don't really give an opinion on what HE thinks happened. More on that later though and back to mentioning me.

Then he votes me in the night poll:

Nothing positive about being caught by Frank. I'm voting MP07 for making me read so many pages just to catch up from being gone a few hours, only to find it was a waste of time.

He then says it's "not a lynch" when I get upset, which is weird upon reflection considering he just voted for me in a lynch the day before and apparently thinks I'm bad even though he's never said it.

To be fair, yes, I posted way too much and some of the posts are unnecessary. But I don't see why I deserve to receive a vote merely because I was actively baddie hunting when many others weren't. If you think it's because I wasn't being genuine that's another story.

It's not a lynch.

Well, it appears that way, but we don't really know what's going to happen, and it seems to have negative effects.

If there's negative effects, you should suffer them. I'd be happy to see you suffer them simply for making a sig bet at all. I'm really against sig bets, that, more than anything, makes me suspicious of you.

Apparently he thinks I should suffer them for making a sig bet at all, but doesn't mention EVER here that he thinks I'm bad.

MP, if you were so sure of Bass and a large part of your suspicion of FZ was predicated on her connection to Bass-- why not lynch bass?

Exactly what I was saying:

It's strange to me that MP's main case was based on a supposed goof-up that Bass made, and yet Bass got no votes and FZ got lynched.

Maybe MP was actually that overconfident that he had magically caught a whole baddie team, but it just smacks of convenience to me. Bass was the one who messed up, but that wasn't as important to MP as the fact that he saw that the thread would more easily go for FZ. The Civvie move would have been to lynch Bass first to be sure, since his alignment is the basis of the whole case, but not even MP voted for Bass.

Worthless rhetoric, he basically doesn't say anything here. Just puts out another possibility without even saying he thinks I'm bad, again.

I don't know what to do about MP. It's possible he could be a severely mistaken Civvie, but the way he just threw Bass, FZ., and Roxy into the pot just based on Bass' suppose slip-up is just bizarre. Then the sig bet thing, which always makes me suspicious. S~V~S just made a sig bet over in Monopoly Mafia and turned out to be a baddie. I feel like it's a move designed to make everyone believe that you're Civvie, because no one would ever make a sig bet as a baddie!

I can see the case about Bass seeming to know that MP and not DF was targeted, has Bass addressed this? The thing is, if MP were the targeter, then that would explain why he would be the one to come up with the accusation. No one else caught it. Or he could be Chick Hicks, not caring who gets lynched. It would be pretty slick, and if he's not a baddie, I don't see MP getting NK'ed any time soon.

Again more worthless rhetoric. He doesn't actually try to get me lynched or say that I'm bad.

"Genuine" baddie hunting... I guess that's classified as hunting a baddie who's not you, right MP?

The vote for Made was not opportunistic, it was made when I thought the lynch was a 24-hour one, and I had run out of time. The only reason I made a weak vote like that was that I really had no idea who the baddies were. I did intend to change it, but I didn't have a chance yesterday, I basically got up, went to work, came home, changed, went out for a birthday dinner for my niece and nephew, and went straight from there to play cards, getting home around 11pm, and the lynch was up.

The fact that would try to build a case against me saying I'm "asking the same questions over and over" just brings back my suspicion of you all over again. It's not even true. I asked Bass one time about his point of view on your out-of-control "case" that got him and FZ. killed. I asked it because I didn't want to wade back into the hundreds of posts you made happen to see if I could find it, figured I could get a fresh answer from him before just condemning him.

And as for my "trust of Roxy" that BR asked... I'm not the one who particularly trusts Roxy, that was half the players in the game. I saw nothing in particular that made me trust her any more than any of you, but apparently a lot of other people did. That kind of thing does affect my opinion of her. Then she came in from being silenced while Bass got lynched, with some angry words and fresh points of view, pointing at Made, Ambray, and... someone else as well I think. Without a solid suspicion of my own, Made got my vote due to his analysis of Dom, combined with the fresh Roxy accusation.

It doesn't mean I have any particular trust for Roxy, it meant I was willing to go with her suspicion because it was a fresh point of view that wasn't MP's death train.

Now apparently he tries to "go back" to the suspicion of me. What suspicion of me? He just keeps making statements about me (and others) and asking meaningless questions. He never actually hunts me. If he thinks I'm bad, why is he behaving like this?

Lol, well, no that's not baddie hunting anyone that's not me. I just mean your hunting has seemed forced and not genuine a lot of the time. I know that's hard to defend against though.

And it's not exactly because you're asking questions, it's more because you kept asking them without adding any of your own input or opinion on the matter.

I hate to be a broken record, but less input from me coincided with a busy time that we were very up-front about. So I can't help you there, I agree, I have given less input than I would have if it had been a free-time time of the year.

Your elaboration re: your trust of Roxy just doesn't make sense to me and elucidates my point. Do YOU trust Roxy? You sort of skirt the question. You're relying too much on other people's opinions, it's just strange.

I don't trust Roxy more than others, but I do like the fresh perspective she brought to the thread when she got unsilenced. After so much MP07-following wrongness in those lynches, I agreed with looking at another perspective.

And I have tried to to some back-reading to see if I could find a baddie, but the only thing I really see there is that maybe Roxy and fingersplints are baddies together. fingersplints was one of the big Roxy trusters, and I believe it was Roxy who mentioned something about 'trusting because of friendship', which originally led me to disregard splints as a "truspect".

Apparently he doesn't think I'm bad because this is what he says.

MP, you are someone who is absolutely stuck inside their own head. Play my playstyle off how you want, you're doing nothing but justifying your pre-existing gut suspicion by interpreting what I'm doing so it fits your ideal vision of the game.

Lemme put it bluntly: you're wrong about me. Lynch me and find out, but I promise you it will just be another Civvie lynch.

Never says he thinks I'm bad.

I have seen this accusation before, that someone "seems to not legitimately want to find baddies". It's always a sketchy reason, very gut-based, and I think it's probably really easy to decide like you think someone's bad, and then read their gameplay as illegitimate because of it... instead of the other way around.

Same story.

Then here comes the post I quoted above, the second one: http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 49#p101949 "I thought MP was seeming baddie, so I came after him". Where did he do that?

Total BS.





And here are his other "contributions" and EXACTLY what I've been talking about. He just constantly raises questions that anyone could glean from reading the thread and never gives his own opinions definitively. He is not trying to catch baddies, he's just trying to get by.

I do find it odd that LC said he'd leave his vote on me because he "didn't feel the need" with Ninja ahead of me in the votes. But I'm more likely to give him a pass on it than sabie.

Yeah, that's all I've got so far.

Thanks for the pass, I don't know why you said you find it odd. Maybe you need me to explain "didn't feel the need" a little better. I threw a vote on you to help prompt you to check in, not because I wanted to see you lynched. If I had checked back in and seen that you were going to be lynched, I would have moved my vote like I said I would, because you gave me a reason to. Since you seemed to be out of lynch-danger, I didn't think there was a point, especially since my catch-up on the thread was a big skim in which I saw some actual suspicions forming. I didn't have time to weigh in and analyze this new development, so I stayed with what I had.

Maybe I don't find it odd because I lived it, but there's nothing really odd there. Busy times, busy day today, I'll be more able to participate after the next couple of days are over.

No issuance of opinion about BWT or anyone else.

Well, that was something. I doubt a Seemer would choose Guido, since he is likely to have secret BTSC with Luigi. At least that's what I assume, since they're joined at the hip.

It's strange to me that MP's main case was based on a supposed goof-up that Bass made, and yet Bass got no votes and FZ got lynched.

"Strange"? He doesn't even elaborate here or look into it.

I thought my conversation with myself made it pretty clear why I'm likely wrong about MP -- he was targeted for a NK

Was it confirmed to be MP and not DF?

Well I guess I voting snow dog. I think everyone who is voting for me needs to be looked at next lynch.

Did you speak at all about the accusation MP gave to you? I think you did, but please refresh me: did you know it was MP who was targeted? Did you know DFaraday could have been the target?

Why did he ask these anyway? I questioned him on it here and he said:

Well I guess I voting snow dog. I think everyone who is voting for me needs to be looked at next lynch.

Did you speak at all about the accusation MP gave to you? I think you did, but please refresh me: did you know it was MP who was targeted? Did you know DFaraday could have been the target?

Like this post.

I already went back and forth on this with Bass for like thirty minutes yesterday.

What does this add? Nothing. Bass just can say whatever he wants to now, it doesn't change how he originally posted.

I read through that dizzying number of posts yesterday only once, due to the massive volume in a short time. Although I could remember a number of people, including yourself, calling out Bass for an explanation, I couldn't remember if he had given one before the lynch just turned on FZ.

I'm not trying to "add" anything, I was trying to decide how I felt about your case on Bass when I knew his side.

Anyways, I voted Bass because there was one minute left and he already has the majority of the votes. His explanation sounds reasonable, but it also sounds like what a baddie would say if he slipped up. So I guess we'll find out.

Never even said he thought Bass was suspicious, ever. This was the only time he even acknowledged him, really.

I was thinking back over the game, and recalling a flood of trust for Roxy near the start. I thought it might be beneficial to track that trust a little, and see who fostered it, and who followed it. Seems like the kind of thing the baddies might want to get involved with on some level. It follows something I've been looking at for a few games now, the idea of baddies expressing trust in Civvies to get some cred.

I didn't find much I thought too interesting in the Roxy trusters. Two were Bass and FZ., one was MP07, and then there's fingersplints, who is Roxy's friend.

I have to vote now because I have to go to work. I'm going to go with Made, partly because Roxy herself agrees with it, partly because of the strange analysis of Dom's play, which seems pretty normal to me. It's pretty weak.

He didn't find anything from this. Again, empty theories without expounding on them. Appearing to baddie hunt without actually doing so. Then he latches onto a Made vote.

Seriously, folks, listen to this:

"Genuine" baddie hunting... I guess that's classified as hunting a baddie who's not you, right MP?

The vote for Made was not opportunistic, it was made when I thought the lynch was a 24-hour one, and I had run out of time. The only reason I made a weak vote like that was that I really had no idea who the baddies were. I did intend to change it, but I didn't have a chance yesterday, I basically got up, went to work, came home, changed, went out for a birthday dinner for my niece and nephew, and went straight from there to play cards, getting home around 11pm, and the lynch was up.

The fact that would try to build a case against me saying I'm "asking the same questions over and over" just brings back my suspicion of you all over again. It's not even true. I asked Bass one time about his point of view on your out-of-control "case" that got him and FZ. killed. I asked it because I didn't want to wade back into the hundreds of posts you made happen to see if I could find it, figured I could get a fresh answer from him before just condemning him.

And as for my "trust of Roxy" that BR asked... I'm not the one who particularly trusts Roxy, that was half the players in the game. I saw nothing in particular that made me trust her any more than any of you, but apparently a lot of other people did. That kind of thing does affect my opinion of her. Then she came in from being silenced while Bass got lynched, with some angry words and fresh points of view, pointing at Made, Ambray, and... someone else as well I think. Without a solid suspicion of my own, Made got my vote due to his analysis of Dom, combined with the fresh Roxy accusation.

It doesn't mean I have any particular trust for Roxy, it meant I was willing to go with her suspicion because it was a fresh point of view that wasn't MP's death train.

That bolded and underlined reasoning is BS. No one knows who the baddies are. LC isn't hunting genuinely because he doesn't have to. He's bad.

Lol, well, no that's not baddie hunting anyone that's not me. I just mean your hunting has seemed forced and not genuine a lot of the time. I know that's hard to defend against though.

And it's not exactly because you're asking questions, it's more because you kept asking them without adding any of your own input or opinion on the matter.

I hate to be a broken record, but less input from me coincided with a busy time that we were very up-front about. So I can't help you there, I agree, I have given less input than I would have if it had been a free-time time of the year.

Your elaboration re: your trust of Roxy just doesn't make sense to me and elucidates my point. Do YOU trust Roxy? You sort of skirt the question. You're relying too much on other people's opinions, it's just strange.

I don't trust Roxy more than others, but I do like the fresh perspective she brought to the thread when she got unsilenced. After so much MP07-following wrongness in those lynches, I agreed with looking at another perspective.

And I have tried to to some back-reading to see if I could find a baddie, but the only thing I really see there is that maybe Roxy and fingersplints are baddies together. fingersplints was one of the big Roxy trusters, and I believe it was Roxy who mentioned something about 'trusting because of friendship', which originally led me to disregard splints as a "truspect".

It's interesting he says this now because it's the first I heard of it.

He FINALLY makes an attempt to baddie hunt here:

I'm not too suspicious of either Made or Snow Dog at this point. Looking more toward Roxy, fingersplints, and maybe Dom after a reread.

I may have worked out a couple of roles, need to watch and see. As for BR, I'm usually blind to her alignment so

But he NEVER explains why he's eyeing any of those players!

I think LC needs to go. If you actually look at what he's saying, his statements are almost always empty statements. They don't contribute anything, but he tries to make it appear like he is, then gets offended when I say he isn't legitimately baddie hunting. That's because he isn't. He's just making empty statements and asking empty questions, never offering up statements like "I think so and so is bad and this is why". Never.

Linki w/ LC: How convenient. Where's the roll eyes smiley?

[Long Con]

At no point to MP call Dom out for "not baddie hunting"...

That should be "At no point did MP call Dom out".

[Tangrowth]

I see nothing wrong with Dom's behavior this game. He's been reasonable. I may not agree with him on Made, but LC's most recent theory is obviously an attempt to CHA (cover his redacted). And he has been baddie hunting and not making near as many empty statements or questions as you, LC.

I'd like everyone to actually read my observations about LC. I am very confident he's bad.

[Long Con]

LOL MP. Nice wall of text. My case is much easier to swallow, I can't wait to read yours.

[Long Con]

I see nothing wrong with Dom's behavior this game. He's been reasonable. I may not agree with him on Made, but LC's most recent theory is obviously an attempt to CHA (cover his ass). And he has been baddie hunting and not making near as many empty statements or questions as you, LC.

I'd like everyone to actually read my observations about LC. I am very confident he's bad.

Of course you don't see anything wrong with Dom's behaviour. It's pretty clear he's your baddie teammate. I just hope we don't lynch Made before proving it by lynching one of you.

[Tangrowth]

Do it, lynch me. Then when I flip civ, I want everyone to lynch you, LC, and your baddie teammate, Rox.

[Tangrowth]

Rox's fixation on Ambray and the way she has emotionally manipulated the thread have been bothering me for some time. I think she's your teammate.

[Tangrowth]

I also think it's really obvious that Snowy and Made have civvie BTSC. I don't think they'd be doing this if they were bad, and the way LC says the same confirms that to me.

Gotta go, be back later tonight.

[Long Con]

LOL what a joke, I just read your post MP. I love how you ignore that fact that I'm clearly suspicious of you and actually say so, more than once, in all the posts you quoted.

[Long Con]

I also think it's really obvious that Snowy and Made have civvie BTSC. I don't think they'd be doing this if they were bad, and the way LC says the same confirms that to me.

Gotta go, be back later tonight.

Convenient for you to state this now. <-- there's the rolleyes smiley.

[Tangrowth]

LOL what a joke, I just read your post MP. I love how you ignore that fact that I'm clearly suspicious of you and actually say so, more than once, in all the posts you quoted.

BS. You never ONCE say "I think MP is suspicious" or "I think MP is bad".

You never ONCE have voted me.

You're lying.

[Tangrowth]

Oh, wait, I'm wrong you did vote me ONCE on D2.

You haven't voted me since. If I'm so bad, why didn't you push a lynch of me before, LC? Why are you only saying this now?

[Tangrowth]

Anyway, whatever, I need to study. I've made my case. Go ahead and laugh it off instead of seeing it for what it is. EMPTY WORDS.

I hope others can see that your failure to baddie hunt has dug you a hole this game.

[Tangrowth]

I really had no idea who the baddies were.

Don't bother, MP, why waste your time when you've already decided? Just vote for me, stop trying to justify it by pretending to analyze my gameplay.

You want me to tell you who the baddies are. I don't know who they are. I know who I think they're not. I put out some discussion about it, and you just accuse me yet again of "not baddie hunting".

[Tangrowth]

Day 4 and Day 5, respectively.

LC is a liar.

Gone now. :P

[Long Con]

Yup, of course when I vote for you and say you're suspicious, it's all empty.

[Tangrowth]

I really had no idea who the baddies were.

Don't bother, MP, why waste your time when you've already decided? Just vote for me, stop trying to justify it by pretending to analyze my gameplay.

You want me to tell you who the baddies are. I don't know who they are. I know who I think they're not. I put out some discussion about it, and you just accuse me yet again of "not baddie hunting".

You voted me D2.

If you found me suspicious all this time, why did you not pursue it?

Redacted.

[Tangrowth]

Even now, you still don't vote me. DO IT. Come on, LC. Do it!

[Long Con]

Even now, you still don't vote me. DO IT. Come on, LC. Do it!

Are you kidding me with this? Keep your panties on.

[Roxy]

Rox's fixation on Ambray and the way she has emotionally manipulated the thread have been bothering me for some time. I think she's your teammate.

You are brilliant baddie hunter MP! I guess your wall of text will secure LC's lynch -
I guess since your lumping me together as a baddie with FZ & Bass who had dun goofed did not work out so now I am a baddie with LC on a team though idk why since I was suspicious of LC before MP - but what ever he says must be true bc its in a wall of text.

Yes everyone, lets trust someone who has consistently led lynches on civvies all gme.

Someone who refuses to see all sides.

Someone who thinks he is right all the time so their mind will remain unchanged even when proven wrong.

Someone who is displaying all the civ qualities that make me want to follow their vote.



I really wish you would just go on and make a wall of text about me so I can be lynched and put out of my misery.

Also to anyone who has cleared MP to be a civ bc he MAY have survived a N attempt - HELO. - there are 2 baddie teams and Chick.

[Tangrowth]

Roxy's bad.

Rox and LC are bad.

LC won't vote me because he knows I'm civvie. He's failed to say I'm suspicious all game after he voted for me D2 (and even then, he never actually say it).

He even JUST SAID you don't know who the baddies are.

I'm not too suspicious of either Made or Snow Dog at this point. Looking more toward Roxy, fingersplints, and maybe Dom after a reread.

I may have worked out a couple of roles, need to watch and see. As for BR, I'm usually blind to her alignment so

Don't bother, MP, why waste your time when you've already decided? Just vote for me, stop trying to justify it by pretending to analyze my gameplay.

You want me to tell you who the baddies are. I don't know who they are. I know who I think they're not. I put out some discussion about it, and you just accuse me yet again of "not baddie hunting".

How have I had a lack of baddie hunting?

I thought that MP was seeming like a baddie, so I came after him. I thought a Roxy truster might be bad, so I reread them. I found a connection that Roxy and fingersplints might be baddies, and I brought it up.

This is an untrue accusation of me. You expect more of me, I'm sorry, but I was busy for much of this game. You're just accusing me because I've been busy when you say I haven't baddie hunted enough. If you can't see that, then I don't think anything I can say will convince you, and you're the one(s) with tunnel vision.

NOTE how he dropped his "suspicion" of Rox and now has gunned after me and Dom.

[Tangrowth]

Anyway, I really need to go now. Civvies, PLEASE just read what empty statements LC has been saying and read how Rox is downplaying my case AGAIN and how she's been emotionally manipulating the thread all game.

LC needs to go and he needs to go today.

[Long Con]

I really had no idea who the baddies were.

Don't bother, MP, why waste your time when you've already decided? Just vote for me, stop trying to justify it by pretending to analyze my gameplay.

You want me to tell you who the baddies are. I don't know who they are. I know who I think they're not. I put out some discussion about it, and you just accuse me yet again of "not baddie hunting".

You voted me D2.

If you found me suspicious all this time, why did you not pursue it?

Redacted.

I do believe you know all about redacted, since your case is made of it.

...that, more than anything, makes me suspicious of you.

Maybe MP was actually that overconfident that he had magically caught a whole baddie team, but it just smacks of convenience to me.

I don't know what to do about MP. It's possible he could be a severely mistaken Civvie, but the way he just threw Bass, FZ., and Roxy into the pot just based on Bass' suppose slip-up is just bizarre. Then the sig bet thing, which always makes me suspicious. S~V~S just made a sig bet over in Monopoly Mafia and turned out to be a baddie. I feel like it's a move designed to make everyone believe that you're Civvie, because no one would ever make a sig bet as a baddie!

Nope, I never actually was suspicious or said he could be a baddie. That's the case, right? I do appreciate you pulling all my quotes together so it's this easy to prove you wrong. Just because I didn't take the Tunnel Vision route like you and Dom seem to enjoy, doesn't mean I'm not baddie hunting. I'm not obligated to say every word that comes to my mind when I'm playing Mafia, I'm surprised to learn that's not a general principle everyone follows. I'm not here to prove to you or anyone how hard I can publicly try to get baddies - when I think I've found a baddie, you will know about it. And I'm pretty sure I've found two here.

What's the phrase, MP? "Ya dun goofed"? Yup. *votes MP*

[Snow Dog]

Family friendly game everyone!

[Long Con]

Roxy's bad.

Rox and LC are bad.

LC won't vote me because he knows I'm civvie. He's failed to say I'm suspicious all game after he voted for me D2 (and even then, he never actually say it).

He even JUST SAID you don't know who the baddies are.

[snip]

NOTE how he dropped his "suspicion" of Rox and now has gunned after me and Dom.

Just another example of the fallacy of Tunnel Vision.

a) It's okay to not know who the baddies are. That's kind of the point of the game. No one knows who the baddies are. So it's a really bizarre thing to accuse me of - not knowing. There's a whole spectrum of suspicion that generally precedes "knowing". You have shown the thread the foolishness of acting like you KNOW who the baddies are, maybe you should sit down and reconsider the way you play, accept that not all suspicions have to be "Lynch that baddie now!" until you're more sure.

b) I have not mentioned Roxy during my new case against you and Dom. She's another one of my suspicions, but she's not currently tied into the Dom/you case. See, when you choose not to employ Tunnel Vision, it frees you to have separate suspicions that you can discuss separately.

[Roxy]

Also its bs that you keep saying I am using emotion MP.
First you think I am bad simply bc I disagreed with your silly cases on FZ and Bass.
Now I am bc for no reason given (sound familar?) I guess you are doing the same thing you accuse LC of

Linky what redacted case MP??? second time you accuse me without giving me ANYTHING to respond to.

[Long Con]

Also to anyone who has cleared MP to be a civ bc he MAY have survived a N attempt - HELO. - there are 2 baddie teams and Chick.

Just to clarify, there is only one baddie team, and Chick. British Intel is Civ-aligned, in that they need to defeat The Lemons to win. Also, it looks like they can win even if dead... but they don't need to defeat Chick Hicks to win (so Chick, leave them alone! )

[Long Con]

Please don't conflate my ideas with MPs.

Just rereading... this statement is telling if you consider they're baddie teammates. Dom would REALLY like to avoid being lumped with MP.

[Epignosis]

Easy on the hot rod talk, there!

[Roxy]

Sorry for the language elo and epi I had forgotten about the kids

Thanks LC but you just helped MP's Case against you by being helpful in the thread :o

[Roxy]

Also the civs deserve to lose this for following bs cases/suspicions - I changed my vote to help.