Ted Lasso Mafia - game over!

[S~V~S]

okay i just have to ask @LoRab do you fear god?

You know she's a Rabbi, right?

[S~V~S]

S~V~S is bad. She's humouring in there like nobody's business. Setting the scene, agreeable. If I were cruder and didn't know S~V~S, she's also sucking up to Jay, possibly pocketing.

Intriguing take- I feel like I have the unique benefit of having just wolfed with her and I haven’t seen anything specific about her that is throwing off my paranoia alarm. And I’m usually paranoid of her as of the last 3 games before I wolf’ed with her.

Now do me do me

OK, you're freaking me out here. I don't think you've EVER said anything like this to/about me. Not the last 3 games. EVERY. GAME. Every one. You think I'm bad.

What did you take away from wolfing with me that makes you say this?

Also gotta go get ready for work. Love my new job, hate the longer commute.

[S~V~S]

One last *?*, Bereft seems to be only addressing/alluding to Robyn and Jay, with the exception of his towny list, which was an answer to Jay, if I'm not mistaken.

I would not be able to read him if I tried, is this a normal thing for him? I don't find it to be AI, it just stuck out to me skimming his ISO.

[robyn]

okay i just have to ask @LoRab do you fear god?

You know she's a Rabbi, right?

why else would i ask

[robyn]

One last *?*, Bereft seems to be only addressing/alluding to Robyn and Jay, with the exception of his towny list, which was an answer to Jay, if I'm not mistaken.

I would not be able to read him if I tried, is this a normal thing for him? I don't find it to be AI, it just stuck out to me skimming his ISO.

can u rephrase this

[S~V~S]

okay i just have to ask @LoRab do you fear god?

You know she's a Rabbi, right?

why else would i ask

I don’t know, I just wouldn’t expect someone to ask a clergy person this in a casual environment, I guess. I wasn’t trying to diss you, it was a sincere question. I wasn’t sure if you knew.

Also,rephrase that how? I thought it was fairly clear.

[robyn]

okay i just have to ask @LoRab do you fear god?

You know she's a Rabbi, right?

why else would i ask

I don’t know, I just wouldn’t expect someone to ask a clergy person this in a casual environment, I guess. I wasn’t trying to diss you, it was a sincere question. I wasn’t sure if you knew.

Also,rephrase that how? I thought it was fairly clear.

i have boundary issues, as you've no doubt seen

[robyn]

One last *?*, Bereft seems to be only addressing/alluding to Robyn and Jay, with the exception of his towny list, which was an answer to Jay, if I'm not mistaken.

I would not be able to read him if I tried, is this a normal thing for him? I don't find it to be AI, it just stuck out to me skimming his ISO.

can u rephrase this

oh you mean alluding as he's only talking about us two [it's very late], and the answer is i bet he was bored and mostly wanted to socialize, i also think we're the two people he wouldn't want to freely talk to as wolf. however this is a read i'm putting 0 value in, as in it exists and it's also entirely meaningless in regards to his alignment

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

S~V~S is bad. She's humouring in there like nobody's business. Setting the scene, agreeable. If I were cruder and didn't know S~V~S, she's also sucking up to Jay, possibly pocketing.

Humoring Jay? Nah. I kinda thought I was shading him a slight bit, tbh, with the call back to the game where he was bad.

How would saying jay fooled everyone as a baddie in a game, and pointing out that he was contradicting himself by being super active be "humoring" him? Poking someone with a small, soft stick =/= humoring.

SVS town

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

okay i just have to ask @LoRab do you fear god?

You know she's a Rabbi, right?

why else would i ask

I don’t know, I just wouldn’t expect someone to ask a clergy person this in a casual environment, I guess. I wasn’t trying to diss you, it was a sincere question. I wasn’t sure if you knew.

Also,rephrase that how? I thought it was fairly clear.

Classic robyn

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I’m still ambivalent about how to read S~V~S so far. Perhaps her observation about Bereft was decent for its specificity, though it came without a perspective. Dunno. Will continue to observe.

[Scotty]

S~V~S is bad. She's humouring in there like nobody's business. Setting the scene, agreeable. If I were cruder and didn't know S~V~S, she's also sucking up to Jay, possibly pocketing.

Intriguing take- I feel like I have the unique benefit of having just wolfed with her and I haven’t seen anything specific about her that is throwing off my paranoia alarm. And I’m usually paranoid of her as of the last 3 games before I wolf’ed with her.

Now do me do me

OK, you're freaking me out here. I don't think you've EVER said anything like this to/about me. Not the last 3 games. EVERY. GAME. Every one. You think I'm bad.

What did you take away from wolfing with me that makes you say this?

Also gotta go get ready for work. Love my new job, hate the longer commute.

Like Caterpie into Metapod, I have evolved!
After being utterly wrong about you before we were partners, I figure what I once viewed as suspicious in a vacuum is just you.

You have some quirks that i picked up on that I’m not going to reveal yet. But rest assured, dear Svs, I haven’t seen them so far. Just don’t do them and we’ll be golden

[Scotty]

One last *?*, Bereft seems to be only addressing/alluding to Robyn and Jay, with the exception of his towny list, which was an answer to Jay, if I'm not mistaken.

I would not be able to read him if I tried, is this a normal thing for him? I don't find it to be AI, it just stuck out to me skimming his ISO.

can u rephrase this

oh you mean alluding as he's only talking about us two [it's very late], and the answer is i bet he was bored and mostly wanted to socialize, i also think we're the two people he wouldn't want to freely talk to as wolf. however this is a read i'm putting 0 value in, as in it exists and it's also entirely meaningless in regards to his alignment

Hi Robyn

I don’t know your history with Bereft, but you two seem to know each other.

Would you say you have good reads on each other?

Based on vibes, I feel like you and he are linked in some way. Like a nerd and his computer, or a squirrel and his nut

[Thunal33]

Spoiler: show

@S~V~S do you feel it is on-brand or not (or neither) for @Long Con to express early suspicion of you?

Onnnnnnnnnn-braaaaaaaaaaaaaannnnnnnnnnd...... on-brand. On-brand. Towny. Wolfy. On-brand. Sassy. Classy. On-brand. Interesting. On-brand. Bon-rand?

@JaggedJimmyJay this is what I meant by "theatricality". I used to auto read this as bad~ weirdly enough, even in games where I was bad, and i had TMI re LC being town, I STILL read him as bad, which is why he's always an easy yeet for me when I'm bad. I kinda half believe it when I'm making the case.

I am on record as not believing in contributing to such lists, or rankings. I'm not a fan and I don't generally post them. Those here who have played with me a lot can attest.

Similarly, I hate when people trust me. Stop naming me, people! And, really....I'm kind of freaked out that I'm on this site and not yet suspected. What's up with that? I don't think that has ever happened. At all on here, and rarely in prior communities.

That used to freak me out, too. Naming civs, like WTF. Extreme target painting. I still don't love rainbow lists, and prefer baddie hunting to townie hunting.

I'm used to it now.

S~V~S is bad. She's humouring in there like nobody's business. Setting the scene, agreeable. If I were cruder and didn't know S~V~S, she's also sucking up to Jay, possibly pocketing.

Intriguing take- I feel like I have the unique benefit of having just wolfed with her and I haven’t seen anything specific about her that is throwing off my paranoia alarm. And I’m usually paranoid of her as of the last 3 games before I wolf’ed with her.

Now do me do me

OK, you're freaking me out here. I don't think you've EVER said anything like this to/about me. Not the last 3 games. EVERY. GAME. Every one. You think I'm bad.

What did you take away from wolfing with me that makes you say this?

Also gotta go get ready for work. Love my new job, hate the longer commute.

One last *?*, Bereft seems to be only addressing/alluding to Robyn and Jay, with the exception of his towny list, which was an answer to Jay, if I'm not mistaken.

I would not be able to read him if I tried, is this a normal thing for him? I don't find it to be AI, it just stuck out to me skimming his ISO.

Where are SVS's own reads? A lot of her posts feel like commentary and not actually taking stances. LC's post used to be read as auto bad and Scotty's freaking her out, but she didn't make actual reads off those when I feel like it would be natural for her to do.

@S~V~S
[VOTE: SVS] aubergine

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Abigail’s entrance is thoroughly null.

[Thunal33]

oops, SVS I was going to ask you what your takes on LC/Scotty were.

[Thunal33]

bereft
loreb
jjj
monroe
long con

scotty

null

thunal

I assume you actually do have a reason to read me bad then?

[Scotty]

Abigail’s entrance is thoroughly null.

To be fair, she herself has said she feels nothing

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I have comments about Thunal’s take on S~V~S, but I will give the latter some time to respond first.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Abigail’s entrance is thoroughly null.

To be fair, she herself has said she feels nothing

Indeed, and that is legal. But I feel nothing about her feeling nothing. Knawmsaying

[Scotty]

Lorab isn’t doing anything so far to make me townread her, and frankly is rather blendy in her entrance posts.

Though I don’t remember how LoRab operates. It’s been a while

[Scotty]

Abigail’s entrance is thoroughly null.

To be fair, she herself has said she feels nothing

Indeed, and that is legal. But I feel nothing about her feeling nothing. Knawmsaying

Dude I’m just a soccer ball; I don’t know things

[Thunal33]

Literally falling asleep and need to close the laptop before I wake up with keyboard indents on my face.

I'm still getting to know the people with whom I haven't played (or, if played once or twice, don't have a concept of how they play).

LC, I'm very much reading as civ.

J3, as well. Way too much work to go into that much detail, for it to be fake. Also, mafia often posts less than civs--because it's harder to know what to say. And also (and maybe mores) because they are spending time chatting in BTSC, and can engage in the game without posting.

Scotty reads entirely civ to me. Even though he needs to stop padding his post count. That always makes me suspish of people, although I know that isn't a tell for you. But I'm reading you as civ other than that.

I'm intrigued by Robyn. They are totally engaging with me as new to this site (to newer players). And also don't have context to read them (if we have ever played together, I need a reminder of what game).

The back and forth between Robyn and Bereft is also odd to me. Is this typical of them? I'm not suspecting them for this, but it's reading as off to me (this could also be a culture thing that developed since I was last here, so really earnestly asking).

okay i just have to ask @LoRab do you fear god?

I feel like you're referencing something and I have no idea what. Or is this actually a theological question? Help! I'm way too tired to think about this.

Is it too early to ask everyone for their top three town reads?

No, of course not. Let’s go ahead an box in the mafia.

I am on record as not believing in contributing to such lists, or rankings. I'm not a fan and I don't generally post them. Those here who have played with me a lot can attest.

Similarly, I hate when people trust me. Stop naming me, people! And, really....I'm kind of freaked out that I'm on this site and not yet suspected. What's up with that? I don't think that has ever happened. At all on here, and rarely in prior communities.

What's normally suspicious about your style?

I think this kind of comment about finding it weird you're too trusted is >rand mafia. A lot of townies are confident in their townieness even if they are suspected often, but it's easy for mafia to assume they're suspicious.

[Scotty]

Lorab isn’t doing anything so far to make me townread her, and frankly is rather blendy in her entrance posts.

Though I don’t remember how LoRab operates. It’s been a while

meh I can say the same thing about SVS tho too

Like I’m not even sure she made a read when she was weirded out by me in her recent post.

Ima figure her out

[Thunal33]

I'm liking Cape so far, I think his curiosity about my RVS vote question was good and it feels like he's saying whatever takes come to mind.

Long Con
Scotty
JJJ
Cape

everyone else

LoRab
SVS

[Scotty]

Literally falling asleep and need to close the laptop before I wake up with keyboard indents on my face.

I'm still getting to know the people with whom I haven't played (or, if played once or twice, don't have a concept of how they play).

LC, I'm very much reading as civ.

J3, as well. Way too much work to go into that much detail, for it to be fake. Also, mafia often posts less than civs--because it's harder to know what to say. And also (and maybe mores) because they are spending time chatting in BTSC, and can engage in the game without posting.

Scotty reads entirely civ to me. Even though he needs to stop padding his post count. That always makes me suspish of people, although I know that isn't a tell for you. But I'm reading you as civ other than that.

I'm intrigued by Robyn. They are totally engaging with me as new to this site (to newer players). And also don't have context to read them (if we have ever played together, I need a reminder of what game).

The back and forth between Robyn and Bereft is also odd to me. Is this typical of them? I'm not suspecting them for this, but it's reading as off to me (this could also be a culture thing that developed since I was last here, so really earnestly asking).

okay i just have to ask @LoRab do you fear god?

I feel like you're referencing something and I have no idea what. Or is this actually a theological question? Help! I'm way too tired to think about this.

Is it too early to ask everyone for their top three town reads?

No, of course not. Let’s go ahead an box in the mafia.

I am on record as not believing in contributing to such lists, or rankings. I'm not a fan and I don't generally post them. Those here who have played with me a lot can attest.

Similarly, I hate when people trust me. Stop naming me, people! And, really....I'm kind of freaked out that I'm on this site and not yet suspected. What's up with that? I don't think that has ever happened. At all on here, and rarely in prior communities.

What's normally suspicious about your style?

I think this kind of comment about finding it weird you're too trusted is >rand mafia. A lot of townies are confident in their townieness even if they are suspected often, but it's easy for mafia to assume they're suspicious.

@LoRab ignore my last post about you being blendy, I somehow missed this entire reads post.

I like it for its stances, until you get paranoid that others haven’t suspected you yet. It’s very self conscious and I don’t know why others would suspect you for anything you had done until this post.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

If I critically assess LoRab beyond a vibe town read:

I think her aversion to being town read stems from an older Syndicate era when essentially everyone hated being town read (due to old win conditions).

Perhaps LoRab’s confidence in her town reads of LC and especially of me can be questioned. To suggest my play to that point was “too detailed to be fake” is a bit much.

[Scotty]

If I critically assess LoRab beyond a vibe town read:

I think her aversion to being town read stems from an older Syndicate era when essentially everyone hated being town read (due to old win conditions).

Perhaps LoRab’s confidence in her town reads of LC and especially of me can be questioned. To suggest my play to that point was “too detailed to be fake” is a bit much.

I think there’s probably a difference in approach since she seems to inference the olde ways, but actively is pushing back against people townreading her. It’s like she *knows* she isn’t doing anything towny, and can’t help but acknowledge it

[Scotty]

Jay is such a high poster, and with not much filler, that I think inherently he tends to be town voice. Even if he’s not town lol

I think I’m slightly suspicious that I am his top town read, but that’s a me problem. I’m down to listen to his scum reads however

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Jay is such a high poster, and with not much filler, that I think inherently he tends to be town voice. Even if he’s not town lol

I think I’m slightly suspicious that I am his top town read, but that’s a me problem. I’m down to listen to his scum reads however

I can at least expand on why. You opened by promoting my initial urge for activity and engagement given the difficulty of the setup. That is not "town" on its own, but I think you have lived up to that nicely to this point. You started by talking the talk, and so far you have walked the walk. In that way I think your play to this point has been pro-town, and I haven't taken issue with conclusions you've drawn or things you've said.

[Scotty]

Jay is such a high poster, and with not much filler, that I think inherently he tends to be town voice. Even if he’s not town lol

I think I’m slightly suspicious that I am his top town read, but that’s a me problem. I’m down to listen to his scum reads however

I can at least expand on why. You opened by promoting my initial urge for activity and engagement given the difficulty of the setup. That is not "town" on its own, but I think you have lived up to that nicely to this point. You started by talking the talk, and so far you have walked the walk. In that way I think your play to this point has been pro-town, and I haven't taken issue with conclusions you've drawn or things you've said.

I hear what you’re saying, and while I don’t disagree because I am town, post a lot and asking others to post is something I think I would do in any alignment. I’m not sure if you read any of Guitar mafia where SVS and I swept, but I posted about twice as much as the next highest poster, and was probably the biggest cheerleader for people to post.

This isn’t a post for me to make you want to suspect me, I just think your reasoning here is a bit lazy by your standards

[JaggedJimmyJay]

This isn’t a post for me to make you want to suspect me, I just think your reasoning here is a bit lazy by your standards

You were looking for Day 1 suggestions, so here's another: understand the limits of what a read can be given the stage of play, and then play within those limits. On Day 1 (particularly early Day 1), if you're looking for "good" reasons to believe anything, you're probably going to be left wanting. But you'll still have instincts. So roll with them until you decide you shouldn't. "Standards" don't really matter yet.

Or don't. That's obviously up to you.

[Scotty]

I’ve turned around on Cape- even tho he doesn’t have a lot of posts, what posts he has made are actual reads. Obviously I would like him to expand on them, but he’s making definitive reads

Thunal on the surface looks fine with their reads, if not making reads that come off as half baked. And no one wants a half baked pie, except maybe the stray cat that hangs out on my patio after dark. He’ll eat anything.
Scumlean

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[VOTE: Princess Abigail] aubergine

Only made one concretely engaged post (to call S~V~S town), and I'm not sure I believe that read.

[Scotty]

This isn’t a post for me to make you want to suspect me, I just think your reasoning here is a bit lazy by your standards

You were looking for Day 1 suggestions, so here's another: understand the limits of what a read can be given the stage of play, and then play within those limits. On Day 1 (particularly early Day 1), if you're looking for "good" reasons to believe anything, you're probably going to be left wanting. But you'll still have instincts. So roll with them until you decide you shouldn't. "Standards" don't really matter yet.

Or don't. That's obviously up to you.

I think I’m more critical of you for your reputation, and that you made the claim that you sometimes ‘engage in deep analysis on Day 1’. Still not sure how that works, or is supposed to work.

All that being said, I ain’t voting you today unless you’re like ‘Nevermind. I am a bad bad bear’. You’re responsible for too much discussion, which is palatable

[Scotty]

*ebwop valuable, not palatable

but that works too I guess

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I hope I get the opportunity to do some heavier analytic solving on this Day 1. I have had a solving itch lately, but I keep rolling mafia everywhere I go, and then I don't get to scratch that itch. Now's my opportunity. But for it to happen on Day 1, I need a nice healthy pile of posts (i.e., something to analyze).

[Scotty]

[VOTE: Thunal] aubergine
Cu cu cachoo

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[VOTE: Thunal] aubergine
Cu cu cachoo

Could you indicate which of Thunal's read(s) you found half-baked?

[Scotty]

I hope I get the opportunity to do some heavier analytic solving on this Day 1. I have had a solving itch lately, but I keep rolling mafia everywhere I go, and then I don't get to scratch that itch. Now's my opportunity. But for it to happen on Day 1, I need a nice healthy pile of posts (i.e., something to analyze).

When was the last time you rolled mafia? Mind if I checked it out? I thought there was a game I was speccing where I pegged you as mafia by like day 3 but I don’t remember if that was confbias or you actually were mafia

[JaggedJimmyJay]

When was the last time you rolled mafia? Mind if I checked it out? I thought there was a game I was speccing where I pegged you as mafia by like day 3 but I don’t remember if that was confbias or you actually were mafia

Refer to the links in this post -- plenty of examples to work with. It's been both annoying and vindicating to be mafia so many times lately. I had one of my worst games ever in Philosophy 2 a couple years ago, but since then I have gone 5-0 as mafia (despite never being pleased to see the role card at first). Feels nice.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

My most recent mafia-aligned game was this one on Wintreath. It was a bit of a different beast for being low in activity though.

[Scotty]

[VOTE: Thunal] aubergine
Cu cu cachoo

Could you indicate which of Thunal's read(s) you found half-baked?

Their vote for SVS came out of nowhere for me:

Spoiler: show

Spoiler: show

@S~V~S do you feel it is on-brand or not (or neither) for @Long Con to express early suspicion of you?

Onnnnnnnnnn-braaaaaaaaaaaaaannnnnnnnnnd...... on-brand. On-brand. Towny. Wolfy. On-brand. Sassy. Classy. On-brand. Interesting. On-brand. Bon-rand?

@JaggedJimmyJay this is what I meant by "theatricality". I used to auto read this as bad~ weirdly enough, even in games where I was bad, and i had TMI re LC being town, I STILL read him as bad, which is why he's always an easy yeet for me when I'm bad. I kinda half believe it when I'm making the case.

I am on record as not believing in contributing to such lists, or rankings. I'm not a fan and I don't generally post them. Those here who have played with me a lot can attest.

Similarly, I hate when people trust me. Stop naming me, people! And, really....I'm kind of freaked out that I'm on this site and not yet suspected. What's up with that? I don't think that has ever happened. At all on here, and rarely in prior communities.

That used to freak me out, too. Naming civs, like WTF. Extreme target painting. I still don't love rainbow lists, and prefer baddie hunting to townie hunting.

I'm used to it now.

S~V~S is bad. She's humouring in there like nobody's business. Setting the scene, agreeable. If I were cruder and didn't know S~V~S, she's also sucking up to Jay, possibly pocketing.

Intriguing take- I feel like I have the unique benefit of having just wolfed with her and I haven’t seen anything specific about her that is throwing off my paranoia alarm. And I’m usually paranoid of her as of the last 3 games before I wolf’ed with her.

Now do me do me

OK, you're freaking me out here. I don't think you've EVER said anything like this to/about me. Not the last 3 games. EVERY. GAME. Every one. You think I'm bad.

What did you take away from wolfing with me that makes you say this?

Also gotta go get ready for work. Love my new job, hate the longer commute.

One last *?*, Bereft seems to be only addressing/alluding to Robyn and Jay, with the exception of his towny list, which was an answer to Jay, if I'm not mistaken.

I would not be able to read him if I tried, is this a normal thing for him? I don't find it to be AI, it just stuck out to me skimming his ISO.

Where are SVS's own reads? A lot of her posts feel like commentary and not actually taking stances. LC's post used to be read as auto bad and Scotty's freaking her out, but she didn't make actual reads off those when I feel like it would be natural for her to do.

@S~V~S
[VOTE: SVS] aubergine

Their loRab push was also not strong.

Even though through a lens, I actually independently find I agree with their reads of both SVS and LoRab: where are SVS’ reads, and why is LoRab so freaked out about being townread?

[Scotty]

When was the last time you rolled mafia? Mind if I checked it out? I thought there was a game I was speccing where I pegged you as mafia by like day 3 but I don’t remember if that was confbias or you actually were mafia

Refer to the links in this post -- plenty of examples to work with. It's been both annoying and vindicating to be mafia so many times lately. I had one of my worst games ever in Philosophy 2 a couple years ago, but since then I have gone 5-0 as mafia (despite never being pleased to see the role card at first). Feels nice.

Wait- THATS RIGHT! I was just in a game with you in Don’t Starve, and would have absolutely gunned for you D2 if I didn’t get D1’d. I totally forgot about that game.

Ok ok I *can* read you.

[Michelle]

Hi!!!
I was informed this game started and I'll be here later in the day!!
Glad to play with everyone, friends and new people!!

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Hi!!!
I was informed this game started and I'll be here later in the day!!
Glad to play with everyone, friends and new people!!

Michelle is here. The game is now better than before.

[Michelle]

My most recent mafia-aligned game was this one on Wintreath. It was a bit of a different beast for being low in activity though.

That will be an interesting read when I'll have time for it

Linki: can't wait to change some reads after I can post a little

[Michelle]

When was the last time you rolled mafia? Mind if I checked it out? I thought there was a game I was speccing where I pegged you as mafia by like day 3 but I don’t remember if that was confbias or you actually were mafia

Refer to the links in this post -- plenty of examples to work with. It's been both annoying and vindicating to be mafia so many times lately. I had one of my worst games ever in Philosophy 2 a couple years ago, but since then I have gone 5-0 as mafia (despite never being pleased to see the role card at first). Feels nice.

Wait- THATS RIGHT! I was just in a game with you in Don’t Starve, and would have absolutely gunned for you D2 if I didn’t get D1’d. I totally forgot about that game.

Ok ok I *can* read you.

You don't seem too confident here tho

[JaggedJimmyJay]

@Bereft and @robyn, each of you had expressed early faith in LoRab, and in the moment I kind of vibed with that. I'd like to dig a bit deeper though: are you able to describe what gave you confidence about her?

[Bereft]

@Bereft and @robyn, each of you had expressed early faith in LoRab, and in the moment I kind of vibed with that. I'd like to dig a bit deeper though: are you able to describe what gave you confidence about her?

I had two major instances of thought about LoRab.

The first was immediately after their entrance.
And to that point, I had the same thought as Robyn did wrt to it.

The second was immediately after LoRab freaked out about getting townreads.
And to that point, I had the same thought as you did wrt to it.

If the question demands why I take strong stock in these thoughts at all, then its because both of these moments are based on LoRab existing archetypical traits of "pure" town spontaneity. And I don't think I've ever once seen these reads fail in my experience. On a mafia theory tangent, its the most basic form of read in existence, mafia simply doesn't post like that, because they have to think about well, being mafia.