[END] Literal WWerecreatures Invade Syndicate Zoo: An SDN Crossover Game

[Zenge]

3 out of 24 votes is hardly anything to get worked up about especially with over 47 hours left.

It just felt like a lot piling onto one person in a very short amount of time

Well, I s'pose you could ask those voting Miranda as to their reasons...but you're not doing that.





Why?

Actually this is sort of hypocritical on review. Falcon votes me immediately after this. They’re tasking issue with my saying I’m uncomfortable with how fast the three votes seemed to pile onto Miranda, and not asking each of the voters for the reasons for their votes.

But then never asks me why I don’t like the wagon.

What’s worse here is I just noted that it was odd how many votes came on Miranda in rapid succession. But I didn’t use that as an opportunity to wolf read anyone or try to vote them out. Falcon here though did the exact same thing he accused me of doing and used it as an excuse to try and get me misyeeted.

That’s foundationally unsound.

You already said why you did not like the wagon, remember?






Now you're saying you found the speed of the wagon odd, before you clearly said you did not like it. So, is it strange, or is it scummy? There's a big difference.







You're also toning down the phrasing each time...first you say you don't like it, then uncomfortable, then odd. You keep scaling back how you feel about the wagon.






I see you still haven't followed up w/ any of the wagon voters. Duly noted.

First of all, no, I haven’t said why. I’ve said things about I don’t like but I haven’t stated my primary gripe with it.

Secondly, as part of my issue with the wagon, I originally said I felt like it was happening very quickly. Claiming I only just now have taken issue with the speed is a blatant lie and mischaracterization of reality.

Lastly I don’t need to follow up with the voters at this time. I don’t believe going to each one individually and asking them “why are you voting Miranda?” Like Oliver Twist asking for soup, will yield any relevant information from their catered and crafted answers. That’s not how I solve.

It’s furthermore counterintuitive for you to make such a big todo about how “WhY aReN’T yOu aSkiNg fOr tHeiR rEaSonS?!?!” When you yourself seem wholly uninterested in the reasons yourself.

I have a reason for not asking. But you, who based on your push of me it seems puts an ENORMOUS amount of value on asking people why they’re voting for someone is entirely uninterested in actually figuring out why people are voting for who they are. This is counterintuitive in a way that seems fairly scummy.

Bro wtf is this?

You got initially sus of Falcon because he didn't ask you what was wrong with the wagon, but you had already said some stuff that was wrong with it that he had read, and instead of accepting that you say no I haven't said my primary gripe with it. How the fuck is he supposed to know what you haven't said?

Dude, if you engage people this way you are going to be so prone to confbias and tunnels? There is nothing at all wrong with Falcon's mindset in this post and if you think him disengaging with you later is wolfy consider that you might be tunneling.

This was early on. It was contentious to be sure, but not close to where the pivotal moment was

[MacDougall]

@Lawpy you have to vote in the poll. The vote tags are just for calling out and tracking votes.

Marmot is a better vote than sloonei I feel.

[MacDougall]

It just felt like a lot piling onto one person in a very short amount of time

Well, I s'pose you could ask those voting Miranda as to their reasons...but you're not doing that.





Why?

Actually this is sort of hypocritical on review. Falcon votes me immediately after this. They’re tasking issue with my saying I’m uncomfortable with how fast the three votes seemed to pile onto Miranda, and not asking each of the voters for the reasons for their votes.

But then never asks me why I don’t like the wagon.

What’s worse here is I just noted that it was odd how many votes came on Miranda in rapid succession. But I didn’t use that as an opportunity to wolf read anyone or try to vote them out. Falcon here though did the exact same thing he accused me of doing and used it as an excuse to try and get me misyeeted.

That’s foundationally unsound.

You already said why you did not like the wagon, remember?






Now you're saying you found the speed of the wagon odd, before you clearly said you did not like it. So, is it strange, or is it scummy? There's a big difference.







You're also toning down the phrasing each time...first you say you don't like it, then uncomfortable, then odd. You keep scaling back how you feel about the wagon.






I see you still haven't followed up w/ any of the wagon voters. Duly noted.

First of all, no, I haven’t said why. I’ve said things about I don’t like but I haven’t stated my primary gripe with it.

Secondly, as part of my issue with the wagon, I originally said I felt like it was happening very quickly. Claiming I only just now have taken issue with the speed is a blatant lie and mischaracterization of reality.

Lastly I don’t need to follow up with the voters at this time. I don’t believe going to each one individually and asking them “why are you voting Miranda?” Like Oliver Twist asking for soup, will yield any relevant information from their catered and crafted answers. That’s not how I solve.

It’s furthermore counterintuitive for you to make such a big todo about how “WhY aReN’T yOu aSkiNg fOr tHeiR rEaSonS?!?!” When you yourself seem wholly uninterested in the reasons yourself.

I have a reason for not asking. But you, who based on your push of me it seems puts an ENORMOUS amount of value on asking people why they’re voting for someone is entirely uninterested in actually figuring out why people are voting for who they are. This is counterintuitive in a way that seems fairly scummy.

Bro wtf is this?

You got initially sus of Falcon because he didn't ask you what was wrong with the wagon, but you had already said some stuff that was wrong with it that he had read, and instead of accepting that you say no I haven't said my primary gripe with it. How the fuck is he supposed to know what you haven't said?

Dude, if you engage people this way you are going to be so prone to confbias and tunnels? There is nothing at all wrong with Falcon's mindset in this post and if you think him disengaging with you later is wolfy consider that you might be tunneling.

This was early on. It was contentious to be sure, but not close to where the pivotal moment was

Man to read it all in context will take ages for me to scroll through and find it all. If you are proper convinced can you just quote all the important points where you think Falcon did what you say they did.

[NateTheLesser]

@NateTheLesser I would like to know how you feel abouts slots other than Dennis, particularly the likes of Falcon, Marmot, Creature and Mightyrunner7.

I'll be back later, I expect receipts.

Mighty isn't outside of his town meta, his posts always read as carefully crafted. In the last game when he was wolfing I correctly called him out on day one, because he had a habit of picking apart other people's reads without actually offering his own perspective. I haven't seen him do the same thing here. He's relatively new and that's a "tell" that can be fixed, but I lean him town for now. The only thing that gives me pause is his Scotty vote looks bad, both in the wagon position and that his reasoning was pretty much just echoing other people's "role fishing" sus.

Creature is POE because there's no reason for him not to be, I wasn't interested in him yesterday because in my other Syndicate game he low-posted as town so the "volume tell" wasn't convincing for me. But his only votes prior to Scotty were a naked 2nd vote on miranda and a naked 2nd vote on me. He said his miranda vote was because he was least impressed by her on that page, but her only recent content was a day 0 test vote. And that's been about the extent of his solving energy.

Marmot was mostly missing, I remember an early wolf lean of Dennis and then EOD. I didn't really vibe with Marmot's EOD reads, for one thing they were wolfreading me and have carried that into today, and I know that's incorrect. But they were also speculating a Scotty/Santy world, which I thought would be odd positioning to take if they knew Scotty would flip town. But it could have also been a way to place Scotty in a plausible wolf team to justify a vote (which is what Marmot did shortly after).

Falcon/Zenge I have the most turbulence around. I've seen town Zenge make correct pushes that were laser-focused that I didn't understand at all, so I pay attention when he gets this locked in even if I don't completely get it. And I thought falcon was sketchy early on. But the way Z's pushed it has been really twisty, especially his interaction with other people about it when they disagree. And on falcon's end I know he has a scummy playstyle in general, he was misyeeted in the other game I played here. If they were both scum but different factions it'd explain everything tbh

[Lawpy]

This is a noob question but important.

What’s the difference between Sleep and No Vote? Is the latter simply a way to unvote your previous vote without actually advocating for a no elimination/sleep?

[Lawpy]

Someone summarize me the cases on Scotty and Creature?

Without seeing anything I think its more likely that Creature is a hit because in my mind they tend to obtown more and have more votes from people of the same community

Can I interest you in a Falcon vote?

I think i’m more interested in slooneis and mayos from the way they responded to your falcons push

[NateTheLesser]

This is a noob question but important.

What’s the difference between Sleep and No Vote? Is the latter simply a way to unvote your previous vote without actually advocating for a no elimination/sleep?

Yes, No Vote is just an unyeet.

[NateTheLesser]

Someone summarize me the cases on Scotty and Creature?

Without seeing anything I think its more likely that Creature is a hit because in my mind they tend to obtown more and have more votes from people of the same community

Can I interest you in a Falcon vote?

I think i’m more interested in slooneis and mayos from the way they responded to your falcons push

Why Mayo? I don't really remember what his response to the Zenge/falcon stuff was.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Notice:

@tutuu is replacing @DrWilgy. Please welcome tutuu to the game, and continue to refrain from discussing replacement/substitution decisions.

Also, let's wish DrWilgy luck, because he will be starting his championship game on Monday as our Syndicate representative.

[Lawpy]

You really think I forget about a game this hard when a partner would be leading huh

Don't make me say the words again.

Quick GTH what is your read on Creature

GTH wolf

But also I don't won't to chop him today for :hand_wave: irl stuff or something

[VOTE: Marmot] aubergine

I could support this.

[Lawpy]

[VOTE: Nate] aubergine

I think Mac is town at first glance and I like that he's voting here. I didn't care much for Nate's EOD1.

I’m not sure how to feel about this

[Lawpy]

I can read some of Marmot's posts from End of Day 1 as a mafia member looking for a place to park their vote, rather than a town player making an earnest effort to solve. Here are a couple about Scotty in particular that stood out:

Spoiler: show

marmot, you know scotty better than i do, would you read his iso and give me thoughts?

My initial thought from seeing his post count is "wow, only 56 posts".

Looking through Scotty's ISO.


I don't think his posts are bad, like they do look like posts that townies make, but I am having hard time seeing a scumhunting mindset behind them.

Also

Let it also be known that I’d *prefer* a syndiCat player to go first.

I was thinking about this, and as a game structural standpoint, I believe there to be an even number of players in each community on the mafia team. So I feel fine about one of my community going first

I don't think the logic here adds up. If the mafia team is evenly split (which I doubt it is guaranteed to be), there wouldn't be a reason for him to push his own community, as the odds are equivalent.

Although, if he knows that he's town, he would then think there is a slightly higher chance of chopping a wolf among the rest of the Syndicaters based on this logic.


Hmmm...

This could be mildly TMIing himself town, but it also gives me pause that he didn't include that in his argument, so that may not have even been part of it.

I'm probably going to move my vote off of Creature because it seems his lack of activity and commitment is out of his control atm.

I wish there was a wagon other than Scotty to offer more choices. Scotty is a fine choice given his contributions thus far, but I'm slightly put off by the fact that he has technically made townie posts. If anyone wants to give me a name to ISO, I will.

The first one feels more convoluted than it needs to be, as though Marmot's seeking out his own justification to place a vote on a wagon that's already taking off. The second is full of language that suggests Marmot has no faith in the Scotty wagon, but is resigned to joining it anyway. I also feel like his justification for choosing Scotty over Creature is weak.

Hmm, i actually agree with this reasoning here. Going to think

[tutuu]

Hello everyone. I'm tutuu, and I am most definitely a doctor.

[Lawpy]

Town lean:
Zenge
SAR
Santy
mighty
Nate

????
Lawpy

Less of a town lean:
Miranda
Mayo
Genny

Explain gently why you’re townreading mighty and nates pls

[Sloonei]

Slooneis looks to be playing a sort of a diplomatic role here which i’m thinking. I know wolf!Jays did the same which admittedly blindsided me so i’m a little wary when i see diplomatic stances/posting styles. It’s looking like a subtle nudge towards (or away) from his players of interest

What you're seeing there is just similar playstyles. There has been a running meme on the Syndicate for years that Jay and I are the same person. I alluded to it in my very first post of this game. That "diplomatic role" that's giving you pause is just a facet of how I (and Jay) play the game. It is not alignment-indicative.

[Lawpy]

For now based on my raw impressions

[VOTE: Slooneis] aubergine

Have you read your predecessors ISO? You have the benefit of knowing that it was pure town thought so it would be well advised to at least review it and put some stuck in their reads as Dya is an s-tier town player.

Could you kindly direct me where? I’m mostly caught up but dyas post on slooneis was indirect - in agreement with PSV/pshelty’s reasoning mainly

i like psv's analysis of sloonei. I don't necessarily agree with it, I just like the logic she's using to get to her reads rn

light v

I try to respect my predecessor’s views but I’m not finding the slooneis iso you’re mentioning.

[Lawpy]

I’m currently interested in marmots, nates, slooneis, falcons, mayos, and creatures

[Lawpy]

Stop twisting my words. I said you’re being weird. Not for asking. You’re just being weird. In general.

When did you say this because I don't think you have

Why are you even voting for Miranda? What’s your endgame here?

I already said I thought her tone was sus. I don’t just snapvote someone I like for funsies unless it’s dubz

Why you bein weird?

First time was here I believe, couple other times afterward

Ah

I was gonna say ponies felt scummy because that post felt like OMGUS but I guess I missed that

(in response to your previous post):

Seanzie is townlean because an interesting pattern I've noticed is that he doesn't say "I'd elim this." nearly as often, or at all, as scum than he does town

One thing that caught my eye was the sudden swooning over mightyrunner? Like sure they looked towny I guess, but there was like 3 to 5 people who all townread them and it felt like there had to be a wolf in there trying to hide amongst the crowd

Interesting point about mighty because i have him in neutrals

Could you refresh me who exactly townread him?

I'm not ignoring you I swear, I'm gonna go find the posts one second

alrighty @Lawpy I don't care enough anymore

I could only find 2, coincidentally scotty and AM, both dead townies but I swear there was more

Ty i appreciate the effort. I’m going to mull over this a bit

[Lawpy]

Someone summarize me the cases on Scotty and Creature?

Without seeing anything I think its more likely that Creature is a hit because in my mind they tend to obtown more and have more votes from people of the same community

Can I interest you in a Falcon vote?

I think i’m more interested in slooneis and mayos from the way they responded to your falcons push

Why Mayo? I don't really remember what his response to the Zenge/falcon stuff was.

It’s his defense of Slooneis that raises eyebrows

You’re right. I’m extremely dissatisfied.

I asked you for one thing. One simple thing. Give me your thoughts on the content itself.

Instead you gave another hand wavy answer that simply acknowledges the existence of the content and talk about how it was created on D1.

I wanted you to talk to me about the argument I’m making against Falcon. The specific point about what Falcon said, my rebuttal, and what you agree with or disagree with in that exchange, with specifics.

I still expect an answer here.

I think Falcon said a provocative thing about you and you were provoked. I think he made a mountain out of a molehill first, and you responded by making your out mountain out of your own molehill. Falcon's initial gripe, whether or not we believe it, was that you were not proactive enough in addressing your concerns about the early Miranda votes. Was it fair as an accusation at face value? Not really. But was it an acceptable play for early Day 1 of a crossover mafia game on Mafiathesyndicate.com? Absolutely.

You responded critically and defensively, because it was a bit of a bogus accusation. That is fair. But, in your response, I felt you took some liberties with his words, or at least presented a rather one-sided view of his position (It is not hard to see how falcon could interpret your initial concern as being simply the speed with which the votes occurred). This is reminiscent of how you have responded to me today. But, again, that is fine, because it is Day 1 of a mafia game, and we need to twist some words to get people talking.

Was I swayed by any of the arguments either of you made against one another? No. I was not. If I am to give a read, it's that both of you are town. Falcon, for playing the role of provocateur. You, because your defensive reaction turned into what looks to be a very firmly-held belief that you are onto something. But neither of those are strong reads, which is why I will again stress that I'm more interested in seeing how you respond to other things.

I do not believe there is anything meaningful to be gained by continuing this dialogue.

Get out of here with your calm and reasoning.

Also, intentionally being peacemaker and trying to stop a distracting argument feels town to me.

[Lawpy]

Slooneis looks to be playing a sort of a diplomatic role here which i’m thinking. I know wolf!Jays did the same which admittedly blindsided me so i’m a little wary when i see diplomatic stances/posting styles. It’s looking like a subtle nudge towards (or away) from his players of interest

What you're seeing there is just similar playstyles. There has been a running meme on the Syndicate for years that Jay and I are the same person. I alluded to it in my very first post of this game. That "diplomatic role" that's giving you pause is just a facet of how I (and Jay) play the game. It is not alignment-indicative.

It’s the trajectory that makes me wary, it looks like you’re trying to diplomatically resolve the zenges vs falcons battle by trying to nudge attention away from falcons. Wolf!Jays pulled off this similarly by nudging me diplomatically towards villagers in a recent game we played.

[tutuu]

i popped in reading this game one time a few days ago and i remember having a townread on animal midwife, seanzie, neon and SVS. yesterday i popped in and i read 5 marmot posts and thought they're towny too. i remember having a scumread on falcon since he was unnaturally invested and "played properly" / played the way "people want him to play". oh and i thought mac was obvtown too

[tutuu]

seeing sloonei and mac vote marmot makes me want to vote marmot despite my aforementioned townread though

[VOTE: marmot] aubergine

[Lawpy]

@NateTheLesser I would like to know how you feel abouts slots other than Dennis, particularly the likes of Falcon, Marmot, Creature and Mightyrunner7.

I'll be back later, I expect receipts.

Mighty isn't outside of his town meta, his posts always read as carefully crafted. In the last game when he was wolfing I correctly called him out on day one, because he had a habit of picking apart other people's reads without actually offering his own perspective. I haven't seen him do the same thing here. He's relatively new and that's a "tell" that can be fixed, but I lean him town for now. The only thing that gives me pause is his Scotty vote looks bad, both in the wagon position and that his reasoning was pretty much just echoing other people's "role fishing" sus.

Creature is POE because there's no reason for him not to be, I wasn't interested in him yesterday because in my other Syndicate game he low-posted as town so the "volume tell" wasn't convincing for me. But his only votes prior to Scotty were a naked 2nd vote on miranda and a naked 2nd vote on me. He said his miranda vote was because he was least impressed by her on that page, but her only recent content was a day 0 test vote. And that's been about the extent of his solving energy.

Marmot was mostly missing, I remember an early wolf lean of Dennis and then EOD. I didn't really vibe with Marmot's EOD reads, for one thing they were wolfreading me and have carried that into today, and I know that's incorrect. But they were also speculating a Scotty/Santy world, which I thought would be odd positioning to take if they knew Scotty would flip town. But it could have also been a way to place Scotty in a plausible wolf team to justify a vote (which is what Marmot did shortly after).

Falcon/Zenge I have the most turbulence around. I've seen town Zenge make correct pushes that were laser-focused that I didn't understand at all, so I pay attention when he gets this locked in even if I don't completely get it. And I thought falcon was sketchy early on. But the way Z's pushed it has been really twisty, especially his interaction with other people about it when they disagree. And on falcon's end I know he has a scummy playstyle in general, he was misyeeted in the other game I played here. If they were both scum but different factions it'd explain everything tbh

Zenges vs falcons looked pretty straightforward to me. Zenges is tunneling on falcons because he asserts falcons is wolfing and found falcons’s responses to be very evasive. He pretty much took a hardline stance and doubled down on his falcons tunnel. That trajectory looks villagey to me.

It’s the responses to the Zenges vs falcons battle that appear like an attempt to shut down the discussion that look concerning, since it makes me think Zenges might be right and wolves are trying to get the heat off of falcons by diverting attention elsewhere

[Sloonei]

Slooneis looks to be playing a sort of a diplomatic role here which i’m thinking. I know wolf!Jays did the same which admittedly blindsided me so i’m a little wary when i see diplomatic stances/posting styles. It’s looking like a subtle nudge towards (or away) from his players of interest

What you're seeing there is just similar playstyles. There has been a running meme on the Syndicate for years that Jay and I are the same person. I alluded to it in my very first post of this game. That "diplomatic role" that's giving you pause is just a facet of how I (and Jay) play the game. It is not alignment-indicative.

It’s the trajectory that makes me wary, it looks like you’re trying to diplomatically resolve the zenges vs falcons battle by trying to nudge attention away from falcons. Wolf!Jays pulled off this similarly by nudging me diplomatically towards villagers in a recent game we played.

I continue to encourage everybody in this game, Zenge included, to talk about Falcon to their heart’s content.

Why do you suspect falcon?

[tutuu]

seanzie i think is very easy to read. his headbuttening with animal midwife is what makes him obvtown imo, didnt read much but its enough i think

neon i also think is easy to read, she seemed excited to play and not depressed and sad, she hates wolfing, ergo, i thought shes town

SVS, similar to neon, vastly prefers towning to wolfing and she made a few big posts (i dont remember at all what she said) but she seems chill and not sad and depressed ergo i thought shes town

mac, i wouldnt say he hates wolfing, but i dont think he can replicate his macness as mafia. i havent seen him wolf too much. only 2 times, 2 years ago. i remember him doing goofy stuff there. like its hard to explain. but its different. i dont believe wolf mac can replicate town mac. and the mac ive seen in the few posts here is typical town mac

[tutuu]

Ah! I have been slapped!

That's what you get for licking everyone in the GoC.

@tutuu you've been summoned

(note: tutuu is not playing in this game)

the summoning ritual was a success

[tutuu]

Spoiler: show

My usual vote spreadsheet bizniss.

Day 1 Votes
(The only note here is I don't actually know exactly when mayo's vote for Creature was, because I couldn't find an in thread vote post for it. It was sometime before the timestamp I have)


Waterfall


EOD Wagons

NO WAY THIS DUDE RECORDED THE TIMESTAMPS OF THE VOTES

does he do it as mafia too?

[tutuu]

i think dennis is very easy to read too. im employing a new strategy:

if dennis cares about looking towny, he's mafia

if dennis doesnt care about looking towny, he's town

i iso'd him and he seems to not care particularly, ergo i think he's town

[tutuu]

Slooneis looks to be playing a sort of a diplomatic role here which i’m thinking. I know wolf!Jays did the same which admittedly blindsided me so i’m a little wary when i see diplomatic stances/posting styles. It’s looking like a subtle nudge towards (or away) from his players of interest

What you're seeing there is just similar playstyles. There has been a running meme on the Syndicate for years that Jay and I are the same person. I alluded to it in my very first post of this game. That "diplomatic role" that's giving you pause is just a facet of how I (and Jay) play the game. It is not alignment-indicative.

It’s the trajectory that makes me wary, it looks like you’re trying to diplomatically resolve the zenges vs falcons battle by trying to nudge attention away from falcons. Wolf!Jays pulled off this similarly by nudging me diplomatically towards villagers in a recent game we played.

I continue to encourage everybody in this game, Zenge included, to talk about Falcon to their heart’s content.

Why do you suspect falcon?

this is the only sloonei post i read and it made me feel sloonei is town

he loves doing this diplomatic stuff like he's an admin, he loves talking like a mod/admin but in a mafia game as a mafia player

as in, this other dude, lawpy (i had to double check) - he's scumreading him right, he's voting him

and sloonei is like "i will be merciful and graceful, kumbayah, my child, *kisses forehead*"

which ... i think is just how sloonei is as town

now - why cant he do it as mafia too? i dunno. i cant answer u that. he could. i wouldnt know ive never seen him wolf

so. this is just like. a gutread. gut townread

[tutuu]

falcon is impossible for me to read i wont even try

creature i have no clue how to read either. that should be for the syndigators aligators

seanzie
mac
neon
svs
dennis

sloonei

creature - i have no clue and i dont even wanna try
falcon - i have no clue and i dont even wanna try

marmot - i had a gut townread but im choosing to sheep mac and sloonei votes, ergo i cant make a proper read in this situation since im biased

[tutuu]

the furry invaders ill try to read later since i have no meta and no clue, i cant just make snap reads like i can with the aligators

[Lawpy]

Noob question: how are you guys posting/seeing ISOs?

I’m not seeing them on my phone so i’m at a loss here

[tutuu]

Noob question: how are you guys posting/seeing ISOs?

I’m not seeing them on my phone so i’m at a loss here

first post itt

[Sloonei]

Noob question: how are you guys posting/seeing ISOs?

I’m not seeing them on my phone so i’m at a loss here

If you’re on mobile, you have to access then from the player list in the first post.

[tutuu]

lawpy town

[tutuu]

lawpy town

i read his posts on this page

[Lawpy]

Thinking i feel ok with dennis and santy

[Lawpy]

And feeling ok about neons too

[tutuu]

the furry invaders ill try to read later since i have no meta and no clue, i cant just make snap reads like i can with the aligators

i lied

ergo u should townread me for this towny contradiction

counter-argument: if im self-aware of this, its no longer towny

counter-counter-argument: i like being honest as town, its what u should be, and this thought just crossed my head (this entire post) so im sharing it

townread me

[Sloonei]

lawpy town

Whose left standing without a town read?

[Sloonei]

*who’s, i’m so sorry

[tutuu]

lawpy town

Whose left standing without a town read?

3 of the syndicators and i havent made any reads on the invaders except this dude

[tutuu]

i dont wanna rush it, ill take my time with them

[tutuu]

well unless they're obvtown like lawpy

ok let me give 20 seconds to iso each

[NateTheLesser]

@NateTheLesser I would like to know how you feel abouts slots other than Dennis, particularly the likes of Falcon, Marmot, Creature and Mightyrunner7.

I'll be back later, I expect receipts.

Mighty isn't outside of his town meta, his posts always read as carefully crafted. In the last game when he was wolfing I correctly called him out on day one, because he had a habit of picking apart other people's reads without actually offering his own perspective. I haven't seen him do the same thing here. He's relatively new and that's a "tell" that can be fixed, but I lean him town for now. The only thing that gives me pause is his Scotty vote looks bad, both in the wagon position and that his reasoning was pretty much just echoing other people's "role fishing" sus.

Creature is POE because there's no reason for him not to be, I wasn't interested in him yesterday because in my other Syndicate game he low-posted as town so the "volume tell" wasn't convincing for me. But his only votes prior to Scotty were a naked 2nd vote on miranda and a naked 2nd vote on me. He said his miranda vote was because he was least impressed by her on that page, but her only recent content was a day 0 test vote. And that's been about the extent of his solving energy.

Marmot was mostly missing, I remember an early wolf lean of Dennis and then EOD. I didn't really vibe with Marmot's EOD reads, for one thing they were wolfreading me and have carried that into today, and I know that's incorrect. But they were also speculating a Scotty/Santy world, which I thought would be odd positioning to take if they knew Scotty would flip town. But it could have also been a way to place Scotty in a plausible wolf team to justify a vote (which is what Marmot did shortly after).

Falcon/Zenge I have the most turbulence around. I've seen town Zenge make correct pushes that were laser-focused that I didn't understand at all, so I pay attention when he gets this locked in even if I don't completely get it. And I thought falcon was sketchy early on. But the way Z's pushed it has been really twisty, especially his interaction with other people about it when they disagree. And on falcon's end I know he has a scummy playstyle in general, he was misyeeted in the other game I played here. If they were both scum but different factions it'd explain everything tbh

Zenges vs falcons looked pretty straightforward to me. Zenges is tunneling on falcons because he asserts falcons is wolfing and found falcons’s responses to be very evasive. He pretty much took a hardline stance and doubled down on his falcons tunnel. That trajectory looks villagey to me.

It’s the responses to the Zenges vs falcons battle that appear like an attempt to shut down the discussion that look concerning, since it makes me think Zenges might be right and wolves are trying to get the heat off of falcons by diverting attention elsewhere

So this all depends on falcon being a wolf? Sloonei is then suspicious for trying to divert attention, and Mayo is then suspicious for defending Sloonei?

[tutuu]

@Zenge @potentialsheltervet @mightyrunner7, I'll try to get through your ISO's tonight, but it may assist me if you would iterate as to why exactly you are voting Falcon?

Let me lay this out for you:

It started with falcon pushing me for weak reasoning. This isn’t telling in and of itself, villagers makes mistakes.

But as Falcon starting building a case on me, which I obviously know is not true, Flacon’s reasoning got worse; to the point that they were making things up.

Specifically I said I was looking to see who was doing what I expected wolves to do. Falcon called that a “Wolfy mindset”.

This was a massive slip. Because no. Trying to figure out what wolves will do, and looking to see who does that isn’t Wolf itself, it’s village.

I pressed Falcon on this point. And Falcon immediately tried to change the subject and said they were going to focus on other things.

I pressed Falcon again, and Falcon used an argument to answer the question that simultaneously didn’t answer the question, but tried to shade me for something else.

This is a wolf. A villager doesn’t play this way. I could tell when I was pressing Falcon, he was wriggling. Trying to talk his way out of it. I’ve pressed wolves and I’ve pressed villagers. This is the former.

@Lawpy since you’re just joining in I encourage you to read this and join me here. Pls.

gut townread, im done with zenge iso

[tutuu]

I don't have much of a reason to town read SAR but my heart feels like she's town. I don't get why she's so confident on miranda, though.

gut scumread this

every mafia game there is a wolf who makes this exact post at a LHF villager

(just to make it obvious, in this case, PSV is the archetypical wolf and SAR is the archetypical villager being TMI'd)

and to try to explain more

the archetypical wolf post is

"yada yada yada but yada yada yada"

as in

keeping ur stance open

not putting ur foot down

ur saying something, that u can easily spin in either direction later on

--------

i iso'd SAR before this and i was unimpressed, i found nothing towny

[tutuu]

I think santy's entrance last EOD was pretty bad

I find it wild that he would totally forget about a game as either affiliation

I agree, Santy is usually very engaged in these games
Very off for him…

i gut townread the "..."

(yes im serious)

(yes im town and u guys will have to deal with me)

[NateTheLesser]

@NateTheLesser I would like to know how you feel abouts slots other than Dennis, particularly the likes of Falcon, Marmot, Creature and Mightyrunner7.

I'll be back later, I expect receipts.

Mighty isn't outside of his town meta, his posts always read as carefully crafted. In the last game when he was wolfing I correctly called him out on day one, because he had a habit of picking apart other people's reads without actually offering his own perspective. I haven't seen him do the same thing here. He's relatively new and that's a "tell" that can be fixed, but I lean him town for now. The only thing that gives me pause is his Scotty vote looks bad, both in the wagon position and that his reasoning was pretty much just echoing other people's "role fishing" sus.

Creature is POE because there's no reason for him not to be, I wasn't interested in him yesterday because in my other Syndicate game he low-posted as town so the "volume tell" wasn't convincing for me. But his only votes prior to Scotty were a naked 2nd vote on miranda and a naked 2nd vote on me. He said his miranda vote was because he was least impressed by her on that page, but her only recent content was a day 0 test vote. And that's been about the extent of his solving energy.

Marmot was mostly missing, I remember an early wolf lean of Dennis and then EOD. I didn't really vibe with Marmot's EOD reads, for one thing they were wolfreading me and have carried that into today, and I know that's incorrect. But they were also speculating a Scotty/Santy world, which I thought would be odd positioning to take if they knew Scotty would flip town. But it could have also been a way to place Scotty in a plausible wolf team to justify a vote (which is what Marmot did shortly after).

Falcon/Zenge I have the most turbulence around. I've seen town Zenge make correct pushes that were laser-focused that I didn't understand at all, so I pay attention when he gets this locked in even if I don't completely get it. And I thought falcon was sketchy early on. But the way Z's pushed it has been really twisty, especially his interaction with other people about it when they disagree. And on falcon's end I know he has a scummy playstyle in general, he was misyeeted in the other game I played here. If they were both scum but different factions it'd explain everything tbh

Zenges vs falcons looked pretty straightforward to me. Zenges is tunneling on falcons because he asserts falcons is wolfing and found falcons’s responses to be very evasive. He pretty much took a hardline stance and doubled down on his falcons tunnel. That trajectory looks villagey to me.

It’s the responses to the Zenges vs falcons battle that appear like an attempt to shut down the discussion that look concerning, since it makes me think Zenges might be right and wolves are trying to get the heat off of falcons by diverting attention elsewhere

And my problem wasn't really with the core of Zenge's argument, it was with him twisting people's words when he was pushing it. Does he do that as town?

[tutuu]

I think santy's entrance last EOD was pretty bad

I find it wild that he would totally forget about a game as either affiliation

I agree, Santy is usually very engaged in these games
Very off for him…

i gut townread the "..."

(yes im serious)

(yes im town and u guys will have to deal with me)

extraordinarily towny post