Scooby Doo: Monster Collective (GAME OVER- MAFIA WIN)

[hollowkatt]

Oh @hollowkatt also, I thought Seanzie’s push on Sig for “slipping” that he didn’t know villains were town couldn’t possibly be real. If town is monsters/villains and wolves are the mystery gang, the only players who wouldn’t know that are 3P. This was pointed out several times but Seanzie insisted.

I know it’s worth fuck all atp but for full disclosure.

I think that's legit to push on from a town seanzie perspective but also a legit thing for seanzie to be pushed on. And it does appear that monsters = town thus far so I would assume the scooby gang are the baddies. The question is this: do we have the full gang or not. I think we'd basically have to not. GTH it's scooby, shaggy, velma, and likely one of fred/daphne. 18 is too small to have 5 wolves and also a 3p with a puppet.

[hollowkatt]

my poe is wigly, rondo, dunya, chihiro, crich

I think lucy is telling the truth and appears to be town siding atm. Dennis, mac, jack, sig I feel pretty good about being town.

Kate and neon and falcon are in the middle tier basically a town lean.
DooM can be in there too.

jdizz and creature I don't have a read on but I'll get to that eventually.

[DaughterOfOmega]

@Creature vote Mac

[Jackofhearts2005]

Well…I caught up to why CR and Pyxxy suspected me. Pretty underwhelming.

Idk if I believe any of CR’s reads tbh.

[Jackofhearts2005]

my poe is wigly, rondo, dunya, chihiro, crich

I think lucy is telling the truth and appears to be town siding atm. Dennis, mac, jack, sig I feel pretty good about being town.

Kate and neon and falcon are in the middle tier basically a town lean.
DooM can be in there too.

jdizz and creature I don't have a read on but I'll get to that eventually.

Is CRich/Mac town or poe?

[Jackofhearts2005]

Also, Creature is super obvious towncreature and HK probably town for having a similar poe to me and at least existent reasoning for where we differ. Also, at one point I was considered pretty good at reading HK and this looks like fired up town HK, not replaced in wolf HK.

[hollowkatt]

my poe is wigly, rondo, dunya, chihiro, crich

I think lucy is telling the truth and appears to be town siding atm. Dennis, mac, jack, sig I feel pretty good about being town.

Kate and neon and falcon are in the middle tier basically a town lean.
DooM can be in there too.

jdizz and creature I don't have a read on but I'll get to that eventually.

Is CRich/Mac town or poe?

oh right crich is mac now.
Fixed in the below quote

my poe is wigly, rondo, dunya, chihiro

I think lucy is telling the truth and appears to be town siding atm. Dennis, mac, jack, sig I feel pretty good about being town.

Kate and neon and falcon are in the middle tier basically a town lean.
DooM can be in there too.

jdizz and creature I don't have a read on but I'll get to that eventually.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Ya know if you ISO CR and do a word search for "Jack", you'll get 20 matches...and almost none of them have anything to do at all with actually reading Jack or engaging with him

Ahem I voted Jack before EOD1 and am voting them now. That should make it pretty obvious Jack is in my PoE.

Yes, but why? Your vote for him now seems to be based off "Let's get the CW to green flip"...and I'm just wondering if there's actually something behind your SR of Jack beyond that.





I thought he was fairly towny last RD

Is that right? Are you claiming info on Jack that clears them?

And now he's fishing for roles




[VOTE: CR] aubergine

I haven’t gotten to Mac yet but CR’s opening is pretty horrendous.

Sad that wolves don’t warn their partners about me more often.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Ya know if you ISO CR and do a word search for "Jack", you'll get 20 matches...and almost none of them have anything to do at all with actually reading Jack or engaging with him

Ahem I voted Jack before EOD1 and am voting them now. That should make it pretty obvious Jack is in my PoE.

Yes, but why? Your vote for him now seems to be based off "Let's get the CW to green flip"...and I'm just wondering if there's actually something behind your SR of Jack beyond that.





I thought he was fairly towny last RD

its quite normal to wanna go after the counter wagon, also CR is pretty head strong on their read. My problem with jack as of currently is the timing of the train disolving.

Can you elaborate on this? The train dissolved when I showed up and started being townie. So what's wrong with the timing and what does that mean for my or anyone else's alignment?

[Jackofhearts2005]

jack should always flip here and i think he might've tmi'ed sig town as creature or someone implied and had my general worldview be incorrect, either way i'm gonna do more town leadery stuff this cycle

i'm gonna reread d1 tonight

@CRichard what's your read on me/creature/dunya

You town
Creature town
Dunya town.

Could you elaborate on dunya

I would imagine a world where lucy, dunya, and creature are all town is a world where one of them dies last night.

Which one do you think is mostly likely bad in that case?

can everyone answer this, thanks

At this point, Dunya is the most likely wolf if only because I'm very certain Creature is town and pretty damn sure HK is town.

[Jackofhearts2005]

for the record dennis is obvs town

His posts D2 preceding this one do look pretty good.

[falcon45ca]

Ya know if you ISO CR and do a word search for "Jack", you'll get 20 matches...and almost none of them have anything to do at all with actually reading Jack or engaging with him

Ahem I voted Jack before EOD1 and am voting them now. That should make it pretty obvious Jack is in my PoE.

Yes, but why? Your vote for him now seems to be based off "Let's get the CW to green flip"...and I'm just wondering if there's actually something behind your SR of Jack beyond that.





I thought he was fairly towny last RD

Is that right? Are you claiming info on Jack that clears them?

And now he's fishing for roles




[VOTE: CR] aubergine

I haven’t gotten to Mac yet but CR’s opening is pretty horrendous.

Sad that wolves don’t warn their partners about me more often.

Mac has come in w/ some solve energy, which is what I'd expect from Maf Mac trying to work himself out of the POE.

[falcon45ca]

Some names that haven't been in my mouth but I have thoughts on:

Falcon - just a falcon doing falcon things, though I feel like he has been less present than normal. I wanna see more of him to solidify a read but he's okay for now.

Wilgy - he hasn't been posting his big posts that intimidate me. He mentioned being low on WiM N0 and that's why I've stayed away from him until now but that tiny voice in the back of my head is getting louder.

I'm having the same concerning feelings about wilgy.

This doesn't make sense. I'm clearly a beacon of towny behavior.

[Jackofhearts2005]

I'm sorry what?

seanzie felt town by the end of d1? or was that just me?

I didn't think so but neon seemed more town toward the end.

ehhh but neon is also a good miselimination for their focus on the puppet account.

Also seanzie death confirms more puppet accounts can exist

neon is a more astute townie than that, maybe something to look at. I'll give her a read later tonight with some thoughts

Scrappy should still die. But CRich should die first.

Yeah no if you're town, there's no way you don't flip Jack 1st.

It's just continued game theory assertions.

Feels stiff. Doesn't feel townie.

Slightly concerned CR's playstyle is just so out there to me that I can't follow their townprocess at all. But that's not the case, right? I've played with town CR and not had this problem in the past, right?

[Jackofhearts2005]

Like it's suuuuuuuuper easy to think that CR doesn't believe the things he says because he's VERY sure of them, stating them as if they are scientific fact, yet the actual reasoning behind what he says is just....missing.

Like he asserts that if you think CR is mafia, you still always yeet Jack first but....why? He doesn't say.

[Jackofhearts2005]

BTW if Jack flips mafia, kill Kate and Neon the next two days. They're trying to strongarm a mislunch on me and protect their scum buddy jack.

This is so fucking weird to say 2 hours into a 48 hour phase.

Like, I do tend to assume townies who disagree with me are wolves....after I've laid out my reasoning explicitly and those townies who disagree with me are not addressing those posts or are just flying by the seat of their pants or reaction testing. The thought process is "I think X is a wolf. I have explained why. The reasoning is good. A townie should be convinced by my reasoning and vote with me. A townie could also see something I don't see and explain these disagreements. Y and Z are not voting for X and they are not addressing my reasoning at all. This is because they are mafia with X and they think ignoring my case is easier or more likely to succeed than arguing against it" and the truth is just that they didn't read it 90% of the time and what I found wasn't that convincing the other 10%. Or I'm occasionally even correctly reading multiple wolves.

But the key thing is that I think players Y and Z are wolves not because they disagree with me but because they disagree with me while ignoring my reasoning.

CR never gives his reasoning so I'm left to fill in the blanks by myself. In fact, Kate, Falcon and Dennis keep asking him to lay out his reasoning and saying they don't understand why CR scumreads me and he just....doesn't address it and calls them sus.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Neon always dies 1st if Jack flips mafia.
Actually, flip them next also if Jack flips town. That's TMI in the world Jack is town.

I sometimes think stuff like this as a townie but I don't think it with righteous indignation.

I'm really struggling with seeing CR's towngame being worlds apart from mine...or just seeing a wolf.

[Jackofhearts2005]

BTW if Jack flips mafia, kill Kate and Neon the next two days. They're trying to strongarm a mislunch on me and protect their scum buddy jack.

do you really think the maf team outs like that? really?

it's obvious town fucking confirmation bias

how the fuck is that not seen

I respect crichs game more than to assume he'd run off half-cocked like this. It's weird and doesn't fit with the current game state. Crich feels like he's fighting for his life and the people pushing him don't feel like "they need this chop to win the game". Dunno if that makes sense but it worked in my head.

anyways, this game state feels weird and I want to sit and think about it while I do more back reading. And preparing a case on dunya

Yeah, tbh.

I don't think a townie ever feels that way in this situation.

But does a wolf? Maybe if he feels his push is falling apart and his team is in deep trouble but it's really just CR, Jack and Dunya being pushed by non CR players ATP in the game. He wants me dead if he's a wolf and if the plan is to misyeet me...he shoots Pyxxy and then pushes me without reasoning and then OMGUS pushes everyone who doesn't follow along immediately? Even the Dunya pressure is almost solely from HK.

Idk. Game is weird. CR's state of mind makes no sense to me.

[Kate]

jack should always flip here and i think he might've tmi'ed sig town as creature or someone implied and had my general worldview be incorrect, either way i'm gonna do more town leadery stuff this cycle

i'm gonna reread d1 tonight

@CRichard what's your read on me/creature/dunya

You town
Creature town
Dunya town.

Could you elaborate on dunya

I would imagine a world where lucy, dunya, and creature are all town is a world where one of them dies last night.

Which one do you think is mostly likely bad in that case?

can everyone answer this, thanks

At this point, Dunya is the most likely wolf if only because I'm very certain Creature is town and pretty damn sure HK is town.

Why are you so sure Creature is town? I'm thinking chihiro is bad. I've got to reread him. Any thoughts on him?

[Jackofhearts2005]

You town
Creature town
Dunya town.

Could you elaborate on dunya

I would imagine a world where lucy, dunya, and creature are all town is a world where one of them dies last night.

Which one do you think is mostly likely bad in that case?

can everyone answer this, thanks

At this point, Dunya is the most likely wolf if only because I'm very certain Creature is town and pretty damn sure HK is town.

Why are you so sure Creature is town? I'm thinking chihiro is bad. I've got to reread him. Any thoughts on him?

I say this with love but Creature is bad at mimicking his towngame as a wolf. It's practically a meme on MU. I (and several other players) have been able to correctly pick out Creature's alignment by mid D2 with 100% accuracy over like 15 games. Sometimes earlier. His tone and his train of thought here are just exceedingly town Creature.

I "lol trust me" isn't fun and I know it seems like there's nothing particularly difficult about Creature's towngame such that he shouldn't be able to fake it but he just can't.

As for Chihiro, I don't know. He says #reasonableshit and asks some questions but I don't see much of anything (that one DR meme aside) that makes me particularly think the slot is town. I'm not seeing obvious agenda, either. Never played with Chihiro before. He can be POE.

[Jackofhearts2005]

CR is blantly town imo, jack's posts were bad yesterday

What posts of Jack's stuck out to you the most?





His tone reeked of towny self-righteousness, what are you seeing?

I'd be extremely surprised if Jack flips anything other than town.

Going all cards in on killing one player D1 in exchange for your life is not a wolfy play.

Let's pretend this is part of the "Jack intentionally baits wolves into making bad pushes on him" strategy and not just that I keep being certain townies are wolves EOD1.

[Kate]

Ok here's my list I promised last night.

Kate
Jack
Rondo
Neon

Hk
Sig
Dunya
Dennis
Falcon
Creature

Chihiro
Daughter of Omega
Wilgy
Jdizz

(Lucy) either not trustworthy 3p or mafia.

I feel like I'm missing someone but I looked 3x. Someone tell me if I am

[JDizz10]

Oh @hollowkatt also, I thought Seanzie’s push on Sig for “slipping” that he didn’t know villains were town couldn’t possibly be real. If town is monsters/villains and wolves are the mystery gang, the only players who wouldn’t know that are 3P. This was pointed out several times but Seanzie insisted.

I know it’s worth fuck all atp but for full disclosure.

I think that's legit to push on from a town seanzie perspective but also a legit thing for seanzie to be pushed on. And it does appear that monsters = town thus far so I would assume the scooby gang are the baddies. The question is this: do we have the full gang or not. I think we'd basically have to not. GTH it's scooby, shaggy, velma, and likely one of fred/daphne. 18 is too small to have 5 wolves and also a 3p with a puppet.

This could be more of a reason why Lucy isn’t 3p and is mafia. Leaving out Fred or Daphne would be odd, don’t you think? I still don’t like the way @lucy has been consistently threatening town. I think she is trying to power wolf.

[JDizz10]

She also tried to control whose iso I read and Strat me in a particular direction when I started playing again…

[JDizz10]

Steer*

[Jackofhearts2005]

BTW I'm the vigilante who tried to kill Jack last night.

aye lmao pretty sure this ain't true cause raisens

[Jackofhearts2005]

BTW I'm the vigilante who tried to kill Jack last night.

signal boosting cr obvious town

Why does 3P care about this so much?

[DrWilgy]

Some names that haven't been in my mouth but I have thoughts on:

Falcon - just a falcon doing falcon things, though I feel like he has been less present than normal. I wanna see more of him to solidify a read but he's okay for now.

Wilgy - he hasn't been posting his big posts that intimidate me. He mentioned being low on WiM N0 and that's why I've stayed away from him until now but that tiny voice in the back of my head is getting louder.

I'm having the same concerning feelings about wilgy.

This doesn't make sense. I'm clearly a beacon of towny behavior.

coward.

[DaughterOfOmega]

Ok here's my list I promised last night.

Kate
Jack
Rondo
Neon

Hk
Sig
Dunya
Dennis
Falcon
Creature

Chihiro
Daughter of Omega
Wilgy
Jdizz

(Lucy) either not trustworthy 3p or mafia.

I feel like I'm missing someone but I looked 3x. Someone tell me if I am

I think an honest player wouldnt have a confirmed town that low

[DaughterOfOmega]

@Creature vote Mac

If you dont vote this slot Im vigging you

[DrWilgy]

CRichard
1
5%
Voters: DaughterOfOmega

dunya
4
18%
Voters: sig, Dennis, hollowkatt, MacDougall

Jackofhearts2005
4
18%
Voters: Scrappy Doo, lucy, Creature, RondoDimBuckle

JDizz10
1
5%
Voters: falcon45ca

lucy
4
18%
Voters: Neon, Kate, DrWilgy, JDizz10

Neon
1
5%
Voters: Chihiro

So... Let's actually try to get into this game somewhat. That would likely be fore the best.

Someone describe for me the lead arguments for Dunya and Jack please? Assuming either flips town, are these wagons pure?

[Jackofhearts2005]

BTW I'm the vigilante who tried to kill Jack last night.

signal boosting cr obvious town

Why does 3P care about this so much?

Ppl should iso Lucy’s D2. She’s insanely invested in the idea that CR is town as a claimed role that shouldn’t really give a damn.

Also coming in with the “resolve the cw” strategy and vague “Jack’s posts yesterday were bad” x alot

Idk if it’s correct but it’s super easy to read Lucy as a wolf either with CR or perhaps more likely, one that is trying to sheep his bad momentum and look good if we misyeet CR.

[Jackofhearts2005]

@Creature vote Mac

If you dont vote this slot Im vigging you

Did you CC CR’s vig claim?

[Dennis]

Ya know if you ISO CR and do a word search for "Jack", you'll get 20 matches...and almost none of them have anything to do at all with actually reading Jack or engaging with him

Ahem I voted Jack before EOD1 and am voting them now. That should make it pretty obvious Jack is in my PoE.

Yes, but why? Your vote for him now seems to be based off "Let's get the CW to green flip"...and I'm just wondering if there's actually something behind your SR of Jack beyond that.





I thought he was fairly towny last RD

Is that right? Are you claiming info on Jack that clears them?

And now he's fishing for roles




[VOTE: CR] aubergine

I haven’t gotten to Mac yet but CR’s opening is pretty horrendous.

Sad that wolves don’t warn their partners about me more often.

Mac has come in w/ some solve energy, which is what I'd expect from Maf Mac trying to work himself out of the POE.

This is an interesting take, can someone with more experience with maf Mac than me please weigh in

[DaughterOfOmega]

@Creature vote Mac

If you dont vote this slot Im vigging you

Did you CC CR’s vig claim?

no

[falcon45ca]

Some names that haven't been in my mouth but I have thoughts on:

Falcon - just a falcon doing falcon things, though I feel like he has been less present than normal. I wanna see more of him to solidify a read but he's okay for now.

Wilgy - he hasn't been posting his big posts that intimidate me. He mentioned being low on WiM N0 and that's why I've stayed away from him until now but that tiny voice in the back of my head is getting louder.

I'm having the same concerning feelings about wilgy.

This doesn't make sense. I'm clearly a beacon of towny behavior.

coward.

[VOTE: wilgy] aubergine

[DrWilgy]

Some names that haven't been in my mouth but I have thoughts on:

Falcon - just a falcon doing falcon things, though I feel like he has been less present than normal. I wanna see more of him to solidify a read but he's okay for now.

Wilgy - he hasn't been posting his big posts that intimidate me. He mentioned being low on WiM N0 and that's why I've stayed away from him until now but that tiny voice in the back of my head is getting louder.

I'm having the same concerning feelings about wilgy.

This doesn't make sense. I'm clearly a beacon of towny behavior.

coward.

[VOTE: wilgy] aubergine

Oh how the Falcon falls.

Do you vote me to find a wolf or for the convenience of such things?

[Dennis]

You town
Creature town
Dunya town.

Could you elaborate on dunya

I would imagine a world where lucy, dunya, and creature are all town is a world where one of them dies last night.

Which one do you think is mostly likely bad in that case?

can everyone answer this, thanks

At this point, Dunya is the most likely wolf if only because I'm very certain Creature is town and pretty damn sure HK is town.

Why are you so sure Creature is town? I'm thinking chihiro is bad. I've got to reread him. Any thoughts on him?

I've been thinking chihiro is bad too but mostly off of weird vibes from D1 + being less present today. What's your reasoning?

[falcon45ca]

Oh @hollowkatt also, I thought Seanzie’s push on Sig for “slipping” that he didn’t know villains were town couldn’t possibly be real. If town is monsters/villains and wolves are the mystery gang, the only players who wouldn’t know that are 3P. This was pointed out several times but Seanzie insisted.

I know it’s worth fuck all atp but for full disclosure.

I think that's legit to push on from a town seanzie perspective but also a legit thing for seanzie to be pushed on. And it does appear that monsters = town thus far so I would assume the scooby gang are the baddies. The question is this: do we have the full gang or not. I think we'd basically have to not. GTH it's scooby, shaggy, velma, and likely one of fred/daphne. 18 is too small to have 5 wolves and also a 3p with a puppet.

This could be more of a reason why Lucy isn’t 3p and is mafia. Leaving out Fred or Daphne would be odd, don’t you think? I still don’t like the way @lucy has been consistently threatening town. I think she is trying to power wolf.

Why would Maf claim an untrustworthy 3P role?

[Kate]

Ok here's my list I promised last night.

Kate
Jack
Rondo
Neon

Hk
Sig
Dunya
Dennis
Falcon
Creature

Chihiro
Daughter of Omega
Wilgy
Jdizz

(Lucy) either not trustworthy 3p or mafia.

I feel like I'm missing someone but I looked 3x. Someone tell me if I am

I think an honest player wouldnt have a confirmed town that low

Please point me to whatever you think clears you. If I missed something, apologies but all I saw was you asking Creature to vouch.

[falcon45ca]

Some names that haven't been in my mouth but I have thoughts on:

Falcon - just a falcon doing falcon things, though I feel like he has been less present than normal. I wanna see more of him to solidify a read but he's okay for now.

Wilgy - he hasn't been posting his big posts that intimidate me. He mentioned being low on WiM N0 and that's why I've stayed away from him until now but that tiny voice in the back of my head is getting louder.

I'm having the same concerning feelings about wilgy.

This doesn't make sense. I'm clearly a beacon of towny behavior.

coward.

[VOTE: wilgy] aubergine

Oh how the Falcon falls.

Do you vote me to find a wolf or for the convenience of such things?

Did this sequence of words make sense in your head?

[Kate]

Could you elaborate on dunya

I would imagine a world where lucy, dunya, and creature are all town is a world where one of them dies last night.

Which one do you think is mostly likely bad in that case?

can everyone answer this, thanks

At this point, Dunya is the most likely wolf if only because I'm very certain Creature is town and pretty damn sure HK is town.

Why are you so sure Creature is town? I'm thinking chihiro is bad. I've got to reread him. Any thoughts on him?

I've been thinking chihiro is bad too but mostly off of weird vibes from D1 + being less present today. What's your reasoning?

Mainly vibe and POE. I don't know him at all but I'd appreciate if someone who does would add some insight.

[Chihiro]

[VOTE: Seanzie] aubergine

Kinda expected better from Seanzie tbh

Also creature lol, its been like 40 mins? What kind of expectation from Seanzie do u have that, in 40 mins you u think the slot isnt playing with towns best interest in mind

This feels like tmi

what is with people misusing the word tmi, first crich now you?

Like plz do explain where the TMI is in this post. Cause thats post was made 40 mins into phase start.

[Kate]

[VOTE: Seanzie] aubergine

Kinda expected better from Seanzie tbh

Also creature lol, its been like 40 mins? What kind of expectation from Seanzie do u have that, in 40 mins you u think the slot isnt playing with towns best interest in mind

This feels like tmi

what is with people misusing the word tmi, first crich now you?

Like plz do explain where the TMI is in this post. Cause thats post was made 40 mins into phase start.

Tmi makes sense to me in that context.

[Chihiro]

@RondoDimBuckle

Give me 4 scum and why?

No, I dont know you and I dont like you try again

Hello? Wtf does knowing me have to do with my question or this game???

[VOTE: RondoDimBuckle] aubergine

[Kate]

I'm voting obvs wolf dunya. Lucy hopefully can be resolved in a meaningful way soon but I don't have the ability to do so at the moment and I'm less concerned with voting off the claimed 3p than I am wolfy people.

Yeah well im certain atleast 2 of the lucy voters are scum

you tell me who yours are and I'll tell you mine.

if i have to pick, its prob neon and the replacement forgot the name lol.

You honestly still think neon is bad? I'm not buying that at all. And which replacement, there are 3, none of whom replaced neon.

[Chihiro]

Cant tell who replaced who anymore cause they arent noted in the OP or the thread anywhere lol.

[Chihiro]

I'm voting obvs wolf dunya. Lucy hopefully can be resolved in a meaningful way soon but I don't have the ability to do so at the moment and I'm less concerned with voting off the claimed 3p than I am wolfy people.

Yeah well im certain atleast 2 of the lucy voters are scum

you tell me who yours are and I'll tell you mine.

if i have to pick, its prob neon and the replacement forgot the name lol.

You honestly still think neon is bad? I'm not buying that at all. And which replacement, there are 3, none of whom replaced neon.

People are telling me neon is within their town meta, but no one is justifying why town neon post caps themselves in like 6 hours of phase start, nor why they didnt out the info given by my role within those posts.

[Kate]

@RondoDimBuckle

Give me 4 scum and why?

No, I dont know you and I dont like you try again

Hello? Wtf does knowing me have to do with my question or this game???

[VOTE: RondoDimBuckle] aubergine

I could easily vote this slot. @jack @RondoDimBuckle @Neon @MacDougall @Dennis thoughts?

[falcon45ca]

Cant tell who replaced who anymore cause they arent noted in the OP or the thread anywhere lol.

The player list does actually have the subs, and who they replaced...did you actually look?






Oh, and Scotty announced ITT as well...so, false on both accounts....hmmmmmm